/vr/ - Retro Games

>>3483046
"In the end, who were the real monsters: the shrieking skinless pterodactyls... OR US?"

>>3483051
Kek. I always thought the pterodactyl were an odd enemy choice.

>>3483046
Great game but it felt a bit short, just finished it the other day,total time was about 7 hours and only died about 3 times
It's a shame there's nothing else like this game out there, would've loved to explore more of the town

I really wish there was a copy of that commercial that prominently featured the "absolutely not for children or the psychologically fragile" disclaimer.

Back then, everybody generally played games with no distraction. Friends came over and literally watched me play Silent Hill with no other additional entertainment required. If there was music, it was selected to compliment the game not distract from it. If a site was open on the computer, it would have been the gamefaqs page about the game. My pager was on vibrate and if my land line phone were to ring it would have startled the fuck out of us not been something that happened all night every night.

I swear to fucking God I'm going to start taking the girls camping somewhere there's no cell reception just to hook up a projector and playstation to the inverter in my truck and play some horror games 20th century style.

>>3483054
Yeah as much as I like SH2/3, the original has a unique feel to it. The better graphics on PS2 somehow made it less creepy to me.

>>3483057
Man that sounds like it'd be fun, hope it happens.
I'd love to do something like that with the guys and a couple of beers

>>3483057
The Vita has become my default system for PS1 gaming and especially survival horror. Just plug a good pair of headphones in and you get a great experience.

I actually just replayed the game on Hard the other day. I used to be able to beat the game in under 1h30 on Hard, no saving, but looks like I forgot a lot because I died quite a few times and didn't remember several things. Then I replayed it again and went for the best ending, fast run no saving times like old times, to see if I still got it.

There is one thing I have to say about this game is that the last part of the game, pretty much from the Moth part onwards, is very disappointing.
The first half of the game is very memorable, everything is balanced so well, exploration, puzzles, backtracking, shooting and fleeing, the environments, etc it all comes down together.

The last part of the game, with the Moth onwards, however is a whole different story. It's a lot more linear and cheap. The last town part not only is small but there are not many places to visit, no buildings you can find solely to be rewarded with supplies for instance. Then starting that moment, all the level design is very linear, some locations are almost straight lines too.
The 2nd sewer for instance feels very cheap, it's like a re-use of the first sewer except much more linear.

Finally there is nowhere, which is a really cheap re-use of locations we've already visited. Not to mention that, we've already been through the hospital twice, once in fog world and once in otherworld, and now it reuses that a third time, which is one time too much.

This is still a great game and my 2nd favourite Silent Hill, but too bad it drops the cake in the last part, the first half was perfect.

Is there any other game this scary on ps1

>>3483054
> only finishing silent hill once

>>3483065
Agreed. Headphones are practically mandatory in this day and age. Maybe if this current surge in virtual reality takes off people will actually shit their pants again instead of being all "lol video games aren't scary" *hair flip* *takes a hit from nicotine free vape*

>>3483060
The spookiest time the year is upon us, Anon.

>>3483069
Yeah I agree. I'd imagine the recycled locations are mostly due to technical limitations.

>>3483071
Not really. At that time you pretty much only had Resident Evil as an alternative.

>>3483071
Hell Night was a game that I missed back in the day and I ended up paying it on my xplay sitting in my truck with a patch cable to the stereo while I waited for a girl to get finished partying with her sibs but she ended up passing out. It has that "you are being chased by a monster that WILL kill you if it catches you" feel that really gets to me as my instincts are more fight than flight which is why I like Silent Hill so much. Hell Night has one of those more deeply disturbing plots than Resident Evil do you might find it to be pretty scary if that specifically speaks to you.

Finally I'd like to point out that I played the PAL version and it's actually a great PAL conversion.

It actually runs at the intended speed, and it runs in a resolution of 320*256 with no black bars, while the NTSC-U version seem to run in 320*240 with black bars.

The PAL seems to be a little less smooth on the animations though but I think the pros make up for the cons. I also like the replacement of the children-with-knife better, I think it fits with other enemies better.

screenshot comparison
>NTSC-U

>PAL

That is using pSXFIN so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

>>3483079
I'm going to guess that one never made its way to North America?

>>3483079
Tried getting into hell night, it's creepy but it feels cheap and lacks polish, yea sure that sort of adds to the atmosphere but I just couldn't get into it after the first level

>>3483083
Saying that tho I'd still recommend it to friends and because they've never heard of it I like to make up creepy stories about it like "only game the developers made cuz they all died and that only a few copies were released in English cuz the game could be cursed"

>>3483082
Yeah but I had a mod chip and a cd burner (that cost me $300!) Back then and I knew a little shop that rented imports but they never even had a copy.

Aconcagua is another game I miss back then that's not even a horror game just a straight survival game but it's scary just from how successfully it conveys the unforgiving environment of surviving a mountain top plane crash and knowing that situations like that have actually happened to people.

Anyone ever fucked around with the bonus weapons? How's the katana?

>>3483087
The katana isn't game breaking compared to the fire axe but the energy blaster is OP as fuck. Chain gun tier or higher.

>>3483091
Are there any restrictions on difficulty level to unlock the bonus weapons? Can you get everything on normal?

>>3483101
No you can do them on normal. Can you even get full endings on easy? You can get the hyper blaster just by plugging a PS1 Konami Justifier into the player two port

>>3483046
>check /vr/ for the first time in months
>SH thread on top
Neat! I guess this is a perfect place to dump this latest SH PC Guide + the DL links for 1-4:

SH1 NTSC DDL:
https://mega.nz/#!bVUCTJzD!PmnPw4S7fWGyvTjw9S0-RQdk7rRp2BQNuXJqRkZCZvk

SH2 DDL:
https://mega.nz/#!rFcj1SIJ!47JH9M4OrzmQKuaiJ6IqUgmgz_SVNtk4LIYNSa-D-_8

SH2 torrent:
https://mega.nz/#!bYcEnbhC!rYnhvcJiRC46T6yExS0Y61JHZ-5N3WxFvfZMI8xbyhE

SH3 DDL:
https://mega.nz/#!2JNkgJ7b!nfPf5cIs6I5K-sdAs7RcnHvGA2hAvIGdpQuIoBhF3iE

SH3 torrent:
https://mega.nz/#!GVVGRLpD!SyklVbuLIkc38ZYji5QL3sWHKtHt9-Bto700My8pH7c

SH4 DDL:
https://mega.nz/#!Us1XTaII!cglH0dZOaH5yQEm4cnEh3eyUz4bIf6rACQqcVzkb4Hc

Mount the ISOs of 2 & 3, and then run their installers like always.
The SH1 is a PS1 rip that you gotta emulate.
The "sh2proxy" is a all-in-one fix, that works as a no-cd crack as well. It is included in the pack.
If you use the NEW fix mentioned in the guide, you can use the sh2proxy's EXE as the no-cd crack!

In case you experience issues saving the game / not being able to edit the disp.ini, make sure the files aren't set to "Read Only", and run the game as Administrator.
If SH2 gets stuck in a black screen upon launch, close it and re-start it again.

SH2-4 do not support Xinput gamepads. Either use Xpadder, a DirectInput pad, or just play with KB+M.

>>3483175
Here's the good ol' recommended emulator settings for SH1. Works great on all other games too, and run great even on toasters.

The plugins used are:
-Pete's OpenGL 1.78; (more options & better performance than 2.x version)
-Eternal's SPU Engine.

alternatively just use a software renderer for very 1:1 PS1-like graphics, including 240p only.
...OR just buy the game from PSN Store for few bucks.

You could also try the new PGXP emulator, that adds Perspective Correction to PS1 textures. I've heard people having various issues with it though.

>>3483080
>I also like the replacement of the children-with-knife better, I think it fits with other enemies better.
I don't quite agree. I'm an old ass PAL player myself, and the 1/6th slower pace (yes, it IS slower on actual console) + altered enemies just bother me to no end. There's a clear symbolic meaning for each enemy, which is totally lost in the PAL version. Not to mention the Sewer Bears were originally a separated, much stronger enemy type in the game, which is now indistinguishable from regular foes.

On top of that, the re-translation is a bit dodgier on PAL version.
The only real con on it is that one single piece of note you get to read by playing the game right, which shines some light to the game's backstory. Said note is not accessible in NTSC version thanks to a programming error.

>>3483180
> and the 1/6th slower pace (yes, it IS slower on actual console)

Are you sure about this? I tested both versions back to back in pSX and it felt exactly the same running speed for the character.
Not every American/Jap game runs slower in their PAL version. Some devs put extra effort in the PAL conversion, like for instance SMB1 on NES even runs about about 10% faster than the NTSC versions. Good PAL conversions were a minority, but they existed.
Generally I find the difference obvious and here it seemed exactly the same.

Is there a list somewhere of the translation differences, you mean the English PAL is different than the English NTSC- U?
Also which note is missing?

>>3483203
I am 100% sure.
I still own my original PAL copy, and after years of playing the NTSC version on emulators, I was just shocked to realize how sluggish Harry's jog-stomping is compared to the NTSC version.

>Some devs put extra effort in the PAL conversion
True, but not even nearly everyone.

>Is there a list somewhere of the translation differences, you mean the English PAL is different than the English NTSC- U?
Yes, the English translations are different.

Their tone and even quality vary quite a bit.
For example, examining this bloody corpse in the very beginning is something like "Jesus! What is that?!" in USA version, while in PAL one, Harry merely wonders "What? What is this?". Similarly, if you go check out Harry's jeep later on, and he starts wondering about whereabouts of Cheryl, the European version has a silly typo: "I PREY she's safe."

>Also which note is missing?
A newspaper clip about Gillespie house fire, which you can read in Nowhere, but only if you have read every other related note during the game.

>>3483051
That is some beautiful glass effects.

Are the shards 2D or 3D?

>>3483253
animated 2D sprites.

>>3483258
Konami had some damn technical wizards on their staff back then. It's so sad to see how far they've fallen since the early 00s.

>>3483272
Konami themselves have been quite a bunch of morons for well over a decade now. Their best known titles (MGS, SH...) have always been done by their smaller teams, like Team-Silent and Kojima Productions.

Team-Silent for example was fairly quickly put together, and Konami considered them to be their worst artists and programmers. I shit you not. Their only assumed role was to quickly make a RE-clone to cash in with the ongoing horror-boom, but lucky for us, the TS guys decided to do something a biiit more original and subtle.

Team-Silent's guys were some true workaholic and detail-maniacs. Their games look pretty stunning for their original platforms, with tons of subtle, fine details and effects coming visible once you bump up the resolution and start playing with the camera.
The audio-work by the series' veteran composer, Akira Yamaoka, is just legendary at this point, and easily creates more than half of the saga's superb atmosphere.

And how were these creative minds rewarded? Exactly the same way as Kojima last year: team broken down, guys kicked out, and the IP whored around to the lowest bidders around the globe.

>>3483240
I feel no difference regarding the running speed between the two.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhguoQXvsJc

NTSC until 0:32, then PAL.

Maybe it's a pSX thing though.

>>3483295
like said, emulators =/= real deal.

You can easily replicate the feeling of NTSC' SH1 on PAL copy with emulators, just by upping the framerate-limit to 60fps instead of 50. You may only face minor sound issues like that, but nothing too major.

The difference's definitely visible with ePSXe, using automatic FPS limit setting.

>>3483293
Never knew that. What a great underdog story. A ragtag team creating one of the best horror series in gaming.

>>3483298

Well, I could remake the exact same video by pressing tab, which would show that pSX is running the first half of the video in "60hz" and the 2nd in "50hz". If it was speed up you'd notice it with the music though.

I can't make a comparison with the "real deal", but you also said yourself that you played the NTSC version in emulator, so I'm still not convinced the PAL version plays slower. It's less smooth though.

>>3483293
>smaller teams
>Kojima Productions
Kojima has always had the biggest team in konami since mgs2. And it only grew with every new release.

>>3483303
Yeah, their tale seems to be forgotten by times nowadays. The fanbase has always been well aware of TS' efforts and rough treatment.

The last year's destruction of Kojima Productions was pretty big hit for old-fag fans like me, not only because it was so much like what happened a decade ago to TS (with more media coverage though), but also because Kojima himself was good, old friends with many ex-TS members, and the revealed Silent Hills project could've meant many of the old Team's key-members (Akira, Ito, etc.) coming back together and work on the game.

If you have played SH1-3 already, I'd suggest watching the "Making Of..." -videos of said games. Really shine some light to the team's design philosophy and efforts. We Europoors actually were lucky, as SH2 was initially released only as this 2-disc "special" edition, which had the Making Of SH2 and many other bonuses on the second disc, so I got to watch it at early age. They all should be on YT these days.

>>3483304
I guess I could try to make a cam-recording of PAL and NTSC versions running "side by side" on an actual machine, but dunno if I'm up for that this very moment.

>>3483313
True, but it was merely an underling group within Konami's empire of sort. That continuous growth and thus potential influence in decision making is said to be one of the reasons Konami's execs gave the death-blow to KojiPro last year.

>>3483314
Team Silent wasn't exactly "a" team anyway, more like the name given for the team working on a SH game every time. Keiichiro Toyama left after the first game, and SH2, while keeping the main tropes, looks and feel of the first game, went in a completely different direction as to what Silent Hill, where it comes from and what it means.
The few "Team Silent" people who worked on several entries in the series generally didn't work on more than 2, and had a different role every time anyway. Let's also not forget that for The Room, the team only became "Team Silent" after a while of development.

>>3483178
ah, I remember seeing you before. you recommended me SH a couple of months ago. Time flies.

>>3483327
While the overall composition of the Team did indeed change (that's totally normal in game-dev circles), they were still pretty much a specific group of their own, occupying a floor of their own in the Konami's main building, just a floor or two below Kojima Productions if I recall right. The "teams" in TS did co-operate quite during the development of SH2-3, that were being worked almost simultaneously.

>>3483319
They killed it because it was a parasite on the game department. Kojima as the VP of Konami and chief of the whole gaming division lowly outsourced IPs and closed smaller teams to funnel money to his own project. Thier mistake was putting Kojima on a directorial position and give him power to decide what gets green lighted. The effect of his 11 year tenure is the total dissolution of smaller teams and degradation some of the biggest IPs in console history. Gradius/Castlevania/Silent Hill/Contra all of them killed during his reign. Kojmia might be considered a brilliant designer but is a shit president.

>>3483329
It sure does. Hope you've enjoyed the series during these weeks!

>>3483054
>>3483058
I disagree and have been wanting to see this game be remade for modern consoles. Of course I want to see them keep the gameplay and story mostly intact as well. That's an issue with modern gaming though. No games come out with those cinematic camera angles that Silent Hill had.

There definitely is nothing else like these games. 1 is basically the spookiest of the series.

>>3483338
I don't see how any of that would be true.
Whatever Kojima "wasted" in his budgets, he always scored back multi-folds with the sales.

Silent Hill had been whored to random western teams long before Kojima's "reign of terror", and in general Konami has never ever really cared for SH in the first place. Anyone trying to defend them in this series' case is not worth even the title of "human being" in my eyes.

All those other IPs... I'd say their fate has been the result of times changing and purely lazy devs. Castlevania never really managed to adopt the 3rd dimension like so many other series, and you can milk the same basic 2D formula only so long; the Symphony of the Night really was the overkill pinnacle of the saga. Gradius and Contra on the other hand are remains of the late 80s arcade eras, and while appealing in their own, primitive forms, their type really does not work or sell well this day and age.

Hell, I even had to Google Gradius now, as I seriously couldn't recall shit about it, and my first thought was "Oh, one of these shoot'em ups"; I had such game already on my ancient Nokia 3310 phone.

>>3483362
Sadly all we ended up getting was Shattered Memories. Not entirely awful but the chase scenes were so repetitive and just got annoying.

>>3483365
I've heard Downpour wasn't entirely bad. I have no interest in Homecoming though. Origins was alright for what it was.

>>3483365
Kojima became a director of Konami right after getting his studio that was in 05 i.e year after Gradius V just hit the stores and the same year SH Origins was outsourced to western devs and he was the one that outsourced CV. I still stand by my theory that his decision played part in all of that. After 06 Konami started it's descent into the MGS and PES company.

>>3483373
>I've heard Downpour wasn't entirely bad
You've heard wrong. My personal, honest opinion is, that it is THE worst SH game ever. Period.

Downpour was the game I was genuinely excited and optimistic about, but it was a huge disappointment:

-No Akira's soundtracks. You can hear it, you can FEEL it.
-The MC's inner monologue = fucking annoying.
-Indicators, flashing items and tips everywhere! Try to play without them, and you gonna be all lost for a while at least, as the game was DESIGNED with them to be ON.
-The chase scenes were annoying. Especially the last one. And I fucking liked SM for crying out loud.
-Bad and limited enemy design.
-A handful of characters that just... are. I guess they tried to personify the Town or something, but come on.
-The environments? Boring & full of copypaste.
-The side missions? POINTLESS in the end, as you get ripped off all your gear, and they don't even effect the ending!
-BAD combat. Yeah I know, and I always ran past 90% of enemies in originals as well, but holy shit this is WORSE than in SH1-4 if you ask me.
-UT3 engine bugs and annoyances (texture & area streaming, usually lagging badly behind, the Subway doors getting locked, random bug of being unable to pick up items ...)
-QTE -like scenes.
Last the story... there technically isn't one! It's not deep or cryptic at all, it's just CONFUSING - most probably because before the very end, the game doesn't know how the story even goes, when your choices are evaluated. In this sense the game actually contradicts ITSELF earlier on, as there's no alternative cutscenes or discussion choices.
Yes, it's slightly better than Origins, can't say any better than HC, but it's still a BAD horror game, and worse SH-game. Far from the original Tetralogy.

>>3483373
>I've heard Downpour wasn't entirely bad.
Who the hell dared to speak such lies??
>Origins was alright for what it was.
urgh, I hated that shit as well.
Clunky as fuck, and a complete lore-rape towards SH1, and thus the entire series.

SH1-4 are the only games that are even worth mentioning.

>>3483381
Damn. What about Siren: Blood Curse? I bought it on PSN a while back but never got around to it. I believe a couple members of team silent worked on it?

>>3483053

They explain that somewhere, can't remember where. Cheryl/Alessa loved reading books about dinosaurs.

My favourite genuinely is Homecoming, I think it's very underrated, misunderstood, and its supposed flaws or exagerated or lies, but I honestly don't feel like arguing over it a 1000th time, besides it's not retro.

>>3483387
Director of SH1 left after SH1 and made both Siren games.

Personaly I can't stand them due to the gameplay; it's HEAVY trial&error, like step by step figuring out where the devs want you to walk.

>>3483387
>What about Siren: Blood Curse?
Played it couple years ago.
Hated it a lot.

-Visuals are can't-see-shit-capt mess, resulted by darkness + filters + narrov FOV + jumpy low FPS + split-screen effects.
-Controls can be just weird and clunky.
-Gameplay in general is bizarre, with some of THE most obscure, obligatory "mission objectives" I've ever seen. There's no room for improvisation or experimentation; you either do EXACTLY what devs wanted, or die repeatedly.
-The story and ending were literally "AMURICAH, FUCK YEARRR!!", and made my head hurt.
-I just hate that TV-series "design"; ruins pacing and immersion to me.

Siren series in general tends to have this kind of issues. And no, just the director of SH1 was involved with Siren games. They got nice ideas, but terrible implementation.

>>3483396
>My favourite genuinely is Homecoming
I just died a bit.

>>3483046
>first playthrough
>miss the rifle
The one fucking time I don't scour every corner of every room like an autist and I miss a unique item.

>>3483381

The enemies were fucking shit too.

Big-Pyramid-Head ripoff man with a gas mask.
Evil devil homie ese.
Evil devil nun.
Evil devil homie with no hair.

>pSX all over this thread
Did I step into 2006? Why? Doesn't it still choke on copy protected titles?

Even ZSNESxe is better now, with Mednafen/RA being the obvious way way to go.

>>3483327
If you check the credits, only Toyama left after 1. 2 was made by the whole team that was left, and then the team split in two parts to make 3 and 4 somewhat simultaneously. Like >>3483337 says, they where still very much considered just one team, and the persons involved in it seem to agree with this grouping too.

>>3483480
did you find the Fire Hammer and Hand Axe? Those are easily missed too.

>>3483565
PSXFin and ePSXe work just fine for SH1.

>Mednafen/RA being the obvious way way to go.
who the living fuck would want to use that shit??

>>3483646
>I'm too retarded to convert to bin/cue, or find the bios files

Someone who cares about accuracy, compatibility (psxfin doesn't run several because it's fuck old), and no skippy frame time issues on Win 8 or later (a problem with ePSXe). RA also reduces input lag pretty considerably with vsync on. PSXfin's input lag is out of fucking control with vsync. Play a shmup on it with vsync on. Please

>>3483652
>>I'm too retarded to convert to bin/cue, or find the bios files
what the hell does that have to do with anything? The PS1 rips pretty much are .bin or .bios by default.

>accuracy
ah, there's that buzzword again. Never explained.

>skippy framerate on W8 or later
Anyone dumb to use W8 or later is asking for it. Literally subhuman fucks in my eyes.

Also morons, since the said settings + ePSXe has worked just fine on the W8.1 craptop I once used.

>Vsync
Why the fuck would you use that when emulating??

>>3483718
Tearing is heightened in 2D games.

That you aren't put off by it or Win8+'s forced DWM fucking with frame times intermittently (not framerate so much, it'll retain 60) shows some terminally plebby tendencies.

Your shit works for you. Great. It's also inferior.

>>3483792
Continued, but on the accuracy front ePSXe is pretty good these days. However it still has the aforementioned sync issues.

>>3483792
>>3483794
like implied, I'm using and sticking to my W7 Ultimate for a good reason. W8 and up fucking up even 20 year old emulation is just more the reason to avoid that crap.

I seldom emulate 2D PS1 games though, and fps limitation seems better option than Vsync anyway.

>>3483852
FPS limitation is not a vsync replacement. A game running at ~20fps will tear just like a 60fps game without vsync enabled in the game or without something like DWM which forces vsync.

>>3483046
do the Japanese actually think when they write dialogue, or do they just put together syllables they think sound good?

>>3483058
it's a weird thing.
all the things that would normally bring a game down really just added to the atmosphere.

>>3483180
>There's a clear symbolic meaning for each enemy
What do the moth, dogs, flying gargoyles, cockroaches, nurses and doctors, sewer enemies, basement lizard etc. all symbolize?

Is there ANY enemy in SH1 other than the school children that can be seen as symbolizing anything?

>>3483974
wut.
most of that can be figured out by playing the game and reading everything.
the rest is stuff most little girls would be afraid of

>>3483974
Every single element in the game has a symbolic origin, just like in the sequels.

Like Harry well puts it in the game, it's literally someone's nightmarish delusions coming alive in flesh. In this case, it all originates from Alessa, with her own personal subjects of fear and hatred getting projected into reality through a nightmarish, tortured filter of sort.
She was afraid of bugs and large animals, and the Lost World was one of her favorite books, though she didn't like the flying dinos. The sewer bears were influences by the stories of monsters living in the sewers, and the ape-like creatures by the adults who misstreated her. And do we really need to explain puppet nurses and doctors, who kept her forcefully alive and locked in a basement for 7 years?

>>3483904
To be fair, it is a memorable and creepy line even if it doesn't make sense.

>>3484648
That's just being a weeaboo.

>>3484673
?

>>3484693
general shitposting method on this part of 4chan.
just ignore it.

>>3483904
makes sense.
who wants to get hurt?

>>3484001
>the rest is stuff most little girls would be afraid of
Then it's not symbolic. It's just shit that Alessa is scared of.

>>3483293
Not to mention they made their own graphics engine for SH2, 3 and 4. That takes a special level of dedication.

>>3483337
>>3483587
That still doesn't make Team Silent it "a" team that worked on all four first games, especially if you think of 1 and 4.

>>3484039
How does that make half of those monsters "symbolic" ? I get it with the nurses/doctors as well as ape creatures and children in the school, all symbolizing how different humans treated her, but because the rest "is all taken from a book or her fears" doesn't make them "symbolize" anything.

Look, I love the Silent Hill series, but there is something about it, its mystery, that makes players inclined to try and interpret everything they see. Doing that is a good thing, and it's a good way of making players be inside the game's world, but that doesn't mean that everything little thing was made to have a deep hidden meaning with symbols everywhere.

I think a lot of fans exaggerate a lot in that regard. Dogs, giant lizards, worms and moths, don't symbolize anything. They tried to give a sense to most of those enemies being there, for instance with the tale about the giant lizard, but that doesn't make them symbolize anything else or have some "deep meaning".
Dogs and giant insects are just generic survival horror enemies straight out of their Resident Evil inspiration.

I would also like to point out that as far as bosses are concerned, Homecoming, a non "Team Silent" game, did a much better job at the whole "symbolize" and "meaning" thing. Most of the bosses are monsters born from the children that were sacrificed, and just by their looks, as well as the way they behave and their attacks, or sometimes even the way the boss get born, you can guess everything that has happened to them and the way they were killed or tortured. Even their gameplay behaviours are at the service of the story and "symbolize" the children's fates. A lot more attention was given to them than just "generic animal/insect that we give a backstory to".

>>3485029
But that, nobody wanted to see, or even tried to see, because they were too busy claiming it's shit because "not Team Silent" or "western" or claiming it's anything like RE4, which it isn't, because of the camera angle, which is fucking superficial; or because they rage quit and shouted madness a few seconds into the game because a wheelchair comes running down stairs, which they claimed was a "cheap scare not worthy of the deep horror of the franchise" even though SH1 is full of cheapscares. (for instance the stuff after the cat in the locker sequence, or the tons of times when a loud weird sound will pierce the audio in a moment when the player is likely to feel safe, etc)

>>3485036
OP here. You've actually convinced me to give Homecoming a try and to avoid Downpour. Cheers.

>>3485029
>Dogs, giant lizards, worms and moths, don't symbolize anything.
If they have a psychological origin in a person's mentality, they do have a symbolical meaning. They are not exactly "real" beings, just manifestations of trauma and strong emotions.
Nobody said that the things would have a "deep meaning", but they do have a meaning, per se. It's really not much different from SH2, which every other person worships for its "deepness" and symbolism; you just got an adult man with vastly different past working as the source material for these projections.

I despise HC notably less than most other non-TS games in the series, but it really does not even try to be "deep" or "symbolic". It merely copypastes various elements from other horror games and films, and tries to make a soup out of it by using SH's implied supernatural elements as the plot device. The main enemies fall into the now so legendary "lets copy SH2!" category, and even the bosses are literally on the level of 15yo SH fan's fanfictions, not even trying to be subtle or original.

>>3485036
Let me also state that I own and have finished every single home-console SH release out there. HC twice already actually. I can stomach it a bit more than Origins and Downpoor, but it really won't get praise from me. Just from the dev interviews it's clear that these guys came in with their shallow yet eager SH-fanboy-ism, and thought they could make a fitting game. But just like with oh so many yank remakes of any media product ever, they made a smooth and fast combat their top priority; something that ends up being a joke of its own, since the basic Knife is the most OP weapon in the game, stunlocking enemies with ease.

>SH1 is full of cheapscares.
welp, a cat or a loud noise spooked you, and now you're pissed off?
Talk about being a little bitch nigger and digging for something to complain about.

>>3485040
>Homecoming

get ready to be underwhelmed. A few nice move-like dark-SH effects, a combat system that works but might feel too RE4-esque for SH. There isnt much too the game.

>>3483175
thank you based SH dump anon

>>3485185
yer welcome!

>>3485130
>"lets copy SH2!" category

I don't think they had much choice, considering on one hand how the story in previous titles went, and on the other hand they're being hated on for every bit of thing that strays away from the previous title.
But actually there is more to it than that. The problem with the story of the previous titles, is that some do completely different things. In some games the meaning and existence of Silent Hill is more due to the cult, and in SH2 it's all about the protagonist's mind. The Room tried to connect both sides of the franchise story and make sense out of it, but it felt forced and cheap. Homecoming does it, and I think does it really smoothly. It's not just "copy paste SH2", in HC Silent Hill isn't even a projection of the protag's mind, but it takes elements from the series that contradict themselves and links them together in a believable way, thus fixing the mess that was caused by SH2 doing its own thing storywise.

As for the bosses I don't know what else to say that I've already said except detail it more.

>since the basic Knife is the most OP weapon in the game, stunlocking enemies with ease.

Ah, let's come down to gameplay. For me HC has the best survival gameplay in the entire series. In SH1 to 4 you can just safely spam with your guns from a distance with huge camera angles showing you everything, there is little danger whatosever from most combat (SH1 has it a little better because it has better level design). Then, supplies are plentiful, except in SH4 the only limit in your inventory, when there is one is like 200 bullets; and supplies can be found easily everywhere in plain sight. On top of that, enemies are very easy to outrun and dodge, and the level design often helps that too.
As far as survival gameplay go, SH games are a joke. Even Resident Evil 3 on easy is harder.

>>3485036
>the camera angle is fucking superficial
god damn your eyes nesfag

>>3485201

In HC, none of that is true. You can't spam from a distance, it doesn't work. You have to put yourself at risk. Most enemies are a lot harder to dodge, from instance to dodge dogs you have to time rolls perfectly, and if you miss and they succeed in jumping on your back, you're dead, even at full hp.
Not only supplies are a LOT more scarce but the limit to how much ammo you can carry is very limiting, iirc it's like 12 or 18 bullets for the revolver.
There is real survival gameplay tension in this game. As for the knife, it's not something you'd realize on first(s) playthrough(s), and as far as survival horror goes, that's the most important, since the more you know the game, the slower the stakes become. Other SH games too flaws and exploits, and that's on top of what I just said about their gameplay.

As for it being anything like RE4, it's true and not true at the same time. There are exagerations on its "action" orientation, the enemies you "have" to kill are very rare, and they represent mini boss fights of a sort.
As for the camera angle, which IS like RE4, it's part of what it took to fix the issues pervious SH games had above (being able to spam from a distance etc) and it's the only link this has with RE4.

As for HC's so called "action orientation", people need to realize that action has always been part of survival horror, it's part of the definition, without "action" they would be "adventure horror" games like Dark Fall or whatever. Survival Horror has always been about taking action from traditional action games, and translating that to survival action. As time went on, traditional action games allowed more moves with better controls and become more advanced, and so did survival horror. SH1 for instance, which came out 3 years after RE1, allows for a LOT more moves than RE1.

>>3485219
HC was the beginning of a new generation and therefore the controls and camera angles followed; It would have been suicide to release another RE1 type game in that time when everybody called them clunky.
But this being, if you look at the moves, it doesn't do much more. It has a little more compared to previous SH titles just like SH1 had a little more than RE1.
In terms of quantity, HC doesn't have more action than previous titles. The number of enemies is even largely reduced in HC, where in SH1-4 you'd find tons of enemies on the street, here you almost never find more than 3 together.
As for the type of action, as HC is not RE4 style "shoot everything with endless ammo drops", as seen with my description of combat and supplies above.

>>3485210
I didn't say camera angles were surperficial. I said that claiming that HC is a RE4 clone just because of the camera angle, is being a superficial person when all of the game's gameplay is anti-RE4. RE4 wants you to shoot everything, and it has endless drops of supplies from dead enemies which is programmed to make sure you never run out.

>>3485201
>In some games the meaning and existence of Silent Hill is more due to the cult
Bullshit. The "cult" has always been a minor cog in a much bigger machine, a mere "late adopters" of the area's power. And even they did not exactly push through any kind of apocalypse agenda; that was all on Dahlia's own little "sect" of sorts.

>and in SH2 it's all about the protagonist's mind.
Not exactly. And like mentioned earlier, in a way SH1 was all about Alessa's "mind", same thing with #3. Fourth one was all about Walter from start to finish, and merely demonstrated how you could utilize the town's powers to free yourself of your earthly bonds. Don't see anything forced nor cheap about it really.

>Homecoming does it, and I think does it really smoothly.
By setting the game to totally different town, having totally different (yet very The Movie-esque) cult, that has to deal with totally different "god" / power of their won?

>in HC Silent Hill isn't even a projection of the protag's mind, but it takes elements from the series that contradict themselves and links them together in a believable way
I see nothing believable in a literal, generic "lol amnesia" + literal demons that need to be kept happy with human sacrifices plot. Not to mention all those The Movie ripoff elements, from the implied coal-fire to the punisher-style PH / Boogeyman.

>For me HC has the best survival gameplay in the entire series
That's not survival. That's literally 3rd person shooter / slasher gameplay. You either lock yourself to the room for X minutes to deal with the unpassable enemies, or you just run.
The combat and action were never the main point nor appeal in the series. Merely a necessary evil, that you had to deal with occasionally. HC literally appeals to DaS fanbase.

>Even Resident Evil 3 on easy is harder.
Nope.

>In HC, none of that is true. You can't spam from a distance, it doesn't work.
since Knife kills everything with ease, you got tons of ammo to spam.

>>3485227
The only difference between RE4 and HC is that latter is melee-focused, while RE4 is gun focused.

Both tried to do similar "overhaul" to their series. In SH's case, it was just the last thing any sensible person would even consider necessary.

the part where soldierboy kills movie cultists like it's no big deal is probably the worst part of the entire franchise

>>3485256
don't forget literal Hostel ripoff scenes.
plus, this puzzle? All my hate!

>>3484795
and?
so are the other things, some just come from books and the other things are based on real fears.

What's the fucking hardest puzzle for you?
>tfw shakespeare puzzle

>>3485563
can't really beat that.
then again, I know jack shit about Shakespeare.

>>3485563
boy did i feel like an idiot

i liked running around town.
it would have been neato to go into more of the buildings just to see the inside of some of them

>>3485563
oh yeah, shakespeare on hard was impossible
actually, most of the puzzles on the hard difficulty in 2 and 3 were a problem for me
the piano puzzle in 1 was legendary when the game came out

>>3487174
I remember how fans used to speculate that in SH5, yiu could finally enter ALL the buildings, no door would be broken, and enemies could actually follow you from room to room. .. all thanks to the power of the PS3!

Oh how naive and optimistic we used to be...

>>3483381
>No Akira's soundtracks.
Yeah instead we got Korn.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83hl5TlAbDA

While I like Korn, it just isn't the same.

>>3483053
It ruined the game for me until I realized Cheryl drew purple pterodactyls in her scrapbook.

>>3490046
Huh. Never thought about that.

Also, just today I realized that one of the first things you see is Harry, Cybil, and a baby, which is also one of the last things you in the ending.
Not really a lore guy, I just thought it was interesting.

>>3483298
>giant fan.gif
Damn, the atmosphere of sh1 is so heavy.

>>3490093
>Also, just today I realized that one of the first things you see is Harry, Cybil, and a baby,
No, at first you see Harry, his wife, and the baby.

This is re-created with Cybil in Good+ ending, after which I think it replaces the original beginning cinematic, if you keep a memorycard with NewGame+ save in the console.

>Huh. Never thought about that.
She had pictures of many monstrosities on the floor. Also butterfly and other bug specimen on her walls.

They even continue this trend in sh3, showing quite clear Closers in one of the drawings on floor.

>>3492608
some drawings on the floor

i know it aint really vr but what are your opinions on the twin perfect silent hill videos?
honestly i think they're perfect

>>3494259
I honestly like them. Yeah, they do some silly over-acting and strawman-examples on purpose, but that does not undermine their hard research work. Unlike most online-theorist, these guys at least provide sources and evidence for their statements.

Their HD Collection and Downpoor reviews are just superb. The only video I do not quite agree on is the SH:SM one.

>>3483053
The game's partiall ybased on The Mist by Stephen King that had similar pink buglike things. Really worth reading if you haven't

>>3485239
>The "cult" has always been a minor cog in a much bigger machine

That's ridiculous, the cult has one of the main roles in 1 and 3. No cult, no story in both. Alessa lives happily ever after as a normal adult who lost contact with her mother because she used to beat her up as a kid.

>same thing with #3
Actually the game tells you it's Claudia's nightmare, which is very close to what Homecoming did (one person in the cult versus the entire cult).
Anyway, my point was SH2 is solely focused on the character's delusions completely getting rid or other essential points that are needed for Silent Hill to exist in 1,3 or HC, like the cult.

>By setting the game to totally different town

Boo fucking hoo. The entire first part of Silent Hill 3 up until the father's death takes place in another town, otherworld and all. Again, what you're complaining about regarding HC was already done in previous titles and nobody cares. Forced incoherent nitpicking.

As for the cult, it evolved and was completely different in 3 as well. HC doesn't take place in the same time period. The Cult evolves with time, and with it everything related to it. There is a book you can read at the end of SH3 that even tells you that, that all religion evolve and can even change the name of their god, and that the cult is NO exception.

>since Knife kills everything with ease, you got tons of ammo to spam.
No, because like I said not only supplies are a LOT more scarce, but your inventory has a very small limit to what you can carry.

>>3485243
SH3 already installed the heavy melee focus.

>>3485239
>That's not survival. That's literally 3rd person shooter / slasher gameplay.
Everything about what I said is the definition of survival. You're denying chore gameplay elements of both genres for the sake of shitting on HC. SH2 fans are as delusionals are their fav protag. Only a very small percent of the enemies in the game you HAVE to kill. A regular action games would have much more than that, and would reward you for killing with ammo drops. But I've already explained the difference between HC and RE4, you just chose to deny the facts.

>>Even Resident Evil 3 on easy is harder.
>Nope.
I just replayed SH2 on Hard. Hadn't played it in YEARS so all the gameplay details like enemy/item placement I had forgotten. SH2 hands out supplies like you would candy on a kid's birthday. the worst offender is the otherworld outdoor town part, which is supposed to be harder, scarier than the regular one, but instead there are TONS of supplies in every corner. On top of that, unlike in 1 or HC, dodging enemies in the town is ridiculously easy. You don't even need to dodge actually, just keep running straight. Try that in HC. On Hard I had about 100 shotgun shells left when I beat SH2 and I shot a LOT of enemies.

>>3485256
>>3485265
I admit that these 2 things, the cult enemies and the slide puzzles, are the worst things about HC. However, it at least gave an actual game presence ot the cult; such an important part of the story is yet barely seen in either 1 or 3.

As for the game's influences.... it's not like Silent Hill isn't Jacob's Ladder in Resident Evil land to begin with.

>>3495740
>>3495753
>the cult has one of the main roles in 1 and 3.
>...(HC) at least gave an actual game presence ot the cult; such an important part of the story is yet barely seen in either 1 or 3.
There's a conflict in your statements.

Yes, the "cult" was one of the important factors in the series lore, but not the source of all evil and happenings like some try to claim. Some ignorant people treat the SH's "cult" like some sort of generic satan-worshipping inner circle, when in reality their entire existence is based on Christianity, and idea of the god being born / returning on Earth one day, triggering the apocalypse.

It is hinted and even shown that it was only the small group led by Dahlia that tried to speed up this promised phenomenon, made possible by her psychic daughter.

It's also weird to try to claim that SH2 would "strip" itself of all cult material, when it is such a big part of the town's entire history. Not to mention the whole Alessa incident did clearly "crack" the powers of the area, resulting them to go haywire and run on sort-of autopilot, thus resulting lesser mental projections out of just about everyone's heads into existence.

What comes to the actual PLOTS of the SH1-3, they were very much personal tales, with the things you see and inter act with being related to a single person. Cult's role was mostly kept in the lore, with only handful of craziest / most foxy pricks daring to come to the stage. There might've been parts of Claudia's "nightmares" mixed in SH3's events, but I'm pretty sure it's mostly all Heather + her "god" baby recreating similar phenomenons in the outer world as in SH1.

Overall, I highly prefer the cult when it's subtle and mostly kept in the shadows, nor a literal witch-hunting nutcase mob running around. That idea doesn't quite fit the late 20th and early 21st century western world setting, not to mention the group did try to keep low profile with their activities.

>>3495740
>SH3 already installed the heavy melee focus.
SH1 already "installed" the melee focus.
The whole idea of getting to bash skulls with a steel pipe was one of the big things differentiating SH from RE back in '99!

But that was not the point of the statement. Just like RE4 made your character's movements way more flexible and nimble, and increased overall capabilities (free-aim, dodge, quick-knife, QTE finishers / kicks...), HC attempted very similar action-i-zation, making combat much more fluent, faster, and notably more necessary too.

>>3495753
>Only a very small percent of the enemies in the game you HAVE to kill.
That's actually a good thing. Something I miss from oldschool survival horror games; avoiding combat was worth the risk, if you could handle it.

>>3495753
>unlike in 1 or HC, dodging enemies in the town is ridiculously easy.
Dodging foes in general was piss easy in HC!
And in SH1, if you're outdoors, you just run. Simple as that.
Yeah, SH2's enemies are the least threat-possessing of the trio, but that kinda goes off the point again.

>it's not like Silent Hill isn't Jacob's Ladder in Resident Evil land to begin with.
There's tons more to that list, with Twin Peaks, Session 9, The Mist, and many others being the obvious sources of inspiration TS used.
However, directly ripping a literal splatter film like Hostel?? Just shows how vastly different (read: shittier) taste in films these western devs had.

>>3496025
>There's a conflict in your statements.

There is no conflict. The cult has a main role in the story of 1 and 3 and yet they're barely present, it's mostly just backstory read in notes.

>nutcase mob running around.
There is more to HC's cult than the human enemies you fight at one point at the end of the game, these are just handymen. The entire game is divided into sections, chapters if you like, and most chapters deal with one of the main person part of the cult, all the key members of the main funding families of Silent Hill.

>Not to mention the whole Alessa incident did clearly "crack" the powers of the area
Now you're just making up excuses to explain SH2. There is no real explanation why the characters in SH2 go through their personal hells and it's exactly the problem. SH2 went on to do its own story thing, put Silent Hill 1 tropes on top of it without really caring whether it made sense with 1's story. That's what I was talking about earlier when I mentionned the mess SH2 left as a story legacy, as a result sequels either had to ignore of the 2 aspects or try to tie both like they could. 4 tried to tied both and it felt very cheap. HC on the other hand did it well, as we're dealing with the "personal hell" of all the major cultists involved.

>>3496054
>SH1 already "installed" the melee focus.
I said "heavy" focus. The least guns and ammo for them you have, the more melee focus it will be; hence why SH3 and HC were more melee focused.

>ust like RE4 made your character's movements way more flexible and nimble, and increased overall capabilities (free-aim, dodge, quick-knife, QTE finishers / kicks...), HC attempted very similar action-i-zation, making combat much more fluent, faster, and notably more necessary too.

>>3496054

I've talked about that already. In short, survival horror has always been about taking action from "regular action games" and turn it into survival action. As standard for regular action games evolve, it's only logical survival action follows.
HC did that, but at that point of the evolution of the standard, people started to think that it didn't "felt right" for survival action anymore, but that feeling is superficial and not backed up by the facts given by HC's gameplay mechanics (which I've also talked about, some several times).
Honestly, I think this is one of the reason why the AITD/RE style of survival horror died at that point. The technical and control standard made it so that, on one hand, if you'd do something like SH2/3 again it would feel dated; and on the other hand if you followed the new standard it didn't "feel" like survival horror for people anymore. I think it's one of the main reasons why AITD/RE style died and first person survival horror gained popularity in return.

As for listing the actions and moves possible in HC and to backup this theory,let me also add that SH1 added a lot of possibilities on top of the RE formula, like being to strafe, being able to walk when aiming and even when shooting, etc then the sequels added even more, like different melee attacks based on how you press the button(s), being able to move the camera around yourself, etc etc this all followed the evolution of standards, and so did HC.

Finally I think another issue here is something you said earlier, about gameplay in survival horror (or in Silent Hill, I don't remember) is only a "necessary evil". If you feel that way, it's only natural you don't think too much of the gameplay elements. I put survival gameplay as the most important thing in a survival horror game and that's why I think HC is the best in the series, and why I think 2 is one of the worsts.

>>3496137
Now though if you really think gameplay is only a "necessary evil", let me tell you it's not necessary. You could be playing adventure-horror games, which retains story, atmosphere, horror, and even puzzles; but don't have the action.

>>3496126
>Now you're just making up excuses to explain SH2.
And why the "town went to hell" after 1 in the first place. The sequels have mentions of various mysterious phenomenons and mental patients referring to "other worlds", proving that the area has had some sort of paranormal activity for ages.

>There is no real explanation why the characters in SH2 go through their personal hells and it's exactly the problem.
Neither is it explained how Dahlia "impregnated" Alessa with a seed of literal god / demon, but does that matter? Just like many things in the series, there's enough evidence to support some theories to make them believable options.

I've never considered there to be anything weird or bad about SH2 being related to the rest. The whole game felt like a fairly natural expansion to SH1 even back in the days to me. Neither have I considered SH4's methods of tying the entire saga into one to be cheap or bad in any way.

On the other hand, I cannot give similar credit to HC one bit. There's people literally teleporting between two towns all the time, and no clear source of all the projections and beings. The Movie boogeyman and James' sexy nurses + totally-not-Lying-Figure monsters do not help it one bit either.

>>3496126
>hence why SH3 and HC were more melee focused.
SH3, melee focused?
Shit son, you get goddamn SMG around mid-point of the game! Yeah sure, there's more melee weapons, but same applies to all past SH games in general.

>>3496137
HC really goes into action-horror category. There's barely any real survival, just funneled fights that you need to tread borderline DaS style, with pattern memorization and combo executions. The maps are also some of the most linear ones in the series, and there's barely any real puzzles either.

>>3496137
>Honestly, I think this is one of the reason why the AITD/RE style of survival horror died at that point.
It "died" only because Capcom mis-translated the poor sales of GC's REmake and Zero as a sign of the genre being out of fashion. Somehow they failed to realize that their main audience was on Sony's machines. They were totally blown away by surprise of the great sale figures of REmake HD couple years ago, one reason they pushed out RE:Zero HD and even dared to start that long waited REmake 2 project.

That , and the few indie games emulating the style and feel of late 90s survival-horror games that have appeared recently, all show that there is still interest towards this sort of games. Games like RE4 and HC literally split their series into two distinct, quite different sides, both of the titles opting for more guided and action-focused experience, which can be called "survival horror" only with grain of salt.

Yes, the basic formula started by AITD / RE1 did evolve even within their series before RE4, and one could say that RE4 is just a next step in that evolution, but too many alterations will ultimately result a totally different experience, different genre. RE being more shooting focused series from the get go, the improved aiming methods sit quite well with the series. However, in games like SH, having an action-RPG style gameplay isn't exactly my idea of "improving" the saga.

All those visible HUD elements, button prompts, literal QTEs..etc, mixed with the over-shoulder view, just underline the fact that the newest games in SH series (and RE to that matter) are infact geared towards more action-focused gameplay. A gameplay type I do consider having only hindered SH more than it is claimed to have "helped" it, reducing all the gameplay into either escaping shit in linear fashion, or trading blows in clunky manner in a makeshift "arenas" of sort.

Yes, I literally take SH1-3's combat, camera, pacing and stories over HC-DP's crap.

Again, another survival horror thread hijacked by nesfag.

>>3496187
"hijacked" ?
Nah, this chump's just a fun little pastime exercise, and it provides free bumps!

SH enthusiasts, should I play the PC version of SH1 or should I rather emulate the PS version?

>>3496229
there is no PC version of SH1.
your only options are to get the game from ebay / PSN Store, or emulate it.

Excuse me, but has anyone seen a little girl? Short, black hair? Just turned seven last month?

>>3483046
Just finished this yesterday. It's a great game but the second half(starting with the sewers) is a bit of a slog. The whole trip to the lighthouse was straight up pointless.

>>3496281

well I have something I torrented years ago, it says "Silent HIll PC" and it's an .iso that installs the game on a pc.

>>3496352
Why does bandaged Alessa in the ope opening cutscene look so much older? She was one of my favorite video game babes back in the day.

>>3496365
That's an emulator.

>>3496375

>>3496365
That is the well known, ancient fan-made "PC conversion", which is literally just an oldass emulator + custom front GUI, running the PS1 ISO.

You'll get MUCH better results with modern emulators and settings shown earlier ITT.

>>3496382
The PSN version runs fine and looks especially nice on the Vita though. That's my preferred way of playing it.

>>3496384
Sure, but I would recommend playing these games on an big screen + good audio system.

>>3496375
because it's been 7 years since the accident?

>>3496391
I know she's supposed to be 14 but she looks at least five years older in the opening cutscene vs in game.

>>3496391
>accident

You mean since her mother burned her alive so she could be a birthing vessel for a pagan god?

>>3496439
>her mother burned her alive

>>3496470
Yes? That is what happened.

>>3496715
In Origins and maybe the movie, but in the games burning her was never part of the ritual, the fire was an accident

>>3496154
>SH3, melee focused?
>Shit son, you get goddamn SMG around mid-point of the game! Yeah sure, there's more melee weapons, but same applies to all past SH games in general.

Are you playing the games on easy or what? There is barely any ammo for any of the firearms in SH3, and especially for the SMG. Only way you can afford to use the shotgun and SMG is against bosses really, and even then if you do that it's likely you're going to have to finish the end boss with a melee weapon because of the lack of ammo.

>>3496183
Again you're comparing HC with RE4 with no base.

RE4 :
- Enemies drop health items and ammo. It is programmed in such a way to make sure the player can never run out, the least of an item type you have, the more likely an enemy is to spawn it. This is the polar opposite of encouraging supplies conservation.
- On top of that there is enough supplies in plain sight without having to particuarly look for it; AND there is a money/shop system.
- You're encouraged and rewarded for killing enemies, it's the chore gameplay mechanic and is most often required.
- inventory limit is huge and keeps increasing as more is required.
- an arsenal of many different weapons at your disposal leaving you different choices to tackle each situation and to make sure you can get out of any


HC :
- Enemies don't drop supplies and killing them don' reward you.
- Supplies are very scarce and you have to look for them.
- very limited inventory limit, IIRC it's like 12 handgun bullets.
- killing enemies is dangerous, each encounter matters and each enemy is a deadly threat, both considering the lack of supplies and the amount of damage they deal
- you have to put yourself at risk to kill an enemy, due to having to get up close and due to the weak point system (a huge improvement over SH1/2 where you can spam everything from a distance).
-The means at your disposal to kill enemies is limited.

>>3498037
- dodging enemies is also as dangerous. For instance to dodge a dog on the street, you have to time a roll and time it perfectly; and keep doing so until you reach the door. Fail ONE dodge, and if that dog jumps on your back, it's a one hit death even at full hp. In other words, each enemy is true survival whether want to kill it or dodge.
- level design involves more backtracking and searching around (compared to RE4) meaning that a threat remains a threat longer
- more puzzles to solve required to advance further (IIRC RE4 only has 2 puzzles which are mandatory, in 10+hours of gameplay)

tl;dr : RE4 = regular action. HC = survival

These are facts. Whether or not HC has a knife exploit doesn't change any of that. I can beat RE1 knife only, there are various exploits and the basic handgun is actually super strong against the end boss while the knife is the best against one of the bosses. Doesn't change its survival gameplay. In terms of exploiting the gameplay, something like HC's knife isn't something one is likely to discover on a first playthrough; while in SH1 and 2, any player will realize straight away that he can safely spam bullets against most enemies from a safe distance.

>>3496183
>There's people literally teleporting between two towns all the time

You're exagerating here, but again that's something you complain about for HC which is also true for the "team silent" games. NPCs keep teleporting, sometimes even conveniently behind rooms which only have one door locked by a puzzle.

>and no clear source of all the projections and beings

Oh but there is. You just haven't cared to understand. I hear many people complain the game makes no sense because enemies have no relation with the protag, because they have "SH2 mentality". In "Team Silent" games, enemies and locations can be there for different reasons, it's not the same in either 1, 2, 3 or 4. In HC if you put two and two together you'll understand it's projections from all the main leaders of the cult, responsible for what is happening.

>>3496183
>linear fashion

HC is less linear than "team silent's" SH3. In 3 you're always locked down to areas consisting of a few corridors and rooms, until the next, with not many places or even rooms to explore which have no purpose for progression.
The most open areas were taken straight out of SH2, cheaply copy pasted down to the placement of debris and car models untouched; and even in this case, with both the SH2 outdoor town area and SH2's hospital; when re-used in 3 they were made smaller, more linear and with less backtracking.
This is actually my main complain about SH3 btw, otherwise it's probably the most "balanced" of the franchise all aspects considered, but it feels like it was developed quickly and therefore only the strict minimum was made.

>>3496715
>>3496439
That did not happen.
Origins is full of shit.

>>3498037
>Again you're comparing HC with RE4 with no base.
You're getting stuck into pointless details, and failing to realize the overall change of tone and pacing. Both RE4 and HC tried to turn their games into over-shoulder view action games, and HC even has similar aiming system.

HC is only "challenging" up until you realize that Knife can stun and hack almost every enemy in the game with ease.

>>3498045
RE4 and HC = action horror games.
HC is borderline Souls game if you start to think about it.

>HC's knife isn't something one is likely to discover on a first playthrough;
Oh, but I did. I've only ever played HC twice, and that was only because I was asked by a friend to show the game around.

>while in SH1 and 2, any player will realize straight away that he can safely spam bullets against most enemies from a safe distance
Oh, is that so? I guess all that melee weaponry you start with and get later on were just for the show then?

>>3498054
>m-muh SH2 mentality!
Sorry, but I've started to get very tired of SH2 because of the nu-fans lately. SH1 is still my favorite game in the series, and the game that every other SH game is and needs to be based on.

>NPCs keep teleporting, sometimes even conveniently behind rooms which only have one door locked by a puzzle.
When does this happen again?
Meanwhile, in HC you literally jump between SH and the what-ever town, all the time.

>>3498072
>HC is less linear than "team silent's" SH3.
even SH3 has some actual dungeon-style buildings that you explore in more or less nonlinear fashion.
HC has none.

>>3498096
>pointless details

They're chore gameplay mechanics, the kind which DEFINE the difference between regular action game and survival action.

>over-shoulder view action games,
And we're back to square one with this superficial view, I don't know why I even bother when we're turning in round because your "feels" make you refuse to acknowledge the facts handed out to you.
You can do survival horror with any camera angle. The first real survival horror, Zombi, was first person. In 1996 Overblood, which was developed at the same time as RE1, offered 3 different camera angles you could switch at any time, including the "classic action game" behind the player camera of early 3D games.

>challenging
Whiel difficulty helps, it doesn't define survival. If it did, that would mean that something like Doom would become survival horror on its last difficulty but not on the others or that Resident Evil games aren't survival horror anymore on the easiest difficulties (it's still survival horror even if some mechanics don't become as extreme); and that doesn't make any sense. That's not how genre defining work, video game genre defining is based on gameplay mechanic facts that can defined, and HC has all the gameplay mechanics of survival action listed above and more which differ from regular action games. No matter how a camera angle makes you "feel" doesn't change genre defining gameplay mechanics. It's superficial.

>Oh, but I did.
I said "likely", but in any case the knife doesn't change all the other gameplay mechanics and it isn't as broken as you make it sound.

>>3498130

>Oh, is that so? I guess all that melee weaponry you start with and get later on were just for the show then?
Stop pretending you don't see the difference. If you really don't I suggest you replayed SH1,2,3. This thread made me feel like replaying the entire franchise and I just did 1,2,3 on Hard, and 3 has a LOT less supplies than 1 and 2 and therefore melee focus, which was more of a player's choice in 1 and 2, becomes almost mandatory in 3.

BTW these fresh replays made me have an even lower opinion on 2 and 4, with some of their flaws I had forgotten.

>When does this happen again?
In SH2 most notably Maria and Angela teleport everywhere. In 3 Douglas and most notably Vincent which wanders everywhere and go through monsters and puzzles alike even though he himself says he can see the otherworld, but Claudia is also seen in both towns so I don't know how it's any different.
For the locked rooms, the end of SH1 and 3 is an example.

>SH1 is still my favorite game in the series, and the game that every other SH game is and needs to be based on.

You must really hate "team silent's" 2 and 4 if you think sequels should be based on 1. These two do their own things and spend all game long trying to justify how it's possible.

Cinematic camera / tank control horror games need to make a comeback

Homecoming's only saving grace(s) were the boss fights and the story around them. Everything else, to me, was just a poor imitation of the classics.

I thought it looked, crap, played crap, sounded crap, enemies on teh whole were crap, protagonist crap, ending(s) were crap. If it had been a fan made game in unity I could have let it slide but people were PAID to produce that crap, and then defended it.

If someone genuinely likes it, then good - I'm happy for them- but I sure as fuck wouldn't take any recommendations from them about games from there on.

I think the story, overall, in SH games is pretty shit but the atmosphere in the first three is just unparallelled and yet to be surpassed. Like Hopkins' Lector, or Cameron's Aliens, sometimes some people jusy get things so unbelievably right that any attempts to better it or improve on the formula do nothing but pale in comparison. I'll always respect Team Silent for that.

>>3498140
I don't know, I really loved downpour. I thought it was great

>>3498141

I hated Homecoming so much I never even considered Downpour. To this day, I've not even seen it in motion to my knowledge.

>>3498096
>even SH3 has some actual dungeon-style buildings that you explore in more or less nonlinear fashion.
>HC has none.

Yes it does, like the hotel for instance.
But if you're into comparing both games, SH3 doesn't have really have town exploring and huge environments (only one it has is taken from 2 and was made very small with little backtracking but no supplies to be found except the one non mandatory room) while HC does.

>overall change of tone and pacing
Every SH game has a completely different tone. As for pacing, team silent's SH3 was made a lot more linear and straight to the point, while 4 has a completely different pacing where instead of going through an area with tons of backtracking, you go through each area, then go back through each again.
So both 3 and 4 have a completely different pacing than 1 and 2.

HC is actually a middle ground between all that; and actually, "middle ground between elements from all the previous SH games" describes HC in many regards.

>>3498090
So it was an accident and Dahlia later just went along with keeping her locked up in the hospital basement for 7 years? That seems just as dumb.

>>3498141
I liked Downpour a lot too. Murphy is one of the more interesting protagonists in the series and the plot kept me guessing. Sure the combat was clunky but no more so than it was in the original three games.

>>3498263
didn't play the game?

Her soul was literally split into two, the other half having "disappeared", so they couldn't carry on with the ritual. They did place a "magical spell" on her though, slowly attracting the other half back into town, which succeeded when Harry arrived to the city, and the two halves were united once more.

>>3498269
Those are some of the least significants complains one can make about DP (though they managed to make the combat way more infuriating than in 1-4):

-No Akira's soundtracks. You can hear it, you can FEEL it.
-The MC's inner monologue = fucking annoying.
-Indicators, flashing items and tips everywhere! Try to play without them, and you gonna be all lost for a while at least, as the game was DESIGNED with them to be ON.
-The chase scenes were annoying. Especially the last one. And I fucking liked SM for crying out loud.
-Bad and limited enemy design.
-A handful of characters that just... are. I guess they tried to personify the Town or something, but come on.
-The environments? Boring & full of copypaste.
-The side missions? POINTLESS in the end, as you get ripped off all your gear, and they don't even effect the ending!
-BAD combat. Yeah I know, and I always ran past 90% of enemies in originals as well, but holy shit this is WORSE than in SH1-4 if you ask me.
-UT3 engine bugs and annoyances (texture & area streaming, usually lagging badly behind, the Subway doors getting locked, random bug of being unable to pick up items ...)
-QTE -like scenes.

Last the story... there technically isn't one! It's not deep or cryptic at all, it's just CONFUSING - most probably because before the very end, the game doesn't know how the story even goes, when your choices are evaluated. In this sense the game actually contradicts ITSELF earlier on, as there's no alternative cutscenes or discussion choices.

It's as bad as BoM.

>>3487174
one of the things i liked about the first game is that the town felt like some place i've actually been to before.
the familiarity really adds to the spoopiness

>>3496381
>that gag reel at the end.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ursejnwllNM
such a neat little thing.
they really were treating it like a movie
>tfw bill pullman is too old to play harry now

>>3498550
Yeah the "blooper reel" was such a cool touch. I can't think of a single other game that's done that and I'm genuinely surprised that Kojima never did. Silent Hill really was made with love and dedication.

>>3498509
Okay but it makes more sense for her burning to be part of a ritual like they retconned in origins.

>>3498563
No, it really does not. Nowhere in SH1-4 is fire stated of being necessary part of the ritual, and it makes no sense to have literal birthing of something to involve fire - a destructible and cleansing power of nature.

>>3498579
Well then I don't understand the point of her being burned in the first game at all. Being locked away and forced to be a vessel for a pagan god would have been reason enough for her to manifest the dark world.

>>3498585
That just shows your ignorance and typical naivety, which unfortunately have also plagued the makers of the terrible Movies and all the western sequels.

The immerse stress placed on Alessa caused her to projections go haywire and trigger a boiler explosion in the house, which ultimately burned her and caused the split of the soul. The being that was implanted within her still survived and kept her alive for 7 years, feeding her nightmares while at it. This alone is proof enough that fire was not needed- she'd already been impregnated, possibly quite physically even.

The "dark world" thing is also often misunderstood thing. There are no "other worlds", just strong mental projections altering and corrupting OUR world, this very planet Earth we live on. Alessa was actually working very hard to stop the spread of this literal infection that originated from within her, by placing those Seals Of Metatron around the town, and by helping Harry. Unfortunately, he was a bit too keen to find Cheryl, who was no longer a separated existence of her own, going as far as getting tricked by Dahlia to stop and momentarily stun Alessa with mystical artefacts.

>>3498130
The viewpoint and controls do affect the genre, as they define the entire gameplay style. You can simulate old-school survival horror gameplay in first-person view if you like, but very few devs bother to do so, since it does not appeal to the more action-focused modern players. To which RE4 and HC are clearly aimed at.

The knife is totally OP. I only ever remember using the Crowbar to fight off the (laughably easy) Scarlet boss... which I've heard some people having trouble with, for reasons I can't understand.
This total domination with the early-game melee weapons meant I got tons of ammo to waste on those smoking SH2 enemy clones and such when needed.

>>3498138
I've literally played SH1 and 2 a good ~40 times, each, and SH3 a good dozen or so times. I go back to them almost annually, and will prolly replay them this coming Halloween once more.

Yeah, the OG games do offer decent amount of supplies, but you also gotta go your way to hunt for them. The need for hunting stuff greatly decreased once you got the Hammer in SH1, and the Katana in 3.

I absolutely adore SH1-4, almost equally. I have no reason to hate them, as I can see and have read the amount of dedication and love TS put into them, including making the events and lore make sense throughout the whole series. It's the western fucks who've made things worse with every new installment, even blurring the facts for some less dedicated players.

>>3498139
They are, slowly. Couple PS1 graphics simulating survival horror titles were just released this year, and REmake & Zero HD were huge successes.

>>3498149
You're not missing much.
You can humor / shock yourself with the TP's 2h long review on youtube, if you wish tho'.

>>3498561
>I'm genuinely surprised that Kojima never did
He did tons of separated gag cutscenes though. MGS3:S bonus disc was full of them, and you can view them on YT these days if you wish:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6Xsgqi0ZwA&list=PL3A6CA4FC803291BE

>>3498604
I was always under the impression that there's always a real world Silent Hill where people go about their lives as normal. The fog world and dark world are alternate dimensions that Alessa created in the original.

>>3498635
Huh, cool. Thanks anon.

Akira Yamaoka - A Stray Child [Silent Hill 3]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nMUcj0wuS8

>>3498629
>The viewpoint and controls do affect the genre, as they define the entire gameplay style. You can simulate old-school survival horror gameplay in first-person view if you like, but very few devs bother to do so, since it does not appeal to the more action-focused modern players. To which RE4 and HC are clearly aimed at.

This is absurd. The type of camera doesn't affect the genre. The AITD/RE style which the original SH games are part of is only a side of survival horror, first person ones existed before and outlived the AITD style; and starting from the PS3/360 gen onwars that style died because sales were dropping and the opinion on that camera style was highly negative about it because that camera style didn't allow the genre to evolve with the standard of the time.
Almost every single 3rd person survival horror from that time onwards used a "behind the character" camera style, are you saying they are not survival horror either beacuse of that?

As for the viewpoint influencing gameplay... Are you trying to say it's not survival horror because you can aim freely, which is about the only difference with the previous SH games? All the other survival gameplay mechanics I listed above are more than enough, I know many survival horror games with less than that.
Besides, complaining about free-er movement in Silent Hill is also absurd. Silent Hill has ALWAYS been about giving more free movement than more "classic" survival horror games, and they kept giving more movements and more freedom as new titles came in. Moving while aiming/shooting, strafing, strafe running (even in circle...), 180° turn, different melee attacks depending on how you use the buttons, blocking (in SH3), dodging (even in several ways like dodging to the left or right in SH4), ability to aim upwards/downwards with a greater variety of degree as the sequels came, ability to switch between character centric controls and camera centric controls, etc etc

>>3498760
(cont)
Are SH1-4 not survival horror because of that, too?!
Fuck, I know MANY "regular" action games with a LOT less moves than that, even contemporary ones.

Like I said the only difference with HC is the free aiming really; and considering how Silent Hill has always been about giving as much movement possibility as possible and how it kept adding more moves going in that sense with sequels, it's only logical HC has it.

So, if that is "appealing to the more action-focused modern players" then so are SH1-4. I don't even know what you're trying to imply with that sentence considering action has always been part of the entire genre, and the ENTIRE AITD/RE style sub-genre IS by definition more cattered to action fans than the other kinds of survival horror games like the first person ones, which are generally more adventure based.

>I absolutely adore SH1-4, almost equally. I have no reason to hate them, as I can see and have read the amount of dedication and love TS put into them, including making the events and lore make sense throughout the whole series. It's the western fucks who've made things worse with every new installment, even blurring the facts for some less dedicated players.

You can dislike HC all you want; but claiming it's not survival horror is just wrong.

I'm sorry but this only sounds like your regular Team Silent blind fanboyism. Like I said "Team Silent" isn't exactly "a" team anyway, and I think that part of the whole term was also marketing. Marketing that worked so well that when they had no excuse to use it anymore, it backfired against them.
I honestly don't know how ANYONE can say SH4 is a better game than HC. 4 is the worst in the series by far in all regards. It's broken, glitchy, feels rushed and unfinished, the story is only loosely connected to the previous games (the whole "cult" thing could very well not be there and the game would be the same), and that's not the least of negative things I can say about it.

>>3498660
Nope. The "worlds" are very much present at all times:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvcs-9lSm64

>>3483178
>ntsc-filter

>>3499389
it's not exactly NTSC filter, but kinda replicates some of that dither you'd see on an actual console. Like said, it's optional.

pic very related.

I respect Silent Hill 1 the most purely because of the hospital elevator thing. It's really simple, but also really effective at achieving maximum fucking spookiness.

SH2 felt a bit bland if you had the pleasure of being spoiled on it.

>>3499367
"What if the people are removed from existence during the dark world sequences?"

Paraphrasing but isn't that essentially the same thing as an alternate dimension? Also, the theory that Silent Hill was simply abandoned is ridiculous. The alternate dimension explanation makes so much more sense. Plus Team Silent clearly took some inspiration from The Langoliers.

>>3499367
If it's not a parallel dimension, what is the portal that Alessa creates for Harry and Cybill to go through at the end of the game as nowhere is collapsing?

>>3499551
>Paraphrasing but isn't that essentially the same thing as an alternate dimension?
Nope. A section of our world being altered by strong external force does not make it another dimension. It may turn it to look and behave like "another world", but it's still on planet earth and such.

>Also, the theory that Silent Hill was simply abandoned is ridiculous.
Why? The town potentially lost tons of people during SH1 incident, and the few smart people appreciating the modern luxuries certainly didn't enjoy the shadowy folks lurking in the town.

>The alternate dimension explanation makes so much more sense
only if you have limited IQ, perhaps.

>Plus Team Silent clearly took some inspiration from The Langoliers.
Never even heard of anyone claim that. Can't recall the name of the movie it was sort of based on, but I doublt Langoliers is one of the sources of inspiration.
A pretty good video on the subject:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-FTLLzvYD8

>>3499608
Escape route from the entire place, which can only be seen as a twisted mixture of everything and nothing merging into one gigantic mess of a manifestation with the birth of the god/demon approaching at steady pace.

>>3499623
So who was it that created the impossibly huge chasms in the roads when all the houses and buildings are completely intact with no signs of decay or disrepair in the fog world? Also, even if you go with the ending where Cybill dies, how did Harry leave so he could show up years later in SH3?

>>3499653
And if the whole place was collapsing how did Heather and Douglas simply drive to Silent Hill?

>>3499623
Dimension probably isn't the right word to use. It's more like layers or planes of reality.

Top layer: Silent Hill the pleasant resort town where people go about their every day business

Lower layer: fog/darkness

Lowest layer: hellish otherworld

The protagonist sees and experiences things that aren't in the normal plane of reality and physically interacting with things in that plane(like the drawbridge) won't effect the other planes.

>>3499653
Everything originated from Alessa / the beast within her. Like seen even in the sequels, the "otherworld" effect is not just a fancy layer of gritty paint; it actually can and does affect the shape, size, location and many other 3-dimensional aspects of our world, even create "new" space where fit. At best, it literally blurs the line with literal dreams and reality, which itself could be seen as a form of "other world" if needed.

Since Alessa/ the demon was fatally wounded, and she even sacrificed most of her leftover strength to recreate what's essentially herself / Cheryl reborn, the nightmarish delusion projections ended, and thus this "fake world" started crumbling, returning to normal.

>>3499660
The town did not collapse, silly. SH2 takes place X amount of time after SH1, and is still very intact, just in clearly bad shape though - even in the "normal" areas.

>>3499729
>It's more like layers or planes of reality.
This is quite close to the idea.
In SH1, Alessa+demon combo is the dominant source of projections, and thus everyone experiences it similarly. Alessa is capable of slightly controlling this plane on her own too.

In SH2, the native psychic power of the area appears to have been altered in a way that everyone's experiencing strong "projection bubbles" of their own. These "personal realities" can even overlap, as seen multiple times when James meets other cast members later on.

SH3 goes back to SH1's style, and has this personal layer following the MC at all times, since she's the source of it. It's hinted though that there'd be some small leftovers of the old Alessa's / the demon's spirit still lingering in the town, though even those could merely be suppressed memories becoming alive under the effects of the area.

>the three layers
These however could be argued though.
In OG games, we clearly see the "real" world transitioning to the other forms, even in real time. SH3 has probably the most subtle transition of them all.

>>3499790
I feel like these videos arguing against the "dimension theory" don't realize that people are just using the word "dimension" in place of alternate reality. Really kind of splitting hairs if you ask me.

>>3500040
>alternative reality
>alternative dimension
Kinda the same thing in my books. The point is that it's our very planet earth, this timeline of ours, getting real-time 4D-Photoshopped by very satanic powers. Not something evil pouring out of some other world of its own into "our" existence.

>>3489381
>yiu could finally enter ALL the buildings, no door would be broken, and enemies could actually follow you from room to room. ..
But you could do all that in Shattered Memories

>>3500050
Oh well yeah. I didn't think that was even something up for debate among fans. The series has a few nods to Lovecraft but it's definitely more Stephen King inspired.

>>3500167
>I didn't think that was even something up for debate among fans
there are rookies amongst all of us, and with those terrible films and later sequels, there's tons of misinformation and believes poisoning the original lore and rules.

>>3500215
The movie and SM are alternate universes, but everything else is canon, no matter how you can dislike HC and Origins, Konami chose what was canon, not you.

>>3500728
>Konami chose what was canon, not you.
Konami did not participate one bit in the development of the SH games, even less so in case of the western games. In those cases they literally whored the IP to anyone even remotely interested and capable of creating a game for them.

Plus, when these major fuckup titles not only conflict with stated facts and event of the originals, but also what's happening in them as well, you know you can ignore the post-SH4 titles as generic fanfic bullshit.

>>3499623
>Nope. A section of our world being altered by strong external force does not make it another dimension. It may turn it to look and behave like "another world", but it's still on planet earth and such.

Actually in SH1 it's pretty clear that there is both. At first you keep switching between dimension, Harry himself saying that in the other dimension everything feels "blurry" in his mind like he's not really there.
Then near the end of the game in the streets, the otherworld invades the fog world; Harry himself stating there is a difference.

>the native psychic power of the area
That's what I was referring to earlier when I said SH2 was doing its own thing and spent all game long making up excuses for it. There is no "psychic town power" in SH1.

>SH3
>the effects of the area.

Please don't take SH2 stuff, which is on its own, to explain SH3. This doesn't even work because like I said, the entire first third of the game, up until the father's death, doesn't even take place in Silent Hill, and it has otherworld and all.

>>3500732
>Konami did not participate one bit in the development of the SH games
This is false. Saying publishers didn't participate in the creation of games is off reality, especially when it's those publishers who decided the games should even exist.
HC and Origins were decided by Konami, and unlike SM and the movies they don't take place in an alternate version of the world. They are canon.

>you know you can ignore the post-SH4 titles as generic fanfic bullshit.

If you ask me, any video game sequel not made by the director of the original game can be considered fanfictions. For some reasons video game players have a hard time with that, usually putting brand name (Konami, Capcom, etc) above all, but if you take movies as an example, no fan in their right mind would consider From Dusk Till Dawn 2 a "valid" sequel to 1.

>>3500737
Do I need to remind you that the director of Silent Hill left after 1, and that then SH2 went to do its own things and fuck with the meaning of the original game's town and "otherworld" by adding the "psychic area" stuff you're referring to?

But, somehow, that is okay but not anything post SH4?

self-sage triplepost to say this

>>3483175
Thanks for this by the way. The PC versions of the games are the bests by far, the only thing is that it can take some time to configure them properly.

Your version of SH2 is missing the nocd crack though but it's easy enough to find. Would be nice to add the music glitch patch for those that need it and instructions on how to set the game for compatibility mode and using only 1 CPU which is required to run it on modern OS.

>SH2-4 do not support Xinput gamepads. Either use Xpadder, a DirectInput pad, or just play with KB+M.

I'm using a PS2 pad with an adapter and both SH2 and 4 detected it just fine. I was even able to configure SH4 exactly how it's played on PS2, but reversing the d-pad and analog, which is just perfect for me. Only thing I'm missing is the rumble, which I have to say is used super well in SH2/3/4; but I think that's because my adapter don't support it I'm sure the games should support rumble granted your pad does

>>3496207
I think it's time for a bump.

>>3500737
>There is no "psychic town power" in SH1.
So the Christians who moved to the area did not adopt any pagan rituals and ways to their at any point?

Hell, even SH1 mentions them practicing "black magic" and shit.

>Please don't take SH2 stuff, which is on its own, to explain SH3
SH1-4 are all the same stuff, like it or not.
Whether or not the OG director was involved anymore after the original game does not matter one bit anymore. Especially when his own games have sucked major ass once he left TS.

>>3501221
>Your version of SH2 is missing the nocd crack though but it's easy enough to find.
like said in the copypasta, the sh2proxy's exe works as no-cd crack

>>3502709
>So the Christians who moved to the area did not adopt any pagan rituals and ways to their at any point?

>Hell, even SH1 mentions them practicing "black magic" and shit.

Yes. But that's power coming from people and their practices. What matters isn't the location, but the people and their doings, which is why it's absolutely fine that the first third of SH3 doesn't take place in Silent Hill, same for Homecoming.
You and SH2 implies that the power comes from the town itself, if you take the stuff from SH1 there is absolutely no logical reason why all the peoples in SH2 are attracted by the town and all go through their "personal hell". This is stuff that was added for SH2 to justify how they did something completely different.

Anyway - in my marathon of replaying every SH game by order of release, I finally got rid of SH4 and started Homecoming last night. 1h30 into the game and already it is the best.
The atmosphere really gets to me, last night I even kept being woken up by micro-nightmares because of it.
It's quite ironical really, because in terms of horror movies (and I am a big fan of that too) Japanese ghosts stories is what I find the scariest; but for Silent Hill nowadays only HC and SM really get to me, although SH1 and 3 still have their moments, it's nothing like what those do to me.

>>3502781
also SH4 doesn't take place in Silent Hill either. Well, maybe the orphanage and the prison do, but not the rest. The game keeps referring to events taking place in Silent Hill, and it's said in a way that tells you that the Ashfield apartments (and therefore the subway and the building world too) aren't in Silent Hill.

Again it's powers and people using them that matters, not the location. SH2 is on its own.

>>3502781
>>3502808
it's fairly common explanation that the area of town had this strong manifestation of this psychical power, which allowed natives and cult to easily perform their rituals. Similarly the Alessa incident most likely sort of "cracked" this power, left its own mark in the area, thus resulted the increased chance of anyone entering the area being strongly exposed to its effects.

In a occultish manner, you could explain it all with that "The old gods still reside in this place", like SH2 of all things puts it in the Resurrection ending.

In SH3, the phenomenon happening outside of SH makes sense thanks to the MC herself. It is implied that Claudia has something to do with triggering the events, though it is not made clear whether its just her working as a mere reminder for Heather, or if she's actually performed some sort of rituals to aid the beginning of the process.

Going with the latter option though, and the fact that Dahlia was able to place a "spell" on the split Alessa before SH1, with its effects working outside of the town, the fact that Walter was able to operate outside of SH and create his own dream worlds, even a psychical projection of himself, is a very plausible scenario. Especially since the "source" still resides within the room 302.

>>3483101
By starting out on easy, you can get some of the weapons on normal (second playthrough). From then on it's always on hard. On your third playthrough you can usually get the Katana, and if your second playthroguh was with the UFO ending, you also get the regular red Hyper Blaster.

Beating the game with 8 star ranking gives you the yellow Hyper Blaster, 10 star gives you the green one.

>>3502910
>it's fairly common explanation that the area of town had this strong manifestation of this psychical power, which allowed natives and cult to easily perform their rituals. Similarly the Alessa incident most likely sort of "cracked" this power, left its own mark in the area, thus resulted the increased chance of anyone entering the area being strongly exposed to its effects.
>In a occultish manner, you could explain it all with that "The old gods still reside in this place", like SH2 of all things puts it in the Resurrection ending.

Yeah, in SH2.

Anyway - I've reached the police station in Homecoming; and I've re-tried different weapons against different enemies and the knife is nowhere near being the best solution against every enemy, and I don't think I've met all enemies yet. I could go into details as to why.

Also in 3-4hours of play I was only forced to kill enemies in 3 situations, and everytime it's more like a mini-boss fight anyway introducing the enemy and fighting them in non normal situation to make it a mini boss fight. There was the first Lurker in the flooded basement (actually, that one you might be able to avoid killing, I just haven't tried to solve the puzzle without killing him), the 3 Needlers in the Hotel's elevator, and the Ciam at the end of the police station.

Everything else you can dodge, even when there is a puzzle in the same room, and most of the times you're better off dodging them anyway considering that fighting is putting yourself at a greater risk and they deal INSANE damage in this game. One hit=one health drink, and that's when they don't combo the shit outtayou like Ciam does.

I can't believe anyone would claim this plays ANYTHING as close to RE4. In RE4 your goal is to kill enemies, but here they're a problem in your way. Also in RE4 they're everywhere, making sure the action is non stop; this is completely different here. That's on top of the survival mechanics mentionned earlier.

>>3503126
>I can't believe anyone would claim this plays ANYTHING as close to RE4
That's because you're thick, illiterate piece of summerfag moron.

Nobody says it's EXACTLY like RE4.
Everyone knows and sees it tried to do similar overhaul to SH games as what RE4 did to RESI series.

Making your character fluent in combat and introducing numerous QTEs and -like is exactly that change of paradigm people are referring to.

>>3483396
>My favourite genuinely is Homecoming

>>3503393
>That's because you're thick, illiterate piece of summerfag moron.

Yeah... no. Someone else here said the only difference with RE4 is that it's melee focused; and you said that it wasn't survival horror.
Also "anything as close to RE4" is pretty far off "exactly" so you see I even gave you the benefit of the doubt.

>Making your character fluent in combat
Tell me exactly in what way Alex is more fluent in combat than Harry/James/Heather/Henry ?
These guys already had EVERYTHING he does: strafing/strafe running, dodging (as a dedicated key), different melee attacks of different strength depending on how you press the buttons...

Actually, with Henry you have 2 dedicated dodge buttons, meaning you can chose which direction you want to dodge to; and Heather has blocking. That's things Alex doesn't have, making them more fluent. Alex also has less different weapons at his disposal than most (if not all?) of those.

The only difference is free-er aiming really; and even then you could already aim in every direction in SH1; there is a wider degree and more freedom for the angle in SH3; and obviously even more in HC.

The QTE in HC are very much unlike those in RE4. They are at the service of survival gameplay mechanics, I actually enjoy them in HC while I despise them in RE4. In combat they appear in situations where you played badly, and give you a chance to make up for it, but you have to fight for that chance with the QTE, it adds tension to it.

Survival Horror is an action genre by definition. action-adventure with a horror theme. Some survival horror lean more towards action, and some more towards adventure, at a varying degree; but the AITD/RE style that SH has always been part of has always leaned more towards action than adventure, especially with RE onwards, you constantly have to fight or dodge enemies using twitch based controls.
Unlike games like Echo Night, Amnesia: The Dark Descent or Slender games, which lean more towards adventure.

>>3503496
>Tell me exactly in what way Alex is more fluent in combat than Harry/James/Heather/Henry ?
I don't even need to answer this.
You've proven yourself over and over again to be an autistic, blind moron, or a literal bait.

>QTE
>service for anything
like I said, a moron.

No, coming out with "lol just pretending!" won't save ya now.

>>3483904
Idunno I like it

>>3503582
Actually I forgot to mention Heather has melee combos, and Henry has the charged attacks.

I am amazed at how many facts you can deny just for the sake of being a "Team Silent" fanboy.

>>3503464
>but I honestly don't feel like arguing over it a 1000th time, besides it's not retro

this one had me in stitches

>>3503776
Tomm Hulett please leave and never return.

>>3504296
No. Fuck you! HC was good.

>>3504374
Tomm, is unemployment hitting you that hard that you have time to shitpost in every single SH thread on 4chan?

>>3503582
Also, as far as "QTE" that involve "hitting a button to let go when a monster grabs you", those have existed ever since SH1, the only difference being that in HC you get an icon telling you what button to press (and actually in SH3 after you've beaten the game once you can turn on the HUD and when you're down and have to keep pressing a button to get back up, it shows a gauge, which is similar).

Also thinking back to what you said about "the characters teleporting back&forth between the two towns" in HC; I've reached the prison and this only happened once with Alex so far; once or twice depending on how you see it (back&forth) and it's done in a very similar way to how Harry keeps teleporting back&forth to the hospital room with Lisa in it in the 2nd half of SH1.
But that didn't prevent you to take SH1's story seriously, did it? Again, this is showing double standard, complaining about HC doing certain things in a "bad way", when those things were already done by "Team Silent".

Again HC is being faithful with the so called "Team Silent" games here, just like the way the Otherworld transitions work in HC are very much like in SH1.
Like I said HC actually takes inspiration from every SH before it and does it in careful, respectful way, that makes a balanced overall. Like the way it succeeds in mixing elements from MC psychology introduced by SH2, but mixes it with a Cult based story of SH1/3 in a fitting way.

But all you want to do is look at the game through blinkers, only retaining "camera angle" and "movie"; and it's not like those are bad by definition either.

>>3505426
>Harry keeps teleporting back&forth to the hospital room with Lisa in it in the 2nd half of SH1.

he was literally placed into Alessa's dream at that point, not teleported.

>>3505429
and in Homecoming everything went to Hell, literaly (or rather Hell came into town, whichever).

>>3504116
Yeah, I said that because I knew it was hopeless. It's not the first time I lay out facts about Homecoming and wash away the common misconceptions and lies about the game in a civil manner; and everytime all I get in return is people covering their ears screaming "CAN'T HEAR YOU NA NANANANA" while throwing insults and impersonating me. >>3504374 >>3503582

>>3505760
Tomm, I don't get it. You were fired from Konami. Do you even get royalties from sales anymore?

>>3505760

>>3503496
dodging look stupid and breaks my immersion

>>3503496
i cant believe you are being serious with your opinion on HC. There are people in denial and then there is you

>>3505968
It's not like Homecoming is actually universally hated. As you should know, on the internet haters are very vocal, because the internet gives them the impression their opinion has weight.

Homecoming has 65% positive rating on Steam; and if you check the negative ratings, you'll notice that a lot of them are due to compatibility issues of the PC port rather than to the game itself.

The game doesn't fare too bad on Metacritic either, both on critic and user side.

>>3506383

>>3506383
>It's not like Homecoming is actually universally hated

I came here to say that I like the premise of SH4 the most out of all SH games.

According to mobygames credit page

>19 people who worked on Origins also worked on SH2
>16 people who worked on Origins also worked on SH4

>only 10 from SH1 worked on SH4 ,14 on SH3

"Team Silent".

>>3506424
>>3507012
I'm not saing HC is many people's favourite, but its reviews are mixed and tend a bit more towards "good" than "bad". It's definitely not universally disliked.

>>3507074
The premise is great, the game has good ideas, but the execution is terrible. Also the game feels glitchy and unfinished

>awful hit detection
some enemies can hit you through walls, entire charged attacks animations give you insane invicibility frames, etc

>forced camera centric controls.
IIRC SH2 and 4 let you choose between character centric and camera centric controls. Not here. It makes the game feel stupid when avoiding enemies: run to the next camera getting past ghosts, camera angle change, changing control directions at the same time meaning you're either not going to go in the wanted direction anymore, or you have to stop for a split second to think what button to press.
On top of that, almost every camera angles are twisted, or leaning, meaning that with camera centric controls, you'll never be running truely straight just pressing forward and you constantly have to press left/right to get the character straight again.

>reduce backtracking into each area; and instead makes you go through each area twice
There was nothing wrong with SH1-3 backtracking. If it's not broken, don't try to fix it. I think the idea here is to reduce backtracking which feels like a chore to some players; but having to go through each area twice only makes thing feel worse, and cheap.

>story
Terrible storytelling. In the end, the game outright MOUTHFEED the ENTIRE story to the player in a single cutscene; making any prior player investigating or thinking pointless. On top of that, the game also repeats the cutscene stuff TWICE in other ways before or after it, just in case you didn't get it

>>3507074
>>3507708
As for the story itself, it's got little to do with previous games; and isn't very consistent with them. If anyone could get powers so easily, and that the instructions was even written in their goddamn bible, why didn't the people in the cult who wanted power (and some of them did, some of them stating "power will be ours" in SH1) did that too ?

>enemies
Instead of being gross, or disturbing, they're just funny. Don't tell me they weren't trying to be funny when you have an enemy that burps every time you hit him; and that you fight several of those in stairs and that they fall down the stairs burping at each bump on the ground.

>puzzles
Either they outright give the answer; or it's super cryptic. Then you have stuff like the wheelchair doll; having to collect parts so that the wheelchair can fall out of the way; when realisticly speaking you'd just move it out of the way yourself. I know it's a video game, but SH1-3 didn't have stuff this stupid.

>escort mission
Almost half of the game is an escort mission with a NPC that runs slowly. It wouldn't be so bad if you have to defend her all the time, and if you don't, you're fucked and can't get the good ending. The problem is that this NPC is retarded, when you're just trying to run past enemies, she'll stop and fight unkillable enemies (ghosts, Sullivan) even when they're not in the way; often forcing you to fight.

>Room 302
First half of the game, it heals you when you get back to it; and there are plenty of ways to get back to it. Not only this nullifies the supposed feeling of being trapped, so the room becomes a safehouse, but it even means less tension in the game world as you can play carelessly during half of the game, get back to the room to heal at at any time and the game keeps track of which enemies you killed. By the time you reach the 2nd half, this system will have make save so much supplies, it doesn't really matter that the room doesn't heal you anymore.

>>3507074
>>3507708
>>3507716

>breakable melee weapons
Great survival mechanic, on paper... except here, it doesn't fucking matter because you'll have plenty of non breakable melee weapons of different strengths, so it's poinltess. Origins did it better.

SH4 is a gigantic pile of shit.
But it's labelled "Team Silent" so it's Gold.

>>3507719

better than that homecoming garbage you've wasted far too much time trying to defend.

We get it: you like it. Good for you.

But I'll put any money that more people prefer 4 over it. I'm sure everyone but you is wrong and you're the only enlightened one here, or whatever, and maybe you're right.

The general consensus seems to be 1-3 are great 4 onwards (with Shattered memories as a rogue due to being something unique) are just pale imitations and arguning which better is like comparing turds.

>>3507730
> I'm sure everyone but you is wrong and you're the only enlightened one here, or whatever, and maybe you're right.

>The general consensus seems to be 1-3 are great 4 onwards [...] are just pale imitation

No, "Silent Hill fans" tend to put SH1-4, including 4, on a pedestal, and call shit anything else. I'm not trying to say I am enlighted, I am just pointing out the double standard of some "Team Silent" fans.

>But I'll put any money that more people prefer 4 over it

Then you can hand over the bills.
I've just been on Metacritic, and I've done % of the "positive" "mixed" and "negative" user reviews of SH4 and HC. In both cases, I included every port (PS2, Windows, XBOX for SH4; 360, PS3 and PC for HC). The result:

>SH4
46% Positive
34% Mixed
20% Negative

>HC
48% Positive
36% Mixed
16% Negative

On top of that, a big part of the negative reviews of HC are regarding the PC version, and if you check them, you'll see that a lot are negative because they have compatibility issues with that PC version, rather than complaining about the game itself.

So guys, what's the worst Silent Hill and why is it Homecoming?

>>3507753

You've not really gone too far to refuting the "comparaing turds" part, chief.

>>3507753

>2% difference

Well you sure showed him

>>3507769
The point in't that Homecoming is liked more than SH4, but rather that both are liked as much; and that it's far from being sure that "people prefering 4 over it" like he said.

Metacritic sure isn't a meter of "everyone"'s opinion, however if you know two shits about poll theories, you know that asking 1000 people rather than 100 wouldn't reduce the "error margin" much, a couple of % at best.

>>3507979

dude, just no. I've been on /v/ long enough to know that 4 is definitely liked more than homecoming. Your levels of autism are cringey even for 4chan.

>in b4 but I have objective evidence

No. Your boner for Homecoming, while weird, is definitely an anomaly.

>>3507998
4chan of all places is the best example of vocal haters. Because they are vocal doesn't mean they represent a majority, the internet is just a mean for their expression.
Nobody except me would be stupid to argue with them, especially when you know they won't listen, and especially on a fast imageboard where threads get deleted super quickly.

It's like your new to the internet or something. If you think 4chan posts represents the voice of people of the world, then according to what you can see on /pol/ facism would be elected in the majority of countries.

Metacritic isn't an accurate representation of "the opinion of the world" but it's as close as we can hope to get on the internet.

Also like I said, I don't expect Homecoming to be many people's favourite, I'm just saying that opinion on the game is a lot more mixed than team silent fanboys want you to believe.

>>3507761
It definitely is downpour.

>>3508047
homecoming story is the shittiest by far. How could you like it??? It's impossible...

>>3508179
Homecoming's story has some amazing stuff, the whole idea of parents sacrificing their own children in horrible ways, and then you have the highlight moments like the choice you have to make with Alex's mother. That single moment fucked with me more than anything else in the series, story wise.

>>3508214
the mother moment is so stupid man. She would die anyway, just shoot her. Plus it looks like something out of Saw, really garbage movie. Ambiguity is the strength of silent hill story

>>3508214
and the expression that soldier guy made while her mom die is just funny

>>3508249
>Ambiguity is the strength of silent hill story

Whether or not this is true, you can't take this one scene which takes place near the end of the game to summarize the entire game's storytelling.
Besides, there is nothing ambiguous about the death of Heather's father in SH3 either, or even about who Heather is pretty much from the start.
If you want ambiguous Homecoming has a lot of that, too along the way. The dialogues with Curtis, judge Holloway, Alex's mother, Bartlett and Fitch... The notes you can read, what you can find in Alex's house about his family, things that require you to wait to have other bits so you can put two and two together, etc

Homecoming doesn't have a NPC coming out of nowhere to mouthfeed you the ENTIRE story of the game in a SINGLE cutscene near the end of the game.
You know, like in SH4.
Speaking of that, I love how the SH movie got criticized by "team silent fans"because of that one scene near the end of the movie where the little girl explains a part of the story; claiming that it's not in the "spirit of Silent Hill" while team silent did it in SH4. Besides, in the movie it's just explanation on how part of the story, and you still have to understand what comes after that by yourself. In SH4 it's even worse because it summarizes the entire story, all yoy need in that game is that ONE cutscene.

>>3507979

(re)Playing Origins now, reaching the end. It's really good gameplay wise, it has some amazing locations and level design. My two main grips so far are the forced camera centric controls, and the absence of difficulty settings, but it's totally a game I'd love to learn to fastrun
like I used to do with SH1, something no other game in the series made me feel.

Fuck the input delay in the PS2 version though. I just triggered the UFO ending by mistake losing more than half an hour of progress, fuck...
>>3508849
Oh wow you are so full of shit if you think that picture means anything with the topic at hand.
1) I used user review ratings, not pros
2) I compared HC and SH4, two games of the SAME genre in the SAME series which came out only a few years apart. I compared what is comparable, unlike in your pic.

>>3510010
Every time I read one of your posts it's like someone shat straight into my brain.

>>3510015

He's been posting so long now that I've developed a mental filter to cut through the autism.

Pretty much everythign he says can be reduced to "I like thing" or "I don't like thing"

The actual reasons and observations are just headache inducing with no payoff - very rarely any actual insight, certainly not enough to pay that much heed.

This RELENTLESS Homecoming defence has reached levels of tiresome I didn't think were possible even on 4chan.

>>3510015
>>3510028
see >>3505760

Stating facts regarding games gameplay mechanics or story, as well as telling about user reviews, has nothing to do with taste.
You know this though, you just cover your hears because you're too closed minded to let yourself admit your taste was dictated by bandwagon misconceptions and brand name fanboyism.

There was progress though, since this thread went from "HC is not survival horror" to "okay it's just shit", and from "the consensus is SH1-4 are the bests" to "the consensus is SH1-3 are the best".

>>3510015
>>3510028


Oh, shit... I think he heard us. Be cool, man... be cool. Maybe he'll go away.

>>3510035

That's bullshit though. I played Homecoming on release and I was EXCITED for it - it was a very real disappointment.

I have always said that I thought the cult aspects - with the dead kids getting revenge etc. was very cool and a neat idea - and that's a big deal because I still think the cult aspect in the originals was the weakest part.

EVERYTHING else about the game was just terrible, in my opinion... or wasn't exceptional enough to stand out over the rest of the crap.

My tatse has been dictated by BETTER FUCKING GAMES. Homecoming was, by and large, a step down in just about every way.

I'm sorry that you don't like hearing opinions on the internet that:

1. are not yours
2. not the same as yours

but I'm afraid if you're going to be a grown up on 4chan that's a couple of hang ups you might have to get over.

You have the audacity to call me close-minded when YOU just won't accept that other people might have a different opinion that you; that they just don't dedicate paragrah after paragraph of text dedicated to justifying said opinion.

Unlike you some people are just more succinct:

They thought Homecoming was trash.

>>3510049
There are bad Silent Hill games, I dont think Homecoming is one of them.

I honestly think the best ones are the ones that are isolated, like Silent Hill 2, Silent Hill 4, and Homecoming.

4 has some huge issues. After Homecoming the games went to shit for sure, but I don't think Homecoming is -bad- it's just a bit different.

>>3510049
>You have the audacity to call me close-minded when YOU just won't accept that other people might have a different opinion that you

You're trying to reverse the situation here.
Look at this thread
- You have the "feeling" that HC has a huge action orientation which is unfaithful of Silent Hill games
- By describing gameplay mechanics of HC, and comparing it to the ones of "team silent" SH games, in other words using facts, I have shown that the supposed action orientation isn't nearly as big as the "feeling" it gives you, which I believe is mostly due to the camera angle

Same thing with the story; and I have also used facts to show you it isn't nearly as badly recieved as you believe it is.

And you refuse to even acknowledge any of that, because those facts hurt your belief too much, only answering by throwing insults and covering your hears. There isn't even a discussion here because you refuse to even challenge your opinion.

I barely even brought the notion of taste in this comparison, but I don't really care about that, and I don't nearly do this with every game I like, the reason I do this is because HC is the most misunderstood game I know of, as all the complains I hear about it are superficial misconceptions or outright lies.

>>3510010
Stop pretending review scores mean anything

>>3483046
the fear of nesfag tends to create fear for the survival horror threads

>>3483203
>>3483240
>examining this bloody corpse in the very beginning is something like "Jesus! What is that?!" in USA version, while in PAL one, Harry merely wonders "What? What is this?"

You got those mixed up.

NTSC version: "What the..? What is it?
PAL version: "Jesus! What is that!"

>the European version has a silly typo: "I PREY she's safe."

True, that's pretty funny. The NTSC version says "Hope she's safe."

Some other differences I noticed:

When Harry examines the corpse in the alternate school bathroom

NTSC: "A hanging body... Why would somebody..."
PAL: "A hanging body... This is sick!"

When examining the doors that lock behind you in the alternate school

NTSC: "It's locked!"
PAL: "The door is locked."

Also, whenever you get a die, the game displays a black screen with hints written on it. If you're acually fast enough to read it, you will notice that it's written in typo-ridden engrish.

>>3483480
I did that as well.

From then on I searched every corner of whatever new area I got to. This eventually led to me leaving the optional area for the "Good Ending", as I triggered the next area by crossing a bridge while searching.

The most unrealistic thing about Silent Hill is how the main character doesn't respond to losing his daughter by running around screaming about it in this annoyingly petulant manner, inconveniencing and taking advantage of everyone around him to rectify a situation that was basically his own fault, like Michael from Lost.

>>3483065
it would be mine if the damn system would just fucking crashing on resident evil 1-3 and silent hill cut scenes.

>>3511336
I missed it too on my previous run, it's ridiculous because it's right there when you start the battle. but for some reasons it's easy to miss, probably due to how dark and symmetrical the room is... and then people complain about shining items in some other games, oh well.
In the same play I also missed the Kauffmann stuff, like I said I always thought the last part of SH1 is sloppy, not as well designed as the rest. They should have made it so that going off that area is triggered by using a key or something, which would be a clearer indication that you won't be coming back.

I always thought the ways to get the different endings was a little cryptic in SH1 as well; but at least it's there in a way that depends on player exploration and actions and that can be done on a first playthrough. I'm not found of the way SH3 does endings for instance, and it fits with how straightforward and linear 3 is.

I'm replaying SH3 on PC this time and I just found out about the way it handles supplies.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/914765-silent-hill-3/faqs/36889

Basically, when you're above a certain number of health items or ammo, you'll find less in the world. I find this kind of stupid because it means that conversation isn't always the best way to play the game.
For instance I was just playing the part inside the subway train until the room with the maule. Got hit 2 or 3 times, used a health drink, found a medpack in the room with the maule. Loaded my save, didn't get hit, no medpack.

I guess that this system kind of works, because when I played the game on hard last time, it always felt like I was low on everything due to my tendency for ultra conversation.
But, someone who will shoot more, will also find more ammo... I guess this also explains why we disagreed earlier about supplies in SH3.

>>3510101
but Homecoming is pure garbage, how could you like it??? o_o"

>>3512436

the word is conservation

>>3483046
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2cK8mOG4Q8

>>3516775
gotta say though, the dither is unreal on a pvm. so bad.

Goddamn, the end boss of SH3 is even harder on PC.

For one thing, the flames don't make the game lag like on PS2, so they're harder to dodge. I could be wrong but I also have the feeling that they're faster, or at least that the "faster flames" is triggered more often, could just be bad luck though.

Then, the exploit (the one where standing on a precise point near his shoulder will make it impossible for him to hit you) seem to have been fixed on PC. I never used that exploit myself though.

This makes me wonder if they changed/fixed anything else.

>>3512276
I've always seen SH1 as rather perfectly paced. I enjoy how the areas get progressively shorter after the hospital, it adds to the feeling of a surreal world unraveling more and more as you play. Then the grand finale of the Nowhere area, where you put your puzzle solving skills to a final test.

I get why they made it so that the Kaufmann stuff is easy to miss. It punishes scaredy cats like myself if they try to advance without putting themselves in danger. But yeah maybe I would prefer a way to return to that area once you leave it, since the player might think there are important key items beyond the bridge that you need for the Kaufmann sidequest. Still, at that point you had the opportunity to save the game at the end of the first sewers, if not at some point in the middle of the sidequest.

How do i beat the last boss on hardest difficulty?

>>3483074
Largely also due to the rushed development cycle, Team Silent's higher-ups at Sony really wanted this to be a fire-and-forget Resident Evil clone and refused to acknowledge how great their work was.

>>3518459
>Sony
durr, meant Konami obviously

>>3518371
Spam whatever strongest weapon you have and heal every time you get hit. You need enough supplies.

Trying to avoid the thunder attacks seem pretty hopeless.

I heard something about how if you're out of ammo the boss commits suicide so it's not impossible to win... I don't know if it's true but t his is why games like RE1 or 3 are superior gameplay wise, in a survival horror you need to provide either other means to kill the bosses or even to run from them, or else you're going to have to hand out a lot of supplies.

hey, fellow anons, does anybody have the "SO YOU WANT TO PLAY SOME FUCKING SH" screencap?

I have cravings for SH2.

>>3518464
Amusing fuck up seeing how it was sony that has given some of the team silent refuges a chance to make a new IP. Forbidden Siren 1 and 2 were great.

>>3518737
>Trying to avoid the thunder attacks seem pretty hopeless.
....wat?
You just literally run in circles once the thunder sounds start. Like, at as steep angle as possible. Then you start emptying your guns to the thing's face.

>>3519882
dunno what you're talking about, but you could just read the thread, check the SH PC Guide, and grab the game + the fixes from: >>3483175

>>3520194
You mean using straferunning using the shoulder buttons? You sure that works on Hard? Also are we talking Alessa or Samael?

I don't think I ever tried straferunning, but turning in round with regular running I've tried every time and the thunder would always be a head of me.

Some FAQ mentions you have to stay close to it so perhaps I was running too far off.

>>3520442
>You mean using straferunning using the shoulder buttons?
No, I mean literally just running in a big circle. Forward + Left / right. There'll be 4-5 thunder bolts, all which should barely miss Harry. Works at least w/ Samael; haven't gone to Alessa ending in a while.

>>3483057
>I swear to fucking God I'm going to start taking the girls camping somewhere there's no cell reception just to hook up a projector and playstation to the inverter in my truck and play some horror games 20th century style.
it's probably going to ruin the moment when they start begging you to let them go, anon. better off just playing games on your own.

>>3496803
>>3496803
>accident

>>3520736
Yes, it was an accident. Educate yourself.

Don't mean to start a shitstorm, but what emulator do you guys recommend for SH1?

>>3521725
pSXfin to retain that grainy look. >>3483069
>>3483087
>>3483203

>>3483069

It's not really an open world game or series. Nothing wrong with being linear if it's done well. (and it is)

>>3521725
see >>3483178

>>3522517
you can achieve that on ePSXe too, if you use a software plugin. You can also "simulate" quite a lot of the graininess with the OpenGL´s options (no texture filters + 16-bit color + color dither + Dot-Matrix).

Not the same thing to an extend

>>3483069
>Finally there is nowhere, which is a really cheap re-use of locations we've already visited
I never found it cheap or bad.
The idea of time and space mixing up to create this very nightmarish maze, one without a working map, always fascinated me. Only SH3 ever tried anything of the sort, but even its "nowhere" was very small scale in comparison.

>>3524501
>Only SH3 ever tried anything of the sort, but even its "nowhere" was very small scale in comparison.

The entirety of SH3 is very linear and streamlined, with a succession of small areas.
But the church in SH3, it's hard to call it "nowhere", it's mostly just the church invaded by the otherworld, apart from that one classroom and Alessa's bedroom.
It doesn't re-use stuff previously seen in the game.

The one thing I love about SH1's nowhere is the floors/elevator thing; how you can take an elevator to the other floor, which is in fact on the same floor....

>>3522545
>It's not really an open world game or series.
Obviously not, but you don't have to be so exterme. Survival Horror has adventure gameplay elements by definition, part of explorations, puzzle solving and story.
I think the first half of SH1 nailed that perfectly, but the 2nd half is very streamlined, so you lose the exploration factor. SH3 is guilty of that during the entire game though.

Bump time.

>>3483046
I know it must not be that special around here, but a 20 days old thread is still a sight to behold in my eyes.

>>3527565
Welcome to /vr/.

>page 10
nope!

>>3512436
I have over 500 handgun bullets and over a hundreds hotgun shells by the end of Silent Hill 2 when I played through it the first time,, blind even. I assume the idea is so you aren't over prepared and the remainder of the game becomes a cakewalk. Because honestly they throw out supplies in those games like candy considering you can get through barely firing any bullets at all by just running away or by just learning how to do the melee combat well.

>>3530976
*had
*shotgun

>>3530976
Yeah, maybe if you played on easy or something.

>>3531887
In SH2, they do give you that much in Normal action mode. It's just that >>3530976 would have to get near everything, which you're really not expected to, and not get into a lot of fights. Not typical behavior but it's very possible.

>>3483293
Just to add to this real quick, I think it was an interview with the voice actor for James in SH2 somewhere that he explained that around maybe 2000 Konami was in some kind of serious financial trouble and had to be bought out by some bank or something.

Following that they made all the Konami offices into sterile, soulless work environments that were awful to work at, which to my understanding is the reason why Team Silent broke up.

Of course it could have been a bit of both, terrible working environment and the Konami executives being bean counting fucktards.

Lore question: So what exactly is the reason that the various characters ended up in Silent Hill's otherworld in Silent Hill 1?

That aspect of why certain people are there while the rest of the town seems unaffected is puzzling.

I mean, I can understand, as the game explains later, why Cheryl is brought back to Silent HIll (likewise obvious with Dahlia, but what exactly caused Harry, Cybil, Kaufman, and Lisa to be transported there?

In fact, why Lisa alone is stuck in Nowhere is never really explained, as far as I can tell.

I mean, I guess this is stuff that was meant to be ambiguous, but throughout the course of this series it's always a question of what did these characters do to end up in Silent Hill's nightmare version of reality - even moreso confusing in SH2.

I like how nonchalant all the characters are in Silent Hill.

>Hey it's pretty dangerous out there.

YES IT'S DANGEROUS THERE ARE FUCKING MONSTERS AND SHIT HOLY FUCK WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS TOWN

>>3534026
I think Kaufman is my favorite for this.

>We won't get anything done just standing here flappin' our gums.

lol Kaufman what the fuck are you talking about this town is beyond fucked

>>3533618
>So what exactly is the reason that the various characters ended up in Silent Hill's otherworld in Silent Hill 1?
Most of them had direct personal relationship / connection to Alessa. It´s also gently implied that everyone got sucked into this spreading "reality becoming nightmare" phenomenon. So potentially hundreds, if not thousands of townspeople got caught in that mess, and were either "removed" from reality, or killed.

>In fact, why Lisa alone is stuck in Nowhere is never really explained, as far as I can tell.
it is: the REAL Lisa was killed a long time ago. The one you meet is a mere perfect image of her that Alessa had of her, given life through her psychic powers + the god/demon stuff going on within her. When Alessa is kidnapped by Dahlia and made to succumb to the god-birthing/becoming process, she loses the only remaining string of sanity little by little, turning into yet another puppet nurse.
Thus that "I´m the same as them".

Also, you´re repeating the very common rookie mistake concerning the form of this "otherworld":
there is no "another reality" or "dimension", just a strong psychic, pretty much magical power that alters OUR world, our reality, into these creepy hellish landscapes you see. The "power" within the town creates these "projections" out of persons´ psyche, into our existence, and sort of 4D-Photoshops the earth in real time in whacky ways.
In SH1, it was all Alessa´s "nightmares", becoming real.

>>3483051
I'm gonna go with the shrieking skinless pterodactyl

>>3530740
>/toy/ bumping a fellow slow board
You guys are alright

>>3496025
>Some ignorant people treat the SH's "cult" like some sort of generic satan-worshipping inner circle,
it is cultural, if you are/were an American fundie where everything that isn't a certain stripe of Christianity is horribly misguided at best or satanic at worst.

>>3483338
Everyone overlooks how much terrible shit Kojima has done, His most recent Slient a Hill idea (PT) was to make an incredibly expensive game with one of the biggest American TV stars and a big Hollywood director on the payroll and give away an expensive proof of concept/demo away for free years before the planned release. This is despite Silent Hill being a niche series now and horror games getting fewer sales than other genres.

The guy isn't capable of limiting his budget and without the MGS name would only lose money. I'm convinced the new MGS was a big disappointment in RoI and one of the reasons Kojima was ousted was because that shit needed to be finished.

>>3535542
never been to a /toy/, just a huge SH fan.

>>3535989
>Everyone overlooks how much terrible shit Kojima has done,
I don´t recall him ever doing any "terrible shit" whatsoever. And no, I don´t suck up everything with his / MGS´ name on it as the best shit ever either.