/vr/ - Retro Games

>>2823028
>shitposting this hard

>>2823034
Are you afraid of the truth, son?

Then what they hell did they mean for them to be played on? You do realize no one was playing videogames on an LCD back in the mid 90s, right?

>>2823045
That's true and no one cared. Still it's not an accurate nor authentic experience. It's just blasphemous nostalgia and a kick in the face to the developers. There was no better tech then, lcds were ghosting in the yard. Now we have better tech. We can finally play games accurately, how they were meant to be played.
Of course there are some games designed for 4:3 strech, but those are a minority.

>>2823028
non square resolution and/or lazy devs that don't account for display AR.
same thing happens with lazy conversions, like earthworm jim or cool spot.

>>2823051

What other games WERE designed for an 8:7?

>>2823043

>using Impact to shitpost


Seriously, knock it off guys

Play however the fuck you want, stop sperging about emulation vs real hardware. It's getting a little out of hand lately.

>>2823053
Literally nearly all. Just try it out and you can never unsee the stretching.

Nintendo made the games for people to be played on their home TV's with normal RF or Composite output at the time. There's really nothing to be mad about. If you want to play with the correct aspect ratio today be my guest, but you can't stop other people from playing on whatever they want.

>>2823058
That's a very butthurt comment of you, but it's true and you are right. No one ever cared and no one cares now. Nostalgia is the ultimate killer. RIP

>>2823028
>Can we talk about how retro games are not meant to be played on CRT TVs since they stretch the picture to 4:3 and disfigure it and smudge it afterwards to hide the flaws

They are meant to be played at a CRT because many games actually were designed with the flaws of CRTs in mind, and the games used it as an advantage to create transparency or simulate more colourful graphics.

Compare the pixel version...

>>2823062
you can still emulate and hook up the system to your crt for correct aspect ratio.

>>2823028
you are an enormous faggot

So whose fault is it really? Why would Nintendo make a game system who's arbitrary output aspect ratio isn't the TV standard? What kind of game company would make such a dumb decision? I guess the one that would be dumb enough to use cartridges for their next system and lose major 3rd party support.

>>2823062
... to the live version

And if a game does not take the output aspect ratio into consideration when having its artwork created, then it is the artists/developers fault, not the CRTs. Capcom for example had to draw everything elongated due to the non-square pixels of the CPS1-2-3 systems. When they ported those games to the Saturn, all the graphics ended up slightly wider as the machine didn't have such a resolution.

>>2823068
you sound enormously butthurt.

>>2823065
>you can still emulate and hook up the system to your crt for correct aspect ratio.

Ah yes, I didn't knew that Yoshi's Island was designed with emulator output in mind. The game was truly years ahead of its time.

>>2823071
>>> >>2823065
You are right, it's not CRTs fault, but actually nintendos for stretching pixels to save memory and ram. playing on an emulator connected to CRT seems to be the best options, except for games that dont work on emulators or introduce too much lag.

>>2823028
This picture is false.
If you run the game on a TV, it will also stretch the video vertically a bit. It's just enough for that circle to appear nice.

The difference between the real aspect ratio and the stretched one is minor enough that nobody cared at the time, and nobody cared until OP made this topic today. If you have more important issues going on in your life, you won't care about insignificant things as much. OP must have it really good in his mom's basement.

>>2823070
Nintendo is the king of flaws and mistakes. Its actually a tragedy looking back.

>>2823056
It seems like some probably underage (or at least young) user who got upset about someone making fun of his LCD or something. I really don't give a shit how people play their games because, come on, what the fuck does it matter?

The way that his posts are absolutely dripping with a bitterness that can only come from having been criticized is kinda funny, though.

>>2823072
you're still a faggot

>>2823087
So when people emulating dont use integer scaling but use screen fit + bilinear it''s ugly and a big drama, but when crt memsters find out that there is streching its suddenly okay, no one cares, since its masked by blur, just like bilinear does minus the scan lines that sharpen it again.

>>2823028
>guaranteed replies, the post
saged
>>2823096
bilinear + scanlines is underrated desu
but I'd rather the NTSC filter, that looks pretty good.

>>2823096
learn how crt works.
and clever emu users do integer vertical and stretch horizontal.

>>2823096
>>2823096
Yes it is okay to have stretched video image on a CRT on a console, because that's how Nintendo released their games as intended. Its fine by me whatever effects they wanna use on an emulator.

>>2823091

haha, I think you're right:

>>2823096
>So when people emulating dont use integer scaling but use screen fit + bilinear it''s ugly and a big drama,

He was probably laughed at from posting some screenshot or something.

Get over it guy, people are gonna bitch whether you emulate or use real hardware. People are also gonna bitch whether you play on Nintendo or Sega.

There is no correct path, just play the way you feel most comfortable and stop giving so many fucks about other's opinions.

Making threads like this is not bringing any quality discussion to the board, you just want to stir up shit between "CRT memesters" and "emulation babbys".

This fucking thread _again_?

>>2823112
they didn't intend it this way. they were just technicaly limited. it's like ps4 and oculus rift - ps4 is underpowered for VR 120fps, yet sony will bringt it through. It's not the way tha devs intended it to be played, its just a compromise between quality and technical limitations.

8:7 makes him look too skinny.

>>2823128
thats an exception. Minorty of games are actually using the 4:3 strech as mentioned here >>2823051 .

Still its a very flawed design since original graphics have to be anamorph with a limited amount of pixels resulting in ugly aliasing. It's a flaw in nintendos design, not a CRT flaw.

>>2823128
8:7 makes him look more bishounen. It is obviously better since all japs are fags, just look at final fantasy recently.

>>2823128
he looks hot. I want his D in my bussy!

The Triforce in A Link to the Past and the moon in Chrono Trigger say hi.

>You really need a real NES and an old TV to fully appreciate a NES soundtrack, and specially the drums. After all, they were composed and calibrated using these. Nothing beats the body resonance of a good old CRT TV for drums and bass! :)

>>2823167
the sprites and menus in ffvI say hi to the CRT shills.

>>2823172
Have you tried 7.1 surround system with a subwoofer?

>>2823174

Both of those look fine on CRTs

You would know that if you weren't too busy shilling for flatscreen manufacturers on /vr/

>>2823178
no, they are stretched. 4:3 is stretched. correct is 8:7

>>2823028
This argument is retarded. 8x7 tvs/monitors never existed. You can literally only play them in 3x4.

what the hell do i do now

i'll never be able to enjoy sfc games again knowing this

>>2823182
which is a flawed and not correct way of displaying them. Ever heard of letterboxing? Even CRTs can display that.

>>2823190
lol playing games with a vertical letterbox would look ugly as fuck.

>>2823181
There's a lot worse ways to be doing this. At least you're not stretching everything to 16:9.

>>2823197
both is flawed and wrong. stop justifying stretching.

>>2823181
No. Because there are things that expect 4:3 even on SNES.

The only aspect ratio you should ever use is 4:3 and stop being autistic about pixel shapes.

>>2823204
Enjoy your overly skinny Triforce

>>2823204
Calling something flawed doesn't make it the worse thing in the world either. Stop trying to justify your own ways.

>>2823205
>the denial is strong with this one

>>2823207
enjoy your stretched sprites and backgrounds in 98% of all other games. memewhile i can just switch to 4:3 mode in my emulator, unlike you.

>>2823208
stop trying to justify that 4:4 stretching is okay. both is flawed and there is no excuse for it.

>>2823197
If the game is originally 16:10 (which was more common than 8:7) then stretching to 16:12 is worse than stretching to 16:9.

>>2823212
And when will those flaws end? You shit in your pants over aspect ratio flaws but you're fine with your shitty emulated stuff. You're trying to push your own gameplay experience as perfect when its nothing of the sort.

>>2823220
I never claimed that you kekster. Read >>2823084
There is no perfect option. But a cycle perfect emulator and a very fast pc with for example a titanx X hooked to a CRT is the best thing you can get. Games that don't work on emulator you have to play on the real hardware and stretched.


Basically if you mod the console to ouput and swtich between unstretched and stretched mode, that would be the perfect way of playing.

>>2823236
Can't you just adjust your monitor's V and H to match the ratio that want?

>>2823028
We can talk about that as well as unicorns, the easter bunny, and how you're an intelligent adult.
So what were they may to be played on in your imaginary made up childverse?

>>2823243
no that's messing even more with the pixels. It's like pixels stretched non-integer, smudged and then again stretched back. it's really messy. i wouldn't do that.

>This entire thread is sustained by the belief of someone, somewhere, who honestly thinks videogame devs didn't know their games were played on CRTs 99.9% of the time.

> Of course they didn't design them with those displays in mind! That's madness! Logic has no place in these sacred retro halls!

I still think we're being taken on a ruse cruise.

>>2823256
Logic ≠ Technical Limitations

>>2823265

The gaming industry has always been about turning technical limitations into strengths. CRTs were no different. Now go back to /v/, you blighted wretch.

Pixel purists can not be reasoned with, don't bother.

anyone into cali≠gari?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRNRmbwTW-g

>>2823256
I think it is really just someone who got pissed off by CRT users for whatever reason and is desperately trying to argue why using an LCD is better.

In the end, it just comes down to preference. You can show them your preferred method and why you prefer it, but if they don't think your reasons are backed up by better results, then they aren't going to change. Extremely butthurt sounding posts won't change that.

>>2823335

In what universe does my post sound butthurt?

Are...Are you sure you're not autistic, fellow anon?

>>2823353
Oh, I wasn't describing your post. I was talking about posts in this thread that are (or are like) the OP's.

>>2823327

I fucking love them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcPvcqkxW84

>>2823359

My mistake. Have an adorable image macro for compensation.

>>2823028
jesus christ are you one of those fucking morons on torrent sites who insists on a 1920x1080 uncropped image because cropping the black bars "ruins the aspect ratio"? get the fuck out of here with this amateur level bullshit.\

>>2823373
cropping doesnt ruin the aspect ratio. what kind of nonsensical try-hard bullshit.

>>2823116
>carbon-freezing lucas

This should have happened immediately after episode VI..

I notice Genesis doesn't really have this issue. I played Sonic one and saw that the squares in the ground looked square and not rectangular.

>>2823952
That's because Genesis is superior to SNES.

>>2823401
snes vs ds ?

>>2823851
>This should have happened immediately after episode VI..


Sanest post in the thread.

>>2823028
Depends on the game. Some have more than a little obvious stretching, and then others have shit where circles are ovals in 8:7, but are proportionate at 4:3.

>>2823361


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXr2ReEPWRc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mhxbW6kDrk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqnExqccwh4

>>2823952
The Genesis output 320x240 which is already 4:3

>>2823028
Whoa OP, I remember this thread. It was fun seeing it again, but would you now can fuck off to /v/ please.

>>2823071

Is there a version of this picture without the shit blocking the tv?

>>2823028
>2. You will immediately cease and not continue to access the site if you are under the age of 18.
>3. You will not post any of the following outside of /b/: Trolls...
Choose at least one

Nobody cares, nerd.

>>2823952
Genesis does what Nintendon't.

>>2823028
Early emulations couldnt do actual TV resolution for shit either.

in the case of NES, THIS IS HOW IT ACTUALLY LOOKS ON CONSOLE.

>>2826068
Notice the "letterboxed" area, this is done to help the display of the NES video area to adjust itself on CRTs.

>>2826068
>>2826069
I'm sorry dude but this is still stretched. Maybe it's your TV not configured correctly. It's not 512x480 letterboxed nor 512x480 stretched to 640x480. It's something messy in between. But I still think the letterboxing is very impressive, assuming it's something the NES does internally. Why can't the SNES do something like this? Letterboxing is really not that hard.

>>2827801
reference pic

>>2824115

love me some cali≠gari

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3a18VZ45ee4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFofE5Cbnls

>>2823051
How is it not an accurate or authentic experience when this is literally how games were played?

Nobody played SNES games in 8:7. Nobody. Now that we have the ability to it's great, but you're kidding yourself if you think the experience offered by 4:3 isn't "Authentic"

>>2827901
authentic as in not false or copied; genuine; real.
not as in entitled to acceptance or belief because of agreement.
the 4:3 aspect ratio is false and not real, not authentic.
the 8:7 aspect ratio is the only real, authentic and correct original aspect ratio.

"Original Aspect Ratio (OAR) is a home cinema term for the aspect ratio or dimensions in which a film or visual production was produced – as envisioned by the people involved in the creation of the work."

>>2827835

oyea baby

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEflnRiMSp8

>>2827931
Sorry kiddo. You're just dead wrong. If you were born in the last millennium you'd understand.

>>2827931
8:7 implies square pixels. Nobody could play NES games with square pixels back then, not even the developers themselves. Maybe they had square pixels while building the assets but you can't really know that for sure, because almost every cathode was 4:3 and the most common resolutions didn't have square pixels when displayed.

OP's pic looks more "right" on the left, but that's an artifact of four 8x8 tiles with perpendicular sector data from the center of the supposed circumference, or whatever.

I don't get the people arguing with OP. Most SNES games are designed in 8:7, and playing on any other resolution (looking back at myself playing on a 16:9 LCD makes me die a little inside) will give most games some stretch. For accurate scaling these games should be played in 8:7.

Of course, that can only be done with an LCD or a CRT with an emulator, so pick your battles I guess.

>>2826069
THIS, the idea was to help it with a little buffer so things wouldn't POP out of nowhere.

Also, lets remember that many of the games on NES, master system and the like where developed on VGA or CGA computers and many artists would work on paper so the programers could replicate their work with code.

>>2828151
The level of butthurt in this one is sky-rocketing.

>>2828232
Ever heard of letterboxing? DVDs also use non-square pixels, but they fit correctly onto your TVs stretching. Blame Nintendo for using a non-standard resolution of 512x480 and stretching it instead of letterboxing. They a) either didn't care like it is the case how they run things today which is the most likely answer or b) technical limitations.
The major point that you are missing is that developers developed most games not in 4:3 aspect ration, it doesn't matter that
>not even the developers themselves
This doesn't change the fact that this is not how they were designed.

>>2828339
But it is still stretched, yet less than on a SNES. No one has come up with an argument yet, why the NES handled aspect ratio more correctly than SNES.

>>2828312
Yeah, ikr. It's like they desperately try to reason the stretching, although their claims are completely unfounded.
All I heard is:
>If you were born in the last millennium you'd understand
>Nobody could play NES games with square pixels back then
>Nobody played SNES games in 8:7. Nobody
>you're kidding yourself if you think the experience offered by 4:3 isn't "Authentic"
>The gaming industry has always been about turning technical limitations into strengths. CRTs were no different
>Stop trying to justify your own ways
>lol playing games with a vertical letterbox would look ugly as fuck
>Yes it is okay to have stretched video image on a CRT on a console, because that's how Nintendo released their games as intended
>The difference between the real aspect ratio and the stretched one is minor enough that nobody cared at the time, and nobody cared until OP made this topic today.

Only good argument I heard in this thread is that some games were designed in 4:3 and that is true. Thankfully I can switch in my emu. between OAR and 4:3, which you can't when using a real console. Best way to play these games nowadays is cycle accurate emu via CRT/PVM.

>>2828514
>Best way to play these games nowadays is cycle accurate emu via CRT/PVM.
>Best way
See. This is why people don't like you. Because you go and proclaim that such and such way is the only and best way to play the games.

A lot of people here will prefer to play on actual hardware, and then you only get 4:3.

8:7 stretched to 4:3 is nowhere near as atrocious as 4:3 to 16:9 anyway. Besides you won't get any wierd scaling artifacts with CRTs due to how they don't work with pixels, so it's definetely not as bad as you make it out to be.

>>2828149

I fucking love cali≠gari, their new album is great btw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHQyfFwHCTc

>>2828532
I don't get care about judgemental people like you.
I only care about accurancy and keeping OAR without stretching.
>Besides you won't get any wierd scaling artifacts with CRTs due to how they don't work with pixels
Read OP again. So you're basically a fan of hiding artifacts with bilinear filtering as well? Because it is basically the same thing. I'm not saying this is the same thing, don't get me wrong, I love scan lines.

People can play however they want, they are entitled to their pride and ignorance of the old days. I however want a true, authentic and accurate pixel perfect experience and emu+CRT can give you that. Stretching is the worst thing that can happen to video/movie/gaming on a TV and people have been downplaying it ever since. I don't buy it. I letterbox 8:7 games on my CRT and play 4:3 games in 4:3 on my CRT. If you disagree that is the most correct way of displaying the game than you are a) not making any sense or b) you came up with a way to mod SNES to switch natively between letterboxing and 4:3, which would indeed prove to be the utlimate way of playing SNES on a CRT. Alternatively you can stretch back to the OAR for non 4:3 on your TV, but of course this is not pixel perfect, but I guess the best thing you can do if you have any hard feeling about emulation.

>>2828556

It really is, best album since 8 IMO.

Also, do you like lab.?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSsBeqRsqQI

It doesn't look like anyone in this thread checked on an actual SNES and CRT TV setup if Yoshi Island actually looks like that there. Specially noy OP.
But nice troll thread anyway, I hope you got the $20 you betted, or whatever justified this waste of time for you

>>2828594

Yes, I love LAB. and pretty much anything Ao was involved in, lol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ji9yeueTsJ0

>>2828312
No SNES game was ever designed in 8:7. Anyone who believes they were is a deluded child. Pointing out that OP is a deluded child isn't arguing with him any more than marking an incorrect score on a test is arguing with a student.

>>2828613
I can do it, but need to wait an hour

>>2829256
You are so deep in denial that you can touch your duodenum through your anus.

>>2823028
>>2826068
Again, you probably took that from ZSNES, also you cropped it considering that Yoshi's Island on real hardware has blackbars on the top and bottom of the screen

>>2829710
This is still stretched LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.
Serious question: Are you blind?

>>2829710
It's amazing that after so many years of deep-seated nostalgia people can't even tell when an image is stretched and when not.

>>2828881
ao is the man

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlATLvEBHoA

>>2825516
Genesis games are 320x224 which is close to 320x240 but not quite

>"retro games were designed to be played on displays that didn't exist"
>/vr/ took the bait

Is it just me, or is this place getting worse and worse?

>>2828575
literally autism:the post

>>2829897
They didn't, it's just one guy replying to himself.

Any decent CRT lets you adjust the H-hold; so this is more of a non-issue, really. I would imagine true autists having multiple sets for this configuration.

>>2829907
Why didn't more games/systems have test images for that purpose?

>>2829963
I've actually considered making some simple ROMs for this purpose, but then I remembered I own some Pixar DVDs. Ratatouille had an excellent video calibration mode, iirc.

16:9 stretched is great, whats the problem?

>>2829989
That appears to be zoomed, not stretched. From what I can tell, at least.

>>2829907
Stretching to 4:3 and then stretching back is not optimal nor pixel perfect as pixels have already been damaged,but it is a compromise,though not optimal.

>>2830032
But there's no digital stretching involved. Perhaps you're thinking of LCD upscaling?

>>2830019
That's the remake, it's expanded.

>>2830054
Right, that's what I figured. iOS port, I assume?

>>2830067
It's also on Android.

>>2823051
>It's just blasphemous nostalgia and a kick in the face to the developers.

I don't think the developers give the slightest shit at all.

>>2830084
Nnnnnailed it.

>>2830090
You don't know, you kucked being.

>>2829641
I don't deny your youth and ignorance in any way. Troll harder kiddo.

>>2829737

He really is!

Thanks to your post yesterday I couldn't stop listening to LAB. all day lol.
It's been a while since I last listened to them.
I hope they put up some new stuff soon. I love cali≠gari, but I want more LAB. goodness. Ao is great as a vocalist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IhPfLXSIio

>>2830219
Wow, how can you be so ignorant? And you call yourself and adult? You're simply whitewashing facts at this point and you aren't even trying.

>>2829968
learn about the rgb test suite, fool

>>2830224

yeah, it'd be great if lab. released something new, it's been a while. I also love ao as a vocalist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVMSBFIfnR4

I actually saw lab. live back in 2007 in Tokyo. It was so good.

>>2823028
Too bad consoles never had the option to set overscan and scaling in the BIOS.

This board needs a fucking mod

>>2830417
It comes with age. When I was a young little shit I knew everything just like you. As I grew older I learned stuff and now understand how little I really did know.
This could happen to you. But since you weren't even born when these games were made let alone programming you will probably always remain a deluded emufag to insists that reality is wrong.

>>2831215
You're old, yet you know nothing. No more than anyone else.

>>2829871
It actually sent a 320x240 signal to the TV though, the top and bottom 8 rows were just always black, so it was still 4:3 unless you went out of your way to crop it with your TV's settings.

>>2830859

>I actually saw lab. live back in 2007 in Tokyo. It was so good.

Jelly as fuck anon. I think if I ever saw Ao in person I'd squeal like an annoying brainless fangirl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okLyh0VzL4M

>>2831298
I know that retro games were designed to be played on 4:3 CRTs. That's more than you kiddo.

>>2832741
You know nothing Jon Snow.

I'm pretty sure the graphics designers for Yoshi's Island designed it for square pixels.

You know all of the cool real time 3D special effects shit they did? Those require algorithms to create. Trying to compensate for non-square pixels would be needlessly complex and put more stress on the processing unit, or at least result in ugly jagged lines.

It's also a fucking circle in the OP. How much more proof do you need?

>>2823028
> phrasing a question like that
Can we talk about how OP is a fagget?

>>2832827
this isn't 4chan.

>>2823028
holy fuck my whole life has been a lie
How do I play games properly at 8:7 then??

>>2832782
I'm pretty sure you're retarded. Make that positive. It's amazing what the combination of youth, ignorance and autsim can do to a humans ability to reason.

>>2823051

>not knowing the meaning of accurate
>not knowing that authentic would mean using only older equipment available back then
>trying to speak his nonsense as if it were in the developer's defense

You should go get stoned and play Ecco the Dolphin, since you seem to enjoy talking nonsense...

>>2833465
a perfect circle = accurate
stretched circle != accurate

Only millennial hipsters would care about "authentic" experience.

>>2833465
GBA version
>widescreen yet 8:7 perfect bubbles
>trying to speak his nonsense as if it were in the developer's defense
yeah, right.

>>2833879
I'm going to kill myself tonight.

>>2833883

>that AIDS Mario

Anyone else love cali≠gari?

I fucking love cali≠gari

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRrx-7JINGw

This thread is still up?

>>2833883
The one to the right looks more "normal" to me.

>>2833441
Prove me wrong then?

>>2833910
That's nostalgia. You can't even tell when an image is stretched and when not.

>>2833859
>who are CRT man babies?

>>2833919
please be nice to me. the internet is supposed to be my safe space. thx.

>>2833910
>>2833917
This comparison here is a more accurate picture of how the nostalgia-syndrome is perceived by the infected.

>>2831330
>It actually sent a 320x240 signal to the TV though, the top and bottom 8 rows were just always black, so it was still 4:3 unless you went out of your way to crop it with your TV's settings.

Er, no, Genesis sent 320x224 and anything else was overscan. The TVs took the 320x224 part and used that with a 4:3 aspect, which meant that the lines got stretched out vertically. It is why Kega has an option for "NTSC Aspect" which does just that.

PAL Megadrives did send 320x240 but only if the game supported it (maybe four games did in total, the Streets of Rage series and Strider, from the top of my head). But, even 240 lines ended up letterboxed to hell due to PAL systems being 576i (so, 288p).

>>2833903

Are you kidding? They're my all time favorite band in the world, I love cali≠gari

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3orZSrjmCks

>>2833845
>my made up definitions are valid

>>2833912
Thanks for proving my point. I can't disprove a delusion, whether it's belief in a emubaby meme or a divine being such as the FSM. It's clear your brain is defective.

>>2833969

>>2833917
nah, nostalgia would be the non-stretched version, as I first played Super Mario World on a GBA. Recently I've been playing the SNES version, though.
I think it looks fine, and mario looks a tad too thin. In particular mario lacks any clear cues as to aspect ratio like circles, so isn't even that greatly affected. It's really hard to tell that boxes aren't 1:1.

But I guess that won't get through to a sperg like you.

>>2833974
Hey you got it totally wrong. Here is how you perceive reality: >>> >>2833924

>>2832741
All this thread has really shown is that CRTs were never the optimal display for these games. It was what the average consumer could get so it was the standard, but it was never best.

>>2833956

cali≠gari might as well be the best band in the world, not even exaggerating.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3a18VZ45ee4

>>2833886
don't.
let someone else do it.
go out in a blaze of glory.

>>2823051
Are you saying playing on an LCD is a more authentic experience than playing on a CRT? How?

>>2834446
You can output emulator image with correct aspect ratio (letterboxed 8:7 or 4:3 depending on the game) to CRT for true authentic experience.

Can someone please pass the salt?

>>2823028
This problem is most prominent with the SNES, right? I'm guessing it isn't as bad on the Genesis, right?

ARE YOU ALL FUCKING RETARDS!!??

OF COURSE TV SCREENS LOOK BETTER 30 YEARS IN THE FUTURE. WHO GIVES A SHIT? THEY DIDN'T EXIST BACK THEN.

GO OUTSIDE YOU FUCKFACES. IT'S FRIDAY. TIME TO HIT THE BAR.

is it more efficient on the hardware?

there might not have been a push for pixel perfect accuracy because crts are inherently not accurate as it's a reproduced approximation of the original image

>>2830032
It's an issue with computers and other systems.
It's more prominent if they use 16:10 and not 8:7 since that's further from 4:3.

>>2834672
Are there any snes games in 16:10?

>>2834474
true. this is appears to be an issue with snes and nes. i don't know about other retro consoles issues (yet). the funny thing is a majority of nintendo self-published titles like mario, yoshi, metroid etc. have the issue of stretched aspect ratio. while games like zelda compensates with anamorphic image. ffvi by square for example is 8:7.

>>2834908
>Are there any snes games in 16:10?
I don't think so. The PC-88 or PC-98 etc games that got ported got remade that far instead of being letterboxed or similar.

>Implying the end user is obligated to make up for poor design, ever

Here's a hint, guys: our perceptions will, to a degree, make up for stretched images.. and what we end up with is, in our minds, all approximately the same experience.
Take >>2833883 for example. I am among those who are not bothered by the 4:3 version, and it's only when I tilt the image and look at the big pipe do I really notice how skewed it is.

Fixing the ratio is all well and good, but at least acknowledge that this is a user mod to make up for poor design. As for "how it was intended": If the developers had given a shit, then they would have acted like they gave a shit.

Why is nobody mentioning the native resolutions of the console systems? If the CRT TVs don't have the same aspect ratios as the resolutions that the games use then it's obviously not what the developers had intended.

WHAT DID THEY INTEND ?!?!?! Someone answer this. All I got is that I should use snes9x to emulate instead of using real hardware which seems counter intuitive. Does the system output 8:7 ???

>>2835348
Higan can also do 8:7 and is a lot better than Snes9x and also better than original hardware.

>>2835348
The developers intended games to by played on consoles connected to 4:3 CRTs. snes9x didn't exist when they wrote the games so whoever told you that's how they intended them to be played is a complete nutjob.
The system outputs an electrical signal. It has no ratio until you display it on something. Then it is displayed in whatever ratio you display it as.

>>2835348
>WHAT DID THEY INTEND ?!?!?!
Depends on the game.

>>2835387
Snes9x came out in 1997. There are plenty of SNES/SFC games that came out after that.

>>2833010

Minus the fighting this thread has some good info in it. This is reptilian conspiracy level redpill for me now.

Is there a device or something I can use to add in the bars or something so I can play vidya with no stretching?

Great info in this thread, up to this point I was always shit talking emus but this is really interesting !

>>2834984
I notice this shit right away.
And I noticed this shit right away back then, when it actually happened.
And let me tell you there were no distortions on original hardware

>>2835479

crts do not use pixels

The 4:3 ratio is what was intended. Akiman has repeatedly talked about this. He had to design special graph paper with rectangular cels for drawing CPS sprite lineart on in order to take into account how the displayed pixels would look.

>>2835623
And how many used that rectangular graph paper instead of regular square ones? Capcom is a controlled environment but consoles and particularly computers had a less control over the artists.
The CPS-1 used a resolution of 384 × 224 which would almost be 16:9 with square pixels which may be another factor.
Now it might be interesting to compare the sprites of the different ports to see which pixel aspect they need to match.

Some games compensated for 4:3.
Some did not.

Like >>2834984 said, if you have any amount of imagination left in you, it won't make a difference.

>>2835636
>Now it might be interesting to compare the sprites of the different ports to see which pixel aspect they need to match.
If you compare a raw SNES SF2 sprite to a raw arcade SF2 sprite, the SNES one is noticeably thinner, meaning it was redrawn to fit the intended proportions.

I can notice 4:3 to 16:9 difference easily, it's quite noticeable and can be bothersome if stretched to that degree.

But 8:7 to 4:3 is not a big deal, in fact seeing OP's pic I think 8:7 looks too narrow.

>>2835348
>WHAT DID THEY INTEND ?!?!?!
They intended to make money.

>>2835623
But that doesnt count for every game. There are lots of games designed in 8:7.
The correct answer is 4:3 and 8:7 are what was intended.

>>2835649

I think you need glasses or something. Maybe astigmatism? >>> >>2833924

>>2835697

That doesn't really look like OP's pic and it's not even the same ratio comparision, I don't know why you keep insisting with that example.

Also, I said it's no big deal, not that I can't notice any difference. If any, I said I think 8:7 looks kind of narrow.

Keep telling people to use glasses or that they have this or that sight problem, though, I'm sure it greatly helps your point.

Maybe OP is a cyclops and has trouble with slightly wide ratios?

>>2835348
They intended both. The correct answer is 4:3 and 8:7 are the intended aspect ratios, depending on the game and if sprite sheets with square pixels or non square pixels have been used.
The perfect way to do play this is to have some modded console that let's you switch between letterboxed and anamorph output. Alternatively you could adjust the TV in 8:7 intended games to shrink approximately to 8:7.
For pixel perfection enthusiasts and fans of emulation you can use higan emulator (no, don't even bother!) or retroarch with higan (bsnes balanced core) and connect it to your HDTV or CRT. Although you still have to do the aspect ratio switching manually.

>>2835714
That pic is closer to how the picture is stretched. Because people always bring up the argument that 4:3 to 16:9 is fucked up but 8:7 to 4:3 to is meh and okay. I think both are awful and wrong. If you want I can make a comparison pic with human faces with the correct aspect ratios so you can notice the effect more clearly. Pixel art easily tricks you to not notice stretching because it's a very abstract form of perception. I just wanna show you that the human eye (normally) notices even slide stretching.

>>2835739

They may be awful to you, but really the difference between 8:7 to 4:3 is not that bad. 4:3 to 16:9 is a lot worse, by a huge margin.

Don't bother with more examples, I already told you that yes, I can notice a difference. it's just not a big deal (much to your dismay), and again, I think those screenshots on 8:7 look kind of thin.

May be ok for cyclops, but I have 2 eyes.

>>2835714
>>2835739
>>2835763

>>2835767

low test on top
high test on bottom

>>2835767

would appreciate if you included 16:9 as well

>>2835768
my nigga

>>2835396
You're really grasping at straws there. List of all these "plenty" of games? SNES games "came out" long after any developers intentions were intended so nothing that came out in 97 would have even theoretically been intended to run on snes9x.
tl;dr No, developers of a handful of sports games did not intend them to run on snes9x

This fucking thread is STILL going?

C'mon /vr/, I love you but your autism really is starting to kill me.

Ok so everyone here says that the machines output the correct aspect ratio and thus the display device is what distorts the image.

1. Is there a box or device I can buy that I can pass the video signal through and it outputs the correct aspect to my tv (by adding bars or something) ? I don't want to hook up and emulator, and I have a feeling this isn't exclusive issue to SNES.

2. What other consoles are non 4:3 ?

>>2833991
pretty sure you're trolling for shits and giggles but I'll humor you. it's not a matter of what's best, but what's available. and CRT was the standard back then, so obviously these games were designed with CRTs in mind. devs used CRTs, testers used CRTs, users... I'm sure you get it by now. oh and nice troll thread by the way, I had lots of fun!

>>2836816
>devs used CRTs
I'm sure they used computer screens. I've never used a retro computer, but my old high school used to have fat PC monitors and they didn't stretch. Did old computer monitors stretch like CRT televisions?

>>2836816
>everyone used crts
sprite sheets with square pixels are no crts you dumbass

>>2836850
>missing the point this badly
okay :)

>>2833940
Can you actually disable that NTSC Aspect on a legit Genesis/Mega Drive?

I know in Sonic 1 and 2 if you do that the letterboxed parts are colored(in blue or some other color) which annoys the fuck out of me
While in Sonic 3 it's just black which isn't bothersome

>>2836845
Holy fucking shit you moron
CRT's didn't stretch it was the SNES which stretched the games before output
Goof fucking lord what a moron

>>2836187
You want a list of SNES titles by release date?
http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_Super_Nintendo_Entertainment_System_games

Basically all this thread proves is that Nintendo and some lot of developers didn't take a moment to consider the fact that the games will be output at a 4:3 ratio. 8:7 is not what the SNES outputs. Plug it into a CRT or an LCD, you're going to get a 4:3 image.

>>2836873
You can actually see the PC-98 or whatever that is being displayed in 16:10 on a 4:3 CRT.

>>2836884
What are you sperging about? You do realize they make games on computers, right?
What I'm trying to figure out is did they draw sprites on a monitor that displays pixels 1:1.

>>2836921

This is now a cali≠gari thread

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P4ih5raauA

>>2836921
>did they draw sprites on a monitor that displays pixels 1:1

What? Are you talking about resolution or something?

are you stupid or don't you understand that monitors even if CRT didn't stretch the image to 4:3 if they were designed in 8:7. There also games designed with non-square pixels in 4:3 that were purposely stretched.
This whole conversation drifted into pointlessness as you are turning in cycles.

If you read this >>2835727 what is there still to argue about? It is a fact that games were both designed in 4:3 and 8:7.

>>2836921
no nigga they used standard 4:3 computer monitors LIKE EVERYONE DID AT THE TIME

>>2836970
the aspect ratio of a monitor is irrelevant as it always outputs 1:1 pixels, especially when you think these are professionally calibrated monitors. Your argument is futile.

>>2836970
But Japanese computers displayed 16:10 for most part. You'll normally see letterboxing on CRTs and the LCD versions were normally widescreen.
You'll also find computer games with square pixels elsewhere.

>>2833883
>Wii U screenshot
>4:3
>How Nintendo re-released the game

>>2836991
well real snes looks similar.

>>2833940
No, it's called overscan because you use your monitor settings to make the image taller so that those scanlines are over the edge of the screen.

>>2835727
>not mercury

>>2833940
>lines got stretched out vertically.

No, that's not how analog TV signal work. TV stretched nothing unless you adjusted yourself its factory settings when possible. It's just that older TV were limited in the number of lines they could show. Most of them could only let you see 448 interlaced lines (out of 486 max for active display with NTSC standard) or 224 non-interlaced, the rest being hidden by TV edges (so called overscan area).

On more recent TVsyou can see the Genesis actually output more than 224 visible lines and there are visible colored lines surrounding the VDP active screen area. The color can be configured by the game, it's used as the background color.

NTSC aspect in Fusion is to take in account pixels output to PC monitor are square (so 320x240 is exactly 4:3) while Genesis pixels were not, so a 4:3 TV screen would approximately correspond to 320x224 pixels in Genesis most used display mode (or 256x224 in the other less used mode).

>>2836889
See less that 50 that could even possibly apply to that insane conspiracy theory.

>>2838050
Exactly, but
>while Genesis pixels were not
That's not "Genesis pixels". TV CRTs don't have square pixels, they're rectangular. The deformation we all see nowadays on modern TVs is due to that, and doesn't only impact games.

>>2836873
>>2836874
>>2836878
>>2836879
>>2836882

The fact that these didn't immediately end the thread proves it.

>>2835767
Yeah. This pretty much cements my view that stretching 8:7 to 4:3 is, while maybe not perfect, acceptable, since the end result isn't so badly stretched.
It's nothing as extreme like stretching 4:3 to 16:9 or 5:4 to 3:2 as in >>2833924

>>2838408
>GRAND TIER NOSTALGIA DELUSION

My condolences.

>>2838451

Delusion would be claiming that there's no difference at all, or that one looks better than the other.

I personally don't think OP's left pic looks better than the right one or viceversa, and before you tell me to put on glasses again or whatever passive-aggressive comeback you might do, I'll repeat that yes, I notice the slight difference, but I don't think neither is "better". I'd play both of them no problem, my problem would be something like 16:9 which does stretch the image ridiculously.

I also think it's kind of stupid to compare screenshots taken from emulators, would be better if you could actually take pictures of Yoshi's Island running on an emulator on a LCD screen set at 8:7, next to YI running on an actual SNES and on a CRT.


I was playing Yoshi's Island today, on my SNES and on my old CRT (before you jump at me, I don't exclusively play on CRTs, in fact lately I've been mostly playing emulators on my PSP), to see if I could notice these "ovals" OP is talking about. Actually, the image I was getting on my CRT was like something in between those 2 pictures in the OP, it didn't look as thin as the one in the left, and didn't look as wide as the one on the right. Then again, the right one doesn't even look that wide, it isn't 16:9.

>>2838408
You do realise that the factor difference of aspect ratio stretching from 5:4 to 3:2 and 8:7 to 4:3 is 0,059, right?

>>2838495
OP pic >>2823028
On CRT via snes original hardware >>2829710
On emulator RetroArch higan core like displayed on LCD >>2829730
On GBA >>2833876 (widescreen yet 8:7 ratio)

Read the thread. We already found out that actual CRT does stretch something in between 8:7 and 4:3, but it is still stretched. Also apparent on NES >>2826069 >>2827801 >>2827805

>>2838516

>>2829710
this pic is from a CRT on original hard? why does it have the black frame on the sides?

>CRT does stretch something in between 8:7 and 4:3

that's what I thought, it stretches the 4:3 image to some degree, but it doesn't look like the OP pic, it's something in between.

At any rate, this thread would be better if OP wasn't such a cunt about his crusade against the "CRTfags", there's some good information here, but this thread was destined to be nothing but shitposting, no better than people that claim playing on emulators isn't playing the real game, etc.
People should stop thinking that their favorite way of playing games is the "correct" way of playing.

>>2838527
Can you help find out what the original aspect ratio of snes is or post an image of a recording on actual hardware? So we could add a 3rd image to this image >>2835767

Another thing Im worried about...is this for all CRTs or does every CRT display it different?
But it seems to the same for nes and snes >>2826068 >>2829710

>>2830045
this, crts can display a wide array of resolutions because the thing doesn't rely on pixels (per se) the beams travel along horizontal lines in the first place so this type of adjustment is possible. You still have the same refresh rate as before only now the beams of light are traveling ever so slightly slower than before to compensate for the less horizontal distance.

>>2838354
What conspiracy theory? I didn't say developers wanted the game to be played with emulators, just that emulators were around when games were released. there were also emulators in 1996 where a lot more games were released since that was the year the N64 came out. Snes9x goes back to Snes96 and Snes97, hence the 9x name.

consider set-up your screen's format (after pal/secam/ntsc/default) holding LRselect (no cartidge) on your snes?
>b-but black bars!

>>2840473
>>> >>2829710 still stretched
mess.

>>2839802
>i didn't read the thread
That's OK. It's a shit thread anyway. And not just because people who didn't read the thread post in it.

>>2836980
>it always outputs 1:1 pixels
>1:1
>pixels
Confirmed never used a CRT ever

V- and H-hold

Too bad this'll get overlooked

>>2833879
Nice to know anon how can that affect speedrunning?

>>2840683
It doesn't, it's just a stretched image

>>2840683
you're actually faster with stretched image as you reach finishing line faster then on non stretch image. It's called space time distortion.

>>2840950
This. Also, there is time dilation due to the rotational velocidensity of the ray emitter obviously.

>>2840950
Wrong. The electron beam takes time to move. The shorter it ha to go the sooner it reaches the end of the line.

>>2841512
That's more a reason to use a small image.
You may actually get a few nanoseconds with a small picture compared to a huge TV you play from meters away.

>>2841527
True. A CRT with H/V compressed as small as possible and stuck against your eyeball would be the fastest possible I guess.

>people mistaking AV captures with CRT "snapshots"

This thread is hilarious.

>>2838535
>or post an image of a recording on actual hardware?

wlp >>2829710 >>2826068 >>2826069