/vr/ - Retro Games

More fighters. Always more fighters.

>>2398678
Perhaps...

>>2398671
>Williams collection(compilation of Williams arcade games that should have existed)
It came out in 1996, a bit late for the Sega CD.

Symphony of the Night

>>2398671
What stopped Frontier Elite 2 from coming on to the Sega CD, or even the SNES or PC-Engine? It's predecessor made it to the NES in Europe, after all.

>>2398678
>1x driver loading times
Bad idea!

>>2398909
I wonder why most of /vr/ dislikes bump posts.

>>2398909
Even sf zero 2 on snes had "loading".

>>2399074
sf in sf Zero means???

>>2399086
BUMP. save the thread.

>>2399731

Why would this thread need any saving?

Is it valuable or something?

>>2399740
It's bascially a what if thread.

What the Sega CD should've had was
1. more games
2. exclusive games
3. games which aren't worthless FMV adventures.

And maybe more stuff that leverages the extra hardware. For example have PCM music, freeing up the CD drive to do mid-level loading, giving you bigass levels. Like, imagine a Sonic game where you don't have "Zones", just one gigantic world that lead seamlessly into alternate areas that act as zones. You'd need to get creative with the level design to have many transitional areas (sort of like in Castlevania SOTN, but with the loading areas actually having gameplay inside), but it would be possible, even on the Sega CD.

>>2399074
Yeah, and VF2 on the Saturn had none (or as close as - is had something like a 1 second picture swap, which is WAY less than what even the late 4mb Capcom games had, you know the ones that everyone claims to have no loading times, except that they have unskippable 4 second VS screens).

>>2399086
SF Zero = SF Alpha.

SF Alpha 2 was on the SNES and it used a special decompression chip to fit so much gfx into the cart, which resulted in the game having long-ass loading before fights, as the console had to decompress the graphics.

>>2398678
Not putting any version of SF2 on Sega CD was a huge oversight.

>>2398909
this was common for the era.
if you think Sega CD was bad, try playing a fighter on Neo CD.

>>2399783
A2 on SNES used a SDD1 to decompress gfx, same as Star Ocean. Star Ocean was decompressed by fans so it could be played on flash cart.

I wonder what A2 would be like if someone decompressed it.

>>2399742
More: I have no mouth and must scream, Doom, a GOOD counterpart to "Marke my video."

>>2399983
Alpha 2 was also decompressed as I recall, before they could emulate the chip it was the only way to emulate it.

How big was Star Ocean decompressed, by the way?

>>2400638
Doom would be impossible, Wolf3d was done recently on a normal genny however (no idea if it would be possible without the modern developer tools, though).

Actually, wolf3d on the sega cd might work better too, since you'd have enough space in there for all the episodes.

>>2399783
>long-ass loading before fights
How long exactly? I played it on my *cough*phone*cough* and it was like only a 3 second delay.

>>2399783
The CD did have a bunch of great games, the problem with it was Sega being fucking retarded and having the marketing solely be on FMV games making everyone think that's all there was to it.

>>2398671
Moonwalker would be an obvious choice, and maybe Elite 2 but the rest, except for maybe games collections, I don't really see the point since none of them really needs the extra space and most Sega CD games were simply genesis games with different (and not necessarily better) soundtracks, so the biggest chance is that they would be too.

Contra Hard Corps, more paths, badly voiced dialogue and a kickass soundtrack

>>2400649
something like 96 mbits (without S-DD1 compression)

>>2400658
with the Sega CD, it might not be impossible, as the CD unit adds in a mode-7 graphical upgrade and has a 68k co-processor clocked in at 12.5 mhz. I'd imagine it to look either better or worse than the SNES version, depending on how the port was handled.

>>2398893
SNES would have most likely needed the Super FX chip, which would be costly for a small european publisher, I don't think PC-Engine would have been able to handle the 3D at all... though Sega CD does seem like a mystery, seems like it would be perfect for a game like that.

>>2401021
What about the PC-Engine CD?

>>2398893

A lot of factors not related to technical problems. Frontier was pretty good even on Atari ST, so a Genesis port was at least possible, while the slow CPU of the SNES could have been problematic but not impossible to work around. The PC Engine however was out of the scope of western developers. The reason because the original Elite was converted to a lot of platforms (including the NES) was the smash hit status of the original version. Frontier by comparison was an impressive sequel (at least for me) but not as succesfull. It was also complex and with less action even compared to Elite. Another problem was related to the in house approach of Braben and a more tight control of the license. It was a miracle that the game was released after years of delays. Meanwhile First Encounters entered in development, so there was no room for a port of Frontier for 16bit consoles.

>>2401031
PC-Engine CD didn't provide any extra power, it just provided extra space.

>>2401072
>he thinks that the CPU of the SNES was actually slower than the Genesis's
where are all these retards coming from? or is this just sega fanboys trying to troll desperately.

>>2401078
It could handle a couple of instructions less per second. the difference isn't as big as the clock speed could make some fools believe but it's there.

>>2401081
ah, actually I was confusing CPU speed for the speed of the systems as a whole
http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~dherring/cgt141/project1/comparison.html

>>2401078

It matters when a 3D procedurally generated game (the Amiga version shipped in a single 720kb floppy disk) like Frontier is concerned. Since the 2D architecture isn't used, the stress is mainly on the CPU. However screenshots of a tentative version of Starfox without the FX chip prove that relatively complex 3D games were possible.

>>2401132
I can think of more games: Ninja Gaiden trilogy. Star Wars. and Wing Commander 1&2.

>>2401078
It is slower, but only by a little. Surprisingly little, and much of the speed difference in practice seem to be related to memory and video access speeds. Also, programmer familiarity with the 68k (which is a bit more of a programmer friendly design in general) compared to the 65c816 helped, due to the 68k being the de-facto arcade standard (sure, other chips were used quite commonly, but late-80s to early-90s arcade games made frequent use of the 68000, it was probably the most commonly used CPU in arcade boards of the era).
.
The 68k's instructions for the most part take more cycles than the 65c816's in general (although, the 68k will do operations working on long words faster, being internally 32-bit).
But, the higher clock speed goes a pretty decent way in making this up.
If the SNES was clocked at 4 MHz (a VERY slight increase), it'd beat out the Genesis in instructions per second cleanly.

>>2403721
And yet somehow, the PC-engine's mere 8-bit processor was faster than even the Mega Drive.

The biggest problem with the Sega CD hardware specs imo was the tiny amount of ram, only 6 Mbit, less than 1 MB.

That's the main reason most non-fmv games were just regular Genesis games with CD music and grainy FMVs.

If the Sega CD had at least 12 Mbits (1.5 MB) of main ram, I'm sure it would be able to do so much more.

>>2400665
>I played it on my *cough*phone*cough* and it was like only a 3 second delay.

In Virtua Fighter 2, you'd be halfway through a round already in that 3 seconds.

>>2398671
None of them. The CD should've never been made. Sega would've been far better off had they taken the resources wasted in developing the CD and 32X and used them in more productive ways, like not making the Saturn a piece of ass.

>>2400836
>the CD unit adds in a mode-7 graphical upgrade

That one isn't really all that useful due to how bandwidth starved you are when uploading tiles to the VDP. You'd need to have either the SCD Scaler to handle all the graphics outside the GUI, which it probably isn't fast enough for, or you'd need to draw backgrounds on one side and sprites on the other - which means more tiles to upload.

>>2405049
>The biggest problem with the Sega CD hardware specs imo was the tiny amount of ram

No, it was the facts that it could not interrupt the main cpu and that the VDP could not take any sort of graphical input from other chips (nor did it have a dual buffer so it could draw graphics while you are writing to memory).

Both of those were faults on the Megadrive side - it was not meant to be upgraded that way.

Aladdin CD

>>2405078
This a thousand times. SEGA lost the console wars when they started wasting all their money into making expensive and shitty addons for the MD. The Dreamcast was just the nail on the coffin.

>>2405078
>the 32x should've never been made
FTFY

Also, if the SegaCD should never have been made, why are you not bashing the PC-engine CD?

>>2405546
Because this is a Sega thread and not a TurboGrafx thread, genius. And it was also a mistake, CD technology in game consoles simply was not advanced enough at that time to be anything more than an overpriced gimmick. It wasn't until the Saturn and PlayStation where CD-based games were worthwhile.

>>2403721
the 65c816 is based on the 6502, which was familiar to anyone who had developed games for the nes or the pce, since those are both 6502/6502-based. it was probably less common than a 68k, but not anything close to obscure.

while it is true that the snes isn't half as fast as genesis despite being half the clock speed, the difference isn't as small as you claim. the snes can't do sonic and sonic isn't an arcade port.

moreover, wasn't one of the issues with the proposed SNES CD-ROM that the cpu was so slow that the hardware designers were having I/O issues?

Here's (hopefully) a complete list of 32x games.

Which ones could/couldn't have worked on the sega cd instead? Like I can easily imagine Knuckles' Chaotix on sega cd.

>>2405860
All of the ones with 32-bit graphics, obviously.

The problem with the 32x is they should've just not released it at all and put its library on the Saturn instead.

>>2405078
>>2405480
>underage who get all their information on old systems from YouTubers

every time

>>2405546
Because they don't know what that is because AVGN hasn't covered it.

>>2405871
>underage who never experienced the disappointment of the Sega CD firsthand
The Sega CD was my first ever instance of "buyer's remorse" as a kid after I pestered my parents so badly to get it. $300 for "Genesis+" was garbage. Between that, the 32X, and Sonic 3 & Knuckles it's a wonder my stupid kid self held out as a Sega fan.

>>2405879
Not even a SEGAfag but the tremendous asspain from Nintendo fanboys such as yourself even all these years later is incredible.

>>2405882
Whatever boogeyman you prefer, anon.

>>2405871
>if you don't like X it's because AVGN said so !
Every time. Segacucks are amazing, just like Sega's MKT department.

>>2405914
Oh, do you get that a lot? Maybe because it's true. I don't give a fuck about the Sega CD but please try things for yourself and form your own opinions.

Super Mario Bros.

>>2405871

>>2405916
This. It's a genuine weird thing where people just repeat whatever Youtube e-celebs say and I really don't know why. It used to just be contained on /v/ but it's been leaking in here over the last few months too.

>>2405916
>>2405927
Or or or, maybe this goes too much against your enclosed worldview, but maybe some people actually came to the same conclusion independently using their own experiences. Crazy thought, I know. Everything that goes against your precious fanboyism must be the work of those evil dastardly e-celebs on the YouTubes.

>>2405618
>And it was also a mistake
What the fuck am I reading? Has there ever been a less informed opinion in /vr/ history?

>>2405920
I've seen this reposted a million times but did anyone ever find out what the fuck was happening with all of that?

>>2405965
Everything in that seems internet-normal to me... until I got to the last image.

>>2405964
I read the words he posted. Now I have cancer.