/vr/ - Retro Games

They played System Shock and probably the beginning of Metroid Prime 1 and thought
>oh this is cool

>>11353620
Back when they made the orginial Doom PC hardware was very limited so they couldn't create a game like Doom 3 despite wanting.

Doom 64 is the real Doom 3

>>11353628
Makes sense to me: I had a harder time seeing in D64.

>>11353620
Because the trend in fps around 2004 was more realistic settings with interactive locations. They pivoted from a the run and gun boomer style to a atmospheric horror game where ostracized enemies on their own were an issue instead of hordes being the issue. And it's great. Probably my favorite doom along with doom64, it's also a retard and a poser filter.

>>11353621
More like Half Life. This is nothing like any System Shock.

That's how Doom was originally going to be, a fpv accion-horror game

>>11353620
Tim Wllits fucking sucks and should never have been hired by ID.

>>11353691
This.

>>11353658
pretty much this. people used to hate doom 3, but then nu doom came out and now suddenly you realize that doom 3 was actually genius
you definitely should play original with flash light, entire game's design was around it, later re-releases is revisionism that ruined it

>>11353658
It’s not as horde-heavy as 90s Doom could get, but most encounters still threw multiple enemies at you.

Original Doom wasn't a horror game, it was an action game that had a horror aesthetic. There's a big difference. It's supposed to have the same appeal as heavy metal music, which itself provides the background music of Doom. If somebody tells you with a straight face that the game where you can run at 60mph with a rocket launcher while metal plays was always supposed to be slow dull horror, you should rightfully laugh at them. Doom 3 is beyond mediocre.

>>11353743
>action game that had a horror aesthetic
That’s Doom 3.

>>11353743
>>11353767
>It's supposed to have the same appeal as heavy metal music, which itself provides the background music of Doom.
Forgot to mention it’s only “metal” a few more times in Episode 1 after E1M1: Kitchen Ace and Hiding the Secrets.
>Imps Song
>Dark Halls
>Suspense
>On The Hunt
>Demons on the Prey
>Sign of Evil
Not metal, not even heavy or fast beyond “On The Hunt”

>>11353620
doom 3 was good but has not a lot of replayability. other than that i still play it every few years and especially hell is KINO.

>>11353658
>Oh you prefer old Doom? Ok boomer
>For me it's Doom 3—a slow burn, bone chilling, atmosphere-oozing, trope-subverting craft from avant-garde post-horror auteurs Id Software, free of lazy jumpscares and cheap gore

>>11353883
>free of lazy jumpscares
Bitch, you've never played the game before, there's a shitload of jumpscares in the game.
>Get an item, walls suddenly open up with loud noise to have a ton of monsters ambush you
That happens so often in that game
In fact, look up Mesh plays doom

If you don't like Doom 3 - you're homosexual
If you like zoom cringeternal at the same time - you're a retarded homosexual

It's really that simple

The trend in the mid 2000s was for shooters to be boring, linear garbage. Doom wasn't immune to this.

It's Clive Barker's Half Life and it's bad.

>>11353923
“Clive Barker's Half Life” would be Clive Barker’s Jericho.
>released in 2007
Fuck. I was hoping it was at least 2008.

>>11353709
When Doom 2016 came out, Doom 3 became le “underrated gem”.
When Doom Eternal came out, Doom 2016 suddenly turned into a masterpiece because it let you mindlessly SSG spam the entire game.
When Doom The Dark Ages comes out, Doom Eternal will become a masterpiece.

Such is the eternal cycle of contrarian retards

>>11353941
>When Doom 2016 came out, Doom 3 became le “underrated gem”.
2016 and Eternal caused people to dunk on it even harder with popular opinions similar to >>11353917

>>11353658
>it's also a retard and a poser filter.

What the fuck?

>>11353941
People do it solely to disagree with you. It's a fact of the universe, you're being persecuted.

>>11353985
Retarded poser detected

>>11353620
Because Doom is about fast paced fps action

Doom 3 is trying to be an RPG with so much texts and shit going on you can't really pay attention - coincidentally the same reason the gta series since 4 have sucked

They wanted the survival horror game audience

>>11353620
Gee idk maybe because it doesn't have spirit halloween costumes running around to 80s gay metal

>>11353621
did Metroid Prime actually influence any other FPS games?

>>11353658
>instead of hordes being the issue
Games like Doom and especially Quake for the most part did not rely on large numbers, this was more than anything the realm of the Serious Sam games.

>>11353709
I like Doom 3 a lot, but I would not call it genius.

>>11353620
Its really a sequel to Doom 64 which is fine by me

>>11354103
Only Judas Priest was gay, and these figures are claymation.

>>11353941
I always liked Doom 3. Not as much as the classic games, but I still think it's a pretty fun game that's worth playing.
I also think that it has a lot of different flaws.

>>11353709
the remastered version ruins one of the expansion levels where the area is getting constantly teleported in and out of hell and when you are in hell you can see corpses fused to the wall and shit, it looks pretty neat in the bfg edition it just looks like another generic area and they covered one of the windows that let you see outside (where you could see you were in hell)

>>11354015
>its trying to be an RPG
are you retarded anon?

>>11354841
Some were puppets with painted latex skins, like for horror films.

>>11354015
this.

>>11353940
Jericho is more like Clive Barker's Call of Duty.
Doom 3 is still better than both Clive Barker shooters for what that's worth.

>>11355049
I wish there was a Hellraiser game.

>>11353658
>poser filter
It was almost unanimously hated when it came out.
You "like" it now because they're making new ones. Poser nignog.

>>11353941
Because the games have consistently gotten worse, which makes the previous games look better by comparison.
This is literally the way Doom works Doom 1>Doom 2>Doom 64> Doom 3> Doom 2016>Doom Enternal
Surely, whatever the nu nu nu game is will also be shit and make the previous game look better. It doesn't mean the game is actually better, but that the bar is just continuously lowered.

>>11355053
>It was almost unanimously hated when it came out.
the zoomer trying to rewrite history attacks again

>>11353620
because games need to evolve.

It's 10 years newer and done by a team that had all of the original creative force ripped out of it.
Only 10 years between this and the first one btw holy shit.

>>11355053
>It was almost unanimously hated when it came out.
There was criticism, and lots of it, but it was by no means fucking unanimously hated, not by a long shot.

>>11355138
Doom 64 is about as good as Doom 2.
Doom 3 is certainly flawed, but it's also a somewhat different game more akin to Half-Life than Doom.

>>11354015
>>11354901
Doom 3 is somewhat slower paced in its action, but there is nothing at all about it which is like an RPG.
There's mail and audio logs all over the place, but the thing is that you can ignore like +90% of them, they are just a way to score some more health and ammo.

>>11355232
You sound like such a pretentious prick when you say that.

>>11353743
The dark section of E1M2 was pretty scary as a lad.

>>11353676
It's a pre-bioshock PDA hunt. There's absolutely system shock influence.

>>11353709
2016 is so much better than 3 I don't know why you bother.

>>11355838
E2M6 is pretty spooky too, mainly the dark wood panel maze crawling with pinkies and barons.

>>11353941
/thread
it's always funny to see retards praising Doom 3 now when it was the reason why the franchise went dormant and was almost entirely redesigned into that cancelled Half-Life ripoff to begin with

>>11355789
That's why I said almost, genius.

>>11355974
"almost unanimously" isn't true in any sense.

>>11355232
>The evolution of a simple pick up and play first person shootemup is to turn it into a dark ass survival horror.

>>11353658
>Probably my favorite doom along with doom64, it's also a retard and a poser filter.
Unequivocally based. Scary horror is where Doom truly shines.

>>11355053
>It was almost unanimously hated when it came out.
You're full of shit. It was overwhelmingly well received with some complaints here and there. I doubt you were even alive in 2004. Fag.

>>11353658
based

>>11356187
The gunplay sucks dick, the showgun sounds like a metal bucket being dropped on the ground, the enemy designs are dogshit, the pacing is horrendous, the spooky-bathroom-mirror "horror" is subject of ridicule, the WADs in the BFG Edition are censored, the levels are overly linear with little exploration, and DOOM IS NOT A FUCKING SURVIVAL HORROR.
Not even the local doom general thread talks about it. Give it up, you stupid fucking retard.

>>11356187
The more controversial points back then were the flashlight and not being able to run forever, and there were easy fixes for both for anyone that became seriously tilted by them. Duct tape was out three days after release, I think.

>>11356207
>Not even the local doom general thread talks about it
There was some buzz for it around August and September during its 20th anniversary, namely with people discovering some mods and how easy it is to mod in general.

>>11353658
Who ostracized the enemies?

>>11356207
>The gunplay sucks dick, the showgun sounds like a metal bucket being dropped on the ground
The sound I think is bearable, what I hate about the shotgun is that it has an 80 degree spread from the muzzle and can only score a full hit at ejaculation distances.
The hand grenades are also completely shit and have an extremely awkward bounce.
Otherwise, the plasma, pistol, SMG, and rocket launcher are ok, the BFG is good, the chaingun is excellent, and the chainsaw is godly.

>the enemy designs are dogshit
Mixed IMO. Pinky and Hell Knight are very good designs, the Z-Secs are both good looking and a fun enemy to fight, the commandos look great, and they're tough yet not too harsh to handle either. Guardian looks great, and he's probably the best bossfight which iD Software has ever made.

>the pacing is horrendous
I think it's alright.

>the spooky-bathroom-mirror "horror" is subject of ridicule,
I'll agree on that, Doom 3's jumpscares are cheap and get old quickly.
Otherwise, it sometimes has pretty good spooky atmosphere, in part thanks to some very good ambient sound design.

>the WADs in the BFG Edition are censored
So fucking what? That's a much later re-release, and you should already have had the proper .wads before that.

>the levels are overly linear with little exploration, and DOOM IS NOT A FUCKING SURVIVAL HORROR.
Neither is Doom 3, you get loaded down with heavy ordnance on the regular and nothing really stops you from stomping every cunt you come across. If anyone has ever categorized Doom 3 as survival horror, then they're fucking wrong and gay.

>Not even the local doom general thread talks about it
Yes we do, it comes up on occasion, it just has a small mod scene relative to classic Doom.
So does Quake, Blood, Duke, Half-Life, Unreal, etc, yet those do get still brought up occasionally.
We're just primarily occupied with classic Doom, but we're also not a monolith, some like the game, some hate it.

>>11353620
It's a fun game. Take out the PDA locker code garbage and it's a straight up 9/10.

one of my steam friends has thousands of hours in this. he just plays the campaign on ultra nightmare or whatever the highest difficulty is endlessly, with some MP and RoE mixed in. He's a true treasure.

>>11353620
I think the engine and aesthetic is amazing and someone needs to make a new game with it
>>11356226

>>11356184
Show me the scary part of Doom 3.
>>11356187
None of the guys in my friend group liked it.

>>11354178
Geist

>>11356187
It was definitely not universally hated, but it wasn't universally loved either, there were complaints at the time even from people who liked the game.

>>11356915
>Show me the scary part of Doom 3.
The part where you go into the break room in the area with the metallic corridors, and when you go into it Satan turns the lights on and off, throws a stapler on the floor and spawns in an imp you can kill with 1 shot. Then he's all like "MUHAHAHAHAHA YOUR SOUL SUCKS DICK"

>>11353620
A lot of people say "DOOM 3 isn't a bad game, it's a bad DOOM game". No, it's just a bad game in general. Forget the DOOM license, take the game on its own merits, and try to rationalize this:
>it's an action-horror game by id, but is arguably the first in their catalog to have no gibs or permanent bodies (I realize this is a technical limitation, but it doesn't make it okay), which is standard for the genre regardless of id
>being a horror game, it tries to startle you, but relies so heavily on obvious monster closets that all tension is lost and you almost always know what to expect
>was clearly pressured by competing games of the time and added a bunch of retarded shit (NPCs ordering you around, audio logs, interactive objects with no real purpose except cool kid points, straight up minigames like the barrel claw machine, etc.)
>weapons feel soggy and lack good audio-visual feedback, with the shotgun in particular being nearly useless beyond point blank range and feels like blowing loads of tomato sauce with every shot)
>enemies are slow, stupid, and rarely appear in great enough numbers to pose any kind of significant threat
>ammo is plentiful and locker codes make it even more so (even in the original, non-BFG edition)
>storyline is filled with dumb movie tropes, right down to featuring Dr. Evil (no seriously, Betrüger means a bad or untrustworthy man in German, his name is literally Dr. Evil or more appropriately Dr. Bad Guy), complete with bald head and mao suit, trying to take over the world. Come on man.
>Has some mentally retarded enemy designs (and character designs too frankly, why does every guy look like Ray Liotta or Dana Carvey in Man of Mystery?)
I could go and fucking on, man. DOOM 3 is a load of hot turd water.

>>11357024
>technical limitation
Hell, Half-Life had it.

>>11357037
I have huge problems with HL2 gameplay wise but that graphical engine rapes idtech4. The fact bodies are permanent is the least of ways source dicks down doom 3.

>>11357039
sorry I meant the permanent bodies in HL1

>>11357024
>it's an action-horror game by id, but is arguably the first in their catalog to have no gibs or permanent bodies, which is standard for the genre regardless of id
That's wrong when it comes to the zombies. When it comes to proper info about the game >>11353658 isn't far off with it filtering the posers.

>>11356839
How a nigga has 8k hours in a game and doesn't even manage to get all the cheevos is wild, although I know they are kinda bugged in BFG edition

>>11357065
zombies heads can gib but the bodies still disappear

>>11357108
D3 zombie bodies only disappear when gibbed.

>>11357024
It has some of the best enemy designs in the series.

>>11353620
because it's a different game from a different time

it was well received back then as well
we were shitting our pants