/vr/ - Retro Games

atari star wars is one of the best games I have ever played, would love to try it on LSD sometime

Raise your hand if you have a Vectrex.

:P

You would want a Sega vector machine like Star Trek or Zektor. That's hard enough but then on top of that you'd need a Zektor ZVG, which I believe is out of production. It would be orders of magnitude easier (but still not easy) to just get a Vectrex with a multicart and overlays. If you do attempt to build a color Vectormame cab, godspeed Anon. Be sure to post it on /vr/ first.

>>2057343
>raise your hand if you think the Vectrex has a color monitor

>>2057659

>Also, general vector discussion
>general vector discussion
>vector discussion

i love vector graphics. i've been meaning to develop my own vector-based game using SVG in HTML. there's a few out there already.

>>2057346
I'm able to obtain the out of production zektor zvg (i have super secret connections with the underground vector display mafia) But i don't really want to buy it if i have to shell out an arm and a leg for a legit color monitor.
>>2057659
Anything vector is allowed here, i'm just looking for color vector monitors.

The Wells Gardner 6100 is the most common color vector monitor out there, and a working one commands a substantial price by itself. The cheapest color vector game is Space Duel by Atari, so finding a Space Duel cab is one way to get a WG6100 (plus you could part it out to make some money back). There are a number of well documented mods out there for bulletproofing the sometimes problematic 6100.

The Amplifone color vector monitor is coveted for it's enhanced reliability and better unmodified design over the 6100, but it usually needs a new flyback transformer - rare and expensive unless you find one in a cab from a unknowing seller.

>>2057346
The Electrohome color vector display used in Sega cabs is known for a nasty habit of burning and going up in flames. Have a (CO2 or Halon) fire extinguisher handy. Other than that, it's supposed to have a good image quality.

This is the color vector game I would really like to get: cocktail Tempest has a full sized 19inch monitor in a cocktail table.

This is the color vector game I would really like to get: cocktail Tempest has a full sized 19inch monitor in a cocktail table.

Can MAME and PC graphics cards even output actual vector graphics signals? How are you going to realize the graphical interface for game selection?

And why don't you just buy one of these? http://www.vector-labs.com/index_vp1.html

>>2058342
Wow I have literally never seen that beautiful thing in person.

>>2057817
>underground vector display mafia
People other than you and I probably think this is a joke.

I was trying to suggest the cheapest route with a Sega/Gremlin cab but if money is no object Tempest is probably the easiest to find and most reliable.

>>2058375
The device mentioned in >>2057817 (The ZVG) drives vector monitors from a PC. The only problem is that it's out of production, and thus hard to find and costly.

>>2058392
The ZVG answers the monitor interface issue, but it still doesn't explain how the vector graphics are created on a software level in emulation.

Also it sure sound like a lot of fucking effort for a dozen vector games.

>>2058396
Custom Vector MAME software works with the ZVG:
http://www.zektor.com/zvg/vectormame.htm

>>2058396
>Also it sure sound like a lot of fucking effort for a dozen vector games.
It's totally worth it.

>>2058403
Wow, now that is impressive. Makes me wanna built a vector cab myself.

In my eyes MAME isn't doing a half bad job with the post processing in recent versions. Good enough to make for a viable alternative to tracking down expensive vector monitors and boards anyway.

>>2058437

>>2058437
>>2058535
Needs plasma to even approach the intensity of vector and jaggies are still visible.

>>2058578
Yeah but it's emulation to begin with, and for emulation it's pretty decent. Of course it's not the real thing, but the real thing is considerably more complicated and expensive.

Ex-Tempest Owner here!

The tempest was my personal piggy bank in the mid 90s. The monitor it came with was twitchy and I replaced caps/transistors as needed. I eventually bought a new monitor from an electronic catalog (Pre-internet) and had it in my room until I sold it.

Years later (and a few homemade mame cabinets) , I considered buying another one, but the monitor condition is usually why they are being sold (and if someone replaced/services the monitor, they want top dollar). So, I've been looking into color vector monitors for a while. Other than rebuilds, there are a few vector monitor equivalents:

VectorVGA was a direct plug in replacement that let you run vector games on a VGA monitor (unfortunately, no longer produced): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=866CM8b6Bvo

There are a few guys out there who are converting TV CRTs into vector monitors:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OGJ7ABNCMg

Mame emulates well enough, but a mouse/keyboard will never replace a good spinner. Someday, I'll need to knuckle down and build a dedicated Vector cabinet.

What the fuck is a vector monitor, does the gun fire lines in any direction rather than normal lines?

>>2060063

There's no sweeping across the screen in lines to redrawing the picture like on a raster monitor.

The gun draws just the lines themselves, each one is a path the actual electron beam took across the screen. There are no pixels, only vectors. They also redraw all the lines on the screen as fast as they can, so there's no fixed refresh rate on a vector monitor. The simpler the scene and the faster the gun assembly, the more refreshes per second.

It's not possible to accurately recreate the look of a vector monitor on a raster display. The display technologies are just too different, hence all the effort that goes into keeping the old displays running.

>>2060089
Do they make HD ones for watching like, Flash animation or something...or doing Adobe Illustrator? Some BVM-level $20,000 dollar pro thing?

>>2060094
No. They can't fill areas. They draw outlines only. And they don't have a "resolution" to begin with - they draw a certain number of points/second.

>>2060089
:^)

>>2060094

That's not how vector displays work. They can't do bitmaps at all. Hell, they can't even mix colors. Think wireframes.

They also don't have a resolution at all, let alone a "high definition" one. That's a property of raster monitors because they have a fixed grid. A vector monitor doesn't, and can scale the image to any degree, limited only to how fast the electron guns can be redirected and how fast they can switch on or off.

You might be able to use a vector display for CAD but I don't think those two technologies overlapped significantly, so no examples come to mind.

>>2060101

NTSC filter on an emulator, I take it?

>>2060110
Vector terminals like this Tektronix 4014 were actually used in the very first CAD systems, running on mainframes and minicomputers, back in the 70's and early 80's. The memory for raster graphics was too expense in those days, so vector graphics ruled. The Tek 4014 had a long persistence phosphor "storage" display which would retain an image without being redrawn until a erase button was pressed.

>>2060498
CAD drawing captured off of a Tek 4014 terminal

For it's time, Speed Freak is probably the most impressive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syDQ1GEM-s8

Also it's funny how 3D games have been around practically since the industry was invented (same with FMVs), but so few games used the technology. Must have been a cost over returns issue

>>2060498
>>2060501
The PLATO inter-university student access system from the 70s also used vector displays so the very earliest online multiplayer games were vector too.

>>2059995
does a tempest vector monitor suffer from burn-in?

>>2060519
They'd learned not to have static elements by then. Haven't you ever seen how heinously Tempest flashes?

>>2060094
well, they do in a sense...

>>2060507
>Must have been a cost over returns issue
in a sense, since console hardware is designed to be cost effective & less reliant on bleeding edge tech. look at atari's hard drivin, it was released around the same time the megadrive was and the console port simply could not compare.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6JC-HCNcio
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfe2Ze_yDk4

>>2060525
oh I see the ugly flashing, but I assumed that was just flickering.

>>2057331
I don't think this is the same stuff exactly but,
There's a sega super hang on near me that needs a new monitor for $75, should I get it? I don't know much about this.

>>2060627
That literally has absolutely fucking nothing to do with this thread.