/vr/ - Retro Games

>>2814375
Mario paint, dunno if it used mode 7 or not

Gokurakuchou wa higashi ni shizumu

>>2814385
Maybe for the fly swatting game, I can't remember

What were the other modes?

>>2814375
How about FF4 and FF5?

Kirby's Avalanche
Plok

SMRPG.

Super Mario All-Stars, I'm pretty sure. Mega Man X, perhaps?

>>2814375
I'll bite. What's mode 7?

>>2814834
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mode_7

>>2814375

What the hell do you mean by blatantly use?

>>2814834
The SNES can operate in 1 of 8 different background configurations per scanline labelled (uncreatively) Modes 0-7. Backgrounds cover the entire screen and are in general composed of tiles (often 8x8 or 16x16 pixels) that are limited to a certain amount of colors per tile.

For instance, Mode 1 allows for 2 16-color/tile backgrounds and 1 4-color/tile background.

Mode 7 allows the definition of a single background layer. What makes Mode 7 special is that the background is transformed with a 2D affine transformation when drawn (essentially it undergoes a matrix multiplication and vector addition). This is useful practically because you use linear algebra to describe scaling and rotations.

An independent function of the SNES (and many other consoles of the time) was something called Horizontal Direct Memory Access (HDMA). HDMA allows you to set up small memory transfers that modify video registers each scanline, and is key to most non-trivial graphic effects. For instance, you could scroll a background in a sinusoidal pattern each scanline to achieve a wavy background for underwater or heat mirage effects.

In combination with the SNES exclusive Mode 7, HDMA could be used to modify the affine transformation parameters per scanline to achieve lots of effects, most notably pseudo-perspective (see image).

TL;DR learn yo' linear algebra!

>>2814879
I know linear algebra. You misinterpreted it.

I always thought Mode 7 looked like shit. Did people genuinely think it was cool or was it just something Nintendo was trying really hard to push on us as cool?

>>2814819

>>2814375
Believe it or not, Star Fox.

>>2814879
Cool explanation, thanks.

>>2814375
Shadowrun

>>2814798
the first thing you see in ff4 is the red wings flying over mode 7, and the meteor that galuf comes in that you see almost right away used mode 7 too

>>2814831
>Super Mario All-Stars

kind of a cop-out answer since all of the games are NES ports with updated graphics

>>2814918

People thought it was cool and I still think it's really cool and often used very creatively. Also, Nintendo wasn't the only company to make use of it on the SNES; far from it.

>>2814918

I remember just accepting it and not really thinking about it as particularly special at the time, honestly. It just was.

>>2814948

star fox had a built in chip for 3D everyone knows that

>>2814918
It wasn't about looking nice and crisp like 2d graphics you nitwit, it was about the effects you couldn't achieve without it

Mode 7 allowed for some effects that let you break away from running around on a 2d plane, and in some cases let you add a little extra something to the presentation. Sure, Bowser didn't HAVE to fly toward you in super mario world, he could have flown straight up to go off screen, but the fact he flies right into the screen, towards you, is one of the little details that makes Super Mario World so awesome, for example.

>>2814631
Modes 0 to 6. They were nothing special.

This thread is like a horror movie plot. Everyone is SURE there were tons of non mode 7 snes exclusive games but no one can name one....

Super Metroid.

You dun gofd OP.

>>2815168
It is more difficult than I would have thought.

Donkey Kong Country didn't use the 7, did it?

>>2815172
Nope, used to animate Samus' starship in the opening cut scenes, Ridley's escape, the shaft in Ceres that sways back and forth, Ceres itself, I think some cloud shit when you escape Zebes, and Samus' shot at you in the credits.

>>2815174
i think thats it. there have to be some jap exclusive ones maybe SMRPG

>>2815174
All the DKC games use mode7 for the Rareware logo when the game starts. In DKC and DKC2 it's just really for scaling, but in DKC3 all sorts of weird bulgy stuff is going on. Rare being showoffs as usual.

The better question is why so few genesis games used blast processing

>>2815206
The best question is what is blast processing?

>>2814948
>Those pictures with vidya games resembling old Japanese prints
I've seen you post one with Mario too, where did you get them from?

>>2814394
What the fuck is this weaboo bullshit.

>>2814834
>>2814918
>>2815292
Oh, look at the babbies.

>>2815168
>none in this thread
Did you even read the whole thing?

Umihara Kawase?

>>2815453

pleb

It's almost like being an exclusive title allowed for unique hardware quirks to be implemented. Woow.

Ball Bullet Gun.

It's actually a really good little tactics game, too. The only problem is that the enemy turns take a while and there's fog of war, but that's what speed up buttons are for.

whenever /vr/ talks about old tech it's always some cringy stuff

>>2815545

I know rite? old stuff stinks! xD

>>2815376
http://geekologie.com/2012/06/more-japanese-woodblock-nintendo-charact.php

Not him but I was interested as well. Did a reverse google image search.
more here
http://geekologie.com/2012/06/more-japanese-woodblock-nintendo-charact.php

>>2815376
better quality here.

jedart
(dot)
blogspot
(dot)
com


thinks the link is spam for some reason

>>2814879

They should have just stuck to 2D. They were truly magnificent engineers at the time. It's no surprise they went to shit when N64 came about.

>>2815691
>hurr magnificent engineers
The snes in 91 loses in performance to both the genesis from 88 and the pc engine from 87. The only thing it was good for was drawing a lot of colors and transparency.

>>2815710
SNES had the better catalog though. All that really matters desu.

>>2815717
Fine, but most of their hardware research went into generating pretty static pictures for magazines rather than actually good performing games.

>>2815720

It all comes down to who the developers were.

Good developers can make amazing games with any hardware.

I don't think people are going to take you seriously if you seriously think that "most of their hardware research went into generating pretty static pictures for magazines rather than actually good performing games.".

You know videos existed way before the advent of Youtube, right? Nintendo had a lot of promotional VHSs, there were TV shows about video games, and of course, you could see the games being displayed at kiosk in stores and such.

>>2815728
Pretty much, late Snes titles such as Rendering Ranger were smoother and more frantic than early genesis/pce titles, yeah. You're correct.

It's super faggy when /vr/ decides to talk about technical stuff because it's clear no one has any idea what they are talking about.

>>2815728
I agree with you, I just wish they hadn't clocked the SNES processor so low in order to cut prices.

>>2814879
wonder what would he think seeing this thread

>>2815749

Any person who was alive in the past would be disappointed as fuck that we only used all of the knowledge and technology we inherited over the generations and centuries only to make stuff like phones and Facebook.

They probably expected by 2015 we would be living on a real utopia, not a (boring) dystopia.

Not 100% sure but:

Pocky and Rocky
King Arthur's World
EVO: The Search for Eden
UN Squadron
Final Fight 3
Final Fantasy Mystic Quest (?)

those 90's snes dev scumbags, how dare they use a hardware feature that some autist would get butthurt about 25 years later.

seriously, the only thing wrong with mode7 was the lack of stock processing power to co-ordinate it well all the time, eg image a snes with the pilotwings style dsp built in

>>2814885
how so?

Castlevania had platforms done in the mode 7 layer. One of the more innovative ways it was used

>>2814831
Mega man x had a special chip for wire frame

Mario kart rainbow road or in general Mario kart and fzero all were impressive usage for a pseudo 16bit console to replicate 3d. Yes it was impressive for its time

>>2815975
That's not mode 7, though. That's a Cx4, which is a speciality chip.

>>2815975
That wasn't in X1.

>>2815975
yeah it was MMX2 and 3 that had special chips, and I wanna say that the title screen X1 uses a bit of mode 7 but I'm not sure

>>2815975
why did they even need a special chip to do that shitty little effect?

>>2816740
When you look at a game like X on GameBoy you start really asking yourself that. It's very possible to write a fast 3d line drawing routine using strictly integers and mostly additions.

>>2815292
far as I can remember, it's a marketing buzzword for how they were able to perfectly time exactly how much data they could process before the game began to lag.

>>2815550
Link actually holding his sword in his teeth while using his bow would be really badass.

>>2816851
No, it just means the Genesis had twice (three times going by normal mode) as much raw CPU power as the SNES, which isn't really something not to brag about.

>>2816864
>raw CPU power

honestly that sounds like it could be a better marketing buzzword than blast processing

RAW CPU POWER, DOES YOUR NINTENDO DO IT!?

>>2816871
It also had 32 bit registers even though I don't think it could read the whole thing at once since it has a 16 bit bus, yet they chose to put a big 16-BIT on it. I think the SNES was sort of the opposite as it had 8 bit registers but a 16 bit bus.

>>2816881
Naw. 8-bit bus, but the register word size could be toggled between 8- and 16-bit modes. 24-bit PC btw.

>>2816748
It also helps if you're able to more or less directly access the pixels. That's not the case on the NES/SNES/GB though. Instead you got to cover the screen with tiles, and then draw in them. While certainly possible, it fucks with your pixel-to-screen mapping, you don't get a contiguous memory map. The extra math to figure the right pixels, kills performance, if you got a weak CPU

>>2814543
Nope

>>2815710
>snes in 91 loses to pc engine from 87
How?

Super mario world.

Super castlevania if I remember correctly

A link to the past?

Final Fantasy Mystic quest

The ogre battles?

>>2816864
>tfw a Genesis game has horrible, pervasive slowdown

>>2817180

SC and ALTTP both use it

>>2817180
SMW: Reznor
Super CV4: Rotating rooms
Link to the Past: Map
FF Mystic Quest: Dunno, never played
Ogre Battles: Map

>>2817180
>>2817403
Also, this guy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qom6Vz1mfEY

Pretty sure that TMNT fighting game did not use this.

I was gonna say Contra Alien wars as well, but I forgot about those top down levels.

Man why yall talking shit on mode7, shit is still cool till his day.

>>2817882
>Man why yall talking shit on mode7, shit is still cool till his day.

console wars