/vr/ - Retro Games

The combination of Birdmountain's characters, Mitsuder's music and the right kind of supervision from Squär.

Lucca's face.

>tfw it being pixel art is the only thing that saved it from looking like generic Toriyama shit

>>2280142
>birdmountain
I speak Japanese and it took me a minute to realise what you were getting at. Then, when I did, I spit the water i was drinking right through my nose and all over my floor in an uproarious fit. I like you.

>>2280126
Literally everything except the fate of Gardia.

This tower was my favorite part

Absolutely nothing. Bad game. Stale story. Horrid fanbase. Inexplicable popularity.
It's such immense /shit/.

>>2280880
>cant' find a single good thing about CT
Yeah, I'm calling this one a troll.

>right
soundtrack
graphics
abilities with tactical aspects
duo-techs
bike minigame

>wrong
too easy
laughable characterization
triple techs being worse than duo techs

>another shitty trigger thread.

It's such a hodgepodge of mediocrity

>>2280126
everything. all CT lacks is a hard mode, which would've given it more replayability then new game + and extra endings.

I like chrono trigger because I'm not pretentious.

That one lucca sidequest.

>>2280890
Nope. No troll. Honestly can't find anything all that great about it. Um... it's not "Secret of the Stars," I guess. Admittedly, it's not quite "shit," per se, just that with all the praise it gets whilst simultaneously being thoroughly mediocre really gets my goat so I attribute a far more negative association to it than is warranted.

Having realized that /vr/ will never accept the unparalleled genius of Chrono Cross, the resident CC fanboy decides to shitpost about its much more successful predecessor at every opportunity.

Inb4 "Trigger Niggers".

>>2280965
The one where you go back in time and actually fix something thats directly relevant to one of the main characters?

>>2281017
Literally no one in this thread other than you has even mentioned that equally mediocre game. You know, not everyone has to fall one side or the other. It's not Skub. Some people can find both games mindbogglingly mediocre and their fanbases equally obnoxious. I am one of those people. They're both "meh."

>>2280998

just because CT gets excessive praise doesn't mean it isn't a solidly fun rpg.

>>2280998
You type like a fucking neckbeard.

>>2281132

yea I agree, 'mindbogglingly mediocre' has a fedora vibe to it.

>>2281042
Yeah you went to fix her mom's leg or something

>>2280126

I like Chrono Trigger but I always found the constant "scripted" battles to be tiring and the art direction doesn't appeal to me

Solid RPG though

It managed to be mediocre and appealing to a large demorgraphic because of >>2280142
Mitsuder's music is objectively good though
>>2280874
>tower
It's a fucking spaceship

>>2281147
>per se

>>2281825
What's wrong with per se?

>>2281828
Nothing. They just have no particular bit of the statement to pick apart, so they just piss and moan about fedoras.
If they like X, everyone must like X and anyone who doesn't like X is just being fedorable. In their eyes, anyway.

>>2281828
"Per se" means "intrinsically", not "precisely".

RIGHT:
>Random encounters aren't bad, per se, just often implemented poorly.

WRONG:
>Random encounters aren't bad, per se, just a little repetitive.

Don't be like the vampire kid in South Park.

>>2281849
*tips fedora*

>>2281775
>spaceship
That never made any sense. The characters talk about a base on the ocean floor, never anything mobile and certainly not a fucking spaceship.
But there it is. A fucking spaceship.
And then you see whats-his-fuck's airplane and it looks goddamn prehistoric by comparison, even though he's supposed to be like a military leader of the same country?

Makes no sense.

>>2281901
>makes no sense
Welcome to Chrono Trigger. Have a seat. It's gonna be an overrated ride.

>>2281889
You're fedorkable.

>>2280880

>i was born in 1999 so i cant appreciate any vidya that doesnt cater to my graphic whoring needs

>>2280126
>What went right?
Western gamers in 1995 didn't have much alternative to this mediocre game so they continue to praise it as the second coming of Christ

>>2281901
>That never made any sense.
Nothing in both Trigger and Cross does, Cross is seemingly more consistent but that's because they dropped time travel and dimesion hopping is less retarded and allows more flexibility.
It's still utterly retarded how you can enter Chronopolis and not be instantly frozen in time, but hey, the plot should keep moving towards that Dragsword right?
>The characters talk about a base on the ocean floor, never anything mobile and certainly not a fucking spaceship.
This is something I actually want to discuss as I want to point out a few things in general.
First of all, almost nobody in Zeal except the Queen knew about the Black Omen and what it was, the few people that did were filled in regarding the particulars by Queen Zeal, who was being controlled by Lavos, and it's highly possible she lied or told them half truths.
Secondly, you people should seriously stop thinking the characters in a story are omniscent, it's not like that, even in the most badly written story it isn't like that, don't take what character X says as truth unless he clearly is the mastermind in some plan or has done something in person and is of course trustworthy, the characters exist in a different narrative level than the lore, this is a basic rule of both reading and storytelling.
If you write characters that know every single thing that happens in the story it becomes shallow and boring, certain things are beyond the reach of a character's mind and are hinted at the reader, it's also an excellent way to create suspence and enrich your setting and eventual characterization.

>>2280126
No filler.

>>2281924
Nice try, except I haven't owned a single console newer than N64. And I didn't even like /that/ all that much. Too much of them newfangled polygons and shit. Just no.

This is getting out of hand but really Chrono Trigger is liked just like Final Fantasy, good music, go on an adventure, experience lots of different places and characters, a laid back fun experience.
If you start picking them apart then yes they're all shit games because story is dumb, nothing makes sense, casual gameplay, etc. Fans know that already, I hope.
I think what's great about them is the fond memories when playing them, and not because of the subtle nuances in bullshit elements of the game or whatever.

>>2282361
>WAAAAAAAAAAAH!!! IT'S GETTING OUT OF HAND!!!!!!!
>...says the guy who bumped a thread nearly five hours after the last comment before his
You could have just... you know... left the thread alone. But no. You had to bump it. Idiot.

>>2282370
I mean in general. It's brought up a lot both on /v/ and now here. Why are you mad?

Bump

>tfw it's the 10th anniversary of CT today

Share your CT thoughts guys.

>>2283494
>2005
Not retro
>>>/v/

I liked the encounter system a lot, honestly. Other games just do random encounters, here's some low-level bunny that pounces your ass every five steps, and it gets really annoying really quickly. With Chrono Trigger, after the first time you fight something, you KNOW where it is. You know what enemies you can avoid and where the ones you have to fight are.

Also, the music. I also liked the plot, I haven't seen time travel done in any other RPG and most of it wasn't about saving the world, just helping your friends and getting back home in one piece. It was a lot about the characters.

Plus, multiple endings. You got to do whatever you wanted to beat Lavos and there was nobody going "you can't go fight him yet, he is too strong". They let you go and fight the guy super early (unless I remember wrong, the first time you reach that bucket is long before the endgame) and get your ass kicked.

>>2283529
Out of the many things I hate in Trigger is the stupid encounter system. No variety, fixed encounters you have to run away from. You come back to an area and already dread going through it knowing all the bullshit fights you have to face. At least games with random encounters sneak in rare mobs so there's some variety.

kek @ people who can't enjoy chronotrigger

>>2280126
A lot.

It's a great game.

>>2283783
I actually loved the encounter system, for the simple reason that I could see enemies in advance and avoid them if I wanted.

>>2280998
"um"
"per se"
What a faggot.

>>2280998
"um"
"per se"
What a faggot.

>>2282361
Kill yourself

>>2284982
There's tons of enemies you can't avoid or that are triggered by bullshit stuff, ie enemy is in a corner, going through the opposite corner triggers him. And running away is awful.

Those are about the only flaws I can see in CT as a whole. I DO dislike Toriyama's art in general but in pixel form it looks neat, and while I generally dislike ATB CT kinda makes it work.

>>2285034
>um
>per se
>whilst
>gets my goat
>warranted

>>2285308
>stop talkin' english gooder then me!
>:: waves confederate flag and flashes a threatening, gummy "smile" ::

>>2282361
>Chrono Trigger is liked just like Final Fantasy

That's a good one. CT wasn't nearly as slow or grind-heavy. And if you ask me, FF was always kind of derivative. CT took a lot more risks with the overall design, and they paid off. The music, the character design, the environments, and the plot. I didn't much care for the ending, but that's just my opinion. I felt like Lavos just sorta came out of nowhere tbh. So I guess in that respect, it could be compared to FF. But yeah, there was like, no real interaction between Lavos and the MC until the final battle, iirc.

>>2286340
>lavos came out of nowhere
lavos was there since the fucking begining dude
the fact that you weren't literally chasing after him like sephirot doesn't make it less of an antagonist, if you could call him that.

>>2286348
I know he was mentioned early on, and we even saw the outside of him and all that, but aside from that, he was just some alien antagonist with mind-control powers pulling the strings or something. He had no real presence in the game.

>>2280126
We wouldn't have gotten Chrono Cross without it.

>>2286353
He is the center of every time period's plot except the "present". Were you even paying attention?

Then again, with comments like "final fantasy is grind heavy", I'd expect someone who paid little attention to what he was playing.

>>2286359

No shit he's the center of the plot, but as I said before, he doesn't have a whole lot of presence as a character. For most of the game, Lavos is just a telepathic space-worm-echidna-thing. Like, there's no real characterization, he's just evil.

>Then again, with comments like "final fantasy is grind heavy", I'd expect someone who paid little attention to what he was playing.

Have you played any of the earlier FF games?

>>2286368
No one actually recommends you play Final Fantasy 1 unless they have nostalgia for it. The series as it is popularly known starts at 4, and no Final Fantasy game from 4 on requires any grinding at all. Its literally baby's first rpg.

>>2286368

I think Lavos' characterization was literally that it was too alien to be characterized.

I'm not sure how the game could have presented that any better, to be honest. How the fuck do you "characterize" a planet-killing alien from the stars?

>>2286370
6 required a bit of grinding. Same with 7 and 9

>>2286376
In the same sense that Chrono Trigger requires it.

>>2286340
>CT took a lot more risks with the overall design
Like? Because it plays like any other standard JRPG for most things.
>FF
>Grind heavy
You don't need to grind in any FF outside 1.

>>2286370
grinding is the worst thing about jrpg's
srlsly fuck grinding in it's fat stupid ass
at least in ctrigger you have the option of running past enemies

>>2286580

I wouldn't say that's fair based on the way it handles encounters alone.

Not to mention the tech system.

>>2286586
It has pseudo non random encounters when there were a lot of games with non random encounters already. While you can see enemies on the map some encounters, especially in dungeons are still unavoidable due to enemy placement.
It has a standard level and growth system.
As the vast majority of the JRPG of its time and before, the protagonist(swordsman) is better than the rest of the cast for basically anything.
All the characters fit into a standard role and there's no customizability at all.
Game is linear as hell.
Multiple endings have been done before and better.
>Toriyama designs
>Original
Healing Items are most of the time better than the actual healers
Standard healing mechanics
Standard spell mechanics
Need save points
Main characters leaves party for a while

Combo attacks are kind of a novelty
Turn based encounters happen in the field instead of using a battle screen
New Game+ is a novelty, makes the game less linear,

It's a fairly standard JRPG, almost nothing is original in any way. Square made much better JRPGs with much better systems and meta, Rudra no Hihou and SaGa come to mind, even Bahamut Lagoon is a more title innovating than Chrono Trigger.
It's a fairly well done game with a few balance problems but it doesn't really deserve all those praises about being "different" and "innovating".

>>2286368
>lavos is just a thelepatic space-worm-echidna, no characterization
well dude, he's not some bad guy who want's to destroy the world. That's the thing. Too different from every movie and game ever? sorry

>>2286601

Rudra no Hihou came out AFTER Chrono Trigger. It also completely falls apart in the last chapter. You've named a grand total of one game you think is more innovative than Chrono Trigger, and you didn't even have the courtesy to specify which one you're talking about (GB? SNES? 1, 2, or 3?).

You're a hipster, aren't you? Chrono Trigger is just too mainstream, so you have to dig up the most fucking obscure titles you can think of and trumpet them as better.

>>2286608
besides, none of us would've probably heard about rudra no hihou back then. You know them now coz internets.

>>2286612

That too. And if he says "Romancing SaGa" I'm going to ask him to remove his eyeballs and stick them up his asshole with Vaseline.

>>2286608
>It also completely falls apart in the last chapter.
Chrono Trigger stops making any sense the moment you go back in time.
>Rudra no Hihou came out AFTER Chrono Trigger.
Boo.fucking.hoo, it still innovated more than Chrono Trigger.

And since you're so picky, GB SaGa on the snes had breakable weapons, evolving characters, lives and unusual skill learning in the case of monsters for instance,
Romancing SaGa had multiple main characters, non linear pseudo sandbox world, focus on formations, no levels, tech learning and a lot of other minor stuff I won't waste time typing
Romancing SaGa 2 had non linear open world, generations of characters, LP mechanics, non linear gameplay, unusual skill and magic mechanics and learning, no levels, bosses that changed depending on your story progression, a job system that was highly customizable, blacksmiths, magic research, permadeath etc...
3 comes a few months after trigger so I wont hurt your feelings more than this.

Though if you want older games there's plenty, Metal Max/Metal Max Returns, Inindo, Tengai Makyou...
>so you have to dig up the most fucking obscure titles you can think of and trumpet them as better.

The only obscures game I listed are Rudra and Inindo, the rest are fairly successful games.
>>2286618

Deal with it.

>>2286619
sorry but saga frontier 2 (only one i played) is kind of a chore to play. I don't deny it's cool and looks good, but it's a chore, while chrono trigger was fun from beggining to end, with memorable characters.

All you list is technical shit like the autist u probably are

>>2286620
Well, what can I say, thanks for proving I am right.

Why don't you grow up a bit and admit you're wrong instead of being a little bitch?
Nobody said CT is a bad game, it's only not as innovating as the internet, especially most of the western audience says.

No wonder people call you guys triggerniggers.

>>2286619
>Boo.fucking.hoo, it still innovated more than Chrono Trigger.

Yeah, you're a fucking hipster. Faulting a game for not being as innovative as a game that came out AFTER it makes zero sense whatsoever.

>>2286623

Cry moar bitchnigger.

>>2286623
>proving im right
fuck off, professional arguer.
Nobody said Crono Trigger invented anything. It just made use of everything correctly. It's like the mario bros of NES platformers

>>2286340
How is CT not derivative again?
>typical jRPG teens-save-the-world story line? tick!
>typical jRPG cast of unrelated raggle taggle protagonists? tick!
>typical jRPG twist where the unrelated protagonists turn out to be related after all? tick!
Remember: three of your protagonists are all blood relatives.
>typical jRPG linearity? tick!
>typical jRPG press-A-to-win gameplay? tick!
>typical jRPG menu-driven magic system? tick!
>typical jRPG go here and do that, now go there and do this, now go to this other place and do this other thing drag-along "story?" tick!
>typical jRPG sidequests near the end-game? tick!
>typical jRPG little-to-no character development? tick!
>typical jRPG world-destroying abomination? tick!
>typical jRPG BUT THOU MUST! lack of options? tick!
So how was it innovative? Because it had Annie-moo characters?

>>2287159
>So how was it innovative?
Not that I play a lot of RPGs but I really liked how the time travel mechanic worked. Waiting until the last time period to open those chests and then going back in time to get all the other items was great.

>>2287159
>typical jRPG press-A-to-win gameplay? tick!

Yeah, try that against some of the lategame bosses (sun temple guardians for example) and you get creamed.

>>2287227
I like Chrono Trigger but I know its press A to win outside of like 5 battles where you get a huge benefit out of using magic (Masamune, Nizbel, Golem twins, plus some randoms) the majority of the game is very much mashing attacks. Of course late game magic gets fucking ridiculous

>>2287227
>"puzzle bosses" are somehow exclusive to and/or originated with CT
Nope.

>>2287227
>thinks a handful exceptions count

>>2287159
Setting aside that a handful of your complaints were things that weren't mainstays of the genre until after chrono trigger... (though still not innovative - both FFVI and PSIV had a fair amount of optional content at the end of the game, for example).

>three of your protagonists are blood relatives
Three? It's been a while... Magus and Marle are presumably related because they're both from the only royal family on the planet in their respective times, but I don't remember blood relation between them and anyone else... neither Chrono nor Lucca are of royal blood, and Ayla's never explicitly stated to be related to anyone from the future (not that it would matter, given how big the difference in time is). Frog only counts in one of the thirteen endings, and Robo is a robot and not related to anyone.

>menu-driven magic system
Is this a problem with the user interface, or... I'm not really sure what this means at all, actually. Please enlighten me.

No, Chrono Trigger wasn't really innovative. It WAS, however, well-executed. Excellent graphics, excellent music, an interesting story, and well-written/translated dialogue. The only thing I'd consider "innovative" about it was the New Game+ mode that opened up a few more options after you beat it once.

>>2287384
>No, Chrono Trigger wasn't really innovative. It WAS, however, well-executed. Excellent graphics, excellent music, an interesting story, and well-written/translated dialogue. The only thing I'd consider "innovative" about it was the New Game+ mode that opened up a few more options after you beat it once.

this. also combo attacks were innovative, unless someone did that before CT.

>>2280126

I actually never got a chance to play this as a kid. I have it on the emulator and I have an snes USB cord. Should I play it stoned? Looking to do some retro stoned gaming.

>>2287424

you should play it stoned or sober. it's solid fun all around.

>>2287384
>in the world where ff1, ff2, ff3, ff4 and ff5 never existed, optional endgame quests weren't mainstays before CT
>marle totally never told ayla and her manbitch to have strong, smart kids "or [she'll] be in trouble!" upon figuring out that they're her ancestors

>>2287412
>>2287412
Phantasy Star IV did combos 2 years before CT did.

>>2287384
I'm assuming you're not the arsehat who keeps saying "innovative!!! INNOVATIVE!!!" And the music etc were all things present in many games prior to it. That's hardly a reason that makes it stand out. I honestly can't understand CT's appeal at all. It's mediocre. It's not bad. It's not good. it's so-so.

>implying new game+ is innovative
Perhaps in the way that it allowed the party to retain most of its items and all of its experience, thereby making it a fuckeasy playthrough, sure, but NG+ has existed since long, long before CT in the form of 'master quest' or 'second quest.' Super Mario Bros. had one, for example.

>>2287440
>Phantasy Star IV did combos 2 years before CT did.
and yet nobody gives a FUCK about Phantasy Star IV

gee, i wonder why that is

>>2287440
>Phantasy Star IV did combos 2 years before CT did.

I should've known, I just wasn't sure because I'm not an RPG expert.

still, it added another dimension to gameplay and made it less of a button masher.

CT was in fact derivative, but it really succeeded at what it did. the only thing CT was missing was a hard mode, which romhackers have done (level zero etc.)

>>2287440
>Phantasy Star IV did combos 2 years before CT did.

I should've known, I just wasn't sure because I'm not an RPG expert. still, it added another dimension to gameplay and made it less of a button masher. besides, for most casuals, double/triple techs were something new.

CT was in fact derivative, but it really succeeded at what it did. the only thing CT was missing was a hard mode, which romhackers have done (level zero etc.)

>>2287440
>I honestly can't understand CT's appeal at all. It's mediocre. It's not bad. It's not good. it's so-so.

Maybe you're being a bit willfully obtuse? It's a really great game, one of the most polished and fun to play rpg's of all time and easily the best of the 16 bit consoles.

>>2287447
Lots of people love Phantasy Star IV. It's definitely the best rpg on the genesis. It's not as great as CT or FF6 but it does hold up as one of the better 16 bit rpgs.

>>2287434
I was going to respond with "outside the FF series, then", but thinking about it, you're right. Forget that point, then.

Shit, I remember that line now. Still, they're only barely related - 65M years of difference would make Ayla share a negligible fraction of her genetics with Magus and Marle (who ALSO only share a negligible fraction of their DNA, but the scale is a bit smaller). ~850 years is about as far forward or backwards as you can go before your descendants or ancestors aren't related to you in any meaningful sense. But I'm being pedantic now.

>>2287440
>I'm assuming you're not the arsehat who keeps saying "innovative!!! INNOVATIVE!!!"
Yeah, I'm a different guy.

>And the music etc were all things present in many games prior to it. That's hardly a reason that makes it stand out.
They were - in other games that stood out. Take PSIV, for example. Not really innovative in any way (though the battle macros were pretty cool), but it was exceptionally well-executed, and is well-remembered for it.
The same is true for Chrono Trigger, most of the FF games, etc. A game that's cliched and trite for its genre can - and usually will - be popular if it's put together well enough.

>>2287440
Fair - though it's not something that I've seen from a lot of RPGs of that era.

>>2287440
I think he was saying that the ng+ allowed you to actually achieve different endings than playing through normally.

>>2286371
uh, Giygas?

>>2280126
>you got triggered

/thread

>>2287412
>combo attacks were innovative, unless someone did that before CT.

Square did. People are hilariously blind towards how much stuff is reused in Trigger. Everything you see is just something old with a new paintjob. Same as the battlefield grouping, it's just an illusion. Monster groups have existed since FF1 (or earlier) in Square games. The only difference between FF1 and CT is that the game presents them differently by misleading you into thinking it's more than it actually is. It would be great if positioning mattered, if you could walk around the field to set up attacks. But nah. You just jump back to where you were standing before.

Trigger is literally Angry Birds: RPG.

>>2288303
Why do you think something has to be original in order to be good? Not everything has to be groundbreaking, sometimes it's good enough to just do what you do normally, but do it exceptionally well.

In fact, I think that if more developers realized this, then modern gaming wouldn't be half as shit as it is now.

>>2287461
>barely related
Stop using realworld logic to solve gameworld problems. In a universe where ancestors/descendants are so alike in personality/physicality that they differ only in clothes and/or skin colour, DNA must be less variable than in ours.

>other RPGs didn't have ng+
I think that's true. Can't think of one.
It was a let down for me, though. When I saw it, I got excited. I thought it would use time gates to put yourself in different situations of the story to cause different outcomes, basically playing a sidequest sort of game. But no. That didn't happen. NG+ was a disappointment.

>>2287458
>willfully obtuse
Not at all.
Back in '95, all my friends flipped shit over how great of a game it was. My reaction then as now is the same: meh. I really didn't think much of it then, still don't think much of it now and still really don't get the hype.
I bought it.
I played it.
I liked it.
But not a hell of a whole lot. It was okay. Friends have actually gotten pissed at me about it. 'you can love it or hate it,' one said, 'but you can't be ambivalent about it.' And why not? It's nothing innovative. It's nothing new. What's they're to be excited about? Maybe if you're young enough where its amongst your first RPGs, you'd think it's the best thing ever (or if you're a thirty-five year old Narutard, like that one friend who was upset about my 'meh' reaction to CT).

>>2287456
There's a sense of awe/discovery to PSIV's combos that CT just lacked entirely. With CT, combo techs are automatically added to the menu when prerequisite single techs are earned. No discovery necessary.
With PSIV, imagine my bewilderment when the first combo macro flashed itself onscreen for seemingly no reason. How did I do that?! HOW DO I DO IT AGAIN?!

>>2287447
MD, a console not well-known for its RPGs, was in its death throes when PSIV saw a western release. SNES, a console well-known for its RPGs, was at its acme when CT saw a western release.

>>2288318
Yet, very few (or none at all?) CT fans say anything like that until they're presented with how lacking in innovation it truly is and feel like they're backed in a corner, forced to admit defeat. But then! They realise something! They still have one option left! "It's well-executed!" they bellow! "It doesn't have to be innovative if it's well-executed!!"
>but didn't you and your lot just spend the last X-amount of time trying to argue that it's innovative only to have that PoV eviscerated beyond all reason?
"Well, um... Uh...!"

It's a desperation move, like the ones from FFVI. I feel like CTFan1991 just used IT'S STILL GOOD! after his HP was low enough to put him in critical while trying to use INNOVATIVE GAME! (but failing to connect the attack) throughout the encounter.

By the way, when I first saw a desperation move in FFIIIUS, I was just as awestruck as when I first saw a combo macro in PSIV. As I said already, I never got that sense of awe from CT at any point.

Furthermore, I feel that your assertion on contemporary gaming is wrong.
Innovation hasn't been a strong part of popular, hardcore gaming for a very, very long time now. Games like CT, FFVII and every FPS after Doom or Halo ever paved the way for that. Damned near everything is a carbon copy of a carbon copy now or just pumped full of style-over-substance filler. That's not to say these games are bad, mind you. They're mediocre.

>>2288303
That's a tad disingenuous. The Twin command was basically useless, available to only two /temporary/ playable characters and more expensive (both in charge time and MP cost) than its effect warranted. PSIV was the first RPG to have combos be a party-wide thing, so far as I can recall.

Chrono Trigger was the first JRPG I played, it got me into the genre. Well, that isn't exactly true, I once rented Lufia when I was a kid, but I thought that blew. Before CT, I never even thought of consoles as being a place where you could play RPG games. I played it in 1999 on an emulator. I thought it was amazing, I couldn't get over how good the graphics were and how cool the story was. I actually went out and spent 60 bucks on a cart and dug out my SNES, which wasn't exactly getting much use then. I probably beat it around 10 times.

But I've never gone back and replayed it the way I do with Final Fantasy. Never got the urge to. All the SNES Final Fantasies have way more depth do them.

>>2288402

I have news for you, Anon: Lufia DOES blow. It blows chunks, cocks, and vuvuzelas, sometimes all at once.

>>2288340

Hey man, I asked for specific examples of Chrono Trigger not being innovative. And, after MUCH shitposting, I got 'em.

Still a great game, but the argument is basically over in my mind.

>>2288413
>I have news for you, Anon: Lufia DOES blow. It blows chunks, cocks, and vuvuzelas, sometimes all at once.

My're dick begs to differ.

>>2288417

Please do not do that.

>>2288413
>admitting to doing exactly what anon said he was doing
You're not very good at this.
And, in case you've missed exactly what that is, you have admitted to claiming it's great because it's innovative, then had it pointed out that it's neither great nor innovative, then changed your tune to say "it's great because it's NOT innovative!/it's still great, anyway!"

I'm guessing you either actually were born in the early 90s or very, very late 80s and got CT as a handmedown from some older, RPG-playing relative or you were introduced to RPGs a little later in your vidya-playing life. It seems that every RPG fan's first RPG will be his favourite. And I say 'his' because very, very few vagina'd people play video games to any extent at all though, when they do, the games they play do tend to be RPGs. Anyway:

A friend of mine loves FF1 above most (all?) others.
Another loves EB above all others.
A third thinks Lunar 1&2 together on Sega CD make the best single RPG of all time (he considers them one game, for some reason).
Me? I love PS1 above most others (not all, but it's definitely the best of its generation of RPGs that I've played).
And what do all these things have in common? They're the first RPGs for each of us. People tend to romanticise milestones. First RPG is a /vr/otherly milestone.

>>2287219
For a game with a lot of forward and backward movement through time, it's very, very linear. Even the different endings are gotten linearly. You can get ending 1 up to the X-point in the story, then you can get ending 2 up to the Y-point in the story, then you can get ending 3 up to the Z-point in the story and so on. Woulda been nicer if the multiple endings were more dependent on what paths you chose along the way (like Demon's Crest) and how you altered the timeline by the endgame rather than how far along the story you were when you decided to kill an intergalactic, parasitic durianfruit.
Pic related: IRL Lavos.

>>2288480

>And, in case you've missed exactly what that is, you have admitted to claiming it's great because it's innovative, then had it pointed out that it's neither great nor innovative, then changed your tune to say "it's great because it's NOT innovative!/it's still great, anyway!"

Pure autism. I like the flavor of the game. That's it.

>I thought it was innovative.

> Others said it wasn't.

>I asked for specific examples of more innovative titles.

>Got shitposting instead.

>I called said shitposting out.

> Finally some kind soul(s) made a decent post citing previously desired examples.

> Oh shit, you're right! My mistake. I still like the game though. :)

>>2288495
>maximumdamagecontrol.png

>>2288340
>implying the same people are saying these very different things
Okay, bro

>>2288321
I'd hardly call Magus and Marle alike in personality at all. They're pretty much polar opposites. Magus and Ayla share a few characteristics, but you could say that same about Robo and Frog, and they're not related.

It's also very possible that Magus and Marle aren't actually related at all, given that Zeal is never shown to have any other children and neither Schala nor Magus have kids.

And I wouldn't say that Leene and Marle only differed in clothes or skin colour. Leene was a damsel in distress type who was otherwise fairly polite and well-to-do, whereas Marle was a whiny brat who just happened to be right more often than her father.

That said, I admitted I was being pedantic. I'm still being pedantic. Continuing to argue this point will get nothing but more pedantry from me.

>>2288736
I wasn't talking about anyone in the party. I was talking about Ozzie and Ozzie the Xteenth and Yakra/Chancellor and Yakra/Chancellor the Xteenth. Four hundred years about yet look exactly the same as their ancestors. It was meant as a joke, sperglord. Then again: what should I expect from someone who tries to apply realworld logic a goddamned video game.
An autist is you!

>>2288736
>one anon says game was good because it was innovative
>another anon later says that the game is good despite its lack of innovation
>that second anon admits to being the first anon
>"BUT THEY'RE NOT THE SAME PEOPLE!!" ::drooling and arm-flapping intensifies::
Thank you, Steven Bielsperg.

Who gives a shit whether it's "innovative" or not. What matters is if it's fun.

>>2289260
>damagecontrolcontinues.jpg

>>2289269

that was my first post in this thread. I'm not bothering to read your retarded essays.

>>2289309
>damagecontrolhasreachedcriticalmass.webm

>>2289317

ebin damage control meme

>what went right
Chrono Trigger. Right into the garbage. Where it belongs.

>>2289318
>not controlling the damage
Amateur.

let me wade into the middle of this and ask another question:

what's so bad about CT? what did it do wrong?

>>2280126

>What went right?

1.) good soundtrack

2.) A simple and easily digestible storyline. This is what people who like Cross but feel the need to shit on Trigger can't understand. Toriyama's character designs are perfect for the Dragonball-like adventure being told. This is also why in spite of the references to the first game, Cross feels like almost a completely different world altogether. The Chrono Trigger world is a pretty innocent and simple world facing the threat of a lovecraftian horror that can only be stopped by the power of teamwork and believing one's fate can change. Cross' style of storytelling is probably more in line with the Final Fantasies that came out on PS1. And Cross feels a bit darker too. Playing Trigger feels like I'm watching Slayers or Avatar: The Last Airbender, something like that.

3.) The characters are fun and quirky and at least for the time the game was released, had a surprising amount of depth and each had more or less complete character arcs (if you bothered with the sidequests). I'd say the least developed characters in the game are probably Crono and Lucca. Now, I'm not saying CT was the first to do this, but it was part of a generation of console RPG's that helped really change the genre's approach to the playable characters.

4.) The design itself has always been one of the most attractive to me. This was a bit of a disappointment I experienced with Cross' design overhaul.

5.) While the game isn't very hard, this, along with the multiple endings and sidequests I thought always gave it good replay value. Many other RPG's I've played have felt like such a chore that I'm rarely ever compelled to play through them again, even when I enjoyed the story.

It's like the dragon ball game we didn't have, bretty gud.

>>2281901
>A fucking spaceship.

Made by uneducated, enslaved peasants, no less, in a world were no such similar technology exists in any shape or form. Out of all artificial objects in Chrono's world across every time period, the Black Omen is the most advanced. It could even resist Lavos's ICBMs. Why didn't they use the same technology to protect the kingdom of Zeal?

>>2289770

>Why didn't they use the same technology to protect the kingdom of Zeal?

They did

I don't see why NG+ is so praised when the game is so simplistic and formulaic that going through it more than once is nothing but a chore. There are no subtleties in the story you only pick up on the second run, there are no changes to the gameplay except it being even easier. The characters are few, yet they're all interchangeable. Given that almost all fights are best fought just attacking physically ASAP, their different skills don't matter, adding even more to the tedium.

Going to fight Lavos at some arbitrary point in the game to trigger a different ending doesn't really make up for all this.

>>2288521
>>2289269
>>2289317
>>2289325

Mmmmm. So much autism. Feed me MOAR!

Somewhat agree with this. The endings don't really do much for me since the best ending wraps up the story perfectly fine to me.

Since the game is more a less the same going through, it's best to just watch the endings on youtube.

>>2289959

>I don't see why NG+ is so praised when the game is so simplistic and formulaic that going through it more than once is nothing but a chore.

I feel the opposite way. It's precisely because the game is so simple that replaying it is not a chore but more like just rewatching my favorite movie except I can say "Hm, which ending do I want today." And you have to understand that when it was released, the multiple endings deal and new game plus was something pretty innovative for console role playing games.