/vr/ - Retro Games

The N64 has the biggest innovative and defining games.

Mario 64 which is still and probably always will be the gold standard for moving a character in a 3d environment.

OoT which established how to target in a 3d environment.

Plus, they are amazing games.


Honestly if you can’t like either of those games you probably don’t like video games.

It had a small handful of really good first party games but ultimately it's library falls massively short of its competition. Mario and Zelda really are very good though.

But don't let anyone try and tell you Rare's collectathons or horrid FPS games are any good.

Nostalgia and Rareware.

Oh and Mario 64.

>>2900846
The first part about Mario 64 is right, but I would argue the modern 3D target system feels more like an evolution from the one Tomb Raider used than Zelda's Z-targeting. I can only think of a handful of games that used a clear variation from the later like Syphon Filter.

This is how I view the strengths of the console of that generation.

N64 - top tier Nintendo games, multiplayer games
Saturn - arcade ports, 2D games
PlayStation - everything else

>>2900838
4-player hook up by default means endless fun with Mario Kart 64 and Smash Bros.

>>2900846
>Honestly if you can’t like either of those games you probably don’t like video games.
No.

>>2900850
>But don't let anyone try and tell you Rare's collectathons or horrid FPS games are any good.
I'll give you the collectathons, but Goldeneye and Perfect Dark are fun as fuck in multiplayer with three friends. I could care less for the single player, but the multiplayer is solid. 4VS16 bots in PD never gets old.

The N64 controller is the best. Sure, the analog sticks degrade too fast, but the feel of those sticks is better than any other analog sticks I've ever used, and the rest of the pad is near-perfect... a trigger, six face buttons, and a d-pad for 2d games and fighters... the only way it could have been better is if, instead of having a right shoulder button, it'd had a right trigger like the Z button. Even so though, it's the best controller ever. No controller since has had a true six-button layout -- the original Xbox controller came closest, but messed up the black and white button placement... then messed it up even more in the S and completely lost it in the 360 (shoulder buttons above triggers... ick...). Sony keeps making poor four face and four shoulder button designs, with the analog stick and d-pad in the wrong positions, and Nintendo has sadly followed Sony down the wrong path (GC with the four face buttons and twin shoulder buttons on the right side, Wii with the awful Classic Controller; the Wiimote+Nunchuck is unique, but the CC, as I've said before, is terrible... the SNES controller is out of date. Bringing it back is a mistake.)

>>2900838

I really enjoy this era of games. N64 included. Sucks that you don't see the appeal OP.

I was a Playstation kid and I was desperate enough to play Mario 64 using Corn emulator and a Sidewinder. That game had me hooked.

>>2900838
I never liked Mario games myself. Honestly I chose to have a ps1 back in the day since it had better games imo, so I gave the n64 to a friend.

3D Games that gen sucked.

Do some shrooms and play sm64 for the first time with an open mind. Thank me later

>>2900928

Thanks for your insightful opinion, edgelord.

Truly ebin

>>2900838
Multiplayer.

>>2900838

How did you hate the N64 if you never owned one?

It need better 3rd party support.

>>2900846
>gold standard for moving a character in a 3D environment

This. I'm not aware of any other game where the simple act of movement is as fun as it is in Mario 64.

If you never played the original Smash Bros. when it came out, I feel bad for you.

Anyway, I'd say the best N64 games have superior handheld ports, but there's a few like Paper Mario that are just plain cozy. I guess that's kind of what the system relies on.

>>2900838
Part of the problem is that the N64 was cutting edge in a lot of ways, but also technically deficient in others, so it hasn't exactly aged well.

Mario Kart 64, Smash Bros, Ocarina of Time & Majora's Mask, Super Mario 64, StarFox 64, Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Pilot Wings 64, F-Zero X, 1080 Snowboarding, Wave Race, Diddy Kong Racing, Jet Force Gemini, Rogue Squadron, and Banjo Kazooie were all spectacular games that challenged and expanded our perceptions of gaming. I don't mean that they all uniformly are 10/10 games, but they all played major roles in altering the way we looked at the industry, and offered novel experiences... same with a lot of the more niche titles on the system too.

Some of the games on the N64 aren't that special in 2016, but there was nothing like a lot of them beforehand.

>>2901279
>hasn't exactly aged well
triggered

There are so many variables that go into that. Things like what consoles your friends already had, what games you like to play, or just what appealed to your parents the most can influence how "good" a system was to you. My folks got me an N64 and I'm happy they did, it was easily the go-to multiplayer system of its day and looking back I think I would still have enjoyed Ocarina and Mario 64 over Metal Gear and Final Fantasy as a kid. It would also have sucked not being able to swap games with friends who all had N64s.

>>2901309
I agree about the variables. Also how many games like it you've played before, what mood you're in at the time. I've played a game one day where I was feeling kind of depressed and felt nothing good about it, and then the next day would think it's a great game. One of the few valid points against /vr/ is that it heightens the variability of the experiences, so we have a huge mess where many people have extremely different views. People also don't stick with old systems and games and give them half the chance they often give newer/other ones. In the end the N64 is a great system and if you don't like it you probably just don't like gaming.

>>2900846
>The N64 has the biggest innovative and defining games
>muh 3D

>The N64 has the biggest innovative and defining games.

This is what console fanboys actually believe.

>>2900838
right here pal

>>2901606
>>2901659
Innovative 2d games are spread apart multiple gens and consoles.

Just about all modern expectations of how a 3d game should play were defined on the PS1 and N64.

I honestly don't know how Playstation beat the N64 so bad back then.

N64 had better specs, zero loading times, and you didn't have to buy extra peripheral bullshit just to save your games.

>>2901725
Were you not around?

Games were double the price. $70-$80 in some cases and sales didn't happen often.

PS1 came out earlier and when the Greatest Hits happened the games were very cheap. $20 even.

Add that PS1 had really great game after really great game.

>>2901725
I swear this isn't a hostile comment towards the N64 but

>you didn't have to buy extra peripheral bullshit just to save your games

Some N64 games needed an expansion pak for some optional stuff like high resolution, and not so optional stuff like game modes. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the expansion pak wasn't bundled with every game that required it. Even if it was bundled with the game, it means the game was even more expensive.

If you didn't have to buy extra peripheral bullshit just to save your games, then what the fuck was the controller pak?

>As a result, many third-party games did not support cartridge saves and required that players use a Controller Pak to save data.

>>2901668
>liking party games
Gtfo smash idiot.

>>2901725
t. Nintendo employee

>>2901725
>>2901761

Yeah some N64 games required a Memory Pak in spite of cartridges' battery backup capabilities. It was quite a pain in the ass to switch between Memory and Rumble Paks, as you'd have to do it between every race in racing games like San Francisco Rush.

One of the big reasons often stated at the time (and I assume it's true from the developers' point of view; not just a meme reason) is that N64 cartridges have very small storage capacity compared iwth CDs. Plus, you can put a game on multiple CDs, so PS storage is unlimited in a certain sense. With N64, 32 MB was like the largest size for a while, it was considered impressive when they released a 64MB cartridge game.

>>2900838
n64 had some good platform/adventure games and multiplayer games.

>>2900838
I like the N64, but its controller was something I never enjoyied about it. I mean its horrible. It looks weird, it feels weird and the stick breaks incredibly easy. Also, the fact that you can't quickly switch between dpad and stick (ie like the ps1) is a design flaw.

>>2901828
3/10

Try less parroting next time and maybe ad a meme or two.

>>2901832
>being this butthurt

So i cant have a popular opinion now? I have no idea what /vr/ thinks about the n64 controller so I decided to use some facts about it to explain my opinion and you get automatically mad.
Grow up and learn to take an opinion, retard.

>>2900838
comfy as fuck 3d gaming, shame we never got animal crossing on the big N in USA tho

Dont get me wrong ps1 has a boat load of classics but when u spent like 10 - 15% of the game look at loading screens it kinda takes away from the experience. Granted it was something you had to experience at the time having both consoles to truly appreciate it now.
Also makes me kinda sad to think we sold our saturn cuz shit didnt have games after a while

>>2901835
>facts

Pretty sure you just spewed a bunch of diarrhea opinions on the floor.

>>2901828
I actually kinda like the goofy controller. Minus the sticks, those are awful.

Play some year-one titles such as Pilotwings 64 and Wave Race. If it's still stupid & boring then maybe it's not your thing.

>>2901838
Those are facts. The controller has a horrible design and the stick breaks easily. You're just a major crybaby that can't accept it.

This aint even an argument sony always wins!

>>2901846
>It looks weird
Opinion
>it feels weird
Opinion.
>and the stick breaks incredibly easy
If you want actual facts, you would see the games were designed to take into account for wobbly sticks. At least if they followed Nintendo's guidelines.
A loose stick doesn’t mean broken.

They use an optic instead of pots so they have zero deadzone unlike every other stick later outside of SEGA.
>Also, the fact that you can't quickly switch between dpad and stick (ie like the ps1) is a design flaw.
No game worth a shit does that and Nintendo never intended to do that.

>>2901853
dictionary.reference.com/browse/weird

The N64 controller looks a way different from any other that was ever released back then or nowadays. You have to hold it in an unusual way with those big ass holders of it. It looks and feels weird.

>A loose stick doesn’t mean broken
Except I was specifically referring to the fact that they DO get broken really easily, it may literally take some months for it to break. A loose stick is bad enough, but when something begins malfunctioning simply from using it the way its intended to be used, you know its horrible.

>No game worth a shit does that
See? This is an opinion, boy. I bet you never played Ape Escape before, which also made use of the extra stick, something the awful design of the n64 controller wouldn't allow.

Really, I love the n64 but ithat doesn't prevent me from being unbiased towards it.

>>2900846

>>2901876
>boy
And confirmed reddit tier/neo /v/ poster.

Ape escape player.... Thats the one game in the ps1 gaming history that fucked your thumbs up worse than a tendoe sixfoe. Ps1 wasnt perfect either or that fucken die hard trilogy. That game was a piece of ship

>>2901668
You know the PlayStation and especially the Saturn had tons of actual fighting games right? They had no need to pretend that a party button masher had depth or is a masterpiece.

>>2901884
Die hard trilogy was on Saturn and dreamcast too m8, and fuckn you I like that gsme

>>2901898
Not him and I'm not a SSB fan, but this comment's completely inane. SSB is a completely different subgenre from Tekken 3 and the like. That's like saying that because PlayStation has numerous acclaimed JRPGs, there's no need for a PC to play western RPGs.

>>2901915

so, because the game isn't a Street fighter clone, its bad and lacks depth?

I legit laugh at you people and your lack of understanding that not every fighting game needs to follow precedents set by games like Street Fighter

The only games on N64 I cared about were zelda, mario and goldeneye. Even as a kid I could see that it wasn't worth buying another console despite how good those games were. Just borrowed one from a friend in 2000, completed everything I wanted and gave it back.

As a 13 yo the n64 felt more like a toy and the ps1 was considered cool. If you were around back then you will know what I'm talking about. Also the fact that Nintendo screwed over Europe hard, with late release and way more expensive console that they slashed the price of by about £100 shortly after.

>>2902467
You're right, I'm so glad they didn't make the Die Hard trilogy a Street Fighter clone.

But wait, maybe that would have been awesome.

>>2901876
all you dual stick proponents are forgetting that the N64 controller came out before the PSX dual stick came out.

Dual stick wasn't a thing until Sony looked at the N64 controller and said "we can do that twice as good".
They also looked at the jolt pack and said "let's build that into the controller".

Most people don't know this though because you have to follow the Japanese release dates for these things as at the time things would release with considerable delay in the west.

>>2902895
>Also the fact that Nintendo screwed over Europe hard, with late release and way more expensive console that they slashed the price of by about £100 shortly after.
not to mention ps1 games were a lot cheaper than n64 games, plus just about everyone had theirs modded with burned games/cds which were even cheaper/free

I'd say the best part were the groundbreaking done with mario and zelda, and the multiplayer games. It's overall an underwhelming system for me compared to the NES, but I still enjoy it for what it is.

It's not a great system, but it is a good system. That's how I'd describe it.

It might also be a matter of perspective too. I grew up with N64, and compared to what it had, I find stuff like Crash and Spyro to be really unimpressive. Especially Crash. I'm convinced most of its praise was for graphics and not for gameplay. This of course only speaks for games which had parallels on the other system. Not like there are any RPGs on N64 comparable to the playstation library.

for 2016 here's the good N64 games worth playing

essential:
ocarina of time
majora's mask
mario 64

also great:
banjo kazooie (dont fall for people telling you tooie is as good or better)
mischief makers
conker's bad fur day

all the other important games like the mario spinoffs and early fps have all been suplanted by modern titles

>>2900856
This, you really needed all three to appreciate where the market was at.

>>2901725
Marketing.
That's how Sony beat everybody.

Owned both an N64 and, later on, a PSX. Both are legendary consoles.

I don't get this hoopla over the analog sticks breaking. Only one of my 4 N64 controllers is loose (as in not locked to center), and it's still perfectly usable.

Best single-player games:
Majora's Mask, F-Zero X, Super Mario 64, Star Fox 64, Conker's Bad Fur Day, OOT, Banjo-Kazooie, Star Wars Rogue Squadron, Perfect Dark, Goldeneye, Jet Force Gemini, Turok, Blast Corps, Paper Mario, Star Wars Episode I Racer (great tracks and racing), Ogre Battle 64 (still good to this day)

Best multiplayer games:
Super Smash Bros, Goldeneye, Bomberman 64 (amazing multiplayer and a full campaign), Mario Kart 64, Mario Party 2 (best mini-games in any Mario Party), Diddy Kong Racing, Pokemon Puzzle League (you may laugh but it's a hardcore match-3 game), Pokemon Stadium and Coliseum, Mario Golf, Mario Tennis (still the best version)

>>2900975
You kiddin? From playground wars. Few things in the human condition are easier to achieve than hating something that you've never tried to understand.

>>2902904
And they also tend to ignore the veritable wild west that was the early 90s 3D games environment. Nobody knew what would work and what wouldn't. N64 was designed to more or less be ready for anything in 3D.

But usually people ignore this and call the design stupid without once considering that Sony just took the SNES pad and gave it wings, and two years after the N64 was out, decided analogs and rumble were a good idea after all.

I'm not saying the controller is perfect, just that people compare them too often out of context.

>>2900838
N64 sucked anon.
It just gave birth to vocal manchildren.
Don't fall for the bait.
If you want japanese late 90s aesthetics play PS1 games

>>2900838
You don't see the draw because they came out fucking 20 years ago, and despite the better story lines, and longer gameplay, you are immediately going to be put off by the shit graphics (when compared to 2015 graphics) and the slightly clunky controls.

>>2902904
>> jolt pack

>>2901725
>YOu didn't have to buy extra peripheral bullshit to save your games
The N64 MOST DEFINITELY had games that needed memory cards.

>>2903174
and the expansion pak for three games

i seriously didn't know anybody that owned a playstation
the only times i heard about playstation were from the vhs from nintendo power smack talking sony and sega

i guess when you go to an expensive private school and live in a town that's 99.8% white, nintendo and sega were all that you needed to know

>>2903159
>It just gave birth to vocal manchildren.
Doesn't any vidya system?


Lain sucked btw

>>2903435
2deep4u

>>2903428
I have a theory, and maybe it is a stupid one, that part of why PSone did so well was ironically because of the pirating ability of the CDs - it was a professional pirate's wet dream for selling CDrs. Poor kids had a choice between expensive N64 games or dirt cheap PS ones. So they all got playstations, and legit copies of games ended up getting bought sometimes.

I'm not sure if some of the younger people around here know just how much the PS outsold N64 by, it was something like 6 to 1, it was utterly ridiculous.

>>2903459
What the fuck are you talking about?
Burning games in 95? Really guy? You were a minority of a minority if you were burning PS1 games then.

And the sales figures of PS1 games were anything but low.

>>2903159

Nah, you just had a shitty single-system childhood, don't blame console warring only to the N64. You grew up with a PS1 and still you're an obnoxious vocal console warrior, so what gives?

Also don't use Lain to shitpost.

>>2903471

Not him but I got my PS1 in 1996 and it was chipped, and my entire collection were bootlegs. Regular people didn't own CD-R units on their computers, they were very expensive back then, but that doesn't mean there weren't some groups that invested in one and bootleged the fuck out of PS1 games and other consoles like 3DO, Saturn, and of course PC games.
Bootleg PS1 games did exist back then and were actually very common.

Maybe it wasn't the main reason the PS1 got popular worldwide, but it helped a lot in zones like latin america, europe, etc.

>>2903501
I'm not a beaner so I don't know.

In American I didn't notice it till the very late 90s and 2000s even. It was mainly from people that bought the game to make duplicates. Getting a rom online back then for PS1 wasn't much of a thing.

>>2903512

The good thing about it is that games were very cheap, like 5 or 10 dollars, so it was less painful to go through the many shovelware the PS1 has. At the very worst, you had only spent 5 bucks.

>>2903518
Sticking with the greatest hits generally didn't lead to disappoint either unlike modern shit.

>>2903471
Most of us didn't personally burn the games, we bought them for dollars a piece, and if you were smart enough and had the means to burn games it paid for itself rather quickly.

>>2903518
Popular consoles tend to have shovelware up the ass.

>>2903729

Thanks captain

Recently sold all my n64 stuff. After exploring basically all the "best" games, I realized the system as a whole just doesn't hold up today. The 3d platformers are collectathons, the fps games run at terrible frame rates, and just most games feel clunky as fuck, with very few exceptions like starfox and smash bros. that being said, the n64 is still an extremely well designed console and a lot of games had really interesting aesthetics and music, just can't hold my attention from a gameplay standpoint. Anyone who says the n64 is the best console of all time is basking in nostalgia.

>>2903863
>>2903863
>The 3d platformers are collectathons, the fps games run at terrible frame rates, and just most games feel clunky as fuck, with very few exceptions like starfox and smash bros

This is true of 5th gen games in general though. They've aged really badly compared to other eras.

N64 had 387 total games, with 296 North American releases. PS1 had 900 North American releases and at least 2000 total games. The library is so huge that you could get lost in it.

>>2903863
>>2903884
Why do you kids and hipsters call 3d platformers "collectathons" when just about every platformer in 3rd and 4th gen had you collecting shit too?

>>2903887
Because collecting coins/rings/whatever to get extra lives is fundamentally different from "go to place X to get Y".

>>2903896
Ya collecting coins in Mario to farm lives? Totally different. kiddo.

>>2903887
What? platformers used to be about tight controls and timing , sure there were things to collect, but that wasn't the main
focus. In games like mario 64, there's a lot more exploring/figuring out what you have to do than actual jumping over stuff , feels like a shitty puzzle game

>>2903903
You can beat the game without farming lives. In fact, you can beat the game without touching a single coin. If you don't see how that's different from making collecting things (which don't do shit, btw) a game objective, then there is nothing to talk with you since you're a full blown retard.

>>2903904
How do you 100% SMW without collecting things?

>>2903904
>platformers used to be about tight controls and timing

>>2903912
It was one example shithead.

Just about every platformer from those gens had some collecting aspect to it. At the very least for points usually.

>>2903914
Straw man argument: the post

>>2903920
Yeah, a shit example.

>collecting aspect

And that's totally the same as making it the game objective, retard.

>>2903918
How bout you actually discuss shit instead of just being a spineless contrarian

>>2903927
Good counter argument.

An example isn't a strawman btw.

>>2903931
Pretty sure none of the N64 platformer's sole objective is "collect X".

>>2903934
No it is a straw man, nobody is talking about 100% things, we are talking about basic game mechanics and objectives. Most games have tedious ass shit you have to do in order to 100% it, there's a difference between that and the core gameplay being tedious ass shit. See: mario 64, rareware 3d platformers

>>2903939
Metroid

>>2903886
>The library is so huge that you could get lost in it.

>mfw getting lost in Shovelware Forest

>>2903904
>arguably greatest platformer of all time
>feels like a shitty puzzle game

>>2903932
Okie dokie; from I've played over the years, I can come to the conclusion that even most 2D platformers barely fit what you've described. Most of them had pretty sloppy design at best.

Things got worse in the 4th gen when companies decided to cash in on Sonic's success without even looking into what made those games well-designed in the first place; resulting in bland imitations with even sloppier mechanics than before.

That said, there were at least a handful of non-Sega/Ninty/Konami/Sunsoft 2D platformers that had above-average to decent gameplay, but trying to search for those was like searching for gold doubloons in an ocean of trash.

I'm not saying the 3D platformer genre is that much better in those terms but if you think their 2D counterparts were more saintly in comparison then man oh man...

N64 always sucked
No need for discussion

>>2905035

every video game ever always sucked

>>2903961
whats that pic from

>>2905035

I disagree, I think it was a brilliant system and opens the doors for all sorts of discussion

>>2905061

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RIO2CY3DTs

>>2905065
>I think it was a brilliant system

Explain

>>2905089

At the time it was the most advanced technology, even PC magazines praised the N64 specs and it wasn't until voodoo 3dfx graph cards came out that PC matched (and eventually surpassed) the N64 capabilities.

The only PC game that rivaled the N64 was Quake, which ironically released a day after Super Mario 64 came out.

other than that, it's subjective opinions. Many people hate the N64 because it's a Nintendo system, other hate it because of the controller ("3 handed mutants lol"), others hate it because it doesn't have many RPGs or fighting games, but all in all people have the right to think the N64 was a great console, just as how you have the right to not like it. But this whole "N64 always sucked" is an unpopular opinion, there's more people who like the N64 than those who claim it's trash.

>>2905106
>But this whole "N64 always sucked" is an unpopular opinion
I'd just say Nintendo themselves went worse since N64. It was only beginning, and farther goes the /v/ story.

>>2905121

yeah, nintendo is doomed

>>2905129
I certainly hope you don't mean in hardware terms. The DS and 3DS has some bloody fantastic games.

>>2905121
>I'd just say Nintendo themselves went worse since N64.
I personally think the Wii was when shit truly hit the fan with Nintendo. The Gamecube, despite having its own problems at least fixed up some of the fuckups the N64 made.

>>2905135
>>2905140

we're entering non-/vr/ territories anyway.

The whole "nintendo went to shit/is doomed" was there since day one, nerds were proclaiming the NES was the end of Nintendo since the days in usenet.

In this thread OP asked what was so great about the N64, and people replied. Some things are more objective (technology at the time, etc) and others more subjective (whether or not you like the games themselves).

There's not much else to discuss, we could engage in tech discussion, and how cartridge format affected the system and all that, but the thing is that despite the things the N64 could have against it, it was still a popular system that gave hours upon hours of fun to many people, from single player games to (and especially) multi player ones.
Personally I enjoy the NES and SNES more, but I also love the N64 and has a lot of my favorite games of all time (which are stuff like Mystical Ninja and Wave Race, and not goldeneye or perfect dark, so even within people who like the N64, there's still going to be different tastes and opinions)

>>2905156
>The whole "nintendo went to shit/is doomed" was there since day one, nerds were proclaiming the NES was the end of Nintendo since the days in usenet.

>>2905129
I didn't say it though, companies don't fade fast. Hell, even Sega still exists somehow.