/vr/ - Retro Games

Is this the same one than the one that was going to replace Cait Sith with edgy author self-insert character or is this made by a different team?

>>2413602

I see no reference to "Cait Sith" on his page, so I guess not.

>>2413592

One thing I don't like about these fan-localizations is that they are often times too dry and direct. Many times, Western localizers can write better dialogue than the Nips.

>>2413640
It's Final Fucking Fantasy VII.

No native English speaker was involved in its localization.

>>2413640
a lot of fan translators are like that, trying to be as literal as possible. i got news for them, japanese aint as colorful and diverse as english. there's a plethora of ways to ask if someones alright rather than daijobu over and over for example

>>2413592
i dont really see they need for this, sure it was rough but the meaning wasnt really lost in translation

>>2413656

>In the late 1990s, Richard Honeywood decided to create a localization team when he was recruited for Square.[2] His first major project was Final Fantasy VII, on which he worked under Director of Localization Michael Baskett.[3]

>Final Fantasy VII's script was done by a small team, resulting in a rough script and inconsistencies. One of the more famous of these was the name of Aerith Gainsborough: the name was originally meant to be a merging of "Air" and "Earth", but her name in the original game was translated as "Aeris". Honeywood also added extra pieces of dialogue to add personality to the protagonists.[3]

Good news, it doesn't seem to be completely full to the brim with optional crap like the PC's current incarnation of it.

I might actually play this one for fun, it did look pretty nice.

>>2413672
i never picked up on aerith referencing earth. also extra dialogue what a monster

i need to know what this extra dialogue is

i'm curious what scenes were removed in the original localization

>>2413602
This is the same project but it looks like they scrapped that part. Thank god. Also seems like they changed the "criticism" section, I remember that being a giant fucking rant before.

>>2413681
Got it from this article:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Localization_of_Square_Enix_video_games

Which uses this reference:
http://www.1up.com/features/squaresoft-localization

with all this effort they could have fully translated some of the more obscure saturn rpgs

now i'm getting kind of mad thinking about it

>>2413694
This. Everyone and their mothers have already played FFVII so it's a fucking waste to put this effort in a game that is already translated and that everyone has already played.

Doc with his translation:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1rCfwrvE9jSO_vojc4rq0fOIlyrjj_6MOUlFCLN0VMgg/edit#gid=0

>Leno instead of Reno

What a faggot.

>>2413694
>>2413704
>implying translators and hackers are this limited

>>2413710
>Changing Choco Bill to "Grean"

I hate it already

>>2413714

what does this post even mean

>>2413710
they literally say in the anime, reno, with their mouths, who cares what some random doc says written by some jap who cant roll their rs

>>2413736
also moguri, when its been moogle for decades

>>2413592
>Official sources have been used to minimize errors in context and spelling
What might these "official sources" be? Ultimanias? Retroactive storyfixes/changes from the compilation of FFVII that came out years after FFVII itself?

>>2413746
>What might these "official sources" be?
I dont know they wont tell us

>>2413741
>also moguri, when its been moogle for decades

Troll hack confirm.

You can't honestly try to change "moogle" and keep a straight face when saying the retranslation is better.

Whats wrong with the original release we all played on playstation? Just keep a copy of that and be happy

>>2413756
>>2413746

In the google doc, he references things like the "Official Establishment File"

Which is this apparently;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8_A5FAxFHc

Though that just raises the question though, that this was likely written by Nips.

Betcha anything he got rid of "Let's Mosey"

>>2413759

It's pretty good. A lot of these localizations are under rated. However, there's grammar errors, typos ("This guy are sick") and such. I think a lot of item materia and enemy names are wrong too.

I would prefer that this translation is cleaned up a little bit, rather than completely over hauled with some autism weeb who thinks we need a perfect literal translation of Superior Nippon language.

>>2413723
Because Choco Bill is much closer to グリン [gurin] than Grean? Or is this a case of muh localization?

>>2413736
>>2413741
They've said before that they didn't take any "series canon" established by the localizations into account when doing this. They translated as if it was its own game. It's the west that turned モーグリ [mo-guri] into moogle.

>>2413746
How about an info book release days before the Japanese release? And if anything they detest anything that came out of the compilation.

http://otaku.com/products/258

I'm a guy who prefers the localization of VI than any fan translation, but if you've been following this project it's gone through a lot and the duo is now taking input from others. Most changes are open to correction and public thought if you really want your voice heard.

This is a retranslation I've actually been excited for compare to most done for 16-bit games.

>>2413767
Not to mention, in the installer (for the PC version), you can choose to keep all those "series canon" localization changes. So if you really wanted to you can play with those still while still reaping the benefits of the grammar and dialogue corrections.

>>2413767
>How about an info book release days before the Japanese release?

Written by Japs with no English experience.

"Yrena" is clearly meant to be Elena.

Leno is clearly Reno.

Remember Japs and their R's and L's.

>>2413774
>while still reaping the benefits of the grammar and dialogue corrections.

At the loss of everything else. I bet you anything the dialogue is now super dry like all other literal fan translations.

Nips do not write good fluent human dialogue. Native English writers write better ones.

http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,19709.msg278023.html#msg278023

http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,19747.msg278528.html#msg278528

TRANSLATION DOES NOT WORK ON REAL HARDWARE OR ACCURATE EMULATORS

IT'S OVER! NO POINT ARGUING THIS ANYMORE. THIS TRANSLATION IS DONE! INTO THE TRASH BIN!

>>2413783
Instead of assuming why don't you take time to go through it? The translators are happy to provide the orignal Japanese script and theirs to those who want to compare and have done so before.

>>2413791
It was originally done as a mod for the PC version. The user on romhacking.net just ported it over to PS1.

>>2413791
>TRANSLATION DOES NOT WORK ON REAL HARDWARE OR ACCURATE EMULATORS
>IT'S OVER! NO POINT ARGUING THIS ANYMORE. THIS TRANSLATION IS DONE! INTO THE TRASH BIN!


FUCKING LOL

>>2413694
Just learn Japanese already.

>>2413694
>with all this effort they could have fully translated some of the more obscure saturn rpgs

Or you could learn Japanese, learn to program, and translate your own obscure JRPGs.

>now i'm getting kind of mad thinking about it

How do you even get this entitled?

I can't read a lick of Moonspeak and think you're being stupid.

So this one of those crappy literal translations, uh?
Dropped.

>>2413694
Definitely agree. The translators should do what they want with their time, but re-translating a game that already got a passable localization when English speakers still can't play Segagaga or SD3 seems like wasted effort. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>2413817
Because everyone here was ready to play FF7 again just for this?

>>2413817
Retranslations have really been so bad that any new one coming out automatically gets shunned, huh?

At least this one's primary translator resides and works in Japan for a living.

I really hope the creators see this thread

>>2413828
Living there would only improve your conversational japanese, not so much kanji recognition.

>>2413828

Hyper literal translations are kind of bad for dialogue though. It is good for item/enemy/magic lists though.

>>2413791
but does it work in epsxe

>>2413842

That's why Woolsey uncensored is my favorite FF6 translation.

>>2413820
sd3? you mean the sequel to secret of mana? thats translated

>>2413842
Why is it bad at times to do pure literal translations?

>>2413867

Japanese dialogue translated literally comes off as stilted and awkward. That is why localization has to keep the meaning and spirit while making some minor changes.

>>2413820
Apparently SD3 got translated like fifteen years ago... so nevermind that part.

>>2413867
Japanese and English are two very different languages so conversations flow a lot differently, common figures of speech won't transfer between the two, cultural attitudes and references are different, etc. There's a reason professional localizations of things like video games and anime almost never take this approach.

>>2413849
Yeah... not sure what I was thinking of. So pretend I said Mystical Ninja 2 SNES instead

Rhapsody: A musical Adventure nailed it:

"Welcome to the town of Whitesnow, a town filled with snow. Enjoy the world of snow. *Note: this is what happens when you do a direct translation."

Which is why anytime one of these fan translations comes up it inferior to the officially translated version (mother 3 withstanding).

>>2413867
Watch one of those Azumanga Daioh episodes where they do Japanese puns for 15 minutes straight for a decent example

>>2413835
???
living there sure is hell of a lot better for kanji recognition than studying it abroad

>>2413832
One of them already has. Check out the last page of the qhimm thread link. And he's laughing at you guys.

>>2413890
This assumes you actually put in an effort. Some foreigners there don't speak a lick of japanese at all.

>>2413904
>One of them already has.

>>2413710
This whole thing is cringey as fuck.
>Nibelheim
>Mt. Nibel
>Change from "Nibel Area" to "Nibl Area"

They thought this shit was positive?

>>2413842
That is precisely what this one's goal was. Items/names/etc were done from a combination of literal translations, official sources such as Ultimania (this was a huge one), and any identifiable mythological references (there were a lot). Dialogue was done in multiple passes. First a literal translation, then rewritten for flow, meaning, and character, as well as to identify figures of speech or other intent that could be lost in a purely literal translation, then another pass to refine it and make it as natural as possible, then ANOTHER pass to proofread for errors and make minor flow improvements.

As for the Cait Sith thing, that person was the project lead for this (not the lead translator), but the two were always intended to be separate projects.

I'm not a huge fan of the name stuff in the retranslation, so I only use the PC version with all the canon options checked, but the dialogue is plenty natural, certainly moreso than RPGOne's FF6 or Chrono Compendium's CT.

>>2413886

Which is why I think they should aim to clean-up or fix the current translation rather than change everything.

Greatest of all time translation coming through.

Anyone notify Squenix already?

>>2413867
Because dialogue is structured differently across languages, even if you did something like a literal translation from spanish to english it'd end up coming off as stilted and retarded

For example, which sounds better?
>What are you doing?

>Option 1: I'm just thinking about the immortality of the crab (literal translation of a spanish saying)
>Option 2: I've just got my head in the clouds (actually what is meant of the spanish saying)

>>2413929
Context?

>Game is translated well
>Its enjoyable, the story isn't really lost
>Never is the translation bad enough to warrant not playing it
>Never lose direction because of bad translation

>Some sperglords think X game is the greatest thing ever and deserves a superior translation (according to their weeb selves)
>Proceed to do cringey bullshit like awkward sex jokes, "colourful" language (see: add in swearing everywhere), self insert characters, 3rd wall breaking characters, and every other shit thing you could think of
>They think this is superior.

>>2413932
Typical fan translation.

"It's not possible a retranslation many years in the making could be better than what I remember from my childhood" the thread.

I know retranslations have a bad rep, but at least play through a bit of one before knocking it. Come on.

>>2413935
>Proceed to do cringey bullshit like awkward sex jokes, "colourful" language (see: add in swearing everywhere), self insert characters, 3rd wall breaking characters, and every other shit thing you
Which this project has none of.

>>2413939
>at least play through a bit of one before knocking it.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Besides, some of the best parts are the bad translation. I can't play teh PSP tactics because I like some of the stupid shit thats in the original FFT.

>>2413939
>I know retranslations have a bad rep, but at least play through a bit of one before knocking it. Come on.

We have the google doc which lists most of the changes. Many of them are dumb.

>>2413939
Everytime I see someone advertising a translation, or a retranslation, or a mod and someone says its stupid I imagine the guy who posted it gets btfo so hard

>>2413640
>muh inaccurate lush prose

>>2413939
>"It's not possible a retranslation many years in the making could be better than what I remember from my childhood" the thread.
>I know retranslations have a bad rep, but at least play through a bit of one before knocking it. Come on.

He's relying too much on some promotional pamphlet when there's no evidence that the translation is superior. It's just as likely that those "official docs" are wrong, especially since Nips are known for having bad English.

>>2413942
Except it is broke. This is what nostalgiafags don't get.

>>2413967
>gender feminists

...as opposed to feminism that isn't about gender?

also what the fuck is the relevance

>>2413867
Because literal translations are based on dictionaries written by westerners who just casually pair up words when actual language doesn't work like that. A proper translation can only be done by an individual or team who is/are fluent in both English and Japanese so they can get across the meaning of the Japanese text when a "literal" translation wouldn't.

>>2413942
But... it was broke. In terms of grammar and dialogue.

I think there's a funny disparity between those who love Japanese shit. The ones into the games don't want literal translations, but the ones into anime don't want localizations (if fansubs are any indication).

>>2413957
So provide me an example with the Japanese, original localization, and retranslation. Then explain why the localization was better.

>>2413979
I posted the wrong picture, but I see you got btfo anyways.

>>2413967
Hold the fucking phone. I didn't know they made a female version of are Ed. For how long did the Bilderbergs think they could keep this secret?

>>2413990
n1gr

>>2413979
>Equity feminism and gender feminism are two kinds of feminism that were first defined by scholar Christina Hoff Sommers in her 1994 book Who Stole Feminism? She describes equity feminism as having the ideological objective of equal legal rights for men and women and gender feminism as having the objective of counteracting sexism and patriarchic social structures in everyday social and cultural practice. Sommers is herself a strong advocate of what she calls equity feminism and a critic of what she calls gender feminism.
No bump for off topic.

>>2413982
It works when the audience is familiar with Japanese. If you watch anime for ten years you won't learn to read or speak but you will pick up a lot of phrases.

>>2414003
The audience is only picking up basic grade-school level phrases and even then most fan subs just do them literally or don't bother translating them at all so they don't actually understand what they think they understand.

>>2413791
>Anyways it's better to use emulators (quick save states, graphics improvements, etc) so the game not working on a reals PSX is not a big deal :^)

God what a faggot. Just admit you did a poor hackfest of a port and don't have the skills to make it work on the real thing and shitty hackfest "enhanced" emulators

>>2413663
>japanese aint as colorful and diverse as english

That isn't the issue. The issue is that literal translations typically only convey direct meaning, rather than the intended "character" of the language.

>>2413846
>ePSXe
>accurate
>supporting closed source emulation

>>2414021
who cares, stallman
does it work?

Why is everybody assuming this is a super literal translation? I can tell most of you have never heard of this project until literally today. From all the snippets I've seen, they took care to make sure the dialogue flows well and doesn't sound repetitive and dry, while making sure the original message is kept intact. A lot of dialogue in this game was weird, incorrect, or outright made little to no sense. This mod fixes that overall.

>>2414028

>Leno
>Yrena

>>2414027
It works on Xebra and No$PSX. If you want to be the one to test it on ePSXe then by all means.

>>2414028
They're more concerned about changes made to names/items/places than the actual quality of the story dialogue. So they'll never play it.

>>2414031
There was an explanation for Leno. I can't remember what it was, but it was more than just "lol i don't know L from R". Similar story with Yrena.

>>2414031
Hey guys, got a terrific show for you tonight. Our guests today are Glean, the chocobo breeder and Ballett the leader of the resistance. But lets hear it for our moguri band!

>>2414035
fair enough

>>2414038

See:
>>2413767

He's using some promotional documents as "official sources". But these are just as filled with Engrish and bad translations. It's clearly supposed to be "Elena". "Reno" I'm not 100% sure on, but Reno makes more sense than "Leno".

>>2414031
The names of characters, items, places, etc. are the only truly literal retranslations in the project, and they made a concession to those who don't like them by making said translations optional.

You have no leg to stand on.

>>2414028
This happens all the time with fan translations. People critique it compared to the original localization and never provide anything more than words of discontent. If they could do their own research and back up their feelings with cross-references to source materials in the original language and any mytholgy references I can deal, but until then...

>>2414042

Under rated post.

>>2414048
Except the only thing people have critiqued in comparison to the official localization so far in this thread are the names of characters and such. Which are optional. No one so far has critiqued the real meat of the mod, which is the script.

>ITT mod makers getting incredibly defensive

>>2414046
>clearly supposed to be
>not 100% sure on
>makes more sense
I think there might be a problem. I don't particularly like them either, but Yrena and Leno ARE real names used by real people.

>>2414061
Which most will never do because that would require actual knowledge of Japanese. You really think anyone who's complaining knows it? If they did they wouldn't be so hostile or at least be more objective and go through it themselves.

What a bunch of ass-clowns

and this time I dont mean the dear anons from /vr/

>>2414046
He is using various promotional stuff, Ultimania, etc., but there was another reason also. IIRC it was because Leno is Latin for "pimp" or "seducer" so it seemed likely that is why his name was that in the first place.

This stuff was all researched beyond simply official promotional stuff, that was only one source among many. I asked him about some of this stuff before and he explained his reasoning.

Don't get me wrong, I still prefer canon, but it's definitely more than just the official sources. He's as aware as anyone there's Engrish in there, and had to sort out what was Engrish and what was on purpose. And if people can provide a more reasonable explanation than "this sounds better" he's pretty good about taking input for future releases.

>>2414069
>I think there might be a problem. I don't particularly like them either, but Yrena and Leno ARE real names used by real people.

And later Square contradicts this. And they even say "Reno" in the film and other animations.

So what's more likely?

>Option 1: They went with very obscure names like "Leno" and "Yrena", but then changed it to match the English localizations

or

>Option 2: The early promotional material was made by people with poor English skills and it's a mistake which was later corrected

Option #2 is more likely.

>>2413985
Japanese: ノコギリ
Original: Sawback
Retranslation: Nokogiri

Nokogiri sure as fuck isn't an established loanword and it literally means saw. Nonsensical change.

Japanese: クライムハザード
Original: Climhazzard
Retranslation: Crime Hazard

Geez guys it doesn't mean crime. The guy goes up striking with his sword, what do you do when climbing? Go up. Retranslation makes no sense, original is closer to meaning.

>>2414069
Well, you'd think everyone on this thread was super knowledgeable on what makes a good translation, given all the talk of dry, awkward, or repetitive dialogue. And sure, such translations exist (see: the original FFVI fan retranslation), but from everything I've seen, they avoided doing that here.

But yeah, with the exception of a couple people with personal disagreements on whether they should have taken Leno and Yrena at face value, it's mostly a bunch of people knee-jerking.

I actually don't mind retranslations. You can never 100% literally translate anything; meaning is always lost. I like to browse/play different translations if possible, just to see the different takes on the story. Not a fan of the literal name translations, but again, it's just an alternate view.

FF7's original PS1 translation was actually pretty terrible: there were a TON of grammatical errors and there were somewhat major plot points that got messed up due to poor/unclear translation.

>>2413929
the DeJap translation of Phantasia is probably my favorite thing ever, as dumb as it is

As long as literally every sentence doesn't end in an ellipsis it'll be better than the official translation...

>>2414084
>and there were somewhat major plot points that got messed up due to poor/unclear translation.

Yeah, I get that sense too, though I don't know enough.

Can someone point to lines of dialogue or screenshots with deeper explanations?

>>2414083
From where I sit it seems like nobody is complaining about the game translation itself, but rather the arbitrary changes to established names. It's been moogle for LITERALLY every game in the series. We're talking over 40 games. So why change it to moguri? That's just stupid and changing stuff for no reason.

>>2414078
Hazzard would be more fitting for ハッザド.

>>2414094
You can disable the name changes if you don't like them. This has been stated like five times throughout this thread. I don't really like Moguri either, but if it's accurate, it's accurate, and it was retranslated accordingly for consistency, and left up to the user to take it or leave it.

>>2414078

>クライムハザード, Kuraimu Hazādo

So you have a few lines of evidence you should look at. Every other game has called it "Climhazzard". Now were those games simply copying FF7's bad translation or is it accurate? I would lean towards accurate.

Guessing from the pronounciation, it would be "Kurim-Hazard". Crime Hazard could work, but Climhazzard also works.

>>2414094
Because they said they weren't taking any established English canon in later games into account. As said before, the translation was done as if FFVII was its own game with no pre-existing connections. And that's not so farfetched considering each FF is their own universe baring a few.

>>2414093
I don't have screenshots or exact lines on hand, but pretty much the entire sequence in Cloud's subconscious was much clearer in the retranslation. Among other things, the word "clone" has all but been abolished because it's completely wrong. Cloud was a copy of Sephiroth in that they tried to make another Sephiroth using a similar method, through injection of Jenova cells (albeit still different, because Sephiroth received Jenova cells in the womb). The original translation does a terrible job explaining this, but it's much clearer in retranslation. Also, the nature of Cloud's memory (he's pretty much remembering himself in Zack's place for events he was present for, but was not a SOLDIER because he never made it in so he was just a low-ranking grunt) is much better explained.

>>2413672
>. Honeywood also added extra pieces of dialogue to add personality to the protagonists.
He seems like a pretty cool guy, if anything.

That is, if you're living in the US. In Europe (at least outside of Britain) they've always been called moguris that I remember (Of course, we only got games from 7 onwards, but you get the point).

>>2414124
Yet, I got that all when I first played it when I was 11

>>2414130
No, that's bad. Translations should not add things that weren't there originally.

>>2414094

What, so Moogle is actually supposed to be like, Moogli? Or... Mowgli?

>>2414093
It's going to take me some time to find images but some that I can say right now are:

1. The first boss, Barret says, "Attack when the tail is up!" When it should actually tell you to NOT attack when the tail is up.

2. Tseng in the Temple of the Ancients, the translation is unclear, and a lot of people understood it as he died when the Keystone gets used to open the Temple.

3. Around the same part as 2, Aeris says something that makes it sound like she and Tseng are the same age, "since we were little." It should be "since I [Aeris] was little."

>>2414118
Their own universe with interconnecting items and names.
That'd be like calling him 'Sid' because "it's more accurate".

>>2414124
Another thing the retranslation helps make clearer is the identity of the voice inside Cloud's head. Throughout the first half of the game, you occasionally see Cloud internally talking to someone, or hear someone else's voice. It's implied that this is the real Cloud within the messed up Cloud's subconscious, but the dialogue is weird and makes it a bit hard to figure out, at least early on in the game. I actually remember people used to argue whether it was Sephiroth, Jenova, or Aerith that was talking to him.

>>2414145
At least it finally makes sense to me why it gets shorted to Mog.

That makes fuck all sense from Moogle.

>>2414116
Kuraimuhazahdo

>>2414145
It's supposed to be "mole-bat"

>>2414116
I think ライ is still prounced as 'rai' like 'rye'. As is the case in another English word in katakana: ライバル [raibaru], rival. So maybe it was meant to be Climbhazzard, but Crimehazard works just as well.

As >>2414097 pointed out, I think hazzard would be more appropriate had the katakana used a chiisai tsu. I believe it's just hazard here. It can go either way, so whatever; we have no idea unless the original writer say flat out what it is in English. But later games taking it on might be an indication.

I can assure you that the kana for "Elena" is not what FF7 uses. We knew from the start that it was more along the lines of "Irina". In fact, that's what I originally used until the Official Establishment File showed us what the true name was. The sound is roughly the same. Elena is incorrect.

>>2414146
>1. The first boss, Barret says, "Attack when the tail is up!" When it should actually tell you to NOT attack when the tail is up.

Actually what he says is:

>Line 1: Attack when the tail is up

>big pause

>and it will counter attack

There's a big pause, so people think he's done talking and attack. The issue is dialogue boxes timing in battle, which work differently than the regular game.

As for "Crime Hazard", I originally had it as "Climb Hazard but was vetoed by my translator who is more confident (given that he understands Japanese culture) that this is Crime Hazard. If you read the document I made, you will see this is explained.

>>2414158

I prefer the idea they named him after a Jungle Book character, personally.

>>2414162
It's actually "Attack while its tail is up! It's gonna counter attack with its laser!", not "and it will counter attack". I believe they corrected that in the PC version, though.

>>2414162
Still, it shouldn't have that ! in there. If it was phrased "If you attack when the tail is up," then people would've waited for the second line instead of just attacking immediately.

>>2414171
The only crime hazard is this botch job of a translation you spergs are peddling.

>>2414162
It's not just that it's a pause. The dialogue goes as such:

>Attack while it's (sic) tail's up!

>It's gonna counterattack with its laser.

That implies that you should attack it while the tail is up, OR it will hit you with a laser. Of course, he does state it will COUNTERattack, so in that sense it doesn't make sense to attack it, but that's precisely why that dialogue was problematic.

>>2414171

Sounds like your translator was being a try-hard know-all weeb to me. I think your more logical approach makes a lot more sense.

After first i thought WOW AWESOME

then I noticed all the mistakes and realized how clueless these re-"translators" really are.

OH well , at least it's free.

Well, you can deal with, troll. Because no-one is paying any attention to anything you have done or will do ;)

>>2414161
I think it really depends how one pronounces "Elena", but yes, the kana the game more closely resembles "Irina" than "Elena". Yrena is fine to me.

>>2414190
>Well, you can deal with, troll.

English, hello?

>>2414141
But what I quoted specifically said it was to add more personality to the characters, which is good.
The characters were fun in FF7, if part of this is because of mistranslation/added dialogue, I can't help but feel some characters/plots are much more dry in the original.

>>2414190
This is the guy translating the game in ENGLISH. Wow, huge boost of confidence this gives me in this project.

Sounds like your translator was being a try-hard know-all weeb to me. I think your more logical approach makes a lot more sense.

==========

Is that really the most logical thing you can come up with? Doesn't "Works as a translator in Japan" make for better reasoning? I.e, he understands better than either of us what a Japanese person / game writer might be getting at. Also, you clearly have no idea how Kana works.

>>2414194
The thing is, right - and get this:

Elena is a name.

>>2414197
>>2414206
Nothing wrong with that sentence? Colloquial.

>>2414210
So are Irina and Yrena. What's your point? You know variations of names exist in other cultures, right?

>>2414189
>then I noticed all the mistakes and realized how clueless these re-"translators" really are.

Care to back that up with some facts?

This thread is going to turn into a shitstorm now

>>2414190
PROTIP: If you don't like trolls, don't respond to them. That's like, Internet Culture 101.

>>2414218

because translator-san is getting defensive and responding to everything.

>>2414218
As does every retranslation discussion. Par for the course.

>>2414207

I don't think anyone would complain if it was called "Climb Hazard", as it actually makes sense. You might *think* the Japanese were trying to say "Crime Hazard", and maybe they were, but I suspect this was a misunderstanding on their part as well. You might as well just leave it as "Climhazzard" rather than try to second-guess what they were trying to say.

>>2414219
But if you don't address intentional misinformation, people will think it's true

>>2414213
>Well, you can deal with, troll.
>colloquial
Holy shit, you showed to us you don't know Japanese AND English. Not sure if troll hack or just plain stupid.

This better not be some BR trying to translate from Japanese to English

The thing is, right - and get this:

Elena is a name.
---------

What about "Yamski", "Aerith", "Nanaki", "Elmyra", "Ifalna", and dozens more. They aren't names, they were made up by writers who wanted to be original. And it's the same with Yrena. Yrena is what they intended because the kana matches and because the Official Establishment File agrees. So, until you can provide me with some better reasoning, it won't be changed. I am so sorry :P

>>2414216
Context clues. The character doesn't particularly have any Icelandic or Romanian influences.

>>2414218
It will be if DPLB keeps responding. It's gonna be like the Squarepusher debacle from a year or so back.

>>2414228
Addressing misinformation is fine. What isn't fine is acknowledging people blatantly flaming and baiting. That just encourages them to keep doing so, and guarantees a shitstorm. Again, see Squarepusher.

>>2414230
Click on the post number to make a proper reply, and use > to quote.

>like so

Just for everyone's convenience.

So many great untranslated Japanese games out there, even from squaresoft, and you have to go and do this. And the kicker is that it's worse than the original translation.

God damn it.

If your tism is gnawing at you that hard, just clean up some of the spelling, grammar and wording to make the story flow a bit better. Outright renaming shit is stupid, especially for a game that everyone and their grandmother has played.

>>2414230
>So, until you can provide me with some better reasoning, it won't be changed. I am so sorry :P

Change? Wouldn't imagine you would anyway. It won't make any difference. I won't play your translation anyway and the shitstorm you're stirring isn't particularly making me want to try it.

Thanks for playing though

>>2414248
>So many great untranslated Japanese games out there, even from squaresoft, and you have to go and do this.

I don't think we would have gotten any kind of quality work from this guy/team. No loss.

Don't worry, I am only here to fix up this ridiculous misinformation. I may even post some of these exchanges on the official thread to make my point about the issues with altering "canon". I'd much rather have people who go through the game and give some positive feedback. In any case, I have already had another Japanese speaker run through the game, and another has also just started. So far, there have been very few issues. I am more than willing to change things if there is a good source that we are wrong. I'm afraid that "YOUR TRANSLATOR SUCKKKKKKKSSS" is not it haha

>>2414229
This is why there was a proofreading pass helmed by not-DLPB.

>>2414227
Yeah I was the one that posted the climhazzard thing in the first place and think Climb Hazard would be fine.

And speaking as someone who actually knows the language you guys are shitting on the translation a bit too much. There are tons of good changes there too, and they do well outnumber the bad ones. It's just that the bad localization choices kinda stand out and make you question the translation of the actual script. Some changes like the "cold snap" to fucking "finger freeze" and of course the aforementioned moguri stuff seem unnecessary and simply worse than the original.

Also I'd take a look at the actual scripts before judging the whole project, I guess.

The best thing about the original localization is that Chocobos say 'WARK'.

'kweh' sounds gay as hell

The reason "Finger Freeze" is used is because of the enemy design and because that is what the Japanese says. It's not a blind choice.

The translation I grew up with > all others

>>2414257
>I am more than willing to change things if there is a good source that we are wrong
Yeah, you seem real approachable and you aren't at all coming off like a dick

>>2414275
Sarcasm aside, the early translations DID have more character to them.
IE. Kefka's ridiculous statements and Earthbound's entire translation.

Oops, sorry. Cefca.

qhimm

Oh man I remember them. That forum was pretty toxic, filled with elitist spergs. Basically my first encounter with /v/.

Haha i'll stay away from this.

>>2414278
Well there has to be a source. I've been following this project for a few years, and I've seen he is usually a dick to people who say it's worse without providing an explanation or just go by which sounds better, but is quite open to people who can provide a solid explanation, especially if it's a reference to norse or hebrew mythology, which ff7 is full of.

>>2414278
>Yeah, you seem real approachable and you aren't at all coming off like a dick

No problem, you can deal with, troll.

>>2414280
Localized Kefka was so superior to original Cefca that his Dissidia version was based upon the localized character rather than the original.

>>2414270
It sounds retarded is my point. Find something better. Making it "ice blast" or something would be fine, even if it drops the finger part. You can probably infer it from the animation anyway, and your translation is already dropping the shot part.

How do you justify something like the "nokogiri" change earlier?

>>2414290
>It sounds retarded

Why?

>>2414278
>>2414284
With all the negative posts before he even made an appearance you can sort of guess what incited his reaction. Then again, he's faced this for years since beginning the project. But you're right. He's very open to those who provide constructive feedback that isn't all "this is shit, you're wrong". Heck, there's still on-going changes even though it's "released".

>>2414284
Translation =/=Localisation.

If the context can't be translated you have to make it work for your audience.

>>2414301
>you can sort of guess what incited his reaction.
How very professional.

>>2414280
A lot of Earthbound had to be carefully localized because it was Japanese-centric: cultural jokes, puns/idioms, alliteration, etc. They did a good job localizing it but it still has some errors/unclear text.

Very long article (it covers the entire game), but worth the read if you're into that kind of thing:
legendsoflocalization.com/earthbound/

>>2414290
Because Nokogiri is a Japanese saw. Not a westernized saw. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_saw Although, I wouldn't really have a problem either way. I chose Nokogiri to retain the Japanese influence. I always try to retain the correct origin because to do otherwise would, in my opinion, dilute the art of the game.

The Japanese writers of FF7 use a lot of English phrases and influences, and they are retained as well. It's only fair that all cultures are retained as the writers wanted.

>>2414310
Why not just change it to 'Japanese Saw Fish' instead? Sounds much better imo, and really fits the direction of this translation.

>>2414310
Fair enough. Context clues. I get it. But why one rule for some, another for others?

Consistency is a huge part of translation

>>2414315
Japan doesn't exist in FF7 and that would be a very strange name to give inside the game regardless. Also verbose.

>>2414310
>"It's super special and must not be touched because it's JAPANESE"
Congrats, you're the worst kind of weeaboo hack fansubber.

You know what they call the "nokogiri" in the real world? A Japanese saw.

>>2414304
I agree to an extent, but there's a fine line. The last thing anyone wants is for it to turn into the likes of a 4Kids abomination.

Generally speaking, if something is Hebrew or Norse in origin, it'd be just as foreign to an average Japanese audience as to an American or English audience, if not far more so. It's one thing to replace or contextualize these things when they are explicitly Japanese in the first place, but it'd be ridiculous to say Sephiroth should be named Craig just because most Americans have never heard of the Kabbalah, where he gets his name from.

>>2414310
There's your problem.
Take a look at the Mother 3 translation. Yes he stayed true to the Japanese dialogue. BUT he also stayed true to the earthbound heritage and made thing flow better. A good example is the hybrid cow-snake. In japanese it was called cow-snake. But he LOCALIZED it as 'Cattle-Snake'. It's not accurate, but it's better. You see?
You've just translated, not localized and ignored the heritage.

>>2414323
But Wutai resembles Japan. Just retranslate Wutai as Japan and add in some quick flavor text lore!

>>2414310
Ah yes, the fact the saw is a pullsaw means that you have to change the word. After all, the direction of the pull makes a massive difference in the context of the game.

It's not possible that the creator just used the Japanese word for saw because he was unfamiliar with western saws. No, the deep significance of the direction of the stroke must be kept, even if you have to make the translation nonsensical to 99% of the audience.

>>2414326
Oh no, absolutely. It reminds me of the Gintama arguments.

Keep it bang on and do a text wall that explains it all or do what Viz did and just rework the puns and jokes.

I'd rather have the latter to be honest.

It's the little things in this like Choco Bill.

>>2414310
All saws are called nokogiri in Japanese, it's not refererring especially to a Japanese saw. If you click the link to Japanese wiki on the page you posted it'll link to a page specifically for the Japanese saws. Here's the normal saw page: https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E9%8B%B8

There's absolutely no indication it's one of the Japanese variants in the game, and indeed anyone seeing the word in isolation would just think of a saw in general.

And how many English speakers playing the game are actually going to know what that word means? It's a failure of a localization. If you insist its one of the Japanese variants in the game you should just rename it "Japanese saw".

>>2414327
This guy gets it

>>2414341
B-but Japanese words sound cooler anon...

We're confident that we've got the balance correct. At the end of the day, there will always be people who disagree on something or other. I'm satisfied with the job we have done and it's up to each one of you whether you play our version, and whether you like it.

https://github.com/simias/psx-sdk-rs/issues/1
So what's the plan there? Could you use GCC or Visual Studio?

>>2414352
>We're confident that we've got the balance correct

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree and move on with our lives.

>>2414353
I don't think the person who ported the translation to PSX, green_goblin, is lurking this thread (or at least he isn't posting). DLPB only worked on the PC version.

>>2414352
>there will always be people who disagree on something or other
Yeah, but is there anybody who actually AGREE with the whole saw thing?
It doesn't make sense, it's basically left untranslated. If somebody is playing the game and is not familiar with the Nokogiri word, how are they supposed to know?
I wasn't familiar with the word until now in this very thread.

>>2414350
You should look forward to my retranslation of FF6 with Edgar and his chain nokogiri. Or maybe I should make it rotating nokogiri to stay closer to the Nipponese roots.

>>2414335
Pretty sure Wutai was meant to resemble China more than Japan.

>>2414352
>We're confident that we've got the balance correct.
>There will always be people who disagree on something or other.
>I'm satisfied with the job we have done
>It's up to each one of you whether you play our version, and whether you like
Pick one. Stop flip flopping.

Have you got the balance right? If you had then surely this discussion wouldnt exist. Your even expecting to be controversial. That's hardly balance is it.

>>2414365
Doubtful; the island is shaped like inverted Japan.

>>2414359
Wouldn't it just be like anything else foreign that takes cultural/mythological influence in the game? You chalk it up to fantasy.

>>2414365
I guess it's a mix, taking influences from both.

>>2414365
>>2414371
And while were on the subject of Wutai - shouldn't it be Yufi if were keeping the Japanese feel?

>>2414369
Stop trying to talk to him, he doesn't even type in proper English.

>>2414384
That's the worst idea i've ever heard. Just keep her name in the original Kanji, keep with the projects direction you baka..err I mean idiot.

>>2414378
But the "nokogiri" in question is just a fucking saw. It's basically the japanese word used to refer to that ordinary object.
It's not like "Nokogiri" is an ancient creature/youkai or an object directly rooted to Japanese culture like, say, Masamune.
It's just a goddamn saw.

>>2414359
Yes, my translator and some others on Qhimm who I've debated issue such as this. As I said before, I am not totally against the idea of using saw (it's not a big deal), but I've made the decision (as I have done countless times) based on the debate and discussion with the translator.

>>2413929
How do you fuck like a tiger anyway? You tear off their face with your claws and then maul them to death?

>>2414403
So it was a bunch of weebs on a forum debating on how to spell the word correctly in Japanese. Rather than, let's say, a larger forum like reddit or gamefaqs.

Cool!

>>2414398
If they used nokogiri to just mean any saw, wouldn't they have used the kanji? The game uses katakana (which is used for emphasis on already Japanese words), so surely the writers wanted it to stand out to Japanese players in some way?

>>2414384
I thought it was, at first, but the Official Establishment File shows "Yuffie". So again, that's the authority until a better source (like the writers) comes along.

>>2413942
>If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

So what you are saying is that the FF7 translation is not broken, just off course?

>>2414393

>>2414420
Not that guy, but replacing one sack of bullshit with another sack of bullshit doesn't make things better.

>>2414415
That's a point my translator also made. They seem to want this word used because the enemy is likely based on a JAPANESE saw.

>>2414412
Because reddit or GameFAQs are any better authorities on the matter? All you need are people who are Japanese or know the language to a more than conversational level.

>>2414415
The kanji for nokogiri is outside the typical school set, something like number ~2700 and you only learn 2100.

So it's more likely that they avoided using the kanji because most kids playing wouldn't recognise it.

>>2414426
'Eastern Saw Fish' there, can we PLEASE move on now. Holy autism Batman.

>>2414420

Heh. That's why my idea would be to:

>Use original script as base
>fix grammar and spelling errors
>Fix blatant translation errors
>Touch up a few spots if needed
>Align names of items/magic/etc with other FF games

Like 90% of it would be the same. I think this is the best approach.

btw, what's the translation for "Let's mosey" ? Probably something dry like "let's get out of here".

>>2414417
Oh yeah, those Japanese sources are well known for consistency.

Christ "official" spellings in manga change all the time, even if they are clearly written down.

By the way. Had a read of your thread.
Love the way you go from calling yourself professional on page 1
>So if we had been the original localizers, and the version that you grew up with was our version (which is far more accurate and professional), you'd now be defending our version. People have the choice to play the original game if they don't like our relocalization.
To absolute stubborn childishness by page 56
>The good news is, this project is not going away. It's here to stay and there are going to be 2 sets of people...

>1. Those who are open minded and want to play something that makes sense
>2. Those who moan and insult and stay angry

Can't wait til Square hire you for real!

>>2414415
Never played Pokemon in Japanese, have you?

>>2414429
Yeah this, it's hard to read for most people.

They leave out or substitute some other kanji too. Take for example 観らん車 which should be 観覧車. By the way it means ferris wheel, not gondola like the retranslators seem to think. https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%A6%B3%E8%A6%A7%E8%BB%8A That's not a fucking gondola.

>>2414310
I'm sorry to contribute anything to this horrible thread, but you should look at the corresponding page under the Japanese version of Wikipedia from the language sidebar. It brings you to a page titled 日本の鋸 (Japanese saw). The actual page about nokogiri in https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E9%8B%B8 has everything from chainsaws to modern hacksaws.

Old native japanese vocabulary broadening to encompass dual meanings including both native Japanese and Western or worldwide versions of something and losing their "domestic" flavor as a result is pretty commonplace.

>>2414426
I'm not familiar with the game, but aren't most skills in katakana anyway?

Here's an image of the enemy. If you take the front bit to be the handle, then hilariously, this can't possibly be a nokogiri. The teeth are the wrong way round. It'd cut on the push, not the pull.

Final Fantasy is boring let's talk about Chrono Trigger. Who's your favorite character? Mine is Kaeru.

>>2414458
Nuh-huh, DLPB, you're not changing the subject of your own ad-thread.

>>2414429
Interesting.

>>2414443
I haven't, but knowing how the game's written I see your point. Which raises a question. Do games targeted at older audiences still resort to kana for words whose kanji is outside the typical set taught in schools?

>>2414457
It's a chainsaw.

>>2414467
'No Life'

How apt.

>>2414467
>and the key throwing away.

Someone PLEASE give this bozo a English textbook.

>>2414463
>Nuh-huh, DLPB, you're not changing the subject of your own ad-thread.

Well, I made the thread because I saw the news article on romhacking.net, and it would generate some interesting discussion. Some of it is interesting, some of it petty flaming. All in all, good thread. I've learned a few things, grew as a person.

>>2414453
You didn't have to, I already pointed it out earlier.

>>2414467
LOL.

>>2414464
If it's intended for older audiences then they'll include more advanced kanji, but "all ages" games like Final Fantasy will limit themselves to the commonly known ones. See >>2414429

Pokemon typically avoids kanji completely because their target audience are kids. Gen 5 got some attention (more than the usual for Pokemon) because they included kanji for the first time, and that was just the basics.

>>2414458
my favorite is Crono

>>2414468
>>2414470
>>2414473
Remember, he's approachable and open to suggestions!

JANIRORS, MODS HERE HERE

IF YOU READ THIS, PLEASE STICKY!!!

>>2414467
I have actually been defending this mod for the most part, but this, my friend, is a huge mistake. You're painting yourself as a huge target for further hate. Shit like this only invites further dismissal of your project, and not just here.

>in b4 i don't care

You wouldn't have come here if you didn't. Again, it's fine if it's purely to dispel misinformation, which there is a lot of, but you must have thick skin if you're going to do so.

>>2414467
>Oh, that thread above is a 4chan... so say no more.

>>2414465
That too.

>>2414467
>gets BTFO
>everyone but me is wrong!
Kek.

I get that this is just one small example, but if something this simple was totally mistranslated, then chances are pretty good the rest of the translation is the same terrible dry trash.

We could have had an actual game translated instead of a re-translation of a title with fairly minor issues.

>>2414474
The reason they started including kanji with Gen 5 is because they had enough room to store them in memory thanks to the DS, and keep the old hiragana mode.

>>2414453
>Old native japanese vocabulary broadening to encompass dual meanings including both native Japanese and Western or worldwide versions of something and losing their "domestic" flavor as a result is pretty commonplace.
Commonplace around the world in every language, unless people start using loan words.

>>2414116
>not grim hazard

Don't worry guys.

He's edited it to include things we didn't say or mentioned what we DID say without the context

>>2414467

>>2414495
>I get that this is just one small example, but if something this simple was totally mistranslated, then chances are pretty good the rest of the translation is the same terrible dry trash.

All of the items, locations, spells, etc. are like this, but the dialogue is pretty solid. I think the goals were different for the dialogue for some reason, like the dialogue is localized and the non-dialogue is translated. I don't know why they did this but the dialogue parts are definitely much better.

Hey DPLB where you at? I can't see you no more, dumb bitch

Come on, share more of those superior interpretations of japanese characters of yours. We're lowly peasants compared to your awesomeness.

>>2414502
That'd be グリム, it's クライム.

>>2414506
"Better than a dream"

Oh and Nokogiri-kun, looks like you didn't make any friends either

>>2414506
Hey now, those 6000 posts on a final fantasy forum get all the bitches wet.

>>2414506

>>2414484

He sounds incredibly defensive and childish.

>>2414504

>Zeng
>Aerith
>Zax

Yet no one mentioned those examples at all.

>>2414508
Yeah, it's strange. Problematic dialogue is always run through others in the forum, and welcomes changes to fit "American English" and such, but the rest is handled differently.

>>2414467
>No life
kek

You know, I actually felt bad for dlpb at first.
I mean, despite some questionable decisions, this project required a lot of work and he was showing some serious effort.
But then this.
Like damn, most of us were actually being pretty reasonable for fuck's sake.

>>2414525
Someone made a thread about the retranslation on neogaf. It devolved into several pages of people bitching about "Aerith", without any discussion about more legitimate problems.

>I am of the opinion that this is the origin.

BASED ON WHAT?!

Accurate and professional, ladies and gents!

Thank you, DPLB, for running a clinic on how to burn bridges and invite further grief upon yourself.

>>2414171
Some shit should just be untouched.

What did you change Braver too? BLAVER?

Special skills and magic and shit doesn't need to be changed. Did you change Magic Breath to Magic Bubbles? Matra Magic to Missile Barrage? Why?

The entirety of this thing just screams pointless.

Whats Sled Fang? Whats Lunatic Howl?

Its stupid, and worthless. Face it, you wasted your time. If I'm going to play FF7 I'm going to play FF7 and not waste my time modding it and running it on an emulator.

I liked VII when it was originally planned to be Cloud, BULLET and AERTIH in Midgar. That's better than this thread.

>>2414532
To be fair, "bullet" makes absolutely zero sense. You have to realise that on worthless faggot forums like that, you can't just post "you're a fucking moron, kid" unless you want to get banned for hurting someone's feelings.

His dependency on this Establishment File as some kind of bible is top kek material, though. Not like the nips have a long history of fucking up romanisation or anything.

>>2414517
Damn, I'm so sorry DLPB good sir. I'd discuss the mistranslations (or possible lack of, what do I know) in the actual script if there was a side to side comparison page for that. Is there?

PDLB, you motherfucker you.

>>2414545
If Barret's name isn't Tyrone this retranslation isn't worth playing.

>>2414529
Agreed. I have my misgivings, but I respect his work nonetheless, and overall the mod looks very solid and well-made.

But this shit cannot fly. He KNEW there would be haters. Why enable them and turn to shitflinging and whining? Grow thicker skin, for fuck's sake. If you are confident about your work, you will take in constructive criticism (which he has done before), and ignore the retards. But it seems he isn't capable of the latter.

>>2414546
It seems like all of his comparisons are between bad text in the original translation, and "good" text in the new one. It could be that the bad one is far more accurate to the original Japanese, aside from minor grammatical issues, but we'll never know because the comparisons are all between translations.

>>2414550
If there isn't a new subplot where Aetriths and Teefa sleep with Tyrone, I'm not playing this shit.

>>2414545
>His dependency on this Establishment File as some kind of bible is top kek material, though.

As is his bad English. He's not a native English speaker. I read all his posts with a Russian accent. This is the guy in charge of translating something to English?

>>2414558
>If there isn't a new subplot where Aetriths and Teefa sleep with Tyrone, I'm not playing this shit.
Cuckoldus please leaveu.

>>2414539
Ironically, everything you said was left as is if you checked. So settle down.

I can't find the thread with the autistic Cait-removal-self-insert patch, was that deleted?

>>2414529
>Like damn, most of us were actually being pretty reasonable for fuck's sake.
I was serious about the Yufi thing! That Establishment File can't be taken seriously at all. They haven't been written or translated by anyone who can translate. Japanese manga and game Data Books are RIFE with mistake.

Pic related was in an officially licensed One Piece game but that doesn't make the character's name Flanky when it's clearly meant to be Franky.

If it's more serious and in with her clearly Japanese influenced origin then it should be Yufi.

>>2414565
Look, why re-translate it if you aren't going to fix some of the issues? It's obvious that a sissy crossdresser like Kuraudo would never get laid. It's important to make it clearer, the chicks are only there for Tyrone.

>>2414564
He's a native UK English speaker. Pretty strong regional dialect as well as occasionally careless typist, which is why there was another person proofreading his work. The dialogue in the game does not have the same problems as his forum posts.

>>2414567
Oh, so they only intentionally chose to fuck up SOME things.
Ok then.

>>2414546
>>2414558
You can ask for the Japanese, and translated scripts in their thread. They seem to welcome anyone knowledgable in Japanese to have a go at them.

>>2414564
Lackluster translations like this supposed retranslation is what happens when you get someone who doesn't speak either language natively.

Looking back on the project, which I've been following since its genesis, it's actually rather hilarious. All the grandstanding and promises of high quality, all culminating into... this.

Show yourself, DPBL, you're not fooling anyone.

>>2414576
>Kuraudo

Why do Nips do this anyways? I never got this. They use an English word, but instead of saying it like English speakers would, they spell it weird and add "o" or "u" to the end. And with their thick accents it becomes unrecognizable.

Why can't they just not do that?

>>2414592
>I'm ignorant to how growing up with another language works; English is so easy!

Do you need one of those other hacks to use the translation?

>>2414553
<Why enable them and turn to shitflinging and whining? Grow thicker skin, for fuck's sake. If you are confident about your work, you will take in constructive criticism (which he has done before), and ignore the retards. But it seems he isn't capable of the latter.
This so much.

It's a mammoth task (albeit one that no one was asking for) but the promises of high quality, professional work and being open to suggestion and criticism just get flushed down the pan with all this.

I mean, surely he'd heard of us before. What did he think he was going to gain by coming here?

>>2414592
Their own language uses a specific set of syllables so they need to pronounce words not originally written with their syllabary in a way that they can represent with said syllabary.

'Kuraudo', etc. is their way of doing so

>>2414602
>shit. fucked up my green text

>>2414592
It's the way Japanese works. They can't pronounce a lot of shit, the language is heavily restricted, which is why they imported kanji to try and avoid the issues of having a million words pronounced the same that all mean different things.

And if they really intended for Kuraudo to be called "cloud", they would have just called him Kumo, the Japanese word for cloud. Another obvious mistranslation. Thank god we have re-translators to fix all these established names.

>>2414592
Nipanese is made up of compound sounds, where as we have individual sounds.

We can say "Cloud" they have to basically break it down phoenetically into their crazy system which would be KU RAU DO

To be fair, DLPB is not the one translating anything. He has translator with the qualifications for that. He only localizes the translation and shares the QA work with others.

>>2414592
>Why can't everyone speak english? DAMN JAPS!
Your amerifat is showing, retard

>>2413694
>getting mad because people are using their free time for something that doesn't directly benefit you

wow

>>2414618
>He has translator with the qualifications for that
>>He has translator

o hai PBLD

https://web.archive.org/web/20140928113219/http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=14914.0

>When finished, this mod will completely remove Cait Sith from the game in favour of a new human character called Iscar Matthias. Iscar is from Judus Iscariot, and Matthias was the apostle chosen to replace him. I have chosen these names to be symbolic of the character's betrayal, and change into a valued ally.

>>2414618
Isn't the translator a nip? They're the worst translators you can get, unless you've got a decent one who was born in America or some shit and grew up bilingual.

>>2414584
If the translations are not shit just make the script public. More eyes on the script should be a good thing. I'm not going to go on the dude's forum begging to be able to do free QC for him.

>>2414626
I thought a remote controlled cat riding a animatronic moogle was dumb. But this... this is some next level retard.

>>2413920
I agree, just fix the grammatical mistakes and add detail when it's lacking. Keep the color of the original translation

>>2414626

That's fan fiction tier shit right there.

>>2414619
>Someone posted something stupid, he must be American!

I'll put through a referral to have your naturalization papers expedited.

Betting all my money on this project being just a long and elaborate joke.

>>2414626
>I have actually had fanboys trying to rationalise the writing regarding Cait Sith. These people generally display an unbelievably poor understanding of fiction and writing (the usual excuse being "It's just fiction" *roll eyes*).

>>2414631
>>2414634
Oh shut up you trolls -_-

>>2414626
FWIW that was never going to be the same mod. But for some reason he puts all his mods into one collection even though that makes them harder to install separately or mix with other mods.

>>2414626

>>2414626
Guy defending the translation mod here. This was utterly hilarious and retarded. Apparently he's since given up on it, though.

>>2414637
It wasn't funny the first time when Sky Render did it for FF6 ten years ago.

Fucking romanians trying to make subtitles for games.

>>2413592
Jesus...this shot alone shows that the retranslation is garbage. Shinra Company? How natural sounding. Anyone gonna replay this on their PlayStation made by the Sony Company? By the way, I love my iPhone from the Apple Company and my car from the Toyota Company.

>>2414646
I'd love to know what made him change his mind on such a fantastic idea.

>>2414650
>District 7
Somebody been watching too many Hungry Games and District 9. Sector was fine. Sector made sense. It made it sound very post cyberpunk which is kind of what Midgar was.

District 7 Slums vs. Sector 7 Slums. The second one just rolls off the tongue.

>>2414649
>Yrena
You might be right

>>2414650
Not defending the retranslation, but referring to Shinra as "The Shinra" practically all the time in the original translation isn't much better.

>>2414657
>You might be right

Anons: 1

BPLD: 0

Could FF7 (and a number of other games, mind) use a better, more fleshed out translation? Probably.

Is this patch that translation?
No, I do not think so.

>>2414656
If I had to wager a guess, I'd say it was probably because "District" actually means this, whereas Sector is pretty much just used to distinguish regions like this in Star Trek. US has congressional districts, Japan has Akihabara district, etc.

>>2414665
>1
and the rest

Square just needs to do a proper retranslation themselves, like they've done for all the past games in the series like FFVI and FFV. They should get Alexander O. Smith to do the new translation.

>>2414667
The thing is, if you know that then you probably already know why and what's being left out so it'll make no benefit to you whatsoever. No ones really asking for these games to be retranslated past correcting little things like 'Off Course' and 'This guy are sick'. Maybe some people would like the spells to be in line with later releases (Bolt 2 becomes Thundara etc) but past that, no one really cares and if this thread has proved anything - there wont be one that will satisfy everyone.

So why bother?

Instead, like some people have suggested, why not concentrate their energies on translating and localising things that have never made it's way here.

Fucking hell, those Shining Force 3 Scenario 2 and 3 translations are so well done, they fall right in line with the style of the first scenario. Very little in the way of complaints

>>2414678
I heard that the original PC version (not the Steam one) had a better translation that at least fixed a good amount of typos.

I dont know the extent of the improvements or if any issues were introduced, but at least they showed they cared back in the day, when it really counted. Now it's too late to go back and do that.

>>2414689
>Instead, like some people have suggested, why not concentrate their energies on translating and localising things that have never made it's way here.

Well the thing is, nerds are obsessed with the games they grew up with. They're not obsessed with random un translated games.

It's like asking why nerds create de-specialized versions or fan cuts of Star Wars, which might take hundreds of hours of work, instead of doing something that might actually benefit other people.

Nerds gonna nerd is what I'm saying.

>>2414667
The issue is that.. unless the game just straight up didn't get released over here, the official translation is absolutely FINE. Seiken Densetsu 3 Fan Translation? Absolutely fine, since it was never and probably will never be released here.

I genuinely feel that the only time a translation like this is warranted is if the game wasn't released here or the translation was abysmal. And although tehre have been some awful ones, nothing I've seen is bad enough to warrant people wasting their fucking time on projects like these.

>>2413663
You shouldn't judge languages you apparently don't know.

>>2414689

You're not entitled to have those things translated. People can do whatever they want if you're not paying them.

>>2414691
The PC version does fix some of the more egregious errors, but I think they left most of the dialogue unchanged. There is a lot that could probably be written better or more clearly, but not to the point where the entire script needs to be re-translated. The whole thing seems like total overkill.

>>2414141
translation and localization are different things. When localizing a game you should definitely change and add things

>>2414714
So then they shouldnt mind if we shit on their pointless efforts.

>>2414718

Sure, just be sure you keep your shit opinions out of civilized places

>>2414715
>The whole thing seems like total overkill.

"Nerds gonna nerd"

You know there's STILL nerds tweaking and modding FF7 PC version? They've gotten to the point where they're making 3D models to create high definition versions of the backgrounds.

Just... like move on. The game is incredibly antiquated. Accept that. I adore it, but it's a PS1 game. An actual remake would need proper 3D backgrounds.

>>2414626
i need to find a rom with the fucking edgelord mod

like holy shit that sounds hilarious

>>2414721
>Just... like move on.
You're on /vr/.

>>2414721
It better keep the chibi characters, though.

>>2414729
>It better keep the chibi characters, though.

I thought they were going full Advent Children on that front.

To those following the project closely, please correct me if im wrong.

>>2414721
>>2414727
BTFO

>>2414689
Hacking the game for script extracting and inserting takes lots of effort. Translating from zero is also harder than retranslating based on an existing script. Frankly fan translators often kinda suck, as can be seen from this thread too.

And yeah retranslation's often a labor of love. I've been thinking of doing Wild Arms 1 and 2 just because the original translations suck so much. Especially 2. I'd like to have other people experience the games as they were meant to be.

>>2414732
I know there was one project that was promising to be a complete graphical overhaul, and it promised to keep the chibi models regardless, just with more detail and a higher polygon count.

>>2414714
Of course they can. I'm not telling anyone what to do and neither do I care if they do anything but they cant have their cake and eat it.

You can't be a thinskinned shit-flinger and use the word professional. You can't bill yourself as open to criticism and changes and ignore everything that comes at you as well as ignoring common sense.

It'll never achieve the balance it needs with that guy at the head. Not with what he's shown in here tonight.

>>2414734
>>2414727

I mean, I still play the game. But ACCEPT the fact it's a PS1 game. None of this half fan-remake stuff. Either it gets a full remake, or you leave the PS1 version alone.

>>2414732
No, they are not going AC with the models. Those are individual mods.

They should just take this German retranslation as basis for a new English translation. It's great.

http://www.romhacking.net/translations/2183/

>>2414742

>Giant game review that has nothing to do with the translation at all and is just gushing about the game

why?

>>2414729
>>2414732
>>2414738
Check out the Team Avalanche subforum on Qhimm near the bottom. If anything their efforts are certainly commendable.

>>2414732
For characters, it's really splintered. qhimm.com forum members pretty much make what they want, and there was at one point an effort to make higher quality models that retained the chibi style, but it was never finished.

In my opinion, this is the most annoying thing about the community. Everyone wants to start their own new projects that never get finished, so there's several dozen "realistic" Cloud models, but not really anything resembling a single collection of all the models in the game redone in a single, consistent style.

As for the backgrounds, that's one of the few team efforts out there, involving several people who are working to maintain a style that is consistent both with itself (the backgrounds look like they belong in the same game) as well as mostly consistent with the intent of the original game's look and feel. There is no associated character pack to go with this project though.

>>2414749
I'm just going to remake the entire game in Unreal Engine 4. Who's with me?

So, how many people who've passed judgment on this translation patch have actually played a significant amount of the game with this translation?

>>2414749

How many thousands of backgrounds are in the game though? How many decades are they gonna take redoing all of them?

We'll have full AI and VR by then. You can just tell the AI to create an experience set in the FFVII world if you wanted to.

>>2414757
Someone actually made a tech demo of FFVII using UE3.

>>2414757
Yeah! And lets make Aerith not die, and we can rename the Gold Saucer the Gold Sausage because it looks like a dick!
:^)

>>2414757
You'll probably get a C&D from Square Enix. Part of the reason the ff7 modding community has survived so long is because of a stubborn insistence of not providing any help for pirated copies of the game and actively promoting the game's sales. Were it not for that, they'd most likely see us as a threat, as they did with Chrono Resurrection.

If you wanna remake the game in UE4, I certainly won't complain; the game is in need of a proper remake. But be prepared for the inevitable legal action they'll take.

>>2414757
Yufi here. I'm in

>>2414757
>I'm just going to remake the entire game in Unreal Engine 4. Who's with me?

Enjoy your cease and dissist from Square. They shut down the full 3D Chrono Trigger remake project.

Honestly, if you're going through THAT much trouble just make an original game and story that highly mimics FFVII.

Remember me?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUY6uc4w3Zw

>>2414767
Starring Iscar Matthias

>>2414767
Original game? That wouldnt be a bad idea if my main intention wasn't to model a naked Tifa model and have her do naughty things in the game.

>>2414592
Turns out sounds which are foreign to your native language are pretty hard to pronounce no matter how easy they seem to you.

>>2414145
>Mowgli?
You looking for a lawsuit?

>>2414769
>tfw this would've been the PS3's best seller.
>instead we just got a colossal troll from SE

Whatever, SE can die.

>>2414592
I can't believe that somebody would actually be retarded enough to ask a question like this.

The 2D backgrounds only look sharp and clear on a CRT TV anyways. So just play the PS1 version.

ANd I'd never trust Square to make a decent full 3D remake anyways.

>>2414742

heh. I wonder if they called her "Yrena" too.

>>2414787
>implying they wouldn't have AC'ed the fuck out of the remake
>no more Honey Bee Inn
>now with more Genesis

>>2414592
They don't call him "Kuraudo", they call him クラウド. It's westerners that call him "Kuraudo".

>>2414742
>They should just take this German retranslation as basis


Dude, one of them barely knows the source language and the target language, you want to add a THIRD one he doesn't know?

>>2414794
Nah man, you underestimate Japan.
I think they'd keep the whole Don Corneo segment.

>>2414792
>heh. I wonder if they called her "Yrena" too.

Yup.
>“Elena” → “Yrena”

>>2414810
We obviously have to find another translator. I nominate the guy who did the BoF II retranslation since the source for that was also a German fantranslation.

>>2414814
I wouldn't doubt they'd keep it, and then the west would never get it due to muh ratings. Which means less money, which means no remake.

>>2414814
I remember seeing an interview where they state that today they couldn't get away with some of the shit they could back then, so a remake would probably remove some of the weirder or more risque things in the original.

>>2414794
>implying they wouldn't have AC'ed the fuck out of the remake
>now with more Genesis

This. They would add stupid fan fiction into it.

Square also doesn't seem to understand, at all the appeal of the game and setting. FF7 is heavily influenced by anime and looks like an anime. The realistic style doesn't fit it. It looks kinda bland.

And they'd add even more ridiculous and gravity-less combat like AC had too. I know the original could get a little out there, but AC is on another level of silly. The characters can basically fly.

>>2414825

The fan outrage would be too much. Everything would likely get grand-fathered in, in any case.

At most, the game would get an M rating, but that's totally pushing it.

page 1

>Marlene to Marin
>Reno to Leno
>Shera to Sierra
>Tseng to Zeng
>ZACK TO ZAX

What in the flying fuck is this even? There's canon accuracy that we've had for years, it's mostly the dialogue that was messy- and then there's trying to be so literal that one's essentially taking butchered versions of the Japanese pronunciations into English.

This isn't a clean translation, this is a short-sighted one that seems more like a personal project of some weirdo who's anal-retentive about his original Japanese content.

>>2414835
I really miss the manga style character portraits and designs Nomura had for this game. God knows why he couldn't have kept it for others.

>>2414925
oh god this, I agree so much with this

fuck Gackt to hell

>>2414912
Yeah no kidding.

>b-b-b-but Crisis Core isn't canon!!!

>>2414912
For the umpteenth time, the accurate name translations are optional. You can play with the original localized names.

>>2414939
>accurate name translations

>>2414939
>Accurate
>ZAX

For the umpteenth time, that Establishment File isn't an accurate source.

>>2414939
>the accurate name translations are optional.

Feels like a drop in an ocean, mister LBGT.

Ok, fine, "accurate". You know what I meant.

>>2413867
Translation is like a woman.
If it is beautiful, it is not faithful. If it is faithful, it is most certainly not beautiful.
-Yevgeny Yevtushenko / Guy who translated a shit ton of Russian poetry

>>2414912
>This isn't a clean translation, this is a short-sighted one that seems more like a personal project of some weirdo who's anal-retentive about his original Japanese content.
Bang on

I don't really care for this mod, but it's hilarious how triggered some of you motherfuckers get when someone dares to change something completely inconsequential about their precious Mongolian interactive puppet shows.

>>2414968
>I don't really care

Seems like you care enough to come here and post ad hominem.

>>2414968

Similar to stupid George Lucas changes to Star Wars actually.

>>2414971
I may not care about the mod, but I do care to be entertained. And you guys are doing a beautiful job of it.

>>2414972
That one's a bit different, because that came straight from the very same guy behind the originals, who has expressed such disdain for the original work that he has sworn never to re-release or preserve them beyond that one shitty Laserdisc rip, and actively awaits the day all the original VHS copies die. In this case, it's just a couple of fanboy weebs who wanted a more accurate translation and stepped on a couple of nostalgia toes in the process.

>>2414714
Theres a donate link on page 1 of their forum thread

>>2414981
>who wanted a more accurate translation

>>2414981
There's still a difference between 'accurate' and 'opinionated to literal'. Even Japanese materials conflict with these changes, despite them being pulled from numerous materials over the years. Something like Shera is kind of a big deal when Cid names a later airship in Dirge of Cerberus after her, Marlene becomes a semi-important character in Advent Children, and Zack gets an entire game to himself where he's, y'know, Zack.

Even Compilation materials aside, this isn't really nostalgia. It's just someone deciding to make a translation too literal and making a bunch of name changes to fit how literal the work is with the claims of accuracy.

>>2414989

The Compilation of FF7 games are kind of shitty, but I'd trust them for simple things like name spelling. Trusting some promotional pamphlet as some Gospel that can't be contradicted and ignoring every other game or work in the series is ridiculous nerd-dom.

>>2414989
Honestly wouldn't be surprised if he just made all the names and shit into Romanji or something.

Kuraudo, etc. That would be pretty fucking literal.

>>2414984
>Theres a donate link on page 1 of their forum thread

I'd just like to state that to those who gave money to these two guys that

THEY

With a lot of retranslations, particularly those that profess authenticity over flow, there is a fine line between a worthwhile usage of time and a weird compulsive autistic waste of resources. On a personal level, if someone wants to change fundamental naming conventions on literally the most famous jrpg in fuckin history, then go for it, but don't paint it as anything other than a personal quest for bullshit when games like Segagaga and the Xuan Yuan Jian series have sat there for over a decade.

>>2414998
>Segagaga

That one still hurts, after all these years.

>>2414998
very well said mate

>>2414998
>>2415003
>>2415006
Feel free to learn Japanese and translate the games yourselves, you lazy asses.

>>2415015
go put on your weighted vest

>>2415015
there's a huge difference between caring enough to post on a gaming forum and caring enough to learn a fucking language and do the work

>>2415015
This might trigger you but I am fine with the game the way it is

>>2415017
I don't understand this reference.

>>2415026
You're acting like anyone owes you anything so you can play these games. If you don't care enough to learn the language so you can play the game (especially in 2015, when you have all the resources available to you on the internet for free), you shouldn't be expecting someone to take their free time to do it for you.

This is just some top tier laziness (or entitlement--probably both) on your behalf.

>>2415015

I never said that I could do a better job, I just pointed out that putting your skills to a use that benefits more than your strange group of donating friends would be a better way for others to experience games that westerners haven't had the opportunity to.

>>2415030
>I am fine with the game the way it is

You mean in Japanese? Because I'm not talking about retranslators, I'm talking about lazy shits who expect people to translate games for them.

And I'm fine with the western FF releases as well, with maybe the exception of FF4. VI's translation was wonderful (in spite of a few things censors wouldn't let Woolsey do) and VII's messiness has a certain charm that I like.

And I'm not sure who you think you're "triggering" with your post.

>>2415035
>I never said that I could do a better job
Nor did I. What a bewildering comment.

> I just pointed out that putting your skills to a use that benefits more than your strange group of donating friends would be a better way for others to experience games that westerners haven't had the opportunity to.

I'd like to play some of these untranslated games as well, but the people who translate and hack the games aren't duty bound to do so. I'm not about to start shitting on free-time projects just because they don't benefit me personally. I've been playing translated ROMs for years, and whenever someone makes something that I don't care about, I keep it moving.

>>2415041
Except that's how the entire fan translation thing works. Other people do the work, not us.

>>2415046
I don't know what the point of this is. There's nothing stopping you from becoming someone who does the work.

If you really want to play some obscure-ass 1996 Japanese-only RPG, there's nothing stopping you from doing it, aside from your own laziness.

>>2415048
Have you actually tried to learn japanese? That super amount of kanji..yeah im not doing it.

i'm actually really interested in this.

is there a prepatched psx version uploaded?

>>2415050
You're not really refuting his point. It is extremely difficult to learn enough Japanese to be able to translate a game well, but it is not impossible, so yes, if you want it done but don't want to learn the skills to do it yourself, it is laziness.

>>2415068
What you call lazy, I call smart. It's not exactly fair comparison, because other languages wouldn't have me mindlessly memorizing thousands of kanji. I would translate a game if the source language was spanish, but not japanese.

>>2414960
Very true.

>>2415068
You make it sound like everyone has the time in the world to learn a second language. People have these things called jobs.

>>2415078
How long have you been posting on 4chan today

>>2415073
>What you call lazy, I call smart.

It doesn't matter what you try to call it, you aren't going to convince most people that not being able to learn things is "smart".

>>2415068
It's very easy to call other people lazy but you haven't actually done anything yourself either.

>>2415035
If there was any real audience for these games you want translated wouldn't have something started already? The tools aren't a problem. There are those who are capable, but don't really have any interest in those games that are. You can't really tell them to work on something they're not interested in.

>>2415046
FFV, the first game to receive a fan translation. Square never completed theirs, so fans of the series learned the know-how and actually applied it. Even creating their own tools to do the job. Since then the scene has been making it easier for others to get into. Every fan translation of any game began because of, well, fans.

If there's a game you think is deserving of a translation that others should enjoy then why not be the one to get it started? That didn't stop anyone else. Then again, the one thing they have on people who just sit back and wait is the drive and passion, no matter the quality of the end product.

>>2415050
Nothing is supposed to come easy. Is it difficult to learn? Maybe, depending on how dedicated you are and what languages you already know. I've been studying it for only 2 years, but I don't expect to be able to translate games by tomorrow. Hell, I just want to be able to use and understand it at a conversational level. The process can be slow and grueling, but if you truly wanted to do it you can.

And lol, really? >>2415073

>>2415078
Time should never be an obstacle for something you want to pursue. Either you sort your shit out and make time, or you don't.

>>2415083
You can't be serious. Learning japanese is in no way going to benefit my career.

>>2415091
Neither is being stupid on 4chan, but you seem to love doing that.

>>2415091
That is a total non-sequitor to the post you just quoted.

>>2415091
So learning something just for self-gratification is stupid unless it helps your career? My dad's an anesthesiologist, but history is his passion. He knows way more than any fresh undergraduate does.

>>2415094
You're comparing a few minutes on 4chan to the years it takes to learn a language? Yeah, you definitely haven't accomplished any actual language learning yourself and just talking out of your ass now.

>>2415098
>You're comparing a few minutes on 4chan
Who are you trying to fool here exactly

>>2415098
The 15 minutes a day you spend on 4chan can be used to get a good grasp on a language.
Anyways, bragging about IRL should really be faux pas.

>>2415097
And? I dont see why you have any right to criticize what i do with my free time. I rather fap to porn than learn japanese.

>>2415104
>I rather fap to porn than learn japanese.
And this is why you'll never play that shitty, obscure SNES RPG that no one cares about.

Anyway, I think you've had enough lulz for tonight. Time to bring it in.

>>2415104
Have fun then.

>>2415091
So, what IS your career, friend? I'm sure we could find some way to shoehorn Japanese in and make it relevent so it'll give you a reason.

>>2415125
I'm a cashier at walmart.

>>2415132
Please tell me you have other aspirations.