/vr/ - Retro Games

other shit to know: if you have an RGB/Component cable with RCA leads, you may need a RCA to BNC converter depending on your monitor (PVMs, for instance)

>>1959310

Friendly reminder that these consoles output RGB natively and don't need to be modded.

>>1959281

>>1959305
I like what i see. Superior aperture grille with superior damping wire and superior picture quality, which mostly comes with superior weight.

>>1959330
see >>1959287

>>1959336

The reds and blues look like they've been dragged upwards.

>>1959338
Bad final convergence, possible to fix. Has not much to do with age, expect that the convergence strips could get loose or even fall off.
Just do what this guy does:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYB1L8AIeq4

I recommend to use black insulation tape afterwards on the strips, it sticks good on the graphite surface. But keep in mind that perfect geometry and convergence aren't possible.

>>1959339

I'm sorry, I'm getting a little confused here. Why would you pull sync from the green signal when it's simultaneously outputting a composite sync signal?
I'm not even convinced there is sync on green. I'll show you how it looks when I switch my PS2 to RGB instead of YPbPr, I'm not familiar by any means but it looks like a sync issue.

>>1959351

I can't show you unfortunately, but when I switch I get a very wobbly signal. The picture gains a purplish-pink tint (as is expected if the colour space changes) and wobbles side to side erratically. There's a lot of screen tearing.
PAL PS2 if it matters.

i'm gonna take my chances and ask if this shit is somehow fixable or not

>>1959365
What kind of signal is that?
Is that a scratch or dirt on the bottom?
It's seems that the degaussing coil doesn't work if this is supposed to be a solid white screen.
If it isn't the coil then the aperture grille is deformed.

>>1959372
no signal

it's scratched

probably the coil, it was damaged during transport. it got a hit to the side (pic related)

i'm getting a refund, but i just wanted to know

>>1959351
>>1959360

The PS2 outputs it's sync signal on the green line if you have it set to RGB out and use the standard component cables.

Some consoles are known to output 'Dirty" composite sync signals if they have a dedicated line for it. You would use an LM1881 circuit to pull sync off another line, usually the normal composite video feed.

If you're using the standard component video cables, you probably don't have a composite video line out, so you can pull the composite sync signal off of the green line with an LM1881.

Sync on green is a thing, it's just kind of obscure. Sony tends to be in on it mainly. I know many of their monitors support it.

>>1959392
get rid of the bad coil and buy one of these.

should fix that color purity issue,


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xboO2JUvtBM

>>1959392
>no signal
Also black.
On what level is the brightness set?
>it's scratched
Woah shit dude.
>probably the coil
So, you heard it during a cold start or when you press the degauss button (if available).
It's usually connected with an connector.
>it got a hit to the side
I think that this kind of shock is strong enough to loosen the aperture grille.

What is the point of these stupid generals

Stop trying to make 4chan into neogaf

>>1959406
or just get a ps2/3 cable like this and use composite as sync.

>>1959416
iirc, sometimes those cables don't quite work right.

If they do, I'd still build an LM1881 circuit to keep around, some consoles are known for having clean sync issues, and certain monitors are picky about clean sync signals. It's useful.

>>1959413
>brighntess
maximum brighness
>Woah shit dude.
blame italian couriers
>So, you heard it during a cold start or when you press the degauss button (if available).
It's usually connected with an connector.
yeah, i heard it. i do have the degauss button.
>I think that this kind of shock is strong enough to loosen the aperture grille.
so... it's fucked right?

>>1959421
>so... it's fucked right?
Yes.

>>1959415

>>1959427
thank fuck i'm getting a refund

it's hard finding PVMs in italy, and the only 20 inch in decent conditions i find comes here fucked to shit

ain't life sweet

>>1959429
its been a bad month for crts

>>1959435
it saddens me that all CRTs in existence today are dying, slowly but surely. and not all of them will know the joy of receiving RGB input from retro vidya

feels bad man

does anybody make CRTs anymore? i know graphic designers and shit need them for their color accuracy, but i know OLED has become the replacement for newer PVMs

>>1959345

That looks a little outside of my skill range, unfortunately.
The image is also tilted a degree or two clockwise, would that be any easier to fix? I can access the service menu.

>>1959406

>The PS2 outputs it's sync signal on the green line if you have it set to RGB out and use the standard component cables.
Then how would my TV be having sync issues?

>>1959463
Either:

A: Your set doesn't support SoG
B: The PS2 is outputting a poor quality sync, and you should try pulling it from somewhere else.

>>1959439

Ikegami and some Taiwanese manufacturers make them.

>>1959468

Is the colour encoding the only difference between YPbPr and RGsB?
Because I'm not swapping any cables as I swap the PS2's output setting. If the only difference is the way colors are encoded then it would still sync correctly, albeit with improper colours.

>>1959472
woah, these monitors look really cool

they're also quite expensive though

is there any video or pics of somebody using one? just curious is all

>>1959439

A few niche manufacturers seem to.

Ikegami being one, though they only seem to have 2 models, the cheaper one is $8,500, and has a lead time of like a month.

There are chinese no-name manufacturers putting out sets to developing countries, however I severely doubt that these sets have any semblance of quality. They're probably made on old, worn-out, improperly maintained production machines that have been bought off of other manufacturers that backed out of the CRT business.

I'm sure there are still a few small outfits making specialty CRT replacement for the military.

And there are still plenty of new old stock CRT's laying around in warehouses, waiting to be found. I know there are tons of leftover Wells-Gardner arcade monitors from just a few years ago, that will do up to 800x600 on a 29" screen.

Every once in a while someone on ebay will find a pallet of unopened Sony PVM/BVM/etc.

>>1959485
how nice would it be to just stumble upon a whole pallet of CRTs

i would probably sell most of them to peeps on /vr/, the rest i'll keep to play until i die on glorious trinitron

>>1959463
>The image is also tilted a degree or two clockwise, would that be any easier to fix?
This is even harder to fix (yoke realignment), it's also caused by the earth magnet field.

>>1959492

My TV has a geomagnetism option, is this all I need to change?

>>1959490
I want to start going to industrial auctions to see if I can find anything like this.

I would jizz my pants if I found something like the fabled PVM-4200 (Not entirely sure of the model number) of the early 90's, a 42-inch monster, said to be possibly the largest CRT ever produced.

I almost bought a New in box PVM-20M2MDU from ebay, the guy had like 12 of them he found in a warehouse. They were going for $250 shipped. Sadly I couldn't put aside the cash for it.

>>1959494
>My TV has a geomagnetism option, is this all I need to change?
I don't know.
Rotating your TV could change the tilt, just degauss it afterwards for the purity.

Or if you have time then just read this:
http://www.repairfaq.org/samnew/tvfaq/tvtiltpic.htm

>>1959530

My set degausses automatically each time it turns on (I think - it buzzes loudly every time it powers up). Tilting it is not really an option due to its size and location.
It's a newer 100Hz thing, there's nothing else I'm capable of getting my hands on at the moment so I'm stuck with it and it's shitty 40ms input lag. I think the geomagnetism setting has fixed the problem regardless.

Found this hunk of junk inside a building. May or may not work, but if I can haul it out, it's free. Looks like it came from the 70s. Worth it?

>>1959613

What ports?

>>1959615
i doubt that thing has anything besides RF

>>1959636

Me too, and that'd make it pretty much worthless.

>>1959613
eh, inputs?

probably rf only

>>1959641
i should learn to refresh before replying...
>>1959615
>>1959636
>>1959638

>>1959643
use 4chanX m8

Is there any easy way to get component out of a PC?

>>1959650
Get a graphics card that supports it.

The 3850/3870/x2 are the last ATi cards that supported it, i believe.

>>1959650
>Is there any easy way to get component out of a PC?

No there isn't. But if you want there is a complicated one.

>>1959650
not without a converter.

you'll probably find cables that look like it should work, but they don't convert the signal and are made for use with projectors/etc that use a vga/dvi port to output component.

>>1959650
easy bad way: 2010 or earlier video cared with direct component output
easy good way: VGA or DVI-A out to component transcoder

>>1959652
>3850/3870/x2
No, there were Radeon 4xxx cards and GeForce 9xxx cards with component. Some of the holdover GeForce 2xx series had it too. After that, nada.

>>1959615
>>1959636
>>1959638
>>1959641
I'm not an expert on this shit, but I think it supports composite judging from this. Definitely not RGB though.

>>1959663
Ah, okay. I haven't looked too far into it, I just remember my 3850 was the last card I seemed to notice it on.

Running an older card like a 3870 X2 shouldn't be too bad. Considering you're only rendering something like 640x480, you should be able to run modern games without too many issues. The only thing is you might have to deal with a lot of heat output.

>>1959665

All I see is RF.

>>1959669
this. left is output, input is only RF

>>1959671
Damn. Oh well.

>>1959665
I think you can get S-Video through that VTR port.
Not sure of the pinout though.

>>1959669
>>1959671
>>1959672

There are no RF inputs, only composite video through BNC.

>>1959665
That has composite via BNC and potentially S-video via VTR.

>>1959673
>>1959678
o..oh

well, i stand corrected. i'll try to know my shit next time i open my mouth

Posted this last thread without picture

>tfw not enough room for new TV

hey guys

>>1959365 here

i got curious and decided to flip the PVM to its side. to my disbelief. the issue almost completely solved itself, but after i flipped it back to an upright position, it started being as bad as before

i flipped it again and pushed the degauss switch. it's worse than before now, but this gives me the idea it might be possible that the grille is still okay, and i could solve this with a degaussing coil. i suspect the internal one is shifted due to the hit.

i'll try to make a home made coil tomorrow and give it a go, if it works, i swear i will jack off and come all over the screen in absolute joy.

any thoughts on this?

>>1959702
Go for it. You've got nothing to lose.

As far as a degaussing tool goes, i've seen a few neodymium magnets taped to a power drill work well.

>>1959708
i had a huge ass neodymium magnet that could lift up to 25kg but i lost it a long time ago

i'll just make a solenoid with wires and a lamp and just j-j-jam it into a wall socket, worst case scenario i'll die but it's not like it's important

>>1959702
>any thoughts on this?
The aperture grille is indeed loose. There's no way to fix that.
Basically in this video at 3:03, you see how the shadow mask is inserted in a generic CRT.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKvVE2jv5UQ#t=182
Your problem is that the holder is broken, that's why it seem to get better when you flip it because it gets back to original spot.
Also the aperture grille of any Trinitron is way heavier than in a generic CRT, it's fine metal strips are clamped around the heavy metal frame.

>>1959730
but then why did it suddenly get worse when i pushed the degauss switch? shouldn't it have done nothing since it's the grille?

when i put magnets close to the screen, it shows normal colors.

i'm talking out of my ass of course, i'm ignorant, but i'd like to know

>>1959732
Since the aperture grille is made out of metal, it could be moving when you apply magnetic fields to the tube. Maybe those magnets are moving it to its original position. Just a guess.

>>1959741
i'm gonna try degaussing it anyways since all i have to lose is nothing since i got my money back and the ebay transaction was cancelled by mutual accord.

i think i'll keep the crt since it came from germany and i don't think that even the seller wants a big ass 40kg motherfucker to be sent back just so he can dump it somewhere (i think) so i'll just try and fix it. if it doesn't work, worst case scenario i'll beat the shit out of it until it works or just sell it to some shmuck on craigslist for 10 bucks

>>1959732
>but then why did it suddenly get worse when i pushed the degauss switch?
Because the degaussing coil moved the grille. Same applies to:
>when i put magnets close to the screen, it shows normal colors.

>>1959702
I literally had the same issue with mine.
My yoke was misaligned when it was dropped. I bought a degaussing coil but that didn't work. Took it to a shop to get aligned.

>>1959760
how much does it cost? assuming i can find a shop that still fixes crts and doesn't tell you to "le obsolete technology" and "le upgrade to fullHD friend :^)"

someone said about 30 bucks which is something i can get behind to

So something doesn't seem right...

>>1959867
dude, fingerprints

>>1959872
Fuck I pretty much got used to them being there. Never got around to cleaning the screen after I got the monitor.

But anyway it appears the contrast control is controlling the brightness and the brightness control is controlling the brightness. Why is this happening?

with all the PVMs being damaged in transit posted on this thread it should be renamed the monitor murders

>>1959884

I managed to get one packaged properly...

>>1959884
is damage really this common in CRT threads?

>>1959884
>>1959898
>>1959905


I just got this notice from UPS

>A train derailment has delayed delivery. We're adjusting plans to deliver your package as quickly as possible.

Great, that thing's going to a box of glass and metal shards when it gets to me.

why am I not surprised?

>>1959923
that... is unheard of bad luck. We're talking " the guy who went to nagasaki for medical treatment after hiroshima" kind of bad luck.

but hey, trains derail all the time. i was once on a train that derailed, maybe it just got off the tracks and the monitor didn't move that much and it'll come home safe and sound

one can only hope.

>>1959923
You've probably ordered tons of dumb little things without incident, but the one time you order something big and breakable like a tv, the fucking train derails. I feel for you bro

>>1959923
>>1959924

How many monitors have to die before this madness ends?

>>1959940
yeah pretty much.

the heck even causes train derailment?

it's on a god damn track for Christ sake!

how do you mess up this badly? ( last time a train derailed near my area it was because the lady conductor was too busy texting on her phone.)

>>1959962
Trains still need to have their speed controlled like a car, go to fast around a turn and it'll derail.

>>1959962
is the area where the train derailed hot? sometimes rails expand more than they should because of heat. it happens often here.

report back when you get your monitor, maybe it won't be so bad

>>1959972

it was supposed to get here on the 26th doubt it's going to make it anywhere near that ship date.

they didn't say where it happened exactly but it had to be the middle of the country, the thing left Miami days ago. it started the journey over 300,333 miles away from me, East to West)

if this thing survives, its will probably have its own biography made into a major motion picture.

"against all odds, the PVM story"

>>1960000

>started the journey over 300,333 miles away
>300,333 miles

U live on the moon brah?

Also, nice quads.

>>1960010
sorry, meant 3,300 miles

but it might as well be the moon, lol

>>1959884
Fuck, I know, I'm on attempt #3. Should I just stop? :(

>>1960402
Please. You are making them more expensive.

Where the hell do you live anyway? I have set up a few automatic ebay searches for within 80 miles if any pop up. Just a thought.

>>1959392
Wow, I'd demand a refund

>>1960402
>>1960458

I think we need to give the sellers very specific packaging instructions.

Lots and lots bubble wrap and tons of foam. (maybe even anti-static bags)

we can't expect them to do a decent job unless we tell them and make them take a photo before sending.

>>1959650
not if you want 240p content, If you are going 480p or higher then why not just use a vga cable?

>>1960481
>we
>having some idiot talk to me like a 5 year old when I sell PVMs I pick up dirt cheap in my area and flip for 10x+ profit
>making me take a photo

negative feedback after I get my positive for sure.

>>1960521
oh wait they switched it to protect shitty buyers like usual, nevermind I forgot

>>1960526
>>1960521

Oh yeah, let's not make sure our expensive-ass, hard to find electronics are well taken care of, sure.

If sellers didn't pack the things like a bunch of apes this wouldn't be an issue.

>>1959323
>games that can be RPG

you forgot NES with PlayChoice RGB mode

>>1959613
I bet you there are bugs inside that thing.

>>1959924
>We're talking " the guy who went to nagasaki for medical treatment after hiroshima" kind of bad luck.

Yeah. "My TV broke" is the equivalent to getting radiation poisoning and then dying in atomic blast. Nice job keeping things in perspective.

>>1960583
That is a list of systems that support it natively, not ones that require (in this case) hundred dollar+ mods.

>>1959613
haha my family had this same tv when I was growing up in the late 80's early 90's

I played nes and snes for years on that thing

it has the flip down top panel right?

>>1960583

The playchoice is a modified version of the NES that was used as an arcade cabinet. It doesn't count as a console, sorry anon.

>>1960760
>he doesn't know about the Playchoice RGB graft mod

>>1960760
You can lobotomize the playchoice's video chip and jam it into an off the shelf NES, giving it magical RGB capabilities.

>>1960767
>>1960765

That count as modding. The pic was listing NATIVE RGB capable consoles.

>>1960770
Nowhere does the pic specify NATIVE you little bitch, it says CAPABLE

the NES is CAPABLE

>>1960778

Here it is retard:
>Friendly reminder that these consoles output RGB natively and don't need to be modded.
If it requires modding, it is NOT natively RGB capable you freaking retard, as the mod is a MODIFICATION. Don't you understand that? You're adding an RGB chip to a console that don't have one.

>>1960787
The NES is capable, it just needs a piece of hardware to make sense of the code. Kind of like how the SNES model 2 can do s-video it just can't do it without a mod because the connectors weren't done. I guess you'd say SnES model 2 can't do S-Video either, huh?

>>1960794

You need to modify the NES and ADD a freaking component on the NES. The console isn't capable of outputing RGB, You need additional hardware. Thus the NES isn't RGB capable.
And your comparison is shit because the SNES 2 already have everything needed in the case, it was just not wired.

>>1960806
>it was just not wired
>needs mod to become wired
Then by your definition, the SNES is not S-Video 2 ready and needs a mod. Good job.

>>1960818

It isn't capable, it needs an external intervention. You don't seems to undertand that Needing an external intervention = Not capable.
What you're saying is like:
>this paraplegic person is capable of walking. But you need to wire the legs correctly
or
>this legless guy is capable of walking. You just need to give him legs..
They can't unless you give what they need to them. So they can't. What you did since the beginning was moving the goal post.
The picture coupled with the post I made earlier in the thread are right, just deal with it.

>>1960834
>moving the goalpoast
>"Muh 4chan lingo"
whatev, dude.

just going to pack up these old CRTs, and get them ready for a bright future in a faraway land.

I hope those kids enjoy playing games on these just as much as I did!

>>1961047

Yep, they just have to sort all these out, and give them to all the needy children.

(really brings a tear to my eye, knowing some lucky kids are going to play on the same type of screens I did when I was young)

>>1961052
the anticipation is killing me, wish I could see all the looks on those little faces enjoying retro vidya on restored CRTs

(this must be what Santa feels like)

>>1961056
sure is getting crowded around here...

Where are the children?

>>1961058

what the... they're just going to leave them all outside?

what the heck?

>>1961059
oh come on!

that wasn't supposed to happen!

what about the children! the videogames!

>>1961061
that's not how you play!

what's wrong with these people?

don't they understand?

why is this happening?

>>1961062
at least some could be saved...

>There Are Some Heroes Left In Man.

>>1961047
>>1961052
>>1961056
>>1961058
>>1961059
>>1961061
>>1961062
>>1961064

>>1959884
I wouldn't blame the buyer for transport damage.

>>1961047
>>1961052
>>1961056
>>1961058
>>1961059
>>1961061
>be european union
>"hurr, all the electrical garbage outside is poising our planet with it's lead"
>"durr, lets ban lead then"
>"hurr, good idea"
And that's how the stupid ass RoHS law has been invented.
A bunch of idiots thought it's better to ruin future technology than making proper garbage disposal laws.

>>1961059
This is just surreal. Like you'd expect to see a field full of CRT TVs in a videogame dream sequence or something.

>>1961076
there are literally, entire rivers of sadness

>>1961079
it gets weird out there, in the Third World

>>1961080
and forests of tears.

forgotten video dreams

>>1961083
>that's not how you make an igloo

>>1961079
I imagine that there are lost tribes of people living in underground cities made of old discarded technology

they will never know with these strange square boxes actually did,

>living inside a hut made of CRTs, you hear whispers of the past.

>being a neo primitive you are always dreaming about videogames you've never played... this is the only time you feel at peace.

>>1961096
>MFW, that's basically the plot of generations lost.

walk by broken CRTs, old men tell stories of "ghosts" trapped inside.

some cave dwellers plug a few of them an old solar cell, and pray to the static.

>>1961112
Phantasy Star Series was also about the recurrent rise and fall of civilization

and the rediscovery of ancient technologies, that most people see as magic.

sometimes I feel like that after years of viewing stuff on LCDs

it's almost like my brain can't compute how good some stuff looks on a CRT...

>its probably magic

>Also, Phantasy Star in one of my favorite game series.

I originally bought a CRT for lightgun games, but was amazed at just how good things looked on it compared to a monitor or flatscreen.

All these CRT dump gore... dem feels...

http://www.ebay.it/itm/Samsung-19-Color-CRT-M46QCY261X112-for-Arcade-or-Casino-Gaming-FREE-SHIPPING-/281380788343?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item41839a1877

this one looks really cool

>>1961076

>The stupid ass RoHS law
Which law?

>>1961375

RoHS is "Reduction of Hazardous Substances"

Basically says "No more lead solder"
This means that solder with a high tin content is used, which causes lots of reliability issues.

Look up "Tin whiskers" for one of the main problems of tin solder.

>>1961385

But that's completely counter-intuitive. If products with lead solder are more reliable, they won't need to be scrapped as much and will cause less of a hazard.

>>1961390
Go tell that to the EU

>>1961390

Yup, but it will please brainwashed ecologists.

>>1961390
Tin whiskers are a real problem but hugely exaggerated by companies pissed off at having to change their manufacturing process. Most electronics are scrapped because of obsolescence, or failure of other parts (electrolytic capacitors, fan bearings, etc.), not tin whiskers.

And the industry would have gone lead-free anyway, because it doesn't flow so easily which means you can more densely pack components without them shorting. Modern phones would be very difficult to make with leaded solder.

>>1961112
does that actually happen in it? might be my new favorite genesis game

>AND THE PEOPLE BOWED AND PRAAAYED
>TO THE NEON GOD THEY MAAAADE

>>1961540

Yeah, its a strange game. I really enjoyed it when I was younger.

In one of the levels you pass by several people praying to Monitors I didn't understand until I beat the game what was going on.

>>1961390
You do realize that lead-based solder is not some kind of magic that makes anything so reliable that it never has to be thrown away, right? And when things get discarded(just look at the dump gore pics upthread), it is much much better for things not to contain lead, right?

>>1961410
>brainwashed ecologists
Be careful edgemaster, you'll slice us all.

>>1961554

>better call him edgy, it'll sure show him!

99% of ecologists are brainwashed leftists, deal with it.

>>1961571
I wouldn't say that's true either, that's just taking it to another extreme. But, solder with lead in it is extremely reliable COMPARED to non-lead solder. Hell, I remember hearing one of the reasons why the 360 had such bad reliability was because they used non-lead solder.

>>1961592
So much pidgeonholing.

>>1961592
>the 360 had such bad reliability was because they used non-lead solder
It's because they were too cheap to use BGA underfill and a sufficiently big heatsink. And they fixed the problem with later revisions still using lead-free solder.

>>1961592

You're right, I'm taking it to another extreme, but it is true for almost every ecologists I met IRL though.

Anyway, I think we'll need to put more solder maybe, because there complains that they don't put enough solder either nowadays, according to some electronic repairmen.

Hello, newfag to crts here. I know that trinitrons are cool but that's all. I play mostly snes and atari 2600

what would you guys rec me?

>>1961804

>SNES and Atari 2600

If it was an Atari 2600 only, I would have said and old 70s or 80s RCA set, or a nice 80s trinitron, with RF only because that's all you need for this kind of console, would be absolutely PERFECT -- it will fit perfectly with the console appearance. But you said you want one for an SNES too, so I think a newer set that accept composite or even S-Video might be a good start, it's just that it will be less awesome to use one with an old Atari.
As for the brands, just avoid the one that made their TVs in china. Sony and other Japanese brands are good, but check what particular models weren't made in China, because Chinamen have the bad habit to ruin everything others make them do.

>>1961827
Wanna rec me some specific ones friendly anon :~)

>>1959683
>tfw your monitor has a scratched and isn't fd

>>1961832

Man, first, where do you live? Are you a yurofriend? Are you an ameribro?
If the former, get a set with an RGB capable SCART input, not made in china. Just check for a good set.
If the former, get a sony with an S-Video or a Composite input, and still not mae in China (I don't know about made in Mexico).
For both, don't get a monitor, as these don't have a tuner, thus wont let you play to the Atari 2600 without spending extra bucks.
I can't give you a specific model, you might not be able to find it anyway, just check for the ones that are readily available. Searching for a good CRT need time and dedication, it took me half a year to get a new decent one when my old german set died. I sailed through thrift-stores daily, and /vr/ wasn't simply didn't exist.

>>1961851
>If the former, get a sony with an S-Video or a Composite input, and still not mae in China (I don't know about made in Mexico).

Meant "if the latter".

>>1961851
I'm an amerifag

>>1961827
>turning the argument of quality control into something racist
no

>>1961863

>complaining because someone said something racist on 4chan

>>1961863
prepare for
>It's 4chan, it's okay to pretend to be a monster! and I have to look cool in front of my peers...

>>1961904
cry more, the chinese are absolute shit when it comes to manufacturing reliable equipment, they care too much about raw profit. else we wouldn't have bootlegs or they wouldn't be cooking in sewage oil

What's the smallest CRT TV with a s-video input?

>>1962121
8"" PVM or BVM should have that.

>>1962183
>>1962121

Yeah, this 8 inch PVM-8041Q, has both component/RGB and S-video (and composite)

it was like $10 + shipping

>>1962121
This is the smallest consumer Trinitron i know.
This baby has SCART RGB, S-Video, support for most video standards, 12-24VDC power input and a motherfucking handle.

>>1962196
you mean this thing?

>>1962207
>handle
oh baby

>>1962207
>KV-M1120

that thing is about 11 inches.

I think, 14" is the smallest I could go without hurting my eyes.

>>1962121
how small do you want it? (and why?)

>>1962207
Yes.

>>1962196
>>1962194
>>1962121


The PVM-5041Q is a 5 inch monitor with Composite, RGB and S-video. Not as common as the PVM-8041Q but they're on ebay fairly often.

As far as consumer stuff goes, I have a few 9 inch trinitrons that were designed to be mounted under cabinets and such. Composite only though.

Pic related

>>1962258

I played through Final Fantasy 9 on a 5" CRT portable.

those where dark times.

>>1962283
it was this thing.

>>1962302
side view

>>1962283
Why?

>>1962302
are you italian?

>>1961426
Weren't tin whiskers the main reason for the RROD problems in early-model 360s?

>>1962316
I thought it was the BGA joints cracking because of thermal expansion.

>>1962335
Nvm, already covered here
>>1961592
>>1961629

I'm emulating on a PVM, so I'm able to run 15Khz on an emulator at their original resolutions.
Modelines are a problem for me, though. How do I calculate them? I know you need the dot clock (pixel frequency), refresh rate, and either the total horizontal or vertical pixels (the other can be calculated if you have everything else) to calculate a modeline. Refresh rate and total vertical pixels are easy enough to get (as 262 is always the total vertical pixels), but how do I find the dot clock? Is it just the emulated console's clock rate?
What if there are two CPUs, such as in arcade games that have a , and dot clock is indeed just the CPU's clock rate, which one would I know is responsible for displaying graphics?

But once I do have dot clock, total horizontal and vertical pixels, and refresh rate, how do I calculate the sync pulses, front and back porches of the horizontal and vertical blanking intervals? Can they even be calculated, or would I have to find some specification like I would for dot clock?

>>1962582
such as in arcade cabinets that have a M68000 at 12.0 MHz and a z80 8.0 MHZ*

>>1962582
Using VESA standards:
http://umc.sourceforge.net/

Or specifically for low resolution monitors:
http://lrmc.sourceforge.net/

>>1962194
I just bought one of these, I'm so excited. It's the 3rd PVM I've bought, and the other two have been completely fucked. I hope my luck is better here

sorry if this question is retarded at all but why are trinitrons the most sought after CRTs?

I play competitive melee (I know I know not retro sorry) and some friends of mine were trying to find a good CRT on craigslist and they were so hell bent on getting a trinitron that they were passing up really nice free CRTs.

I know for a fact they don't know shit about CRTs and are just following whatever /r/smashbros tells them, but I'd genuinely like to know what makes them superior because when I move I'm planning on getting a larger CRT for all my /vr/.

>>1962617
because Sony and aperture grille

>>1962617
They're slightly sharper than other low res CRTs, but you can do far better with a high res CRT + line doubler (and line doublers are available with 0ms added latency).

And image quality isn't really relevant to competition so long as you can see all the details you need to, and all modern CRTs have identical motion quality (some very old ones might have slower phosphors).

>>1962605
How can lrmc's vertical blanking interval results be accurate if it's not even taking dot clock into account in it's calculations?

>>1962639
>>1962653
so good aperture grille = better picture quality? what is an aperture grille and what does it do?

they already have one trinitron in their dorm but my newer-ish samsung CRT that I have looks better than theirs as far as picture quality goes. we've had them side by side before and it was obvious that mine was much clearer and had better color.

>>1962706
vertical and horizontal blanking interval results*

>>1962714
one anon said it a few threads ago and it's a great quote people should remember for the next threads to come:

when it comes to CRTs, tube condition is more important than type

>>1962706
Video cards support variable dot clock, so dot clock is adjusted according to the other timing.

>>1962714
So, the difference between a shadow mask and an aperture grille is this:

A shadow mask is a thin metal sheet with a bunch of tiny holes in it.

An aperture grille is a bunch of tiny horizontal wires stretched over a frame.

Each of these devices allows the electron beam to separate into 'pixels' before hitting the phosphor. There are a few advantages to an aperture grille over a shadow mask, namely the fact that you can get a smaller 'dot pitch' with an aperture grille. Dot pitch is how far apart the 'pixels', or dots on a CRT are.

They also offer better geometry, since they are resistant to heat expansion, and allow the tube to only curve in one dimension, horizontally.

The one downside is that you'll have 1-2 stabilizing wires in an aperture grille display, visible as faint horizontal grey lines.

Some people note that aperture grille displays have better color reproduction than other CRTs, this is often not from the aperture grille, but the fact that most aperture grille monitors are going to be made by Sony (It was proprietary for the longest time), and Sony uses a darker phosphor than other manufacturers, allowing deeper blacks.

>>1962724
So if I were to specify the cga timing, it would automatically know the dot clock of the arcade game/console I want to make a modeline for from just the active resolution?
Isn't the emulated system's dot clock necessary in calculating its TOTAL horizontal and vertical pixels, which constitute the correct blanking intervals?

Weird question but do you guys know of any good monochrome monitors

>>1962785
Why do you need a monochrome monitor?

If you can find one that doesn't have a billion hours on it, you shouldn't have to worry about image quality too much, as most B/W monitors should be pretty sharp. There are no aperture grilles/shadow masks/convergence issues to worry about, as the single beam projects directly to the phosphor on monochrome displays.

>>1962780
It's not necessary, because emulators don't generate the vblank/hblank pixels (because they are blank so all it would do is pointlessly restrict video output flexibility for geometry adjustment etc).

>>1962794
I wasn't of that.
Alright, so can I still be confident in having a 1:1 image generated in terms of shape/centering?

>>1962814
There's no such thing as 1:1 image because there was no standard monitor for these systems. Different monitors would have different overscan/geometry. You can adjust the mode timings or monitor controls to get whatever you like.

>>1962824
>There's no such thing as 1:1 image because there was no standard monitor for these systems
I thought that would be the case. I guess it's fine, then.

But, theoretically, does that mean you still couldn't get a modeline from lrmc that would generate a 1:1 image to an arcade game's image even if emulating on its original monitor?

>>1962840
It might be possible but there's no easy way of generating one.

>>1962617
>>1962714
>>1962769

why would anyone who knows anything about CRTs want to game on a consumer trinitron?

>>1962856
Because it's the best you're gonna get if you don't have a PVM?

A well-equipped consumer Trinitron will get you S-video and component inputs, each offering a pretty decent picture.

You have to be a bit savvy about what you're buying, since anything too recent will have input lag and the image will be overprocessed. Newer consoles (6th gen+) will look great on them, especially if you have component hookups.

While the image quality will be worse than a PVM/BVM, it will be better than most run of the mill shadow masks.

Also, you are getting better build quality, reliability (In some cases), sound quality, adjustability, etc etc .over other manufacturers.

The biggest factor is that pro monitors are just plain hard to come by in certain areas of the country. They're plentiful in places like California and Florida, areas with lots of production studios, but in other places such as the midwest, they're hard to come by and you have to end up gambling on a unit from ebay.

>>1962856

pic is from two 14" sets with the same component input (a ps2)

I will say one thing about consumer trinitrons, they seem to display interlaced signals a little better than my PVM.

but for 240p, the PVM is king,

>>1962869
those are all valid points, and I should point out that the pic on the right only really reflects the KVxxFSxx models.

I don't think the PQ on any of the silver sets looks all that great.

I prefer the oldr black sets (best they have is S-video, but the sill have a more arcadey look to them then later models)

>>1962872
Yeah, it figures that they'd do interlaced better. Most people are going to be viewing 480i signals over composite/s-video, and a major selling point was all the sorts of comb filters and feedback circuits that helped with the picture.

>>1962902
The newer silver sets tend to be models that apply too much filtering, scanning, etc. to the image.

I think the only sets that have this issue are the ones that support 480P and up, so the WEGA Hi-Scan and WEGA Super Fine pitch.

Those sets are still pretty great for 6th gen and up systems. I'd love to have a late model 16:9 CRT for the Wii U.

Anyone here have some (detailed/upclose) pics of older games running on anything other than sonys?

I've heard toshiba and phillips tubes give a lighter scanline effect that some people prefer for retro gaming b/c they're more similar to traditional arcade monitors.

>>1963013
Search "CRT Fetish Thread" for a 100+ page thread on some neo-geo forums about RGB CRT's. It's mostly Sony PVM's, but occasionally someone snags a JVC or Ikegami or whatnot.

Pic slightly related, Castlevania running on an older NEC MultiSync

Has anyone ever used the serial port available on some PVM monitors? Is there a program you need? Being able to adjust calibration values outside of the menu would be nice.

I want to flip my CRT vertically for shumps, but i'm afraid it will fuck the TV up.

Wat do?

>>1962856
SCART RGB is good. And the RGB amps often have a bandwidth of 8-10Mhz, allowing pixel clocks that are twice that much (Nyquist–Shannon sampling theorem).
It's not my fault that you never used a consumer Trinitron with SCART.
In this pic i'm displaying 692 pixels on a 14" Trinitron with about 600 LoHR via VGA->SCART.

>>1963485
>Wat do?
Fast way: Turn on and flip it very carefully, then turn off for 10-15 minutes and turn on again (degaussing).
Slow way: Take apart and inspect the circuit boards for dry solder joints, also check if the internal connection are secure.

>>1963556
>internal connection
*connections
Also check if the case for damage, like cracks or missing pieces.

>>1963028
thanks man. Also that castlevania looks real nice. wish the larger pro CRTs were easier to come by, I'm not holding my breath though

>>1962869
>Also, you are getting better build quality, reliability (In some cases), sound quality, adjustability, etc etc .over other manufacturers.
Oh come on, the same could be said about most major Japanese manufacturers. The only undeniable differentiator between Sony and the rest is the tube. Their reputation is already inflated these days now that cost is no longer a factor; they don't need any more hype.

As for sound specifically, I've never been impressed with the stock speakers and sound modes from any Sony I've ever heard, including mine compared to my Toshibas. I have high-end HD models from both and there's no comparison.

>>1962919
>I'd love to have a late model 16:9 CRT for the Wii U.
A 36" 4:3 gets you the same size widescreen image as a 34" 16:9 and has the added advantage of a much larger 4:3 image. They're incredible. It's a shame Sony never made a 36XBR960.

>>1962919
>CRT for HD systems
This might make sense for Virtual Console stuff, but why in the fuck would you get a CRT for 7th gen and up? (sans Wii) There is not a single game on PS3, at all, that looks better on an old CRT than a 1080p LCD.

>>1963675
maybe 2D fighters?

>>1963675
Plasma is a different story, but CRT still has better color, motion quality, black response, and response time than any LCD. Yes, in 2014.

>>1963675
The later Sony BVMs looked great with 7th gen and up systems. Though were talking 900TVL resolution and up, so really high end shit.

>>1963697
...except that games were designed on and for LCDs. So CRTs are actually worse in every aspect. The response time for a PS3 game played on an LCD or a CRT is the same.

>>1963675
Every game running at 60fps looks better on a CRT.

>>1963702
>The response time for a PS3 game played on an LCD or a CRT is the same.
The only way that could be true is if the devs can somehow detect that the game is displayed on a CRT and add artificial latency to make it deliberately worse to compensate.

>>1963740
Old game played on an HDTV: input lag.

New game played on an HDTV: no input lag.

How is this difficult to understand?

>>1963697
Plasma is a worse story than LCD. Not worth discussing.

>>1963752

Because it's not what happens at all.

>>1963752
He's probably having difficulty because it's not true in many ways and you're arguing an equivocation. He did say CRT and you are saying HDTV, but those two words are neither the same or different things. They're different concepts.

>>1963757
How so? I was under the impression that plasmas had very good color reproduction, somewhat competitive with CRTs, since they both use a phosphor based display.

Not trying to argue, just curious.

>>1963758
Actually, it happens to a degree.
Putting an interlaced signal into a new flat panel introduces a delay from the display's de-interlacing and scaling processes.

Putting in the display's naitive resolution should bypass any image processing required.

>>1963803

There are other delays outside of scaling and deinterlacing. Those tend to be the most significant ones though.

>>1963675
My PC CRT monitor says otherwise

>>1963752
>New game played on an HDTV: no input lag.
Depends on the output resolution, and of course, slow LCD response plus sample and hold delay both affect image perception.

>>1963757
Plasma is superior to LCD for games. Instant response, no sample and hold. Superior.

What's been going on in this thread this week and China?

>>1963886
Plasma is hardly superior in terms of latency. Even without scaling, both still have to convert an analog signal to a digital signal, which is then converted back to an analog signal which adds latency.

>>1964660
>Plasma is hardly superior in terms of latency.
Oh ho ho, you damn well better believe that yes plasma is better than LCD for games.

>>1963697
>better color, motion quality, black response, and response time
These are all very good with plasma for non-game material. A/D conversion is where lag is added for analog games.

>>1964687
I tried playing DDR on a plasma with an Xbox 360 with a progressive signal through HDMI, as well as an old Xbox with an interlaced signal through composite; both were unplayable. The steps were too far behind the music.
Plasma might be better than LCD for gaming, but not for the reasons this thread exists

>>1964827
It's fucking DDR. If you play Guitar Hero or something, you won't have that issue.

>>1964843
I'd hope not, since Guitar Hero actually has compensation settings for display lag.

Also, DDR > Guitar Hero

>>1963763
It's not even close to competitive to CRTs. They're as bad as LCDs, worse than some types of LCDs actually. The color production is even worse than LCD as well. They get all sorts of color banding, have issues with color gradients and also can glitch out with fast motion. They also still have image retention issues, temporary but still shit to have.

>>1963886
No. They can have delay also they still ghosts like shit for motion. Plasmas have way too many downsides to compete with LCDs. They're just awful all around. It's best for everyone that some manufacturers have quit making them.

I got http://ebay.to/1yteDzC for $8 today at a thrift store. Did I do gud?

>>1964961

Seems like a pretty good set. You've got component on the back so that gives you some good options for 128-bit consoles, such as the PS2. S-Video would be nice to see, for consoles like N64, GameCube, etc.

However it seems like a good set overall.

So this just happened on a Quake live game with me in the lead. It also times out, then dims then off.
>lost the game
>lost the crt
Tell me it ain't so, docs of vr!

>>1964887
>No.
Yes.

>They can have delay also
Yes they can.

>they still ghosts like shit for motion.
No.

>Plasmas have way too many downsides to compete with LCDs.
List them.

>They're just awful all around.
No.

>It's best for everyone that some manufacturers have quit making them.
No. LCD is cheaper/lighter/thinner than plasma and has no burn-in. That's all.

>>1965174
Yeah I don't get where this ideal that plasmas have horrible motion problems. I've been to the store plenty of times where the TV is and the plasmas look no worse if not better than the LCD counterparts.

>>1965208
No worse than an LCD == horrible motion problems.

>>1965906
This is in comparison to LCD, not to CRT.

>>1959305
Can anyone tell me which model Trinitron this is just by looking at it? Does anyone know if it would have RGB/component connections? I found a great deal for it and would love to get one if it does have those connections.

>>1966126
I should also mention that it's 20" according to the seller.

>>1966126
Looks like a 90's Trinitron so the best you will most likely get is S-Video.

>>1966126
>>1966208
Looks more like early '90s when S-video was far less common. Odds are that it only has composite unless it's from one of that period's higher end lines.

I'm strongly considering getting a universal 6th/7th gen component cable so I can have my Wii and PS2 hooked up to my CRT at the same time (not off-topic, I use them a great deal for classic emulation and PS1 games). Also I have four other devices that require S-video (modded PS1, SNES, N64, and a laptop), so I need a switch. Are there brands I should look for, and is there any reason why these would be bad ideas (lag, significant quality loss, etc.)?

>>1966397

I have one that does Playstations, Wii and Xbox 360. You must unplug the cable from all the others in order to use one device, otherwise the brightness is cut in half and you get a lot of artifacting.

Picked this sucker up for $7 yesterday only to get home and realize it is only in black and white.
Any use for this thing?

>>1966418
Shit forgot pic

>>1966421
play gameboy games on it!

>>1966421

For Super Game Boy, it might be cool.

>>1966421
Backside.
Can anyone tell me anything about these inputs?

>>1966432
Looks like a security video monitor. Middle ones are just regular composite/S-Video input, you may be able to display all four of them simultaneously depending of the monitor. Right are just input to switch onto of the channels if an alarm is ringed.
Left one allows you to plug a VCR to record footage, or another screen.

>>1959613
Very worth it. This is one of the best televisions for NES, SMS, etc.

>>1959638
>>1959636

>rf makes it worthless

you friggin' RGB fags... I swear. In a few years you'll get bored of looking at MS Paint and you'll wish you had a television like this.

>I know this from experience

>>1966457

RF is just plain shit. It's not RGB or bust, S-Video or Composite is acceptable

>>1966457
what the fuck are you talking about

>>1966464
The obsession with monitors doesn't end with RGB perfection. Once you achieve that, you'll start looking at other things to do, and that means looking at vintage TVs and trying to get the perfect retro image.

>>1966463
RF is interesting, and if you are trying to recreate the experience of what many people played on in the past it is what you want to use. It all depends on your goals. I switch between RF, Composite, S-video, and RGB all the time.

>>1966472
The only console I had as a kid which didn't output RGB right out of the box was the N64, I had scart cable for everything else.
Perfect retro image is just RGB for me, that's just how I enjoyed it back then

>>1966472

I can't understand wanting to make it look shitty for the sake of "authenticity".

>>1966478
Not yet, give it time.

>>1966397
You can get a component switch, just like you can get S-video switches. No need to resort to poorly-made universal cables.

>Are there brands I should look for,
People in analog consumer video back in the day generally liked Sony and JVC switches but honestly it really doesn't matter too much as S-video doesn't need anything special like analog HD does. Chances are if you've heard of the brand before, their S-video switch will probably work fine.

>and is there any reason why these would be bad ideas (lag, significant quality loss, etc.)?
Well, the worst of the worst ones will give you brightness problems, along with potential dropouts (screen flashing or blanking) whenever the picture is supposed to go all white suddenly or any other extreme shift from darkness to brightness in the signal. The same thing happens with crappy component switches.

>>1966406
Yikes, that sounds horrible. Sounds like you're getting signal reflections like crazy because all the wires are unterminated and there's no in-line switching.

>>1966480
it's a matter of tastes really, i like RGB better, especially after a decade of using composite

i know some games used the blurry vision of composite to make visual tricks, like the waterfalls in sonic the hedgehog, but i still prefer RGB

RF is still really bad though, i say this having played a bunch of shit on my dreamcast with RF inputs on an old-ass CRT. it's horrendous.

>>1966490

Yeah. I'm fine to simply unplug one cable and reinsert another - it saves me having to reach behind the TV which is very awkwardly placed.

I can understand people who use RF or composite for that comfy feeling. I get it. I used RF in the NES-Genesis days and was ecstatic when I could upgrade to composite for both NES and Genesis and S-video for SNES.

I wouldn't go back to using RF unless necessary, but if/when it's ever needed, I won't mind too much. Those are my roots.

>>1966463

RF is what you need to display atari 2600 colors correctly, as it heavily rely on NTSC color bleed.

>>1966491
>i say this having played a bunch of shit on my dreamcast with RF inputs on an old-ass CRT.

Dreamcast games or emulators? Either way it is far off the mark of where you want to use RF.

So, can anyone give me some suggestions on the best consumer-level CRTs to look for, and the best way of obtaining them besides Craigslist? I originally had my eye on some RGB monitors like the PVM-2530 or NEC multisync xm29, but I can't find either of them or the ones sold on Ebay are out of my price range & sold as-is, and most of the time it's local pick-up only.

>>1967368
See
>>1959310
As for obtaining them, why wouldn't you use Craigslist? Go to thrift shops like Goodwill and look around, that's probably your best bet. If it has s-video it's probably solid, but you can always look up the model number on your phone for more info.

>>1967368
Depending on where you live, just drive around middle-upperclass neighborhoods the day before trash day and you're bound to find some crt's, of course that's a total crapshoot to see if they work or not.

Craigslist is really the best though because you're more likely to get something that works, and most people are giving these away for free/next to nothing.

>>1967368
Just keep looking and be patient. Certain areas are going to have better luck than others, but if you are patient you will probably find something. Ask around on forums as well.

>>1967368
Also, this might sound obvious, but do try using more general search terms in addition to specific model numbers. Knowing cl, someone could easily list a decent monitor and call it nothing more than "Sony monitor."

>>1967368
Visit surplus auctions.

Can any italians here tell me what postage would be internationally? I'm attempting to purchase a cable off someone in italy and he quoted me 20 euro for postage alone. Despite the item probably weighing 200g at most.

>>1967856
Or just "old tv", I've seen that one a lot in my area.

>>1967368
You can also look for local tradeshow or broadcasting companies and call them and ask if they are getting rid of stuff. Most likelly they will just tell you to fuck off but sometimes these companies are willing to sell old shit like crt monitors.

Local Goodwill got a crap-ton of monitors in recently. Most of them were black and white monitors for an old security system, but six or seven of them were Sony PVM's with RGB in. I bought two for $25 each. They're all PVM-8042Q's. Small screen, but perfect for a desktop setup. Here's one of the two I bought.

>>1967969
And here's the hookups.

>>1967969

>Two 9" Sony PVM with RGB for 25$

Wow! That's a really nice...

>dose damages

Ouch, I understand now why you got it for this cheap. Well, at least they're working, right?

>>1967975
Yeah they both work fine. And don't worry, the other one doesn't have any cracks or anything on the faceplate, it'll be my primary monitor. Already ordered scart cables for my SNES and Genesis and an RGB adapter. After I get those I'll update with pics. Will say that Super Castlevania IV looks pretty awesome even with just S-video.

If I was to hook up an older console, like a PS1, to a CRT with S-Video cables, would I be getting 240p or 480i?

>>1967996

Oh I see. Great catch anyway, they're pretty small, but I'm sure they'll make nice tabletop monitors.

>>1968012

240p.

>>1967969
I dont think those pvm models with Q have comb filters. So you should mostly play games in rgb because composite will look like shit without a comb filter.

>>1968041

My PVM-1444QM gives me a nice picture in composite m8 (well, maybe the comb filter was integrate in the LD player though).

>>1968049
crt and anime is really living the dream.

>>1968015
are you sure?

>>1968086

If you plug the PS1 into the TV with other cables, does it display 240p?

>>1968012
All depends on the game. If the game is meant to be in 240p, it will display in 240p. If it's meant to display in 480i, it will display in 480i.

Any good RGB output DVD players in the USA? The PS2 overlays a green tint when you try to play movies with this output for some stupid reason, so that one is a no-go.

>>1968130

It sounds like it's trying to output YPbPr instead of RGB instead. It always happens when trying to run DVDs on a PS2.

I dunno, use a PS3? If you have one, that is. The AV out is the same for all Playstations except for the PS4, which only offers HDMI.

>>1968134
I think I read somewhere that the green tint was intentional - games run fine when set to RGB mode, no green tint. Thanks for the PS3 suggestion, I hadn't thought of that. I'm curious to see how DVDs will look on my monitor.

>>1968135

When I set the console to YPbPr and use RGB cables, I get the same green tint over my games.
If I were to guess, the PS2's DVD player overrides the systemwide colour space setting.

>>1968139
From a brief look, it sounds like PS3 does the same but I will have to confirm with mine. It sounds like maybe this was done as some sort of copy protection?

>>1968142

I can test it right now if you like.
Yes, that seems to be the excuse.

>>1968130
>Any good RGB output DVD players in the USA?
No. Prohibited by DVD Forum.

>The PS2 overlays a green tint when you try to play movies with this output for some stupid reason
Analog copy-protection. Forces output to YPbPr and embeds noise on Y during blanking to destroy videocassette gain adjustment.

>so that one is a no-go.
Mod chip.

>>1968146

Is there a homebrew DVD player for PS2 without this restriction?

>>1968151
Most modchips just patch the existing DVD player.

>>1968156

Yes, but can this existing DVD player be tached without a modchip? Is this possible on a PS2 with FreeMCBoot, for example?

I just tried the PS3 with RGB and it doesn't work, it still outputs what I think is YPbPr. Maybe use VGA from a PC or a Wii instead.

Alright CRT thread, PCE question here.

I modded a white PCE per mmmonkey's guide (subbing the transistors for 2SC945s in the amp because they're supposed to be compatible) and the colors look dull compared to other consoles on my PVM (pic related).

I've got some 2SC1815s on the way and I'm going to build the amp shown here: http://www.gamesx.com/grafx/pce_rgb.jpg

Will this help, or is this just for the PCE is? I know there are a million different versions of this mod out there, but very few show any actual screenshots. Also, by dull, white text seems a little gray and it doesn't seem to have perfect contrast. Not bad, and I can still see backgrounds in R-Type for example, but the picture is just a little lifeless compared to my other consoles I play through RGB. If I crank the contrast on my PVM it looks a little better, but I don't want to have to do that. Are there components I can add to the existing amp to just boost contrast?

>>1959305
Looking into buying my first CRT. What are acceptable prices to look for?

Most I find online are around 15-20, but their either local pickup, or like 85 shipping.

>>1968606
Try and find a local GoodWill or something similar, they almost always have a large selection of CRTs for dirt cheap.
Check the inputs on the back of them for at least s-video, component would probably the best.

I hear flat screen CRTs are not recommended, but I don't know enough to say anything about that.

>>1968618
I saw one little box TV I really like at my local goodwill a week ago. I doubt its been bought up yet, but I'm not sure if its a CRT.

I just got an SNES recently, but the scaling is just bad on HD composite. So I want to find an alternative that will really make it shine.

Also, Will 5th generation consoles work wioth CRTs? 64 is headache inducing in 1080

>>1968626

5th gen consoles work well with CRTs, and even 6th gen consoles do (especially ones which can do 480p)

DynaFlat, is this some rip off of Sony's aperture grill? Or, better yet is there anything better as an alternative to Sony's aperture grill?

>>1967856
Would this also apply for crt monitors?

>>1967492
>infopics
lel, enjoy knowing literally nothing

Just impulse bought this Sony Trinitron KW34-inch HDCRT TV for only $2 bucks at Goodwill.

What's good, /vr/

>>1968985
you son of a bitch

i paid $1000 for one of those not 8 years ago

>>1968985
>Trinitron
>Goodwill
Ugh, working at a Goodwill. Just hearing the word "Trinitron" gives me back pain.

>>1968985

I always hear HD CRTs suck.

>>1969002
Not true. They're ideal for 6th gen.

>>1969016

You mean EDTVs? I thought they were different.
I have one which handles 240p, 480i (both with optional linedoubling) and 480p.

>>1969023
Wega KD models can do 480p and 1080i natively. They're fantastic for HDTV broadcasts, Dreamcast, Xbox, and Wii.

>>1969026

That sounds perfect, actually. I think one of the Gran Turismo games on PS2 and a handful of Xbox games supported 1080i.

>>1969031
Xbox actually supports 720p as well.

>>1969036

Well. How do those TVs handle 480i and 240p? My EDTV introduces a little lag on all inputs unfortunately.

>>1969041
Most HDCRTs do 480i natively. 240p though, not sure.

I decided to try some PC games on my KV-M1400D.
It didn't looked very amazing at 640x480i but then i forced 640x240p (and turned off aspect ratio correction in nGlide) and everything looked much better, except that the scanline 'filtered' FMV was blank but that doesn't matter.
This is one hell of an port, they stayed with passwords instead of going through the effort to implement save slots.

>>1969096
I couldn't use 320x240, as the pixel clock of my HD3450 can go lower than 7,14mhz.
Is there a way to force Dosbox against the aspect ratio?
It always assumes square pixels and squishes the picture horizontally to the half.

>>1969001
As soon as I heard Trinitron and Goodwill, my immediate response was "Enjoy your hernia".

It will be a sexy display but I pray that that you never plan on moving that TV again. Its just a nightmare.

>>1969116
This is a another game i played back then.
I always started this game before this title screen appeared, i honestly don't recall seeing this.
The title screen of the SNES version is kinda cute but THIS is just plain disturbing.
I believe that he will reap your soul if you start a stare competition with him, or should i say 'it'.

>>1969138
Dude, we got so many CRTs that we could be choosy about what ones we put out on the floor. Old people finally upgrading their TVs and such.
It sucked that most of them ended up being huge fucking monsters, because I swear anytime a Trinitron or other such TV was needing to be loaded up, they asked me to do it. And I was a goddamn cashier!
The worst was lugging that crap out to their Prius or Smart Cars and the people were dumbfounded that it didn't fit.

Which is better, an old, aperture grill or, a brand new black matrix (shadow-mask) pc crt?

>>1968049
That makes no sense. Comb filtering is applied to a composite signal on the display side. LDPs with comb filters use it for S-video output only.

>>1969158
I am able to fit 27inches and under in my corolla so thats not terrible. But I'm itching for a 4:3 36 inch CRT, but I'll probably never get one. :(

Imagine how much fun Time Crisis would be on it!

>>1968618
>I hear flat screen CRTs are not recommended
Depends completely on the model.

>>1969175
Lifting fuckhuge crts is a great workout. Imagine how jacked you could get doing squats with a 200lbs monitor.

>>1968631
>especially ones which can do 480p
The systems that do 480p are best served by different TVs than the older systems.

>>1969183

A CRT with 480p support is, in my opinion, the best way to play those systems.

>>1968808
>DynaFlat, is this some rip off of Sony's aperture grill?
No.

>Or, better yet is there anything better as an alternative to Sony's aperture grill?
Subjective. But really all AG screens are functionally equivalent.

After the trinitron patent expired several manufacturers started using aperture grille technology under their own unique trademarks.

>>1968990
I paid $400 for mine that same year (floor model).

>>1969001
>>>/fit/

COME ON

>>1969283
Ehler's-Danlos is a bitch, what can I say?

>>1969291
ah , my bad, sorry.

This was in a craiglist thread on /b/.

>>1969608

>>1969615
WHERE THE INPUTS NIGGA

>>1969629
WIFI CRT MAAATE!

>>1969640
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMHcQo23u5k

>>1969615

>BEARS MADE IN JAPAN

What?

>>1970186
That says "sears". I did not know sears made crts.

>>1970186
>Not getting Japanese Bears
>Settling for chinese knockoffs

Can any kind anon tell me anything more about the TV in the pic. All I know is it's a Sony Trinitron 68cm. Is it worth picking up for retro gaming on? Will it handle component and s-video?

>>1970217

Ask the seller if he can offer any details, if he can take a picture of the inputs for example.

>>1970328
Thx, Anon. The seller already offered, which was great. No pic yet, but i'm hopeful :)

Trinitrons are meant to pretty good for retro, right?

>>1970347

As far as consumer models go they're great.

>>1970347

>Trinitrons are meant to pretty good for retro, right?

Unless they're HD ones, and they have more than RF input, yes. (Though RF is the on ly thing you need for an Atari 2600, a Colecovision, or this kind of console)

>>1968985
That's not the KW, that's a 34xs955.

>>1969051
Wrong, most HDTVs deinterlace 480i and mangle 240p.

>>1969186
Depends on the game for PS2 and GCN (even a few on DC and XBox).

>>1970724

I think a native res screen would be ideal.

>>1970732
which for many PS2 and GCN games isn't 480p

>>1970738

Do many EDTVs improperly handle 480i?

>>1970742
Almost all, as far as games go. Deinterlaced TV and DVD at 480i (where lag doesn't matter) looks great on them, though.

>>1970790

I get the feeling that this opinion is going to be pretty controversial, but I prefer deinterlaced 480i to native. I hate the jagged look it gives and gladly accept the couple of frames of lag.

>>1970796
Native 480i isn't jaggier, since on displays where it's native, it either has scanlines or a tight vertical resolution.

240p and 480i on SDTVs is great, just like 480p on EDTVs and HDTVs is great.

What's the reason why most CRTs that sync to 31+khz are not able to sync to lower scan rates like 15khz?

>>1970815

Any kind of movement gives a very distracting comblike pattern.

>>1970821
Because they not made to do so.

>>1970815

>480p on HDTVs is great
You can't be serious.

>>1970836

Why not? What's the reason why low scanrates don't just work?

>>1970823
Not for me on my TVs. That literally sounds like a bad TV tuner card with no comb filtering.

>>1970861
>What's the reason why low scanrates don't just work?
Because the electronics inside the monitor isn't designed to do this.
The deflection coils of any CRT is capable to scan vector graphics but it's up to the electronics (chassis) that drive them.
All monitors and TVs have their limits.

>>1970850
shway serious. Plenty of CRT HDTVs have native 480p modes.

>>1970878

I'm using RGB SCART and I see it. Interlaced video looks awful, progressive scan or bust.

>>1970881

Ah, well then you have a point.

>>1970883
On a PVM or a regular Euro CRT TV or what?

No regular TV that is natively 480i gets those artifacts.

>>1970883
I was playing Sunshine with my niece early on my PVM, and it looked fine.

I'll admit, there are some games that just don't look that great in 480i, but that doesn't stand for all games.

My camera wants to cover everything in moire patterns today for some reason.

>>1970891

I'll try on a different TV and see if I still get the same effects.

>>1970823
>>1970878
It's normal for interlaced video on CRTs. You probably don't notice it because you're used to it, same as Americans often don't notice 3:2 pulldown.

>>1970907
It's not a perception problem. Literally none of my 5 CRT SDTVs or my PVM show this effect. What does show this effect is my TV cap card with all filters off.

Are there any guides that exist for photographing a CRT screen?

>>1970907
No, it's "normal" if you're incorrectly displaying 480i60 interlaced video as 480p30 PsF.

>>1971635
1. use a tripod
2. set up your camera using a color bars pattern

>>1970861
>>1970880
As I understand it, the high-voltage power supply design is tied to the horizontal deflection.

>>1971636
Example 1 - fields weaved and treated as 30hz progressive video (e.g. raw DVD)

>>1971648
Example 2 - Fields treated as 60hz interlaced fields

>>1969116
Is this game being playing on the kv-14 ?
It looks quite good

just hooked up my bedroom setup for nes games, the bulk will be out in the living room but this is off to the left of my computer and may be played more.

>>1971826
here is a bit closer look at the screen though glare proved an issue.

the low resolution on this screen is only a hair higher than what the nes outputted natively resulting in surprisingly clear composite

>>1971826
an old advert for this exact model.

So i got my first proper CRT TV of my own today, it's a BEKO something or other, fuck knows, it's old.

Everything works perfectly fine apart from a really high pitched ringing sound, it mellows out after a bit and fades into the sounds of the game but it's still really noticeable at first and it gets into your head.

what's that? is it worth fixing or just ignoring?

I remember playing c64, nes and snes on this thing. It was nice and light with handles on sides.

>>1971868
sounds like one of the electronic capacitors might be malfunctioning

if you turn the volume all the way down you still hear it?

Just make sure it has nothing to do with the speakers

>>1970901
the scanlines in that picture? are they stable with the image like at 240p

or do they roll like normal 480i on a high-resolution monitor?

>>1971868
Is it coming from the speakers or somewhere else? Cheap CRT TVs sometimes whine at 15KHz because of slight magnetostriction in the deflection circuitry.

>>1971340
why did you post your image so dark?

are those motion blurs I see on the graphics of the top?

>>1971826
That monitor is comfy as hell.

>>1971983
They "flicker: the same way any 480i source would.

>>1971993
>why did you post your image so dark
Because I post my images raw, as in no post processing. Don't need no "oh, you photoshopped it, that's why it looks so clear" or any other type of bullshit. I take most of my shots at ISO 100, but sometimes dropping it down to 64 gets me a clearer picture; This also usually results in a darker image, but what are you gonna do. Perhaps one of the shots I posted on tumblr would be more your liking.

>motion blur
Looks like it. Capturing just one field isn't exactly the easiest of things to do.

>>1970901
Try fucking with the exposure time so you can avoid the moire from the interlacing, maybe you can time it with the refresh perfectly like they used to when they'd make telesnaps on 16mm of TV shows.

>>1972306
I'm stuck with a shitty point'n'shoot, so things that I can manually adjust are rather limited. While I don't have to rely on it as much as I used to, rapid fire photography and luck still play a sizable role in getting a decent shot.

The only time I can think that I've ever gotten even semi-consistent exposure was with my Super Metroid playthrough, where most shots came out at or at least close to 1/16 sec. This has to be close to some sweet spot for CRT photography, as the hit to shit ratio of the ~600 photos I came out with was actually quite high.

>>1972275
>They "flicker: the same way any 480i source would.

yeah I hate that, never been a big fan of interlaced video. it's way more apparent on high-resolution monitors though (Wega vs PVM)

that's why I always run 240p or some other native progressive format (like 480p)

if I have a source that's only available interlaced, (ps2, vhs, etc) I run it through my (somewhat) pricey video processor, and convert it into 480p

before anyone screams "lag", these algorithms have sub millisecond delays.

I can get near native quality with no discernible lag. everything looks beautiful

>>1972315
what's your camera model?

and, do you use a tripod?

>>1972326
With my PVM, as long as I'm not sitting too close to it, the interlacing doesn't jump out too much.

For me, the larger the screen, the more noticeable it is. Where I might be slightly aware of it on the PVM or the GXTV, playing on the 32'' FD or my father's 32'' Toshiba makes it stick out like crazy.

>>1972331
>camera model
A Kodak Easyshare m863 that isn't even technically mine.

>tripod
I have in the past, but they've all been stupidly cheap(literal dollar store) and broken with light use. Most of my photos are taken by hand. Oddly, when I've tried to place the camera in attempt to stabilize it is when moire likes to rear its head the most. Mind you, recently this has been a WiiU box, a wooden chess board and a container of blank CDs, but still. It was quite bad when I was trying to take some shot of Sonic the Fighters on the HS420, but I think that may have been amplified by the set itself and not so much the camera.

Here's an oddly specific question that only you guys can answer:

I don't have a receiver at the moment and I was thinking of using my PVM to forward the audio signal to my passive speakers. If no video signal is being fed to the monitor, will it still cause wear on the tube?

What are your thoughts on the My Life in Gaming Retro RGB videos.
They're using HDTV's but it seems really cool.

It's bothering me though that they haven't found a s-cart switcher since there seems to already be plenty available and what /vr/ recommends.

Has anyone here ever bought one of those framemeister boxes?

>>1971967
>>1971984
Yeah it doesn't come from the speakers, it comes from the television itsself, the speakers can be all the way off and it still makes the noise

>>1971868
not being a dick, but are you younger?

my wife (six years younger than me) swears she hears a loud pitch ringing when i have my trinitron on.

i just assumed my hearing had lost the ability to hear that certain pitch, which is an actual thing.
too many phish shows...

>>1971868
>it mellows out after a bit and fades into the sounds of the game

>>1973119 here, again.
forgot to say that she tells me it fades with time as i keep playing, like in your situation.

so perhaps the tv is fine and you just have super ears?