/vr/ - Retro Games

Probably because of mame.

>>2288997
but what's wrong with bootleg???

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRItYDKSqpQ

Apparently Neo Geo carts are fucking complicated. krikzz, the fellow who makes those excellent Everdrive flash carts, looked into it once and promptly said, "NOPE!".

Even if someone did make them they would probably be crazy expensive compared to a regular flash cart. Though, that hasn't stopped Neo Geo fans before.

Neogeo collectors would send assassins to however manufactures/designs such cards.

And I'm not joking, collectivelly they could probably buy a suitcase nuke.

>>2288997
Probably easier to build a money printing flashcart and print enough money to buy all the games.

>>2289039
This, sorta
He said it was do-able, but because of the size and number of pcbs per unit (there are two pcbs) it'd be /very/ expensive to produce, and he didn't think there was a market for it.

>>2289616
arent late neogeo releases actually 4 carts together back to back or something
i say this because usually arcade owners had to choose between one"modern" game past mid 90s or 4 older games selectable in the same cabinet

>>2289632
Do you mean the different MVS models that had 1-6 cart slots? The carts themselves stayed the same as far as I know. Later MVS models where all 1-2 slot models.

>>2289640
then how come I've never seen kof99 or later in one of these multi slot cabs

>>2289645
dunno, but they're all still single carts

Anyone know where I can buy the 60 in 1 mvs multicart? it's the ultimate accompaniment to the 161 but I can't find it anywhere.

the MVS multicart and AES adapter is probably the cheapest solution at this point in time. Krikzz would have to charge like $500 for a flash cart because of the dual-slotted PCB cart.

>>2289645
if your talking X-in-1 carts, it's because 99 had encryption.
Maybe that also makes it incompatible with multislots, doubt it tho.
But it might just be that those multi slot got rarer. I remember not seeing them after like 94-95.

>>2289668
500 would be very cheap for playing the whole Neogeo library TBH.

>>2289668
>the MVS multicart and AES adapter
>cheapest solution
No, because then you would need to buy both an AES and an adapter, which combined costs more than just an MVS.

Hell, I've even seen MVSes go for cheaper than AESes.

>>2289681
I know, I kinda wish I got a MVS now. Goddangit.

>>2289680
Lol, I would pay it... I bought all the other Everdrives.

Here is one of the PCBs of a late era MVS game, the PROG board of Metal Slug 3.

>V ROMs 1-4 contain audio samples
>P ROMs 1-2 contains 68k code
>NEO-SMA is a bankswitcher for P ROMs
>PCM is a multiplexer for V ROMs

>>2289751
And here is the CHA board.

>C ROMs 1-8 contain sprite data
>M ROM contains the fix layer(HUD)
>NEO-CMC is a protection/banking chip

MS3 is one of the largest games, 708 megs(88.5MB) which is larger than any N64 game. Simulating all those chips won't be cheap, and many games have a different layout/use different chips.

>>2289680
30 dollars more like it

>>2289760
Correction, the M1 contains the Z80 program. Usually the S1 ROM contains the fix layer.

>>2289887
>emulation

barf

anyway, to recap what others have already said: bank switching. as well as other various tricks used to expand the size of aes/mvs carts.

not to mention that the memory such a cart would require would drive up the cost.

>>2288997
Because it would require a lot of work to make a very expensive device that a very few people would buy.
A few explanations ITT of why it would be expensive are relevant but most are fantasy

Knowing the Neo Geo community there would be people willing to pay over a 1000 bucks for something like this. I doubt Krikzz wants to deal with the NG community though, and they would take a lot more to manufacture than any of his other flashcarts.

Most of the chinese multicarts on the market today have very questionable build quality, use recycled chips and still cost like a 100 dollars.

>>2289952
>emulation
works fine

>>2290809
People want some kind of authenticity, that's why they ditch emulation in general, add hype and shitty emulator machines like the retron 5
instead of just use a damn emulator for free.

Then you have idiot's like this guy over here,
that think playing in a emulator box is some kind of accomplishment.
Do you need a nes replacement conector?
ZOMG NO I HAVE A RETRON 5

Why not tell, I don't need one i can play on any emulator whit perfect music and video.

0:17
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHWF4clyC_E

Really when I heard his comment, I wanted to punch him right in the mouth.

If someone owns a Neo Geo then they are more than likely someone who also wants to collect the carts making an already niche market even more niche. Just seems like a waste of time compared to making them for more widely owned consoles.

>>2288997
Home console cartridges are usually a single ROM on an edge connector. One address bus goes in, one data bus comes out. Neo carts are more like 5 separate address spaces with a pile of strange multiplexing and bankswitching going on. A Neo cart has independent buses for the 68k address, 68k data, z80 address, z80 data, multiplexed ADPCM address/data, multiplexed graphics addresses, sprite data, overlay data, palette data, and a pile of other shit too.

There's a reason they needed 240 pins. A Neo-Geo flash cart would operate somewhat like 4 or 5 flash carts for a typical home system.

>>2290809
NeoGeo emulation actually has quite a number of sound issues and occasionally graphical issues, nothankyou

>>2291230
The last thing i remember was the raster effect's
And i think they nailed that.

>>2291256
there's still a few issues

probably the most obvious I can think of is Terry's stage in MOTW (the bridge section) has never ever looked right under emulation (recent versions of MAME are pretty bad with it -- older versions just played it too slowly, but now it seems to be related to how high you jump and it judders and flickers between frames and is distracting as fuck)

>>2291272
sounds like you need retroarch

>>2291272
I was under the assumption that NeoGeo was literally perfectly emulated under MAME, at least the most recent ones. The again I don't own the legit hardware, so what do I know.

>>2289971
Even if one was made and sold at five hundred bucks minimum, it would still be a far better value than trying to collect every single good game, at least the AES carts.

>>2289039
>>2289616

I think krikkz is waiting for a crazy neogeo collector to pay up some big cash to get him to develop flashcarts. He should just do a kickstarter. Based on neogeo prices, he could charge a shitload for each cart. Nevermind the development time of the thing

>>2291298
it's not, there are still numerous issues. none are game-breaking but they're VERY annoying if you're familiar with the games

>>2290809
i'm not even sure why you emufags bother coming into these threads

>>2291316
tbh if krikkz tried to kickstart this, I don't think it'd go anywhere. Neo fans are notoriously hostile to any attempt to monetize "their" community and most neo-related kickstarters fail spectacularly.

krikkz's only chance is he either just does it and takes the risk, or finds a wealthy backer to help finance it.

>>2291298
What makes you think people who charge close to $200 for something as basic as an N64 flash cart could make a beast like a Neo Geo flash cart for anywhere near $500?

>>2290024
>>2289331

I think these are good points, in a way.

Beyond whatever technical issues there would be, I get the feeling that home-use NeoGeo gaming and collecting is a somewhat obscure hobby when compared to GameBoy, NES, SNES, Genesis, and so on. The market would be immediately smaller from the get-go based simply on that. Add to that the fact that some of said Neo collectors are probably rich purists who would prefer to get real carts, be they AES or MVS than to get a flashcart. Add to that that not many average gamers already have the ability to play MVS or AES carts at all, and the ways of getting setup for that can be somewhat expensive. Of course, there certainly IS a market in the home-gamer scene, but I think the question is if it is big enough to justify making a flashcart. Again, that is just based on my immediate feeling rather than careful research, so, whatever.

Where there might be a bigger market would be targeting them to arcades, but I don't know how well a flashcart would be setup to play in a coin-op setting.

Another issue are the differences between AES home carts and MVS arcade carts, which aren't as easily interchangeable as you might think. Not only do they have a different amount of pins, AES cartridges also have a few important chips which are on the main board instead on the MVS, which means 2 different flashcarts would have to be manufactured.

Because nobody owned one ?

>>2291430
>Neo fans are notoriously hostile to any attempt to monetize "their" community
But neo geo stuff is already insanely expensive. Isn't it already monetized?

>>2291013
holy shit what a colossal faggot
>i don't touch this hands with anything electrical

>>2292038
They don't want their "investment" to lose value

>>2289887
fuck yo speed hacks

>>2288997
more importantly, where are goddamned CD/CDZ the ODE loaders?

>>2292024
>Because nobody owned one ?
Ding Ding Ding Ding! Ladies and gentlemen we have our winner!

Seriously, it comes down to
1. Small userbase.
2. "Emotionally invested" (to put it kindly) userbase.
3. There's already a 161-in-1 multi-cart for $800+/- USD.
4. Neo-Geo carts are complex and expensive.

>>2292864
Why would you even need this for Dreamcast? CDs are pretty cheap anon...

>>2293029
GD-ROM is not a CD-ROM. GD-ROM is a 1GB disc, CD-R are at max 800mb, so a number of games had down sampled video or audio to fit onto a CD. Not to mention that CD-Rs do quite a bit of harm to the Dreamcast laser (which is already not the best)

>>2293024
>3. There's already a 161-in-1 multi-cart for $800+/- USD.
You're an idiot if you pay that much for a multicart, they go for less than $200 lol

>>2293052
He's still an idiot but he didn't pay that much. If he actually had one he'd know the actual price and that they're so shit comparing them to a flash cart is retarded

>>2293048
>CD-Rs do quite a bit of harm
Thread seems to be full of idiots

>>2292038
I mean in the sense of third-party products, such as flash carts, consolized arcade boards, conversions, replacement shells, etc.

>>2293052
far less, more like $60-80

What about playing burned Neo Geo games on a Neo Geo CD?

>>2293324
It's like playing a neo geo, only you get to spend half of your gameplay time waiting for a monkey to juggle balls.

>>2293324
Even with it's tiny library you'd spend longer than the average human lifespan on loading screens to play it all.

>>2293332
>>2293346
Loads are decent fast on a CDZ.
Still, fuck SNK for going the absolute cheapest x1 drive.

>>2293120
>Thread seems to be full of idiots
Are you referring to yourself?
The laser draws more power when reading CDs instead of GD-R, don't believe me pull your head out of your ass and check with a multimeter.
Next you're gonna tell me that disc rot isn't real

>>2293318
~aliexpress~

>>2293324
Not only are the loading times absolutely abysmal, some of the later titles also removed animation frames and made sprites smaller to be able to fit on the very limited RAM. The CD library is also missing some important late games like Metal Slug 3 which were released after SNK stopped supporting the NGCD.(~1998)

However, the NGCD does have some redeeming qualities. Games like Puzzle Bobble don't need much loading, there exist NGCD exclusive games(Ironclad, Crossed Swords II, Samurai Shodown RPG) and some games include arranged soundtracks and exclusive content like Metal Slug 1/2's Combat School and RBFFS's music video.(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khbd5Pcj9g4))

>>2293447
Oh God, that's just too funny. If you even have a DC or a multimeter I'd be surprised if you know how to operate either.
Now run along and check your disc rot with your multimeter kiddo.

>>2293447
I was not aware that I was putting unnecessary strain on my laser. That's unfortunate. Any word on the SD card GD-ROM drive replacement yet?

>>2293493
Neither was anyone who bases their info on science as opposed to urban legends.
Probably best to check the gdemu blog every couple weeks for the updates.

>>2293493
GDEMU
https://gdemu.wordpress.com/

>>2293029
>not wanting faster load times

>woe is me I'm some fuckface who is concerned about a consoles laser when said console can be had for 40 bucks

Get fucking bent you tards, by the time your dc laser wears out you would be 10 years older than you are now.

>>2294860
Please don't ever procreate. Keep your dick in your hand where it belongs.

>>2294862
sorry you got mad at the truth ocd autist, maybe you should go back to cataloging your games by color and angle and leave the rational people to discuss the topic at hand. Also only virgins make virgin jokes, you fucking bacteria.

>>2289887
>emulation on ARM
lmao

>>2294879
what does the processor architecture matter?

>>2294872
it's been proven that using CD-R/W discs on Dreamcast can prematurely wear the laser out.

The laser assembly is already unreliable and you cannot purchase brand new replacements; why would you bother with CD-Rs at this point when SD readers exist and original discs are dirt cheap?

>>2294912
>SD readers exist

I beg your pardon, but isn't the only game in town in that regard GDEmu, a product which has seen continual delays amongst those who even made it onto the waiting list in the first place?

Also, there seems to be some conflicting stances on whether or not cd-r usage will be damaging/straining to the laser of a dreamcast. On what basis do you make the claim that the laser will burn out faster?

>>2294912
Dreamcast can't read CDRW discs, and for the SD card reader you need special SD card games, it doesn't work with regular Dreamcast isos.

>>2294862
Damn dude! You totally burned him with your intelligent fact filled come back!

>>2294915
uh, what?
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/For-Dreamcast-DC-SD-Card-Adapter-DIY/32274646819.html

https://www.assemblergames.com/forums/showthread.php?49919-F-S-Dreamcast-Internal-SD-Mod

>>2294924
you're right about RW not working, it's been a while. That said, I _did_ saw R/W, so I was 50% right ;]

>>2294982
>laggy-ass serial port SD adapter

Though technically you were correct... second one looks promising though. Wonder why I've never heard of it?

>>2294912
>proven
source?
>some kid on the internet
real source?

>>2293120
Having to replace your DC laser is a common thing, actually.

>>2295117
It is. Hence my comment about idiots.
I have many DCs. All have played many CDRs. I have never had to replace a laser on one.
I don't know what these idiots are doing to fuck up their lasers but it's not using CDRs.