/vr/ - Retro Games

>>3102110
this looks like a hell lot of fun!
Shotgun Frenzy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHsQfRnquck

you know where I can download this?

Is there a Version compatible with Brutal Doom?
(and what music-track is this?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FIE7bRTWFo

can I get this glowing-bullet-decals-effect as single .pk3 ?

Wha happened to Doom general threads? Where is the OP text?

>>3102110
Doom 3, T-shirts with the UAC Logo on them.

Anyone got a picture of it. Not the shit that's on bethstore for Doom 4 but Doom 3.

>>3102110

I've been playing Doom for years and only recently found out the berserk pack's effects don't wear out when the blood red fog does.

Hey! You're not the regular OP!

Here, I'll copy and paste from the last thread:

[INSERT WITTY ONE LINER]

DOOM THREAD / RETRO FPS THREAD - Last thread >>3099151 → →

DOOM/II/ULTIMATE/FINAL/64
Gameplay, WADs/Maps/Mods, Source Ports
All other retro FPS welcome
~~ Let's post like gentlemen ~~

FAQ/PASTEBIN
http://pastebin.com/vPbiw4NR

SO YOU WANT TO PLAY SOME...
Doom: https://data.desustorage.org/vr/image/1448/27/1448271860636.png
Doom download: https://yadi.sk/d/469ydBaLndVCJ
Quake: https://data.desustorage.org/vr/image/1405/27/1405272990521.png
Duke: https://data.desustorage.org/vr/image/1403/19/1403195896088.jpg
Thief: https://data.desustorage.org/vr/image/1456/09/1456095399293.jpg

== INFO/LINKS ==

OFFICIAL DOOM WIKI
http://doomwiki.org/

WHERE TO FIND WADS
Vanilla/Boom: http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/
ZDoom: http://forum.zdoom.org/viewforum.php?f=19
/idgames: http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/
BT (2016-02-01): https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13513277/idgames.torrent

TUTORIALS/UTILITIES
http://pastebin.com/7vKYWYp0

== /VR/DOOM COMMUNITY ==

IRC
irc.zandronum.com #vr (key in faq)

THREAD ARCHIVES
https://desustorage.org/vr/search/text/%22doom%20thread%22/type/op/

IMAGE DATABASE
http://vrdoom.booru.org/?page=post&s=list

OUR WADS
http://pastebin.com/5sKRiJzS
http://pastebin.com/aiEgdB3K

COMMUNITY PROJECT
Make a Boom-compatible E1-themed Ultimate Doom map.
Status: https://desustorage.org/vr/post/3019509

===NEWS===
Stuff happened, the real OP knows what's up.

>>3104053
OP here.
thank you for this one!

Been wondering where the real OP was! ^^

Okay, explain to me this shit.

Map is The Abandoned Mines, starting room. I go to fucking window and get pummeled by something. It's not the chaingunners to the right, but pic related, one light year away.

>>3104204
So I retreat back, but the fucker still manages to hit me through walls.

Is this a bug or some sort of stupid texture that hides the view but allow bullets to hit? And why does this guy deals cyberdemon-rocket-equal damage in every machine gun hit?

>>3104205
Chaingunners don't deal much damage per hit - 5 through 20 iirc. the hit chance is randomized with a greater chance the closer you are. If you think you're being hit through walls, you aren't. Something could be hitscanning from below, from above, or maybe you don't see what's hitting you from the sides. Assuming no gameplay mods, doom monsters don't act like that.

tl;dr, pic related.

http://www.nightworkgames.com/
>The new First-Person Shooter by John Romero is being built at Night Work Games Ltd. in Galway, Ireland.

the old thread is still at page 6, come on this wasn't necessary

also chaingunners do 1d5*3 damage in a 22.5 degree spread

http://zdoom.org/wiki/A_CPosAttack

>>3104205
Chaingunner on the left, visible on your first screen ? Maybe he can still hit you where you stand on the second screen.

>>3104593
That's the point. I know it's chaingunner on the left, but on the second pic, how can he still be hitting me when I'm at the back of the room.

>>3104418
Obviously :)

>>3102787
>Call of Doom: Modern Warfare

nty

>>3104673
he can still see the top of you, which is 56 units off the floor, even though your eyes are only 41 units off the floor.

>>3104008
you aren't the first and you won't be the last. i think even the readme that comes with doom2 gets this wrong

>>3104053
===NEWS===

[03-29] Nihility: Infinite Teeth
https://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/85591-

[03-28] Anon map release: rnfwip.wad
>>3096295
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4mwJRa7e5VpdXBxTVJZeUtCQ3c/view

[03-27] Anon map release: Cubed.wad
>>3094739
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4mwJRa7e5VpaTJXaWtJMzd5UFk/view

[03-26] Gun Godz 0.8
>>3092904
http://www.mediafire.com/download/68jk6od0sz16t0v/GunGodz_0.8.pk3

[03-26] Anon map release: bluebase.wad
>>3091128
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4mwJRa7e5VpSVZfcEQ3RUtObWs/view

[03-26] Guncaster update
http://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?p=895331#p895331

[03-25] Anon map release: Durex Waste Disposal
>>3087796
https://www.dropbox.com/s/zl37cs00ew3eads/CLOSETV2.wad

[03-24] Anon map release: Homecoming.wad (two maps)
>>3087352
https://mega.nz/#!w4cV1agJ!w_d_zfvOoE6F9XKCln5bmoWWvJJjuFewfhc3R1xOBaY

[03-24] Anon map release: map02 (title still unknown)
>>3087259
http://temp-host.com/download.php?file=lm04de

[03-24] Mutiny Community Project, alpha 1
https://www.doomworld.com/vb/post/1577910

[03-24] Anon remix release: Perfected Hatred
>>3086146
https://youtu.be/QOzrI3HFDjg

[03-22] No Sleep For The Dead v1.0, by janvknn (dodead, class_ep)
https://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/53924-

[03-21] TNOTMWOFOLBTIDIDWTSOCSNTITNOTM final, on /idgames
https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/levels/doom2/Ports/m-o/map_name

[03-20] Doom2 Nightmare speedrun in 23:06, by Zero-Master
https://youtu.be/GPhVDe0Vj-s

[03-20] DUMP 2 Test Build (60+ maps)
>>3078794
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tt5ey6ngh4ai3wh/DUMP-2-test0.pk3

[03-20] Defecation Foundation updated
>>3078627
https://www.dropbox.com/s/y4dg1f6sluy8yz9/Defecation%20Foundation.wad

[03-20] The UAC Fucked Up Yet Again updated
>>3078225
http://www.mediafire.com/download/atixtqd84686ptc/TheUACFuckedUpYetAgain.wad

[03-20] Anon mod release: TennisGun.pk3
>>3077575 >>3077598
https://www.dropbox.com/s/gqwe24q1skoe6da/tennisgun.pk3

===

To submit news, please reply to this post.

>>3104687
butthurt purist with nostalgia-goggles detected.

>>3105156

everything about this picture is cool. I love this artist's take on Doomguy, and jamming a rocket launcher into the caco's eyesocket is metal.

Nth for Deathmatch Classic, the redheaded Quake sibling grown in a lab and fed Headcrab innards.

>>3104926
MSX is great at what it does (injecting elements of modern FPS into Doom)

Brutal Doom is allover the goddamn place, and combat with more than 10 enemies becomes a total clusterfuck of flashes smoke and flying gibs and mob screams, which can look great when you see it in a montage but becomes an unmanageable garbage when you play it yourself.

>>3105175
Grenadelauncher is hideous

>>3102113
Gameplay mods tend to be mutually exclusive.
You can always try to make compatibility patch yourself.
If you manage not to vomit after seeing Mark's code that is.

>>3102110
>op is a bd-faggot
>old thread is still at page 8
>no general text in the op, no news update no nothing

move along people, let this thing die and real thread be made in due time by the OP that is not a faggot.

>>3105180
The normal Quake launcher is hideous, too.

>>3105207
Normal Q GL is qt.

>>3105175
someone pls port the DMC models to a regular sourceport or something

>>3105214
It looks like a toaster combined with a PVC pipe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5hWHOt7v8U

>>3104673
He can see and shoot through the bottom of that grate texture, it's not solid. (you can shoot through it as well)

>>3105243
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3v3zcygH5c0
Superior fix coming thru.

>>3105243
Does the last bit of the trailer look like a reference to Deimos to anyone else?

>>3105305
>Superior

opinions

>>3105243
If I changed the music to be unironic i'd rather have this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4e0VvHZMaTs
than whatever they had in the original trailer
If I wanted to make it funny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIgZ7gMze7A

http://temp-host.com/download.php?file=lt02uz
Version 0.8 of map03 finished. Not 1.0, mainly because a few places still don't have quite the right textures. The places that I want to get a real feel with textures though are finished. Taking all critics and commentary.

If you want to, feel free to also critique map01 and map02, both of which are 1.1 versions. Intending to go for a larger megawad where these levels are respectively the start, somewhere middle, and boss or close to bossfight.

Picture is not the start of map03, but where you'll be walking uphill to face doom.

Before making more maps, I think I'm going to try my hand at making some music of my own for these levels as well as just polishing them some more.

>>3105363
>large ammopool
>supremely rapid firepower
>good damage
Couple that with the fact that you don't find the BFG until Ep3, so you might as well go all out with the Plasma until then, the damage output is totally worth it.

The really fast rate of fire makes it ideal for hurting enemies that are sensitive to pain, and just in general it does great damage.

The trailer cyberdemon sounds like BLOOD's gargoyles

>>3105243
>>3105305
The only way to "fix" this trailer, is to have doomguy ripped in half by the first baron. That should be the end of the clip. It just feels like he's invulnerable. what's the point? I'd like the enemies to at least seem like a danger, but no, he just gets some slight scratches on his armor. What's the point of a game if you can just walk through everything without any danger of death?

>>3105156
love this picture, but can't help but feel like this is something eric harris would draw

>>3105524
>>3105524
>but can't help

yes, yes you can help it.

>>3105526
too bad then

>>3105417

I'm not saying it's useless. Just that it's rather redundant and is better than many of the other weapons. Each weapon seems to serve a specific role. But Plasma overlaps a lot. And it totally outclasses the RL.

The SS also out classes it at short range, meaning the RL is almost never used.

>>3105243
>>3105305
I hate this faggotry so much.
>>3105443
Are you fucking retarded? Doomguy gets killed both at E3 (twice, but one is barely shown) and on the campaign trailer.

>>3105552
>Doomguy gets killed both at E3 (twice, but one is barely shown) and on the campaign trailer.
so he should get killed in this trailer too. keep it consistent, make it look dangerous

>>3105625
No, fuck off. It would be chicle at this point, not "consistent".

>>3105549
What role does the pistol serve?

>>3105627
chicle eh? Well I can't argue with that. and you called me retarded lol

Work on Durex Waste Disposal marches onwards
What would be a cool thing to use for the final encounter at the tip?

>>3105681
Ranged starting weapon. Fists are superior, but when you can't reach the monster because they're on a ledge or you're low on health and need to keep some distance between a baddie the fists wont do. That's when the pistol shines.

>>3105712
I'm liking that layout. Especially the northernmost room.

>>3105712
does the room on the top by any chance use wood textures for the floor wall and ceiling

>>3105718
I do use some wood but I try to keep it as veiny and rock-hard as possible

>>3105712
End the map with the player speeding out the tip into a void.

>>3105715
The problem with the starter weapon is that it's shit.

Starter weapons should not be shit. I mean, look at the first Quake. They did things right-ish, by making the starter weapon a shotgun.

The pistol serves no purpose once you get the chaingun, because you can just tap-fire the chaingun and it'll automagically be 100% accurate. It takes the same ammotype, meaning that you aren't even obliged to use the pistol at all.

When I made a map and made the players have to use a pistol for a good time, basically EVERYONE who gave me feedback gave me shit and whined for a shotgun earlier in the level. Fuck the pistol.

>>3105738
I'm personally okay with the pistol being useless after finding the chaingun. I always felt as if the pistol being fairly bad was suppose to be motivation to get out of the starting room quickly to find something better. Maps that force you too keep the pistol for more than a few rooms are doing it wrong, and I totally agree that being forced to rely on it and fists for too long is frustrating.

I agree with your statement that Quake did it better. The shotgun is more satisfying to use than the pistol, and the SSG doesn't completely render the shotgun useless once you find it. They made the SSG an option instead of a straight upgrade, and I think that's ultimately the "best" way to do weapons in a game.

>>3105738
>Starter weapons should not be shit.

The idea is that you start weak, and want to find something bigger.

>>3105791
Weak and shit are two different things.

>>3105687
I'm an actual spanish speaker, so yes, it autocorrected.

Also "lol you spelled a word wrong your post is invalid". Are we on fucking youtube's comment section? Come on anon, even you are better than this.

>>3105791
I prefer when starter weapons are useful from beginning to end, kinda like how Perfect Dark does. Falcon 2 is sexy.

Does anybody here play DoomRL?

>>3105794
Not really.

So what do you guys think of the Doom Beta?

To me, it's definatley faster than the alpha, but it certainly can be faster. Especially with the jetpack when kinda fucks up your momentum when you use it which I'd go without.


Also I know it's a beta but holy fuck I wish I could change my FOV.

>>3105805
Perfect Dark is a bit different, though. It aims for somewhat more realistic damage (ie, headshots are always 1 hit kill). And generally weapons arent carried over to the next mission.

>>3105863

Haste speed should be default. This can't be argued.

>>3105863
I had some fun with it, but yeah, REALLY need an FOV slider.

I also kinda reckon the haste powerup speed is what the normal speed should be..

>>3105549
RL does more DPS, especially against multiple targets (but even against single targets)

>>3105872
Yea, which is one of the reasons I would love a mod with a decent limb damage system. I guess BD does it, but I hear it's a cluster fuck.

>>3105879
Yes it can
Fuck you

>>3105890

No it can't, especially in the way you're doing it.

>>3105893
Yes it can you retarded cockgobbler

>>3105879
>>3105893

speed is jsut fine way it is

game is perfect fuk u

there i argued it

>>3105896

>>3105735
no, speeding out into a meat dungeon room.

>>3105863
>So what do you guys think of the Doom Beta?

Imagine an ass farting. Eternally.

>>3105914
some of us think thats hot, anon

Why the fuck did they have to title the new game just "Doom," this shit is confusing

>>3105798
I still think doomguy should get torn to shreds. It would really hammer home that the new game aint gonna be easy. But then again, its going to be doom so it will probably be a walk in the park difficulty-wise

>>3105937
Fuck this trend so hard.

>>3105681
>What role does the pistol serve?

Low end ranged weapon. Capable of killing low to mid range enemies if needed.

>>3105937
This. It doesn't even feel like a loving tribute like Rise of the Triad 2013 did, it's more of "Oh we're gonna call it Doom because it's gonna be a replacement for that old piece of crap that the kids don't like anymore." It really wouldn't have been a problem to call it Doom 4, this is pure marketing bullshit just like the movie industry pulls.

>>3105887

But ti's harder to use. For whatever reason, in Doom I constantly kill myself with the RL.

>>3105967
well stop doing that

:^)

>>3105937
Dunno, but its common for them to use the excuse of "trying to bring in new fans".

>>3105681
Outside of shooting switches, and killing trash monsters when you lack other weapons, not much.

>tfw only have time to make one sprite before nightshift.

>>3105937

I wonder if our community will henceforth be known as doom 2 modders or oldoomers because of this dumb naming scheme. It really annoys me badly that they didn't go with Doom 4, I know it's trivial as fuck, but good god I hate this trend.

>>3106009

Probably just the doom modding community because, honestly, Doom 4 Modding is going to be a clusterfuck at best. Nonexistant at worst.

>>3106015
Yea, I can't help but feel the whole snapmap crap is going to be like Tony Hawk's create-a-park. Fun for a couple hours but no real replacement for proper level making tools. Pretty sure that's the only content creation tool we're getting too.

>>3104926
MSX
Brutal Doom is at least somewhat technically innovative

>>3105840
I do. It's nice but the fact you can't savescum and everything is randomized means gameplay is kind of a shitshow.

>>3106090
>Brutal Doom is at least somewhat technically innovative
HEH

>tfw Doom is dead

>>3106090

Ah Brutal Doom, Suffers from a creator with an ego almost as big as John Romero before Daikatana.

>>3105552
>I hate this faggotry so much.

>hating on it's not unusual

No anon, you're the faggot.

>doomcucks

Gave legendoom a try. It's bretty good when the RNG doesn't feel like making a cyberdemon legendary.

>>3106134

>>3106172
>>3106134
compare them on the same scale m8

>>3106172

that big peak in the middle is one hundred percent BDv20 (released around mid-2015), then that small peak is the so called "starter pack"

which simply goes to show how people just simply forget about the mod once an update is out and they stop playing again for a month or two to go back to whatever else they were playing

>>3106179
why would somebody search for it again after already downloading it you dumbass

>captcha: third Manassas

>>3106189
>why would somebody search for it again after already downloading it

update

>>3106189

Are you the kind of guy that keeps sitting on older versions of mods like Samsara?

>>3105937
People are jaded by sequels. So now they just omit the number and think they've fooled everyone. Hollywood does the same thing.

>>3106218
Well they could have just named it "Return to Phobos" or "Doom Resurrection" or something. I just fucking hate this new trend.

At least Rise of the Triad didn't have "Dark Wars" in the name

>>3106134
i've been playing doom for many years. i know what it is. i don't need to search for it constantly.
>>3106189
>>3106191
i check here or doomworld regularly for news. a search of the entire web is unneeded and imprecise.

>>3105191
the updated news post can be found a few posts above yours.

since i never did get a response to my request for clarification about thread deletions, i did not wish to further agitate (as it were) the moderators by posting another doom thread, even if this one lacks the standard layout you've all come to expect.

>>3106236

so that means you're officially stepping down as thread maker?

>>3106243
no, i meant another thread in addition to this one. after the previous thread survived to term i figured normal service could be resumed, until i saw this thread.

>>3105712
>>3105716
>>3105718
>>3105724
>>3105735
>>3105904
are you guys 14 years old or something

>>3106284

Shut up, buttmunch

>>3106134
Honestly multiplayer seems about active now as it was 10 years ago, and modding seems *more* active, owing to better tools.

I imagine what that graph is really showing is the interest in Doom 3.

>>3106134
>>3106172
>inb4 russian interface

Also note that about 2/3 of the BD searches come from Russia. Edgy schoolkids 12-16 and parents who dont look at what their kid is playing.

>>3106353
At last I truly see

>>3106353
>a game is more popular than a mod for that game

Unless its DayZ, I'm not surprised.

>>3106134
>>3106353
>>3106356
>>3106360
One more. Note that the last Brutal Doom (as well as overall game series) spike is actually related to the release of the Doom trailer in June, and subsequent drama when BD-fans started to calim that Beth riped off marks work.

>>3106375
drama, really? i remember that but it didn't seem to last more than five minutes. maybe it played out somewhere i don't look at

>>3106171
This is my main problem with legendoom, GL spotting the legendary and engage it properly
>start shooting something
>suddenly goes into uber rage mode
DOOM RLA's monsters were better at this because they could be spotted MUCH easier than this "everything looks default, and then I shoot it"

>>3106420
Don't forget that one demon that's placed in a ledge you can't reach, or is behind a cage you can't access.

>>3106428

Legendary enemies can walk off ledges. Can't do anything about the ones in cages though.

>>3106428
Oh those too as well, and the worst part is not being able to get the shit they dropped
>kill legendary monster
>drops a weapon
>can't pick it up
>>3106431
I almost wanna say if they were to have noclip... but then that'd be a whole new level of "why even?" I guess

>>3106431
Hmm, well could have been just bad luck with me. I tried Legendoom with Requiem, and one of the first enemies dropped a legendary BFG and I couldn't get it without noclipping. Maybe there was a way to it, but it wasn't obvious

>>3106436

You have to bait the enemy into walking off the ledge. Legendary enemies attack non-stop so you have to move out of their range of vision to get them to walk off.

>>3106171
It looks interesting but also gimmicky.

Why do I keep getting killed by monsters bros??

>>3106445
Because you suck at videogames.

>>3106375
>doom 3 spike in 2014
what the...

>>3106478
Not sure why either, since the BFG edition is the smaller spike we see in 2012

OHHH WE RNG NOW

>>3106493
What?

Uh

>>3106543
horrifying

>>3106549
The theme options are gone, too. There's no night/dark theme anywhere. My eyes are currently on fire.

>>3106543
Jesus how to undo it

>>3106543
It's fine for me, but I'm too afraid to hit F5

>>3105343
A gentle bump from mr skeltal

>>3106557
Don't F5. Don't close your browser. Don't let it crash.

I fucking hate April 1st.

>>3106543
>hit f5
>see this
AAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>3106560
SUFFER WITH ME, WARREN MEDINA

>>3106559
http://www.croteam.com/serious-sam-4-cancelled/

At least Croteam are funny about it

>>3106564
Oh shit I noticed we have names now.
That's kind of cool.
Too bad about my fucking eyes HIROSHIMOOT YOU NIGGER

Post your favourite weapon mods, megawads and gameplay mods so I can call you faggots.

>>3106575
Alien Vendetta is breddy gud

>>3106575
brutal doom
complex doom
gvh
aow2

>>3106575
Smooth Doom
Uh ... Back to Saturn X? Requiem? Don't think I have a single favorite
Trailblazer

How homosexual am I?

>>3106575
I've always been a fan of vanilla megawads

Memento Mori 2 is near perfection for me.

I've made a boom map. It's an E1M1 replacement and difficulty is similar to that so don't expect any big fights. Maybe fit for /vr/E1? I think it's a bit under detailed myself but I don't know what the barrier to entry on that project is.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4mwJRa7e5VpM1RKWlNTTVRyUDQ/view?usp=sharing

>>3105879
Haste should be faster, "normal" should be a little faster than it currently is.

Maybe Haste shouldn't be faster by as much on the gun speed, those are a bit ridic, purely discussing movement.

>>3106675
Thank god it's april 1... Oh god. Also that the names are wrong.

>April Fools

Google/Botnet Doom when?

Haven't played BUTTSEX in a while, forgot how a lot of the levels went.

It's so orange...

Goddamn what a mess, I bet that pink blood smells fucking disgusting too.

>>3106717
What mod are you using?

>>3106575
Samsara + Addons because Caleb is fun.

I want to have an identity

>>3106719
Saturn X? I just played this level myself :3

only 5 savescums

>>3106732
Mapset is Back To Saturn X: Episode 1
Gameplay mod is Accessories To Murder

>>3106774
Is it true that the reloads are clip based?

Disgusting fuckers.

>>3106778
Yeah, most weapons, when you reload, you drop and lose your current magazine, regardless of if it's empty or if there's still some rounds left.

The exception is the shotguns (they load shells individually, always), as well as the gatling cannon and BFG, which just draws from one ammo pool at one time and doesn't necessitate any reloading.

I thought it would be weird first, but actually feels quite nice.

Personally, I tweaked a few damage values and magazine sizes, and swapped out some sounds for ones I felt were better.

Two weapons have ADS, the assault rifle, and the pump-shotgun, for the rifle, the aiming is actually incredibly useful, for the shotgun, it typically doesn't matter much (though it actually has a pretty tight spread pattern, like a real shotgun, so you can actually use it at pretty damn decent ranges, just not as far as the rifle)

>>3106803
i think the magnum shouldn't have that mag reload system, just a different (longer) animation where you don't use a speedloader to reaload if there's a (few) good bullet(s) left

but maybe that's just me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tF6MSYkyfrY

so why do we have two threads?

>>3106814
Because post limit has been reached and new replies don't bump the thread anymore. It's on page 10 now so it doesn't have much life left.

>>3102110
so what's considered purist? cause i'm playing gzdoom with no vertical mouse aim and autoaim.

>>3106817
>Not playing the original on dosbox
>Not playing the original on an actual old not upgraded PC
>Playing with mouse
>Strafing

>>3106817
Purist is playing Doom on Doom 95 and only playing on Doom.wad, DoomII.wad, TNT.wad, and plutonia.wad
Adding anything what so ever else means you are no longer playing vanilla and are not playing Doom the way that Doom was meant to be played

>>3106803
Sounds a little annoying on paper. You should at least be able to pick up the ammo afterwords.

>>3106816

k
maybe we can get a proper OP next thread

>>3106817

Purist is pretty gnarly, Vanilla monsters have infinite hitbox height to compensate for the lack of vertical look.

>>3106846
Not true

>>3106846
It's a limitation of the pseudo-3D engine
It's the same reason that a monster on a tall ledge in front of you can still hit you with a melee attack and why explosions are actually infinitely tall cylinders

I didn't make this mess, so I'm not cleaning it up.

>>3106879

I suppose those barrels just spontaneously combusted anon?

Anyone know some good channels on Twitch for Doom and retro FPS? Mostly looking for doom but games from pre- call of duty 4 times would be welcome too.
pic not related

>>3106898
Have they sped up the movement speed, or am I seeing things?

>>3106903
I don't think so, maybe a little bit

>Doom 2 episode 2: The City
>Levels consist of city theme
>Innermost Den
>Suddenly some weird medieval level

>>3106898

#Quake 3 Arena HD

>>3106898
Plain Jane. Looks like almost every other post-2000 FPS.

>>3106910
Quake 3 is much, much faster.

>>3106902

Oh shit I've been wanting this comic for awhile now. Thanks

>>3106886
Hell if I know, it was like this when I got here!

>>3106898
A lot of people are mad about this, glad I don't give a shit about multiplayer.

Well, looks like this is my line.

>>3106982
Aw shit that's a cool name.

>mfw the Doom 4 paladin brigade kept going "wait until the gameplay! wait until you play it! it'll be different and fine! don't knock it just based off gameplay footage and interviews and screenshots and press releases and etc etc etc"

I have never played a more dogshit game in my life. Fuck Doom 4.

>>3106986
Awful lot of green goo.
Probably smells like stale licorice and old fish.

Why are people discussing a 2016 game here?

>>3106994
Is this BTSX?

>>3106998
Pretty sure it is

>>3106995
Because we like Doom?
And /v/ is a fucking shithole, you can't go one thread without someone calling you a shill, a cuck or a nostalgiafag

>>3106991
Did you play the singleplayer campaign?

>Doom 4 paladin brigade kept going "wait until the gameplay! wait until you play it! it'll be different and fine! don't knock it just based off gameplay footage and interviews and screenshots and press releases and etc etc etc"

I don't know about you, but my opinion was simply that "it looks like CoD" and "it looks like Halo" is wrong, it looks nothing like either and doesn't play like them either.

>>3106898
oh god this made me lose it so fucking hard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpeoS9TfRtI

Best April Fools mod coming through

>>3106991
>'I played it and it's shit'
>doesn't elaborate on why it's shit
>will probably reply parroting everything said so far about it because he can't form his own opinion
topless kek, try shitting the thread more

>>3106898
Legit looks like Q3.
Also not retro in the slightest.

>>3106909
I think it's meant to be the old city tourist trap.

>>3107017
BUUB

>>3107017
>Cyberdemon doesn't shoot double rocket
Immersion ruined, dropped

why does 4chan all of a sudden look really weird. did they just overhaul the webpage

>>3107054
Yes Bessie.
It's about time we got with the times <@;-)

>>3107017
>cross eyed status bar

I think I need a Fallout mod

Gee, wonder what happened here?

>>3107025
Quake 3 is pretty retro though.

>>3107017
Amazing

It's legitimately like someone made Halo and Quake 3 fuck each other. Personally, I think it's pretty cool, I hope it doesn't die in the first year.

Don't believe the .webms or much Twitch footage, honestly, every game I've played has been about leaping from ledge to ledge and bopping over your opponent's head, there is so much vertical combat, which is shit I never see in footage.

Sorry for no retro.

>>3107054
Look at this April Fool

test

>>3107096
I'm legit stoked.
All my rl friends who are too kool to play doom with me will be playing doom with me.

Besides it's been far too long since there's been a good fast paced shooter.

So when did Doom become all hardcore gameplay and shit? I remember even late 90s WADs being rather slow-paced and comfy.

Brutal Doom has one major flaw and that is that stupid fucking last stand mechanic were zombies pull out a gun on you when they lose their legs or having to finish off gutted Imps and Knights like what the fuck is that all about this isn't Mortal Kombat I shoot monsters to kill them quicker if I wanted to play some torture sim I would use a chainsaw.

>>3107109
A mix between misinterpretation from not-so-diehard-fans and modders understanding DOOM had a pretty high skill ceiling.

Vanilla Doom is so, so fucking easy. Ultra-Violence is a joke. People seem to forget that.

>>3107108
You and me both, bud.

>>3106090
Nothing in brutal doom is even remotely innovative.

This is some of the info acquired from the beta files

>>3105938
>It would really hammer home that the new game aint gonna be easy.
Who cares, honestly? Trailers are for showing off cool, not just muh difficulty.
> its going to be doom so it will probably be a walk in the park difficulty-wise
This, too. I wanted to make this point before.
>>3106149
It's the *FIXED* shit I hate, not the song.

>>3107113
I think the original game didn't have to bother much with edgy gameplay since monsters did most of the work, being much more dangerous and bullet-spongey than the average at the time. But once players acquired the ancient secret of circle strafing it became a routine.

>>3107125

That all sounds pretty cool, here's hoping it's as cool in execution as it sounds on paper.

>>3107128
>It's the *FIXED* shit I hate, not the song.

Fair enough, I agree there, he shoulda titled it It's not unusual or some shit

speaking of

https://youtu.be/tF6MSYkyfrY

Do you remember the first time you Doom'ed, Anon?

>>3107109
after Hell Revealed and Alien Vendetta

>>3107136
Yep. Started with Doom 2 too.
My dad brought home a PC back in 1995 that had Doom2 and Heretic installed on it.
I liked Heretic more though.
I still do.
Too bad there isnt as much good mods and maps for it.

>>3107136
Not the exact first time, but I remember playing it with dad when I was 5 years old. He'd handle movement and I'd shoot with spacebar.

>>3107104
they've managed to make a game worse than 343i halo while copying it

gj neo-id

>>3107254
just k

>>3107254
>Worse than 343 halo
>Everything went to shit after 3/ODST

No, this is on par at the least with 343 halo lad

>>3107254
okay, now what does that have to do with his post and why would you choose to post an ill-fitting still image to accompany your opinion without even complimenting it?

>>3107309
>>3107254
>>3107318
I hate to be that guy but take this shit to /v/

>>3107136
Mid 2012 when I got it on sale on steam. I really started getting into Doom late 2013 though thanks to these threads.

post more bethesda webms

>>3107375
Not retro, kill yourself back to /vg/

>>3107375
Are you new? Threads here get deleted for less. Not to mention /doom/ is on notice as it is on account of being a general.
Go to /v/.

So I tried playing >>3107017
and for some reason some textures are missing and I can only play Doom 1 levels.

Help?

>>3107385
They just did a half-assed job apparently. No big surprise.

>>3107385
Oh wait actually nevermind, I was just loading both the files for Doom and Doom 2

>>3107384
I haven't been here in a while but there was never any issue with it before.

Not to mention the board rule of sequels being allowed.

>>3107405
Fallout 3/4 threads get btfo

>>3107405
and "Doom 2016" is not a sequel

>>3107375

So if DOOM does well, what's the next FPS that gets a reboot?

This map was ROUGH, and I totally forgot how ROUGH it was, I had several close calls here (while on a previous level I fought like an ace and took very few hits).

>>3107456
Wolfenstein 3d got one and System Shock is underway. So I reckon next in line is Heretic?

>>3107456
>>3107474
Powerslave would be cool.

>>3107460
Some very cool basic attention to detail.

>>3107474
>next in line is Heretic
wew lad that'd be gnarly

>>3107474
Man that would be rad, I'd love another fantasy FPS. Although they would probably find a way to mess it up

>>3107487
I thought they were gonna re-release that?

>>3107487
>>3107492
My wet dream is a proper Witchaven.

>>3107501
I never played that because it looked ugly as sin for me.

What's wrong with it? I've heard a lot of people say it's not really good

I was always a big fan of Ken's Labyrinth.

Really funny, faggots

>>3107512
Witchaven tried to do a lot on a very limited graphic system. Some deficiencies are due to design (like weapons that break very easily), but most of them are due to the rudimentary Build engine.
Given the right resources and code it could have been Hexen done right, i.e. without the annoying puzzles and hub system, and with an actual medieval universe. It has an amazing concept and the atmosphere still holds well imo.

>>3107534
Sounds like my kind of thing.
Unfortunately no one seems to be interested in making FPS games that don't involve guns.
Closest thing we had was Ziggurat and that was slightly above average at best

how do I into Doom?

where do I get it?

>>3107585
pls help am noob

>>3107585
You download it from a torrent site of your choosing and then run it through a sourceport

>>3107585

Does anyone know what exactly the naming convention is for the monster sprites in Doom? I'm looking through them in Doom II but I don't quite get it. What naming convention should I use for my own monsters?

>>3107602
so you're saying don't buy Doom Classic Complete on Steam if I want to multiplayer?

>>3107618
Nope, cash doesn't go to the devs, there's a link in the top right of the image, no need to torrent
>>3107607

>>3107607
best sourceport????

>>3107618
>>3107628
zandronum covers multiplayer and most mods

>>3107629
ty mang

good thing I asked /vr/ first or I would have wasted $15

>>3107632
How would you have wasted 15 bucks. (G)ZDoom is free too.

>>3107585
>>3107628

see, if we had a proper OP maybe these would be answered before they were even asked

carmack get

>>3107639
Project Brutality + Back to Saturn X?

>>3107136
Yes.
I didn't know how to open doors until I figured out how to customize controls, days later.
I also I thought it was a good idea to try the nightmare difficulty and those shotgunners at the beginning of E1M1 made me quit the game in fear.

this is probably old news but,

http://www.bafta.org/press/press-releases/john-carmack-to-be-honoured-with-bafta-fellowship

>not being an agitating skeleton

>>3107715

Actually...

That looks kinda good.

>>3107718

W-Would you?

>>3107748

Anon you sick fuck

There are people here who are into this sort of thing.

I never really enjoyed the experience of looking at an imp's asshole as a kid, but now that I'm looking at the sprites I realize that it was probably actually the hole left behind from a support beam that held up the maquette for photographing.

>>3107748
>>3107750

DO NOT PET THE CACODEMON

>>3107748
I would pet that thing cacos are pretty kawaii

>>3107721
are there no other player v player finishers than the knee to the face?

and where's the chaingun, plasmagun and bfg
all i've seen is the RL, SSG + 3 flavours of railguns

>>3107645
on the Steam version

>>3107759
>implying if that was the case they wouldn't have just covered up the hole with pixels

embrace the anus

>>3107809
>>3107759
it's a shadow

Man TNT is just better than Doom II in every way isn't it?

So, has anyone done any datamining recently on the beta?

doom noob here again, how the hell do I change my name in multiplayer? (doomseeker)

The turrets didn't work out, so now I'm using a slow projectile that sprays shit everywhere on bounce.

>>3107854

I would rate that a BFG Tier weapon. Also a great way to kill yourself.

Where can I download the Master Levels?
I hate to ask for spoonfeeding, but I couldn't find a working download after cursory googling, so either I'm a dumbass or it's decently hidden.

>>3107857

It's a plasma rifle pickup.

Maybe I should at least lower the damage a little. Though everything else in this mod hits like a truck.

the BFG pickup will give you immunity to self damage for a set amount of HP and let you remotely detonate regular bombs

>>3107854
>Spends days/weeks on additional add on weapon that you find at random
>Additional weapon is more complex than anything else
>Can't just release something as is and must always pad it out
Get your shit together Joanna

>>3107865

But it's not at random? It's the plasma gun pickup. Gotta have a plasma rifle replacement.

> forget one flag in the monster's attack state
> imp picks a fight with a chaingunner
> chaingunner proceeds to endlessly shoot at the imp and it's corpse
stop! stop! he's already dead!

WHY IS GZDOOM ALWAYS GIVING ME BLACKSCREENS RAAAAA

>>3107886
That chaingunner was a loose cannon

>>3107887
help.

>>3104418

2spoopy

any mods to cover up doomguy's exposed arms?

>on mars
>space suit not fully sealed

>>3107929
> mars has trees
checkmate

>>3107929
>>3107930

You're not even on Mars anyway, unless you're playing DOOM 3.

It's damn hot here.

>>3107681
Accessories To Murder + BTSX1
(I also have a flashlight on autoload because it's damn handy to have, some mapsets are really dark, and it's just average enough to be useful, but not ruin the dark atmosphere of a map)

>>3107803
>are there no other player v player finishers than the knee to the face?
Yeah, they are context sensitive. Incidentally that's why you get the knee so much.

About the guns, not all guns are in the beta.

>>3107759
I always assumed it was shadow.

>>3107815
I feel so. I mean, don't get me wrong, the maps in Doom 2 are largely great up until 12, where it starts to really drop and then meander at mediocre for most of the game.
TNT has a much more consistent quality, and has a special air to it that the other iwads just don't have. It feels like a grimmer, darker, "rustier" and "techier" sci-fi than the original games, and it really appeals to me like that.

Good thing I can look up, these assholes would have been unbearable otherwise.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y4dg1f6sluy8yz9/Defecation%20Foundation.wad?dl=0

One last update to good ol' Defecation Foundation. Not a huge update though. Just fixed a few textures/HOMs and a floor mistakenly marked as a pain sector.

I played through Ultimate Doom, Romero's "Tech Gone Bad" map, Doom 2, Master Levels, and the "No Rest for the Living" episode.

Besides Final Doom and Doom 64, are there any official Doom campaigns/maps I missed?

Also, I watched a video of the beginning of Doom 3 and it looks like a generic modern horror game. Even the enemies don't look reminiscent of the old enemies. Is there any reason for a fan of the classic games to play it? Are there many references to the old games?

When you're making a map, do you leave it blank, use specific placeholder textures until you've blocked out the whole thing, or detail it as you go along?

>>3107983

I won't speak for most anons. But I personally can say that Doom 3 is a safe skip. it's fucking shit.

>>3107983
>>3107992
I'm currently playing through doom 3.

I agree- it's shit. In fact, you could probably skip it entirely. The weapons are lacklustre, the 'story' is shit and every single pickup in the goddamn game opens up a monsterhouse with a gazillion monsters.

Monsters are kind of interesting though...

Honestly, the only way I find myself able to play through it is if I act like it's not a doom game.

>>3107759
The imp was drawn from scratch, anon.

>>3107812
From what I can remember, the original renderer really made it look like a butthole. Especially in darker areas with that fog it had going on.

My Quake 2 map is finally done!

Load it down from here:

http://quakeulf.suxos.org/3d/nyan.zip

It's only 1.7 mb. I have only been able to complete it once.

>>3108059
Some more screenshots.

>>3108062

>>3107992
I won't speak for anyone else either, but I actually like it a lot. They went for the horror aspect that a lot of people felt when they first played doom in the 90's and stretched it across the whole game, as opposed to the run and gun that it ends up being in the mid to late game.

I can see how it's not a good "doom" game, but I do think it's a good game. The guns aren't all bad, and the monster behavior feels good. They telegraph their actions beforehand well. The main story is pretty barebones, but I did like reading and hearing the personal lives of the people, and seeing the technology videos and what not. If you don't like it it's not even necessary to read it.

Lighting and graphics in general still stand up today. There's a lot to like.

>>3108068

Tiddies

>>3108123
>not using centered viewmodels

My five year old nephew is playing doom. He already loves the SSG, and died for the first time in map06. But that could just be because he thought he had to shoot down the hell knight in the crusher instead of crushing it. And doesn't understand pellet spread. Or how to strafe, since his fingers are too small to arrange themselves properly.

>>3108142
The pulse gun doesn't change position when you use the centered weapon models anyway

>>3108167

Isn't that age a good age to get nightmares from Cyberdemons?

>>3108182
I DID tell him it was a very scary game. He was determined to play it anyway.

>>3107929
>>3107930
>Mars

Phobos doesn't have trees, Hell does. not sure about Deimos, though.

What are your thoughts on the console ports? Which are the better ones?

>>3102110
Where's the OP information?

I play classic Doom every day, but I enjoy the Doom 4 beta for what it is, and I think it has potential. I just wish that everyone would stop comparing Doom 4 to fucking Brutal Doom.

Brutal Doom is not classic Doom, god damn.

That being said
>Legendoom with Colorful Hell
>Slaughtermap on a pistol start
>Aaaaaaaaaaa.jpg

>>3108296
Nevermind, I just didn't scroll down at all like a shithead.

>>3108298
actually the irc password doesn't seem to want to work anyway.

>>3108297

>Doing all of those at the same time

Do you hate life?

>>3108297
>I just wish that everyone would stop comparing Doom 4 to fucking Brutal Doom.
It's impossible not to.
>Brutal Doom is not classic Doom, god damn.
No shit. I fail to see what your point is. Are you possibly the dumb?

>>3108297

And here I thought Brutal doom was getting buried in Sergent Mark IV related Drama.

Trying out LegenDoom with OBLIGE 6.20. What settings do you lot use for the combination of the two?

>>3108327
BD wouldve been SO much better if Mark knew how to sprite and had a tiny bit of taste.

>>3108327
It keeps coming up in the Doom 4 threads. It's always:
>lol Doom 4 is so slow and not brutal enough
>It's fine
>No, look, I'll post a Brutal Doom webm to so you how fast and cuhrazy classic Doom is

I wish these people would crawl into a hole and fuck off. Bethesda is going to listen to these idiots and we're going to end up with Quake 4 in a Doom skin. Doom isn't about crazy walljumping and air control while traveling faster than most projectiles.

You're planted to the ground, you have just enough speed and control to avoid projectiles, but running headlong into a fight in a cramped room still gets you fisted to the elbow by a Revenant or a Baron in a fraction of a second.

Anyone in the nuDoom beta?

Notice how you can melee through the SSG reload animation? I think I've already discovered the combat meta. Got a genocide on warpath just by shoot > melee > shoot, fun stuff.

I really hope their snapmap shit or whatever gets some good minds behind it, I hope to see some bullshit-tier difficult co-op maps.

>>3108338
Calm down. It's just another modern AAA shooter, everyone will forget about it soon after release and you won't have to read negative opinions about it for long.

>>3108305
/join #vr passwordgoeshere

>>3108353
Yah, I got it. Just being a retard.
Thanks though.

So, since the Doom 4 beta is out...
How long until someone make a Doom 4 weapons mod that doesn't suck ass like the ones that currently exist?

>>3108401
>Elizabeth Lopez
I didn't know Pop/Soul singer-songwriter musicians played video games.

>>3108401
As soon as I get my hands on it.

lol, and of course someone currently working at id software had to have a mental meltdown over the criticism

>>3108443
Link?

>>3108449

>>3108534
>*triggering intensifies*

>>3108534
Well Duke Nukem and Shadow Warrior are pretty similar, so I don't know what he's on about

>>3108551
>Doom looks like Borderlands
Haha.No. Not even close. Had he even saw Borderlands?

I actually wouldnt mind a Borderlands-like game set in Hell and Hell-occupied worlds. One of availible characters should be "Helga the Hellgirl" as "Imp-tan". Or Archie. As herself.

>>3108338
I don't know about you, but Quake 4 was slow as fuck.

>>3108572
I'm just saying that one specific comparison is not completely inaccurate, given how both run on the Build engine and even Lo Wang says something like "Holy cow! Look-a like Duke Nukem!"

>>3108338
I actually agree with your points, but the new Doom (I'm not going to call it Doom 4) just looks generic as fuck.

>>3108590
Lo Wang says a lot of shit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKnoTbg2qtI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_FcybvR6rA

>>3108597
"You want to wash Wang? Or you want to watch Wang wash wang?"

>>3108602
I wonder if Mick searches "DOOM 2016 theme" every now and then since he's commented on a few of them?

Damn it, I'll need to keep fiddling with this and WHEN THE FUCK IS THIS AWFUL APRIL FOOL'S JOKE GONNA END

>>3108609

Oh wait there we go, I refreshed. Thank goodness. That was awful.

I'm playing good old vanilla episode 3 (Inferno) and the level design is absolutely fantastic.

>Dissolution of Eternity
>R1M4
>intermittent earthquakes
>several platforming sections

wew lad

>>3108216
PSX and N64 doom seem to be the best regarded because they both bring something new to the game (or in fact, is a completely new game patterned after doom's monsters and weapons in d64's case)

>>3108059
Fuck this, I'm not playing a map where it's a fucking puzzle not to die from drowning in the beginning. Not wasting more time on this tripe.

What Doom levels (official or not) would you say are atmospheric?

Just played LUNATIC.wad with brutal doom.

Very nice.

>>3108534
This is glorious

>the last release of H-DOOM came out almost a year ago

rip

>>3108663
Good riddance

>>3108651
The most atmospheric Doom got were the PS1 ports and Doom 64. It's amazing what a change in music style and different lighting does to a game.

>>3108652
I love the music in Lunatic. Really upbeat.

Was doom actually the first game to do the "bosses become regular enemies" little design trick?
I think the most obvious example are the hell barons but later, also counting doom2, they reinsert cyberdemons and spider masterminds in the middle of the level.

Anyone have the WAD that was made from the Doom Xbox 360 port's extra level set? Seems kinda hard to find.

>>3108692

No. The earliest example I can think of off the top of my head is Final Fantasy I, but I imagine there were plenty of games that did that trick before FF.

>>3108692
The first FPS probably

>>3108696

http://www.mediafire.com/download/y8f0x6jkb6y90j4/NERVE.WAD

This is from the PC version of Doom 3 BFG Edition

>>3108692
Lots and lots of Sega games had this feature before. It might be the first FPS though.

>>3108665
>>3108663
It's still being worked on

>>3108651
E3M5 in vanilla

>>3108602
meh

>>3108715
Cheers, mate.

>>3108738
ok

I missed an entire day's worth of discussion thanks to that shitty meme style for le april fool xDDD

Was there anything good while I couldn't see?

>>3108764
unrelated but
>Dan 'get in the van' Schneider
>Daniel McDaniel
>Wesley Smith
/co/ is having the time of their lives

>>3105156
old as fuck reply but idgaf
>nostalgia-goggles

I first played doom in 2012.

>>3108649
Thank you for giving me the exact response I wanted.

I even wrote in the readme-file that this is not a fun map to play, and that it is inspired by kaizo-maps for Mario.

>>3108812
>Thank you for giving me the exact response I wanted.
Glad you accomplished what you set out to do. I hope no one else downloads your map.

>>3107425
>longed for the days of quake 3 and UT again
>finally getting doom and UT
It's 1999 again.

>>3108817
>being this mad over a Quake 2 map

>>3108817
I did, shitter :^)

>>3108812
>this is not a fun map to play
mah nigga. archaeologists nightmare

So I just had a play of 200 Minutes of /vr/ and the main word that came to mind was "cute."
Speedmapping compilations are always fun.

>>3108839
I've not done speedmapping since 2001.

It was fun, though.

>>3108842
I like how simple a lot of the levels were. They were very quaint. I guess I also felt a little more for it because it's a speedmap compilation from 4chan instead of the usual places.

дyм when?

Time to expose myself to heat radiation!

>>3108868
What's this? A weapon mod?

>>3108869
Accessories To Murder

>>3108836
>>3108838
Aw, thank you. The hardest part is the jumping puzzle towards the end of the map where you have to jump from light to light. That's where I spent 90% of my time.

Redpill me on jumping.

>>3108897
It's a way to get to Gensokyo. :^)

>>3108897
The standard zdoom jump height allows you to jump over demons which is pretty retarded.

GZDoom is still giving me blackscreens what do. It's the latest version.

>>3108924
how is that retarded? caleb from blood can jump over zombies, and they're much taller.

Is doomguy some kind of low-jumping pussy?

>>3108935
It's been established Doomguy is a manlet

>>3108941
Probably the first badass manlet ever.

>>3108935
Because it breaks gameplay senpai

>>3108960
It keeps with the post-Quake tradition of turning fast-paced FPS into 3d hectic platform game.

>>3108924
I just tried this out and its completely untrue. You can't jump demons. Vanilla zdoom, unaltered.

>>3108934
You could always regress to the version that uses OpenGL 2.0. That seems to fix most of my problems.

>>3108897
S'cool if you don't use it to break sequence on vanilla or vanilla styled maps.

>>3108924
I see that as an advantage, if I get cornered somehow or caught in an ambush, if I'm quick enough, I can jump on top of a group and walk over their heads to get out of certain death, feels like the kind of bullshit you'd see in some action movies and I dig that.

Also sometimes you can dodge a low flying projectile, but it's a pretty rare occurrence.

>>3108971
Vanilla zdoom, unaltered. Yes you can.

>>3108990
not for me. Are you using the latest version?

>>3108990
>>3109012
Does one of you have infinitely tall actors? I imagine that would prevent jumping over them.