/vr/ - Retro Games

>>1881580

I'm thinking of selling my framemeister and pooling that cash towards a pvm, worth it? I made a thread asking about it earlier but ignore it, didn't see this thread here.

complete noob to CRTs and all this shit in general.

I just realized how much better-looking S-Video is than composite cables. Do CRTs generally come equipped with S-Video capability? I haven't owned a CRT TV for over a decade probably.

>>1881602
If you just want to use consoles w svid then there a assloads of cctv monitors and older pvms and shit that don't have rgb but do have svideo. Some new in box I've seen on ebay. And yeah and consumer set after about 2000 will have svid.

>>1881590
You don't have to pool that much cash, unless you are in Liberia or something.

Buy old telly and become the ultimate hipster

Just set up my first crt, hope /vr/ approves.

>>1881703
Get street fighter 3 and before the capcom logo appears hold down L and start and it will make the game play in 240p instead of 480i. Looks badass like the arcade, way sharper.

>>1881602

Excuse me as I ramble...

Pre 80's TVs are generally RF only. Meaning your game picture was only as good as the built in tuner of the TV. Lots of noise and interference from anything electrical in close proximity to your pong or Atari 2600 game. Most TV's of this gen are also made of heavy wood or particle board With a wood veneer.

The 80's saw an explosion of VCR's and looked like ass on a TV with a flaky tuner, so composite input was born! Easily identified by a yellow RCA input, this input would send the picture from your VCR (and later, Nintendo/Sega) to the your TV tube. This would become the standard for many years to come. TV of this era are known by the heavy, funky and often brightly colored plastic that had to be strong enough to hold a picture tube.

Mid 90's and up should have at least 1 S-Video input. The reason that it looks better is because the inputs are separated: Image color (Chrominance) image brightness/intensity (Luminance) on separate lines directly connected to the tv's circuity. Filtering (often user enabled) cut ghosting and crawling. Your PSX, N64 and Xbox benefited immensely because of this break through. This is also the Gen that brought us that 'Cheaply made as Possible' black plastic vacuum form case that is shaped to hug the CRT tube. No room on top of that TV for that new DVD Player or Game PS2/Dreamcast... Gotta buy shelves!

>>1881590
PVMs aren't that expensive. Get the PVM and if your Framemeister is gather dust after six months or so then sell it if you need the cash. I sold my Framemeister but now I regret it because it's hard to gather a bunch of friends around a PVM to play video games.

>>1881590

I just don't see the point in owning the FR anymore, since it has those screen blackouts. I started the Silent hill series and SH1 is literally... well... it's playable but it's really fucking annoying having to frequently check the map or open the inventory but wait 5-6 seconds everytime for the resolution to change.

I'm the type of guy to use a mid-2000's CRT, the kind they made right before they stopped manufacturing CRT's.

>>1881934
This is super helpful, thank you.

When will you guys get around to making a pastebin?

>>1881987
On the topic of that, I've actually been thinking about that for the past week or two. My problem is I'm not a terribly good writer and when I do get about writing, it tends to be responsive rather than addressive.

What are some points that should be brought up?

>>1882001
>Logical Increments for buying CRTs.
>Basic Definitions(like >>1881934)
>Limitations each console has
>Console modding for extending those limitations
>Regional difference details(America, Europe, Japan, South America, etc)
>Reviews regarding upscalers/converters/etc

>>1882001
Somebody made one a while ago but it never caught on. It was very well put together. Took me forever to find it again.

http://pastebin.com/B1vVG9VW

>>1882014
I might be able to put something together based on that.
No promises of it being well written though.

>>1882018
From the looks of it, it's >>1881934 in text form.

>>1882018
That's just the same as >>1881934

>>1882027
>>1882028
Well I'm fucking dumb then.

I bought a SCART cable for my Genesis 2 and a SCART-BNC adapter for Sony PVMs. I have a GVM-2020, and am not getting any picture other than a few white lines (pic related). I thought the GVM models didn't need a sync stripper, like the PVMs. Am I mistaken? There's a switch on the back to switch between csync and sync-on-green, but neither produces a picture.

Do I need a sync stripper, or did I get a defective cable? Is there anything else I can do to isolate the problem?

>>1882434
Is there switch on the front for EXT Sync? If so is it on? Other than that I don't know.

>>1882434
Actually I just looked and apparently you might need to wire up a connector to the DB9 connector for some reason.

>>1881987
>>1882001

I've already got one half made, although it's still far from done. Still researching adjustments.

http://pastebin.com/qudM0c3e

And I'm always open for input on stuff to change.

>>1881934
>>1882014
Fuck the whole "FV300 is best" stuff. Adjustment > model. It's a good set, but most other FV models are going to be within spitting distance if they are similarly adjusted. The difference between S/FS/FV models is nothing compared to any good consumer set and PVM/BVM.

And logical increments for CRTs will never work because of the market. It's more an issue of what you can find more than what you are paying. I mean, it'd basically be consumer low end shadow mask, consumer high end aperture grill, and studio sets.

>>1882018
I might steal the cables section from here.

>>1882514
I also never use the correct trip. Better stick to namefagging.

>>1882506
Really?
It has BNCs on the RGB B input.You got a link?

>>1882506
>>1882554
Nevermind, I checked the SCART cable with a multimeter and it looks like it's wired up as per this diagram - with composite video from pin 4 going to the sync lead on my BNC adapter. Pin 5 outputs raw sync, but of course there's no wire for that on the SCART end so I'm going to have to figure out how to open and rewire the mini-DIN or try to return it and buy a different cable.

ok guys, help me out. I've spent at least 40 hours the last 5 days researching CRT's and I still feel somewhat clueless, after looking at many, many sets, I'm considering the set in my pic. it's a KV-27S46 27". I'd be using it just for my PS2 and my soft modded wii, for my retro gaming.


any help, thoughts, or opinions on this will be greatly appreciated. tia

>>1882630
KV-27S46 has decent specs. 3 composite inputs, 1 s-video. Supports picture-in-picture. Not terribly old, these were from the late '90s.

Should be fine for PS2 and Wii emulation. I've got a similar KV-27TS36, PS2 games look great through s-video on it. You'll definitely want to get s-video cables for your PS2 and Wii to make the most of its potential.

>>1882634
sounds good, thanks alot.

Bought this big boy for 15 Euro. its got RGB and S-video. Good deal? (not my pic btw)

>>1882848
forgot pic

>>1881703
Cute, I approve.

>>1882848

Nice set, do you have pics of it running?

>>1882514
>Fuck the whole "FV300 is best" stuff.

It's an easy recommendation to make in a "CRTs for dummies" guide. If you had to tell a newbie just one model number to get, the safest bet would be those models. They have all the inputs you need, are fairly new for SD CRTs, and were high quality. Of course other TVs will look just as good if you put some time into them, but you can't expect everybody to be comfortable with calibration.

>>1881580
For us in the UK, is a scart connection on a CRT the thing to look for to make retro games look the best?

>>1882891

Yes, it means that it accept RGB most of the time, that's why you don't buy chinese shit.

>>1881714
Cool, I'll give it a shot.

>>1882875
But it can be incredibly difficult to find a specific model, and people that do remotely know what it is charge way too much for it. Some chucklefuck in my town wanted 100$ for his, which is about 80$ too much.

And on top of that you are just as likely to find one that is completely fucked up adjustment wise as you are any other FV or FS set, and all FS/FV models have component and S video inputs, although the 310 and a few other models have extra sets if you don't wanna use a splitter box or stuff like that. The main advantage of the FV300/310 over other models is the comb filter, which you shouldn't be using anyway.

Basically there are no real advantages for buying a FV300/310 over any other FS/FV trinitron. You are better off trying to find a model that is in good condition then looking for a specific model.

>>1882613
>Pin 5 outputs raw sync

Did you actually check the output? Like by wiring it to a composite cable just for the sake of it.

So I saw some of the great capabilities of broadcast reference monitors, like the Sony PVM. They seem to be pretty pricey online. Some people were saying they got some from TV stations that have them just piling up.

What's the protocol on getting one from a place like that?

>>1881703
My OCDP disapproves of Miku's feet not resting on anything

>>1884149
ask nicely

>>1884149
woah man whats up with those shitty blacks?

>>1884913

The colors seems off too. I think the fact that he's photographing in broad light affect the picture though.

I've recently got a Sony Trinitron PVM 1351Q off of ebay with a Nintendo Scart Cable and a Scart to BNC with RCA cables, and I've been trying to get the best quality possible.

I was wondering how to get rid of the bleeding. I found out that the contrast is a part of the bleeding though.

Here's mine. Game is Super Marisa Land.

>>1885284
I sense some repairing is inbound.

>>1885284
Well by any chance are you making the silly mistake of maxing out the contrast setting on it?

>>1885642
nope, its on minimal right now, but when its on the normal setting it bleeds colors

>>1882861
Here's one

>>1885786
And here's another (the reason it's so dark is because the screen is very reflective in light)

>>1885789
nice, I have barely met anyone who knows what star gladiator is. I found plasma sword in a shop pretty recently so I have the whole series now. I wouldn't have any idea what this game was if hayato wasn't in mvc2 and i wasn't so blatantly a starwars ripoff. 1236

took a high speed picture of the moment the ray was passing by, very interesting eh

>>1886252
and full shot

Is there a PVM without Scanlines guys?

>>1886364
Most likely not; the trinitron series all have really pronounced scanlines. Do you dislike scanlines? You might be better off with a modern display and an upscaler.

>>1886384
>recommending an expensive non-CRT option as if scanlines are the only reason people use CRTs
Sometimes I just can't tell who's trolling any more.

>>1886429
Upscalers aren't that pricey anymore. You can get a reasonable lenkeng one for the same amount of money you would have to pay for a PVM setup. But if you know any high fidelity CRTs without visible scanlines, that would be a great solution too.

>>1886364
Computer monitor + line doubler (not upscaler, although some upscalers can run in line doubler mode). This doesn't completely eliminate scanlines but makes them much less obvious.

>>1886364
Why would you do that?

>>1886469
This sounds like by far the best idea, anything else is going to be expensive and/or shitty.

But try to find a computer monitor that supports 640x480 natively.

Maybe a line quadrupler? I don't know shit about scalers.

>>1886625
>>1886384

>modern display and an upscalar

This is what I've been doing the past half year, with the framemeister. I'm ditching the framemeister because I can't even play Silent hill properly with the 5-7 second resolution changes... It's really annoying. I'd be okay getting a PVM but if there was a PVM without scanlines than that would better.

>>1886469
Does this setup create lag?

>>1886625
I mean a CRT monitor of course, this being the CRT thread and all.

>>1886721
>Does this setup create lag?
Assuming a high quality line doubler, it adds only one line worth of lag, which is imperceptible even to the most autistic CRTfag. But it's hard to find actual latency specs for this kind of hardware. I wouldn't be surprised if some of them add a frame or more.

>>1885284
Maybe the pots on the transformer? Be careful adjusting stuff inside, only touch the screwdriver to the pot you're adjusting.

>>1886364
Get an L5 PVM and put 480p games (like on xbox 360 or a pc) into it.

>>1886364
>PVM without Scanlines
No, even small hi-res models have scanlines with 15 kHz signals.

The best alternatives for retro vidya are sufficiently small 15 kHz pro monitors or arcade monitors (or even TVs) from manufacturers who used standard CRT masks (meaning non-Sony). These will not display scanlines to the same degree as the typical Trinitron/aperture grille display.

Anything involving a non-15 kHz display, line doubler, deinterlacer, scaler, etc. is an inferior compromise, unless you are intentionally seeking the artificially jaggy look as opposed to the naturally soft look.

>>1886808
>pots on the transformer
>mfw I dont't have a clue what that is

What exactly would I be adjusting?

>>1886821
I don't agree with this. I just bought an Ikegami monitor with a dot shadow mask and its sharp as hell with as much scanline intensity as my PVM. A consumer set would be good if you wanted to stay 15khz, but one that is really sharp will still show them. You could use composite I guess, and have it be all blurry.

>>1886840
Convergence I guess, I'm no tech, but I opened my PVM up and adjusted everything I could, I'm still alive and so is the PVM.

>>1886840
Pot means potentiometer, knob is a more general term. Turn knobs w a screwdriver, see what happens, don't touch anything.

>>1886851
What size is it?

>>1886867
Just opened up my PVM, but where would the potentiometer be?

So with the PVM I guess I would convert my SCART to BNC, but I'd be interested in using my cube and ps2 as well. Can PVM take component as well ?

>>1887027
Depends on the model. Most late ones can.

>>1886913
20 inch, theres another one on ebay from the same seller, he's asking 100, but took 40 on offer.

>>1887105
Well I'm talking about smaller ones on the order of 13" on up. Even tiny PVMs produce very clear scanlines, whereas others that small really shouldn't (at least not necessarily).

>>1887036

Well I suppose if Sony PVM-14N5U can't, then maybe I can just convert the component to bnc I guess?

That's the model I'll probably be picking up tomorrow for $30 if I'm not lazy.

>>1887408
It doesn't work like that. BNC is merely the connection. You'll have to convert everything except S-Video to BNC regardless of what the input is. If a PVM can't accept component then it can't accept component. Period.

Hell, that model you mentioned only works with composite and S-video, anyway.

>>1887408
>PVM-14N5U
That's Composite and S-Video only, no RGB or Component.

>convert the component to bnc
Component is a video signal, BNC is an adapter type. There is no "converting".

>>1887420
>>1887418

Ahh geez, well you can already deduce that I'm clueless Anons.

What models should I hunt for? I think at least a 20 inch would be enough space to fit in my room.

>>1887426

Also, I guess that explains the $30 price tag heh. Definitely not buying that.

>>1886840
>>1886858
>>1886867

Yeah, that's a convergence issue and not a focus issue. Knobs on the back of the flyback transformer (little brick that has a thick wire going to the anode cap) will control focus and drive, and if you ever mess with those you should be VERY careful. Aside from the fact that you'll be sticking a screwdriver near the part of the TV that has all of the high voltage, if you adjust the drive/picture/"G2" knob too much the wrong way, you can fuck up the tube. I'd also say the entire range of adjustment was maybe 90 degrees as well.

There should be tons of manual convergence adjustment pots somewhere on it though.

>>1887420
>>1887426
>>1887429
Honestly I'd take a 20" PVM for 30$, even if it didn't have RGB. As long as the set is in good condition, it'll probably look better with svid than any consumer set would with RGB.

>>1887696
>Me not reading again
Don't think i'd pay 30$ for a 14"... but maybe 20.

Where is this again?

>>1887426
>>1887429
Recommending a single model/select models isn't very easy or smart for that matter. It's more so of a checklist of things to look for, including age, usage, condition(of the tube rather than cosmetic), and inputs. A simple google search of a model number will usually give you at least the inputs of a given model with out much work.

That said
20M2
20M4
2030(RGB only)
Are all relatively common 20'' models used for retro gaming
20L5(Multi Format - 480p/720p/1080i compatible)
Would be a real nice find just for how versatile it is.

The N5 you're looking at would still have a really nice picture over S-Video.
If you find an N6, that will do RGB at the very least(no component) but the N* models are all lower cost models, and won't be AS high of quality as other models.

here's mine

>>1887696
I looked at the flyback transformer, but I'm not sure how to adjust the focus

>>1888174
Then look at the neck board.

>download Darkstalkers roms to try out on Wii
>first 4 or so don't work
>get distracted by mega man
>finally get around to trying the other ds roms
>get one to work
>camera dies before I can take pictures of what I wanted to in the first place
Well at least the ones I got came out nice.

Need a new camera battery though; Had to fight to get it out and it's bulging quite a bit.

Also Mega Man

Recently I acquired a Sony Trinitron kv 29x5d and an SNES.
The problem is that the picture is shifted to the left, and accessing the service menu, I cant change the parameter H-Size or H-Center at all.
I am using a Scart cable, so it should be a RGB Signal.
Can anyone help me out?

>>1888458
>>1888459
What television is that? Those scanlines are just too good.

Is there a way to lay a grid over my television, like that Mega Drive homebrew, without a Mega Drive? Will that kind of thing work on a Wii?

>>1888758
There's gotta be an adjustment for it somewhere, you know service menu isn't just the regular menu right? Both sony's I've had had tons of options in the service menu.

>>1888758
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?248996-Sony-WEGA-Trinitron-CRT-TV-service-menu-Tips-Tricks-and-settings-suggestions

some of these codes might correspond to your TV

>>1888813
I imagine the Genesis emulators on Wii have Sega CD support, in which case 240p should work fine.

>>1888862
240p Suite, I mean.

>>1888758
>The problem is that the picture is shifted to the left
>I am using a Scart cable, so it should be a RGB Signal.
Yes, this is normal.
>I cant change the parameter H-Size or H-Center at all.
Keep in mind that this also changes composite (or S-Video).
So if you make RGB centered then composite will be shifted to the right.

>>1888813
SNES Test Program (U).
It features a few useful test patterns in the 'Color Test'.

I've got a Sony PVM 1953MD. Wii virtual console games output 240p and look great.

My problem is that the monitor only seems to like 480i for the wii settings. When I set it to 480p, the picture is sharp, but is misaligned like when you send a 16:9 signal into a 4:3 tv. I have the aspect ratio on the wii set to 4:3, but it only works with 480i.

Any ideas what could be going on here? I'm pretty sure that the PVM supports 480p, as most people get garbage on monitors that don't support 480p, not just misalignment.

>>1888868

Or maybe there is a way to have the emulators output 240p that I'm missing?

>>1888758
>I cant change the parameter H-Size or H-Center at all.
My KV-M1450D doesn't allow any kind of adjustment when the signal is 60hz.

>>1888840
>>1888851
>>1888867
>>1888886
Well, I kind of fixed it,
although without changing the h-center parameter.
Something I overlooked, was that the TV automatically shifts the picture to the right when in the right channel. (a channel with three dots, signaling that its for rgb)
there is still a slight shift to the left, but its bearable.
Thanks for all your tips, anyway.

>>1888868
>PVM 1953MD
Does it say multiformat on the front? If not then it doesn't support 480p

>>1888813
>Will that kind of thing work on a Wii?
It will and does.

The Wii actually has it's own version of 240p test suite now. Still haven't had a chance to test it out.


>>1888868
>>1888870
>I'm pretty sure that the PVM supports 480p, as most people get garbage on monitors that don't support 480p, not just misalignment.
It doesn't. I'm pretty sure it uses the same general chassis as the 20M2MDU. I get the same misalignment when feeding anything higher than 480i. It looks really neat with SVGA (or XGA, can't remember). It triple scans the image.

>maybe there is a way to have the emulators output 240p that I'm missing
There are, which emulators are you using?

>>1888458 >>1888459
Are both from RetroArch using the CPS2 core from Final Burn Alpha, running in 640x224p.

So is this.

>>1888773
Sony PVM-20M2MDU

Alright, so I'm a complete noob at this CRT thing and I picked one up at a garage sale a while back. My problem is that the image is slightly tilted and there seems to be quite a bit of overscan. Is there anything I can do about this or am I SOL?

>>1889343
>Sony PVM-20M2MDU
>look online
>$100-$300
>no shipping options
>cali-fucking-fornia
Oh well. Guess I'm stuck with composite and mono sound on my Quasar.

>>1889363
>cali-fucking-fornia
Are you saying you're in California? You're liable to find good deals on PVMs and the like more so there than just about anywhere else in the country, the NYC area withstanding.

>$100-$300
I lucked out and got mine for $50+40 to ship. Last $90 I had to my name at the time, and haven't regretted the choice even once.

>>1889357
If it is a later model, it could have a service menu that you could get into to adjust settings and the like. Older and lower end sets would need to be opened up and fiddled around with physically to adjust. Both choices risk messing up the picture if you don't know what you're doing and the later could actually kill you if you're not careful.

>>1889381
Which one of these should i get for old vidya
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-monitors/city-of-toronto/17-samsung-syncmaster-753df-monitor/1009814747?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-monitors/oshawa-durham-region/viewsonic-e773-crt-monitor/1010924507?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-monitors/city-of-toronto/nec-accusync-95f-crt-19-monitor/585695016?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-monitors/markham-york-region/17-nec-multisync-5fgp-crt-monitor/604770008?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true

>>1889394
If your plans are for consoles, none of them.

Judging by the Quake picture however, any of them should work relatively well for PC games.
The Samsung and Viewsonic look like solid models, and the NEC 5FGp seems pretty good too.

A very short search seems to suggest the 95F has some issues with focus and contrast, so you may want to avoid that one.

Remember, the condition of the set can have a bigger impact on the final outcome quality wise than what model it is. Nothing is going to save that top of the line monitor if it's been ridden long and hard with burn in and a dim image.

>>1889421
actually i wanted them for consoles, yeah after doing a bit of more searching finding old pvms for under 50 dollars is very difficult in toronto
im not sure what kind of trinitron to get

>>1889363
>cali-fucking-fornia
I get free ones here, m80.

>>1889381
Nah, I'm in Southeast Pennsylvania. Ain't nothing out here.

>>1889490
I'm in Southwest PA myself. I see some pop up over there from time to time. I'm not capable of driving across the state to grab them though.

>>1881714
is that also possible on other Capcom games?

>>1889343
>
FCE Ultra GX for NES, Snes9x GX for SNES, and Genesis Plus for Genesis, which appears to be outputting 240p.

OH MY GUAAAAARD I'M SO JELLY OF ALL YOU CRTFAGSSSS

sorry for the autism

>>1889530
I can confirm all three of those will do 240p. >>1889381 is running in Genesis Plus GX.

Go to 'Game Settings' then 'Video'

Set rendering to Original. Enjoy your 240p.

>>1889490
So am I. They're usually in Jersey. North Jersey, which is a pain in the ass to get to, but still. It's a matter of lurking the hell out of Craigslist.

You just have to perservere. I've looked for a PVM since 2011 and finally found a 20L5 earlier this year from Craigslist. It has slight pincushion issues that are visible when the screen is vertically scrolling (Which the dude who sold it to me was clearly aware of and didn't tell me after I found some posts he made talking about the problem on Youtube, but that's another issue entirely), but I love it regardless.

>>1889643
Is that running from an actual Genesis? Looks absolutely stunning.

>>1889587
Go get one then
People are literally giving crts away everywhere

>>1888813
gradius 3 on snes has a test grid that comes up at the start

>>1889652
Yes. It's the only system I have a SCART cable for. although I do run my Wii and PS2 off of component. Unfortunately it's a pain in the ass to get my camera or phone to focus on the full screen, so shots only look -really- good when focused on a small portion of the monitor. If you think that's stunning you should see what it looks like in person.

If it weren't for the ever-so-slight funhouse mirror effect on the right side which I've tried to fix for months and months and months dialing in every combination I can think of in the geometry settings menu to no avail, this thing would be perfect.

>>1889671
>If you think that's stunning you should see what it looks like in person.
I can imagine.

And I feel you on the camera focusing trouble. Try going in at somewhat sharp angle from the sides. That usually helps on certain games that refuse to focus otherwise.

I was going to post my own photo of the Headdy title screen, but it has some really nasty artifacts and generally looks like shit.

>>1889661

>literally giving crts away everywhere

I wish that were the case with BVMs

>>1889710
heh, yeah sadly bvms aren't so easily come by but that doesn't mean good crts aren't available

Hey there, guys. I have a Sony Trinitron KV-27V65. How's that for playing games? It seems a bit blurry to me, but that may be because I don't have S-video cables for any of my systems. Should I get something new? (Sorry about the shitty quality. My phone is the only camera I have)

>>1889712

Oh I don't doubt that, but at this point of my life I can only settle for 1 CRT next to my HDTV in my room, and I want the absolute best, as well as something small. 20 inches and nearly the best possible video quality? That's why I only want a BVM/PVM.

>>1889718
Should be fine, assuming it's in decent condition.

Go buy yourself some S-Video cables.
Be warned that there are some really cheap ones out there that won't give you actual S-Video though.

>>1889774
I'm planning on buying Monster cables. Heard they were pretty good. This is for my old Nintendo systems, but I'm planning on putting a Genesis and a PS1 to use soon.

>>1889787
Innovation, Hori, and of course the official ones are good as well.

The Genesis will need modding to output S-Video.

>>1889787
>>1889805
>Innovation, Hori, and of course the official ones are good as well.

You might have better luck finding one of these at a fair price rather than the monster cables, assuming you're talking about the monster s-video for Nintendo consoles. Those have gone up in price a fair deal recently.

Going from composite to s-video is a huge step up in quality, it's definitely worth it.

>>1889812
But the Monster cables are 60 bucks while I can't find the composite cables for anything less than 200.

>>1889787
>I'm planning on buying Monster cables
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

But seriously, do not give them money. Their cables are the same quality as must less expensive options, and they don't really protect you from viruses.

So I want to get the VGA box for the Dreamcast to use it on my CRT, the problem is that it doesn't have any VGA inputs so I'd like to use it via component outputs.

Do I really need to fork out for an extra box to change the signal or will a VGA to Component cable cut it?

>>1889774
Do S-Video cables do well to improve the image quality of N64 games? All other consoles like fine through composite on my CRT but the N64 looks pretty grainy. Also my CRT doesnt have S-Video input so i'm asking how big the difference would be.

>>1889818
Hey, thanks for the advice. I found the official Nintendo ones for the N64 for about 5 bucks. Not spending 60 bucks on this shit.

>>1889817
You're confusing component and composite.

Composite is the regular yellow plug. You can still get those new from Nintendo of America for $15 shipped.

The official Component cables for the gamecube are retarded expensive, and aren't backwards compatible with snes and n64 like the s-video cables are.

I'm recommending S-video for nintendo systems, the only way to really get a better picture is with RGB and that requires a monitor or euro tv.

I have official Nintendo S-video cables that I got for around $35. I love them and they work perfectly, so well that even though I have a PVM and hook up my other systems through RGB I still use s-video for snes and my (unmodded) n64.

>>1889830
>Do S-Video cables do well to improve the image quality of N64 games

Absolutely. I highly recommend playing n64 with S-video, since it's a console that could really do with less blur. The most noticeable differences will be in texture sharpness and color separation.

If you want a good example to look at compare Mario's outfit in Mario 64. With composite it tends to bleed around the edges (like most reds do with crummier video signals), and with s-video everything is clean and distinguishable.

>>1889843
Oh jesus, I need sleep. Sorry, and thanks for the advice and for explaining that shit.

>>1889830
While its built in filtering doesn't do any video signals any favors, S-Video definitely clears it up significantly.

>>1889823
A crt tv or a monitor?

>>1889878
A TV.

>>1889881
Dreamcast vga box puts out a 480p vga signal that a tv won't accept. A computer monitor will, or an HDTV crt.

>>1889818
>Monster hate
At the right price and purchased from a licensed dealer, Monster is superior for durability and warranty. Also, unless you buy their lowest-end cables that lack screw-on plugs, they are excellent for end-user repairs and mods.

>>1889823
Yes, DC > VGA box > transcoder > progressive-capable TV (640x480)

>>1889931
Please don't shill Monster unless it's in the form of a beverage.
http://www.geeksaresexy.net/2012/03/29/monster-cables-face-off-against-coat-hangers/

Paying upwards of $200 for the same quality you get from $5 cables is just disgusting. You literally cannot defend this.

>>1889940
So there are hd crts that accept component but not rgb? Don't most have a dvi port that can just use a dongle for VGA?

>>1889931
>they are excellent for end-user repairs and mods.
Just like near-literally every other cable? Most notably the ones that often cost a fraction of what Monster cables cost?

>>1889945
>wire coat hanger = monster audio cable

Holy shit that article is gold.
Get shit on, monster cables.

>>1889949
Buying a transcoder and vga box just to use DC on a crt seems insane, just use svideo w 480i unless using an HDTV then just use the cheapo vga DC cable from amazon.

>>1889949
>So there are hd crts that accept component but not rgb?
Yes, the majority of all CRT HDTVs in the US.

>Don't most have a dvi port that can just use a dongle for VGA?
No, those DVI inputs are DVI-D. You can passively adapt HDMI to them, but not VGA.

>>1889956
CRT HDTV. Gorgeous for DC + more recent systems.

>>1889940
Ah, so it's true then. Thanks! That answers my doubt then.

I think I'll go with >>1889956 and get an s-video cable.

>>1889949
I don't know if mine classifies as an hd crt since it's an sdtv sharp. It has s-video and component inputs (which I'm using to play n64 games and ps1 games via ps2 component, pure bliss).

I was wondering how far in terms of quality I could get using it. It might just be me, but I feel like 480i works better on those consoles.

>>1889963
Yeah that SD so 480i/240p only, svid and component will be fine.

>>1889963
The difference between 480p and S-video is quite huge on DC. But there are things that make S-video worthwhile too.

For example, my setup for DC is this: VGA Box > transcoder > CRT HDTV for everything other than Capcom fighters. For those, the 3D backgrounds do indeed look amazing at 480p. But I switch the box over to S-video for them since the sprites are low-res, causing jaggies on my HDTV. When I switch the box over, it sends the signal to my CRT SDTV.

>>1889956
>>1889961

The problem is virtually all HD CRTs upscale everything internally to 1080i. That's fine if you have a 1080i source, but 480p isn't going to be ideal with the internal scalers.

I'm sure there has to be EDTV (480p) TVs out there, but I don't know of any specific models. Sony never made any consumer sets like that that I know of, they went straight from SD to 1080i.

>>1889973
Dang you must really love your DC, a few games output 240p as well like SF3 and all those NGdevteam games.

>>1889979
>The problem is virtually all HD CRTs upscale everything internally to 1080i
Not a problem for me and my old multisync Toshiba HDTV with a true 480p mode.

>>1889981
>Dang you must really love your DC
You got that right. I bought this transcoder not intending to use it with anything else. I even tracked down the Performance VGA Adapter so I could insert my DC into my then-current desktop PC setup with no need for an extra switch.

>>1889983
>old multisync Toshiba HDTV with a true 480p mode.
What model/series is that?

>>1889983
I have a scanline generator and always wondered what it would look like w 480p on an hd crt set, like maybe a giant arcade screen. Might be badass, but I'm not hauling one home from Savers to see.

>>1889992
I've mentioned them before, but I have a 36HFX72 and a 32HFX72.

The HFX series was their top 2002 line. It was their "specialty store only" line and included a built-in woofer that actually does make them sound a lot better than the regular HFs. The HF series was very similar except for the sub and was sold everywhere for much less. Both have true 480p modes, completely separate from their 1080i modes (you can see when it switches, but more obviously, you can HEAR it).

The 73s are when Toshiba started to incorporate scalers. They also added 720p support thanks to it, along with a DVI input. Mine lack all of these, but I don't care, since the 480p mode has been far more useful to me.

What brands/models are known to have native 480p support?

>>1890040
Look for early-2000s HDTVs. Toshiba for sure, possibly (probably) Panasonic and JVC too.

I stopped buying Sony in the late '90s for a while based on bad experiences in the mid '90s, so I can only imagine what they were doing at the time.

>>1890050
Damn, I think I saw a toshiba with a woofer on top on a flea market a while back. That time I was single mindedly looking for a trinitron and didn't consider it. Maybe it had 480p support.

>>1890018
>Two

I'll take one.

How did you get them anyway?

>>1890137
Bought 'em brand new at full price.

Salesman threw in a free DVD on top though. He probably fed his family for 3 weeks off that commission.

>>1890148
Nice.

I need to look into toshiba models and see what else was multiscan. Hopefully I can get something of a listing done up for the pastebin.

>>1890018
>36HFX72 and a 32HFX72.
Do these have 16:9 mode?

>>1890161
Yes, although it might be manual.

>>1890161
Yes, and it's manual. Which is ideal for flexibility, btw. For example, I am typing this on the 36 right now in 4:3 1080i, but my on-screen geometry is accurate. If it auto-switched to either of its 16:9 modes, I'd be wasting screen space.

>>1890185
>CRT 1080i

If you don't have your DPI turned up I'll be amazed. My XBR910 can just about display text legibly in the middle, but the sides are blurry as fuck.

>>1890187
120 dpi here.

I've never used either of my XS955s for PC display.

>>1890192
>Toshiba multiscans AND TWO XS955s

Pics of all this now please

>>1890237
No thanks. But I do still have one other Toshiba CRT HDTV besides those four. Sold one a long time ago for a small profit, otherwise I'd have six.

Guys fuck I'm a dumbass. I picked up a Trinitron (A PVM-1380 to be specific) but what the fuck do I plug into it?

I'll snap a picture of what I'm looking at, one second

>>1890971
Here's what I've got.

Anyone help me out here? I've never seen this type of ports on a TV before. I'd like to hook up a toploader NES and a super famicom to it

>>1890975
Scratch that, I've discovered that these are BNC inputs. I'm off to buy some converters. Will hopefully post some pics of what this baby looks like in action although I don't have the highest expectations of it.

>>1890975
>>1890971

That's BNC anon, it's a professional alternative to RCA. What you've got here are 2 composite input. Just get an RCA → BNC adapter (its pretty cheap).

>>1890328
Unless that is somehow using BNC composite, I think it might be a B&W model.

>>1891027
>>1890986
Thanks!
It seems (thankfully) it's not B&W. Also I'm a pretty shitty photographer - as in I have no idea how to photograph a CRT. Any tips would be welcomed

Nonetheless I'm pretty impressed with this thing (definitely a huge improvement over my rear projection hdtv).

Unfortunately my usual shop laughed when I told them I was looking for BNC-coaxial converters. They had 2 composite to BNC converters so I took one of those but ended up with nothing to convert coaxial to BNC. I'm gonna see if I can dig out my VCR from storage as I believe it may actually convert coax to composite which I can in turn convert to BNC now, till then though I've got my Super Famicom which I'll probably kick back and enjoy for the time being.

>>1891162

>Any tips would be welcomed

You sould make your room as dark as possible, not use flash, and try to have a fast shutter speed (something like 1/60 of a second is perfect). Also, use a support or a tripod for the more stability.

>>1891175
Appreciate that.
Probably ought to consider getting a better camera if I want better pictures then I suppose.

>>1891162
That monitor only is going to have composite in so if you do have anything that is RF only you will need to hook it up to a VCR.

Tip about VCRs though: Newer VCRs will take 240p and interpret it as 480i and output it as so, older ones don't care and actually let you record to the tape in 240p. Around '90 and earlier is best from what I've seen. My local Goodwill has a million of them so that might work for you!

>>1891285
Picture related, my older VCR. Oddly enough it's not HiFi but is HQ? I guess it was easier to do HQ.

>>1891294

You know what? You VCR is sexier than your DVD recorder.

>>1891294
>that responsible monthly budget

>>1891309
Thank you, you may be interested in my video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z4iw8Ppo1o

>>1891285
>>1891294
Hm, I just busted out my VCR (it lists itself as Daytron TCR-2010) I had it when I was a kid so it's at its newest mid 90's. I'd have to get in touch with my parents to see when they think it's from as I have no real clue.

I'm running the NES through it right now and it looks pretty good but the picture seems to be much less photogenic...

>>1891353
Hoo boy.

>>1891353
>dat bowl haircut

>>1891309
Yeah, it honestly is. I lost the damn remote for that DVD recorder and there's no buttons on the front for it to change the input so I have to use my phone's IR as a remote to change the inputs.

>>1891369
The easiest way to tell is if you see any sort of scanlines without the VCR, and then you don't see them with the VCR it's most likely shoving it into 480i.

>>1891332
Shit, I didn't even notice it, ha. Enjoy.

If anyone here has a PVM with BNC outputs and you want to record or stream your gaming sessions without having to sacrifice quality, you should pick up a set of BNC to SCART cables and get one of these for an HDMI capture card.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00D86UYBS/

>>1891478
>The easiest way to tell is if you see any sort of scanlines without the VCR, and then you don't see them with the VCR it's most likely shoving it into 480i.

With some extensive testing I've determined that my VCR is probably shit. Oh well I guess, I'm sure I can figure out something.

>>1891487
Noted. That price is too good to ignore.

>>1889787
>I'm planning on buying Monster cables. Heard they were pretty good.
Don't fucking do it. You heard incorrect information. They are a complete and utter rip off.

>>1891027
bad aim is bad

>>1891027
>somehow using BNC composite
It's not as uncommon as you make it sound. I can tell you haven't really spent much time around old equipment.

>>1891294
HQ non-HiFi was common. I had a 1980s model that used linear stereo before buying my HiFi VCRs.

>>1891294
>sub-$1000 mortgage
I'm moving to your state, breh. You can't get a 2 bed/1 bath in-law around here for less than twice that.

>>1889818
>>1889931
>>1889945
>>1889950
>>1889952
>>1891531
Monster is the big evil boogeyman, yadda yadda yadda.

It's just trendy to rip on them, even among people who have never used them. I'm surprised the "Monster are not just a rip-off, they are actually very bad" crew chime in by now.

Break the cycle of ignorance. At the right price, they are fine.

>>1891905
It's a re-fi loan from the gubmint, hell yeah fannie mae.

>>1891898
yeah it makes sense but it's just funny that they do that.

>>1891920
There is no "right price" because they rarely ever outperform any normal kind of cable which you can get for dirt cheap. The only time they'd ever be the same price as a normal cable would be if they were next to each other in the Goodwill $1 cord bin. Even then I wouldn't buy any of their shitty RCA connector cables because they latch on too fucking hard. A previous TV I owned had one of it's component jacks ripped off because of them. Shit ain't worth it.

>>1891973
Sounds like somebody's never been a very astute clearance aisle shopper or had the forethought to loosen those turbine connectors prior to installation.

Throw the marketing hype and high regular price out and they are really quite nice.

>>1891920
Yeah maybe if you found them at 60% or more off thereby making them the price of a regular cable which would be exactly the same thing anyways.

>>1891986
Quite nice in that it's the same as everything else?
I mean excluding that when they're on an amazing sale its the same price as a regular cable?

Take your nonsense shilling elsewhere. This isn't your viral marketing outlet.
>>>/youtube/
>>>/reddit/

>>1891986
I shouldn't have to fucking loosen a connector that doesn't fit safely on any RCA connector, that's a bad design flaw sorry. Your apologetic nature for Monster Cable is so unwarranted.

Does monster wire the cables correctly?
Someone mentioned that some online outlets sell cables that are not grounded properly.

>>1892034
I honestly wouldn't be surprised one bit if that were the case.

>>1892034
>>1892040
Samefag, samefag go away
shill again another day

>>1892019
>maybe if you found them at 60% or more off
Lucky me I have a full stash of Nintendo and Sony Monster cables puchased brand new for even less than that.

>>1892019
>same as everything else
Don't fool yourself into thinking I don't understand basic principles of electricity, but Monster cables in certain lines are easily much better than the Monoprice stuff I buy for other people's installations. Ever get into a Monster cable higher than their outsourced "standard" lines? They are very well insulated and sturdy even compared to the Chinese stuff that is designed to "feel" right in the hand, with all that braided jacketing. And the plugs aren't just glue gun specials either. They actually have some really smart strain relief designs.

>>1892021
You really shouldn't have to, as I never have. It's just that you should be smart enough when experiencing too much resistance plugging in a simple little cable that you shouldn't be doing it, otherwise you'll have trouble during teardown.

Paperclips and rubber bands may work too, but for my stuff I'd rather have something less shoddy.

>>1892034
Silly that this has to be a question, but yes. Monster's console S-video cables are one of a tiny handful of known-good cables that don't simply split CVBS off into the Y line. First-party and Hori are two of the others.

>>1892060

>>1892060
>uh oh, someone's talking positively about a consumer product that I already have an opinion about
>won't someone please think of muh shillin

>>1892061
>Silly that this has to be a question
Indeed, I would have thought that wiring a cable would be a solved problem by now but anons have reported otherwise.

Why is there such a defense force going on for Monster right now? Cables are all literally the same shit unless you buy one so fucking cheap its falling apart... and Monster is very clearly overpriced, yeah their cables look nice but that doesn't make their $10 cable worth $60 bucks to me.

I'm not gonna cry "shill" but maybe you anons should just go ahead and get monster to sponsor your 4chan posting since

>muh brand loyalty

>>1892079
Well badly wired S-video cables are common among shitty no-name cables because it saves them the cost of one stupid little wire and they think people won't notice.

Plus incompletely wired multi-line cables (like SCART, VGA, etc.) exist because people assume that not all lines will be used, and it also saves some money on the wiring.

If there's anything Monster doesn't do (and even their detractors will admit this), it's cut corners on the cents they could be saving on the wiring.

>>1892103
>I know you've used them and have first-hand things to say about them but DON'T talk about them around me!!!
I'll just put it as simply as I can: Ignoring cost, if you put a pile of console cables on a table and say I can keep one to use for myself, I'm probably going to choose the appropriate Monster cable.

>>1892115
I really like how you make up random "quotes" so you can dance around what I'm saying and plug Monsters' products further. Where at all in my post did I say anything even remotely near that?

Seriously - Monster is just another brand man. It's the exact same as any other cable except marked up tenfold. Talking them up by comparing them to cables that are literally miswired like it makes them some amazing quality product is a total joke.

>>1892140
>Talking them up
I only have experience with owning and using them. But all of a sudden when I say something about them in response to the usual claptrap that always appears whenever they are mentioned, it becomes a battle for the detractors to get the last word in.

Go ahead guys, I'll stop replying to you all now. Get in all the digs you want, they will go unanswered and everyone can finally know the true story about how this little cable company shot your dog or whatever.

>total joke
Yeah it's so funny.

>>1892061
You don't understand basic principles of electricity because if you did your own testing they pretty much provide no more benefit at all. There have been numerous independent tests done on this to show that there's no worth in the cables.

This thread seems made for me.
I actually don't own a single a digital tv.

>>1892353
Hey, there were SDTV CRT's made with ATSC digital tuners to be fair.

>>1892353
>>1892464
Many CRT HDTVs have digital scalers too.

So, I posted a few months ago that I managed to get a proper CRT but had a problem that it showed SCART in 16:9 instead of proper 4:3 (only SCART, composite on the front outputs in 4:3). Since I couldn't change it on the TV and I didn't have a remote at that, I had to live with it at first. Today I finally got myself one of those universal remotes. The problem now is that I don't know the code for this specific TV. I tried to look up an instruction or rather the code for the TV but can't find it. Do I have to bruteforce it or is there another way that is less time consuming?

>>1892858
Some universal remotes have a scan function that will try different codes until it finds one that works. Try looking into that.

>>1892858
Perhaps you have +6 volts instead of +12 volts on pin 8. You could try to disconnect pin 8. +6 = 16/9, +12 = 4/3 and 0 is hopefully as is.

>>1892872
Thanks for this tip but my remote doesn't have this function, unfortunately. That means I really do have to bruteforce my way to it, don't I?

>>1892876
Do you mean the TV or my cable? Since it's not on the cable's end. I just tried it again on my HDTV and it's in 4:3 on it. However, if you mean the TV, I have to say that I'm afraid of breaking it instead of fixing.

>>1892884
I meant the cable. If there is no pin 8 it's easier to get a remote with aspect ratio control, imho.

My famicom has very, very oversaturated colours. No matter what adjustments I make on the TV I can't seem to get it right. Any suggestions?

>>1892893
Like I wrote, it's not the cable's fault since it does output in 4:3, it's my TV's fault.
And my remote could change this, if I find out a way to program it onto the TV. I just don't seem to be lucky to find the code for this model.

>>1892858
German here, you can only handle a grundig with the right remote. For the service menu you have to enter a code 0855.

>>1881703
trinitron damn that brings back some memories

>>1892919
If it's a Grundig it might respond to Philips remotes as they might share parts.

>>1892884
Well, it can still be the cable. Some TV's respond differently to certain signals, especially the different sync types and widescreen signaling. My Sony doesn't like SNES cables where they wired composite video for sync.

>>1892858
This might not help you if you've already committed 100% to using a universal remote, but you could search for the model # of the remote that originally came with your TV based on the TV's model number, then hunt down that exact remote. There are many online stores that sell replacement remotes, whether the originals or third-party clones.

Alright guys I'm back (guy with the new PVM-1380) and I can't for the life of my figure out why the image is so jittery! It's shakey enough it could give me a headache if I looked at it for too long.

I've tried a few different consoles (NES via VCR, PS2, N64, even my RetroDuo) and it seems to make no difference.

Any thoughts?

>>1893282
Are your power lines clean?

>>1893282
>>1893307
Ah shit I ended up figuring it out. Some kind of magnetic(?) interference from having it on my desk with a questionable number of other electronics running within inches of it.

>>1893312
Yeah, that's why I asked about power lines, sounded like EMI to me.

Ya done good.

>>1891887
>>1891895
Fair enough, I don't have much experience with stuff that uses BNC.

It also seems to be a lot harder to find detailed info about professional models, for whatever reason.

>Arguing about cables
>>>/g/

>>1892919
>>1892956
It's a Panasonic, not a Grundig. Thanks for the tip though.

>>1892962
It's still not the cable, I tested several of my consoles which all of them utilize another cable plus a RCA -> SCART adapter. They all were in 16:9. Thank you for the information about the signals, though. I didn't know that. I always assumed that it is the same for every TV.

>>1881580
I lucked out and found a 2005 Polaroid CRT with component inputs on the back. It needed a new power cord soldered on, but my buddy helped me with that and now it works great. I have a few questions about it though:

1. It produces a loud, high-pitched whine when it's turned on. I've read it can be all kinds of things, but what are the most likely causes and can they be fixed?

2. Is there a good calibration suite to use for adjusting settings? It's a bit out of whack and could use some work. I have only a modded PS2 and a softmodded Wii in my possession, and only the PS2 has component cables at hand.

Holy Shit, Guys. My wife would kill me but one of you other Central Ohiofags might want to take advantage of this fucking FREE 36" 4:3 VGA monitor

http://columbus.craigslist.org/sys/4611502517.html

Question: What results would I get if I hooked a console to a TV-Monitor using a SCART cable? Do TV-Monitors have proper upscaling, disregarding the need for upscalers?

>>1895336
Depends on what specifically you mean by TV-Monitor. If you mean an HDTV that has RGB Scart inputs then it will vary from model to model but you can find out how your monitor handles 240p over RGB by plugging in a PS2 and playing a PSX game.

>>1881703

The last good sets of trinitrons, until they went grey and had flimsy build quality after 1999.

>>1881715

>tfw grew up all my life with the same TV sets (magnavox and phillips/magnavox) until 2008
>they only had coaxial
>never knew the joys of having a decent CRT from 1990 and up until recently

I'm considering buying this new in box 22" viewsonic from around 2003/4 for $180. It's like a trinitron and has an aperture grill.

I don't know much about crts though. Think it's worth it?

>>1895513
forgot pic

I was thinking about getting a Dell E773c monitor for emulation purposes and quasi-240p/640 playback. Does anyone have experience with it?

>color calibration
>problems
>other

>>1895415
Sony build quality was at its worst in the mid-90s and actually improved in the 2000s.

>>1895526
>worst in the mid-90s
Yeah, KV-M1400D (1993) and KV-M1450D (1995) have the exact same tube but the older one has a much superior picture quality but no 16:9 mode or service menu.
However i blame the bad picture quality on the MC44002.
Sony often used video chips from ST or Philips in the early 90s in their European sets, that stuff is much better than that chip from Motorola.

>actually improved in the 2000s.
Wow, I never realized that.

No decent camera sadly.

Hi /vr/.
I've been able to get my hands on a Toshiba 36zp38b for >£1, and have switched my PS2, Wii and soon will be switching my Dreamcast to it. The LCD screen I had before scaled horribly and made the games look terrible, but I'm happy with how the picture looks now. I'm using RGB SCART cables for the PS2 and Wii, but the old VGA cable I was using for the Dreamcast doesn't fit since the TV only has 3 SCART (2 RGB, 1 S-Video/composite), 1 component and 1 S-Video/composite input on the front.
Is it possible to make my Wii output true 240p so I can get proper scanlines in homebrew or VC emulated games?
Is it worth buying component cables for the PS2 and Wii for 480p? Would that affect 240p output for the Wii at all? I hear there are problems with PS1 games and component cables, too.
What's my best option for connecting the Dreamcast? I'm assuming RGB SCART, since a VGA > Component adaptor would likely be expensive if I wanted a decent one, and introduce input lag.
Is there anything else I need to know?

Sorry if this isn't /vr/ or I'm not posting in the right place, I'm rather new to this all but I'd like to know I'm not doing anything stupid.

Since I'm poor as shit and I can't afford a NESRGB board, I tried a NES emulator for the PS1 and this is how its looks like on my PVM-2030.

The only problem I had is that some roms won't work at all.

I should probably get a NESRGB, and a job

How is the AF series of Toshiba?

Is there even any benefit to using a crt? Or honestly playing on a tv/aynshent console anyway?

Why not just emulate and upscale to play games how they were meant to be played?

>>1896530
I have a 35AF44 that I really like for retro.

The usual caveats apply for specific models, though.

>>1881934
wait so Sony PVM's are actually bad for 5th gen and lower?

>>1896504
Find a cheap ass used Wii and put RetroArch on it.

>>1896585
You dense fuck.

>>1896585

PVMs aren't HD, so no, they aren't bad.

>>1895513
>>1895519
Mite b gud but pay like half of that tops.

>Is it possible to make my Wii output true 240p so I can get proper scanlines in homebrew or VC emulated games?
Yes, depending on the original system. You have to hit some button combo in the operation manual.
>Is it worth buying component cables for the PS2 and Wii for 480p? Would that affect 240p output for the Wii at all? I hear there are problems with PS1 games and component cables, too.
Yes. It'll look better than S video and a lot better than composite.

>>1896585
The guide was talking about computer monitors. It's still shit tho.

>>1896595
>>1896504
Wii emulation is the cheap way to emulate most consoles. Cheap as in 'inexpensive', not 'bad'.

>>1896605
Some PVMs are HD, but only late model wide screen (expensive as fuck) ones. You probably won't end up with one by accident.

Even then I -think- HD PVM/BVMs are multiscan, but I've never found a service manual or otherwise that says so.

>>1896609
Yeah for pretty much anything that wasnt 3D or 32X it works great. Even Sega CD. I played Snatcher on the Wii with it.

>>1896615
I think turbo grafix systems only output 480i as well.

>>1896627
Well I was going more for like, emulatable. The 32X and anything 3D and stuff doesn't work at all.

>>1896628
Ahh, yeah the game working is important as well.

Is there a medium size trinitron thar has both component and S-video inputs? I only seem to find with one or the other but not both.

>>1896635
What is medium sized to you? 20"?

>>1896638
Yes, around 20" or so.

>>1896595
>>1896609

How do I output RGB from a NTSC Wii?

>>1896627
>I think turbo grafix systems only output 480i as well.

No it doesn't, only the Wii Virtual Console make it output such a signal.

>>1896643
You need to get a region changer, I don't remember which I used. Just change the settings to PAL on all of them, most importantly video output. Make sure you have BootMii or whatever the backup thing is for the Wii just in case of bricking you can bring it back to life.

When you get back to the main Wii system menu, go to the video output settings and change it to PAL60 or else your eyes will fall out.

>>1896650
>go to the video output settings and change it to PAL60 or else your eyes will fall out.

Not him, but what happens?

>>1896643
It's a huge PITA to get RGB out of a NTSC wii, and the picture is pretty close. Better off using component.

>>1896648
Er, I meant to say games. Not sure how I got 'systems' out of that. VC was what I meant.

>>1896653
Probably the same as running a 480p signal into a 480i TV. Picture scrolls across the screen quickly.

>>1896653
I'm guessing that the 50hz refresh rate on the 60hz display is the cause. It hurts really bad.

>>1896656
It's really not much work, the hardest part for me was getting the damn region changer because I lost it for some reason. After that it took me all of 5 minutes to get it done.

>>1896650
Thanks, now I just need a SCART cable for my Wii
>>1896656
As sad as it makes me feel, my PVM doesn't have component input, only S-video, Composite and RGB through a weird "CMPTR" connector.

And I just don't like how it looks on my LCD, not even at 480p.

>>1896656
>>1896657
You would think competent sets did both refresh rates and not just one. I can understand going 60hz though, especially since VC games are unoptimized as all hell for 50hz.

>>1896663
I got a SCART cable off of ebay, it was about 7 dollars and it actually works perfectly. It comes from China though.

how do I find a good CRT? Like a PVM or something, what are the tips? I live in San Diego

>>1896664
Well, it does the refresh rate, it's just too flickery I think because it doesn't scale it or anything like a digital TV. So since American power isnt 50hz thats probably why.

>>1896635
>>1896639
Sony was pretty horrible about that except in what they considered transition years between featuring one or the other, but at least the 20FV300 had both.

>>1896674
Then why is PAL60 a thing?

Perhaps I might have some luck if I ask this here

I have a SNES/Wii/PS1 and an old CRT monitor, which only supports VGA, and these consoles are RCA outputs

what i'm thinking is getting a capture card (probably usb, a PCI one might not fit thanks to my gpu) and hook it up on my PC to use the CRT, without recording anything, just to be able to use the consoles with the monitor

My budget isn't huge right now and I don't mind some degradation on quality, as long as it works without any noticeable delay

any help?

>>1896680
I'm guessing because going up in Hz wouldn't make it be more flickery, usually it does the exact opposite.

>>1896680
I think because since the NGC/PS2/Xbox era europe began using 60hz. But not everybody had a TV that could accept it.

But then again, that just a guess of mine.

>>1896669

>>1896684
Sounds fair.

>>1896685
Yurop TVs accepting 60hz come a long way. It's the ones supporting NTSC in 480i that were difficult to find.

>>1896682
Using a good dscaler-compatible PCI card, there would be very slight (but generally acceptable) lag and much better quality compared to most built-in TV scalers, especially if you use s-video cables. A nice one with a Philips chipset should run you no more than $20-30, new.

>probably usb
I have no experience with them, but I generally try to avoid relying on USB for low-latency applications. There are people who try to avoid USB for audio, not to mention delay-free video. Then again, there are always people who say things like easycap devices are fine for making youtube videos, so who knows. (I do know that recorded video quality from easycaps is clearly quite poor).

The more expensive alternatives involve not using your PC at all, instead using upscan converters. More info here:

http://retrogaming.hazard-city.de/

>>1896685
I wonder how many other Americans on /vr/ would recognize what game that drawing is from. I imported it a long time ago.

Without cheating, any Americans wanna take a stab at it?

>>1896693
While sharpening filters are the only filters allowed on /vr/, you seem to have posted in the wrong thread.

>>1896705
Dscaler is shit in 2014 and would introduce more lag than a normal TV would, Amarectv is the preferred for capture related things. I hear that the legit, non-knock off version of the Ezcap USB is good for SD capture.

You will be quite disappointed with the quality of it on that particular monitor, though. SD composite/s-video capture is not very good, especially since the capture device will interpret it as 480i instead of 240p. You'd be better off using emulators or trading that monitor for an actual TV of the same size.

>>1896729
>SD composite/s-video capture is not very good
>bought cheap easycap just for the hell of it a year ago
>composite captures relatively well
>s-video looks like complete shit and ruins the picture on the PVM at the same time
I have to assume something isn't ground properly, but like hell if I know what it is.

>>1896736
Yeah that's probably what it is. Grounding's a cunt.

>>1896715
Sorry in advance for the off topic reply.

I drew it for a "guess the game" thread a few weeks ago, my uncle gave me that game along with a bunch of other ones when he modchiped my PS1 when I was like 10 or 11 years old, I instantly loved that game from the first time I played it and I still remember every single song, too bad it was never released here.

Mexican btw. Here's the other one I made, not that is hard to guess or anything.

>>1896729
>Dscaler is shit in 2014 and would introduce more lag than a normal TV would
dscaler is no slower than amarectv, it's just much older with an interface and options to match. Dscaler is still the standard for card compatibility.

>>1896754
That is complete horse shit, Dscaler's filters add much more lag and the only standard it was for was 10 years ago when there was nothing better, like bt848 cards, which were shit to begin with. This isn't the olden days of shit driver compatibility and such, nor is it Windows 98.

>>1896705
>>1896729
i'm not trying to record anything, just want to output the video signals from the consoles through the monitor since I don't have a TV I can use and my budget is somewhat limited right now
I still prefer PCI over USB but i'm afraid to buy a card that can't fit on my motherboard

>>1896749
Yeah man, the soundtrack was awesome, opening track still lingers in my head to this day. Fun game.

>>1896760
>That is complete horse shit,
>Dscaler's filters add much more lag
lol

it doesn't get faster than dscaler anon

>>1896609

I'll assume this was directed towards me.>>1895957
>Yes. It'll look better than S video and a lot better than composite.
My cables are already RGB SCART cables.

Is there any real difference on a CRT between using the actual native resolutions (e.g. 256x240) and using a "superwide" resolution with scaling (e.g. 2560x240)?

>>1897209

The result will be way to sharp when using the "superwide" mode.

>>1897209
With the superwide resolutions, you can do high-quality video effects like NTSC/PAL filters or easily change pixel width.

>>1897209
>>1897209
First of all, I don't think you can send a 2560x anything over a CRT, the image will have to be reprocessed internally to at least hit 720x, and no, save for some non-integer rescaling (for the 720 thing) I don't think you'd notice anything if you don't give a fuck. Why do you ask?

>>1897219
You can always use a blur filter for scaling if that's a problem. High quality blur at that high of a horizontal resolution should be indistinguishable from "real" low bandwidth signal blur.

>>1897250

It isn't anon, it isn't.

>>1897267
Whatever you say. I couldn't tell any difference.

Picked up this KV-13TR24 today, but when I tried to connect a system I got a vague flickering image of what I think is a warning screen. Is it broke?

is PVM-1350 good for SNES through Wii? Is it worth spending $110 (including shipping)? Everything on Craigslist is hours away

>>1897985
You can get a 20 inch for about that much. I just got a 20 inch ikegami broadcast monitor from a dude on ebay. It was 80 total. I also got an Olympus OEV203 (relabelled pvm) for 100 total, both from ebay.

>>1898061
I guess I will just wait till a deal like that pops up

PVM 1954Q for $100 but a 96 minute drive, worth it?

>>1896686
Oh my god, I am so angry about this that I could shit. Why couldn't I live in a place focused on film? Fuck. I'm gonna have to scrounge up a PVM-20M2MDU that probably has burn-in of the inside of a million peoples' assholes, and probably overpay for it too.

Hey guys. I bought a pre-calibrated BVM20F1U with a replacement tube from 2009 off a retired Sony Tech. Only thing is he's away from his residence or so and he won't be shipping it or communicating with me until Tuesday (I'll post pics when I get it). In the meantime, maybe you guys can help me out with some things.

The BVM comes with BNC-in with RGBCs (composite sync which threw me off because I bought a truly component Horizontal-Vertical Sync RGB BNC cable from a thrift store). I was planning to pass-through a VGA source into the BNC lines. Anyways, long story short I'm gonna have to convert the Horizontal and Vertical Sync to Composite Sync and only use four of the BNC lines as opposed to all five of them, which I'll be using the pic attached as reference to do so (even though I'll be converting to BNC as opposed to SCART). Another thing that irks me is that I know VGA from a PC source expects EDID information (metadata on the other of the 15 pins available to identify safe display modes and detect the monitor being used). I heard there was a way to create a 'dummy' device to output generic monitor information to the PC, but I don't have any references to do this correctly (I just need simple monitor identification data to detect I plugged something in, as I can set a custom 'forced' display mode myself through my video drivers). The EDID info is the biggest obstacle I'll probably need help with. So I would appreciate it if any of you can oblige.

>>1898902
Update: I got a reference of the latest E-EDID data format standard most likely compatible with my system (I have a video card from last year [a Geforce GTX 770M if you need to know]).

Also, if any of you have any analog displays similar to the BVM20F1U that provide EDID information, or know all of its timing and EDID settings, perhaps you can chip in with this program (freeware): http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/dump_edid.html

>>1898939
Woops, forgot pic. My high quality ASUS VG278HR LCD monitor from 2 years ago is using EDID standard 1.3 apparently.

>>1898940
I guess certain EDID values vary between the inputs the TV accepts (like maximum resolution between Composite, VGA, DVI-A, DVI-D, HDMI, etc.). Certain things are always static though (like timing settings that have to do with the physical display and not settings limited by the encoding or decoding scheme of the signal).

I hope my question is retro enough.

How are 100 Hz TVs for 6th generations consoles? I have a Sony Trinitron and a Löewe CT1170, and I could buy a 100 Hz Löewe TV for a fairly cheap price.

>>1898996
they sucks

>>1898997

Better or worse than an HDTV?

>>1885873
My brother actually came across it about ten years ago. It was even in a plastic case instead of a jewel one (for whatever reason). Also I've finally got a remote control that works with it so here are some better shots.

>>1900065
And the other one.

>>1898996
go to scart hunter and he'll teach you why they suck

>>1897250
Wouldn't linear scaling do the same effect?

Do any of you guys have any knowledge of non-Sony video monitors? I'm worried that I won't be able to find a PVM in decent shape any time soon so I'm curious if there are any good alternatives that I could pick up for cheap.

my aunt was giving away a crt tv and i snatched it. its bulky "newer" silver samsung i think. is it bad to leave it outside?

>>1901527
>is it bad to leave it outside?
Very much so. Exposure to the elements/rain can cause corrosion on the external jacks and moisture will get inside the case and corrode things on the board.

>>1901529

This, and on top of that, moisture will short the circuits too.

>>1901529
>>1901532
alright thanks

>>1901116
Ikegami, Mitsubishi, NEC, and Panasonic all made good monitors. An anon posted earlier about an Olympus monitor that was a rebranded Sony PVM, selling for much less than officially branded PVMs in the same size, worth searching for those too.

>>1901558
JVC too

All of those manufacturer had/have a big video/broadcast production presence.

Hey guys doing a house clear out today and found this Amstrad ctm 644 monitor, can it be used with anything else? connectors are weird.

If I could hook it up to my SNES or PC I would be happy, any experience with these?

>>1901807

It can't without some custom cables. If you still have the Amstrad, just use it with this monitor, or else you'll have to make your own cables.
Also, for the PC, it'll need more than a special cable, your video card need to support 15kHz output.

Does anybody in the Los Angeles area want a free Sharp CRT? full analog too.

http://files.sharpusa.com/Downloads/ForHome/HomeEntertainment/Television/Manuals/Archive/tel_man_25C340.pdf

>>1901810
>>1901807

Also, they're not really good monitors, I can even say that they're pretty shitty ones. If you don't use the Amstrad nor this monitor anymore, the best advise I could give you is just sell it with an Amstrad CPC (if you still have it, and because it's the only way for a CPC to be powered, selling a CPC without it's monitor is criminal) and get a better one with the money you got by selling it. Don't trash it: it might be a bad monitor, but it's still an Amstrad monitor, some people might need one.

>>1901821
Thanks. can't seem to find the CPC for it so I think I'll just give it away to anyone who needs it.

Any dudes want to go in with me on this?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pallet-of-20-jvc-14inch-grade-1-BM-H1400PND-monitors-with-SDI-20-vat-inc-/191296151592?pt=UK_CCTV&hash=item2c8a23a028

>>1900404

Yes, but more sophisticated blur techniques will blend dither patterns like what SNES used for pseudo hires translucency.

So, there's this Dell CRT monitor I can get for free that hooks up via VGA. IIRC, it only does 640x480 at the lowest and 1280x960 at the highest. I'll probably nab it anyway since I need another screen for work stuff and I'm too cheap to buy another LCD monitor, but I was considering using it for emulation outside of that. Would that be any worth using for emulation or would there not really be any difference compared to just using my LCD monitor with a shader?

>>1902740
If it helps any, from pictures I could find on the net, it seems it's an E773c.

>>1902740

Those Dell CRTs are pretty good for emulation if you know what you're doing.

>>1902997
I'll probably just be using a VGA converter since my GPU is too new for VGA itself. Beyond that, I'm not quite sure how I'd set it up other than putting RetroArch at a lower resolution.

>>1881580
Hey guys, havent used a crt in years.

I have an opportunity to get one from my Grandparents though. My Dads mother had a 70's TV in one of those huge wooden chests with legs and shit and we had it and its what I used to play Super Nintendo and N64 on. My dad gave it to my other grandparents because we had no space for it. Now my grandparents are downsizing and reverse-indian giving it back to us and I have an opportunity to take it. My dad replaced the 70's TV with a new one some time in the early 90's.

Should I go for it? Will it really enrich my gameplaying experience? I'll have to move some stuff around but I think I can get it to fit.

I think its like a 35 or 40 inch CRT.

>>1903005
>GPU is too new for VGA itself

It will output VGA through the DVI port, just get one of those VGA to DVI-A adapters.

>Beyond that, I'm not quite sure how I'd set it up other than putting RetroArch at a lower resolution.

http://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Display_FAQ#240p.2F480i_Emulation_on_a_CRT_Monitor

>>1903005

DVI-I and DVI-A are the same as VGA, just with a different connector. Your graphics card should support it.

>>1903019
>It will output VGA through the DVI port, just get one of those VGA to DVI-A adapters.
That's what I meant by VGA converter. I was just talking about a general adapter. Unfortunately, my DVI slot is taken up by my LCD monitor, so I'll probably do miniDP to VGA.

I actually just checked the emugen wiki, but all I could find was the section on CRT shaders. Thanks!

>>1903026
Wow, I didn't believe you until I looked it up. That's pretty cool.

>>1903019
>>1903036
Also on that article, but because I'm not too familiar with forcing resolutions, etc, would creating and forcing the resolution of 3840x480 fuck up the monitor at all? I'm guessing not, but I'm not familiar with this kind of stuff.

>>1903010
No, get a newer one, if you're in the uk go for a 90's rgb scart tv, if in USA get a 2000's trinitron flat screen one with component input. And don't get one thats too big, it will be more likely to have geometry issues and will be less sharp, 20"-25" is best.

>>1903058

No. Only the vertical resolution and refresh rate actually matter, horizontal resolution only matters for signal bandwidth

>>1903074
Alright then. Thanks for the help, m8. I'll probably pick it up tomorrow and see how it looks.

>>1903070
and only use svideo and component or rgb when possible.

Just leaving this here.

UME->GDM-5510 320x120@120hz

pretty new to CRTs. gonna sound dense but how do I plug things in? second pic coming

I want my phone to be on the screen, so right now my phone goes to HDMI. what kind of converter cable do I need for this to work?

also rate my TV /vr/. found this in the closet yesterday.

>>1903451
This picture is a pretty good guide for CRT information >>1881934
If you're emulating on a PC CRT screen (Doesn't look like it), using the information here is good >>1903019

>>1903465
Looks like you need an RF adapter of some kind. I don't even know if they do HDMI to RF at all.

>>1903471
what if I went to a thrift store and got an old computer monitor that already has VGA in? cause HDMI to VGA is a thing. is worth it for video quality or no?

>>1896550
it's ALL about the performance. it's less about how it looks.

well, that's the only reason I use a CRT anyway.

>>1896550
CRT and original console has no input lag.

The average LCD and an emulator will give you about 2 frames of latency.

Is it possible to make a light gun work in an emulator? I mean, is it possible to connect my PC on crt tv, and play games such as House of the Dead or Virtua Cop on it?

>>1903451
>>1903465
RF only, cheap shadow mask model. I wouldn't bother with it at all unless you want a true nostalgic NES setup. It'll look like shit.

>>1903514
VGA can be used with a VGA port, but HDMI ain't gonna work.

HDMI fucking sucks for anything retro anyway.

>>1903379
Shit looks good.

>>1902997
Also looks good.

I'm making it my life's mission to get a 32" widescreen HD BVM at some point. Probably won't be able to use it for /vr/ but it'll make a nice stand for my XBR910.

>>1903669
Whoops.

ok, I don't have a retro console, but what emulation setup could I use that looks good on a CRT if this is possible?

>>1903737
Any emulator, just set it to 1x and disable bilinear filtering. If you want, you can also set it to 1:1 pixel aspect ratio and use your monitor to resize it.

>>1903564

>>1903737
Depends on the CRT display.
If a TV of some sort, what >>1903746 said will pretty much work.
If it's a PC monitor of some kind (not HD CRT either, as those stretch the image, as well), then >>1903019 works.

>>1903981
Or if you just want 240p, you can double the refresh rate at 320x240.

>>1903451
>>1903465
>RF only
>black plastic case which is common in the 90s
I always laugh whenever i see that.
I saw once a Grundig from the early 80s with RGB capable SCART. It was like 14".
But the only RF-only ones i saw were made of quality wood and valve tubes.

>>1885284
find the focus pot on the inside, it will give either center convergence or outer convergence as you turn it. Find a good middle ground.

>>1903019
u wut m8?

>>1904940
i use this mode for 240p instead

>>1904949
and this mode for PSP games combined with RemoteJoyLite

Are the modern CRT's worth anything for retro gaming? A friend of mine said he has a Trinitron KV-21FT1B, which seems to be made in the 2000's. Should I pick it up?

>>1904987

If it's an HDTV, then no.

>>1905067
I don't think it is, at least from what I can gather from the service manual online. Manufacture year looks to be 2000 sharp.

>>1904949

Setting the horizontal resolution really wide to something like 3840 or 3200 and scaling output to fit that gets rid of some issues with games that change horizontal resolution on the fly. Non-integer scaling issues aren't noticeable when they're too tiny for your monitor to resolve, and 3840 is a multiple of some common horizontal widths used by games so it's avoided much of the time anyway.

I also use that while applying shaders that apply some horizontal signal blur, color adjustment, and conditionally apply scanlines and interlacing based on the vertical resolution of the input image. That last part needs 480p resolution.

Does anyone have experience with scratch removal from a crt?

I've already tried the toothpaste method. I was thinking about trying NOVUS POLISH #2.
Opinions?

>>1904987
If by '2000's you mean like '2004', then it's fine. Anything SD is fine.

>>1905229
Scratch on the anti-glare coating? Take a plastic scraper/spatula and scrape the rest off.

Scratch on glass? Probably no easy way to deal with it.

Sup guise
Lucked into this multiscan 15kHz-capable TV/monitor at a thrift store
Only problem is it can't maintain vertical deflection when it's cold. RGB input mode doesn't collapse as fast. Eventually it will hold in any input mode.

I love this thing, is there hope? Toshiba timm Mm20e45

>>1905336
Well yeah, "modern" in this case means exactly that, made in the year 2000, as in, not in the 80's / 90's. I've read different opinions about a flat screen CRT vs. a tube, so I'll pick it up and see the quality for myself.

>>1882630
I have one of those, it looks fucking amazing running at 240p, even with composite. Running at higher resolutions still looks great, but it doesn’t, look nearly as good once you've gotten used to the crystal-clear edges and scanlines of 240p video

>>1906343
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBlP_T0voy4

This is how you fix it.

>>1898902
Me again.

So. After looking at the dot pitch for the monitor (supposedly .3 mm), and then looking at the screen dimensions (http://www.ampronix.com/content/web/sony_bvm20f1u_specs.asp)), and doing a quick calculation, this tells me that the BVM20F1U supports an aperature grille with 1286 2/3 x 970 possible dots on the TV. Or in a more friendly aspect ratio: 1280x960.

Does this mean that you could output at these resolutions if you had the right decoder? As in, there's no physical limit that prevents you from utilizing as sharp a picture as you can get on this TV? If so, this TV is technically an EDTV and could even do 720i under 16:9 mode.

Dont mean to be solicity but the guy who sold me my PVM 2530 has 4 PVM20M2 for sale for $110 each in the South Jersey area. The guy is an electronics genius and an engineer.

email me and I'll give you the contact info. hope no one takes this the wrong way, just trying to get monitors in the homes of people who will appreciate them

>>1906851
email is quiethumor at gmail dot com

>>1906851
Wish I could find someone local in Seattle selling that low. Bah.

I can get my hands on a sony PVM-20M4A for $20aus. Audio is stuffed, but I can buy speakers I guess, worth the plunge?

>>1907428
I always disable the audio on my TVs because it's never any good anyways. For $20 in any currency it would be a no brainer. I just bought a PVM-20M4U on eBay for $125+115 USD for shipping because it was the cheapest one i could find for months.

>>1907428
These things are only going to have mono audio in most cases, so buying speakers is something you'd likely end up doing anyway.

My crt is malfunctioning on me and I don't know what to do because I've been looking all over town and I can't seem to find any crt tvs. Pawn shops, salvation army, dump, nowhere to be found. Is there any modern tv that I could get that wouldn't be completely terrible? I mean as long as the input lag isn't awful I'm fine with playing nes games on a newer tv. I just want to play my games again.

>>1907207
There's someone on the Seattle CL with a PVM that's trying to sell it for $250 which is complete BS. I'd try to jew him down to $100, honestly. It's worth that much.

UME, 320x240@120hz

Neo Geo AES, Extron Andora, 640x480@60hz

Neo Geo AES, Extron Andora, 640x480@60hz

>>1908347
Funny, a few months ago a medical PVM popped up in "West Seattle" (I think in Ballard) for $100. I had the money in my hand and the owner called it off.

>search for pvms online
>no less than 90 fucking euro

why the fuck do i have to live in europe. everything costs a shit ton here, goddamit why Why WHY

i have a shitty ass schneider CRT tv with scart and RF. I'll probably have to stick with that until i find one for not all my fucking money

>>1909954

Which country in Europe? Sometimes there are PVMs that appear and that cost less than 60 € in France.

>>1910017
Same here in The Netherlands. They just get sold in a relatively short time, but they do keep appearing.

question :
what kind of video output do most arcade machines use, vga ? or is it hardwired or what ?
just curious to see how they differ from the home consoles

>>1910032

>vga

VGA isn't a video signal.

Anyway, arcade machines mostly use RGB (vector arcade games excepted). Most of the time, the Red, Green, Blue, and Sync wires of the JAMMA ports (or whatever port the cabinet uses) is hardwired to the driver board of the CRT.

Should I pay to have my PVM calibrated or try the 240p test suite? How much £ does calibration usually cost?

>>1910017
Italy. It's like the shithole of shitholes.

I could do with a PVM for 60 bucks i guess though, maybe i'll skip next month's purchases to get one

>>1910257

>the shithole of shitholes.

Naah, you guys used to make really good stuff (you guys made the very-first micro-computer, 10 years before we did the first micro-computer with a CPU instead of discrete logic and TTL chips with the Micral).

>>1910307
>used to

that's the problem, unfortunately

don't ever come here, ever

i just want a CRT to play vidya with and to forget all the suffering that my engineering studies bring

>>1910314
tfw i know the feels italianbro, i will never have a decent CRT monitor, even the mediocre ones are all shot to death, my trinitron barely works.

>>1910345
hold me

eh, i'll just order a german monitor when i have enough d0sh