/vr/ - Retro Games

>>2107835
It's not. Fallout 2 isn't either.

Both are great.

Fallout 1 has the better story and is probably more fun for your first playthrough. It heavily favors Speech/Small Guns characters so there's less variety for repeat plays.

Fallout 2 is more open world and less focused. There are more viable builds so it's more fun for repeat plays. The opening is crap, but don't waste your time punching the ants, just run past everything. You'll get a gun soon enough and then the game becomes fun.

Stat ranking for both games:
Agility > Intelligence > Perception > Endurance > Luck > Strength > Charisma (almost completely useless in FO1, still bad in FO2).

Theoretically you don't want to max out any stat in chargen for optimum late game stats, but Agility 10 is so useful early game that I always take it.

Best trait in both games: Gifted (so good it almost feels like cheating)
Best perk in both games: Better Criticals

Perks are very valuable, don't waste them on things you could get through other means.

>>2107835
I went back to play fallout 2 and its a much different experience that can be rewarding but frustrating. Check it out if you like the series.

>>2107861
Thanks, that was very helpful. I'll start off with the first one then move to the second. I loved Fallout 3, it's probably one of the most memorable and immersing games I've played in the past 10 years, so naturally I wanted to check out the other games.

I'd recommend trying it but if you can't get into the game I think it's understandable. It's design is very dated at this point. Not necessarily archaic but it's missing some functionality to it. FO2 fixes some of these problems but not all.
If you can get behind the way the game plays, I think FO 1 and 2 are still very much worthwhile. It just takes some patience. You WILL die. You WILL fail. The game is not forgiving but it's more to give you an original experience than to be a hard game.

>>2107861

charisma isn't very useful, but it can do interesting things if turned up to 10. one time I tried that and the girl in shady sands told me about deathclaws early in the game.

luck is even better turned up to 10, you'll find a crashed ufo with a highly effective plasma gun.

oh yea, and if you go to the raiders camp, the leader thinks you're the ghost of his dead father, lulz. I forget whether max luck or charisma triggers that though.

fallout 1 looks dated but its fun, great western rpg, and the writing is well done. the master is one of my fav villains.

>>2107835
What about Wasteland

>>2107908
Wasteland is a game that makes me sigh heavily.
Like....I get it. At the time it was groundbreaking. But....it really aged poorly. It's really hard to figure out any semblance of an idea of what you should be doing. Some of the stats just don't do anything because I guess the game was released unfinished? You have to navigate menu after menu after menu after menu just to do the simplest of tasks. Combat is actually the only thing in the game that aged great.
Here's an example of the jankiness of Wasteland 1. The first quest you find is a kid who is crying. You talk to him and it opens a keyword prompt but he only responds to two words and there's, like, infinite words. So how do you find out what to say? Go to the store and read a sign on the wall talking about a dog on the loose. Except there's no visual sign on the wall, you just hafta KNOW that there's a sign on a wall if you walk into the wall at this one spot. So after that ya talk to the kid and say "Dog" and he runs off crying telling you not to kill his dog who he hid in a cave near the river. But there's no visual indication of a cave so you just walk around mashing the search action until you discover a cave. Then you kill the dog and are promptly chased out of the town for being an evil, evil dog killer.
So, you can see how it's a cool idea but it's way too raw and unrefined.

>>2107861
>heavily favors Speech/Small Guns characters

No. The game heavily favors the Turbo Plasma Rifle, that's what.

>>2107907
You need 6 Luck for Better Criticals but it's probably not worth going higher than that unless you really want the rare encounters.

>>2107948
Then pick Energy Weapons as your third tag skill, if you don't mind it only being useful late game.

>>2107979
You don't even have to tag it, you can just start upgrading it late in the game and you won't miss that much.

>>2107979
>tagging energy weapons

Absolutely no need.

I almost always tag speech, science, and sneak

both games pretty much

far better than being really good at guns is having a really good gun and a near endless supply of ammunition and stimpacks, so sneak is the way to go, fleece everyone

speech and science just get you shitloads of free experience and easy ways to solve problems

>>2107885
keep in my f3 shits on the lore pretty heavily

>>2108434
>this
My face when I went from Fallout 3 to Fallout 1 and saw a complete tonal shift from wackiness to grim pessimism.
Not that FO3 isn't a fun game, it's just....it's really very different.

>>2108434
not really. It plays it a bit safe, but it's understandable considering they had to introduce the fallout world to a new audience.

>>2108452
fallout 2 is the wackiest of the series. 3 is like a mix of 1 and 2 in terms of tone.

>>2108541
I've extensively played 1 and 3 and I've played a bit of 2 but not very far into it. It's sorta a project I'm preparing to work on soon. I didn't know it was that major of a tonal shift, I've only done the first town after the tribe and things weren't TOO weird.

1 has actually more replay value than 2 because of power armor.
You can get PA so soon in 2 that it'll screw any roleplay builds.

>>2109269
...just make it a point not to meta-game and don't go to Navarro immediately at the start, duh. Roleplay builds shouldn't involve that much metagaming anyway.

>>2109293
no matter how hard you try, after the first playthrough, it'll always be in the back of your head, torturing you and your builds.

>>2109301
I've beaten both games numerous times in many ways and I never bother with doing that because it just plainly isn't fun to me.

Then again most of my rolls nowadays are pretty crippled characters involving traits like Bruiser or being Throwing specialists, so I'm not really worried about being any powerful or my builds being optimal.

>>2107885
I think you're in for a treat, Anon. Played 1/2/3 in that order, and really enjoyed all three. Without spoiling it for you, I think you're going to enjoy meeting the younger versions of a certain older character.

1 > NV > 2 > 3

>>2109369
What about Tactics?

>>2109369
Anyone with any other opinion would have really, really poor taste.

>>2109389
Not a real Fallout game, but its really fun if
A) you are playing multiplayer
B) you are playing low points (2k)
C) you are playing with house rules to limit broken shit
D) You have 4 player minimum, the more the better. Once it becomes a complete clusterfuck, camping becomes harder and the lack of balance doesn't matter so much.

The single player is atrocious and it is not balanced at all.

fallout 2 is fun in the way that you can make a character with 2 Str and maximized critical hits who can barehanded destroy any human opponent by punching them in the head for an instantaneous knock out, then molesting their prone corpse with finishing moves.

The whole boxing sequence of the game is hilarious, you just wreck them by viciously detaching retinas and and shit, even though you're like, some tiny little girl.

I've played through Fallout 1 multiple times, but every time I try to get into 2 I just end up getting bored and losing interest at some point; I think the farthest I've ever gotten was somewhere around New Reno or Vault City.

How do I enjoy Fallout 2?

No, fallout 3 is when the series got good

>>2107919
Another "interesting" feature of Wasteland is that the game often says things like "Refer to paragraph 19" and you have those paragraphs in the manual/textfile, which contain the actual text/dialog.

I would never blame anyone if they refuse to play Wasteland.

>>2107835
I really enjoyed fallout 1. The combat is a bit confusing and frustrating (since you can miss point-blank shots and melee attacks at the start of the game) in the early game, but it gets better after you catch some gear and get a few levels.

I didn't finish fallout 2 yet. I ended up in a very shitty situation in FO2, but then again this happened when i first played fallout 1, so i'm going to give another go on FO2. Didn't really like FO2's story either.

1 has the better VAs, can't beat Tony Schaloub and RDA.
And Tandi is somewhat likeable at least, unlike that bag of sour lemon that is in 2

I think FO1 is the better overall game (story, atmosphere, pacing, etc), but FO2's replayability is unmatched. Yeah its a bit goofy sometimes but theres hardly anything better in gaming than supersledging it up with your tribal bro sulik, driving around, banging mob wives and their daughters all while huffing dat jet

>>2109369
have played only 1&2
is NV really that good?

>>2110295
it's not, it's endlessly venerated here because it's miles better than 3 (which isn't that hard, considering what clusterfuck that game was)

>>2110325
3 > NV though

>>2110325
My theory is that people were not ready for 3D fallout game, no matter how good.
>Not muh
I remember people posting crazy videos about first-person perspective being a killer to the series, etc.

Once you accept the fact that Fallout is now an Elder Scrolls game, you can judge the game more fairly, thus NV had an edge.

Personally, NV > F3.

>>2110346
>street_fighter_II_laugh.wav

>>2110295
no. /v/ started praising it loudly and overbearingly because 3 was still more popular so now everyone just parrots.

What are the best builds for FO2? I want to play it again, and actually finish it this time.

>>2110375
I went back and tried to play fo3 with all the stability tweaks and it still crashes every 15-30 minutes just like it always did :/

This topic is teetering dangerously not retro so I will just go out and say it. If you are a die hard FO fan i highly recommend checking out Wasteland2. Its rough around the edges but it definatley scratches the Fallout itch.

>>2109301
That's true. The first time I beat the game was back when the game first came out, so I played through it without any FAQs or outside help. It was a fantastic experience, although I had to restart once or twice due to bugs (this was before the 1.02 patch came out).

Anyway, once I found out about the power armor being available at the beginning of the game, I would attempt to get it in my later playthroughs of the game. Each of those playthroughs ended up being unfinished due to boredom and lack of interest. Henceforth I forced myself to only visit areas that are unlocked (or made visible, rather) by NPCs, and the game became enjoyable once more.

>>2110504
Melee is one of the easier and cheaper builds.
Sneak, Melee Weapons and whatever you want for third skill (probably Speech).

Basically you just get a super sledge, sneak up behind someone, bash them 6+ tiles away, enter stealth and repeat.

1 is probably the best Fallout game overall. Great writing, story and atmosphere. Great for a playthrough, but not that fun on repeated plays.

2 is the superior sandbox game though. Fallout 1 is good for actually beating the game, F2 is amazing for just fucking around the map, exploring, doing random wacky shit or roleplaying. Up there with classic The Elder Scrolls games for actually "living" in the world, if you're into that sorta stuff.

Also I never got the NV meme. I only played it as much as F3, which is like 40 minutes before I got bored and went and reinstalled F2. What exactly makes it so much better than 3, and even 2? I know this is not the board for this, but on /v/ it's the in thing to shit on the older Fallouts now, so here it could earn more fruitful responses.

Would you guys recommend the Restoration Patch for a first time playthrough of Fallout 2 from http://www.killap.net/ or just the standard bugfix patch by the same guy?

>>2110537
Altho I liked NV, I don't think it's better than 2, so can't help you here. Being better then 3 is "explained" in this thread, but I do agree it's more of a /v/ meme, then objective judgment.

I agree with guys saying F1 is better game, but F2 better sandbox. Fire them up depending on the mood.

1>2>>>>>tactics>NV>>>3

>>2110542
Neither.

For a first time playthrough just play it with the latest OFFICIAL patch.

Don't let retarded fan made patches that only fuck up what was working and add broken stupidities ruin your first experience of it.

>>2110598
But the latter patch only fixes bugs. Why would it break things or add things on?

>>2110604
I'm telling you from my experience with Master of Magic.

Sure, it solved some of the mechanics. But do you know what it does also? It causes a crash to desktop 50% of the time a new map is created.

>>2110579
Also why is Tactics considered subpar? Never played it, never touched it, never even seen any gameplay on Youtube or whatever. Can someone give me a rundown of it?

>some people here consider the bethesda games to be real fallout games.

>>2110640
Tactics is basically Fallout without any of the story or RPG elements.

Well, there are, but the focus on combat is so great that it overshadows any kind of plot or atmosphere.

>>2110529
>mfw killing any enemy with unarmed attacks + bloody mess (and leather armor)
Began playing, managed to a lot of stuff much faster and easier with this build than with my old one. Thanks for the tip.

>>2110730
How is the fo: tactics' combat? I got it for free (alongardes FO2) on Gog, and mi might give it a go.

>>2110876
I had fun with the campaign, finished it like three times. You can choose between real-time and turn-based combat, and i feel like the real-time is the way to go, that game didn't have as good turn-based as first two games. Overall decent, liked it more than both F3 and NV

reminder that this was FO3.
If this is superior, I don't know what to say.

>>2110958
they're different games entirely. let it go.

>>2110967
that's the problem.

>>2110967
was for 3 / NV
NV has flaws, but it's written much better. And has some 1/2 music in it.

And ED-E

>>2110876
>How is the fo: tactics' combat?

Bad. the AI has two patterns: rush into melee or go prone and overwatch. Boring beyond belief. As I said earlier, though:
>>2109907
It is fun in large multiplayer games.

>>2110573
I haven't visited /v/ since before Fallout 3 was released. It has bad writing, bad graphics (fault of the engine, but the lighting is awful), dumb characters, and a really stupid story. It has good points. The energy weapons are a blast, and with proper mods, you can get that Fallout feel from it (fellout is good).

NV has a coherent feel to it (unlike 3 and to a lesser degree 2), a decent story, likable characters, and is more structured with the side quests popping up at logical points. The "talky" skills actually matter and quests can be resolved in multiple ways. It feels like Fallout 3, if Fallout 3 were an RPG, basically. Graphics are still fugly, but that can't really be helped on the Oblivion engine.

>>2110537
>What exactly makes it so much better than 3, and even 2?

Fallout New Vegas it's the real Fallout 3.

>>2110542
My advice for first playthrough is FO2 Unofficial patch+children patch if you have european or GOG version+sfall+hi res patch. Then, if you will like it, you can try the RP.

>>2110512
what about Gaia last days?

>>2111825
Alright, then. That's what I did for FO1, so I assumed similar was for FO2.

>>2110542
If you want to end Sulik's quest to find his sister, the Restoration patch is the only way. Other than that, it adds OWB 0.5 (a self-contained location, which is as annoying as the NV's DLC) and raises the encounter rate a lot, to make the Outdoorsman skill useful, or at least that's the intention.

>>2109907
>Anyone with any other opinion would have really, really poor taste.
but it's just like your opinion man

>>2111794
if only the world and landscape wasn't so boring and the strip wasn't a complete disappointment, Freeside was more interesting and the strip had such a huge buildup only to be mediocre

>>2110976
>And has some 1/2 music in it
Yeah but it used it so lazily. I think I even heard the Modoc theme in some guy's house at one point. Didn't make any sense. Also it clashed with the game's original music because of how different it was.

>>2110295
Yes. It's really good. I didn't like Fallout 3 but FNV gave me the comfy Fallout 1/2 and 'I'm playing a good RPG' vibes again.

I doubt any of the people hating NV here have actually played it (or played Fallout 1 or 2 any time recently to have a fresh opinion).

The good:

A MASSIVE world to explore with unique & interesting locations, NPCs, secrets, treasure etc (way better in this regard than the original games).

Cool factions.

Good writing and enjoyable quests for the most part. Like in 1/2 you can play a diplomat and forget combat almost entirely (use a companion to handle random encounters if you must).

A proper Brotherhood bunker.

An economy that doesn't go to shit once you clear out the Khans in FO1 or the Raiders hideout in FO2 due to breakable equipment.

The bad:

Visual style - Gamebryo is shit. FO1/2 still look pretty. You have to man up and take it, I guess. It's not that bad once you get used to it.

Combat. All Fallouts are bad in this regard so it's nothing new.

>>2114481
in bad, you forgot inventory and crafting ui.
1/2 were awful in that, and despite the time gap between 2 and 3/NV, inventory is still hit, because of that gimmick pipboy3000 ui

>>2114510
There were tons more good and tons more bad that I didn't mention. The specifics don't matter because I found the game enjoyable overall and it gave me that Fallout fix that Fallout 3 failed to give.

Same way that this year I found Dragonfall, M&MX and Lords of Xulima enjoyable despite their (undoubtedly) very many flaws and kinks - M&MX not even being a properly finished game.

Fallout and Fallout 2 are one of the best games ever and I'm kinda surprised about people saying they didn't age well or that they have poor mechanics. The games have great setting and art style that doesn't get old and looks just as good today as it did when they came out. Comparing the graphics to the new Wasteland 2, I'd take Fallouts any day. I first played them around 2000 and I really recommend you to read the manual before playing (it's written as a guide to the world and it's really funny, worth reading), otherwise you'll be a bit lost in mechanics, which are great when you familiarize yourself with them. I liked the original Fallout better than the sequel, mainly because of the great story and the ending. Fallout 2 ads some cool things like a car and party members. The original is definitely more memorable.

Fallout Tactics did stupid things like add guns that didn't exist at that period and overall things that don't fit the setting. I still liked it but without the exploration and quests, it wasn't very motivated to keep playing. Tried to play it twice and both times I quit 1/3rd into it. I'll give it another try eventually.

I haven't played Fallout 4 or New Vegas yet but from what I've seen they can't stand up to originals.

>>2114624
> they didn't age well
To a degree they didn't. Putting aside story quality, visuals and such the simple fact is that when released, Fallout 1 and 2? Actually pretty darn buggy. The fact that these bugs are generally fixed by the time people find them nowadays doesn't change that.

They were worse than Fallout 3 and Fallout: NV in terms of how glitchey they were at launch, by a clear margin. That's part of why older players are a bit frustrated to see them held up QUITE so high: it's not really fair to compare 'years after the last bug was found and fixed' games against sequels without, you know, making the same allowance.
>looks just as good today as it did when they came out.
That's not really an objective fact - relative to 'liking a retro look' it could be considered nice, but at face value it's not in and of itself great in-game art.
>I haven't played Fallout 4 or New Vegas yet but from what I've seen they can't stand up to originals.
This is kind of the fundamental problem with this view: how on earth can you know whether one's more fun or not when you haven't even tried it?

>>2114624
Fallout 1 and 2 aged very well, IMO. There are patches to play them in 1920x1080 with scaled everything + speed-up.

1, 2 and NV form a complete trilogy in my mind. You can pretend BoS and part 3 never happened (though I did like BoS back when I was a teen).

>>2114658

>not great in-game art
actually means >not high polygon in game art

not the same thing bro

is there a way to make custom Fallout stories for 1 or 2?

Fallout 2 Restoration Patch, anyone?

>>2114760
It's not very good. Same level of fanfic writing as FIXT for Fallout 1. Added/restored content is of very dubious quality.

>>2114481
>A MASSIVE world to explore
Which is incredibly boring beyond some obvious points of interests. There is nothing to find even with the wild wasteland perk, just a bunch of empty radio shacks and huge stretches of desert. The original games had no pretense of exploration beyond locations marked on your map, so all that empty desert wasn't an issue.
>Good writing
Kinda, but the NPC's felt like exposition machines where they dump all kinds of info on you as soon as you ask them a question. Fallout 1-2 had a little bit of that but they at least tried to keep it relevant instead of giving you each character's back story when you ask them their name.
>Cool factions.
Only on paper. They don't ever meaningfully interract in the game.
>A proper Brotherhood bunker
Oh wow it's fucking nothing
>An economy that doesn't go to shit
It doesn't go to shit but it's never actually good either. As long as you're willing to deal with walking back a bit slower than usual every once in a while, you can pretty much be swimming in caps throughout the entire game.

>>2114793
Use JSawyer mod + play on hardcore, you won't be swimming in dosh and sleepwalking over stuff until you're almost done with the game.

Unlike, say, Fallouts 1/2 where you're swimming in money (or, more precisely, barter material). I don't think there are mods that fix this properly.

(I'm not talking about metagaming here, just playing it normally - e.g. killing the Khans which is done as as soon as you get Ian nets you enough gold to buy anything you will ever need)

>writing
Fallout 1 writing overall felt pretty bland with some notable exceptions like the Master. Fallout 2 stood out for its self-referential humor which some found jarring but I personally enjoyed. FNV got back to being more serious but managed to keep some Mad Max style irony that gave Fallout 2 its charm.

>infodumping
As for infodumping of FNV - I replayed F1/2 back to back a few weeks ago and I don't see how the NPCs there are superior. Some NPCs simply don't even any real dialogue when they should (e.g. Harold - hi, fix the reactor, kthxbye; Ian - hey, need help? k. etc etc).

>factions
Factions - did they ever properly interact in F1/2? Caesar's Legion was a bitty shitty, I admit. They run out time there probably.

>exploration
Don't know about you, but I found exploration in FNV really fun. Sort of like the Gothics where you could find something really cool and unexpected just around the corner instead of the devs simply putting you on rails from beginning to end.

FNV is far from perfect and its biggest fault by far is the shitty engine. If you manage to get past that, however, I still think it's a worthy successor to the Fallouts of old.

>>2114724

Tactics and BoS are non-canon anyway.

>>2114781

I thought the RP stuff was pretty good overall. Obviously, it's gonna be a bit rough around the edges, but overall everything at least feels like it fits in.

Well, except the EPA. I honestly don't know how to feel about that one.

>>2107979
The library in The Hub solves all skill problems.
If you're walking around with a pocket full of caps wondering wtf you're supposed to do with all this shit, buy books. You can train most skills up to 95% with the library.

>>2110608
It' sbetter in FO2. FO2 was already a piece of shit. Bugfix makes it much more enjoyable

>>2110598
>>2110608

I never suffered any issues as a result of the Fallout 2 UP or even the RP.

>>2114910
>economy
I did play normally, and I'm really not getting where you're coming from. Everyone you fight has so much loot on them that I had to give stuff away for free due to merchants not having the caps to trade. I guess the thing that made the Fallout 1-2 economies more rough for me is that going for a low endurance character there is harshly punished until you get the power armors. Also the lack of instant travel, I guess.
>infodumping
There is a lot of infodumping in New Vegas, especially when you go to Vegas and everyone seems to be a walking encyclopedia. I get that some of it is just trying to ease people into the world, but do I really need detailed background of the relationships between the NCR and Legion in every area I go to? In the beginnings of FO1 and to some extent FO2 the dialogue was kept to a minimum and most people were more cold and hostile instead of willing to chat.
>Factions - did they ever properly interact in F1/2?
Not a whole lot, but it fits much more with those types of games. A good chunk of the world was described to you with flavor text and there wasn't much room for faction fights besides random encounters. NV could show the factions fighting each other in the pretty big overworld and maybe some territory takeovers here and there, but it didn't. People just kinda stand around.
>Exploration
I completely disagree with the exploration part. I remember going off to the lower right parts of the map because it was a huge chunk of wasteland off the beaten path excited to explore. After about 30-40 minutes of running around all I found were some Legion camps, geckos and a radio shack or two. The Gothic games, on the other hand, have a lot of cool things hidden in bizarre locations you don't even think are explorable at first.

I don't know, I keep trying to get into the game because of people who claim it's very similar in spirit to FO 1-2, but I'm not feeling that at all.

>>2110295

yes, especially modded

>>2110346

nice b8

>>2110346

>>2115182
>>2110346
They're both total shit

>>2115208
Seriously. Same shitty gameplay, graphics, atmosphere, characters, everything. It's like if reddit had made a game and put what they thought is good into it

>>2110537
New Vegas is fun because it pick it up from FO2 and puts on the new engine without being as retarded as FO3

it's not better than 1 and 2. it's just fun and feels like a fallout game. if you're in for more fallout, it's a nice option

>>2115218

0/10

>>2115221
That and FNV is linear as shit like FO3 was.

>>2115251
No it isn't.

And even though I think its kind of shitty, 3 isn't linear all. You can even skip like half the main quest simply by having played it before and knowing where to go.

>>2115251

>NV is linear as shit
>FO3 is linear as shit

>>2115254
>3 isn't linear

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAA hooooo

>>2115257
I typo'd, I meant to type isn't for FNV...


FO3 has the exact same storyline that you can really only skip parts of, not fully disregard until you stumble into the ending.
>Fuck tracking down Benny (original plot point) I'm joining the NCR
>Following NCR's orders will take you too the end.

That and there's some ambiguity in your actions. FO3 was just like "THIS IS EVIL THOUGHT YOU SHOULD KNOW TOTALLY EEEEEEVIIIIILLL"

>>2115262

3 isn't "linear" outside of the main quest, which /is/ painfully linear. At least you can skip it for the most part since it gives you basically no reward for following the story.

And I really don't get what you're on about in the second half of your post.

>>2115251
>>2115254
>>2115257
>>2115262
>>2115270

MODS MODS MODS

>>2107835

Both Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 are great games.

Here's my rough lineup for them:

Fallout 1 is a tight post-apocalyptic story. It's kind of downbeat, but has some really cool areas (the hub, necropolis, the glow, etc.). The writing is tight, there aren't a whole lot of weapons, the characters aren't super memorable (beyond, say, Harold or the Overseer or Gizmo), but it all comes together really tightly.

Fallout 2 feels a bit more like people have settled in. Civilization is coming back along, there are larger towns with more going on in them, more guns exist, and just generally there are more things going on. The writing is better and more varied, the locations are more and varied, the quests are good, and overall it's a better if less focused game than Fallout 1.

Fallout 3 I got about half-way through and stopped playing. The graphics are a little janky, but that's forgivable. The world has a seemingly small amount of items that matter, the characters are semi-forgettable, and the tone just seemed off. The writing wasn't great, the locations were kinda cool but meh, and overall I just didn't care about the characters or what I was doing enough to finish.

Fallout New Vegas was kind of the 3D version of everything I liked about Fallout 2. It had a lot of items and weapons, many memorable characters and locales, and the world just felt like there was a lot going on after humanity had time to rebuild. The DLC had some pretty amazing writing; the tone of, say, Dead Money or Lonesome Road was amazing coherent and dark, and the humor in Old World Blues was really well done.

Fallout Tactics is a really solid tactics game with minimal RPG elements. It kind of builds a bunch of other nonsense onto the fallout canon but still respects it (unlike the goofy shit in 3), though it has a little zany humor in places. If you don't mind the lack of meaningful conversations and character arcs, it's a pretty great game (with some dumb bug and design decisions).

>>2115275

Cry some more.

>>2115278
(continued)

I'd suggest playing them in this order:

FO1 -> FO2 -> FO:NV -> FO:Tactics

In order of personal preference:

F3 <<< FO1 < FO2 == FO:NV < Arcanum

>>2115279
Ok if we're gonna discuss F3/NV lets do it right. Sure imagination can be used to make up a lot of its shortcomings but here are the facts

>best way to kill anything is by pausing the game
>real time combat is horrible
>it's in an fps view mode
>there aren't any vehicles yet it aspires to be like mad max
>it looks like SHIT
>there's no sexy girls (and i mean they went out of their way to make the females ugly)
>you don't actually have any freedom to go anywhere or deathclaws will get you
>the quests suuuuck
>glitches and overall jaggedness of it's 3d engine

Seriously compare a mission in fallout 3 to another highly rated shooter. Why would you ever choose fallout? Just because it can be done in an open world with dialogue choices doesn't make it good.

And don't even mention modding the game or I'll call mods on all you again

>>2115278
>Fallout Tactics is a really solid tactics game

It really isn't. It is tedious and not well designed.

Fallout 2 is amazing and i got really into with the high resolution patch. I did a could of quests but I really don't know what I'm supposed to be doing

>>2115525
Find a GECK, Chosen One

>>2115251
NV is only linear till the Goodsprings-Primm-Nipton-Novac part, and even then you can skip it if you want/know what you're doing. Hell most of my characters won't even see Vegas till level 20 or more because i keep doing shit everywhere else. And the options for your endings/allegiances are more varied than most of the games out there (even more varied than the original fallouts even)

Fallout 3 is linear as fuck. You are the Lone Wanderer. You HAVE to find your dad. You HAVE to pass the same places. The same metro stations. You HAVE to cross through LL, Tranquility Lane, and you HAVE to help the brotherhood and fight the Enclave, nothing else allowed.

I know you're just trolling but some people actually really think like that, so the post is valid anyway.

if you're going to playing F2 again

whatever you do

download the Restoration MOD

>>2115173
what mods should i get for NV to get the best experience?

>>2115650
JSawyer mod

That's about it.

>>2115650
jsawyer
CCO is good too

>>2112140
bump

>>2115298
no bows & crossbows

>>2115602
>You HAVE to find your dad. You HAVE to pass the same places. The same metro stations. You HAVE to cross through LL, Tranquility Lane, and you HAVE to help the brotherhood and fight the Enclave, nothing else allowed.

Eh, the game becomes a lot less linear when you exploit the bugs. You ever seen the FO3 speedrun? It's like a half hour and doesn't really do any of the story missions. Would've been a lot shorter if not for that damned intro sequence.

>>2115298

>best way to kill anything is by pausing the game
What?
>real time combat is horrible
I've definitely had worse. It is functional, even if it is clunky.
>it's in an fps view mode
That's not necessarily a bad thing, as much as I like the isometric Fallouts.
>there aren't any vehicles yet it aspires to be like mad max
That's really quite irrelevant. Did you even play Fallout 1 and 2? 2 had ONE car that was operational, and even then you had to find the parts to fix it. Then it took energy weapon ammo to fuel it up.
>it looks like SHIT
They do. I blame Bethesda. They've been using the same game engine since Morrowind, and then they made Obsidian base NV off of FO3, adding to the shittiness.
>there's no sexy girls (and i mean they went out of their way to make the females ugly)
In FO3? True. Bethesda can't make faces with their own tech. New Vegas, though? Obsidian did a lot better at making non-fugly people.
>you don't actually have any freedom to go anywhere or deathclaws will get you
But that's wrong. FO3 didn't have the "railroading" that NV does, and even in NV you can get around all that with some creativity and a bit of luck.
>the quests suuuuck
Subjective.
>glitches and overall jaggedness of it's 3d engine
Glitches are a fact of life with RPGs. I can't name one RPG that wasn't terribly riddled with bugs. I'm not defending the bugs, but you really need to just deal with it if you like RPGs.

And what do you mean by "overall jaggedness?"

>>2115890
by pausing the game he meant the VATs thing that paused action so you could select a body part to attack then initiated a cutscene of your character shooting/slashing the enemy. It was obviously a homage to FO1/2's turn based combat but it was just kind of dumb

>>2115650

>Should've Been In The Game Already Tier

Fellout (removes orange tint, darker nights)
JSawyer mod
Centered Third Person View (or whatever it's called)
Classic Carry Weight (okay, I will admit I made that one, but it's still recommendable)

>Great tier

Classic Fallout Weapons
More Perks and More Traits (plus the DLC ones)
Weapon Mods Expanded (IIRC, there are two with a similar title and similar function. Pick one and go with it.)
Project Nevada (for when you need a complete overhaul)

>Everything else

See here: http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/

>>2115893

Oh, VATS? Yeah, that was overpowered, not the least bit because you take HALF damage during VATS sequences. Mods remove the damage reduction and it really balances it out a bit more. Still OP, but at least now you're somewhat vulnerable.

I don't even like 3 that much, it is easily the worst real fallout game (excluding BoS, tactics, etc) and arguably not a real fallout game. But this "muh nonlinear" shit is obnoxious. The original Fallout isn't very nonlinear.

>>2115940

wat. Do you even know what nonlinear means?

>>2115961
Yes. Fallout 1 is a short game with 2 objectives required to beat it (in order). Get the Water Chip, then stop the Mutants. In 1.0 both are timed and the second quest got unstable if you didn't do it in a certain order. Fallout 3 has a dozen major questlines that can be done in any order. Granted, you don't really want to do them unless you want cheevos because they are all pretty boring, but they are there.

>>2115875
>The game gets less linear when you don't play it the way developers intended.

Well shit, that must been that Fallout 2 is an MMO too right? Since I can mod that in...

FO1 feels so empty and nonreactive at times. Whacked Gizmo for Killian, went over to talk to the boxer at the ring. He keeps telling me he works for Gizmo 'at that casino over there', what the heck man.

>>2115298
>best way to kill anything is by pausing the game
Honestly, playing H2H in F3 and NV, it was a lot faster/easier just to beat whatever was attacking me to death in real time. Even with gun builds, it was usually easier just to shoot them in the head than it was to VATs and then hope my character doesn't shoot the fucking wall.

>it's in an fps view mode
What's wrong with a first-person perspective other than that it's not like F1/2?

>>2115971
>Fallout 3 has a dozen major questlines that can be done in any order

Fo3 have very few quests though. Way less than NV. I'd even say less than FO2.

And they can't be done "in any order" because of the way most major quests work in FO3 (do this and then you can do that). In NV most quests are separated into smaller pieces and you can juggle them the way you wanted. FO3 has those bigger quests that forces you to go through their path till the end. And them being really, really boring and poor written doesn't help a bit.

>>2116028
>What's wrong with a first-person perspective other than that it's not like F1/2?
The fact that there is still VATS

New chapter up.

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/5889623/26/The-Legend-of-the-Wandering-Pair-from-Vault-101

>>2116625
go away

>>2116067

Yes, VATS is still there, but you don't have to use it. It's bad that it's there, but the game isn't designed around it. Just unbind the key for it or something. You won't miss it.

Arcanum>Fallout 2>Fallout 1

>>2118873

Arcanum is such a pain to play, though. The combat is nearly as bad a Planescape: Torment's.

>>2118873
Once you're past that village with the killer bunny Arcanum degenerates into one of the worst games ever made. It's one of the best games ever made before that, so I guess it evens out.

What do you guys think of the temple of elemental evil?

It was designed by cain, at least.

>>2119217
I found it pretty dull and quit at the elemental nodes out of boredom.

Basically, an excellent combat system ruined by a shitty module - dull story, dull encounters, no redeeming value. The Circle of Eight mod doesn't make it any better, btw.

>>2119217

Most of the classic CRPGs suffer from being good games with shitty combat.

The Temple Of Elemental Evil supposedly suffers the inverse.

On a related note, I've noticed that all of the best WRPGs are made by people that can't code worth a shit, on a limited budget, and on a rather tight schedule. Why is this?

>>2119467
Circle Of Eight really fixes everything with TOEE though. I quite like it combat and all now.

>>2119210

How does it go downhill? I don't suppose I've gotten to the point with the rabbit yet.

>>2110295
Now that I think about it, both 1 & 2 are superior than NV. Just prefer the top down view, less hectic and more relaxing to play I guess. Also 2 is pretty memorable, at least for me. NV I don't know.. feels kinda bland

>>2119476

Before: cool steampunk cities, quests, things to do and interesting places to explore. Main quest line with a healthy fantasy noir vibe.

After: large areas filled with trash mobs, empty cities, followed by even more empty areas, main quest degenerating into 'kill the bad guy, save the world', then the game ends.

>>2119473

If anything, the +content version makes it worse. It doesn't fix the absolutely horrid quest hubs (Hamlet, swamp city, elemental districts) while adding an entirely new city that manages to be even more dull than the existing content.

Oh yes, you could even kill Cyric and St. Cuthbert (wielding Cloud's sword from FF7) on top of it all IIRC. Modders, modders never change.

>>2119483

>After:

Man, I almost don't even want to pick it up again now, except maybe to say I finished it. That just sounds disappointing.

Then again, Troika was infamous for getting screwed by the publisher with deadlines and release dates, so I guess it's kind of understandable. The publisher is also responsible for the awful combat, so it wouldn't surprise me if that's why the endgame sounds rushed.

>>2119784

> Man, I almost don't even want to pick it up again now.
The game's still pretty good up until that point, though, which is why it's so fondly remembered.

A real shame.

Want to buy those games but only in specials.

>>2119845

>buy

They're owned by Bethesda now. You should know better.

>>2119838

Is it more like halfway through the game is more towards the endgame stretch?

>>2119784
He's exaggerating ridiculously. 3/4 of the game takes place before the point he's talking about, the "large areas filled with trash mobs" and empty cities are ruins with established backstory important to the plot, and who the bad guy is isn't settled until the very end of the game.

I played this game about a dozen times when I was in high school and none of these criticisms even crossed my mind; it's the kind of reduction to absurdity you could apply to any RPG.

>>2120434
The game takes a drastic turn for the worse, gameplay and style-wise once you cross the frozen tundra.

>>2120492
Arcanum stops being interesting once the setting degenerates into generic high fantasy. Half-empty elven / dark elven / desert cities are as dull as can be compared to what came before.

>>2115535
motherfucker always startled me with those visions

>>2120692

>>2121452
Anyone playing FOnline? I remember trying it like a year ago, got tired being constantly killed by russians with bazookas but i still liked it, the crafting system was cool as fuck

>>2121452

>didn't like FO2
>likes Tactics

Opinion discarded.

>>2121893
I have been playing it for 2 sessions now. Shit was very frustrating in the beginning. Being on your own and get killed every where. But it was actually the unforgivefullness of the game that lured me in.

>>2116625

We never asked for this.

>>2110537
Fallout 1 story is good but all over the place; people will stop talking to you for no particular reason; the NPC's that can follow you are not memorable and the dialogues are interesting and sometimes funny but they seem to be written in a hurry. Fallout is better without a doubt.

>>2123659
I mean F2 is better than F1, I've benn playing the F1 for a couple of days and I'm not impressed.

>>2119483
>+content
I will agree with you there. I always used vanilla.

>>2123659

Fallout 1 is more wrapped-up and more focused than 2. You have a clear goal and most dialogues and experiences apply to the story at large.

>people will stop talking to you for no particular reason

People are pretty fucking easy to upset in Fallout. You probably pissed them off.

>the NPC's that can follow you are not memorable

Eh, they're like most of the other NPCs in the game. They have a bit of info and backstory, but ultimately they're not a major part of the game. Fallout 2 was a lot more sprawled out with only a loose suggestion of a story from the first 5% to the last 5% of the game, so a lot more effort was put into world building and NPC depth.

>the dialogues are interesting and sometimes funny but they seem to be written in a hurry

They don't seem rushed, they just don't have all that much depth. They're not a major focus of the game. Most of the dialogues when Fallout came out in 1997 would have been fairly normal all things considered, but later RPGs have so much more to them in terms of dialogue and content that it feels like Fallout is missing about half a game, but it's fine as it is.

>>2123664

If you played Fallout 2 before Fallout 1, you done goofed.

I've never been assed to beat Fallout 2. I have owned it since 1999 and still have the full packaging. It is too long and wears out its welcome.

Fallout 1 is simply more fun to play.

>>2124798

>it's too long

You can beat it in under 20 minutes if that's all you want to do.

>>2124805
It is all relative. All the content in Fallout 2 probably takes only 30 hours to complete, but it gets tiring every single time, about 75-85% through and I quit.

>>2124813

Fallout 2 does have a lot of content, but it doesn't force any of it on you. All you have to do to beat the game is make it to the Enclave oil rig, start the self destruct sequence, and kill Frank Horrigan. You don't have to help with Modoc's Ghost Farm, you don't have to save Gecko from Vault City, and so on.

Fallout 2 does have a massive open world with a lot to do and has only a vague suggestion of a story from the first 5% to the last 5% of the game. Obviously, it's not everyone's cup of tea, but if all you want to do is finish it, it's not that long.

>>2124827
This.

F1 is actually a much tighter more cohesive game. Hell, the longer you take the worse your situation gets. It had some nice non-linear bits though.

>First time I beat Fallout I let myself get captured by the Super Muties.
>Leave cell, steal energy pistol off of one of the monk scientists handling the vats
>Sneak my way, kill a few guys, get my gear and fight my way out.
Definitely shifted the overall narrative of the story; it went from "We think there's a mutie threat" to "I just crawled out of 5 stories of pissed off super mutant, which promptly exploded. There's something going on."

F2 though is more about what random series of events sent you to your next location. While most playthrough paths will look like a big, reversed 'c' the whole thing had a lot more random elements to it

There's not really any non meta-gaming bottlenecks in F2's plot once you leave Arroyo, it's one of the best example of "Well, figure it out" in video games.

>>2125719

>it's one of the best example of "Well, figure it out" in video games.

That's one of the things I love about Fallout 1 and 2. I love the idea of dumping a player in a big world and saying "You're on your own now." I think we need more of that, honestly. No Fallout 3/Oblivion style quest markers, no good sense of direction, no kickass starting equipment. Just whatever you start with and your wits.

>>2125861
that's actually what I disliked about NV, they attempted to mimic F2/F1 linearity and just kinda ended up guiding every player by going "okay there's a bunch of ways you can go, but every way has high level dudes that will instantly kill you except the one place you're supposed to go"

they kinda missed the point

>>2126380
to be fair its possible to sneak past those high level monsters by crawling around the mountains and most return players will end up doing so just to get access to the implant chips for the extra skill points from the intelligence boost

what I probably dislike about NV most is the disproportionate number of NPCs who are assholes and most of the dialogue options being good, evil, or greedy versions of smart-aleck shithead.

that and the broken damage reduction/damage threshold system that is blatantly programmed incorrectly.

>>2126380

Well, Fallout 2 was kinda similar, although it was more random and less blatant. You can run straight South of The Den, but anything short of save scumming will probably result in your death once you get into Deathclaw, super mutant, and FEV creature territory, and if you pass too close to The Enclave they will kill you just as fast.

Similarly, New Vegas allows you the option of sneaking North, but it's not the recommendable path because everything will want to kill you. New Vegas just takes the extra step and actively tells you how bad of an idea it is, and it's a bit more definite than relying upon random encounters.

I do think the "railroading" was a little blatant in New Vegas, but it's not bad. Really, the abundance of invisible walls is what upset me more than anything.

>>2126395

Personally, I blame a lot of that on time and budget restraints. If Obsidian didn't stupidly accept a terrible deal and try to work on a VERY short timeframe with limited resources, they could have made something much better.

>>2107861

Gifted really is OP.

>>2128564
I've actually seen Skilled used once instead of Gifted: it was for a speedrun, so the guy needed a boost for his low level character. Otherwise, Gifted is too good to leave, especially when most of the other traits are pretty bland gameplaywise.
>>2126395
I find the DT/DR mechanics to be much better in NV than in older Fallouts. All you had to do in the latter was to put on your better armor and then it was a game where whoever crits faster.

>>2128834
the mechanics are fine, but apparently they fucked up the implementation.
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Damage_Threshold
>In the initial release of Fallout: New Vegas, all creatures such as super mutants, robots, or deathclaws had twice as much DT as intended (in other words, twice the amount of DT as was entered in their G.E.C.K. page). This was corrected in the 1.2 patch. A similar bug affects the DR of creatures in Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas, which has not been corrected.

Having actually played the games I can believe they did that because the balance on toughness for those enemies is fucked, and you end up dumping ridiculous amounts of ammo into them or use bizarre tactics making use of other bugs like the shotgun criticals to take them down.

I'm fairly certain this only applies to enemies with inherent DR/DT though, not effecting humanoids who wear the same gears you do.

>>2109992
being this dense
it was to avoid piracy
also, i found that awesome
return to /v/ please

I really like F1 but I'm going to need a guide for this fucking Temple in 2, Jesus

>>2126523
New Vegas is best when showing up to the strip with nothing to your name.

It's a pity they don't make your stay at freeside more integral; most of the time by the time you make it to New Vegas getting into the strip is easy as shit.

>>2128834
NV armor mechanics and skills were a freaking godsend. I love me some old school Fallout, but the old school skill sheet was mostly useless. Redistributing Big Guns and Throwing into all the other skills? Fucking genius.
Its makes choosing a particular style to go with much more versatile.
>Old school Fallout shit like "Oh, I can fire a minigun, but not an assault rifle. But, since this minigun is a big gun, I can fire a rocket launcher too!!!! Oh, and flamers? Hell fuck yeah I know how to use that. Oh no, don't give me that 10mm, I'll shoot my dick off"
>Throwing almost entirely useless
>Explosives and traps being separate skills narrowed their usability so much...
Can't hate on Melee/ Unarmed too much, in pretty much every game they open exploits into the utter pwnage of enemies. FO3 Crit maxing with a ripper was fucking insane...

>>2128882
it was to save space, it just had the side effect of working against piracy.
The manual itself recommended to make backups of floppies, because they were known to be unreliable.

>>2128963
The manual said to make backups of the floppies because if you didn't you'd overwrite the fucking game.

>>2128934
>yfw it's in the game manual

>start FO2
>survive the starting dungeon after like an hour
>finally get to explore some
>get killed in a random encounter
>didnt save
>like 1 or 2 hours lost
>rage hard
>....
>start again
>mfw
I got lucky this time, some bandits and some merchants killed each other, giving me the 10mm smg early and some nice gear

>>2107858
Are you German? I'd like to fight you in the streets.

>>2129046
>giving me the 10mm smg early and some nice gear
Yeah, the first thing I do when I exit arroyo is make a save and walk at random in the world map until I get that encounter.

>>2129061
the second time took me like 3 hours to do the same thing, sometimes the bandits would win and gang up on me killing me in the process.that and failing point blank headshots...man, those where the times

>>2129020
Yeah I figured it out now
Didn't realise you don't need lockpicks

>>2129068
You just need some drugs and savegames, the merchants are bounded to have them.

>>2128948

I literally can't show up to New Vegas with less than 2,000 caps and a fucking arsenal in my pocket. The only reason I ever have fewer caps than I arguably should (because of mountains of sellable loot) is because the merchants are out of loot and caps.

>tfw going to glow
>tfw forgetting the rope
>again

>>2129482

>go to Glow
>forget Rad-X only does 25% RR instead of 50%
>have to load a save and buy more
>come back
>accidentally brought 2 ropes and the extra weighs 10 fucking pounds

>>2129487
>in Glow
>forget to destroy bots
>turn power supply on
>have to fight whole way up, wasting stimpacks against those fuckers armed with shotguns and sniper rifles

>>2129504

Man, that's awful, too, but I really hate the bots you can't access on that one floor until after you turn on the power. You can't kill them prematurely so you /have/ to fight them.

>>2128934
Is "Fallout 2's opening temple is hard" some sort of an Ebic Mame? Like "Pidgey is overpowered" or something. Because I've beaten it literally dozens of times with every conceivable build and never once had any problems with it.

>>2129548

It's not really "hard." It's a pain in the ass. Only a fool tries to fight the ants and scorpions, but even then you still have to run through and it takes forever. And for what? The only meaningful loot in the place is some antivenom and some healing powder. Fucking hate the ToT.

But yeah, a lot of people try to kill everything and get their ass kicked.

>>2129548
I'm with you, anon.

I can easily beat it with a Gifted character with lowered melee stats and STR 4 by kicking everything to death, let alone using the attributes my characters are actually good at. Jesus, you get infinity tries to disarm all the traps and the mobs barely graze you.

It's tedious, not hard.

>>2129551
>Only a fool tries to fight the ants and scorpions
>abandoning precious xp

>>2129686

It's an insignificant amount of XP for how tedious it is to get it. If I feel like I need a fuckload of XP, there's always a Navarro run option.

I hate how meager some quests are about XP.

I replayed FAllout 2 so much the only quests I give a fuck about are saving gecko and vault city, unify vault 15 with NCR and the wanamingo rampage at redding.

Everything else I find tedious.

>>2129716
It's is NOT an insignificant amount. If you kill every ant and scorpion, and disarm every trap you'll be at level 2 before you even blow up the door - that comes in RIDICULOUSLY handy at the early game, because once you leave you don't get a second crack at it. Play correctly and you can be level 3 and get your first perk before even leaving Arroyo.

>>2107835
Yes but you may be disappointed, given the differences between the originals and the newer ones.

>>2130042

One would only be disappointed for 3 and NV.

>>2110958
God damn you Fawks!

>>2129792
i loved calling Enclave from Gecko and later they came and annihilated the town

>>2129482
Is there a list of misc items that actually do shit in game? I remember carrying around a lighter and other junk most of the game because I wasn't assed enough to alt+tab to search for every single item I encountered

>>2130095
He happily goes in and does it for you in the add-on.

>>2130409
>playing with the restoration mod

Yeesh, there's a huge crap to fix ratio with that mod, I hope you played vanilla at least once before you did that.

>>2130478
don't worry
when i was younger i finished F1 7 times, and F2 4, tactics about 2 or 3
i just this year found out about the mod

never got into 3 or NV, and i think that's for the best

>>2129548
>I don't agree with it; Therefore, it's a meme.
Did you ever think that I could call that a meme?

>>2130478

Why does everyone hate the Restoration Project? I haven't noticed much of it at all that I would describe as bad.

Finished first two Fallouts so many times it gets kinda tedious for me. Any good mods out there?

>>2130701

Welp, obviously try out the Restoration project if you haven't.

After that, go check No Mutants Allowed. I recall some Russian modders making some cool shit for Fallout 2.

>>2129551
>Only a fool tries to fight the ants and scorpions
>I always fight them all
>Even in my gun runs, it still only takes like 30 mins to get out of the temple
>There are people taking two hours
how
I'm not even saying this to be a smug guy or something because I'm pretty bad at video games, so I'm actually curious since I don't know how that could be.

any mods for Arcanum? i remember people recommending some mods for the first run since the game was kinda buggy

>>2130774
Aside from the usual bug-fix patches, high quality music, and hi-res patches, not really. Is Terra-Arcanum still up? If so, you might be able to find some that are pretty fun.

>>2130774
>>2130779
That said, if you were looking for those specific bug fix patches rather than just a general mod, the ones you might want are:

UAP 091225 - Bugfix patch. I think this was the latest one last I remembered.

High Quality Town Maps - Better looking maps and fixes a few bugs

High Resolution Patch - Does more or less what the title says

High Quality Music Pack - Replaces the music with mixes from the official OST. Default is 320kbps mp3s (with them included), but if you rip it to wav yourself, there's also a version for that as well.

You'll probably only need the UAP and HQTownmaps, unless you have a newer monitor, in which case you might also want the high res patch. Music is nice to have, but not entirely necessary.

You can nab them all from here: http://www.terra-arcanum.com/downloads/

Under the Arcanum section.

>>2130769
Is not than it takes two hours, I can beat the place in 15 minutes, the problem is that it's fucking boring and can easily destroy otherwise good builds.
I personaly just punch everything for the exp and abuse medical/first aid skills.

>>2130807
I just punch things and use the medical powder.

>>2130769
>>2130807

I get through in like 5 minutes because I run past everything. I can't imagine taking a whole half hour in the most tedious place in the entire game.

Rate New Reno families /vr/

Salvatore>Wright>Mordino>Bishop

>>2132149
Mordino>Bishop>Salvatore>Wright

>>2130816
This. This should work for virtually any character.