/vr/ - Retro Games

>cutscenes
Isn't this the very reason why people bash modern gaming?

>>2424717
I have to tell you, some hacks are really cool, rock and roll racing MMX3 , dkc2, secret of mana, chrono trigger (before it was pulled from the net by a CD from CT reorchestral music)
Some are ok Legend of zelda DX
Some are bad "legend of zelda With videos"
megamanX
And some are fuckign garbage Super Mario World by kiddocabusses, my ears bleed after hearing thatgarbage

I think it's retarded. But that wont stop people.

>>2424946
>DKC2

Considering it already had one of the greatest OSTs of all time, there is close to zero chance replacement music could be better.

Unfortunately, even games that had shittier soundtracks have even shittier MSU-1 music available.

what is MSU-1

>>2424717
>FMVs

Super Road Blaster is the only game that makes any worthwhile use of this feature.

All the romhacks that use it tend to have a single FMV at the start. It reminds me of the days when scene releases would have an intro with their logo tacked onto the start of a game. This common usage of FMVs seems equally pointless.

>>2424717
In order for this to take off people need to have an open knowledge of SNES games and the junk they're programmed in so they can add that stuff.
for example if I had even the slightest idea of a fuck of programming talent I'd take Earthworm Jim on the SNES apart, port over Big Bruty, Intestinal Distress, and the extra section in New Junk City from Special Edition and add the CD music.

this MSU-1 stuff means nothing for people who can't use it, but a learning experience yeah sure

>>2425013
Zelda and chrono trigger, at least the zelda one have orchestral music. But the DX Zelda is the way to go no videos, beter music.

>>2424982
I agree with you now speaking of garbage listen this shit!
So this piece of shit is better than the original music?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZkbchA67Fc

>have no idea what this is
>look it up
>it's an enhancement chip for SNES, made by byuu, who also created bsnes

So let me get this straight.
The guy bitches and moans about there being no accurate SNES emulators, crying that hacks are utilizing errors in said innaccurate emulators in order to function properly. Then he makes an emulator that even modern computers today can't even run in full accuracy mode, then makes this "chip" that no real snes even uses, and is pretty much made specifically for hacks and conveniently, his emulator is the only one that emulates the chip.

Niiiice double standard.

>>2424717
The worse part is that the ones that are great are for sale by a guy named the drakhon

>>2425045
I pointed this out in the first thread a few weeks backs.

The Byuu fans are idiots and will buy or believe anything that guys does.

>>2425045
I hope Byuu don't read this, he will cry again and abandon everything!
OH WAIT HE ALREADY DID!

>>2425045
Real SNES can use MSU-1 roms through flashcarts. The only thing stopping real carts from using the chip is that physically they don't exist.

>>2425054
How do you know that Byu abandoned it?
>>2425052 Nice lumping together of Byuu fans into one ball.

>>2425014
This is a very important point. Some games are loads more complicated that others.

The actual MSU-1 part is the easiest by far. Just find empty space in the rom and put your custom routine in there. The routine needs to handle things like selecting which track to play, playing, pausing, stopping, etc.

But once you've got the MSU-1 music playing, you also have to prevent the game's normal music from playing. You can't completely disable it either, since you're supposed to detect whether or not the system has the MSU-1 present or not. The big problem is that some games handle their music in an extremely complicated way, but some make it very easy.

The LoZ patch was piss easy to implement because the game has a built in silence track and all sound effects are always loaded and played when needed. Just start the MSU-1 music, play the silence track and you're good.

The DKC series on the other hand is absolutely horrifying. There are several variations for each track and each variation will load the sound effects needed for a particular level. So if you don't load the audio properly you won't get any sound and the game will lock up. Disabling the music without breaking the game is almost impossible. The guy who made the patch for DKC2 is a fucking genius and I still don't understand how he made it work. The technical aspects of the hack are quite amazing, whereas the skill required for the likes of LoZ or SMW just pales in comparison.

>>2425065
He abandon everything after a fight with lost templar and translator TOM over and argument in his part of Fart East of Eden Zero (4 years and no progress) so he decided to drop everything even higan-bsnes.

>>2425131
Byuu made an MSU-1 patch for Der Langrisser with orchestral music. Every so often he posts about how brilliant it is, that it's fully complete and that he's going to release it someday.

He's been doing that since 2011. :(

>>2425093
There's two legend of zelda patches out there, both with different music and different goals.
The first one add some videos made from the manga and keep the original music just orchestrated.
The second one the one in romhacking net
is called DX altered all the music with aranged tracks and changed how some items work, like the pegasus boots or the master sword.

>>2425139
None of those other things really matter. The MSU-1 hacking aspect should be almost identical.

Making actual music for the MSU-1 is very easy. Just convert any audio to 16-bit unsigned PCM (WAV), then run it through the wav2msu tool and set the looping point if needed. You shouldn't have to touch the rom if it's already MSU-1 enabled.

>>2425136
The drakon , I made this great MSU hack of "Insert game here" but i will no release say hack for free, gibe moni plz!
I once made him realize that what he is doing is illegal since , the hacking part if from him sure, but every other thing is from copyright IP, and without say IP his hacks are useless.

>>2425156
Can you please point me out how to make a working msu patch like the one for secret of mana to work in another language translation.
I tryed to make it work with the spanish one, but fail miserable.

>>2425156
http://www.zeldix.net/t619-msu-1-secret-of-mana

>>2425163
There are two versions of the Spanish translation patch on RHDN; one for the EU release and one for the USA release. The MSU-1 patch seems to be for the USA version only, so if you want to use both you'd probably have to use the USA version.

It should work assuming there are no conflicts between both patches.

>>2424717
FMV A SHT
OP A FAGGOT

>>2425157
drakon is the king faggot of faggots, not only does he go around demanding to get paid for his 15minute hatchetjobs, but he also ruins retro with his piss poor console mod services.

>>2425456
>>2425157

The Drakon is a huge jerk. He's a wannabe entrepreneur trying to make as much money as he can from the Retro game scene. He doesn't do things for free to help others.

Take this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfNI3HpUt-4

Take his Super FX over clocking. A valid concept and I appreciate him for demonstrating this in video. However, he did this entirely so he could sell SFX over clocking mods. He claimed that such over clocking is impossible on real hardware. Now emulators like Bsnes mercury include SFX over clocking.

He frequently makes romhacks and refuses to release them. He wants you to buy his reproduction carts.

>>2425662
By the sound of that. Drakon ought to be purged like a bad subroutine.

>>2425662
>>2425668
Isn't this the hot glue dude?

>>2425676

Yes, he makes bukkake glue mods

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QMH-xp-WtI

>>2425685
What the actual fuck.

>>2424751
Although this can support the real issue, the real issue is lack of real gameplay, not necessarily abundance of cutscenes.

>>2425040
Pretty much my opinion with Nintendo and their fucking obsession to orchestrate music that has no business being orchestrated.

>>2425676
Yes the problem is that it appears the only guy capable of doing decent msu1 hacks.

listen to this shit made by kiddo kabusses
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olMaJumaHC8

Now the drakon castlevania

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YF0XsUAsNLQ

If no one release a damn thing as good as this hot glue motherfucker, Im very tempted to purchase one from him, and distribute says hack to the world.
I hope his not as a lunatic as o threat me in realife like nightwolve

>>2425045
It isn't a hack actually
It's real hardware, that could run on a real SNES

>>2425040
I usually like jazz fusion, but this does not fit.

>>2425701

MSU-1 romhacks aren't that hard. It's mostly lack of interest and the community is small.

Drakon is just an opportunist, who's seeing the next fad in retro gaming, and then exploiting it. He wants money, it's always about money.

>>2425040
>no 16 bit ukelele in the background
Yeah, it's shit.

>>2425703
It could be used in theory, provided you had unlimited funds for rom chip manufacturing. But it's beyond cost prohibitive, which is why it's usually called a hack -- you can only use it in emulators and flashcarts.

>>2425703
reading comprehension
he said "made for hacks" not that it IS a hack

>>2425045
>>2425052
There's actually one good thing to come out of this: http://www.zeldix.net/t684-bs-zelda-and-bs-zelda-ancient-stone-tablets-msu-1

MSU-1 gives Satellaview games the chance to be emulated closer to their original formats, rather than being pieced together with little workarounds (like using the original game's music) and completely new elements (like textboxes to reflect the original voice acting.)

>>2425701
>Asumming the Rondo of Blood OST can save Dracula X

>>2425701
>Yes the problem is that it appears the only guy capable of doing decent msu1 hacks.
Gotta disagree, that cocksucker hasn't proved that his hacks produce proper sound levels in bsnes and that's the more difficult part. The basic hack itself is pretty damned easy, adjusting the fabe & volume levels is where all the real work is.

As for his choice in music, I'd say a lot of it is pure shit. Listen to his msu1 hack of Super Metroid, a lot of those tracks sound like shit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQwbm1W06eI

>>2427041
OH EM GEE AWESOME!
except the original audio is in japanese. D'OH!

>>2424717
I just heard of the MSU-1. From my understanding the specification has only been implemented in software. I guess the idea is to implement the 'chip' as an FPGA eventually and work of an SD card.

Just one question. Why?

Working within the limitations of a system is part of the art in creating a game. I figure /vr/ would appreciate this more than any other board. Otherwise we would all just play Android games because the capabilities of the hardware is a superset of everything retro.

MSU-1 makes retro an aesthetic, not a (bygone) necessity.

>>2424717
To be honest I never saw anyone talk about this thing at all until people started posting hate threads like this one.

>>2427762
I suppose the same people that spam threads about this thing are the same people that spam threads about that shitty "retro style" system some over glorified scam artist wants to make

>finally a good way to gave custom music in Mario world hacks
>hackfags will still forever stick with zsnes
fuck...

>mfw Tex Murphy SNES game will be possible but will never, ever, ever, ever, ever happen

>>2427747
I said closer, not exactly.
That's what a translation is for.

>>2427812
But ZSNES is the best emulator.
Why not stick with the best emulator?

>The CD soundtracks just sound so fucking wrong, and they lack the bass and retro feel of the classic 16 bit tracks.

Honestly, to me, that sounds a bit... ignorant? I'm not sure what to call it, but what I mean is that you're basically not looking at the bigger picture. Of course, a lot of CD soundtracks sound bad, but that's not because they're CD soundtracks that lack some sort of nebulous "retro" quality, it's because they weren't made to fit with the game and aren't consistent. A lot of these hacks, as far as I've seen, use a random hodgepodge of assorted remixes and the like, a lot of which was not made to be used in a game, but made to be listened to as a regular music track, and there's definitely a difference between the two. What needs to happen is that remix artists and the like need to get together and plan out a consistent project for the sake of making an entire soundtrack, only then will we actually get somewhere.

Now, some have considered using CDs with full soundtrack arrangements, but even then things don't usually work. The prime example is the Actraiser Symphonic Suite. I've seen a few people talking about wanting to use that for an MSU-1 hack, but that's a terrible idea, since once again, the tracks were not made for use in a game and you get nasty cut-off points and shit. Plus, a lot of the tracks are just too calm to fit the action scenes and have long lead-ins at times (again, bad, you need instant action).

Now, the Drakon Dracula X thing is something that actually kind of works, because it's consistent and works as a game soundtrack (obviously), however, just using the music from another game is just redundancy, so again, we're not actually getting anywhere new.

Really, the only way we're going to see the true potential of the new possibilities for music the MSU-1 brings is if somebody actually puts some effort into creating a fitting soundtrack for a game. Still, having that opportunity open is good reason to get excited for the future.

>>2427812
actually even hackfags don't use zsnes as the standard anymore

>>2427840
>that's what a translation is for
yeah, because we all know how great fandubs are.

>>2427846
stop giving zsnes so much guff

it was brilliant in the old days

>>2427879
he was making fun of the people that still use it as their main emulator, not the program it's self, though

MSU-1 is a little pointless for most SNES games since the music was already really good. SNES can do a good job replicating the sounds of most instruments.

The main benefit would be for romhackers and indie devs. It's much easier to create new music with MSU-1. So you make a new, let's say Metroid or original game. Instead of re-using music or having to code more, you can just take any old music and use it.

Or you can take a later release's soundtrack and FMV and port them back to the original SNES version.

I like the Mega Man X MSU-1 hack, since it lets you use the music from the PSP remake. I don't think the SNES can do very good job at synthing guitar sounds, so I'm not a huge fan of the original score.

Question: Can MSU-1 be used for more than CD audio and FMVs? Can it be used for regular level and graphic data? If so, then a true indie game harnessing its power could really be great.

>>2427874
>>that's what a translation is for
>yeah, because we all know how great fandubs are.
yes, because videogame dubs have a long history of being disney tier masterpieces #irony
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRhDmUzWuBI

>>2425045
From what I heard SD2SNES supports MSU-1 so you could use these modifications on a real console provided you have that flashcart.

>>2427889
>Question

Yes, but there are no games or hacks that use it for this purpose. Not even a demo. Everything is either audio or FMV.

If someone wanted to be pedantic about it, FMV is technically data that is fed to the SNES CPU which handles decoding, displaying, etc. Audio on the other hand is just pushed straight to the DSP.

Ninja Gaiden Trilogy

This game really needs it.

>>2429469

So you could potentially make some huge 4 GB sized Metroid-vania?

>>2430789
From what I've gathered, no. The MSU-1's 4 gigs is exclusively used for CD quality music and FMV

>>2431043
There are optional pins on the cart that let you mix in sound directly from the cart.

There is no such functionality for graphics. All VRAM writes have to go through the CPU, either through software or DMA. It is therefore trivial to load any kind of data from the MSU-1 into main memory by redirecting the writes from VRAM to WRAM.

Still why you'd need this is beyond me. Learn to get away with 16MiB of memory. That's plenty for an SNES game. Learn to code the SPC700 rather than steamroll it with 4GiB of technically unimpressive audio.

>>2430789
Yes, although we're still waiting for a game that uses more data than a normal SNES game can allocate, let alone approaching the limits of the MSU-1.

Hell, we're still waiting for anything that uses MSU-1 data in a way that isn't FMV.