/vr/ - Retro Games

That's probably the most retarded filter/shader I've seen on a PS1 game.
You really want to emulate the shitty rounding that bad CRT TV's had? How tryhard can you get.

>>1514783
I have seen some shit but this shader is ridiculous.

Is there a filter that simulates discoloration defects from poorly shielded speakers?

>>1514787
>>1514783

You can turn off the curvature. The main appeal of CRt Geom Halation is to provide better upscaling than nearest neighbor. It is aiming to provide a similar visual quality to a CRT tv.

What /vr/ taught me is that emulator filter enthusiasts are exactly like extreme fetishists, and there's no way (or reason) to argue with them.

Yes, the scanline-and-curvature filter in >>1514778 is fucking hideous to me, but so is vore porn, yet there are plenty of vore fetishists online. Yes, >>1514801 is on the general level of babyfur, but some people just like those kinds of things due to some weird or unfortunate events in their childhoods.

But still, I've never encountered this particular kind on Internet crazyness until /vr/ became a thing last year.

>>1514821
What filter should I get if I like vintage porn? I'm thinking black and white with lot of grain.

>>1514834
The Marilyn Monroe shader is a good option.

>>1514821
>Yes, the scanline-and-curvature filter in >>1514778 (OP) is fucking hideous to me,

You're not understanding it or the goals.

PS1 cannot do 3D that well. It took a lot of shortcuts. When you upscale that in an emulator, it makes those issues become more exaggerated. If you've ever run a PS1 emulator in HD, you'll know what I mean. Distorted polygons, jittering textures. Also the HLE plugins simply remove dithering, which many PS1 games, especially 3D ones used for shading. The games look much brighter and too clean.

So the answer to this, is a native resolution high accuracy software renderer, such as Mednafen or GPU bladesoft. Now our modern digital displays aren't native resolution, so the question of how to scale that to the display comes up. There's nearest neighbor but that preoduces a lot of jaggies. CRT shaders like CRT Geom

Yes, the 3D can look better upscaled, but it causes issues. And upscaling does nothing for 2D, and 2D/3D games are common in this era. Shaders like this then are a nice middle ground. And, when viewed from a distance it produces an image similar in quality to original hardware + CRT SDTV.The black lines are not supposed to be seen at all, and aren't if you move a bit away from it.

There's also several different variations of CRT Geom, such as CRT Geom sharpness such as this. The shader can be edited heavily as well.

This is CRT Geom Sharpness.

Shaders are important also because as display resolution increases, the quality of shaders will also increase. CRT Geom is just the start.

>>1514821
Why are pixels purists so bitchy about people using filters? It seems like this started when people would bitch when someone posted a screenshot with Super2xSai or hq4x or a similar filter, and soon enough it became "cool" to hate all filters and use only "pure" nearest neighbor upscaled.

>>1514974
Because those filters look like shit.

>>1514980
No they don't

>>1514983
Except that they do.

>>1514974
It's "stop liking what I don't like" in its purest form. I always just tell them to shut the fuck up and kept using the filters I felt like using.

>>1514989
>close up pics of sprites to try and make filters look worse than they actually are

Nice try. "Pure" nearest scaling will look ugly too when you do that.

>>1514980
>>1514983

Smoothing shaders are a misguided effort. At least how they are currently done.

>They produce an overly round look to the graphics, which only occurs with these shaders. Turns many purists off
>Introduces tons of false positives and errors
>

I think the technology is perfectly fine however. This is an example of 2 xbr, where the image is scaled by nearest neighbor by 2 first and then the shader is applied. It is a huge improvement over just using 2 xbr alone. Not perfect. But this is the kind of direction I'd like to see smoothing shaders go. They have the potential to do the same things as blur, but while keeping the image sharp.

Trying to make games perfectly smooth is a fool's errand.

Btw, to do this, you use the following shader settings in RetroArch:

Stock
Nearest
2x

xbr/2xbr-v3.8b.cg
Nearest
2x

Stock
Linear
Don't Care

I'll try this but with x3 nearest soon.

>>1514989
Except that's an exaggerated example and not indicative of what filters actually look like.

It seems like posting exaggerated shots of filters is a constant meme in these threads in an attempt to try and prove that all filters are shitty.

>>1514989
>yay I posted this pic again!!!

>Kamiya on Shaders

>>1515010
>>1514996

Nearest neighbor just looks pixilated. Smoothing shaders create false positives and distortions.

That's the reason why I like >>1515003 more. By having the shader try to do less, it causes fewer problems. That's why I think someone should try to create a smoothing shader that is very, very weak. Even weaker than this.

This image is a standard smoothing shader. The distortions from the original are pretty big. I suspect that smoothing shader advocates have just gotten used to it.

It has a kind of vector graphics look to it that I don't like.

>>1515019
I'm pretty sure he's talking about bilinear filtering there. bilinear only works well if it's applied after scaling by nearest neighbor to the highest integer scale factor

>>1515026

Possibly.

But he is confirmed to prefer CRTs to digital displays for Retro games.

>>1514974
Actually I don't see this outside of 4chan very much, most of the time on emulator forums people talk about filters without anyone shitting on them for liking them.

>using any kind of filter even when a real console used one

>>1514974
Use whatever filters you want and circlejerk about them.
What I don't like to see is people posting ridiculously bloated images in other threads instead of unscaled, unfiltered screenshots that the emulators should be capable of.

whoops

>>1515083
>Actually I don't see this outside of 4chan very much

This surprises you? Other places have an easier time accepting that not everyone does things like them.

As anonymity increases, the capacity for empathy and understanding decreases. I don't use filters or shaders, but if I did, no one IRL would bitch at me the way the do on 4chan. They might, at the most, say something like, "Bro that's kinda ugly." and then get on with the rest of their day.

>>1515102

more like people just don't say anything to save face

>>1515097
I like it better that way

>>1515197
I think the characters and HUD are nicer-looking and clearer, but the environments need higher-res textures.

Shaders, hm?

Yeah, I kinda fancy that.

>>1515045
>>1515053

I like the scanlines but the smoothness just feels unnatural to me. I only use scanlines to help bring me back to when I used to spend all day in front of the SNES as a shithead kid

that and I don't have a CRT

>>1514989
A little trick I like to do is to enable the HQ 2x filter, then resize the screen to the native resolution so it creates automatic anti-aliasing.

>>1514993
>It's "stop liking what I don't like" in its purest form
Related pic describes your passive-aggressive stock phrase.

There's a few holdouts on this website who really take critical opinions personally.

Also, you have no authority whatsoever to order people to "shut the fuck up"-- something tells me the only one who deserves silence is you.

>Captcha: andsons decadence

>muh authenticity: the thread

>>1515509

Some of the features are trivial, but most of shaders is about adapting SD games to HD screens.

basically there are better ways to scale than nearest neighbor.

>>1515509

To be fair today IS National Autism Awareness Day

>>1515512
The main issues with nearest neighbor are non-square pixels and non-integer scaling.

retroarch has interesting shaders

this guy has the best scanline + curvature combo:
http://postback.geedorah.com/archivo.html

>>1515520
>The main issues with nearest neighbor are non-square pixels and non-integer scaling.

No, the main issue with nearest neighbor is that you're scaling to begin with. The games look best on CRTs since they have no scaling. 240p on a CRT TV/Monitor is glorious. Shaders are trying to maintain that level of quality on other displays.

>>1515585

Interesting.

Is there a download? What format is the shaders in?

>Virtual Reality console simulation
>Nintendo Power, Sega, Terminator, Nirvana, MAD Magazine, etc. posters on the wall
>play on one of those shitty, tiny CRT TV sets
>have to turn the TV and console on manually, then navigate backwards from channel 1 through FRONT, AV-OUT 2 and finally to AV-OUT 1 and put the sound up
>loud high-pitched squeal constantly coming from TV
>muffled, monaural audio from a tiny speaker at the back of the set
>game will occasionally crash or refuse to boot, forcing you to blow into the cartridge to continue
>dust will accumulate on the screen over time, which you must wipe off occasionally
>screen glare from sunlight and visible dust particles until you close the blinds
>you can see your own 10 year old reflection
>your mother will occasionally tell you to go outside and play with your friends
>you must let your annoying little sister play every 20 minutes, or she will get mad and your console privileges will be taken away for a day

THIS IS THE FUTURE I'VE ALWAYS DREAMED OF

>>1516196
If it's virtual reality, I want the best TV there is.

>>1515585

Pretty sure that's not a shader and was added to the screenshot after the fact.

>>1515197

me too

>>1514974
Coz they're mental and can't accept the fact that some people don't like big chunky razor sharp pixels.

>>1516740
>>1516937
Holy fuck those are awful.

>>1515506
Recently played Earthbound for the first time all the way through using that exact filter. It was rad and i had a good old time.

>filters
>general
Holy fuck, two cancers combined.

>>1515506
Now I actually like that. And I don't care.

>>1516196
for added effect you could play with one of these, with a light slather of honey beneath the buttons to make them stick

>>1517019

smearing and blurring it won't make the quality any better

>>1517067
Leave /vr/.

>>1514778
>>1515506
My main gripe with filters like these is that the scanlines on CRTs do not follow the curvature of the screen like these - the scanlines are usually much straighter.

It's like whoever made these filters didn't even look at a CRT.

Dot matrix master race

>>1519756

You can modify curvature to whatever you want to, or remove it entirely.

>>1517067

Some of them are bad, but the quest to adapt SD games to HD screens is valid. The main problem actually is lack of pixels. If we had very ultra super duper HD screens, like around 8000p, we could make perfect shadowmask shaders and it would look exactly like a shadowmask CRT. That's many years away of course. But we are getting higher resolutions screens, such as 4K standard.

Until then, we will have to do with these half-measures.

>>1520473
>it would look exactly like a shadowmask CRT
Not unless it has black frame insertion or scanning backlight

>>1520480

Well, I meant just in terms of a still image.

For similar motion, yes. You would need 120hz or higher, and black frame insertion hacks to get 60hz style CRT motion.

>>>/vg/64571961

Sharing with this thread in case anyone is interested in getting their PC CRT monitor to output seamless 240p and 480i switching at 480p output resolution using shaders.

>>1516740
>>1516937

Mario hardly benefits much from point filtered textures. Some games on the other hand...

>>1522196

>>1522197

>>1522198

>>1522196
Are the any options to improve the text rendering? One of the Kanji are barely recognizable and the text could generally look a lot nicer.

>>1522205

this isn't technically a filter or shader at all that you can edit or anything. It's just a N64 emulator option that turns off the forced bilinear hardware filtering the system applies to all textures usually. It basically turns the games into PSOne ports.

>>1522197
>>1522196

N64 sort of needs texture filtering.

>>1522209

In S&P's case I personally think it's an improvement actually. To each his own though.

>>1514960

Could somebody tell me more about this image? What game is it? What shader settings are used?

>cubed shader
>for a PS1 game

What always annoys me about these shaders is how far in one direction they'll do. It's either HEAVY SCALINES and BIG ROUND CURVED TVS, but never truly emulate what playing on a CRT really looks like.

>>1515031

>Bayonetta glasses

Silly goddamned dude he is.

>>1515003
This looks amazing, how do I replicate this?

>>1520009
>>1520006
>>1520001
The problem with dot matrix in SH1 is that it looks amazing in Other World but looks like horseshit in Mist World.

>>1522630

In RetroArch, load up the following shaders with the settings:

>Stock
>Nearest
>2x
>xbr/2xbr-v3.8b.cg
>Nearest
>2x
>Stock
>Linear
>Don't Care

Get RA from here (comes with shaders):
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/91sakv0qdyxjx9f/cGOfV7ZOKd

What it's doing is scaling by nearest neighbor x2, and then applying the shader. Scaling x3 would be even better.

I should create a preconfigured thing but I'm lazy.

>>1522637
>>1520006
>>1520001
>>1520009

HLE removes dithering. So that's no good. You guys are too used to your crappy HLE emulators.

>>1522638
Thanks, at first I didn't get it thinking it's some 9 pass filter but then I realized how retarded I am reading this and it's 3-pass.
Thanks a lot.
Too bad RetroArch is shit because it doesn't support cheats and has worst UI ever made since ZSNES.

>>1522641
Dot matrix is a very worthy replacement for the dithering in SH1.
I'm more pissed off about PPSSPP removing dithering in BOTH software and hardware rendering modes.
Dissidia and Metal Gear ACID simply look wrong without the dithering.

>>1522208
I was asking in general. Emulators can render the polygons in higher resolution so why not the text? It's not like they store it as inflexible sprites.

>>1522648
>It's not like they store it as inflexible sprites.

actually i think it does...

>>1522645
>Dot matrix is a very worthy replacement for the dithering in SH1.

No it isn't. It's an even pattern across the screen. Real Silent Hill dithering is uneven, and is more in darker areas and non existant in clearer ones.

It's VERY heavy in the dark world and darker areas.

I'm too lazy to fire up SH1 now, but here is a pic from the net from a supposed real ps1.

>>1522664
>Supposed to look
On real PSX you'd be using a CRT TV which offsets the dithering, giving it a superior shading without all that pixel dithering actually being visible to the naked eye.
tl;dr when emulating Dot Matrix is a better option of the two if you ain't using a CRT TV.

>>1522672
>On real PSX you'd be using a CRT TV which offsets the dithering, giving it a superior shading without all that pixel dithering actually being visible to the naked eye.

This is where shaders come in that replicate composite. There is not a perfect blargg shader yet, but Maister has one, and there are other ones such as GTU that can blend dithering.

>tl;dr when emulating Dot Matrix is a better option of the two if you ain't using a CRT TV.

That doesn't follow. You're taking away shading, and replacing it with an even grid over the entire screen. It's simply not the same.

>>1522672
>without all that pixel dithering actually being visible to the naked eye
You obviously used shitty CRTs or composite connections. Dithering is clearly visible with good CRTs and RGB connections, and it looks better than way.

>>1522679

Due to how ubiqutous composite cables were, they were the assumed default in many places. Games that heavily used dithering assumed composite cables.

>>1522661
That would be a huge waste of space. Icon and other interface elements are sprites but text isn't usually prerendered.

>>1522687
The PC8801 which features dithering for almost everything expected you to use an analog RGB monitor.
Even strong blurring isn't able to remove all the dithering there.

>>1522707
I wouldn't have thought videogame designers would bother to make vector fonts unless they planned to use multiple font sizes in the game.

>>1520480
>Not unless it has black frame insertion or scanning backlight

Mine has scanning backlight.

>>1522717

Sweet lord in heaven, dat ass.

>>1522717
is that some kinda space harrier clone at the bottom?

>>1522219
It's Super Contra on Arcade.

>>1515083
>most of the time on emulator forums people talk about filters without anyone shitting on them
That's because most forums are moderated by people with esteem issues, so all communities are either 100% pro-filter or 100% anti-filter, and any argument to the contrary is subject to ban because "poster was too stupid to argue with".

On 4chan, meanwhile, you can say it like you see it. And, while we're at that, in the OP I see somethig truly ungodly.

>>1514957
>PS1 cannot do 3D that well.
Fake scanline and curvature of all things can not help with that, though. Emulators can and do introduce floating point in PS1 emulation, just like it does allow for more sprites in 8-bit emulation or emulation with no hardware-related slowdowns etc. - that is an actual improvement. The travesty in OP only makes it so much very worse. It's like a hideous rubber tit and lipjob on an ugly woman - it doesn't help, it makes it all worse - no matter how some weird people see it.

>>1522772
Alantia
http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/alantia/alantia.htm

>>1522756
Brand/model?

>>1522774

thanks

Can someone tell me how to put scanlines on zsnes like I'm a child?

>>1523232
It's under display under options or some shit. I don't remember.

>>1522678
>>1522664
>>1522641
I personally think the higher resolution makes up for the loss in dithering.

>>1523451

Well, I don't. I think games should try to preserve how they originally looked.

>>1522637
I don't think it looks THAT bad.

Though does truly shine in the Otherworld.

>>1522642

Are either of those things really that important in an emulator to make it shit or not? I would think the actual emulation and video/audio performance would be more important...

How do I remove the curvature from the Halation filter in Retroarch?

>>1523698

Add "//" before "#define CURVATURE"
>//#define CURVATURE

Also this is an interesting blur shader:

http://www.libretro.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=658

just turn off pass 7 (old tv border) and remove the curvature in crt-geom-interlaced.cg like in above. The border and curvature I think are trivial needless additions. but it aims to replicate blurry displays which use composite. It can blur the dithering.

>>1523709

Okay, now how about the TV border thing?

dumbest idea ever: is it possible to write a vertex/geometry shader for an emulator to apply smoothing to ingame geometry?

>>1515003
dear god that is hideous

>>1522784
>The travesty in OP
Settle down princess, It actually doesn't look that far off a proper 240p screenshot.

I'm not really see what's so bad about the OP, other than the tryhard curvature effect.

>>1524343
Agreed, I never played Vagrant Story before, but the screenshot reminded me of my TV at home.

>>1522212

paper mario looks good

>>1524343
No. There was no hyperbole in my post.

>>1516937
my god this looks so much worse than pic related

>>1514778
I like mednafen, is there some way to do this shit without retroarch, I really hate retroarch

>>1524684

No.

Also Mednafen itself has bad video/audio synch. RA has dynamic rate control which is the best ever.

>>1514821
What /vr/ taught me is that emulator anti-filter enthusiasts are exactly like extreme fetishists, and there's no way (or reason) to argue with them.

Yes, the raw unfiltered pixels are fucking hideous to me, but so is vore porn, yet there are plenty of vore fetishists online. Yes, >>1514801 is on the general level of babyfur, but some people just like those kinds of things due to some weird or unfortunate events in their childhoods.

But still, I've encountered this particular kind of Internet crazyness since retarded hipsters started showing up fourteen years ago.

>>1524693
Is there any way to make RA not insanely difficult to use/set up

>>1524803

I don't find it particularily difficult. RGUI is pretty simple. For most systems it's just load and play. The most major issues are with cuesheets and bios.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/v8zwpqavib1rc1b/RetroArch+BIOS.zip

Those are the bios you should be using by the way.

>>1514787
where is than image from
i think i've seen it before just can't remember the name.

>>1524803
What problems are you having, exactly? It's pretty simple.

>>1524803
The worst thing is having to edit the controls in notepad if you use a keyboard. Would it kill them to be less anti-keyboard?

Left blurry PS2 game with bilinear.

Right native resolution with CRT shader.

I think those screen curvature "CRT" filters are funny because my CRT-TV is a flatscreen.

>>1528756

Well, most of them have a glass in front that is flat. There is still a slight curve though.

>>1524417
>>1516937
>>1516740
How can I get it like this? I dislike the texture filtering and much prefer pixels.

>>1528794

1. Just so you know N64 has low resolution textures, and assumes some filtering.
2. Many Emus have the option of nearest neighbor filtering.
3. RetroArch's M64+ has 3-point bilinear, nearest, etc options.

>filters

Seriously though, its kind of funny how worked up some autists get over the things. Yes, those smoothed images of DKC or Yoshi's Island look terrible. But not mentioned is that those games also look terrible scaled to 1080p. The games are never going to look good unless you're playing them at proper resolution, so fooling around with shaders so that they look "better" to you is very reasonable. My personal preference is to just play games in a window so that the scaling is less crazy and the pixels aren't so huge.

>>1528991
>But not mentioned is that those games also look terrible scaled to 1080p. The games are never going to look good unless you're playing them at proper resolution, so fooling around with shaders so that they look "better" to you is very reasonable.
If you're not stretching shit and that "1080p" happens to be an integer multiple, then it looks exactly the same as the smaller resolution, just bigger.

>>1528794

i use project64 & glide64final graphics plugin

in settings, filter mode: "force point-sample" (aka nearest neighbor)

a lot of character models apparently aren't textured at all

>>1529010
Those edges...

Looks like it was cut out and photoshopped in.

If people have such a big problem with people using filters then why not play on a crt? it looks nicer on a crt.

>>1529010
>>1529019

How can people seriously think this looks better than this:

>>1529007
>>1529015

>>1529034

2d is much sharper, things with sprites and prerendered backgrounds look nice

3d objects / scenery that use textures generally are very pixelated

>>1529068

RA has 3-point bilinar which is less blurry than standard bilinear.

>>1529010
god that looks worse than Super Mario Kart

>>1529027

usually space is a factor. or in mine that since i'm studying the less stuff i have to lug around then the easier it is to move to better places if the need arises

>>1529027
because everyone has a CRT

>>1530643
everyone could get one, people are throwing them away by the ton atm

>>1530643

nah

>>1529034
It really depends on the game and how the textures are drawn. Some games were designed with blending in mind and the textures are well defined with lots of color contrast that look ugly without it.

For instance these games look great unfiltered
>mario games
>racing games
>zelda games

these games not so much
>most Rare games
>later titles like hybrid heaven
>dark and spooky games
>starwars games

Im even one of those old school guys that grew up with the glorious unfiltered textures of Time Crisis and all the great sega 32 bit arcade games of the era.

Its just preference.

>>1514778
>I use filters so my emulator can look like a console/CRT setup that would cost me $6
>Potato isn't just a number. It's a way of life

>>1532957
>Huge outdated and mostly useless crt
>making an all in one that plays everything and still looks good