/vr/ - Retro Games

Did that thing output Dreamcast through VGA or simple composite?
Was there anyway to change it if the former?

>>1922938
simple question that I'm sure has a complicated answer, maybe someone here can shine some light on this for me.

What would be the least expensive way to get 15khz picture from a computer to a CRT?

I'm building a mame cab.

So far the most expensive option seems to be an arcadeVGA card plus an arcade monitor, but I'm convinced it can be done cheaper.

>>1923043

The least expensive way is using custom drivers and having a graphic card that you can force to output a 15kHz signal. I'm not really experienced in this domain, but this is what I learned from lurking in these threads.

>>1923056
I understand this but then how to you get the 15lhz signal to the CRT without losing quality.

PC CRTs that accept VGA are only made for 31khz and up. Consumer crts don't accept VGA. So I'm thinking I might get a lenkeng processor to convert the VGA to component... but then I'm not sure it's going to be very good quality. I'm a student so I don't have the cash to blow on an arcade monitor

I managed to get myself a CRT PC monitor and want to set it up as an emulation display.
I read in one of this threads something about using a custom resolution of 3840x480.What are the benefits of doing that?

Looking at getting a Sony PVM-20M4A (which I believe is the Australian version of the PVM-20M4U) the composite & Component inputs look different, is this standard for all PVMs? Will I need some sort of adapter?


this one: https://isurplus.com.au/manuals/Sony%20PVM-14M4A%20Monitor%20Brochure.pdf

>>1923069

there are schematics to make a VGA → SCART adaptator, and all TVs accept RGB internally, so you can get a cheap one and modify it (DON'T FORGET TO DISCHARGE IT BEFORE).

Took me a while to realize what I was looing at. Then it hit me and all I could say was: Wow, I am so jelly OP.

i need to get a scart cable for this trinitron

tfw mono sound a

Anyone with experience using a JVC BM-H2000 series pro monitor...or bmh1300?
Rgb input and 750 lines/res is a jump from my current pvm14L1 unit...but shipping on the JVC I found will be high...

>>1923098
>the composite & Component inputs look different
They BNC connectors. You'll need to get a SCART breakout cable to connect most older consoles up to it, and you can choose one that's terminated in BNC

>is this standard for all PVMs?
The newer ones, yes. Older models can have CMPTR inputs for RGB.

>Will I need some sort of adapter?
As said above, your SCART breakout cable should take care of older consoles running RGB, but for something like the PS2/Wii/etc, all you need are Female RCA to Male BNC adapters like: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000G5S4JI/

>>1923217
and here's the small panasonic that i use in my room which would also take SCART if i had the cables.

>>1923069
You may need a Transcoder, they will change the VGA signal into Component without affecting the resolution and refresh rate, and it will be a lossless signal.

IIRC cheap ones are around $60, and the high end ones are closer to $200.

>>1923043
buy x600, get soft15khz, set up mame cfg accordingly (google mame cfg 15khz or something along those lines), in USA you'll need a transcoder, in UK you'll need ultimate scart adapter

>>/tv/

>>1923354
noice, thanks mate.

Can somebody explain something to me? Why do some people claim 240p would look better than 480i on a CRT?
Both have 240 lines per field, both are 60hz. What's the difference? Obviously 480i alternates it's even/odd lines, but it's still "physically" 240 lines per frame (actually field, but you get the point) if anything, 480i is supposed to look better because the brain retrospectively connects lines displayed at the moment with those displayed 1/60 of a second earlier, resulting in a percieced 480 lines.
I'm not a CRT enthusiast

>>1925318
480i looks a bit 'flickery' for older games.

Also 480i doesn't have scanlines like 240p does.

>>1922945
Probably internal RGB. It's a 15khz display so it wouldn't be progressive scan.

How does one take a proper picture of a CRT to make tests in terms of picture quality? My only option is a smartphone that has pretty poor camera quality (Moto G)

>>1923196
Anywhere I could get info on a VGA to rgb CRT mod??

>>1922949
This is a pretty good infographic and it warms my heart that I detect some of my own often-repeated phrasing included in it. Without being tl;dr it should take somebody from knowing the very basics that anybody who's ever connected a console to a TV would know to knowing more about the subject that 99% of "serious gamerz" and should cut down on the basic questions so the thread can be more about specific CRTs, their connections and performance.

>>1925446
>it warms my heart
no offense but get a life

>>1925446
It's a shit infographic actually. I kinda wish people would stop posting it.

>>1925450
Agreed, like all the infographics

>>1923043
The least expensive way would be to get a video card that outputs S-Video, or to use a hardware scaler. Both should be $20 or so but they'll look pretty crappy. Putting a TV in an arcade cabinet is pretty inauthentic. For an arcade cabinet, if you don't want to go to the expense of using an arcade or pro monitor you'll be able to get a cheap VGA monitor to more closely approximate one than a TV. If you want it to look like consoles on a TV why not put it in a nice old console TV cabinet?

>>1925449
>>1925450
>>1925452
3edgy5me. Are you disputing its accuracy? If you'd rather spoonfeed that info to noobs over and over that's fine - or maybe you just want the whole thing to be mysterious and exclusive but I for one appreciate there being something that answers all the easy questions.

>>1925472
The only complaint I've seen about it is the TV model number it recommends.

>>1925514
Yeah, I have no idea where that came from and it could have more info about scart-to-yuv transcoders but you don't want your infographs to be too wordy.

>>1925472
lol did you make it or something ?

all infographics I've seen on 4chen are usually very opinionated with very little detail or explanation. aka shit

>>1925462
this is crappy advice . a cheap VGA monitor won't produce correct scanline effect.

Also there are good hardware scalers worth quite a bit more than 20$ that produce pretty nice picture quality.

Building an arcade cab, not that plebian/antique looking thing

>>1925567
A VGA monitor in 640x480 mode with a filter will replicate scanlines just fine. A low hour one with its brightness and contrast adjusted appropriately can even approximate bloom. The poster wanted to know the cheapest option, not the best and he's obviously working on a shoestring if he wants to put a consumer TV in an arcade cabinet. He SHOULD get an arcade monitor and feed it its correct signal via crt_emudriver and a jpac.

>>1925563
No I didn't make it but you obviously didn't even look at it. It's all facts, except possibly those KVM model recommendations, though they are the biggest, newest non-flat Trinitrons you can get.

I swear, the amount of worthless bitchy shitposting on /vr/ gets worse every day.

Hey Guys, I'm looking for a crt on ebay and stumbled upon this one:

http://download.p4c.philips.com/files/2/21pt1967_01/21pt1967_01_pss_.pdf

I could get it for a few bucks and the seller is in the neighborhood.

What do you think?

>>1925578
get a life
offense intended this time

>>1925578

seeing as I'm on a shoestring budget, the computer for the cabinet won't be good enough to run filters without considerable lag. Need hardware level scanlines


Still wondering if anyone has any information on modding a north american consumer level CRT for RGB. I'm decent with soldering

>>1925586

Here are some Images

>>1925586

>>1925596
You can run a PC monitor at 240p if you force it to 120hz. It gives scanlines and everything.

>>1925586

>>1925614
Will they be the same as 15khz scan lines of tho? What resolution would you use at 120 hz

>>1925621
>Will they be the same as 15khz scan lines of tho?
They'll be excessively sharp, and the brightness will be lower because you'll need BFI. On the plus side, latency will be lower.

>What resolution would you use at 120 hz
3200x240 or similar ultra-wide resolution.

>>1925625
Sounds like other options would be better

>>1925596
The guy who made this guide deleted it. But it's still on the internet archive:

https://web.archive.org/web/20111215141048/http://133fsb.wordpress.com/2010/05/22/adding-an-rgb-input-to-a-cheap-generic-ntsc-tv/#more-123

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NaMOqM3bg8

Also this video. The guy tried, but couldn't get it working right.

>>1925640
Amazing thank you. This seems like a fun new project and good practice for my classes

>>1925614
>>1925625
>You can run a PC monitor at 240p if you force it to 120hz
>latency will be lower

stop inventing things or try to convince yourself you got the "perfect" 15khz CRT replacement

1) this is not true 240p because the line rate s still fixed to 31kHz and the black frame insertion is what causes those fake interlaced "scanlines" (a real 15khz CRT has them blanked which makes a real difference)

2) input latency has nothing to do with screen refresh rate, especially when emulated games only refresh their inputs every emulated frame at best (60 hz). Input latency is caused by hardware latency of input controller, software buffering in the emulator and latency of the display hardware.

>>1925835
1) It is true 240p. It has nothing to do with black frame insertion either. You have no idea what you're talking about.

2) With MAME, input latency is reduced if it didn't already have 1 frame of lag to begin with.

How much of a difference would I see by using a VGA to Component converter on a CRT TV vs. using S-video for a Dreamcast?

>>1926069
VGA to component is mostly lossless, and VGA is a huge difference from NTSC.

>>1926092
>VGA to component is mostly lossless

Yeah nah, there's vertical sync, a whole channel you'd lose.

>>1926136
top kek

>>1926136
That would constitute as lossless pretty much.

>>1925318
I don't like how images displayed at 480i *shimmer" and I don't like how clarity is lost when any kind of smoothing is applied to remove said shimmer.

>>1925318
Interlacing sucks balls in any situation.

So I've been wondering about multisync CRTs. How do they change the height of the electron beam?
Doing a high resolution, it would a fine beam to show that detail. But it would need a comparatively fat beam to fill the space on lower resolutions.

>>1926573
Nah, if we're talking about CRTs specifically, give me 1080i over 540p for movies and TV any day.

>>1926630
>i

It's 2014, anon. Interlacing is dead and thank god.

>input latency has nothing to do with screen refresh rate
The image doesn't magically teleport to the screen all at once. Faster refresh = faster image transfer.

>>1926061
>It has nothing to do with black frame insertion either
It absolutely does, because if you simply duplicate frames you get a ghost image following motion, visible for the same reason as sample-and-hold blur on an LCD.

>>1925835
Do you even understand what horizontal refresh rate means?

>>1926636
And I'm willing to bet that he also prefers 1080p over 1080i, but that isn't what the first statement was about.

>>1925835
>black frame insertion is what causes those fake interlaced "scanlines" (a real 15khz CRT has them blanked which makes a real difference)
BFI, as the name suggest, blanks frames not lines. 120Hz 240p at 31kHz has just as "real" scanlines as 60Hz 240p at 15kHz. They are not blanked, they are parts of the screen the beam skips over. The only difference is 31kHz monitors are sharper so the scanlines will look too sharp.

>>1926630
I'd take 360p over 1080i. 240p could go either way.

>>1924686
>get soft15khz,
Don't. It's redundant. Get CRT Emudriver, it's much more compatible/flexible and comes with a tool to adjust geometry. It runs brilliantly with GroovyMame - Groovymame automatically selects the correct resolution and refresh rate on a per game basis.
>>1925318
480i is flickery as fuck. 240p is stable and clear.
>>1925621
>Will they be the same as 15khz scan lines of tho?
Nope.

>>1925578
>640x480

That's a suboptimal video mode. 3840x480 gets rid of a lot of issues with games that change horizontal width often.

>>1922938
>crt
absolutely disgusting

>>1926738

>The only difference is 31kHz monitors are sharper so the scanlines will look too sharp.

That can be dealt with by using horizontal blur and boosting the color intensity/brightness to maximum to make the raster line bloom a bit more.

Depending on the CRT, you could have something that's BVM-tier at 240p.

>>1926795
Some PC CRTs, such as this Mitsubishi Diamondtron, have a mode to boost brightness (called SuperBright in this case) without messing with color intensity or washing out the whole picture. It literally makes the scanlines bloom about twice as much.

I've not seen a BVM in person, but every close-up shot I've seen of one looks just about identical to what my monitor produces with SuperBright enabled.

This shot has fake software scanlines.

>>1926743
Can groovymame double the refresh for pc crts?

>>1926636
There were never any large consumer-grade CRT HDTVs that could do 1080p, and I specifically was not talking about games.

>>1926697
Correctamundo, sir.

>>1926742
For TV and movies? On a large screen? That's an unusual opinion.

>>1926840
>This shot has fake software scanlines.

You didn't have to mention it, it was pretty obvious.

Are there any tiny TVs like 15" or something that accepts component? Or is that wishful thinking

>>1927390

There are professional monitors, yes, but TVs, I don't know unless you live in Europe and then no need for component just use RGB.

>>1927390
Sony has made at least one 13" TV with component input available in the US, as well as 14" pro monitors.

There were probably others.

>>1927402
You mean the other way around. NA uses component but Europe uses RGB. Component video is used by things like PS2, PS3, PSP.

>>1927408
>You mean the other way around. NA uses component but Europe uses RGB.

Yeah that's what I just said: for TVs, I don't know, unless you live in Europe, where there's no need for component just use RGB.
Maybe I should have formulated my sentence like this.
Anyway, the PS2 can into RGB if I recall, but I don't know about the 2 other consoles though.

>>1927332
So you're saying a BVM obviously inserts fake scanlines as well?

>>1927457

>>1927457
>>1927467

Nope these are different. On the diamondtron screen you can see that the aperture grid have much more TV lines, making it way sharper.

>>1927467

>>1927470
Nigga please. The only shot in >>1927457 where you can actually discern any TV lines is the very last one, and as you can see in >>1927472, they are almost identical. Which has little to do with real vs. fake scanlines, in any case.

>>1927479

Yup it has to do with it: look at the transitions between pixels of different colors, and the thickness of the pixel lines: the one on the diamondtron is much more abrupt than the the one in the BVM, thanks to the additional TV lines it has in order to achieve a way higher resolution.
Diamondtrons looks great with old DOS and Windows games, but look fake with emulated console games.

>>1926574
It's because the beam goes a lot slower at lower scan rates, more time to energise the phosphors

>>1927498
What are you talking about? The transition is abrupt as fuck on the BVM shots as well. If it is any more obvious on my own shots, it is probably due to the waaaaaaaaaaaaay higher resolution of my shots compared to the truncated collection of BVM shots. By my count, every pixel is made up of just about as many lines on both the BVM and Diamondtron shots

In any case, if needed, this too can also be worked around with a teensy bit of horizontal blur if need be (which I actually enable usually). These shots were taken at maximum sharpness, after all.

Of course, I'm convinced at this point that 15KHz purists see things that apparently no one else does. Kinda bordering on audiophile levels.

>>1927521
>By my count, every pixel is made up of just about as many lines on both the BVM and Diamondtron shots

I count 3~4 for the BVM, and more than 6 for the Diamondtron.

>>1927521
>By my count, every pixel is made up of just about as many lines on both the BVM and Diamondtron shots

I see 3~4 for the BWM, and more than 6 for the Diamondtron.

Also, ain't no 15kHz purist, I own more 31kHz monitors than 15kHz ones. I just to see the difference between the way the 2 can render a picture, even when people desperately try to make 31kHz monitors act like a 15kHz one.

>>1927543
Point out a pixel on both shots where this is the case, because I don't see it.

I've actually overlayed both pics here. Hardly ideal given the resolution and slight background differences (not to mention I have SuperBright turned on, which makes white pixels bloom a bit more), but on most pixels, it is a very, very close match.

Honk


I really need to get more SCART cables for shit. Specifically the Genesis and Dreamcast.

>>1927570

For each BVM pixel, there are 2 Diamondtron pixel behind it.

Would anybody here happen to have any unique or "rarer" crt displays?

For example, the early 1980 kv trinitron line.

Also are there any italians, germans or people from the netherlands here? I'm wanting to import a crt or two and could use some assistance.

>>1927735
Here you go
A Toshiba timm, model MM20E45
Mid-90s Amiga-compatible computer monitor with built-in speakers. Multiscan, capable of both 15kHz and 31kHz over RGB.
I'll post some pics that show the screen up close. Unique look. Very nice in person.

>>1927752
An absolutely terrible pic, one of only a few I have showing at least most of the front bezel.

The TV looming in the background is a KV-36FS500.

>>1927754
Here's a good closeup that shows Mario's final form. He will rape your family.

>>1927759
I only have composite cables for my SNES. Apparently I would need the SNES SCART RGB cable and a Sync Strike to use the 15kHz RGB feature of this monitor properly. Same for my Sega Master System, which only has RF for now.

Component out, for PS1 games on PS2, would require a component-to-VGA transcoder that doesn't fuck up 480i/240p. Anybody know of one?

The easiest system to hook up will be my Dreamcast (sorry for not retro).

>>1927752
>Amiga compatible
I'm a little confused by that. Amiga monitors usually have DE-9 or DIN-6 plugs for 15khz RGB in, not DE-15 VGA ports. Any monitor that accepts 15khz RGB will work for an Amiga as long as you have the right cables. Currently using my 14" PVM as my Amiga 2000 monitor.

>>1927768
http://theweeks.org/toms-stuff/NEWSYS.html
http://theweeks.org/toms-stuff/Timm_Mon.txt

Apparently back in the day, Amigafags ate this shit up.

>>1925472
It's inaccurate when it comes to TV models. Condition is the most important thing to look for assuming the TV is what you are looking for in terms of size and picture (aperture grill 90% of the time). A FV300/FV310 that's got high hours and was run in 'kill my TV for extra brightness' mode is gonna look like ass. Or one that took a knock and has it's geometry/convergence all fucked up.

A bad FV310 can easily look a lot worse than a good FS16.

>>1925586
I'm pretty fond of Phillips. I say go for it.

Are there PAL CRT with component-in?

>>1923196

How exactly would you carry out said modification? Can you feed the signals directly to the electron guns?

I've got a sony TV with only composite and S-video that I've attempted to mod only to experience failure. I know that it's possible in principle but I don't know how to achieve it.

>>1927834
Probably very rare, considering RGB over SCART was available in Yurop for longer than component was in the US.

>>1927834
There were, but as >>1927857 said, it was quite rare.
I think most of them were HD CRT, I don't remember Component-in anywhere else. Except some professional monitors with combined Component/RGB BNC connectors.

>>1927843

Check the schematics of your TV model, and try to feed it RGB directly on the driver board. If you need to add some resistance, add them. All TVs use RGB internally.

>>1927803

"Amigafags" either used 15kHz TVs with a SCART cable or a monitor.

>>1926642
You're a fucking idiot please stop posting in this thread before you confuse people.

>>1927752
Where did you find it? I used to have one until my mom threw it out.

>>1927735
In addition to newer and much more common things that people might still own, I've owned:

- a mid-late '70s Sanyo with channel buttons you didn't have to press (just touch)

- a late '70s Trinitron with Lumisponder that eventually became haunted

- an early '80s Magnavox with stereo audio inputs but no video inputs

- a 1991 ProScan with S-video input and speaker outputs (with matrix surround decoder)

>>1927834
>meanwhile, in the Down-Underverse...

Scart was never common in Australia and New Zealand, even composite was missing from a lot of sets - hell, even the sega saturn was usually shipped with only the rf cable.
With the boom of DVD's, component became standard on big SD CRT's pretty quickly; and conveniently enough, ntsc support as there was a lot of imported ntsc machines early on.

>>1927920
You seem to be the idiot here. Everything I posted was correct.

>>1927962
No, you're just trying to sound like you know what the fuck you're talking about when you don't. In that post alone, you're suggesting that VGA CRTs have the same characteristics as LCDs which they don't. There is no sample and hold blur on a CRT monitor, obviously. You also seem to be suggesting that VGA refresh rates are slower than console or arcade refresh rates which again they're definitely not. Either that or you're once again putting LCD qualities like delay onto VGA CRTs.

The guy trying to make the cheapest possible MAME cabinet should be using a VGA CRT monitor. That's a fact. On close inspection it won't have exactly the same texture as an arcade monitor but it would be super cheap. As another Anon (not you) correctly pointed out he may even be able to send a 640x240 signal to it with Powerstrip or other utilities if they're compatible with his video card but even if they're not he can send a 640x480 signal with a simple "interlaced" filter on it that just draws the screen with every other line blank. Filters like that don't require any additional processing power.

The areas where this will not pass close scrutiny are that the dot-pattern will be much tighter than on a SD monitor, edges will be sharper and flicker will be much less noticeable. There are some regulars in these threads who prefer these qualities. The sharpness can be reduced by adjusting settings on the monitor, not just sharpness but also cranking brightness to cause bloom. The flicker can also be simulated through black frame insertion but that's the only reason to use it since sample-and-hold blur isn't something that happens on CRTs.

>>1927985
>cranking brightness to cause bloom

Thereby shortening the service life of the display, to be fair. The likes of which are no longer being manufactured.

>>1926642
>The image doesn't magically teleport to the screen all at once. Faster refresh = faster image transfer.

and this does not equal to less input lag

this is just some myth propagated by idiots who like to simplificate things they do not understand and have no idea how emulators are coded.

refreshing output frames at twice the input rate has no impact on the emulated processing of the input since it's still acquired and processed at the original frequency (60hz).

Also lag relates to input acquisition frequency, not output display frequency, if you display something twice as fast as it is produced, you only got repeated frame, hence the black frame insertion, but it has no impact on input lagHich is bound to emulation processing and input/output hardware latency, not hardware refresh rate.

>>1927806
"More important than the model number is the condition of the device. Condition is really what determines how good a device will look. Hopefully you can test the picture before buying."

Right from that guide

>>1927985
They could purposeful throw the convergence off if they really hate the sharpness.

>>1927470
>much more TV lines, making it way sharper.

Isn't this a good thing? People are alway pining for CRTs with higher TV line count because they're sharper than regular CRT TVs

>>1927472
You know, if you didn't point out that it was a Diamondtron, most people would think that was a PVM or BVM shot.

>>1927985
Thanks for the detailed info. I think I'm leaning towards a VGA monitor with a scan line generator like the slg3000

>>1928130
>refreshing output frames at twice the input rate has no impact on the emulated processing of the input since it's still acquired and processed at the original frequency (60hz).
False. Considering RA using BFI and KMS, timeline is:
1. Frame delay (optional)
2. Input poll
3. Run core
4. Upload result to GPU back buffer
5. Wait for vsync (if you set frame delay correctly this should be almost immediately)
6. Buffer swap on Vsync
7. Upload black frame to back buffer, with image frame scanout happening in parallel
8. Wait for vsync (complete image frame calculated from input in step 2 is displayed by this point)
9. Buffer swap on Vsync
10. Back to step one, with black frame scanout happening in parallel

60Hz version.
1. Frame delay (optional)
2. Input poll
3. Run core
4. Upload result to GPU back buffer
5. Wait for vsync (if you set frame delay correctly this should be almost immediately)
6. Buffer swap on Vsync
7. Frame delay, with image scanout happening in parallel (note scanout takes twice as long)
8. Input poll
9. Run core
10. Upload result to GPU back buffer
11. Wait for vsync (if you set frame delay correctly this should be almost immediately)
12. Buffer swap on Vsync (complete image frame calculated from input at step 2 is displayed at this point)
13. Back to step one, with image scanout happening in parallel.

Note how the delay from input poll to corresponding complete image output is longer in the 60Hz case, with the difference being purely the longer scanout time (which is directly influenced by refresh rate and nothing else) if frame delay is set perfectly in both cases.

>>1928312
this sounds like a fun game

>>1928223
Glorious. What TV is that?

I have been trying to track down a PVM for a few weeks now with no luck. Thought I had a guy that runs a local video production company on the line for a few, but he balked at my offer and said he'd rather just keep them.

I fucking hate when you're negotiating with someone and they won't give you a price but get offended with what you offer them. Such a waste of my time.

>>1928326
This thread is for people who care about quality. >>1917423 may be more your style.

>>1928201
>People are alway pining for CRTs with higher TV line count because they're sharper than regular CRT TVs

Some people do, and they're the one playing with emulators, some other don't and play with consumer-grade TVs, and then there are people who don't want something too sharp, but still sharp enough to see scanlines, who buy professional video monitors.

>>1928365
you bring your CRT with you on the bus? cool d00d

I enjoy a good CRT as much as anyone else for 15khz games, but that post is just overkill to the max.

>>1928384
>but that post is just overkill to the max
It's the minimum detail necessary to explain why I was correct.

>>1928312
Yes in this specific case, the delay is reduced by one half frame (8ms).
But that's only because the frontend you are considering has one VSYNC delay before displaying the calculated frame, so VSYNC period indeed matters.

However...

If framebuffer was swapped before VSYNC occured (like it is done in many other frontends), the calculated frame would be displayed during the immediate next frame, not the second next and there would be no differences between 60hz and 120hz version because VSYNC interval would not be part of input latency (if you use frame delay off course).

Btw it seems like RA could be still more optimized for input latency since it adds one uneeded frame delay.

>>1928312
So the difference is 8ms, which is the time difference it takes for monitor to display the Who,e screen, it's not "twice less input lag" as some people claimed and I doubt anyone is able to notice a 8ms difference between the time a button is pressed and the corresponding movement appears on screen.

Hey everyone. I need some help. So i just got this CM8833 II monitor but there's just a small part of picture that works. I really have no idea what I can do.

sorry for poor picture quality

>>1928529
Looks like the vertical deflection is busted.

>I really have no idea what I can do.
Do you know the meaning of repairing?

>>1928540
well yeah. Damn i just got it today and was so excited.

Guys, would you mind giving me a bit of info on signals? I have an early 90's Grundig.
It is based on an european model. It doesn't accept any sort of NTSC.
Yet, when I connected my Mega CD (also european, but I am not from Europe), it still displays the image in black and white.
Why?
It does accept RGB (reason why I bought it) from NTSC consoles and does a wonderful job displaying it, though.

Also, is there any service mode code or anything like that that you can input with the remote and lets you move the image? I know it's common, but the off-centered image irks me.

Model is Grundig CUC5360.

>>1927935
Ten dollars at a Lancaster, CA thrift store.

>>1927914
And this Toshiba timm is the best of both worlds: a 15kHz monitor. All you need is the 23-pin adapter and you can run any Amiga graphics mode.

>>1928608
>Also, is there any service mode code or anything like that that you can input with the remote and lets you move the image?
No, but you can open the TV and adjust R431? (the symbol used in the schematic does not make much sense, it could be vertical center)

>I know it's common, but the off-centered image irks me.
Yes, in more modern sets. Most TVs that old doesn't feature this, it became a standard in ca. 1995.

>>1928652

Yup, I was just saying that Amiga users were also using TVs as monitors, ith an RGB cables, because that guy was all "Amiga users are so dumb xD".

>>1928347
It's actually a Dell CRT monitor

>>1928203
I pointed it out because some people have their heads so far up their asses about genuine 240p that a proper example was needed. Had I lied and posted those shots, claiming they're from a BVM I got for $10 off some old dude through craigslist, I would have had more than a couple of nuthuggers praising my find.

I actually did have some guy in a past thread genuinely thinking a shot I posted was from a PVM or BVM, but when I stated it was a CRT monitor with fake scanlines, he immediately expressed a level of distaste because it was no longer "genuine". This is the kind of people we're dealing with. In these threads and elsewhere, it's not results that matter, but rather whether you're part of the exclusive little club of PVM/BVM owners.

>>1928814
I think the funniest thing about the pvm/bvm guys is the fact that alot of these older games were developed on average crt monitors back in the day, so you're not really experiencing the developer's "true vision" anyways.

that "genuine" though.

>>1928829
I've heard Commodore 1084 monitors (IIRC) were pretty commonly used by developers back in the day.

>>1928851
That's amiga-related, right? I haven't gotten into that yet so I'm not too familiar with their development process.

I remember from a previous thread when we were discussing this , someone posted a few pictures of nes/snes developers in japan - everyone was using normal ass CRTs.

>>1928814
Please don't generalize. Not everyone that uses PVMs and the like are elitist and such; "Genuine" or not, I personally think some of the different PC CRT shots look amazing.

>>1928673

I can try. I am a chicken though and I've heard that the voltages within a TV can fry you in 3 seconds, so I dunno. Thank you either way.
It may be useful if I ever call a technician though.
JIC that's a vertical adjustment, where would the other one be?

>>1928851
For the NES, there was the Sharp Combo NES.

http://nes.wikia.com/wiki/Television_With_Built-In_NES

Apparently they have pretty good image quality.

>>1928862
I didn't mean to generalize. Apologies if it came across that way. Like I said, it's only some people that have their heads up their asses.

>>1928874
> I've heard that the voltages within a TV can fry you in 3 seconds
Not sure about these 3 seconds, i think this might apply to everything else that goes into main.
I touched the solder joint of the horizontal deflection coil twice while turning the convergence rings, it was about 400-500Vac@15khz (measured between my body and that solder joint).
I don't think that it will kill me unless my fingers clamp around this, but it was rather painless, less painful than a papercut and that heatsink which had about 30Vac.
The very high voltages are usually around the flyback transformer, neckboard and the anodecap. I can't imagine myself touching these on accident.

But the trimmer you have to adjust is maybe easy to access.

>where would the other one be?
That's why i wasn't sure. I couldn't find it.

>>1928874
Most newer televisions (2000s and later) have bleeder resistors that drain off the crazy voltage that may be lurking in the back of the tube or the flyback transformer.

Stay away from anything that looks like this! It has thick wires coming out of it, something that looks like a suction cup attached to the glass, huge traces on the bottom of the board, and all the solder points are very far away from each other due to the extremely high voltage (25-30kV).

i have this CRT

http://www.manualslib.com/products/Samsung-Cw-29m064v-1646246.html

the only inputs in it are RF, composite, and a SCART input.

Does the SCART accept component through it or only composite?

just curious is all, i'll get a 20 inch PVM this week but using this monitor mite b cool once in a while. you know, for shits and giggles.

so is dropping 150 bucks on a huge ass PVM worth the expense or is actually just a way to squander money you could well invest in more videogames and a cheap ass 10$ used PC monitor you'll put in software scanlines and play emulators on or any alternative CRT you found laying on the side of the street?

i want to buy a pvm but if it's really just meaningless sperg i'd rather spend my money in more games. or food.

>>1929342
I don't think SCART is used for component, it has its own way of doing RGB.

>>1928520
Sometimes discussions of detail have nothing to do with what is noticeable on an individual level. So if there are ways to minimize things like lag while targeting a certain level of detail, people will work towards it.

>>1928652
How does the Toshiba compare to that Trinitron you have, or CRTs you have in general?

>>1928520
If you have interrupt based or synchronous polling input, and CRT monitor, and infinitely fast CPU to run the core in 0ms, latency could theoretically be halved. Without the infinitely fast CPU it's more like 12ms vs 20ms.

>>1929360
Exactly. Lag is cumulative. I'm thinking of hacking together a parallel port GPIO interface for my arcade stick to avoid the USB polling (every 4ms) latency and jitter.

Yo, is there a way to fix those black bars on the top and bottom of the crt? For some reason the tv decides to show RGB image from my soft15khz/crt_emudriver equipped pc in wrong aspect ratio. In composite there's no such problem.

btw it's a Grundig CUC6301

>>1929492
>Lag is cumulative.
ding ding ding!

The more dismissive people are of minor latency here and a little lag there, the worse their overall experience becomes.

>I'm thinking of hacking together a parallel port GPIO interface for my arcade stick to avoid the USB polling (every 4ms) latency and jitter.
Yep, that's what people did in the '90s and early 2000s for PS controllers before LPT was mostly phased out of most motherboards sometime in 2010-11 or so.

>>1926905
I don't think so.
>>1927834
Yes heaps. I have a sony and an lg.

Before I go through the trouble of moving my PC around to try it, is there any combination of drivers, software, or OS that can get an AMD 6950 to reliably output a 15khz signal, or am I going to have to look to using another card/PC all together?

My attempts at it before only made it to the configuration screen for Groovy Linux. It would go back up to 31+ or just stop sending anything at all afterwards, though the later could be chalked up to the absolutely terrible way I had everything connected.

How do you know if you've overclocked a CRT too far?
Running this Dell at 1280x1024 @ 120hz and so far so good.

>>1928027
Yeah but right now he could buy a huge stockpile of 17" VGA CRTs for $1 or $2 each. If he wants 21s he might have his work a bit more cut out for him. I actually posted a link in the last thread to a Craigslist post here in Columbus where a guy had a damn 36" VGA monitor (800x600) for FREE he just wanted someone to have it who would use it.

A quick check shows ANOTHER one now for five bucks.

http://columbus.craigslist.org/ele/4660714109.html

>>1929660
times sure are good

>for now

>>1927913

By driver board I'm guessing you mean what on sony TVs is called the "C Board", which connects to the neck of the tube.

I've found the RGB feed-in for it but the problem is I don't know what level to have the signals at (as in VCC).

>>1929714

Vpp, sorry. Not VCC.

>>1928520
I expect the idea is that if all LCDs sample and hold then they will always be at least 1 frame behind. If the refresh is 120Hz then frame 1 will be displayed at the exact moment that a CRT would have reached the end of its first frame. Sure there's still "lag" but it's not more than someone using the real hardware would have to deal with.

Since 120Hz monitors are sold to gamers then adding more frame delay to reach 120Hz would be counter productive and would get them called out early so I'd rather bet on a 120Hz gaymen monitor than an expensive HD TV.

What would you recommend for an Amiga 32CD?

>>1930134
>No RGB output on the CD32 except for French versions

>>1930091
>I expect the idea is that if all LCDs sample and hold then they will always be at least 1 frame behind.
Most LCDs update line by line, not buffer the whole frame. The CRT may have a perceived latency advantage because the raster scan is a bright pulse of light, and with the LCD the eye has to integrate the light over time, so it won't register it immediately, but it doesn't take a whole frame.

>>1930159
>No RGB output on the CD32 except for French versions
WTF? Every day I lean more and more to just pimping the A500 I already have.

>>1930270
>Most LCDs update line by line
Maybe for true progressive scan signals but almost certainly not for 480i and 240p

>play retro a lot
>visit /vr/
>everyone loves scanlines
>never saw scanlines on any of my consoles since they all have either composite or scart
what am I missing

>>1930487
You never played arcade games?

>>1930487
pic related

>>1930497
>composite
>vcr combo tv
>samsung

ur doin it wrong m8

>ur doin it wrong m8
but this is how I've always played them, aside from one TV that only had an RF port. I've certainly had better TVs though, this one is rightly pretty bad

>>1930497
>>1930517
>dem pal bars
it hurts you're not using rgb scart since youre clearly a euro

>>1930517
>Samsung
Dein Fernseher ist einfach scheiße.
Deswegen sieht du auch keine grossartigen Scanlines.

>FBAS
Du arme Sau.

>>1930523
I'm using the cable that goes into the AV Multi port on the SNES but it only has a composite end, I grabbed it from a Gamecube. If there's a different one to get RGB I can't be bothered buying it just to get rid of bars I don't notice in gameplay. Either way I still don't get the scanlines thing

>>1930497
donno how any you plebs can game on such a small monitor. PVM or this piece of shit right here, they're just so fucking small

>>1930523
pal bars?

>>1930591
PAL bars are the black bars at the top and bottom of the game image on the TV on (some?) European consoles because of more horizontal fields on the PAL standard than NTSC. At least that's my pleb understanding

I've got a relatively recent Toshiba CRT for some reason.
When displaying SDTV video it gives options for the scan mode: Natural, Active, 100Hz and Progressive.
If I try use Progressive with 240p video, it gets rid of the scanlines.
Anybody got a clue what's going on here?
None of these options appear with 480p or 576p, just 240p/480i and 288p/576i

>>1930625
It's buffering and scaling to 480p, adding latency. I wouldn't trust any CRT TV with 100Hz support.

>>1930756

That or 576p, since this is a PAL TV.
I only have it because I had space and a pound to spend.
What would 100Hz do? Scan over the same line twice in succession?

>TV station right near me
>Send business email inquiring about if they have spare CRT monitors I was in the market for
>mfw they say yes and offer to let me have a look around

>>1930764
Buffer the whole frame scan it twice.

>>1930860
Not him, but I guess this would eliminate need for low pass filter that supposedly is inside TV's circuitry and make the picture sharper?

>>1930860

Hmm. Would any of the other scan modes (Natural or Active) bypass this buffer?

>>1930876
Natural might, you'd have to test it yourself.

>>1930964

I'm not sure how I'd go about that to be perfectly honest.

guys, is the PVM-20N5E a good monitor? i might be able to get one in (allegedly) good conditions for 178ish euro.

Aside from the price which i KNOW IT'S FUCKING HORRIBLE, is it a good choice for vidya?

>>1931286
>N5
It's an absolutely terrible price and that line does NOT have RGB; Composite and S-Video only.

Unless you're a master haggler and could somehow manage to get the owner down to 10-20% of his asking price, pass.

>>1931326
thanks a lot man!

i was also looking at this

http://www.ebay.it/itm/Sony-PVM2043MDTrinitron-Color-Video-Monitor-fr-Endoskopie-/111453128143

maybe it's a better option?

>>1931343
That will accept RGB(no component though), but is an older model so you'd have to be wary about how much wear the tube has seen. Get lucky and have a wonderful looking monitor, the opposite side of the coin is burn in and a soft, dim image.

The price is still fucked though.

Could one of my /vr/os identify this sony triniton model?

>>1931364
post everything you know about it first, right now the odds are most likely that you know more about it than anyone else unless someone actually owns that tv

Have any of you ever witnessed the holy grail of CRTs, the NEC XM37?

http://www.assemblergames.com/forums/showthread.php?49008-NEC-MultiSync-XM37-Plus

>>1931364
It's fairly large, silver, likely outputs in 4:3, accepts power from the mains, and is a Sony Trinitron.

>>1931386
2huge5me

Just moving my XC-3730 makes me regret picking it up. No updates on it I might add.

The XM-29 on the other hand is right in that sweet spot of large screen and still manageable.

>>1931401
Is it really that heavy?

>>1931414
It's basically a giant glass tube, I cannot imagine it being light.

Pretty useless for actually playing games due to the old prong input for coax and mono sound only. Picture's definitely okay though.

It has headphone ports but I've been unable to get them to output stereo, which blows. I did however waste $10 on an RF modulator to fuck around with newer stuff just for the novelty of playing an Xbox 360 on a 45 year old television.

>>1931386
There's nothing on that page describing what games actually look like on it. One can assume only so much; can't really consider it the holy grail without seeing it in action.

>>1931418
>prong input for coax
Prongs as in 300 Ohm antenna connector? Those antennas didn't normally use coax cabling, they used twin-lead wire.

>It has headphone ports but I've been unable to get them to output stereo
It doesn't have a stereo tuner, since stereo TV audio wasn't standardized in its various formats until the '80s. So it won't have a stereo headphone jack.

>>1931414
I don't know how much the XM37 weighs, but the 3730 is over 200lbs.

Leaded glass is pretty heavy, who knew?

>>1931418
If they were still broadcasting analog, I'd use it if only for a little work area TV.

Where can you even find digital to analog converters for that anymore; We missed them back when the switch happened and I don't them around anymore. Being able to actually catch the news without cable would be nice.

>>1931475
i have a few of those converters laying around but they work like shit, you're better off just using a normal ass mini LCD tv or some shit

>>1931490
The point is I have a small CRT to use, no LCDs.

Hell, out of the 10 working televisions in this house, only 2 of them are LCDs: one is my computer monitor and the other is a 32in Vizio. A digital receiver would let me put my GXTV to work again.

>>1931463
>>1931475
Forgive the atrocious camera (thanks, HTC!), this is what I'm working with here. I had this adapter hooked to an RF modulator going to a digital converter box and a digital antenna. Kind of a clusterfuck, but to get this thing working it was worth it.

>>1931506
oh, i see

i think those converters are still around though, i live in europe and people still use CRTs and analog-only tvs a lot. you can find them in most electronic stores for around 20-30 bucks new.

>>1931508
Yep, it's twin lead.

Truth be told, that's what I was stuck with for a bedroom TV and gaming until probably 2002-3. I can't even begin to imagine the number of times my father hauled that little thing off to Sears for repairs.

>>1931510
I'l admit that I haven't done anymore than glance around for them a few times. Maybe once I get my attic setup, I'll give it a better search.

http://www.ebay.it/itm/SONY-PVM-9042QM-EB-Monitor-16-9-4-3-Trinitron-Rohre-/380976964350?pt=Filmnachbearbeitung&hash=item58b3ff22fe

still looking for a fucking PVM. this is the cheapest one i found, don't like that it's too small but i don't care at this point. I fucking hate prices in europe

if anyone tells me the investment is worth it i'll buy it, else i'll buy this piece of shit

http://www.ebay.it/itm/151401450145?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

and be done with it

>>1930414
>Maybe for true progressive scan signals
Which the case for computer monitors, which is what we were talking about.

>>1931518
Eh, I wouldn't scoff at a JVC monitor, as long as you're alright with s-video, because I doubt it has RGB or component inputs. It's probably too small to have an appreciable difference of quality anyways.

That, and the PVM is just too small in general for my tastes. But that's just my opinion.

>>1931518
The PVM has inputs you want, but the price point is still shit.

I don't know what the "crt scene" is like over in Italy, but if I were in your position, I'd just find a decent consumer model with SCART and hold off until luck finds me. Those sizes with those prices are just not worth it.

>managed to find a PVM in my city easier on ebay.it than .com
I don't fucking get it.

>>1930787
report back

>>1931589

i have this monitor
>>1929342
it's a somewhat decent plano with composite and a scart input that probably ingests composite only

>managed to find a PVM in my city easier on ebay.it than .com
you can luck out in ebay.it
i just bought mamono hunter youko for mega drive for a good price, and may be able to get another good game for 15 bucks if i luck out.
The problem is that most of the time prices are ridiculous and you have to wait it out.

It doesn't help that this country is absolutely horse shit

>>1931518
That little PVM is a sweet little monitor but notice how I used the word "little" twice. It's really, really little. I mean, I have a 5" PVM so it's bigger than that but 9" is pretty fucking small you'll need to sit very close to it to really play, like close enough it might be uncomfortable and multiplayer would be pretty much out of the question. The screen will be about the size of a lunchbox.

>>1931596
is a 14 inch version of that monitor OK? there's this one

http://www.ebay.it/itm/SONY-PVM-1444QM-Multinorm-Komponenten-Monitor-/380978491327?pt=Filmnachbearbeitung&hash=item58b4166fbf

i know the price sucks but it's the norm. and the picture looks good.

my toshiba crt displays stuff fine at 640x480 and up but for 240p stuff like old ps1 games it makes a loud high pitched noise. why?

>>1931597
A 14'' model would be decent for a desk setup. The price is displaying as the same as the 9'' model for me(80eur shipped).

As most people know, getting good photos of CRTs is relatively difficult, but if that tube is in good condition, that doesn't seem like all that bad of a deal. It's even a slightly newer model than the 9''.

>>1931597
Yeah 14" is fine as long as you're not trying to use it clear across a room. You can have 3 people on a couch with the 14" on a coffee table or cart and everyone can play fine. If you're trying to build an entertainment center type setup you want at least 20 though.

>>1931617
looked into his store

http://www.ebay.it/itm/SONY-PVM-2054QM-Monitor-16-9-4-3-HR-Trinitron-hochauflosend-/390914466701?pt=Filmnachbearbeitung&hash=item5b0451638d

i'm gonna ask this guy how much shipping costs. if it's feasible i'm getting this one. Looks pretty fucking good.

if it's too much i'll just get the 14 inch one and give no shits.

I'll someday have to post the story of how some asshole tried to scam me out of 300 euro for a 20 inch PVM that turns out he didn't even have

>>1931594
I haven't scheduled an appointment yet.

>>1931597
German post, Italian ebay, brought up on 4chan in English. Halp.

>>1931718
now that's multiculturalism if i've ever seen it

>>1931718
>>1931751
And about Japanese electronics.

Lots of PVM jerking in these threads. Guys if you're in the market for a decent screen just remember that a TV with RGB or Component is just as good. In fact, they're not as blindingly sharp as PVM's which is actually better.

>>1931809
Hah, I did recommend to anon just a few posts up that the shadow mask-based JVC monitor would probably be pretty good. Ikegami monitors are pretty popular around here too...

>>1931809
The problem with that is old TVs don't tend to last anywhere near as long as PVM/BVM's. The picture can easily become more shit than usual over time. RGB monitors are professional equipment, they'll last forever.

>>1931849
>implying we don't check hours clocked on our pro monitors

>>1931817
i listened to your words but that JVC monitor doesn't have neither RGB/Component nor S-Video (from what i could make out of the info i found on the internet) and the seller doesn't respond to questions so i don't feel like taking a shot in the dark with this

plus, if i can get a 14-20 inch monitor that'd be better.

>>1931865
Oh definitely. If you can't get all the information you need, don't get it.

I also just looked up if the JVC takes S-video, and while it technically does take a Y/C input, it's not through a port that's very common; a JVC 7-pin.

>>1931862
Is there even a way to do that? I've never heard anything conclusive and nowhere in the service manual can I find anything of the sort.

>>1931919
figured as much. If it had all the inputs i needed and could have checked the listing better i would have gotten it.

But hey, really appreciate your input. Just wanted to say that.

>>1931921
That later high end models do, but most don't.

>>1931926
Considering the L5 is a pretty model and that's the one I have, I'm not so sure...

>>1931934
I believe it's mainly for BVMs, but I could be mistaken.
http://i.imgur.com/u1tuI0n.jpg

I finally snagged a PVM, it should be here next week. I got a pretty good deal on it, after searching around for quite a while. I only wish I could have found one locally, but whatever.

I'll be sure to post pictures once it arrives. In the meantime, I'm wondering if I can mod my NTSC Gamecube for RGB? I bet only the PAL can do it natively, but maybe if I took it apart and did some soldering...

>>1931949
>I'm wondering if I can mod my NTSC Gamecube for RGB? I bet only the PAL can do it natively, but maybe if I took it apart and did some soldering...
I believe the only way to get RGB out of an NTSC Gamecube is a modified component cable.

>>1931958
Well fuck that, I'm not spending $100+ on those cables just to tear them up.

Are there any decent RGB solutions for GBA? That's the only reason why I keep my Gamecube out.

>>1931961
S-Video from the Gamecube is pretty nice with the GBPlayer.

It was brought to my attention by someone on tumblr a few weeks back that it's possible to force 240p output from it with Swiss. I would assume that would work for s-vid and composite, but I can't confirm.

Aside from that, all I can really suggest is emulation. Mednafen Wii isn't half bad with GBA games.

>>1931970
I speedrun Oracle of Ages, and I'd prefer to stay away from emulators if possible. I currently have a cheap s-video Gamecube cable, but I get some checkerboarding. Maybe I should just invest a little bit more money into it and get the SHVC-009.

I didn't know about Swiss, I might have to look into that. Thanks!

>>1931980
>I speedrun Oracle of Ages
One of these days, I'll stop being such a lazy shit and learn to speed runs something.

>Maybe I should just invest a little bit more money into it and get the SHVC-009
http://www.ebay.com/itm/171403277112

>>1931989
I bought something similar and that's what is giving me the checkerboarding. I've heard that it doesn't happen on cables without composite, though (which SHVC-009 does not). I thought I'd save a couple bucks... but I forgot the old saying, you get what you pay for.

If you haven't seen a run of Ages, there's a pretty cool arbitrary code execution bit at the end that warps you to the final phase of the final boss after beating only 6 of 8 dungeons. It's amazing.

>>1931989
I just read more of the description, he specifically says "no checkerboarding." I guess I'll go ahead and get the damn things. Thanks again!

Dang it, you know what? I should have waited to order those cables to see if it just looked like shit because it was going through my capture card or if it was the cables. Oh well, all my crap including the PVM should be here next week and I'll be ready to have fun.

>>1932032
>to see if it just looked like shit because it was going through my capture card or if it was the cables
Time to play "guess which is composite and which is s-video"

>>1932038
They're both pretty gross, but for different reasons. What's going on there?

>>1932049
An extremely cheap usb capture card is what's going on there. If you think it looks bad you should see what pulling s-video does to the PVM. I don't think I have a photo of it, but if when I get around to using it again, I'll be sure to take a photo.

The terrible part is, I don't even know if it's the capture device or the s-video cable I got from monoprice.

S-Video is the right screencap.

>>1932038

Top left is S-video. There's clear dotcrawl on the top right.

Bottom two, not so sure. The background isn't uniform enough to make it distinct, so you'd have to compare them in-motion.

>>1932067
>S-video is the right screencap

Wow. The S-video is actually LOWER quality than the composite. I think this isn't an accurate depiction of the difference between the two, given that S-video should always be better due to luma and chroma being separate, whereas in composite they're mashed together.

I'd say it's a combination of a shitty cable and a shitty capture card.

>>1932067
That's crazy. What capture card are you using? A Dazzle?

>>1932076
>Wow. The S-video is actually LOWER quality than the composite.
That's why you must play the guessing game.

And I know it's not an accurate depiction by any means.

There has to be something mis-wired, as if memory serves me right, having S-Video connected to the capture card actually fucked with the PVM's composite display as well. This was done [Console->a/v cable(s-video and composite terminated)->pvm->s-video cable(or RCA cable for composite)->capture card]

I just remembered; I bought a DVD recorder some months back that accepts S-Video in. I'll try running the S-Video cable to that and see if it has the same effect.

>>1932091
>A Dazzle?
WE MUST GO CHEAPER

>>1932101
You know what, for $7 I am not even going to complain. You can see a video game, and that's goddamn impressive. If you had told me that this shit would be possible 20 years ago for the cost of a meal, I would've called you a liar.

>>1932112
That was pretty much my reasoning. It was extremely cheap to the point where if it didn't work it wasn't that big of a deal. I was already ordering something from amazon, so I thought "why not".

I wonder if that dvd of X4 is still in the recorder. Suppose I'll find out in a moment.

>>1931475
You can still find those converters new on amazon, ebay, and the usual suspects as long as you do your research and look for specific models. They're still being made, btw. Plenty of used ones on CL too.

>>1931506
Funny, I also have exactly 10 working TVs in this house, not counting TV-capable devices like computers with TV tuner cards or monitors with inputs capable of connecting to VCRs, etc. All of mine are CRTs though, including my HDTVs. I have turned down free TV offers because I just can't handle any more. Time to do some decision making and get rid of some of them I think, since I have even more CRT PC monitors that I should also get rid of.

>>1931490
>>1931510
In the US we got plenty of different models. The one that got the most publicity, and which was released fairly late into the $40 voucher program we had, was the DTVpal line from Dish Network. It reportedly had the best remote and on-screen guide (higher quality construction and with a good layout, second nature to use for those who are used to Dishnet equipment), but it didn't have S-video output. The one I really liked and still use is the Apex DT50x line, which has excellent S-video output. Combined with a Philips-based TV tuner card, the S-video image and sound are unbeatable (but the RF output is horrible, as is the on-screen guide). They're made by someone else now.

There are high-end models that were never eligible for the voucher that have things like HD output, but I never considered those a good deal considering the atrocious digital reception my area has anyway, and my HDTVs have true 480p modes.

>>1932038
>image quality screen comparison
>jpeg

>>1932217
S-video output would disqualify a tuner from the voucher program.

Oh mah gah, soooo close... I wish I could just drive there to get it!

>>1932217
I'd be fine with composite, since that's the best the GX will take.

>>1932229
They're both terrible and captured from a horribly compressed avi. The point is still made perfectly fine.

After running around like an idiot trying to find the s-video cable, and then being confused why I was getting complete dog shit quality before the cable was even in only to realize that I was attempting to get s-video from a SNESmini, I got it connected together.

I can confirm that it isn't the S-Video cable that was a causing the problem.
"S-Composite" on PVM | Composite from DVD recorder on the HS420 in Interlace mode | Progressive mode | Interference visible on the HS420 that isn't on the PVM.
I can also state that I should probably look into buying a pair of those innovation s-video cables now, as made apparent by the last photo.

Either the capture card is sending some feedback down the cable, or it doesn't like what seems to be double composite s-video.

>>1932234
Nope, it 100% didn't. I picked up my DT502s with the voucher. Component and HDMI (or any HD output at all) is what was DQd.

>>1932247
Huh. Looked it up and that's right.
http://www.ntia.doc.gov/legacy/frnotices/2007/DTVFinalRule_2e.htm

Wonder why I only saw composite/RF.

>>1932261
Yeah, there were only a tiny handful of models with S-video. The Apexes were the only ones that were easily found at most stores in those big stacks of blue boxes.

The popular models at the time were the RCA and DTVpal since they were so easy to use.

>>1932246
>"S-Composite" on PVM | Composite from DVD recorder on the HS420 in Interlace mode | Progressive mode | Interference visible on the HS420 that isn't on the PVM.
Sorry, I don't follow. With all respect, I think verbs would help me visualize what you're saying here.

Did you have S-video and composite from the same console connected to the same or different devices at the same time or not? If so, what happens when you disconnect one display or intermediate device?

>>1932246
>Either the capture card is sending some feedback down the cable
My guess is this, you might have a case of ringing.

>>1932246
>decided to finalize the dvd so I can check the quality of ~1:00 of MMX4
>load it up in MPC-HC
>resolution reports as 352x240 (60hz 4:3)
Considering I had it recording in EP(6 hour) mode, the quality isn't half bad. The fact that it's actually in 240p is really surprising though.

>>1932335
I'm sorry, the "|" were supposed to differentiate between the various images. The first being what I'm forced to believe is double composite S-Video(composite on both lines), the second being the recorders out put with the HS420 set to interlace in its video settings, third being the same except set to progressive. The last I think is worded well enough.

Everything is branching out from the PVM. SNES MultiA/V goes to the PVM via both S-Video and Composite. S-Video is fed from the PVM to the Recorder which in turn records it to disc as well as sends it to the 27HS420 over composite video.

I'm trying to put together some webms of the video(MMX4 composite and X1 "S-Video"), but they keep coming out as either too large or shit quality.

>>1932387
So you really do have S-video and composite connected at the same time then.

What happens when you unplug composite? And why do you have that connected at all when S-video is connected anyway?

>>1932395
Having composite connected to the PVM at the same time as S-Video doesn't affect picture quality at all. The main reason I leave it connected is for taking comparison shots and to keep it from hanging down and making the rat's nest of wires back there any worse than it already is.

"S-Video" from SNES

>>1932421
Is there a reason you're daisy-chaining everything like that instead of using a nice analog distribution amp to blast the same signal wherever you need it?

>>1932430
Because I haven't had any type of income in the past 3 months, and even when I did can't afford much.

daisy-chaining is cheaper than getting a distribution amp.

Than and I haven't really had anything being fed from the PVM to really justify it. If and when I decide to do some actual recordings, then I'd have more of a reason.


Composite(I believe) from the PS2

>>1932436
OK, just wondering what you'd tried so far to fix your ringing problem. A good source cable, a dist amp, and zero other intermediate devices will normally eliminate any such problem, but it sounds like you have a plan of your own. gl

>>1932436
My typing and sentence structure keeps getting worse and worse.

I need sleep.

>>1932450
Like I said, I'm pretty sure it's the capture card that's the problem.

>>1932476
If you have a desktop and can scrape together $15, go get a SAA714 based card and see if you can donate that Easycap to Goodwill without them spitting in your face for wasting their time.

>>1932530
Could you suggest any card in particular? A short search gives data sheet results, but little else.

>>1932538
Just Chinese whitebox versions like mine. I made a typo on the model # of the chipset, it's actually saa7134.

I use mine for recording from S-video and frankly it's awesome. The $15 I quoted before is what I paid new back in 2010 or so.

>>1932575
>>1932538
When I get around to buying a new computer I'll probably pick up an Elgato capture device that does component and test it out, unless someone knows of a better capture device that does either RGB or component.

the german guy replied, the shipping costs 33 bucks for the 20 inch pvm

looks like i got a deal. 90 euro is not too bad considering that the picture looks decent

>>1931418
hell yeah steve pool

>>1931418
It's not useless for old consoles, that's how I had my NES hooked up in late 80's and early 90's. I also used RF modulator in the very beginning with my Amiga 500, before getting a real monitor. It was fine for playing games. Heck, I even made some stuff in Deluxe Paint that way (of course ran my Workbench screen in low-res mode so things would be readable...)

>>1932609
It's more than what I would pay but I'm cheap (I got all 3 my PVMs for half that, total). It IS comparable to what other people in the US pay for them. I think it's around what KyaDash paid for his 20.

>>1932717
i really don't have any chances of getting anything better at a comparable price. I don't live in the US where people just give these things away for free in decent conditions, this place is horrible

plus germans are cool in my book, they made unteralterbach.

on that note, here's a little greentext story for ya

>find 20 inch pvm on an craigslist-like website
>150 euro, but it's been used for only a year (allegedly)
>send email, i'll haggle it out or something
>yo how much for the pvm, shipped?
>"300 EURO TOTAL"
>what the fuck
>check courier prices and calculate costs using manual specs, amounts to 15 bucks w/ insurance
>ask him if it's cool if i have the courier pick up the monitor from him, i'll pay for it.
>just drop the monitor price a little will ya
>"I WON'T DROP THE PRICE"
>mind you, every email has been a 1-liner in all caps
>this looks kind of fishy, but oh well.
>whatever, i'll pick up the monitor, it's more expensive everywhere else and i can't find anything comparable after days of search
>SO YOU WANT A 20 INCH SONY, IS COMPOSITE INPUT OKAY
>what the literal FUCK is he talking about
>"i need RGB/component, the monitor you advertised was a pvm, right?"
>YOU CAN'T HAVE A PVM FOR 150 EURO
>god fucking dammit
>"i asked for a pvm, which by default has RGB/component. I want that. What are you trying to sell me?"
>he replies, i shit you not
>DO YOU REALLY NEED RGB!?

I'm not going to bother with italian sellers on private listings anymore, fuck that shit.

>>1932101
>pic
My STK1160 looks similar to that.
It uses a chinese clone of the SAA7113, which does a decent job. But the drivers are terrible and set some settings to the worst level, i hacked it to gain access to these.

Pic related is with the original settings.

>his was done [Console->a/v cable(s-video and composite terminated)->pvm->s-video cable(or RCA cable for composite)->capture card]
Did you used good and shielded cables?

>WE MUST GO CHEAPER
I have a Empia 28285 along with a homemade RGB->YUV transcoder.
I posted some shots in the Repair/Mod General thread:
>>1878950
>>1881008
These above are before i modded my SNES with an THS7314, and after a lot of tinkering with this. I was able to get this:
>>1917718
>>1917735
And i made some screenshots of my modded and portable Sufamiclone which outputs 1chip like quality:
>>1917730
>>1917754

>>1933089
why on earth would you play bubsy

>>1933278
Because Ulililia plays it.

>>1933292
>Ulililia
oh my god i had forgotten about him

>>1932575
>saa7134
Yeah, that brings up some better results.

>>1933089
Yeah, it's actually all those that got me into think about the capture device again.

>Did you used good and shielded cables?
The multi-a/v cable is a multi system cable. I've never had any quality problems with it before. The s-video cable isn't terribly thick, but seems well built enough.

It looks like mine may be a stk1160 as well. Any suggestions you can give me that might be able to increase video quality or otherwise?

>OBS can actually read it and pull the video on its own now
Nice

>>1933278
Because i like him way more than Sonic, i also played the Win95 version back then.

>>1933310
>It looks like mine may be a stk1160 as well
Open it, you should find 2 chips labeled as STK1160 and SC8113 (the clone of SAA7113).
Or look somewhere in the device manager, STK1160 identifies itself as Vid_05e1 and Pid_0408.

>Any suggestions you can give me that might be able to increase video quality or otherwise?
If you aren't using 32bit XP then i can't help you with my modified driver files.
But there isn't that much improvement (pic related), enabling the unused Anti aliasing filter might remove jailbars.

>>1933337
>Because i like him way more than Sonic

>>1933337
>Vid_05e1 and Pid_0408
Nope, looks like it's a different version.
VID_046D and PID_C52E

And it seems that OBS doesn't want to use s-video input from the Dreamcast right now, only composite. Surprisingly little input delay though.

>>1933310
>The multi-a/v cable is a multi system cable. I've never had any quality problems with it before.
Can you really guarantee that it isn't a contributor to a possible ringing problem though? They have to be terminated somehow for them not to be. Do you have to flip a switch on some inline blob to select between all the connected systems or is there an active switching chip inside? If not, all those lines are live all the time and the signal is reflecting off of every unterminated connector, which can produce ringing (or worsen any existing ringing problem created by connections down the line).

People recommend against universal cables all the time because of this, and people with uncomplicated connections always brush them off just because they don't notice anything. Well your target setup is more sophisticated, so you really should test with known-good cables instead of an assumed-good cable. If it doesn't make a difference, at least you've done the testing and can sell anything you don't need.

>>1933889
The main reason I haven't went about replacing the multi cable is that it's been relegated to n64 duty until I manage to get it modded, and when in solitary use with the PVM, it doesn't cause any negative effects quality wise.

Once I get a more stable and expendable income, I plan to move to better solutions(and for more than just video games).

One reason why I think that it isn't the cable is because the DVD recorder doesn't seem to cause any such problems.

>>1931364
Looks like a 90s "S" model. Should have S video, probably won't have component, and isn't worth much more than 20$.

>>1929026
Also note that the two circular bits on the back of the transformer are the 'picture' and focus adjustments. Not the best location if you are squeamish about electricity.

>>1934429
>probably won't have component
try definitely

>>1929512
Id try out different resolutions just to be sure it's not the graphics card.

Hey /vr/

>>1934649
It's not retro but fuck if it isn't cool to see at sub 240 resolutions

>>1934657
Third times the charm,
ikegami tm14-17r

>>1934657
>sub 240

>>1934668
320x204
I can't remember if it actually output at that or if I just scaled it from 240p, either way it's fucked up line spacing did some interesting things with the UI

>>1934678
Oh, you mean 320x200? I thought worse, technically 320x200 is still in 240p territory with different aspect. Then again I'm not sure I know about terminology.

>>1934657
>It's not retro but fuck if it isn't cool to see at sub 240 resolutions
>Megaman X Corrupted will supposedly have a 240p setting
How is Shovel Knight anyway?

>>1934687
super great

>>1934678
>320x204
Why?

>>1934709
Shovel knight only runs at 16:9 resolutions

Or did you mean why so low? Because I wanted to see what it would look like at 240p

>>1934718
So why not proper widescreen 240p, i.e. approximately 426x240 if you're assuming square pixels?

>>1932691
Back when I was a kid, I liked RF more than composite because I could daisy chain 5 consoles to just one input on the TV.
>mfw there was a time I had an NES, SNES, N64, PSX, and GameCube all connected that way to some cheap 27" CRT

>>1934687
I've been playing the PC version, and as far as I'm concerned it, Xenonauts, and Wasteland 2 are my contenders for GOTY for 2014.

>>1934683
320x200 still displayed at 4:3.

>>1934760
Just because 13h wasn't really 320x200.

>>1934747
>>NES, SNES, N64, PSX, and GameCube all connected that way to some cheap 27" CRT
>mfw having an NES, SNES, N64, and Genesis chained together to a ~13'' CRT that only accepted twin-lead
I suppose I have finding the PS1 my brother bought but couldn't figure out how to connect up to thank for introducing me to the existence of composite cables.


Was doing a bit more testing with the DVD recorder earlier, this time with the Dreamcast over S-Video. Seems as though it's capturing 480i sources at 352x240 as well. Possibly from recording in EP mode, which I'm not sure how to get it out of if doing so is even possible.

Greetings from /k/. I heard you like CRTs and thought you could tell me if this is any good.
1/2

>>1934791
2/2

Here's a little comparison picture i took of two of my CRT TVs.

the left is a Sharp CRT with component input, and the right is a sony trinitron xbr with composite input ( it also has s-video but i don't have a cable). both via wii emulation at 240p.

Thought you guys would get a kick out of it.

>>1934791
>>1934793
Is there a more exact model number than "Viewsonic 17"? Looks like a pretty plain PC CRT monitor. Interesting that it has a 5BNC input, but I don't think it would work with 15khz modes (SDTV consoles, etc).

>>1934793
>>1934791
Looks like an ok VGA monitor. Interesting that it has BNC connectors.

>>1934806
Model number is 1782-2 according to the second picture

>>1934808
>>1934791
Seems to be 30 - 82 H, 50 - 160 V. So, you could use it for high-framerate PC gaming. It will do 1024x768 @ 100hz.

>>1934584
Thanks for the tip, although I fixed it already, sort of. While messing with the modelines I noticed that 50p modes filled the screen fine so I thought it must be because of some PAL shit. I adjusted the vertical size pot on the tv to get the 60p modes to fill the screen fine, but now the 50p modes get cropped. Oh well.

>>1934806
>>1934808
>>1934835
Thanks for the information. So it's got to be something like a Sony PVM to be worth anything? Those look pretty neat anyway.

>>1934862
>So it's got to be something like a Sony PVM to be worth anything?
Broadcast monitors are much rarer than computer monitors. Most /vr/ consoles output 15KHz video signals (i.e., television) so you need a TV monitor for them.

>>1934862
If anything, it would be awesome for emulation if you want to go that route.

Are 50hz CRT tv's useless for "retro gaming"?
I had found a nice old sony television with a scart input from europe, but its 50hz only.
Would this make is a less then desirable decision?
I'm only interested in a few pal n64 titles, the rest I am wanting to play are ntsc-j

>>1934978

What TV is this?

>>1934996
1983 trinitron.

Posted in another fred earlier.

Got these suckers, 20N5A modded for RGB, 20L2. $0.99 and $0 respectively.

>>1934978
I'd only pick up a 50 Hz compatible display if I ever intended to get PAL consoles, and I don't.

You also should be careful about power requirements for that TV. To use 230V devices in the US, you'd need a step-up converter.

>>1934978
I've got a Trinitron, that says its 50Hz too,
but there is no problem when I switch my SNES to 60 Hz mode.

>>1934978
50hz CRTs are usually more desirable for retro gaming. In europe there are 100hz CRTs that will give poor results for retro gaming. If you read the documentation provided with most retro consoles, they generally advise against using 100hz CRTs.

>>1935047
When you say switch snes to 60hz, are you talking about playing ntsc games?
So I would be okay using a sd2snes to play ntsc/j roms for example?

I just wanted to make sure before getting the set

>>1935016
how many more threads will you post this image in?

>enjoying PAL garbage

>>1935067
Not in the US or Japan. We use 60 Hz and the games designed for our regions don't have slowdown.

>>1935112
rofl.
Post in 2 threads.
Autism maxxed out buddy?
They're SFC :)

>>1935112
PAL 16-bit consoles can be modded to output 60Hz signals. My mega drive is region free and can output both 50 and 60 Hz

plus, no need for adapters when playing SFC games

>>1935170
No need to explain it to someone who clearly just wants to have a problem for the sake of having one.

The console pictured is indeed modded for 50/60.
However you still need to defeat the CIC chip to play SFC games.

>>1935178
oh, i thought it wasn't necessary. Damn region lock.

Anyways, nice find on those monitors. I wish i could have the luck to get PVMs for free, i had to pay a premium for mine

>>1935082
I play ntsc games on my modded pal console through my everdrive.
I have a switch on it, that changes its mode from 50 to 60 Hz.
I cant say if it works on every Trinitron model.
I have a sony trinitron kv 29x5d.

>>1935208

I found this one here:
http://pastebin.com/nMcq3564

Would this be the exact same model as yours with 2 scart inputs? (It looks like a nice set actually, how much did you pay?)
And thanks for the information

>>1935112
>enjoying wrong NTSC colors

>>1931386
Almost. It's a non-plus model. It doesn't do 15khz

That's why I have a 37" megaview to go with it.

>>1935341
Nobody actually means NTSC when we say "NTSC", we mean 240p60. Obviously you're supposed to use RGB.

>>1935375
>obvious damage control
>Nobody actually means NTSC when we say "NTSC"
>we mean 240p60
Ha, i knew it would be funny to add NTSC443 support in my PAL SNES.
I always laugh when i adjust the hue on a NTSC signal.
>Obviously you're supposed to use RGB.
Like this?

This isn't directly related to CRTs, but I'm not sure where else to ask.

I have an HDTV that only has SVGA inputs, while all of my older consoles use RGB. Are there any converters that would allow me to play my older consoles on my HDTV?

I have a CRT, but no room in my room to set it up.

>>1935510
Never mind, I am a retard. For some reason green = yellow for SVGA.

>>1935250
Yes thats the same model.
I payed 30 bucks, so a bit more than you,
but its worth it.

>>1929453
Very well. The dot pitch isn't good enough for anything over 800x600 but is overkill for 240p and 480p. Can't wait to get my sync separator, transcoder, and VGA boxes.

Scan lines at normal viewing distance are just about perfect. Not too pronounced but clean. Some bloom. The composite output of SNES on this monitor is unusually sharp. Only a little ringing on high contrast areas and the usual dot crawl, all of which should disappear on the RGB input.

>>1935361
>fluorescent lighting

Looks pretty cozy otherwise.

>>1932239
So this is fun.
>follow the trail of packing peanuts up to my door

>>1936042
The first think I think is how small that box is considering that my 14M4U came in a box about the same size.

It's a heavy damn thing too.

>>1936045
Open the box up, and remove the padded drop cloth that was draped on top. Got that sinking feeling.

>>1936050
It must've taken a really hard hit to the front to have broken the rail on the left, and to have punched in the control knobs.

>>1936058
Rear is also caved in, metal chassis is dented, and half of those little plastic rivets that hold the back in place are missing. Oh yeah, nice hole too.

>>1935341
I've never had the game look like that.
Ever.

>>1936065
So, maybe take it apart and find all the missing bits of plastic and glue it back together, it'll be fine as long as it works, right?

Hmm. Not so convinced it works very well either.

>>1936073
From a glance, everything inside looks fine, but once you scrutinize a bit and find...

DAT C BOARD. Completely f'kd. Ugh. I'm beginning to think PVMs and I just aren't meant to be.

And there's your daily dose of schadenfreude.

>>1936073
I'll tells ya.
Friend collects games (he'll buy everything and anything).
Seen this shit happen to 2 SHARP nintendo TVs he had shipped overseas.
No matter what you tell these stupid cunts on ebay they'll never pack this stuff properly.
He got refunds for both of them, I managed to fix one, but the case is still cracked.

>>1936078
That's terrible; I'm sorry for your loss. I hope you aren't too much dollars in the hole with this.

>>1936078
As long as the CRT itself isn't fucked any competent tech could fix that in 30 mins.

>>1936082
He should be able to make a paypal claim if he bought it off ebay.
Seen this shit too many times and it has scared me away from getting any crt shipped.

>>1936094
Yeah, I'm in the process of addressing this on eBay, actually.

Here's some more gore for y'all. Interesting pattern.

>>1936104
Good stuff my friend. Best of luck with the outcome.

>>1936050
>>1936058
>>1936073
The tube itself looks undamaged to me.

>>1936078
The heater (H1, H2), blue cathode (KB), ground and certain grid voltages are still connected, and others are cut. This explains why you only see blue with retrace lines.
Scarping away the solder mask and reconnect cut connections should fix that.

>>1936113
Thanks, I appreciate it.
>>1936115
Alright, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks fixing the broken connections is a reasonable idea. And yes, aside from some very light burn in (looks like from a safe zone template), the tube is fine.

Still wondering if I should just try to fix it, or fight about it on eBay. Problem is, I don't know what kind of resolution I'll get if I try that road.

>>1936135
I would make a claim. Get on the phone and talk to ebay/paypal to speed up the process.

With some luck you will not be required to send the seller his/her stuff back.

>>1936078
Damn, dude. I have a pit in my stomach waiting for my 14L2 now. I really hope she survives the journey. The guy seemed nice enough and is paying a lot to ship the thing, so I have high hopes.

Hope they don't get dashed. God that is so sad, man. I'm sorry.

>>1936153
My hope is that the shipment was insured. The packing job wasn't all that great, but UPS beat the hell out of it also.

>>1936158
Well, my fingers are crossed that it arrives safely. I've had really bad luck with having them shipped.
Pic related, my 14M4U that may or may not have been damaged during shipping. I've had bad luck with these.

>>1936153
My hope is that the shipment was insured. The packing job wasn't all that great, but UPS beat the hell out of it also.

>>1936158
Well, my fingers are crossed that it arrives safely. I've had really bad luck with having them shipped.
Pic related, my other PVM, a 14M4U that may or may not have been damaged during shipping.

>>1936348
Arrived nearly falling out the bottom of a box of packing peanuts. I think the big rack mount it was attached to saved it.

>>1936115

Dude, you clearly know your shit.

Question: how can one connect an external RGB signal directly to the C-board on a sony trinitron? Where does it need to be spliced in, and what kind of amplification will the signal need?

>>1922938
MY DICK LOOKS BETTER THAN A CRT

>>1936389
does it have scanlines tho? What resolution ?

>>1922938
>mfw SC5 uses prerendered backgrounds so it looks like ass on anything other than a CRT and is impossible to port to other systems because of that

>>1936406
IT HAS MORE SCANLINES THAN YOU KNOW TO SUCK

>>1936383
Well.
First thing would be to observe the RGB waveforms on the input of the C-board. Compare these to the RGB signal source that your console or whatever gives out.
Is there gain? Level shift? Some kind of processing?

The other half of it is sync. Will the deflection still be synced when something else is driving the RGB guns? Will the IK (beam cathode balance feedback circuit) have an issue?

I'd love to try this myself. Any more experienced people here?

>>1936472

I'd need an O-scope for that, correct?

Luckily I've got the waveforms in the service manual, they're printed there. However, wouldn't they only be important if I was trying to get the signal to comply to a standard, say SECAM, PAL or NTSC?

My intention is to effectively add a SCART connection to this television so I can use it as an arcade monitor. It only has S-video and composite currently, but the picture quality is fantastic; I'd like to drive it with correct resolutions and refresh rates via GroovyMAME/CRT_Emudriver.

I looked into getting a "universal" chassis for it, but of course sony have to use a non-standard pin layout on the neck and a 3-in-one electron gun, don't they.

>>1936498

O-scope would be definitely recommended. Some understanding of amplifier circuits and signal conditioning circuits (contrast, brightness) wouldn't go astray.

>I looked into getting a "universal" chassis for it, but of course sony have to use a non-standard pin layout on the neck and a 3-in-one electron gun, don't they.

That's trinitron for you! Shame ;(

Once the signal is RGB there is no pal/secam/ntsc. All you have is 525/60 or 625/50.

>>1936507
>Some understanding of amplifier circuits and signal conditioning circuits (contrast, brightness) wouldn't go astray.

Oh yeah, that's simple. There's tons of IC solutions for that kind of stuff ranging from the basic to the hopelessly complex, so sorting that out won't be a problem.

>That's trinitron for you! Shame ;(

It's only a shame so far as compatibility with aftermarket products goes. Otherwise it's fantastic - picture quality is great on Trinitron tubes, so great that other companies paid Sony so they could replicate the idea.

>Once the signal is RGB there is no pal/secam/ntsc. All you have is 525/60 or 625/50.

Most of the signals coming out of the video card will be a range of vertical and horizontal sync rates between two values - usually about 15.4 to 16.2 for horizontal and 55 to 64 for vertical. I know TVs can display those no problem because I've got a little Thompson set with SCART-in being driven by a VGA->SCART adapter and a CRT_Emudriver modded card - it looks absolutely fantastic.

>>1936590

Oh I forgot to mention all the resolutions will be somewhere around 240p - some go as high as 256p but not many.

>>1934649
>ePSXe
>on a CRT

>>1936714
because reasons
and cheats

>>1936717

I hope you're at least using gpuBladeSoft for graphics

>>1936717
and
http://youtu.be/0RCEp0DfTV4?t=1m42s

I pulled out my Commodore 1702 monitor for some retro games, but after using it a bit I notice some distortion. It sometimes look like the v-sync is not holding, or some distortion in the middle. Rarely it blacks out a bit. Hitting it temporarily fixes the problem. I read a while ago that this was a common problem with CRT monitors and tube televisions, something with the solder joint coming loose as it heats up.

Does anyone know how to go about fixing the problem or know what exactly the problem is?

shitty pic related

Anyone here want a free arcade monitor? I was thinking of picking it up but I don't really need it. If its a trisync you are in luck.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/zip/4666590625.html

Would anybody have any information or have seen (in person) a trinitron KV-29XBR with the glass panel in the front?

>>1936507
Also I heard some tv manufactures still had trouble with different frequencies using RGB?

Just picked up a set at Goodwill for a dollar only to find that it has green retrace lines.

Oh, well. It's off to craigslist for me, so you might all see me in the news stuffed into a refrigerator in pieces.

>>1936754
You'll need to check the solder joints on the PCB. You can usually see the ones that have begun to crystallize. Look for small cracks in the joints. Re solder any suspect joints.

You can also try some spraying some freezing spray on the board with the TV on. (be careful.) when you spray the right area you'll see the picture change.

in da GREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN

>>1936923
Thanks, I can do that. I'll look up a guide for safely opening up a CRT. I have not heard about freezing spray.

Is it something like this?
http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product/TECHSPRAY-1915-16SQ-/20-4275

>>1936951
neo turf masters is an amazing game

>>1936383
>how can one connect an external RGB signal directly to the C-board on a sony trinitron
Study the schematics.
On my KV-M1400D has the TDA3505, it takes RGB or component (with inverted color signals) and a bunch of other control signals. And it outputs amplified RGB to the nackboard and this gets amplified further.
My KV-C2521D has the TDA4580 which is very similar to the TDA3505, but it has 2 RGB inputs where the 2nd is used for Teletext and the 1st gets converted component internally for saturation control and then back to RGB.

>>1936951
>dat ball
I never understood when that happened

>>1936951
AES with line doubler

Just got scart cables for Saturn & Dreamcast for my PVM 2530.

Thank you based god.

Does anyone know if Scart cables or downrezzing component gives best picture for Original Xbox on a PVM or similar monitor?