/vr/ - Retro Games

>>2825218
Cause you have cum in your eye faggot

because you're playing on LCD.

>>2825218
low res textures and shit stretched to ludicrous degrees

>>2825227

But what about the PS2?

>>2825218
it's called 3d

you should try progressive scan mode (available in a dozen of games)
https://youtu.be/8wDxmA2WZeY

N64: Because Nintendo was stupid and put a non adjustable anti-aliasing filter on everything which made things blurry, rareware games being the most notorious.

PS2: Use component cables and try to force games into 480p. It'll help.

>>2825275
rgb mod and the N64 is pretty sharp.

PS2 is a lost cause. Too many games are stuck at 480i.

>>2825218
cause you weren't playing on a crt fag

>>2825237
Shit RAM so a low resolution.

>>2825237
Composite video my nigga.
Rule of thumb: more detailed graphics + composite = horrible fucking mess.
Go ahead, youtube some last gen gameplay videos that were captured with comp. I guarantee they look like PS1 games.

>>2825284
RGB mod makes it worse.S-video is the way to go. Get a funtastic N64 and a set of monster S-video cables.

>>2825332
That's false. I sold my colored N64s after I RGB modded my main unit.

RGB is superior.

>>2825343

Whcih should be pretty clear by format alone. Three true seperated channels for the three base colors will always be better than some mixed together luminance/ chrominance signal.

>>2825275
>non adjustable
It was always on by default. Nobody bothered to disable it during development.

>>2825518
Quake 64 let you turn it off.

>>2825218
Trilinear filtrering. Funny thing that the 'blurry' thing you've mentioned only happends on 3D.

I think the PS2 was deliberately blurry in order to tame the flicker of 480i.

Unfortunately when you play PS2 on a 480p or higher display the flicker is gone but the blurring remains.

The N64 was blurry to hide the fact that its textures were very low res and looked worse than the 3DO/Saturn/Playstation.

>>2825589
A few PS2 games let you disable the flicker filter.
FFXII for example.

>>2825595
>I think the PS2 was deliberately blurry in order to tame the flicker of 480i.

Except I fail to see how that would help in anyway since the blurriness is only horizontal because picture is displayed horizontally. 480i flickers everywhere, it's the nature of the signal. Component cables are a little sharper than even RGB because RGB still uses composite for sync and that could blur things a little. Also, several games have stretched framebuffers so they look naturally blurry.

>tfw I have a gorgeous PVM for playing PS2 games via component but it can[t output 480p

>>2825218

PS2 looks sharp as fuck when using S-Video or better on a CRT TV... but get ready for all the exposed jaggies because there's no AA in the majority of games.

>>2825218

The N64 had some shitty AA that blurred the screen.

>>2825652
With 480i you want to avoid single-pixel horizontal lines and other small details because they will flicker like mad, as they'll only show up every other field.

So being blurry/not having small details will reduce apparent 480i flicker.

Man, this thread is so unscientific so far.

The main reason the games are blurry is because of the low-resolution. We're talking about 240p 3D, barring Expansion Pak games. On PS1 the games that are 240p look even worse, being terribly pixelated and jaggy. Fortunately you did get a fair number of games like Crash and Spyro which are higher than 240p at 512x240 resolution, the resolution sits somewhere between the low-res and high-res modes on N64. Without the Expansion Pak the N64 cannot achieve higher than 240p in 3D because the z-buffer (something the PS1 doesn't have) takes up space that could have otherwise been used for a higher-resolution framebuffer.

Next reason is because the N64 had a two stage polygon edge anti-aliasing process. The first stage is conducted on the RDP texturing/rasterizing core of the N64's GPU and smooths out the jaggies from the inner edges of polygons. The quality of this anti-aliasing isn't too bad at all, but it has a significant performance penalty, pic related. 3Dfx Voodoo cards also did something very similar to this, having a bit of 'blur' in their images as well (although less prominent because of higher resolution).

The second stage occurs on the Video Interface core of the N64's GPU during the process of transferring the framebuffer to the video DAC. This now attempts to smooth out the jaggies from the outer edge of polygons, but in practice functions almost, but not quite, like post-AA as the Video Interface is a very simple DSP (a true dumb filter would only read the color values of the framebuffer, but the Video Interface also reads coverage values which improves the accuracy substantially). The advantage is that using anti-aliasing here is free since it happens in parallel to the framebuffer transfer. The disadvantage is that the algorithm is very fast and very messy. This is where a hell of a lot of blur comes from, but it's also true that many jaggies get dowsed in flames and die in return.

>>2825940
Continued...

Texture filtering doesn't itself really make the output itself substantially more blurry unless the texture is magnified (although this happens pretty often if the texture-resolution is low). N64's mip-mapping does work very effectively to remove aliasing from minified textures though. So if you're trying to put substantial blame on the texture filtering itself for the cause of the blur you are mistaken. It's better to blame the developers for letting their textures get magnified so easily.

Anyway, everything that I've explained so far can be turned off. Developers can disable both anti-aliasing stages if they wish, and can also disable texture-filtering.

Very few did so, and I'm assuming this is primarily because at that time they were wowed by the special features that the console offered even though there is a performance penalty of turning everything on. But then again, at the low-resolution they were rendering at, perhaps they thought that the filters and anti-aliasing did really improve the image substantially over the alternative so it was worth it.

Do people honestly play a non retro console ps2 on pmvs when you can play via component on HDTV or download most of ps2 ROMs for PS3 or play the dozens of HD remasters? This board /vr/ sure sucks a lot of cock. The only time I feel is necessary to plugin my PS2 is to play Silent hill 2,because the original is obviously better than the HD remaster. But even then I play it rather on my PC with PCSX2 in HD and it looks gorgeous. I can't fathom why people wouldn't choose to play their PS2 in HD on PCSX2 or on ps3 when there is a good remaster e. g. God of War, Kingdom Hearts. The only remaster that is also debatable besides Silent Hill 2 is Final Fantasy X. It looks absolutely gorgeous in HD, and it enhances the experience so much, everything looks better.... but they changed up the low poly models of Yuna and Tidus and they look even worse now. They have lost their facial expressions, seen in the fight against Yunalesca. Also shitty remastered soundtrack, which is fixed on ps4. So for ffx and sh2, classic ps2 wins for me. I bet there are more games with botched remasters.

>>2825237
Because you're using composite cables

Try component

>>2826332
You sound confused. It's possible you're retarded. One obvious reason someone might not do things the way you do is they don't have the same hardware.

A lot of PS2 games can be forced to 480p just by changing two line of codes in the .iso
480p (progressive scan)

initial value
002C0500 2000B2FF 00340600 1000B1FF 003C0700

changed to
0000053C 2000B2FF 5000063C 1000B1FF 0100073C


y-pos fix

initial value
70FFBD27 002C0500 7000B6FF 00340600 6000B5FF 003C0700 5000B4FF 00440800 4000B3FF 004C0900

changed to
70FFBD27 002C0500 7000B6FF 00340600 6000B5FF 003C0700 5000B4FF 00440800 4000B3FF 1000093C


Or they can be forced with GSM

>>2826358
Or because one has a profound distaste for sample and hold.

>>2825237
The PS2 AA hardware was broken so in order to reduce jaggies many devs used weird sized back buffer and supersampled it. You had less jaggies but more blur.

>>2825940
>>2825953
Thanks

>>2825343
What kind of cable will it be using after an RGB mod? Please don't tell me it's VGA or SCART...

>>2825223
Was blurry for me even back on my fat CRT shit TV.

Also, Mario never looked like that for me on a flat screen.

I always thought the ps2 looked blurry and had a bad flicker to it ,looks shit compared to the sharp crystal clear image the ps1 put out.

>>2828160

the ps1 is known for having texture flickering out the ass

>>2826560

Whatever your device accepts...

After modding you will have three seperated channels for the three colors, now how you transfer these depends on which adapter you build in. And that will depend on what your TV you want to use can accept. You could in theory even solder a SCART plug to the console and use SCART to SCART if you want to.

>>2826560
Original guy.

My set up I use a scart cable with sync on luma.

N64>scart>jp21>xrgb>transcoder>TV
Is the chain I use.

You don't need any custom connector. The pin outs are the same as SNES. Also you can wire in a VGA plug if you wanted or use BNC or w/e.

The N64 RGB mod is dumb simple if you use the early revision mod. Buy a premade amp from like retro RGB. (The amps like from PCEforums can be a bit fiddlier) And solder it and 3 wires to it. Done. And it has much better picture quality than the color N64s with svideo.

Modding the later revision N64s or PAL N64s is a bitch, expensive, and I think pointless.

Also watch out for that HDMI mod. It’s trash.