/vr/ - Retro Games

Imagine how much better the series would've been if Aonuma wasn't a total casual who couldn't play this game.

I think zelda 1 is the weakest of the series.

Remember how you could just play the game without being bombarded by text, cutscenes, and side quests?

>>339117
I remember hearing that a decent while ago and I interpreted it as him being unable to beat it, which is kinda understandable.

But then I learned that he couldn't get past the fucking OCTOROCKS on the first few screens.

>>339134
What would you say is the best?

>>339134

only casuals that never completed it think that

>>339134
No, that goes to Minish Cap. Beautiful, but short and easy. Plus annoying hatbird.

Yeah, but there's nothing IN it. LA's overworld has personality in every corner.

I want a Zelda with a world as open as the original and as full of shit as Link's Awakening.

>>339156
I beat the game.

>>339156
>only casuals that never completed it think that

Don't turn this into /v/ man.

>>339135

>>339148
>But then I learned that he couldn't get past the fucking OCTOROCKS on the first few screens.

Wait, is this true? That's just fucking ridiculos.

I beat that game for the first time last year.
I don't think i'll have another glorious experience like that ever again.


But I gotta say, Link's Awakening is probably my favorite world to explore because it holds a special place in my heart.

Not trolling, Zelda 2 is my favorite overworld

>>339172
Strange, because I consider Minish Cap one of the best in the series. Immersive, interesting mechanics and items, and did you just badmouth Ezlo?

I mean, it doesn't stand up to near perfection like LttP, but I really do think Minish Cap deserves more credit. At least on the same tier as the other Capcom Zeldas

>>339154
Hmm. Probably Link's Awakening. But it's just my opinion.

>>339102
yea i miss that. why do i have to go linear? for some bullshit story?

>>339217

I thought it was pretty bad to be honest, it just feels too cramped with little room to roam and constant roadblocks everywhere

I wholeheartedly support OP's statement.

Somewhere along the way, someone decided wrongly that Zelda was about solving puzzles, rather than exploring.

>>339176

then I will never understand

I played it for the first time a couple of month back and it brought back all the memories of why I loved Zelda games so much

some things like rupee farming got annoying though

>>339321
Metriod is about exploring
Zelda need its own focus

>>339323
>then I will never understand

It's easy, people have different opinions.

>>339286
Well it is a gameboy game. there's only so much you can do with it.

I think it's an amazing game for the system, and for the Zelda series overall.

>>339241
I also loved minish cap. I need to play the gbc capcom zelda games.

I have the original map guide, it's old and kinda worn out but it looks cool and its still readable, like an actual map. It has all the secrets marked by the previous owner, it even has the first three dungeon layouts. Makes wanna beat the game, never could get past the first halve of the last dungeon

>>339438

the last dungeon is a bitch, I think I completed it without finding the master key and having to resort to a guide

But they did improve on this overworld OP.

>>339472

by cutting half of it away?

>>339102
I've said it before and I'll say it again

I loved how this and Zelda 2 are the only 2 games that have enemies that will PUSH YOUR FUCKING SHIT IN if you dare travel to certain parts of the map unprepared

When I was little, I found my way into the graveyard at the west side of the map, the area with the lynels under that with 5 hearts...

boy did I ever fucking regret going in there

I loved that some areas and labyrinths were accessible but the enemies were going to keep you away until you were ready

No other zelda does that anymore

Now it's almost linear, they guide you by the hand to the door of the next temple and show you where you need to go

I would kill for a new Zelda that amped up the challenge, a Zelda where Link can't just steamroll down Hyrule Field and kill everything in sight with a wave of his sword

A Zelda where enemies stop bowing down to you and become actual threats instead of just fake obstacles

I actually enjoyed Zelda 2

I loved it

For the first time ever it feels like the forces of Evil really are out to fucking get you

They're not fucking around.

It really does feel like the odds are against you.

Of course, remember, Zelda 2 is THE ONLY Zelda game where Link starts out as an established hero and the enemies know what he's capable of

>yfw when you realize this is why Zelda 2 is the hardest of them all

Link's awakening has a hero that saved hyrule but the enemies on the island don't know of his adventures, same for Majora's Mask

>>339218
I never thought about it, but yeah it does have a really good overworld. I think it just kind of gets ignored in that aspect, because the overworld is an RPG styled overworld, where nothing happens other than traveling while in other Zelda games you're exploring, and fighting your way through it, and a good portion of the game takes place in the overworld rather than it solely being a hub for levels.

I don't think I ever beat this game without the map. Some of the shit is pretty cryptic. But it is a great game.

>>339498
That's the joke. But considering the game's time limit mechanic it makes sense that they'd do that.

>>339510

Imagine a game where normal enemies are almost on the same level of broken as fighting Shadow Link in OoT

would you play that?

>>339510
I used to screw around exploring the overworld, I went to the graveyard all the time to wake up the ghosts.

>>339554
Oh fine we can throw a couple of octorocks for the kiddies, or we can put in a Kid Mode like Spider Man for the PSX did

I guess Zelda games will never challenge players again
>sadfrog.jpg

>>339554
That Might be a little too much. But enemies like the Garro being regular enemies might be fun.

Or the Stalfos and Lizfos.

>>339589
I never finished the first two, and I finished OoT, WW and TP, something is seriously wrong with me. I'm gonna finish them some day, got em on a Wii emulator, without save stating obviously

>>339589

Hay I don't mind a challenge, but those blue knights and axe throwing crocodiles are the epitome, of "fuck this shit"

you have to use techniques that are borderline glitches to get rid of them

>>339102
Thanks for the new desktop background, OP

>>339612

but then you'd be bored of them anyway because you've already encountered them a billion times before

Stalfos were only dangerous to kid link anyways.

>>339618
Or you could, you know, develop some skill, read their moves, get a feel for when to block high or low and strike high or low, you know, like ACTUAL FUCKING FIGHTING

Like I said put in a Kid Mode for the kiddies that just want the story, where you dangle a couple of darknuts in front of them so they can hit them like retarded pinatas

Then put a normal or hard mode in for the ones who are bored of breezing through Zelda games

Don't get me wrong, I love modern Zelda, and I play it for the stories and everything but the challenge is sooooo low

>>339703
>Or you could, you know, develop some skill, read their moves, get a feel for when to block high or low and strike high or low, you know, like ACTUAL FUCKING FIGHTING

oh wow, you must be joking nignog, the blue knights will trample all over you. It's not about reading their moves, its about confusing the shit out of the ai into lowering its guard.

>>339703
continued

Let me use me as an example

Yes, when I played Zelda 2 in 1990 I was like fuck this shit several times

But then I started getting a feel for the enemies. No you do NOT need glitches to beat this. You need to actually develop some skill, and what the hell's wrong with that?

Kids playing cowaduty and other multiplayer shooters and halo develop skills for shooting fast situations knowing what to do etc.

You develop skill in Street Fighter to get better and defeat opponents

What's wrong with developing skill for fighting baddies in Zelda?

Quit treating us all like retarded 4-year olds, nintendo, give us a challenge.

We're better than that. we can handle it.

>>339736
And I've learned to do that. It's not easy but I can beat Zelda 2 without cheating or glitches

>>339736
The game is telling you to be smarter than the computer

>>339736
>It's not about reading their moves, its about confusing the shit out of the ai into lowering its guard.

WOW a game with a battle system that works like real-life fighting?

Well we can't fucking have that, specially in a Zelda game!!

Ok change of plan let's get some enemies that look threatening but are basically retarded pinatas that the player can beat on by swinging the wiimote retardedly at them

>>339784
no wait wait I got it let's fill hyrule field with enemies that are basically item containers for the player to plow through without even trying

Let's make link so fucking overpowered nothing is a danger to him anymore nothing can even get close to touching him

Fuck, does anyone even remember the Lynel?
They were in Link To The Past as well

They didn't play around, they hit you hard and it really did hurt.

When was the last time you were afraid of a Zelda enemy?
When was the last time you felt Link was actually in any danger?
When was the last time you didn't avoid an enemy because he was annoying but because he was an actual threat??

>>339770

no the game is telling you to overwhelm the computer with fast input not far off from button mashing

>>339784

I actually liked fighting against those Gerudo bitches with their insta KO

but having those encounters every fucking step of the game is moronic

>>339863
You don't need fast input to beat Darknuts.

Do a short hop close to them, swinging on the way down. You will hit them twice, both high and low, on the down-turn.

>>339853
Where were they in LttP? I'm not remembering them in there off the top of my head. Not accusing, just forgetful.

>>339980

doesn't really work against blue ones because they'll constantly back away and keep flinging shit at you

>>339992
http://zeldawiki.org/Lynel

In Zelda 1 they throw their sword at you,

That reminds me, they were in the Oracle games as well!

In LTTP they're in Death Mountain but I'm not sure if only in the Dark World

Link to the Past and the Oracle games they spit flames at you and they're not as powerful as the original game Lynels

I like Zelda 2 more than the average person, but the difficulty curve is pretty silly. Your first iron knuckle shouldn't show up until a few dungeons in, and their reflexes should be far slower (the actual speed of the orange ones should have been saved until the blue ones). The game is so set on making its dungeons hard that it's forced to put iron knuckles everywhere, which makes the dungeons all feel samey. Did you notice that Midoro Palace has more snakes than the rest? Of course not, you were paying attention to the iron knuckles.

And yes, I can beat the damned thing; I beat it a couple days after I turned six. Doesn't excuse the game from annoying time-consuming enemies that eat up all the personality of its dungeons.

>>339102
Never got the appeal of Zelda 1

it's slightly less interesting than Rogue, which came out years earlier

>>340047
Totally agree with all that and yes Zelda 2 is not without its faults but a little challenge wouldn't hurt the series

Stop making Zelda linear by leading us by the hand to every dungeon

Stop giving us only enemies we can plow through

Give a little challenge, and make an easy mode for players who aren't interested in that

too much to ask?

>>340073
i don't see what killing the player accomplishes, except on bosses

>>340043
Ah. Yeah. That'd be why I forgot them. I didn't feel threatened at all by them, because by the time I faced them, I could just block their admittedly hardcore fireballs (2 full hp with max armor) with shields.

>>340078
Challenge

The need to develop skill

Replay value

Come on, for fuck's sake, would Star Wars have been fun if Darth Vader wasn't a danger to Luke? Would Star Wars be fun if Luke was the ultimate power and could plow through Vader and the Emperor?

I have never once felt threatened by an enemy in any new Zelda game since OOT

Maybe the iron knuckles in OOT, a little, and even they're pushovers.

The cave of ordeals in TP gave me some of what I wanted but left me wanting more challenge, and now I can breeze through that too without a second thought

Hero mode in skyward sword is nice but still lacking

and none of these still solve the problem of linear zelda I mentioned earlier. Zelda is not about exploring as much anymore. You wake up as link, then the game shows you where you need to go, then you get done with that, then it opens another area and it shows you where to go there. What happened?

zelda needs to go back to its roots. it's an adventure game not a poorly written movie.

>>340129
I guess what I'm saying with the Vader analogy is that the stakes were raised

You had a feeling Luke was going to win in the end, but then you knew that Vader could end him at any time. He was actually dangerous. There was actually a chance Vader could win in some crazy twist surprise ending.

Zelda now has no stakes. Nobody is a danger to Link. He's the Hero Of Time, the bearer of the triforce of courage, but who needs courage when your opposition isn't a threat at all?

>>340160
he has the courage to plow through tons of underpowered enemies who go down easier than a sleeping Glass Joe and face a Ganon who is distracted by a fishing pole

WOW WHAT A HERO!

Serious question for everyone. I love every Zelda game I've ever played besides Skyward Sword, which I did enjoy but did not love.

Will we ever see another Zelda game that is really, genuinely as great as the original, ALttP, OoT, etc?

I would put Twilight Princess on that level of greatness but at the time it came out, it wasn't a revolutionary game like the others in the franchise had been.

A Zelda game was once not just a good game, but an important one - something that was one of the best, if not the best in its respective genre.

Now, no hate here, but is that even possible anymore? Has that window simply closed?

>>340184
pointless post

>>339357
Both were about exploring, just that Zelda was an arcade/RPG hybrid whereas Metroid was a straight-up action game with a very mazelike world.

>>340184

It would need a metric ton of innovation. Something that would blow peoples faces off with how awesome it is. Like OoT that featured playing instrument playing, context sensitivity and refined battle system on top of being 3D. Or the original which featured saving.

TP is also kind of important for being the first with motion controls.

I'm thinking it has to be heavily tied up to new tech and do it above everybody else on top of being among the first to be truly great.

>>340243
Yeah you got it, pretty much... unfortunately I just don't think there are really any more boundaries that can be crossed in a game like that.

I mean you have the dimension-jumping, time altering, the jump to 3D - and then what?

Super Mario Galaxy did the gravity thing, one of the best games I've ever played - but I don't think the motion stuff in TP really accomplished what it set out to do.

Are there any more barriers to be smashed like that?

>>340318

Not with the WiiU that's for certain, because they already did both touch and 2 screen gaming with DS Zeldas and the GC-GBA connectivity in WW.

>>340318

To be honest the gravity thing was kind of a detriment, mainly because platforming sucked ass on irregular surfaces

>>339134
You shut your whore mouth

>>339472
that's.....missing half the overworld

>>340318
They could make the combat system good for once. TP was a step in the right direction with all the special attacks, but the enemies were made with the fact that the special attacks were optional unlocks, so they had to be able to be killed by normal means which meant if you had the special attacks they were just really easy.

SS was eh. The motion controls worked 95% of the time, but that 5% when it didn't swing right, and you took damage for it just really ruined a lot, and almost all the enemies were just Simon Says "hey you have to attack in this direction, oh look the new enemies block MULTIPLE directions, oh look now you take damage if you let your attack get blocked!"

The sword controls on the Nintendo Land minigame were really fucking good, and I'm looking forward to seeing what they do for the next Zelda game. Imagine something like Mount and Blade directional Combat in a Zelda game. That would be amazing assuming they actually had some difficulty in the enemies.


Honestly I think WW had the best combat of the 3D Zeldas. It didn't try to be complicated, but it was very responsive, and very visceral.

>>339102
ITT: Extreme nostalgia fagging

Zelda 1 was one of the weakest Zeldas. Sure its gets points for being the original and its definitely a special game. But as far as the overhead Zeldas go, the only ones worse than it are the DS games.

>>340497
>the only ones worse than it are the DS games.
Have you forgotten about the CDi games and minish cap?

>>340497
man suck a dick, you think that shitty GBA Minish Cap was better than the fucking Legend of Zelda? Eat a dick.

>>340497

Terrible opinion

>>340497
0/10

>>340803

Minish Cap was fucking fun.

NES Zelda is fun as fuck.

All those upgrades
All those weapons
All those areas
All those tough as fuck enemies

>mfw there is a lost woods

>>340803
>>341857

I agree with both of you, but you're both incredibly juvenile.

i honestly don't think zelda 1 is very good

i think exploration should still be a factor in zelda, and i hated skyward sword's almost mario-like design, but a game being open doesn't make it good. you still pretty much visit the dungeons in a linear order, so the 'non linear' aspect is an illusion.

>>339134
no! zelda1 is best zelda

>>340458

yeah i never felt like i was fighting in SS. in TP and wind waker, i used to LOVE fighting even though both games were too easy.

if hard mode TP/wind waker existed they'd be amongst my fave games.

>>341992

i think most people just liked the fact that you have the OPTION to explore and get acquainted with the overworld instead of the overworld being opened up in 'segments' so poor baby doesn't get lost

>>342002

ohhhh yes wind waker's combat was something special

skyward left a sour taste in my mouth, but it had cool items like that beetle thing

>>342002
>wind waker
>good combat

lol

enjoy your "win" button, faggot

>>342036
>playing blatant collectathons


also fuck off, this is a Zelda thread

>>339472
This reminds me of Kanto in Pokémon GSC

>>339286

yeah, definitely lots of roadblocks.

for some reason, LA is one of those games that i enjoy more when i go back and replay it rather than the 1st time around (getting into some of those dungeons for the first times, especially the first couple, was a huge pain in the ass when you didntknow what you were doing)

>>339703
>Or you could, you know, develop some skill, read their moves, get a feel for when to block high or low and strike high or low, you know, like ACTUAL FUCKING FIGHTING
I know it's not retro, but I feel like Viewtiful Joe had a nice evolution of this kind of action/adventure style fighting. I'd like to see more games experiment with it.

>loathing hate for Minish Cap

Can someone please elaborate? I played it and thought it was fine. Not the best in the series, but certainly not the worst.

>>339641

Now all you need to do is make some custom icons for your desktop shortcuts that resemble certain landmarks and place them where they belong

>>342080
idk either.

I liked it.

Not the best, but not a colossal drag like the DS games

hey guys. I'm playing LoZ for the first time in my life, and damn is it cryptic. I spenthours just looking for a goddamn dungeon.
Is it considered cheating if i use the map?

>>342127
Yes

>>342127

no, the original game came with a map in the manual that you were expected to use.

>>342139
>>342140
im confus

>>342080
>>342105
The only thing I didn't really like were those keystone things. It was too dull and repetitive and went on for far too long. Other than that I enjoyed it.

>>342142
The game came with a map and hints.

>>342154

>>342035

can you fucking read? i admitted WW's combat was too easy

>>341992
>you still pretty much visit the dungeons in a linear order, so the 'non linear' aspect is an illusion
With the exception of a few levels needing an item acquired from another dungeon, it's completely feasible to play the LoZ dungeons in any order you want.

>>340441
No.

What made Zelda 1 unique was it dumped you directly into a world and told you 'figure out what to do'. No Zelda game since (except Zelda 2) has done this. All Zelda games since have pretty much told you where you need to go and what you need to do through NPCs or direct linear dungeons.

Now, does this mean future Zelda games need to drop all story and NPC interaction to be good? No way. They just need to tone it down a lot more. Allow the player to explore the world and find the NPCs themselves, much like a Dragon Quest game. Or better yet, do like Red Dead Redemption and have a huge open world to explore, with side quests and main quest NPCs. And you can trigger them at your leisure.

The problem is, most Zelda games now push 'side quests' like saving a goron boy or collecting spirit orbs as part of the 'main quest'. You no longer feel like you've explored the world and found something to do, you just have an NPC telling you to go do something every time. Because its mandatory for the story.

All that said, Zelda 1 is still my second favorite Zelda game.

The wizzrobes are hard as fuck, so are the darknuts

>>342154
>this old man
>this old woman
>this old man
Was Hyrule a retirement home or something? Nothing but old people as far as the eye can see.

>>343764
Old men, old women and shopkeepers who looked like burly, bearded blacksmiths.

>>343764

Old men and women are always used to give sage advice in games. Zelda just repeated the same character over and over to save on having to make more character sprites. Commonly used in NES games.

Obviously the old man by the sea who gives you the letter is not the same old man in Dungeon 1 telling you to walk into a waterfall.

>>343840
When I was a kid, I just figured it was the same old guy showing up over and over again to help me out. It didn't need to make sense, it was just a video game.

>>339134
This.

>>339156
Wrong. I completed the game. It's not even good, let alone as good as people say.

>>344019

You're entitled to your own opinion. You are not entitled to claim anyone who disagrees with you is wrong. All that breeds is more arguing and idiots (like you) coming in here and claiming your opinion is wrong.

Zelda is just way too fucking easy now. Really it requires no skill with the controller...its just about memorizing patterns and what to do, and to just do it.

Having everything available to you right from the start is nice for exploration but not so nice for progression through the game.

>Alright, time to go searching for level 2!
>Find every level other than that one

>>344136

The map that came with the game showed you where each level was and the numbers. Well, the first 4 or 5 or so, at least/

I know this is suppose to be a Zelda love thread, but OP mentioned good overworlds that you can romp around right from the start.

... funny, this game series is from the same era, too.

>>344136
I think ALttP struck a good balance. Apart from the fact that it fucking pointed the order of the dungeons out to you, the next dungeon is almost always the easiest to get to, the path of least resistance, yet you can get to the rest of the game if you tried; you can access pretty much all of the Dark World after (or before, if you leave once you get the hammer) you complete the first Dark World dungeon, even though the path isn't obvious and the game doesn't make it easier for you to traverse the map until you get a few new items.

>>340231
Zelda was never an RPG.
Not any more than Metroid, anyway.

>>344043
Look to who he was relying to. He's saying the guy is wrong to assume only people who never beat the game can dislike it.

>>343764

Everyone else moved north. You see them in Zelda 2 in the villages. So basically the people you see in the first game are hermits.

>>344493
I'd like to think of it like the opposite. In the north it's like Logan's Run. They send all their useless elderly to the south, a.k.a. Monsterland.

ALttP's map was much better.

>>352570

It looking nice and it actually being nice are two completely different things. The map butt-fucking annoying, but it looks beautiful.

>>352570

>>352570

I completely hated the map of ALttP. It's hard to say why, I just found it very annoying to get around and not pleasant at all. And I just feel like too much ugly greens and browns.

>>353267

Honestly I loved OoT's map. Also I love how Zora's River flows throughout the whorl region.

>>353303

Oops here's the image.

>>343530
copy this and send it to Miyamoto. I like the idea a lot. it's what made older games interesting. newer ones can have that too.

>>353306
>>353306
they could have done a lot more with hyrule field.
lon-lon farm ain't enough in the middle.

Termina map was pretty good too but the game fails ultimately because it has not enough dungeons and I loved MM.

a good zelda game should always have at least 8 dungeons and not just fucking four.

>>353303
OoT was fucking tiny. I hated OoT's map and Majora was basically OoT v.2

>>353303
OoT map in ALttP style
>>>/hr/1770527

Filesize was too big so I uploaded it on /hr/.

>>353347
is this...playable? could one mod it?

>>339134

Isn't Adventure of Link the weakpoint of the series?

>>353392
Nah, that would be Phantom Hourglass if you ignore those 3 other awful games nobody counts.

>>353397
>3 other awful games nobody counts.
Wind Waker, Twilight Princess, and Skyward Sword?

>>339510
>Of course, remember, Zelda 2 is THE ONLY Zelda game where Link starts out as an established hero and the enemies know what he's capable of
>Link's awakening has a hero that saved hyrule but the enemies on the island don't know of his adventures, same for Majora's Mask

Just adding onto what you say
LA Link is the same Link as Oracle of Seasons and Oracle of Ages, and before that, Link from Link to the Past, and (forgive me for bringing non-retro in) Link from Phantom Hourglass is Link from Wind Waker.

But, as none of those games take place in Hyrule so none of the enemies know what Link is capable of, your point still stands.

Also Zelda 2 was the enemies' last chance to bring back Ganon. The silver arrows fucked him up majorly, and the enemies needed to kill Link in order to ressurect him. Zelda 2 finished the timeline which had popped into existence hundreds of years before, when a version of OoT Link fucked up and got killed by Ganon.

>>353420
I was more hinting at CDi.

>>353420
All Zelda games from Majora's Mask and onward were god-awful, MM itself included.

Yeah, whip out your shitty reaction images and out-of-ten scores.

>>339736
Jump towards blue knight, press down while in the air, stab at their unprotected heads because the AI detects you pressing down and incorrectly assumes you're aiming for the legs. It doesn't take your jump into account. And that's how to beat the blue knights. Figgered that out when I was like 8, dude.

>>339173
This. I wish Zelda 1's map just had more to it.

Back when it was debatable that Wind Waker took place before LoZ1 (as in, prior to the timeline being released), I liked the idea of LoZ1's world being so desolate from things being flooded during the WW times, and by LoZ1, Hyrule hadn't recovered yet. It had sort of a post-apocalyptic feel, but it was still sort of hopeful because you were doing something to make it better. By the time LoZ2 rolls around, you see little towns scattered about sparsely.

It would be cool if you could muck about and find ruins of towns, or little pockets of interesting characters hiding away and trying to survive, and all that.

>>353473
The fact that you just state a contrary unpopular opinion without any reason or explanation leads me to believe that you just want a reaction.

>>353303
I don't really like how OoT set up a theme for Zelda maps where you just kind of have a hub (usually Hyrule Field) and then everything branching off of it in a circle.

Pre-OoT the maps were proper adventure maps: lots of different paths and a very large world which you could properly explore. Then, OoT and afterwads, there wasn't really any exploring:
"Okay for quest 2 go from Hub to Area 1."
"Okay now go back to Hub."
"Okay now for quest 3 go from Hub to Area 2."
"Okay now go back to Hub."
"Okay now for side quest 1 go from Hub to Area 1 again."
"Okay now go back to Hub."
"Okay now for quest 4 go from Hub to Area 3."

>>353554
I agree. Most of the 2D games feel like big interconnected worlds, where OoT just seemed like extensions from Hyrule Field with the occasional secret path between arms.

>>353554
>>353585
Some of the later games don't suffer so badly from this.

Twilight Princess is kind of a middle ground. It's like they tried to make a big world which you could explore, like the original games, but then they forgot to put anything in the world other than a lot of puddles, chasms and bridges.

Then the Wind Waker trilogy sort of cheated it by having tiny little patches of overworld connected by the tedious vehicle sequences (boats, steam boats and trains).

>>353619
I liked the way Wind Waker did it, though I think the execution was bad. The concept was good, and could have really been something more special.
Skyward sword is fucking awful about this. I couldn't even finish that game, it was so bad.

I've tried a few times to play LoZ, but I just never have any motivation. I have no idea where to go or what I'm trying to accomplish, and going through the same screens with respawned enemies multiple times gets tedious after a while.

At the same time, I love Super Metroid despite it giving you no real directions on where to go/what to do. Not sure why.

>>353347
That looks amazing

>>353638
>Skyward Sword
I couldn't finish it either. I felt like I was on a track. There was nothing to explore. Flying could've been cool, but there was nothing really in the sky to see.

>>353736
>I have no idea where to go or what I'm trying to accomplish, and going through the same screens with respawned enemies multiple times gets tedious after a while.

That's weird, because one could say the same thing about Metroid.

>>353779
I actually have the same problem with the original Metroid. But not with Super.

>>353736
>I have no idea where to go or what I'm trying to accomplish
That was more or less the point. It was an early experiment in adventure games that really emphasized exploration. The whole point was to have no idea where you are, and to be fully discovering and exploring a new world.
I loved it, but it's not really for everyone; you have to have an intrinsic love and drive for exploration, and most people don't have that anymore--They need a goal to goad them forward.

>>353736
LOZ manual gave you a mini map with the first 2 dungeons locations

>>353736
>>353792
http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/HugoBille/20120114/9236/

>>339554
Hell fucking yes I would.

Imagine a game where you find your first Octorok and the second it sees you, it'd rev itself up and rapid-fire stone slugs at you like a chaingun. If you just ran right at it like in pretty much every Zelda ever, you'd lose your three hearts before clearing even a third of the distance to it. You'd have to sneak up on it, run for cover with the Pegasus boots when it inevitably notices you, hit it with the slingshot while not getting your hand torn off in the process to stun it, and close the distance before it can turn you into swiss cheese. And that's an enemy that *doesn't* have any melee weapons to deal with.

I would love this so much. Make every enemy a serious threat, make costly solutions (Din's Fire, etc.) the best way to deal with hordes of enemies instead of just running through all of them with your sword. Make it so tough that every new item is accompanied by a sigh of relief, because now you actually have a tiny chance of making it out of the dungeon alive.

>>339554
fight against shadow link broken?
what did i miss?

>>353983
Ok, while I can agree that most enemies nowadays aren't much of a threat, I'm not a fan of your "super octorock". I'm actually more upset with the games since Ocarina of Time using Octorocks as stationary turrets.
The idea of bouncing thier rocks back at them is certainly neat and fun, but, and this merges with my thoughts on enemies in the overworlds since Ocarina in general, you don't really encounter more than one of them at a time, and the only way to beat them is to bounce the rocks.
Gone are the sections of overworld just TEEMING with creatures. This is my biggest dissapointment with Hyrule field, yeah it's one big open actually kinda boring field, but even worse, there's no life. No octorocks, no moblins (and I know tey changed moblins into those hulking beasts in the woods before the forest temple), no Goroyas...

>>354815 cont'd
as Young Link there's some Peahats around the outer edges of the field, and most of those are on the Death Mountain/Zora's River side. (granted most of the time as Young Link that's where you need to be). and At night you get endless Stalkids comin' at you two at a time...but that's it.

True, maybe the 3d element makes combat more difficult to handle more than 2 creatures at a time,since you can't see everything like in the top down games, but you're still more than capable of hitting several targets per swing, and that's not even counting the Spin attack.

Then as Adult Link...
There's nothing.
APPARENTLY somehow...despite Ganondorf taking over, Hyrule field is SAFER under his rule than it was before.

No Stal-anythings at night, the Peahats are gone, and there's a meager 10 Poes across the field that are there for a collection quest, and never come back once that sidequest is done.
Yeah there's regular poes (and I'm not sure, but I think they mark the locations of the special ones if you happen to not be riding Epona)...but only when you're on foot.

>>353392
I believe the Philips CDI version of Zelda is the worst in the series.

>>354826 cont'd again

It's like they decided that since you have a horse that you're pretty much invincible on, and teleportation songs, they don't need to bother filling the world map hub zone with monsters.

I don't think Octorocks should be ultimate killing machines...They are practically the Goombas of the Zelda franchise, and were most often just minding their own business and occasionally shooting rocks.
Nothing wrong with having them take a more active position in actually trying to end you, but have them move around, have THEM circle strafe while shooting while in "hunt you" mode.
more wandering monsters that strike a balance between actively out to get you and just protecting their territory.
They can even keep some of that personality they started having since wind waker (that look of shock when they first notice you), but let it be on a case by case basis, intelligent monsters versus predatorial wildlife.
(and then a third step in between: mindless monsters summoned by Ganondorf, not so much out to get you specifically, but out to threaten all who oppose Ganondorf/control the populace into hiding via threat of monster presence) which I believe Octorocks originally were).
*end*

>>340047
if you like it so much , you should know that you fight like 4 or 5 Iron Knuckles in the FIRST dungeon. (red ones show up in 2nd dungeon, blue ones in 3rd)

>>339703
>never had a fight