/vr/ - Retro Games

Thread theme song: http://youtu.be/XSjby9Kq7Xc

>>2239068
It's exciting, but always leads to disappointment in the end in my experience. You build up to fight the side boss cause it's crazy hard, you win and get something awesome. But now usually all that's left is the final boss who's a pushover by comparison, especially with the XP and loot you got from the side boss.

The only game that did this right in my thinking was Lunar 2 where the optional dungeons and bosses are in the epilogue after having beaten back the main enemy of the game.

>>2239068
>play through entire game saving red essences and rock candies
>inventory almost completely full
>Put lazy shell on peach
>Use all red essences and all rock candies
>Peach is immortal for healing to finish off whatever is left over

I never fought him straight up fairly ever, I don't even know what the different crystal attacks are.

>>2239242
I never realized that was the boss music from FF4.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OqGXfDpjZA

>>2239068
I prefer having to search for your ultimate equipment instead. Super hard ridiculously long boss fights are really the worst part of JRPGS in my opinion.

>>2239270

>The last boss of a normal playthrough is secret-after-the-end-of-the-game boss hard

Fuck you Bravely Default.

>>2239274
>Bravely Default
ummm... did you forget what board you are on?

>>2239270
>Super hard ridiculously long boss fights are really the worst part of JRPGS in my opinion.

Wow, really? Those are what I live for. I love boss fights that have you down to zero MP and scraping the bottom of your potion supply. When you think you're doomed to loose and half your party is dead but eek out a victory with one last slash...

>>2239294
that's great and all, but don't you get bored and frustrated when the battle lasts literally 3 hours?

>>2239292
You can't be that dumb.

>>2239310
dumb? how?
it's was released a couple years ago and it's not for a system that this board covers, the "style" of the game doesn't matter. Do you think we should start talking about indie "retro" gimmick games here too?

>>2239313
Do you bitch if someone say the name of a movie outside /tv/ too?
That's not even changing the subject, it's a mention, you can't possibly be that hypocrite.

>>2239321
these mentions of games that are outside of the boards rules always bring in a bunch of idiots that just want to talk about the newer games, go look at any metroid thread

>>2239294
I remember when I legitimately beat the first Breath of Fire for the first time, I tackled the final boss without the ultimate dragon transformation Agni, which the game strongly suggests you use. The battle lasted literally for hours, exhausting all of my resources, items and only the worst characters, that usually occupied the back slots of the party, remained on the last leg when Tyr disintegrated. It was an amazing experience and one of the most memorable RPG boss fights for me, even if I could have been just severely underequipped and underleveled.

Anyone knows any more bosses that legitimately challenge you for hours and cause you to exhaust all your resources before you can win? I've heard that Romancing SaGa final bosses are like that, but I've never got to one.

>try and fight Ashura
>get my ass kicked
>read the bookshelves
>oh, that's how you beat her
>also hints you on how to beat Bahamut

I don't know which is better; just plain hard bosses or gimmick/specific trick bosses

>>2239340
you know your life has taken a downturn when you talk about a battle in an RPG as if it was an epic conquest irl.

>>2239340
>Play FF7 for the second time
>The first time, a year previous, I made it to Sephiroth underleved and with shitty materia and gave up
>This time actually level up materia not retardedly
>Exploring the final cave
>Feel that I am underleveled in this second playthrough, but cannot remember where the point of no return is in the cave
>Stumble into Sephirtoh
>Well shit
>Might as well give it a go
>What follows is an hour and a half of back and forth, using elixirs and skills, and a generally well fought battle
>Suddenly, white flash and crack sound effect
>Oh shit, I actually beat him, I thought I was struggling to stay alive

Was a pleasant surprise.

>>2239308
Sure I would, but I've played almost every retro RPG out there and have never had a battle that was even close to that. What game are you thinking of?

>>2239345
Usually the just plain hard bosses are dps races. Healers heal every turn, damage dealers deal damage, rinse, repeat. I liked that FF4 changed it up a bit with some of their enemies like Ashura as you mentioned or the jellies whose weaknesses depend on their colors. They didn't expand on it as much as I'd like but it was a step in the right direction.

>>2239248
I see what you mean but back in the day (at least for me) it was almost guaranteed that you'd beaten the game at least once before you found out about such bosses. Then it gives me incentive to play it over again. These days it's difficult to have those kinds of secrets now that the internet's become a thing and you can just snag that stuff on your first playthrough..

>>2239268
that was the whole point m8

>>2239352
I'm legitimately jealous. The first time I got to Seph I was already stupidly powerful. I had heard about Supernova being this really cool but I also had a friend tell me he was easier than Kefka. Just as I was thinking, "maybe I should go a little easy on him, I would like to see Supernova..." he died on the very next attack.

Eventually I replayed it, partially with the goal of finally seeing that attack. But I had Cloud loaded up with Cover and a shit ton of counter attack stuff. So any attack on the party and he would block it and counter for like 180 000 damage or something insane like that.

Then I got to Seph and realized I'd forgotten to re-euip Cloud before the fight. So the entire final battle was all three characters throwing megalixers at him to keep him alive long enough to finally cast it.

It was worth it.

>>2239360
There are quite a few trick/gimmick bosses in FF13.

>>2239313
fez
braid
limbo
cave story
the order 1886

>>2239378
I'm a completionist. I got the Knights. I HAD to use them. I also had the same obvious Mimic idea.
I never had a really tough time with Seph in the few replays I've done.

>>2239403
Listen, it's not really that complicated. "Retro style" games do not count as retro games as far as this board is concerned. Shovel Knight was made to look like an 8bit game, but it's not. Besides, most of those except Cave Story really aren't even "retro styled"

If you want to talk about Bravely Default or any of the others there's /v/ freely available and usually some appropriate threads in /vg/ as well.

>>2239420
Which is kind of the problem with optional bosses in general. The stuff you have to do just to get knights alone is way more challenging than Sephiroth.

>>2239427
>Discussing problems with KOTR
>Not mentioning how critical it was to beating Emerald/Ruby Weapon

>>2239573
>Beat Final Fantasy 7
>Never have I gotten Knights of the Round, or have I beaten Ruby or Emerald weapon
I beat the one that flies around a bunch, but all that other shit is just like "Why?"

>>2239582
Those battles are by far the most challenging in game content, even at level 99. You can't just outgrind them; need to concoct some gnarly materia combos. Makes you feel like king bonobo of the FF7 world.

>>2239582
It's been so many years, but I thought you got knights for beating one of them. Or was that just from doing the gold chocobo shit?

Anyways, I remember them being tough and very tough compared to most of the game but really not that crazy if you devoted someone to healing each round. The only real trick is one of them (Ruby I think) has a move that hits all your characters for 9999 damage so you have to have Life attached to a Counter Skill Materia or something weird.

>>2239378
do people consider sephiroth/the game in general hard? i didnt do any sidequests or leveling and i just had equipment i found along the way and didnt even know how materia worked at all, yet i never died once in my entire playthrough. was i just lucky, or...?

>>2239635
Ruby is vulnerable to status ailment. Just summon Hades and then wreck him.

The Wild Arms series had some great optional bosses.

>>2239340
If you don't use your dragon forms on Myria in BOFIII she's very similar. An extremely nasty boss that makes Rei almost completely useless. (It seems like her AI will just instantly use mass dispell if you try and use weretiger/control combo.) As I recall there's a dagger Rei can steal from a fight that kind of takes away the suck.

>>2239248
What if there was a game that upgraded the final boss if you fought a secret boss first, to result in a better ending? Would that diminish the "secret" element of the secret boss too much?

Anyway, I like it when optional bosses have a bit of lore to them. Like outside of the game's main narrative, people tell legends of these powerful creatures that dwarf the villain in power. Then when you finally fight one it seems like a supernatural event.

>>2241720
Guy you're responding to here, I think that would be potentially really awesome. It sounds a little familiar too, I think something like that has been done but I can't put my finger on it at the moment.

>>2241750
Star Ocean 2 is sort of like that.

Rhapsody has a pretty good optional dungeon.

In Dark Law, completing the optional dungeon changes the ending.

In the SaGa series, several of the games let you choose to fight a powered up version of the final boss, or choose to fight it without weakening it by fighting it's penultimate aspects, making the final boss the hardest challenge available.

Any examples from games that aren't turn-based RPGs? I love secrets and hidden levels in games, but I really don't like Menus: the Game.

>>2241802
Didn't most of the Star Ocean/Valkyrie Profile games do that? I definitely remember being able to power up the final boss in SO2 so much that you needed to level up in the secret dungeon just to beat him, I forgot if they actually gave you the option to power up the bosses in SO1/3 or VP2 though, or if the dungeon is just there for shits and giggles

>>2241907
Demon's Crest and SotN come to mind.

Also, most of the Touhou games have neat bonus bosses.

>>2241720
Star Ocean 2 had an optional side quest that, once completed, made the final boss way fucking harder.
The point the quest can be done is fairly close to the beginning of a 60hr+ game, too.

In my case, I did the quest without knowing what the fuck was happening. Then I got to the final boss and he slapped my shit down so hard.

>>2241968
How did you accidentally do the Filia PA in Klik(sp?) AND the PA in Central City after having already saved at the final save point? Doesn't seem like something one would accidentally do.

>>2239292
>>2239313
>>2239324
>>2239421
You fucking morons. You can really tell this place is going to shit when people start discussing the rules in specific.

The guy literally mentioned a game, MENTIONED a game, which isn't retro, and you fags start derailing the topic and shitting everything up.

I hate this place. Even /vr/ is shit, and I thought that would be the last place to go since most of the oldfags are here.

>>2241907
Lots of shmups have true final bosses, especially ones with two loops, such as Hibachi in the Dodonpachi series.

>>2242001
Pretty sure it's posts like yours and letting juvenile /v/ culture slide on this board that's making /vr/ shit.

Letting things slide is EXACTLY why /v/ turned to shit, among other things as well.

>>2242123
Seconded

>>2241914
I haven't played Valkyrie Profile in ages but I seem to remember a secret dungeon at the end that if you did a certain set of events correctly you got the secret GOOD ending. I've never been able to do it nor do I want it spoiled for me before I eventually do.

>>2242207
You only need a high rating at the valhalla war at the end of every chapter. It's impossible to get in your first playthrough even if you know the right order.
There is, however, a secret chapter or two that require specific actions to unlock.

>>2241907
Castlevania: Rondo of Blood is probably the best example. There's an entire secret route through the game, with its own unique bosses and everything. It gives the game double the replay value.

>>2242251
to get the good ending you have to get those secret events, good ratings alone don't do shit

>>2242286
http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/199175-valkyrie-profile/faqs/7190

>>2242001
>50 responses
>5 people point out that we're not here to talk about new games
>Rest of the topic is interesting discussions

Then this guy comes along to have a tantrum over it.

You're acting like a child. Most of us here are probably at least as old as you are and even the ones who aren't are far more mature.

I always wanted to beat that bastard side boss in the alexandria castle library (Final Fantasy 9)...

But give up after 5 tries because fuck it.