/vr/ - Retro Games

>Is it wrong for me to like filters?
Yes, it is. Very, very wrong.

>>1614725
>Is it wrong for me to like filters?

No. Play them as you want. Don't listen to people who just love to be angry.

>do you do any enhancement (scanlines)?

I only NTSC filter, everything else looks too dramatic for my taste.

I like ntsc filters, don't ask me why.

>>1614737
>use

Well, it's getting late.

>enhancement
Let's be honest here: the correct word is "distortion".

NTSC > Billinear filtering > 25% scanlines > no filters > the rest is shit

No it isn't.

>>1614725
It's on you but honestly you just can't turn pixels into vectors

I've yet to see an example of a game that made me go WOW that is definitely better with the pixels smoothed out

>>1614725
I can't stand the "original" in your pic. It's way too blocky, especially on an LCD, the game didn't actually look like that back when I played it as a kid, so I have to have a general filter to just smooth out those edges. But the other two you posted are horrible. They just outright distort it. I just use a light blur, whatever one that is called. Pic related is how I do it.

>>1614725
Yes, it is. If you hate seeing pixels so much, why don't you just go play a 3D game instead?

Jinc upscaling works quite well when anti-ringing is implemented

>>1614948
Jesus, how can you stand to look at that?

>>1614954

How can you stand to look at blocky aliased nearest neighbor upscaling?

>>1614725
>Is it wrong for me to like filters?
Some are great, but those HQ/XBR/EAGLE/SAI ones etc are garbage.

>>1614940

3D games have pixels too

>>1614940

I'm using a CRT and don't see any pixels.

>>1614725

No, I could care less who wants to use filters. The problem is that these threads are just a cover for RetroArch spam. You (or someone) posts 50+ fucking screenshots all clearly labeled "RetroArch" in a vain attempt to advertise this software to /vr/ despite our numerous insistence that we have no interest in it. After the spammers fill up their 500 topic, they turn around and create yet another one with the same copy-and-paste contents.

>>1614862

And so it begins...

>>1615012

So are screencaps starting with "RetroArch" going to be /vr/'s "vlcsnap" now?

lol

>>1615012

What the fuck are you going on about?

You sound like a stark raving lunatic talking about this out of the blue.

>>1615012
>could care less

How much less could you care?

>>1615020
He's the resident anti-retroarch shitposter. Squarepusher must have raped his dog or something.

>>1615012

>posts 50+ fucking screenshots all clearly labeled "RetroArch

Maybe because
1. RetroArch has the most filters/shaders of anything out there thanks to having a large library of Cg shaders
2. That's put into the filename of the screenshots it produces, so obviously someone is USING it to TAKE SCREENSHOTS, who would'vethunk it?

But keep spouting these off topic conspiracy theories about "spamming" or "viraling" with no proof, it makes your posts seem really sane.

What about filters than modify colors?

>>1615012
Enjoy your guaranteed reply's every time, poster.
Does it ever get boring?

I don't really use them at all other than to mess around with, the ones that are supposed to simulate the effect of a TV don't do it for me. If you like it though, more power to you.

I'm pretty sure I saw a screenshot of Yoshi's Island with a filter similar to this. I'm not sure what you call this, though. I thought it looked nice.

>>1615009
Exactly. If you're using a modern LCD screen on the other hand it looks like it's made out of legos.

>>1614954
By not being a hipster.

>>1614725
Nah. I usually do the "TV Mode" filter if the scan lines are tolerable

With games I really like though, I don't even bother. It's only when the graphics start to hurt my eyes that I fuck around with filters

>>1614725
Other thing I need to say: while playing with filters is okay, you should probably take them off for screenshots you want to show other people. They don't look as good as the original graphics if they're not moving

>>1614725
Filters like this only look good from very far away, like the thumbnail. Up close (i.e. actually playing the game) it turns into blurry shit because your brain is supposed to filter the pixelated image by itself.

I don't give a fuck if someone uses filters, but I don't, because I am not obsessed over fucking graphics like everyone else seems to be.

Guess that's what happens when you were raised on Pong and the Atari 2600, you actually care about gameplay over graphics.

>>1615012
>that we have
>we
Nothing disgusts me quicker than some faggot perpetuating some 4chan maymay hivemind

>le le le le board culture
I like /vr/ but none of you faggots will tell me how to live my life and I wont yours

>>1615884

CRT Hyllian

I own a Trinitron and its definitely not the same of course but it still looks right to me

ITT comic sans: the game

>>1614725

Nah do what you like. Every one of the pictures in your post looks awful though. That isn't what it looked like back in the day.

I use NTSC with pretty heavy color bleed and 50% scanlines, personally. Seems legit to me. Or if not, what my mind remembers as legit.

Honestly, I found my tastes by messing around with Blargg's NTSC until the game looked like the screenshots of the game you saw on the box and manual. Sort of a highly-exaggerated version of what they actually looked like, with RF bleed and artefaction and noise and shit.

What can I say? I like vinyl too because I find the imperfections sweet and human.

>>1615976
>I like vinyl
Way to discredit yourself.

1/2

2/2

>>1615962

>>1616020

>>1616006

I kinda like this filter

>>1615293
This is the only acceptable filter

>>1616042
No, it's belongs to the worst category - novelty filters. It's somehow even more terrible than scanlines and curvature.

>>1616038
There are insufferable black lines between every fucking dot.

who the fuck wants to play some stamp-sized pixely bullshit? I prefer my games full hd and that's that. also, when the graphics get vectorized in real time, there's no quality loss if you're playing even on a 8K monitor.

get with the times

>>1616134
Nice.

>>1616137
>implying GBC had curved screens
>or scanlines

what the fuck am I watching

>>1616146
I just wanted to make an image of similar quality to the vectorized one.

>>1616149

okay
it still looks better though, get rid of the curvature and it'd be "10/10 what the authors originally intended"

>>1616048
Looks exactly like the original GB screen. Pretty cool I´d say.

Shaders are controversial because there's no perfect tv shader. Most people used Shadowmask CRT TVs. They have a special raster to reduce the lines. It produces a slight amount of blur in exchange. I love them.

Few people had aperture grille tvs. They have strong lines. I consider them weird looking.

Until we get shadowmask crt shaders no one will agree on anything. We need more resolution for this though.

>>1616001

>like something
>be discredited

I'm hipster scum, etc? I know this doesn't help, but I had a pretty sizable collection of vinyl long before every tryhard douchebag in every tryhard movie and TV show had to like vinyl records at some point.

>>1616006
>>1616008

That's pretty much how I like mine too. Slightly more color bleed, and I don't into the whole CRT curvature thing.

>>1616137

And yet as stupid as it is this looks way better than the vectorized vomit above it.

>>1615142
Adjusting for over saturation, due to shitty dark advance screen doesn't sound like a filter to anyone

>>1616854
>just likes collecting vinyl
>not because of it being a lossless format
he's right, your a shitty hipster

>>1615916
>>1615938

>>1614948
Looks like shit. Do like >>1614937.

I like how misleading OPs pic is. The "original" never looked like that back then. Plugging the game on a CRT will hide the pixels just fine without making it look smeary like those HQ filters do.

Despite what emulator-educated indie games devs and their fans think, "pixel art" was never a thing on consoles.

>>1617318

>>1617339
Why do people keep posting this dumb image? What you see on the left IS what the game actually looks like. What you see on the right is the same as the left except through a filter.

This also isn't even getting into the discussion of different TVs. You know they're not all the same, right?

>>1617339
Wow, the grass on the TV looks blue. What the fuck were the devs thinking?

>>1616854
>i liked it before it was cool
Really? REALLY?!

It's just the CRT interlaced halation filter that came with retroarch. Modified to get rid of the "screen tilt", which just looked odd to me.

Also have another preset that doesn't have the curvature. I find some games like better with the curved screens, and some don't. Maybe it's just me.

I honestly don't give a fuck about "what the developers intended". I just use filters for the hell of it. At the end of the day. the game is still the fucking same.

>>1617342
>What you see on the left IS what the game actually looks like.

It's scaled like x4 though with nearest neighbor.

>What you see on the right is the same as the left except through a filter.

That filter is called a "crt tv". You sort of need those to view things. How exactly else would you view a famicom game in the 80's or 90's? This IS how the games looked. Well, if you were really close to the screen.

>This also isn't even getting into the discussion of different TVs. You know they're not all the same, right?

There's lots of variation. But they're all better at displaying SD games than some shitty LCD

>>1617345
>Wow, the grass on the TV looks blue. What the fuck were the devs thinking?

It's two shots from different areas silly. I was too lazy to do it properly. One is outside in battle the other is inside in a temple.

>>1617357
>That filter is called a "crt tv".

I know what it is, ding dong. You know the word filter can be used in more contexts than emulation, right?

>>1617353

Curvature is kinda dumb.

Also it's dumb that you need to use interger scaling. That ruins CRT shaders for me. I don't remember black bars at the top or bottom of the screen on my tv.

>>1617361
I know, it was just a joke. :3

>>1617364
>I don't remember black bars at the top or bottom of the screen on my tv.

I don't think the guy you're responding to cares. He seems to use filters to make the game look better in his opinion, not to emulate TVs of old.

>>1614961
It looks blury as fuck, it's painful to watch, literally

>>1617372

Fullscreen or bust.

>All this scanline/retrofag purism

Lighten up guys, I uronically think filters are fucking gorgeous.

>>1617384
That actually looks kinda ok. All filters have pathological cases though, and in most games one will turn up at some point. Whether you like filters or not is mostly how willing to accept that you are.

>>1617361
>Trying to cover up the dev's fuckup this badly

I can recognize the difference between blue grass and water

>>1617342
> What you see on the left IS what the game actually looks like.

Sorry but no, you will never get output like that out of a real NES

>>1617364
I guess.

I also don't remember my TV looking like a Windows 7 window.

I also don't remember playing SNES games with a third party gamepad that is basically just a dualshock.

It's whatever. If I want to perfectly play games the way they were played back in the day, I would just dig out my CRT and my old consoles. And maybe hang up some old Iron Maiden posters and listen to Metallica on my walkman to really nail that early 90's feel. But that's a pain in the ass. I use emulators for convenience, so something like this is good enough for me.

>>1617393
>Sorry but no, you will never get output like that out of a real NES

Irrelevant

The sprite itself looks like what you see on the left. That's what the artists made.

>>1617350

More like 'I liked it before it had been flogged the fuck to death in everything' but I can see why you would respond that way.

>>1617364

That's your LCD's fault for having a retarded native vertical resolution that isn't a multiple of 240.

>>1617397

No what's on the left is a bunch of squares that happen to look like the actual graphics due to being based on raw VRAM translated to bitmap image then upscaled 4x or more.. What the "actual graphics" are depends on what your display does with low resolution signals.

>>1617403
>I liked it before it became ubiquitous
That's just a wordier way of saying "I liked it before it was cool."

>>1617410

There's also problems like the raw VRAM being too bright because the video encoder was expected to ramp gamma or adjust colors in some way before being output to the TV. In the NES's case, the colors are entirely determined by how the TV decodes NTSC color, so that shot on the left is not the real graphics at all.

>>1617417
To add to this, the N64 is a particularly good case. Very often what is on the VRAM does not correspond to what is actually output to the screen due to the VI filters that are added afterwards.

The left shot is the raw VRAM image. The right shot is what you would actually see.

>Is it wrong for me to like filters?

No, not at all. It's all personal preference. It also really depends on the game. Some look all smudged and muddy with filters, others make look better (Yoshi's Ilsand, for example.)

For the most part, I hate them, though.

I use Scale4x. Also, does anybody know some Android emulators that support filters?

>>1617621
[opinion]That's so unpleasant.[/opinion]

>>1617621
Retroarch is on Android.

>>1617621
It doesn't work for Ristar at all, the graphics are already too good on that game.

>>1614725
Wrong? Yes.
Can you like them anyway? Yes.
Any fucks given? No.

>>1617395

How did you turn the black border off? I can't figure out how.

>>1617702

Its windowed anon are you blind?

>>1617713

What? When I use the Halation filter, I get a black, rounded border on the edges that's meant to simulate the border of paint on most CRTs that was used to cover up overscan. That screenshot has it removed.

>>1617719

oh you mean the curvature?
isn't there just a non curved variation?
otherwise you have to edit the shader which is probably not that hard but I don't know the exact code you will have to change

>>1617732

>oh you mean the curvature?

No. Don't talk about things you don't understand.

>>1617702

I just edited the shader so it doesn't curve. The black border in the curved screenshot is because of the curvature. A rounded box can't fit neatly inside of box with straight borders, so there's empty space. No way around that.

>>1617759

Jesus.

I have curvature turned off. Do you see the black border?

>>1617763

That looks like the corners are curved, m8.

>>1617767

Nope. The corners were curved until I turned curvature off. The border is a separate effect. What shader are you using exactly? This is crt-interlaced-halation.

>>1617769

I'm using the same one. I just changed some of the settings myself.

Don't know exactly what you did to yours.

>>1617781

Well could you tell me which settings you changed?

>>1617787
Go to the file crt-interlaced-halation-pass2.cg

These are the parameters you want:
const static float2 angle = float2(0.0,-0.0);
static float cornersize = 0.001;
static float cornersmooth = 1000.0;

Those are the only things I changed. Removes the screen tilt, and you shouldn't have any curved corners.

I usually use bilinear filtering.

>>1617808
You're scum

>>1617808
The issue with pure bilinear is it makes everything look unfocused and diffused, especially at higher scales. There are better ways to smooth out pixels IMO.

>>1617798

Thank you, that worked.

I've never been able to find a filter that makes 240p games look like they do on a nice CRT, with sharp scanlines that seem to glow a bit.

>>1617831
That would be the very shader the two anons have been discussing for the last couple of posts above you.

https://github.com/libretro/common-shaders/blob/master/crt/crt-hyllian.cg

This one is quite nice, too.

>>1617831
My CRT doesn't even have scanlines being that much apparent. It's a shadowmask CRT and it's gorgeous. Emulators just add some lines to the image and it doesn't look anything like it. I just use 1:1 scaling when emulating on my PC.

>>1617819
If you play PS1 games on a PS3, you have the option to enable bilinear filtering, and I find it makes games look better.

Maybe it's just something with the PS1 emulation.

>>1617846
I find bilinear filtering is a bit more acceptable for low-res 3D games, since it acts like crude anti-aliasing, sort of.

For 2D, however, ugh.

>>1617621
Retroarch does it, but it slows the whole thing down really badly from my experience.

The .Emu series of emus is experimenting with new filters now, just got a shitty hqx. It does though have linear and scanlines to use.

>>1617874
That's because RetroArch uses GPU-bound shaders as opposed to CPU-bound filters, and mobile GPUs are either shit or have shit drivers. They are adding regular old filter support, however, so we'll see how that fares.

>>1616146
>Game boy player
>Super game boy 2

>>1617920
The Game Boy Player only outputted 480i or 480p, so no scanlines there. The Super Game Boy, however, does output 240p.

>>1617928
Wait, so CRT TVs that output 480i do not have scanlines? I thought scanlines were how CRT TVs showed the picture. Even 1080i CRT did them.

>>1617934
I don't remember scanlines on any TV I ever owned. Ever.

>>1617951

Well I don't remember being born but I'm still pretty sure that happened

>>1617835

>That would be the very shader the two anons have been discussing for the last couple of posts above you.

>interlaced halation
>interlaced

No, that shader tries to emulate the 480i look.

>crt-hyllian
>This one is quite nice, too.

Yeah, lots of scanlines here.

>>1617978

you're doing it wrong
it must be set to nearest otherwise it doesn't work properly

>>1617981

Ah, I'm retarded, thanks. That still looks pretty interlaced, though. I need MORE SCANLINES.

>>1617934
When I said scanlines, I was referring to the "black lines". Technically, that term is incorrectly applied, as scanlines actually refers to the lines that have actual video information (some times known as raster lines), but for whatever reason the black gaps in between them typically seen with low resolution signals came to be known as scanlines in popular speak.

Anyway, all CRT SDTVs are 480i, but when you output 240p to them, some of them (particularly big sets and Trinitrons) have the "black lines". However, if you output 480i, you'll just get interlacing instead, and as such there'll be no black lines.

>>1617978
>No, that shader tries to emulate the 480i look.

You don't know what you're on about. The interlacing only kicks in if the video input in over 400 lines. Otherwise it's scanlined.

>>1617993
Do you even know what interlacing is?

>>1617951

Unless you're like 12, you almost certainly had a TV with scanlines.

>>1618139
Unfortunately, if he was born in 1996 he could have "not seen" SD scanlines (satellite+early adopters) and would be 18.

Welcome to old, my friend. We've been waiting for you.

>>1618157

28 isn't old. But I understand what you mean.

Sorry filtards, but this is how the developers intended the game to look like.