/vr/ - Retro Games

Your mother.

>/v/

>>2470772
MGSfags can't even redirect to other boards properly. Lol.

>>2470768
Goldeneye.

>>2470780
This, actually. I love Goldeneye, but Perfect Dark blows it out of the water in terms of gameplay, weapons, story, and multiplayer. In fact, Perfect Dark still has the best offline multiplayer options in any game. Its the only game I know of that managed to do bots right by giving them personality.

>>2470768
Doom.

>>2470772

MGS is well liked on /v/ though.
It is an overrated game in my opinion. The design is really sloppy, it's too short, there's too much padding and it sacrifices its gameplay for the sake of story.

ITT: /v/

>>2470975
Vanilla DOOM? Sure.
DOOM source ports? Not really.

Every sonic game is bad
Every(main) final fantasy game is bad
The only fun part of doom is knee deep in the dead

Threads like these are always fun and never full of contrarian assholes

>>2470768
not that I give a fuck but this thread won't last m8, despite you giving it a "serious tone"... they get mass reported by the neckbeards and eventually the mod takes them down, or get shitposted by the same neckbeards falseflagging so others report, or a combination of both...

this exact same thread, with the same picture was posted like a week or 2 ago. Come on, gotta try a little harder.

>>2470975
>Best video game ever made
>overrated

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxSI1QsIo8g

>>2471049
go to bed john romero

>>2471016
>accept the consensus
>question nothing
>your criticisms end where my nostalgia begins

>>2470997
Have you even played through FF6 and seven?
I agree about Sonic though

>>2471043
It only gets remade because the mod deletes it for no reason other than he's a butthurt Kojima fanboy.

>>2471068
I've never completed any final fantasy game, because they're absurdly long and profoundly ungood. I have played all of them for at least a few hours each.

>>2471083
So in other words your opinion is worthless

>>2470768
I wonder who is behind this post.

>>2471068
haven't played 6, but 7 is extremely overrated. And to be fair... 8 gets too much shit, when under a huge mess and with patience, you find that it's pretty interesting... more than 7.

>>2471101
no, in other words, the games are shit, and the only reason anybody likes them is that they played them when they were children and were pliable to the simplistic narrative and lifeless characters.

>>2471146
If you're only giving them "a few hours," you have no business evaluating shit.

Do you go to movies and call them shit 10 minutes in and refuse to finish?

>>2471149
you can't reasonably expect anybody to play through all 13 of those 60+ hour games before making an assessment of them. Do they dramatically change in any fundamental way as you progress further through them, such that your opinion on them might change as you get further along? I've played 4 to at least halfway through and 7 for a longer time as well, and I certainly didn't see any fucking changes. They're bad fucking games. Deal with it.

>>2471154

>they're bad because I say so!

lel

>>2471159
They're narrative driven games whose narrative is targeted towards 12 year olds. The primary mechanic of all of them is "select attack". For some reason, people expect you to explain in detail why this doesn't constitute a quality video game.

>>2471167

Because "it's shit" or "overrated crap" aren't good points to make here on /vr/. It's okay to do it at /v/ though

>>2471167
So, by that self-same logic, Ninja Gaiden is a bad game because the primary mechanic is pushing B to kill things.

We need a mod

>>2471061
Right, because if I disagree and actually like games that are widely considered to be good, I clearly question nothing and it MUST be fueled by nostalgia.

So fucking presumptuous.

>>2471207
It wouldn't be the case if you MGS fanboys could actually argue why you like the game, but you faggots never do in these threads so it's clearly nostalgia at work.

>>2470768
Honestly I think MGS the original is one of the few in the series to still have appeal before they went batshit insane, that one still comes across as a primitive James Bond sim.

>>2470780
>Goldeneye.
Didn't take long for that one.

I had a lot of fun on the N64 at the time, but didn't have a computer at the time. Going back Mario 64 is so much slower with so much less variety than SM3 or World. OoT is a lot more linear and small and as an adventure puzzle game even fucking Soul Reaver a little bit later was more of a Zelda. But Goldeneye I loved so much, but even with the dual controller setup the backward controls keep me from returning to it, which is a pity the levels honestly are still pretty damn nicely designed.

Mario Kart 64 is still fucking great though.

>>2471296
I didn't play the game until I was 19 but okay sure call it nostalgia. My comment wasn't even about MGS.

>>2470768
Anything on the Sega Saturn that isn't Virtual On.

>>2471106
I agree that 7 is extremely overrated but 8 failed on every level - the cringeworthy story, the embarrassing dialogue, the detestable cast, the level scaling, the drawing mechanic, the convoluted and poorly planned out junction system, the subpar graphics even for a 1999 PS1 game, can only choose 3 commands at a time not including the standard attack (inb4 muh foresight), the okay but not particularly special soundtrack, the fact that the game randomly takes away your magic for no reason, the over-reliance on summons etc. thus it deserves all the shit it cops and then some.

Anything Zelda, why people are obsessed with that generic high fantasy videogame series is beyond me.

>>2470768
I've beaten this game like this year, during winter or something.

It's astonishing, I loved absolutely everything about it, except for Sniper Wolf boss battles. I wouldn't even call them boss battles.

I think it holds up really well and I love it.

Second boss battle with Raven is probably one of my favorite video game moments ever. Just, no bullshit, you run with this giant dude with a minigun in a maze, you have to beat him using any explosive in any way you can come up with, and you must move, always move, you can't stop. I liked that one a lot.

>>2475814
MGS's story simplicity is pretty fantastic. Then MGS4 happened.

>>2475821
I thought MGS is pretty deep. Well, it's simple yes, but at least what I got from it, it just talked to my soul.

In my vision, Liquid couldn't beat Snake not because he's inherently inferior due to recessive genes, but because he couldn't let knowledge of that let him live a real life. So, overall, I thought MGS's message was to live for the sake of living.

>>2470768
Basically everything except for STGs.

>>2476018
Shmupfriend detected

I dare you to find a game /vr/ overrates harder than Half-Life.

>HALGBGLRJBG,LRBLHGLA THE CITIZEN KANE OF VIDEOGAMES, BEST AI EVER

>>2476487

Deus Ex

Mega Man 2

>>2476487
I've never seen /vr/ treat Half Life as anything other than average on account of having played all the games that it ripped off.

>>2470768
COD, Battlefield, any war game pretty much etc. Any game that has to do with racing, skating, sports, and such.

Leave MGS out of this fuck fag.

>>2476487
Fallout.

>>2478491
The first 2 fallout games were kinda niche. Then fallout 3 happened and alllll of sudden everyone became a fallout fan... Go figure.

>>2478515
Who cares what brings people in to like good games you fucking hipster?

>>2471773
>the dialogue wasn't bad, matched what it was going for
>needing more than 3 additional commands on a single character, really?
>wasting time drawing magic outside of a few occasions
>thinking the junction system is complicated in the least
>okay soundtrack...you have got to be playing right?
>not understanding that "losing" magic is in accordance with your junctioning strength
>relying on summons...ISHYGDDT

Some people's opinions on why they don't like FFVIII I can accept. But straight up, you made the game unenjoyable for yourself or you have just read through FFVIII threads and made opinions while never finishing the game.

>>2478519
Why are you mad? Fallout 1 and 2 were very generic "sci fi pc games" from the 90s. And yes, even the setting was generic.

>>2478564
Generic doesn't mean bad or not fun

>>2478569
It also doesnt mean good. See my point? It is overrated as it is a bland game praised only, and only because its sequels.

bump

Perfect dark, and any legend of zelda game.
Not bait at all, I actually find those to be highly overrated

>>2480840
Most people that think Goldeneye/Perfect Dark are overrated aren't playing them properly.

The gameplay has a particular vibe and it can be hard to latch on if you come with preconcieved notions about how a shooter should play (e.g. Trying to play it like Quake or Halo, etc).

I actually really like MGS but I actually think it's fucking worse than MGS4 for cutscenes. You can't walk 10 fucking feet without the codec going off

>>2481401
What a complete load of shit.

>>2470975
Is this bait?
>Also, the most overrated Videogame of all time is Resident Evil I

>>2470768
99% of all 5th gen games. Being the beginning of 3D graphics was really hard on them.

>>2470975
Go play CoD negro

>>2481491
>implying that looks good
you probably like drinking pee in the morning don't you anon?

>>2481487
Overrated: Resident Evil
Underrated: Parasite Eve

>>2481491
Is there a reason they decided to stick with iD Tech 4?

>>2476632
Overrated as fuck: Half-life
Underrated: System Shock 2

>>2481498
Hipertexture shit (RAGE) was a mistake

>>2481504
So they went backwards? I love iD and Doom and I'll be buying Doom 4 but watching the footage from the other day it really does just look like a Doom 3 mod.

>>2481509
The problem with new Doom is, the graphics look like realistic things made with clay and mud. So fucking brown and undershaded.

>>2481517
an entirely claymation fps sounds pretty cool.

Also was I the only one whose reaction the snapmap shit was "Oh no..."

>>2476018
>implying Battle Garrega and Gradius aren't overrated

smb1

>>2470923
I disagree. I think perfect dark was more ambitious with its co op multiplayer and mad graphical improvements but GoldenEye felt like a more polished experience to me. PD suffered from too many bugs/frame rate issues for me to consider it the better game. I also found the missions in GE to be more fun.

To be honest I dont find GoldenEye to be overrated at all I think it deserves the hype

>>2481401
>>2481401
This is true

>Overrated Retro Games General

The fuck is wrong with you?

>>2481494
I know parasite eve is nothing but a cult favorite. But even then, it's not that good, I don't understand why people absolutely love that game.

>>2481517
the colors in doom and doom 2 were atrocious

>>2481504
I thought they'd resolved the problems with megatextures ages ago. Wasn't the problem with Rage that they released the game before drivers were done?

>>2470768
Goldeneye
Perfect Dark
Doom
Halflife
Especially Halflife with those headcrab things. I remember laughing the first time seeing them and wondering "is this supposed to be scarey?" They look like someone slapped a Thanksgiving day turkey on their head.

>>2481401
No, you can make that excuse with any game. Goldeneye and Perfect Dark are legitimately bad games that have aged horribly. Especially Goldeneye's postage stamp-sized MP screens.

>>2482151
now thats what I call edgy

>>2482156
None of the titles refuted
Le edgy meme

Your post is pure faggotry

>>2482164
no, reasoning as to why they're overrated. (granted the lack-luster halflife comment)

your post has teenager written all over it

>>2471773
>Anything on the Sega Saturn that isn't Virtual On.

You're cruisin for a bruisin.

>FF VII
>Goldeneye
>Sonic 2 (S3&K was better both not separate)
>Ocarina of Time
>SF (Genesis and SNES too) and Final Fight 1 on SNES (both sucked btw)
>All the rare collecathons except Conker that was pretty good

>All JRPG's
>Half life and Counter Strike (seriously, people in 2000-2002 playing this fucking pile of shit instead of Unreal Tournament or Quake Arena or even the first Battlefield or Medal of Honor)
>All series of Super Mario, Donkey Kong, Zelda and Starfox, but there are underrated games like Kirby in Dreamland and 64 or Kid Ikarus.
>Sonic 2/3/3K/K instead of Sonic CD and 1.
>Sonic Adventure 1 and 2
>Street figher 2 instead of 3.
>POKEfuckingMON
>Resident Evil instead of Alone in the Dark I (because there were no ports of this for psx or Saturn before RE, and yes, the 3DO port was a shit)
>TOMB RAIDER
>Age of Empires and Civilization 1,2 and 3
>The Sims

>>2482478
>Starcraft

>Megaman 2
Megaman 3 does everything as great or even better than 3, but most people think this is the best NES, i actually wonder why.

>Final fantasy IV
It has almost as many ports as the first game, it has a sequel and an actual remake, better games like FFV, VI and IX, don't have that treatment.

>Zelda 1
lel gotta bomb every wall and burn every tree.

Seriously this was acceptable in 1987 but even zelda 2 makes its secrets and ways to progress through game more clear I think it has better music too

>Super mario bros
Maybe most people disagree, and i think it's a good game but seriously it was excellent for its time but all 2-d mario games after it did it better (well maybe not 2 but it has its charm)

Sometimes i get the feeling that people like to pretend is amazing just because is mario. i think this happens with zelda 1 and metroid too. But well i guess in the end it doesn't matter because it is an important piece in gaming history.

>Sonic adventure 1 and 2
Sonic was fun because of the pinball like physics and open levels, they are decent games but sega really missed the point (specially with 2).

>Early mortal kombat
The graphics aged horribly and imo the gamplay is nothing special.

>Donkey kong country
The 2nd game is great, 3 was fine, but the first one feels like it doen't has anything new or great on it except for the graphics, nice soundtrack though.

>Pokemon
It was ok, nice marketing though.

>>2482478
>Street figher 2 instead of 3

Holy shit this, i don't know if i should call them hipsters or just idiots

>>2482009
come at me bro

>>2481550
If they would be overrated they would still exist today.
STGs are horribly underrated, since most people are just too casual for them.

>>2482478
Now this is just hipster butthurt the post

Literally every FF game except maybe 5.

>>2475814
I've replayed it a few years ago and also thinks it holds up well. Actually, due to the soliton radar I'd say it has a more solid stealth system than MGS3 or even Peace Walker, where you have some troublesome gadgets and have to rely on sight to locate enemies that wear green in green forests.

>>2478491
This, though I never liked the combat system even back in the day. Criticals were so broken that you pretty much needed to save scum like a madman to keep going, and it was pretty slow overall.

>>2482753
>even peace walker
Eh, I thought MGS3 had a much better system than it. Also at least in 3 you can clear the game using all sorts of tools. 4 has so much shit yet the game is short as fuck if you skip the cutscenes.

>>2475821
>Then MGS4 happened.
MGS4 was just trying to salvage the mess that MGS2 left behind.
>>2475830
>Liquid couldn't beat Snake not because he's inherently inferior due to recessive genes, but because he couldn't let knowledge of that let him live a real life.
Did you ever got the "Meryl lives" ending? Cause they reveal that Liquid was supposed to be the superior clone after all.

>>2482772
Tough shit, it made the mess much worse.

>>2481504

No anon, texture virtualization is now present in all modern engines in conjunction with a ptex technique for texturing.
In rage they just messed up, the idea was good.

>framerate
>framerate
>framerate
>Nbombs
Makes it downright almost unplayable. I don't know how I put up with 4 player with bots as a kid.

>>2482154
>No, you can make that excuse with any game
It's particularly true with Goldeneye though. Scratch at the surface of any Goldeneye critic and you'll find somebody who knows absolutely nothing about the game. They never played it on 00 Agent mode (where the real single player begins), they don't know you can't turn off the auto-aim, and they don't know you can adjust the controls.

I am not exagerating when I say that your average Goldeneye critic is an 18 year old that booted up the game on an emulator and immediate trashed it after 5 minutes because they couldn't find the jump button, and then proceeds to come to /v/ (or /vr/) and shitpost about how overrated t he game is.

>Especially Goldeneye's postage stamp-sized MP screens.
You can't be this stupid anon. the MP screens scale in size to the size of your television

>>2482954
*that you CAN turn off the auto-aim

>>2481504
So that explains why The Evil Within has blurry textures, if only for a split second, when you enter a new area (or rather, the cinematics with the frequent angle cuts). idTech 5 is flawed at the core.

>>2483064
Ps3 was the original platform which ID tech 5 was developed, but for some reason the 1,5 seconds of retexturization mixing low quality with high quality textures is in fact on the Ps3 version. (and is not a driver problem, and yes I remember playing RAGE with my old HD 4760 and the optimization was shit, not only the megatextures but lagging with drops of 20 frames with no reason.)
>Wolfenstein TNO
>The Evil within
>RAGE
>Quake Wars
-Carmack is like the great ancient old man wizard with demency that needs a retirement.

DoA and VF got a limited ring in the first chapter, all the Tekken to Tag Tournament got a infinite ring... i consider Tekken a nice game but not so great how people say.

>>2478557
I seriously hope you're not implying "Y-your b-breath s-stinks!" is a witty retort, or anything Zell said being non-cringey.

>>2476514
Seconding this, but on /v/ too.

>>2482954
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgZupi6RE-k

>>2483457
>linking to your shit YouTube video
No-one gives a fuck nigger.

>>2481454
I feel the same way but with MGS2. That fucking beginning of the Big Shell was inexcusable.

>>2483460
Autism.

>>2483457
>headshot a dude sitting on the toilet
>hat flies off instead
>this doesn't alert him somehow
>shoot in the literal exact same spot
>apparently his hat was bulletproof because it kills him this time around

THIS GAME.

>>2482213
Virtual On is the only reason I would ever want a Saturn.

>>2475821
You mean "Then MGS2 happened" because MGS4 exists only to clean up the mess made by MGS2's convoluted nonsense.

>>2482772
>>2483521
MGS2's plot is actually the best one, or at least the more mature and original -for videogames, I mean- in the series, but I can see that you kiddies still miss "MUH SOLID SNAKU".

While Snake is presented to us as some kind of Ubermensch, Raiden is a portrait of the average player; it is, in fact, the own player; young, whiny, immature, unexperienced, etc. To confirm this interpretation of the Raiden meaning, we can look at the fact that the game ask the player name -and other data- the first time we control him; this very data will be shown later in Raiden's dog tag. So, Snake finds his own path to freedom, but society rejects him; he's supposed to be killed after the Tank chapter -at least, "oficially"-; then, Raiden is presented to us as a "new Snake", but soon things change: Campbell tells us that we cannot use that name since the terrorist leader is called... Solid Snake. Yes, it's Solidus Snake, but the thing is that Snake is portrayed from now on as a jerk, a renegade, the bad guy. Then, real Snake appears and teaches Raiden -the player itself- that he have to be free and break the chains society put on him. At last, Raiden has to confront society in order to gain his freedom, but Solidus, his supposed "father", won't let him and has to kill him (take that, Oedipus). Also, it's curious the way society -represented by the entity the game calls "The Patriots"- chooses to enforce its will and subjugate Raiden: Campbell (the colonel) and Rose (his pregnant girlfriend): in other words, State and Family. After killing his "father", Raiden is finally fully aware of his chains and can start his own way to freedom, as Snake tought him.

MGS4 just piss on the concepts used as plot devices in MGS2 because keep developing a plot like that would be complicated and nobody would have liked it; instead, we had the "War is bad, mmkay" thing again and a constant appeal to nostalgia, among some extremely embarrasing -more than usual- lines of dialogue.

>>2470768
Not that one, replaying it right now and having a blast. It still holds up better than its shitty sequels.
Yeah, I went there you big boss cocksuckers. Fuck you.

pretty much every 3d nintendo sixty-four / sony playstation game looks terribly outdated, and other than the few games with mechanics that actually excel (super mario bros. sixty-four, goldeneye, banjo kazooie, spyro or armored core) most of them are utterly terrible now. there's no reason to play clunky pieces of shit like resident evil, metal gear, turok or the nintendo sixty-four castlevania games.
it's no wonder that the best psone games (mostly rpgs plus castlevania symphony of the night, raiden and darius) and the best nintendo sixty-four games (games like mischief makers, bangai-o or goemon) are all in 2d

>>2484071
Great, now explain the significance of the "POSSESSED BY MUH ARM" shit.

>>2475793
Because they played it when they were kids and have overly-fond childhood memories of it.

>>2483380
I'm getting mixed signals, you're saying that the PS3 version of IT5 is the one that's buggy, yet you encountered bugs in the PC version as well. That sounds like the engine as a whole has problems. That might be the reason why they're going for IT4 for DooM 4.

>>2484071
The most meaningful part of MGS4 is the beginning with the TV ads

>>2484637
Still better than MGS4's "Possessed by muh arm but I was merely pretending; also, we are the Patriots, dude, me and your mother".

>>2485472
>Possessed by muh arm but I was merely pretending

MGS2 was the one who brought that shit in the first place though.

>also, we are the Patriots, dude, me and your mother

I agree, that was especially dumb.

>>2485497
Kojima is a hack writing and a frustrated filmmaker.
I'm a MGS fan, but I laugh out loud when people claim he's a genius and the proof that videogames are an art form par to literature and cinema.

>>2485569
I used to be one of those people who shat on MGS4 for being such a convoluted shitpile that ruined the story but now that I think hard about it, the story was already technically "ruined" by MGS2, and MGS4 only existed to clean up the mess left by MGS2's convoluted and "experimental" plot. Hell, even if KojiPro hired a team of talented writers they still couldn't have done a better job at making sense of the arm transplant possession shit than the "merely pretending" revelation in MGS4.

And let's not forget the games borrowing heavily from other works of fiction i.e MGS1 from Escape from New York, MGS2 from 1984, MGS3 from James Bond; then again, good luck finding anything 100% original AND worthwhile in any medium today.

>>2485650
I did not accuse Kojima of being unoriginal. He just sucks at writing. Some lines and scenes in MGS feel cringeworthy.
At least he was a bit more original in MGS2, or his writing were a bit braver, even whether it feels clumsy sometimes.
The whole thing feels convoluted because of all the plot twists necessary to appeal to young illiterate audiences

Also, I don't think you really know what you're talking about namedropping films and books. Of course there will be references; always. And MGS2 has little in common with 1984 -are you still in high school or something?- and feels more inspired in some Nietzsche's philosophy concepts, the usual teen's choice philosopher, which fits Kojima so good.

In the meantime, we're not approaching the series' plot critically and avoiding a far more interesting topic: MGS game design at gameplay core and as a whole, taking advantage of the possibilities of the medium. That's where Kojima really shines.

>>2485686
>And MGS2 has little in common with 1984 -are you still in high school or something?

I mean that whole Orwellian-esque shit about some secret organization monitoring and controlling everything from the shadows etc. I wasn't trying to sound elite or that I know it all, I'm just saying that people give Kojima more credit than he deserves and his games aren't as deep as they think they are. Just a personal observation.

>>2485686
>MGS game design at gameplay core and as a whole, taking advantage of the possibilities of the medium. That's where Kojima really shines.
That's the main point, I believe. Most people out there who try to compare literature and cinema with video games forget that they have very different goals, usually. Say, writer A created an intricate storytelling which depicts the themes he wants to explore in countless ways. Why would he use video games to express these ideas? Or vidya dev B sudddenly thought of a really interesting and creative mechanic, and he models the settings and characters based on it. Comparing the story's complexity and themes (if there are any) of vidya dev B with writer A is pretty damn stupid. Now, the possibility of making a "DEEP" story based on games is always there, but how often does this happen? Not often, maybe because video games don't aim for that to begin with. I think a lot of video game "theorists", DEEPfags and the like would have a lot more fun reading books.

>>2485693
I think MGS2 has a stronger relation to 1984 in the main character being exposed to the lie, coming straight from the horse's mouth.

The ambiguous ending also reminds me of 1984.
But I see where you are coming from anon

>>2485773
That too.

>>2485569
I used to laugh out loud whenever people do the same of Bioshock Infinite or The Last of Us, but now I just roll my eyes.

>>2471154
>any ff game
>60+ hours
LMAO
M
A
O

>>2476514
this

>>2485650
MGS2's mess is due to the urge of finishing the project after almost four years of development, but the plot, even if it felt convoluted, was arguably groundbreaking. We can agree, to some extent, that may be it was the hardest one to understand in the whole series; not only because of the themes themselves but also because of the storytelling in the final act, that relies heavily upon long codec sequences, for instance. MGS4 "fixes" this supposed mess, thematically speaking, for all the people who didn't like MGS2, but using the same vague storytelling techniques from this final MGS2's moments. It not only fucking ruins anything valuable in MGS2's narrative and plot; it also comes packaged in overwritten cut scenes that last hours, filled with the usual ocassional cheesy lines, mediocre character development, etc. tl;dr. If Kojima were a good filmmaker, he would have made films.

>>2470768
Pic not related.

>>2487752
>Kojima were a good filmmaker, he would have made films.

Sure, because you need to be good to do them right anon ?

He's cheesy sometimes, but i don't dislike it to be honest.

>>2470768
Breaks my heart, but Banjo-Kazooie and mother seem to be part of this

>>2483519
That's nice that your tastes are so limited. But some of us like other games as well, saturn was amazing especially for shmups and fighters, but also a lot of other stuff. Virtual On is pretty damn fantastic, but I wouldn't put it in the top 5 saturn games, probably not even the top 10.

>>2485686
>Some lines and scenes in MGS feel cringeworthy.
That's called a joke, Anon.

>>2487805
I was thinking in solemn or supposedly serious scenes, but the jokes you might be referring to are no much better.

>Tee hee, this guy has diarrhea. It's funny because, you know, it's about poop. So clever, a touch of comedy with a wit.

>>2487776
>but i don't dislike it to be honest.
Good for you, champ. I've played MGS for countless hours and I've enjoyed them a lot. I don't dislike MGS either, but that doesn't stop Kojima from being a hack writing and (filmlike) "directing".

Also, liking something != that something being good, but since almost all the hardcore fans consider MGS "2deep4U" stuff, what can I say to all these manchildren that consider Kojima and MGS the best thing since microwave pop corn?

>>2487905
>what can I say to all these manchildren that consider Kojima and MGS the best thing since microwave pop corn?

Nothing, EVERY single fanbase is shit, i like MGS and i find the story entertaining both in a cheesy and a dramatic way, nothing ground breaking, but good.
As a director he's not bad at all, don't start shitting on something more than necessary only because you find the fanbase obnoxious or you will end up worse than them.

>>2487937
I'm not going to move my opinion into a middle ground position if I don't want to.
Most MGS "film" sequences can't match good films; the pacing is often bad and the writing is clunky.

>>2470768
>Starting thread with bait.

Is this /v/ or /vr/?

>>2487971

Being bait does not necessarily mean being wrong.

Also in my experience, /v/ has a much bigger boner for Metal Gear and will tolerate much less dissent.

>>2487795
Right, and how many of the have super fast robots blasting each other?