/vr/ - Retro Games

=== CURRENT PROJECT ===
/Vertex Relocation/ PHASE 2
IWAD : Doom 2 | Format : Boom
RULES AND CLAIMED SLOTS : https://pastebin.com/CrVTqGvr
BETA V2 : https://files.catbox.moe/tc0rgk.wad

=== NEWS ===
[9-8] Eviternity 2 RC6, supports co-op and a new difficulty
https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/142015

[9-5] Tei Tenga, a simple weapons mod using Id Vault assets

[9-2] Constriction 1024 had RC1 update
https://doomworld.com/forum/topic/147591

[9-2] Mindprison Project, a limit-removing megawad
https://jmaa.tv/mindprison-project

[9-1] Dr_Cosmobyte releases Codename Nomad, a vanilla+ weaponset
https://dr-cosmobyte.itch.io/codename-nomad

[8-31] Skelegant releases DEHEXTRA Eraser weapons mod
https://skelegant.itch.io/eraser-weapons

[8-30] Anon shares Eraser 3.0, a single-level partial conversion
https://doomworld.com/forum/topic/147486

[8-28] Doom running on a neural network powered engine
https://gamengen.github.io/

[8-26] Abysm 2 + Expansions Receive Anniversary Update
https://moddb.com/mods/abysm-2-infernal-contract/downloads

[8-24] ZScript versions of Legacy of Rust monsters + randomizer
https://doomworld.com/forum/topic/147247

[8-23] SPRAWL: total conversion for Quake
https://x.com/SPRAWLfps/status/1827028382577782884

[8-22] Marathon Infinity is on Steam + Workshop support for entire trilogy
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2398520/

[8-22] Lunatic, Vanguard, Valiant, Ancient Aliens update
https://doomworld.com/profile/8877-skillsaw/?status=1747176&type=status

[8-21] Goldsrc SDK got updated with HL 25th anniversary stuff
https://github.com/shawns-valve/halflife

[8-18] Blood: What Lies Beneath trailer
https://youtu.be/sx9bL36K7ng

[8-17] ZScript versions of Legacy of Rust weapons
https://github.com/jekyllgrim/ZSLoRWeapons

=== PREVIOUS ===
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-vrTgPGmlLwdO5VHHCJMxmRD05E6XlNmqHIN8aykRG0
TO SUBMIT NEWS, REPLY TO THIS POST (ideally with the [mm-dd] date bracket)

In 2291, in an attempt to control violence among deep space miners
the New Earth Government legalized no-holds-bared fighting.

Liandri Mining Corporation, working with the NEG,
established a series of leagues and bloody public exhibitions.

The fight's popularity grew with their brutality.
Soon, Liandri discovered that the public matches were their most profitable enterprise.

The professional league was formed;
a cabal of the most violent and skilled warriors in known space,
selected to fight in a Grand Tournament.

Now it is 2341, 50 years have passed since founding of DeathMatch.
Profits from the Tournament number in the hundreds of billions.

You have been selected to fight in the professional league
by the Liandri Rules Board. Your strength and brutality are legendary.

The time has come to prove you are the best-
to crush your enemies-
to win the Tournament.

>>11224593
Nice Tei Tenga link
https://lossforwords-atmo69.itch.io/tei-tenga

>>11224621

>>11217908
E1M9 Excavation Site
When this began I had a bad feeling. The beginning's hallways felt so tight and the combat very bland. And while there definitely isn't much sophistication in the combat or map design as it continues on, Late Night Person knows how to use gibs to enhance the fun.

The combat setpiece is basically just rocketing and chaingunning a big monster teleporter. But it feels so satisfying because of the inherent gibbitude of Knee Deep in the Deadites.

Kind of a neat little romp.

E1M4 Mineral Processing
Nice and open map, progression is not totally clear without some exploration. Pretty standard Ultimate Doom fare. I did the exit switch fight without the rocket launcher and it was really easy. So, its a little too easy to miss and theres way too much chaingun ammo.

E1M5 Mining Complex
This is not a winner. The combat is tougher, which is nice (this was my first death) but the spectre use is a little dickish and the chaingun is withheld for too long. Also, I found a way to get to the red keycard in an unintended way really early on. So the design feels much sloppier than each of the previous maps.

>>11224590

Citadel progress
I hope you like punching imps/pinkies

>>11224678
Normal punching or berserk punching?

>>11224663
I liked Solar Struggle when I played it, though I think I had more fun with Stickney Installation.
>>11224676
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65uNCLBTje0

>>11224676

>>11224682
I'm enjoying it so far. But the slightly longer maps are starting to drag on me.

I know the combat gets more interesting later on, so I'm hoping that will sustain me in the later episodes.

>>11224682
>tfw no Build game with a Lou Albano style protag, putting enemies in wrestling holds and cranking them in the back of the head with a big pipewrench

>>11224621
Sorry I’m hanging out on Na Pali forever. I love this place.
>mod’s planet is technically not Na Pali

>>11224681
Berserk, I'm not that evil

>>11224708
Then yes. Beating up pinkies and imps is fun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mZp5_xN1xU

>>11224737
You sure can't mistake his wads for being anybody else's wads with the music he does for them.

I liked that one joke in Duke Nukem Forever where this scientist lady mentions the Planck length and Duke goes "I got your plank length right here, baby" and he's too dumb to realize he just said he has the smallest dick in the universe.

Fisting Imp is fucking fun.

I wish I had sources for all the sexy girls in old fps games

>>11224779
Relative to its size, the gorilla has the second smallest penis of any animal. Duke has the first.

Is SNS over again?

I finally got that fucking custom berserk punch noise to work, it took about a full day & a half to figure out how to get the bitch working, but here it is. Shoutout to >>11218603 in the last thread, he told me I had to make a custom actor to replace Doomguy so he could have the custom fist. Here is a PK3 with the coding I did to create the custom berserk punch noise.

https://files.catbox.moe/o5s2e5.pk3

The noise I used is the BRSKHT.WAV file from the id vault. I think it was supposed to be an unused noise for punching when you picked up a berserk pack. I put the wav file through the Audacity program, changed the wav file's Hz from 44100 to 11025 Hz, which is the Hz that most of the Doom sound effects are at. As for the BRSKHT.WAV itself, I think it is kind of lackluster sounding for a punch. I kind of prefer the more meaty thunking base noise Doom punching noise. I think I will use the unused berserk punch noise to see if the noise will grow on me, I am just fucking glad I finally got it working, thank you guys in the last thread for telling me what I needed to do, It saved me from having to make a stupid thread on faggot ass Doom world.

>>11224827
Double Prank'd

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIeUFnmpHJk
https://vocaroo.com/1l0OHlS5ypAF
https://vocaroo.com/1d8uwvEwMvW4

Anything I know about the classic AvP game before I start it?

>>11224692
>Build game with a Lou Albano
>SWING YOUR ARMS FROM SKULL TO SKULL

can niggas stop replacing fucking decorations with no option to turn them off
when was it a good idea to do that ever

>>11224862
Just open it in slade and comment them out.

Fuggedabbout Freeman, we're pulling out.

>>11224879
coop opfor night when

>>11224876
i did. i'm just appalled that it's still an active practice

>>11224862
What is that decoration normally?

>>11224901
You've probably got bigger issues running custom monsters on a DBP wad anyway, nine times out of ten they use the WolfensteinSS and Keen for environmental effects and stuff via dehacked.

>>11224910
If I remember my DBP37 right, it should be some fire that you can walk through.

>>11224910
fire you can pass through
>>11224919
true, but this time that issue got solved by me loading augzen after the mod. besides, decorations aren't as crucial to the experience as monsters can be.

>>11224879
How did you do that?

>>11224623
>needs 90s feels

>>11224841
i highly doubt you'll learn much modding in /doom/ alone, so if you do want to get further into it, imo it's best you try and calm your hate boner for the forums a bit.

Zdoom should've never happened.

>doom
more like GOON

Hmmm...I wonder who could've done this.
>>11224936
A lot of quicksaving and loading when someone died.

>>11225041
>that pic
Oh my god, is he okay?

>>11224623
>id24 usually release whatever ports

>>11225041
Poor dude.

>>11224789
wat gam?

>>11225257
It might be the D3 Phobos mod based on that hud.

Gonna get an automated zandy server set up with a variety of mods picked at random. I got Push, Doomware, and (good) deathmatch WADs in mind. What should I add? What do you dudes like to play?

I like this map pack. Its vibes are cozy and at 8 levels it doesn't overstay its welcome. I swear some of the soundtrack was pulled from Metroid Prime though, but was *just* a bit different. Now to decide which to play next.

>>11225382
What is he playing?

is there still no coop for pwads on that updated steam release?

>>11225397
Looks almost like Super Mario Bros. 3

>>11225420
How is he playing it on the computer? This photo must of been around 1993 - 1994, were NES emulators a thing back then?

>>11225434
>>11225420
Fuck, I missed reading the part where you said "almost".

>>11224992
>calm your hate boner for the forums
Shit advice desu, the best way to learn is to find other people's mods who did things you want to do and open them up to see how they did it, until you finally know enough to figure shit out on your own. Forumfags will not help you in the long run, especially not if you aren't into sucking the right dicks to fit in.
A decompressed gzdoom.pk3 and entry level programming knowledge to search through is the absolute bare minimum for any serious modding. If using DeHackEd, there are resources for that too.
>t. Taught myself modding with near-zero forum use

>>11225434
Weren't they doing a mario clone for pc to impress nintendo with though?

>>11225434
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YWD6Y9FUuw

>>11225442
Mario... easy on the mushrooms.

>>11225439
>Shit advice desu
No, that's still good advice. You shouldn't waste time and energy getting angry over a shitty forum. I learned same as you: Cracking open other mods, though I had the added benefit of having direct contact with people smarter than me as well.

>>11225434
Id Software was developing a SMB 3 version for PC and showed a prototype to Nintendo. But in the end Nintendo didn't want it, so Id started to make Commander Keen with the same code.

https://youtu.be/1YWD6Y9FUuw

>>11225470
DW has a forum called "editing questions" and there's a few people there who basically answer questions as a hobby. I agree that having an understanding on your own is more valuable, but it's fine to learn from somebody else now and then.
Though I must wonder how socially dissonant one must be to think you need to "suck the right dicks" to get advice from there.

>>11225041
I was asking what mods you're using actually sorry.
>>11225124
That's a bad guy so it's ok. Less so in your image I guess.

>>11225475
Hard to say, I just assume he's an angry guy with a chip on his shoulder.

>>11225486
I almost want to make an alt and ask a really dumb question to see the results

>>11225487
Now when you say "dumb" are you talking about just asking something genuinely unanswerable just to be a cheeky piece of shit, or a dumb question that's common knowledge?
Because fuck man, I've asked some real stupid questions during my early days of modding.

>>11225491
Just something I already know how to do, like a self-referencing sector or a 3D floor in UDMF, nothing full-on retarded. Also finish kustam

And talking about stupid question, where can I download the quake drake source code? It's supposed to be open source now.

>>11225492
I just got home. I was supposed to a dev stream and totally missed it as I kept a word to a friend to take him grocery shopping.
But here, I posted this yesterday.

>>11225496
https://youtube.com/watch?v=CCg99EPJhdU

>>11225483
Field Intensity. Breddy gud, feels like an official expansion, if you ignore the amateur voice acting.

jesus christ

>>11225504
>Amateur voice acting
There's a solution for that, if you don't mind a little AI voice cloning. Only replaces custom voices for non-original characters.
https://www.moddb.com/mods/field-intensity/addons/fanmade-patch-half-life-field-intensity-ai-voice-remake

I'm trying to play Ancient Aliens in dsda-doom but its lacking the cool wolf sfx in the beginning- I'm only getting standard teleport sound. I know this because gzdoom works fine, but I don't wanna use gzdoom for this playthrough. Im a dummy using Windows 10. It starts exactly like Decinos play here in dsda-doom: https://youtu.be/as3X5VIiG1c?t=607 time stamp 608s or 10:08

>>11225612
You need GZDoom or Eternity for the sound effects.

>>11225612
The wolf sound effects and various other relatively unimportant features in that wad were originally exclusive to zdoom derivatives and the Eternity. Lucky for you, Skillsaw recently released an update for all his major wads that adds this functionality to dsda-doom and other mbf21 compatible ports. The news post mentions this.
https://www.doomworld.com/profile/8877-skillsaw/?status=1747176&type=status

>>11224663
E1M6
Visitor Center
Ehhhhhhh. The doomcute is nice, but there are some weird design choices like placing a switch to lower a key in a room unconnected to it and is not visible from activating that switch.

I dunno, I won't remember this one very well.

E1M7
Traffic Control
Lots of big groups of former humans to feed to your rocket launcher and some nice open space to run around in. A little too easy defang by pulling a Decino and just leaving though.

Nice interconnectivity by being able to go around the main buildings onto the cliffs at the beginning of the map. Not a bad map at all.

E1M8
Huygens Spaceport
I have never played Plutonia 2, so the midi selection cannot bother me like it did MtPain27. And I am glad that is the case because it so perfect for this level.

From the very start, the tram you are on destroyed and appears to be filled with viscera. The doors are only partially ajar as shotgunners pot shot you and lost souls clog up the vents. Its a short but tense and dark crawl that leads into a rocket fiesta with a ton of Barons. The damaging floor and sheer space the Barons take up make this so precarious.

Its so moody and just a goddamn joy. This is for me close to peak Ultimate Doom.

It makes me very excited to see What Lies Beneath by Violentbeetle.

(Screenshot taken from Sandwedge's playthrough because I never learned how to screencap in game)

>>11225652
Slight correction, it is visible from the room with the switch in it but if you press it, it becomes easy to not notice lowering or not connect it to the lowering action.

I think the area is a little visually noisy (especially with the action) and that obfuscates it.

Sandwedge had a similar issue in his playthrough.

>>11224992
>i highly doubt you'll learn much modding in /doom/ alone
Certainly not in 2024 because there aren't many people left who know shit.
When I took up Doom modding in 2016 I could basically ask everything here. One anon even helped me by putting together an ACS script for a weapon mod I made.
I try to help everyone who asks questions, if I can, but I also don't lurk daily.

>>11224623
>Author possible entire retarded
Far too many wads I have played suit this

>>11225642
That link was more than I hoped for. Wolves are a howlin. Luck had nothing to do with it-- Ancient Aliems.

Attempting to make Kleer sprites from scratch. Probably gonna base it mostly on the classic ss1 design.

>>11225762
Godspeed, Anon. This is a good start thus far.

>>11225762
It might be easier to use the modeler to get screenshots then tweak them but I have no idea how to load a Kleer into this thing.

>A_Explode
>XF_HURTSOURCE — This flag is set by default. Hurts the source: if set, the source can be damaged by the explosion. Note that the source is not necessarily the calling actor. To unset the flag, either use 0 for the flags argument, or pass other flags to it without passing this one.
>or pass other flags to it without passing this one

What is this trying to say? I gave Walpurgis' Firestorm attacks XF_NOSPLASH so the fire spiral tertiary wouldn't eat my frames when I use it on liquid and I'm going to put it on more things, but now it's doing damage to me.

>>11224879
Too bad you lose them all like 2 rooms into the next building.

>>11225652
>(Screenshot taken from Sandwedge's playthrough because I never learned how to screencap in game)
You can always press Print Screen button and paste it into a graphical editor. Most ports also have bindable screenshot keys, at least DSDA does. I think gzDoom just dumps screenshots into one of its internal folders when you pres PrntScr.

>>11225906
>PrntScr
Warning for this on the latest Windows: Windows' inbuilt Snipping Tool tends to override the program's usage of the Print Screen key, which depending on your port can cause the game to go black. In GZD I had to create an alias function that takes delayed screenshots so I could trigger it and hurriedly close the console.

>>11224593
Legendoom 3.0 released
https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=51035

>>11225941
>completely overhauling items internally, adding synergies and fixing a buncha stuff
Oh fuck, Yholl is an absolute madlad.

>>11225439
>>11225475
Cracking open mods and just looking at their code and assets, tinkering with them, and referencing wikis to learn what this or that thing might do, is actually a fantastic way to learn, but as much as you can talk shit about the various problems of Doomworld, I have to agree and say that there really is lots of people there who really know their shit and they are eager to help you solve a problem and teach you.

I don't know if ZDoom Forums is the same these days, it seems to have become a ghost town after everyone fled it to various Discords after the big fuckening.

>>11225486
If he's talking about sucking the right dicks, he's more likely an angry guy with a cock on his shoulder, waiting to be sucked. He's been sucking a lot of cocks now, and he's starting to get really tired of it.

>>11224593
>/Vertex Relocation/
I read the rules and the very first idea I had is to encapsulate all the monsters into teleport boxes and do the actual map somewhere away from the initial area.
The project sounds fun, but I don't really get the rules yet. Definitely gonna jump on the train if you will be short of maps though, just how I did with last three levels for 512 linedefs of /vr/.
t.guywithteacup

>>11226076
>I read the rules and the very first idea I had is to encapsulate all the monsters into teleport boxes and do the actual map somewhere away from the initial area.
That's kind of not going with the spirit of the rules, I feel.

>>11225941
>Agitating has been improved, thanks to Combine_Kegan.

>>11226076
I used teleporting monsters and nobody complained, but I used the original teleport destinations.

>>11226089
I feel there is a difference to do so with some of the monsters against doing it with all of them.

>>11225820
You have to extract the model files from SE1_00.gro first. These are basically zip files so use whatever zip tool you have like 7zip to open it. It'll be under "Models\Enemies\Boneman" I believe. You could just extract that folder and open the model file I believe.

>>11225007
ZDoom was the major force that kept Doom community alive in the 00s. Be glad that ZDoom happened.

>>11226076
Kek, I actually took a look at the maps that were still left and kinda came to the same conclusion, because they're all already clustered in such a fashion that you can't do THAT much more, or at least not without an effort I currently don't have enough energy for.

>>11226076
>t.guywithteacup
I don't get why you do this all the time when you could just namefag

Does anyone have any Eternity Engine exclusive wads they recommend? Playing through Heartland and I am floored. Usually I use gzdoom because its compatible with everything but I grew up playing Doom with no mouse.

I don't like Quake 2, I simply don't, it's slow, ugly and boring. I would unironically rather play Quake 4

>>11226442
Nobody cares about your two sentence opinion mate. This isn't Twitter, go focus on something fun if you don't like it. Simple as.

>>11226442
That's fair. I feel that way about Quake 1 for the most part.

>>11226469
Seconding this, even though I’m marginally curious if they played original or the new port.

>>11226469
Translation: I want to post my shitty anime waifus on /vr/ for some reason so I added a boring milquetoast opinion to make it slightly on topic

>>11226442
Playing through Q2 right now.
The base game is okay, almost good, a bit too padded. PS1 version was better.
The Reckoning is a bit worse, new shit weapons, all these cave levels with green lizzard monsters make it feel like Unreal and not in a good way.
Ground Zero is even worse, shit weapons again, so far I don't like it.

The only really good things are soundtrack and weapons design. Best railgun ever. and remaster brightmaps

>>11226442
This used to be me but I've come to appreciate it way more. Maybe even more than Q1.

>>11226507
>Reckoning
>new shit weapons
The pizza launcher is OP.
>>11226509
Same for me, though it’s also been the most they’ve felt to “change” compared to Quake 1 and both Unity and KexDoom.

>>11226517
>The pizza launcher is OP.
That doesn't contradicts what I said.

>>11226523
Then you should specify better anon. Do you not like it being OP, or just don’t like it?

>>11226507
>Best railgun ever.
*nerfs ur railgun damage for no reason*

Why didn't you fags tell me how much the original Unreal kicks ass? Fucking Alexander Brandon soundtrack and I never knew

>>11225439
If I, as a retarded young teen like a decade ago now, could have learned Doom modding entirely through the community on Doomworld while having literally zero prior experience with anything similar, I think a retarded young adult such as yourself should be able to do the same.

To be completely honest I can only imagine you're just a fucking asshole because I think it's one of the only centralized community spaces I've ever seen with such a storied history that ISN'T a massive cocksucking circle. Like that IS a problem you'll run into in almost any community space this old except for Doom's, I imagine because of the constant influx of new autists actually.

I waltzed in there like 13 years ago posting a map that couldn't have been any better than wow.wad and the thread was EXCLUSIVELY just actual honest to god friendly advice on level design and visuals, editor tips, and how to pace enemy encounters.

You're not cooler for disavowing other sources of community and advice. Just because they have usernames doesn't mean they're fucking Reddit or whatever inane /v/-brained contrarian opinion I imagine is rattling around in your cranium.

Either get your head out of your ass and try to genuinely engage with people who are probably really excited to teach someone like you, or accept that you're gonna get stuck in ruts for way longer than you should.
Because with how volatile you act I can't even imagine you finding a lot of people willing to deal with your bullshit here, let alone an actual forum.

>>11225475
Oh look, the usual suspects act out in the expected way. Yeah, so, this is exactly what happened whenever I asked for help on any doom forum. Not only did I not get help, but then about five or six cocksuckers would wait until they thought I wasn't paying attention anymore and talk as much shit as physically possible, making up stuff about me and basically playing me out to be the villain because I did something like go "okay I'm glad you're really good at modding and stuff but the topic of my thread was X and you just spent four posts flexing about Y and then got upset when I asked you about X".
It is absolutely a game of sucking the right fucking dicks to get anything done when you are dealing with forumfags like yourself. This is why the zdoom forums are a fucking graveyard these days, this is why places like doomer boards (not that it's any fucking different) end up being created, and this is why I will never, ever interact with the wider doom community outside of an anonymous setting where I can tell you dipshits exactly what retarded, autistic, narcissistic pieces of shit you are. You are not fucking special for understanding basic programming, you are not special for withholding information from people who ask for help on forums specifically designed to help people, you are not smart because you have the ability to lord things over people. Your existence is fucking sad when you have to play power games over mods for a 30-year-old video game. I sincerely hope you piss out the largest kidney stone in history, fuck you.

>>11226638
>2/3 of the post just dedicated to insulting me
You're just proving me right lol. God I'm so good at this.

>>11226640
Kill yourself. This is life advice. You're going to anyway you fucking eunuch.

>>11226604
>Why didn't you fags tell me how much the original Unreal kicks ass?
I’ve been doing that for awhile now.
Probably my favorite “90s FPS” soundtrack.

>>11225397
Dangerous Dave in Copyright Infringement

>>11226650
By the way I'm using reverse psychology to convince you broadcast your true colors. I can even tell you I'm doing it and it will make you want to do it even more. Funny how it works.

>>11226638
>It is absolutely a game of sucking the right fucking dicks to get anything done when you are dealing with forumfags like yourself
They don't particularly like me, yet I still get help.

>>11226371
Vaporware

Then there's Tarnsman's Projectile Hell and The Lost Episode, but they also work on zdoom.

>>11226663
It's amazing what not lacing your posts with weird unhinged rants can do huh

>>11226659
I'm very glad that you think you're smart, but you're not. You're so used to playing reputation power games that you can't even comprehend the notion that I don't give a shit about "true colors" because not only do I not have a name here, I don't interact with your pedo/faggot infested community at all.
What you dislike about my post is not that I take issue with you and the behavior of people like you, but that the very idea that someone might be able to learn modding and mapping without having to suck your fucking digital dick lessens the narcissistic supply you get, which is hilariously the only way you can enjoy yourself likely because you've hormonally and maybe even physically castrated your body, or you were just born wrong. It's sad and pathetic that you place this much importance on a hobby, and letting you know that makes you angry.
>>11226663
The only motherfucker who ever helped me was a crossposter here, and he left the community over half a decade ago. Every single other one either posted non-answers to shit I didn't ask or just openly mocked me. I was polite, I was cordial, didn't matter, which is why I have no use for politeness when dealing with them now. Hell, one time I almost got banned for asking Edward850 why he was calling me a fucking retard (or something similar, it's been a decade) in a thread where I was openly admitting that I didn't know about the topic and needed help. That's the kind of community the ZDoom forums and Doomworld have.

>>11226442
I like it, the expansions and mod campaigns too. But I'm glad there's not so much custom content as Doom has. Q2 is fun, but too much would be too much. Doom has no such a problem. I think it's an only game I can play almost exclusively without burning out.

>>11226675
I mean, you come across like a turbowhining faggot right now, so are you sure you weren't also doing that back then and people didn't have the energy to deal with you?

Again, the Doomworld people don't fucking like me, but I've gotten plenty of help from people there who know their shit.

>>11226675
And now we're into schizo territory. Amazing. Good job.

>>11226481
>they
No girl would come to /vr/ to post shitty baits with anime waifus. We all can assume that it's a dude.

>>11226684
>>11226685
>hurr you're just whining it's not like every experience you ever had told you that the forums where useless, chizo
>stop telling people about your experience and stop recommending better ways to learn
No, and fuck off. The best way to learn is solo, period. There is no drama, there is no bullshit, you don't get harassed for asking questions, you don't have to interact with people who belong in a mental asylum.
If anything, this exchange should be more than enough to justify my viewpoint here. I say one thing (Don't use the forums because they're filled with dickheads, find your own resources and learn solo) and a bunch of those exact dickheads jump down my throat about it with exact the kind of stupid powergaming forumfag bullshit that caused that viewpoint in the first place. Fucking classic.
If you love those forums so much, go back.

>>11226687
It's called Singular They, you zoomer fuckhead, it doesn't have to have anything at all to do with gender, especially not modern day gender warrior cancer.

>>11226695
Yes anon I'm obviously from those evil cabals that tormented you oh so many moons ago because I think you're not very social, you got me.

>>11226695
>No, and fuck off. The best way to learn is solo, period.
You can, sure, but there's no actual need to. Whenever people ask for help here, and if it's something I know how to help with, I'll try to assist them and teach them, and there's nothing you can do about it.

>There is no drama, there is no bullshit, you don't get harassed for asking questions,
I have never endured any drama or gotten sat down with the Forum Commissars for asking "Why doesn't this UMAPINFO thing work, can someone help me?"

>you don't have to interact with people who belong in a mental asylum.
Like I don't do that here too? We've had our share of absolute lunatics right here.

>If anything, this exchange should be more than enough to justify my viewpoint here.
>I say one thing (Don't use the forums because they're filled with dickheads, find your own resources and learn solo) and a bunch of those exact dickheads jump down my throat about it with exact the kind of stupid powergaming forumfag bullshit that caused that viewpoint in the first place. Fucking classic.
Cool confirmation bias and all that.

>If you love those forums so much, go back.
But they won't let me say nigger or faggot for fun, or doodle on troon flags.

>>11226624
Not him, but even dw laughs at reddit's doom community just like every doom community does. It's a funny thing, that db, dw, zdoom.org and /vr/ might have clashes sometimes, but they all always agree r/doom is a retarded place. Funnier is that when /v/ tourists come here and try to act all contrarian by hating reddit's doom community. It's not a contrarian opinion, it's widely known canon in all doom communities.

>>11226717
That's true, none of the forums respect r/doom at all, and neither should they.

>>11226604
It's been discussed to death before, especially stuff how it handles the dispersion pistol and keeping it relevant throughout the game.
>>11226701
Yep, singular they has been part of normal English for hundreds of years, it's just the /pol/ kids getting real touchy over it.

>>11226638
Nobody is playing you out to be a villain. You are having a massive spergout and basically turning yourself into a one-dimensional seething caricature yourself. The dude gave you an advice and wrote multiple paragraphs of pointless seething. Learn social skills.

>>11226723
Yes. But if there's one good thing in r/doom at least the most massive retards stay there without infecting the other communities.

>>11226717
>>11226723
>My dear brother, are you familiar with Doom?
>Doom? That video game from the 90s?
>Yes. I find no greater example of memes than in the still withstanding community of Doom. You see Snake, the community is fractured into various communities. ZDoom, Doomworld, Doomer Boards, and /vr/ - Retro Games are but a few of these communites. They've poured countless hours of effort into creating source ports, preservation efforts, and WADs for the game.
>WADs?
>That would be custom content such as levels and graphical assets for the game. There is a clear burning passion and love for their legacy. Although most amusingly, in spite of their efforts they do not shape the face of their community. The king of Doom is none other r/doom.
*3 seconds of black while the PS1 loads cutscene data showing a montage of various doom sites*
>r/doom? You mean the subreddit?
>Of course. Consider the fact that Doomworld has 45 thousand members. Impressive at a first glance, yet they are utterly dwarfed by r/doom's half million userbase. r/doom does not put even a fraction of the effort any of these recessive communities do, yet they shape the public consciousness' perception of Doom through various memes. Rip and Tear, Isabelle, and Shooting a Hole Into the Surface of Mars to name a few.
*Fades back to the game*
>Just internet memes, that's all it takes for r/doom to be the face of the community. They've never made any WADs or content for the game they deify in the first place! Yet the ones who do such as Doomworld are left in the dust.
>What does any of this have to do with your plan?
>Memes control history, snake. The lesser communities are hidden in the shadows, while r/doom triumphs through using memes to control the public psyche. That is what I intend to do, brother. I shall harness my dominant memes, I won't be held back.

>>11226767
>meme scheme
>not Solidus or Monsoon
FOX...

Discuss Doom on codex

You know I really appreciate how the (good) generals like this one usually avoid the nuclear sperg out timebomb retards that waddle around the rest of the site but I guess containment breaches happen anywhere.

How do I set the ambush players flag for a monster spawned in with SpawnSpotFacing in a script? I've set

SetActorProperty([TID], APROP_Ambush, 1);

to run right after but it does literally nothing despite that it's what everyone else seems to use from what i've researched. i'm using the new TID I specified in SpawnSpotFacing so I have no idea why it's not working.

>>11226838
You sure do want to continue a discussion that has no purpose besides stirring drama, don't you? Can't just say your final word and leave like someone sane.

>>11226862
Nta, but can you see the irony in your post.

>>11226840
I guess to be more specific I'm trying to get a custom Wrath of Cronos enemy working right which can't be placed directly in the map in UDB so I have to use map spots.

SpawnSpotFacing ("Impwarlord" , 1, 501);

SetActorProperty(501, APROP_Ambush, 1);

the mapspot's TID is 1. the imp warlord spawns in like it should but then can hear me when i'm behind him. what gives?

>>11226891
You might want to dig up Cult of Despair and see how that gets around it, being a Wrath of Cronos wad and all.

>>11226838
This general has seen MUCH worse days than now. Remember when S*rais had his feelings hurt and spammed the thread with gore? I don't think there was a jannies then because shit would go on for 12+ hours, and the faggots would try to time this shit to when they determined the only mod/janny on /vr/ was absent or sleeping, because that's how much it meant for some of these pedophiles to ruin any and all discussion for others.

>>11226908
oh yeah that guy. i remember he joined SNS under an alt and tried to guess the RCON password.

>>11226905
that's exactly where i first copied the SetActorProperty bit from lol it just doesn't actually work, it doesn't even seem to actually work in cult of despair. i have no idea why it wouldn't though.

I set up the Open Fortress server to automatically run on Saturdays. Even if I'm not here to post about it, it'll be running, so if you wanna get some frags going with /vr/ just say the word. I've also updated the infographic.
I'll work on getting Zandronum set up the same way for Mondays, stick around and I'll get a server up today

>>11226891
You might be screwed here, and that's because the enemy likely counts as already having been woken up once you are applying the flag, or something. ACS is a bit of a shitshow when it comes to flipping certain flags and I'm pretty sure ambush is one of them.
There are a few instances of people suggesting that you spawn the monsters outside the map, and the tag to them, and then move them into position using the markers. I'm not entirely sure if that would work or not. Other than that, it might be best to try to copy the monster definition out of the mod and assign a proper doomEd number or whatever to your copy so that you can place it in the map.

Is there any way to make hexen 2 look less like ass?
It somehow looks more bland than vanilla quake.

>>11226914
Like recently?

>>11226908
I should clarify that I don't think S*rais is a pedo, and I don't know for sure if any of the others are, but the Fake Alf guy had like the EXACT same personality as a guy I once had the misfortune of knowing, who went to prison for that.

>>11226931
2022 if that counts as recently. I remember there was a whole discussion about him over discord because he started referring to himself in third-person to paint himself as a victim and that's how he got caught

>>11224590
What's his best map?

>>11226928
yeah at this point i just need confirmation i'm not insane after trying everything. funny to think it's not actually working whenever someone else has used it. just assembled a quick example using vanilla doom2 and yeah it's not working there either. i'll figure something else out.

>>11226949
Since it looks like it's a decorate definition, you can just do
>Actor impwarlordwithafuckingDEDnum : impwarlord 69420 {}
In a simple decorate add-on and that will probably work. Don't take my word for it entirely though, I haven't done this in a while.

>>11226946
Well map01 is iconic and the whole starting position is the most visually pleasing place of the whole game, which is unusual for Sandy.

>>11226929
Let's wait for Nightdive remaster.

>>11226946
Arguably Tricks & Traps.

>>11226952
now i'm getting

"DECORATE warning in "beach2.wad\DECORATE:6", line 1. Unable to find "impwarlord" class to inherit from, while parsing "impwarlord:19420"."

even though I have woc loaded in the map. fuck it i guess. it's an incredibly jank solution just to make an enemy ambush me anyway.

>>11227010
The only thing I can imagine is that that is some kind of load order issue, but without actually having your entire setup I wouldn't know how to solve it.

>>11227000
Tricks & Traps is garbage. I don't know why I consistently hear people call it good. It's literally a circle with hallways branching off of it, and each hallway is just a retarded gimmick that you can see from a mile away. There's no flow or nuance, it's lazy and boring. Sandy has made some legitimately good maps, but T&T is not one of them.

>>11225382
Napoleon Dynamite!

>>11227149
nah, udb is just retardedly limited when it comes to pulling assets out of wads. i think it's because the custom enemy is in a file called MONSTERS.txt when UDB seemingly only searches in DECORATE.txt. not sure how to fix this without making a whole ass custom version of woc which would be defeating the whole purpose

yesterday i was confused why so few mod for hexen...

>>11226087
I also updated the muzzleflashes for the Illegal, nuclear, and optional effects. I'm just gonna give myself a little pat on the back for the illegal muzzleflashes, cus I'm still really proud of those.

>>11227208
sounds like you got tricked and/or trapped

>>11227208
Hi Romero

>>11227208
Because it's a gallery of tricks and traps, each room having its own trick or trap, it's perhaps one of the best executed gimmick levels of Doom and Doom 2. It has its theme and executes it in multiple different ways, and it's at least partially non-linear in that only two rooms are mandatory for getting to the exit, everything else is optional, which you won't necessarily know as a newbie.

One room has a Cyberdemon face off against shitloads of Barons, and you're kind of forced to just handle this situation, wait for them to thin each other out, until you can grab the key and leave. Stray Barons might teleport to the central hub.

Another has a horde of Pinkies at the ready, you can be smart and take care of the initial ones and you might think that you're safe, but as you go in further you get ambushed with two big closets full of them in very close quarters. You might accidentally discover a hidden BFG here, the first in Doom 2.

A secret in one of the room unleashes the first Pain Elementals in the game, and the quarters are pretty tight and tough here, if you survive you just got a crash course in an all new monster.

The big hall with the Palsma Rifle baits you on UV with a Shotgun Baldy so as to wake the Cacos early.

>>11227275
Romero has a ton of shit maps, that doesn't make T&T good. Now Chasm, that's a good Petersen level.

>>11227279
That's a long way of making it sound more interesting than it is. Example A:
>One room has a Cyberdemon face off against shitloads of Barons, and you're kind of forced to just handle this situation, wait for them to thin each other out, until you can grab the key and leave. Stray Barons might teleport to the central hub.
Lmao, yeah, "forced to handle the situation" by grabbing the invulnerability sitting right there, nullifying any challenging or threat posed by the horde to begin with.

The map should really be called "Gimmicks & Garbage", because as I said, it's a circle with hallways (half of which you can ignore entirely) and not more than one possessing any kind of actual threat. It's Sandy's lazy, circular level design at its most egregious.

>>11227275
I don't think he has a grudge with Sandy.

>>11227280
Chasm is a categorically underrated level, maybe even better than Tricks & Traps, but I will continue defending the latter.
If there's a map which I don't like as much, it's The Pit, because it's essentially Tricks & Traps again, right after Tricks & Traps, but mostly not as good.

>>11226946
The Palace of Hate

>>11227289
>The Pit
I'll agree with you on that one. It's a boring, exhausting map. At least it has actual level design though, regardless of whether you consider it to be 'good' level design.

>>11227279
i'm gonna be honest, this looks like something a 13 year old whipped up

>>11227305
That's what made Doom 1 and 2 so cool. For better and for worse.

>>11227306
both games have plenty of professional quality maps, particularly in e4 of d1 and the first few and last few maps of d2. this is just amateur hour shit though. sandy was capable of doing much better, and did so, significantly, later in doom 2.

>>11227286
Open ended levels with optional areas aren't bad, Romero does that too with Industrial Zone (where you can even skip the Red Key), and both The Chasm and Monster Condo are fairly large, open-ended, with some optional areas.

Should I be using the MLFDII wad that came with the Doom combo order?
I have the individual wads, but I just figured it would be convenient to play through them in a single wad like a mission pack.

>>11227305
Welcome to 1994, you are currently the second best level designer in the world for this game, the best level designer is not in the office as much as he should, therefore you and the others need to pick up a lot of his slack. Also you need to make sure that there is not too much slowdown with 486 or even 386 processors, meaning even a lot of really basic detail needs to be cut. The game must ship with 32 levels and the clock is ticking.

>>11227312
Yeah. But it says something that some of the most infamous levels in Doom 2 still get talked about to this day.

>>11226638
>I can tell you dipshits exactly what retarded, autistic, narcissistic pieces of shit you are. You are not fucking special for understanding basic programming, you are not special for withholding information from people who ask for help on forums specifically designed to help people, you are not smart because you have the ability to lord things over people. Your existence is fucking sad when you have to play power games over mods for a 30-year-old video game. I sincerely hope you piss out the largest kidney stone in history, fuck you.
Some much projecting. Just breath or something.
>>11227289
>I don't think he has a grudge with Sandy.
I mean, you can't blame for thinking otherwise with the amount of nerdy "well, actually" Romero threw his way on Twitter via John's his (allegedly) perfect memory or whatever.

Just put up a Doomware server, come on down and test it at "Monday Night Madness: Doomware"
SNS may never come back but hopefully this can fill a void. This will be fully automated to host a huge variety of WAD configurations to match SNS. No more funny pictures though, sorry.

>>11226682
The first Quake also has too much fan-made content. And a lot of it isn't worth playing.

>>11227338
Why don't you stop trying to reignite an argument that ended hours ago?

>>11227381
It was less of an argument, and more of a circus freak show where the main attraction stepped out hours ago. Anon's just talking with the empty stand now.

>>11227368
Looks like it needs work still, I'll keep posted

>>11227401
I'm a Doom too kid, what is the deal with E2M7?

thanks daina

>>11225764
Thanks. I plan to make sprites with this level of detail until I can get all animations and rotations right, then I'll do all shading and detaills.
>>11225820
>>11226193
I'll probably just use the actual model as reference for animations. But first I need to get the modeler to work. I have the binaries that came with the disc installation and they crash. Does the steam version have a working one?

>>11227578
>Does the steam version have a working one?
yes.
Or you can compile it from the source code on Github.

>>11227578
I can already head the bone rattling and hooves.

>>11227321
Sandy really did get the short end of the stick with Doom and Doom 2 with that shit, first being hired and having to learn the tools while knocking out most of the remaining maps and then in 2 having to fill most of the void left by Romero alternating between dicking about and doing the rockstar developer shit.

>>11227616
Sandy had no involvement in Doom + Doom II.

>11227623

>>11227313
Yeah I never really understood why people use optional areas as a negative against level design, outside of maybe just lacking in navigational skills (though to be fair, some tom hall maps are literal mazes). Maybe its because I love exploring, but I find levels with open-ended design and optional areas far more compelling and replayable than levels that make every part of the layout that isn't explicitly tagged a secret a required part of progression.

>>11227616
Doom 2 especially, considering he mostly couldn't rely on Tom Hall's leftovers anymore

>>11227149
>>11227236
i think i've finally "solved" it by just copying over woc's whole monster script into a new decorate file and just putting a 2 after every actor's name. bloated and janky but it works.

>>11227623
Fun fact: It was Romero (Adrian), Williams and Reznor who made all the maps in Doom 1 and 2.

are there any 90's wads that still hold up?

>>11227545
What wad is this?

Pain elementals are just cacodemons that got toasted by an arch-vile until crispy.

>>11227717
epic2, hideous destructor, merchant mod. i don't remember the skin pack.

>>11227000
Would that be "TRIPS & Traps", or "Tricks & TRIPS"?

>>11227754
trips & braps

I need a doom wad to play

>>11227797
Play unbrappled

>>11227797
Imp Encounter.

>>11227797
Boku no Romero

>>11227797
https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/?random

>>11227818
>My brother and I have built over 40 levels to date this series bcs01 through bcs05 are some of our favorites. A lot of care and work went into the look and theme of the levels in this series. We have played these levels many times in four player Coop and Deathmatch. They are all guaranteed to be fun and bug free. You will not be disappointed with them.

>bcs01.wad is a medium sized level. Its outside areas are dimly lit. All three keys are needed to finish the level. There secret areas, switches in elevated areas, and interesting passages. There is a single transporter. All skill levels are supported and Ultra Violence can get a bit tough at times.

pretty soul

>>11227653
actually solved it without extra decorate just putting two block sound sectors around the imp. i'm retarded. turns out the 'ambush player' flag in general is janky and needs extra assistance to fully work.

>>11227863
The ambush flag isn't supposed to make the enemy deaf, even if it was frequently erroneously labelled as such.
It makes them respond to sound activation by beginning a 360 degree line-of-sight search for the player instead of waking up immediately.

>>11227902
you can just put block sound lines around a mapspot and not even bother with ambush flags. i went through a lot of doomworld threads and none of them suggested that.

I just finished playing SIGIL on the KEXport and I gotta say, I ended up noticing a lot more weird quirks than during Doom 1 and Doom 2

>Shotguns falling into the cracks which means they end up impossible to grab
>The cracks into the floor also seemingly causing "tears" into the rest of the floor drawing big ugly lines across.
>Monsters being stuck in walls/no reaction to getting shot
>Monsters seemingly aggroing for no reason (Spider Mastermind Aggro'd at the beginning of the map on the last map for some reason)
>I seem to be constantly be wall-running at very fast speed in tight spaces even though I'm not trying to
>I also kept getting bumped off walls with a lot of speed, it was quite jarring in a few areas.

Now it has been a while since I played SIGIL but I remember none of this while playing through it with Crispy when it released. I know some of these quirks are "normal" but I've never encountered them to this rate.
It kinda sucks since I've been a bit of a defender for the Kex port so far but the more I play it the more soured I become.

>>11227691
Demonfear is pretty neat. short n sweet levels

>>11227909
The ambush flag and block sound lines do different things and both have their uses when manipulating monster behavior as a mapper.

>>11227916
>Now it has been a while since I played SIGIL but I remember none of this while playing through it with Crispy when it released.
I remember none of this from playing the Kex port but then again I did not play Sigil on Kex past map 4.

>>11227931
I should have taken some clips at least, some of the bumpers I got were quite intense and the shotguns falling into cracks was annoying with how little ammo you get in SIGIL at parts.

>>11227926
it's not even an option if you're spawning enemies with mapspots. i'm pissed i spent so long on something so easy to fix with something else

>>11227313
>>11227643
Open-ended design isn't inherently bad, but you have to implement it the right way. Several maps in D2 are basically just giant fields with little puzzle hubs scattered around. Maybe some people like this, but personally, I don't. I need want a sense of direction and urgency. I want tight, compact level design with layouts that allow you to explore the map in different ways.

Huge maps with random shit smattered around put me to sleep. They instantly kill a sense of progression. The experience goes from:
>Here's the task at hand, take this shotgun and get to work
To:
>Here's a big field of shit. Just do whatever you want, you'll probably stumble onto an exit eventually n' stuff...

This right here, this is the definition of a good map: E4M1. It's small, but every inch of it is utilized well and has a sense of purpose. The map unfolds in a logical, connected way that loops back into the center without feeling circular. It offers a respectable challenge without being unfair. It's the kind of map that feels like a dangerous adventure before you know how to conquer it, and then a brief, brisk walk once you've uncovered its secrets. This is the kind of map I want, not a fair ground filled with attractions.

>mostly indoor/subterranean level with the occasional little green grass courtyard
a heavily underused design concept

is there a hud/automap equivalent to flashlight++? I want something that lets me force change some of these hud/automap settings cause I swear some mods disable the ability resize the hud and having to figure out what changes the size of the hud for each mod is a annoying pain in the ass.

Why's it got cheeks?

>>11228062
I really like this room.
It just feels comfy

>>11228209
What else are you gonna spread?

>Alien Vendetta

Thoughts on this wad? Does it hold up?

>>11228256
Yes.

>>11228256
It is fucking great and while not particularly fancy compared to the stuff we get nowadays I think it still holds up really well.

>>11228213
i wish i could stand in there and just whiff the air and listen to the muffled sounds of wind and demon grunts in the distance while looking out onto the grass and the sewer beyond.

>>11228256
I’m new to the Doom scene, relatively speaking. So I am untainted by nostalgia. But, AV was one of the first wads to really pull me in. There is something special about it, like a sort of magic.

I remember hearing about its reputation as a mapping milestone, and a legitimate speed running challenge. And the sight of the red portals in the screenshots really making me curious about its little world.

It invaded my imagination and I gritted my teeth throughout the day waiting to get back home so that I could finally play it.

And while it didn’t live up to all of my imagination, there is a sort of beauty to it thats difficult to capture in words.

I will say though, this is based on a playthrough with the midi pack. It infuses the maps with the magic I think I imagined before playing it. And it’s interesting to see so many of the composers of the midi pack seem to feel something similar as I did from the outset toward the megawad.

It is without a doubt one of the watershed moments of Doom mapping.


Putting that aside, most of the maps are hit or miss. Enjoyable but definitely just getting out of the 90’s era of quality. It’s a stepping stone into modern Doom slaughter mapping.

That Cyberdemon, like a sniper.
The chaingunners, all crackshots.
Ancient Aliens, mission 5 is smoking me.
The Hurt Me Plenty click of shame now commencing. fuuuuu

>>11228323
Want me to play it and give you some tips?

>>11228323
Maybe because you stand in place? Map is mostly wide open. If you would've moved towards the steps or into one of the sidepockets, you would've been safe.

>>11228323
Just savescum. Ancient Aliens is just not designed well enough.

>>11228338
>not designed well enough
You may omit the guest mapper contributions as I'm not fond of most of them either, but do elaborate on skillsaw.

>>11228338
filtered

I still haven't played a mapset I've enjoyed as much as Plutonia

>>11227993
There is no right or wrong open-ended design style, IMO. People just have their preferences. It's fine to not like the sandbox open amusement park design that many Doom 2 levels employ. I personally love maps like that, however.

>>11228338
>Ancient Aliens is just not designed well enough.
My I ask why you believe this?

>>11228323
I made it to MAP08 before having to make the click of shame.

>>11228323
Bit too early to give up there chief, it's a popcorn entertainment of doom wads. Don't just run into walls, make every crucial motion slow and deliberate, mind surroundings and swift momentum will be learned later. You shouldn't have problems until >>11228374

And Nectar Flow is some real blueballer too. I like Resurgence, but Joshy made some really clunky and tedious shit here. At some point I think he just sics archvilles on you with no cover to hide behind, so you most probably get fucked if you're unaware of what's coming. I'd rather replay Grey Dwarf a couple of times to be perfectly honest.

>>11228343
Skillsaw can make good stuff, like Vanguard and Heartland, but then he can also make shit like lazy guest maps and Ancient Aliens.
>>11228373
Overreliance on traps and moments where you can get fucked over by RNG.

>>11228275
Very poetical anon.

>>11228394
>Overreliance on traps
What does this even mean? Frequent use of traps is pretty standard, especially in wads that aim to be a challenge. Ancient Aliens traps arent even that crazy compared to other wads, either.
>and moments where you can get fucked over by RNG.
Such as?

For me, it's Valiant.

>>11225652
E2M1 Piazzi Spaceport
Cool UFO in the beginning and thats it.

E2M2 Storage Complex
Awesome tense start that has you scrambling over a conveyor belt to find a shotgun. However, almost all the ambushes or teleport traps were trivially easy to dismantle. Fun to explore for a bit but thats about it.

E2M3 Stock Exchange
Great map! Doomcute is on point and makes the environment more believable (if I could share more screens at once I would). And for once a big ambush has some real teeth to it!

Having to manage almost every type of enemy at once as pinkies threaten face rockets and shotgunners sneak attack you is such a thrill.
Ultimate Doom is such a vulnerable experience for me in comparison to Doom 2. Part of it is the lack of an SSG, but its also seems to me like the limited enemy roster incentivizes tighter spaces and maintaining lower firepower.

When you have tankier and trickier enemies like Doom 2's additions, then open spaces become more viable while still keeping combat interesting. Which is ironic considering how much closer range the SSG brings combat in Doom 2.

>Doomcute
>Doomcute
>Doomcute
Aaand any faintest trace of interest gets blown away into nothingness

>>11228425
Nobody tell this guy about build engine games

>>11228425
Good. Stay out of my doomcute.

Let's say I'm playing a TC that has character stats (strength,agility,intelligence etc), how can I edit those stats?

>>11228435
Like, in game or in the wad files?

>>11228438
In game, I want to raise some stats

>Playing through a wad
>See recognizable object made of sectors
>Close game and delete the file

>>11228427
There's nothing "cute" about them. There's a slight sensation about Shelly, and even that's until she opens her mouth with one-liners. Someone may get enamored by Caleb out of his sheer charisma though, but you have to be feminine for that.

>>11228442
Mmmmm... I'll make a wad with flushable toilets in your honor.

>>11228443
https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Doom_community_jargon#D
>DoomCute - An adjective applied to real-life objects recreated in the Doom engine, usually in highly simplified form.

>>11228435
You'd need to figure out how the stats are handled under the hood, it may be something simple like giving yourself a dummy item of some kind if it's DECORATE based, or running specific named scripts if its ACS based. I'm clueless with Zscript stuff so I can't really offer any advice there.
Your best bet is to probably just give yourself a bunch of resources instead, so gold, EXP, or whatever this TC uses.

>>11226925
That rule is silly and should be broken.

Team Fortress 2 is not retro, Team Fortress (classic) is.

>>11228448
Hmm, well, there's an item that gives a free stat point, so maybe I could use the give command if I knew the name.
How would I go at adding exp?

>>11228451
Same thing as the stat point items: Finding out the name and then using the console, alternatively you could be a cheeky piece of shit and spawn tough monsters and use the MDK command on them, see if you get EXP from that.

Really it varies so much from mod to mod that you'd be better off cracking the fucker open in SLADE to see how it ticks.

>>11228450
Feel free to file a complaint then
https://4chan.org/feedback

>>11227368
Alright, I figured out randomized mod selection. If you guys don't intend to use Clovr's Quakeworld servers on Sunday then I can probably relocate this to Sunday, effectively resurrecting SNS, free from the errs of human hosting. Populating will be entirely up to (You) however, I'm taking a hands-off approach to hosting like with Wednesday's event.

halfway through wrath's 2nd act, really starting to feel like the game would strongly benefit from a more linear structure desu

>>11228441
Then you'll probably have to work with the console.
It would probably also help if you posted the name of the TC.
Or, like, raise the stats by playing the fucking game.

>>11228468
After over 10 hours of playing the inquisitor 3d, I just want to be fucking done with it, and I want to raise the stats so I could see all the spells it has because there is zero chance I will ever replay it for a different "build"

>>11228460
I've seen many things take place in this SFM map, coincidentally featuring the same demons.

>>11228457
No need:
>>>6775606
"[...]Retro gaming means platforms launched in 2001 and earlier[...]".
>platforms launched in 2001 and earlier

Windows XP was released back in 2001. Your PC game must have been released in 2007 AND be compatible with Windows XP running on 2001-era hardware (or an equivalent setup if virtualized). According to >>>/vr/ rules.

How are you supposed to download Steam and install Team Fortress 2 when Steam dropped support for Windows XP several years ago? Is the "Open Fortress" server compatible with an older version of Team Fortress 2 that still works on Windows XP?

And most importantly: Why is there a message about Team Fortress 2 in a DOOM thread?

>>11228472
Open fortress is built from leaked source code of one of the older builds, and runs on Source SDK 2013, you don't need TF2 to run it at all.

>>11228473
you do actually because mounting and stuff but anon's kinda being a pedantic fag anyway so

>>11228463
Wrath could really use any structure at all honestly. You can tell muh architecture and artfagging were a higher priority than actual level design by the excessive use of teleporting in enemies. Shit's just a disappointment once you look past the visuals.

>>11228472
Better complain about modern Doom sourceports and mods then, sport.

>>11228473
>runs on Source SDK 2013
Was Source SDK 2013 released back in 2007? huh? Does it even run on Windows XP with 2001 PC hardware?

According to the rules, fucking Team Fortress 2 is not retro.

Then again: Why is there a message about Team Fortress 2 in a DOOM thread?

>>11228495
It does, valve archives old versions of steam and their other software on Archive themselves, so you can get an older version of steam installed on your shitty ass dell dimension, download a 2007 game running on a 2004 engine built from a 1998 quake derivative, and play an Arena shooter that's not been optimized to shit, or stay forever in a cycle of replaying the same boomshoots over and over until your brain flows out your ears.

>>11228495
This is an all encapsulating Retro FPS thread newfriend.

>>11228508
>>11228508
Hey, I like Open Fortress but I like "boomshots" too, I'm working on bringing back SNS as we speak. Let's not engage in friendly fire here.

>>11228479
Meh, he's acting like a bit of a shit, but I agree that it's pushing things too far out of being retro. As far as the PC "loophole" goes, I think anyone acting in good faith knows that anything past 2005 is pushing it, especially if it's anything that also released on consoles and only on 7th Gen. Might as well start putting up a server for CoD4's Old School mode because hey it was released before December 2007 on PC and it's an AFPS. Technically yeah you could do it but it's also kinda taking the piss to do so.

>>11228516
>Let's not engage in friendly fire here.

>>11228513
Team Fortress 2 (current) is not retro because it cannot run on Windows XP (a 2001 platform).

That Open Fortress server is supposedly running on Source SDK 2013, which is not a 2007 software (or game).

If live service games are going to be retro, then I am going to create a thread about World of Warcraft, a 2001 game, talking about The War Within announcement because, hey, base game was released back in 2001.

>>11228516
I'm just astounded at the amount of pedantry in a thread that consistently discusses games released not one year ago. Remember when Ion Maiden was coming out? That shit couldn't run on a Duke era hardware without lagging to shit, but we discussed it nevertheless, or what about wrath. I don't even like OF, i prefer TF2C, but the double standard makes my brain go smooth.

>>11228528
It literally can you pedantic faggot, just go and fucking try it. I've been playing TF2 vanilla in 2015 with a fucking Dual core and half a gig of ram, 128mb graphics, Windows XP SP2, reality is you don't know dick about anything.

>>11228528
It's not a fucking live service if you can host standalone servers you actual retard.

>>11228532
Current Team Fortress 2 is not retro according to the rules. Source SDK 2013 is not retro according to the rules. Insult everything you want, but the rules are the rules.

Feel free to file a complaint:
https://4chan.org/feedback

>>11228529
>Ion Maiden
>what about Wrath
I distinctly remember at release that yeah, people were pointing out that those aren't really retro either. At most, people are kinda willing to bend the rules when it comes to games that are released on retro sourceports; Ion Maiden, Wrath, and ones like Citadel kinda get a pass because they're on eduke32, Darkplaces, and GZDoom, but even then, most people still acknowledge that they're not really actually meant to be here, especially since sourceports don't mean shit for being on the original engine. As such, of course OF having even less retro DNA and wanting to play it regularly would ruffle things a bit more than those games.

>>11228513
>This is an all encapsulating Retro FPS thread newfriend.
>Doom/Quake/Duke/Heretic/Hexen/Unreal/Sam/Half-Life/etc
>...
>All other 90s FPS welcome
Anon should share his thoughts on the daily Karting servers if he's that exacting. Open Fortress is an arena shooter out and through, there's only so few grievances I have about it besides being unable to join.

>>11228535
you can host standalone servers on wow too.

"A live service game is a type of video game that is designed to keep players engaged for as long as possible by frequently adding new content and updates." Team Fortress 2 is (or was) a live service game. Current TF2 is not retro according to the rules.

>>11228543
>Sam
>90s

>>11228540
Here's an idea. USDQC hosts regular Quake and Doom events on set days, then they have an "Action Sack" event which comprises of everything else. Halo, Half-Life, Sam, you name it. I could establish an event in this vein with OF under it so it doesn't "take up too much space" if you will.

>>11228539
Ok, than we shall stop posting about every single Doom mod with advanced Zscript, cause that shit is not retro.

>>11228547
The difference is that WoW actually discourages it, Valve provided the server hosting software, as was customary with any multiplayer game.

>>11228485
>picrel
god if this is what lies ahead i might as well bail. the visual being a priority sounds pretty accurate.
i wanted to compliment its arsenal, but come to think of it, everything outside the pistol and the boomstick is kinda mid at best as well.

>>11228539
I guess we kicking HD anon out as well.

>>11228543
Kartan isn't daily anymore by the way, it only goes up on Wednesday now because 1. the rest of the games I'm hosting need resources and 2. that's the only day we really played anyway.

>>11228470
Being a completionist autist must be hell

>>11228553
That rule is silly and should be broken.

>>11228539
>Source SDK 2013
Literally not relevant to the matter.

>>11228539
Source SDK is what amounts to a source port for source games.

>>11228543
Not him, but that's actually crossed my mind before as well. Like how much of it actually does fit, cuz SRB2 does go WAY back, but then how much of SRB2K can be truly considered a mod for SRB2 anymore, and then there's stuff like other standalone retro engine games that are iffy, like when Nazi Zombies Portable was posted in the thread months back. How much can you say that's retro just because it's on FTE-QW when it doesn't actually require any Quake files and is based on a modern game. Then there's other shit like, man, what about games like Micro Mages. Brand new games for retro consoles that technically wouldn't really fit since it's released in 20XX.as a whole new thing instead of a romhack.

Of course the answer is simply that you just know what's actually retro, you know what's gonna be bending the rules, and what's actually going to have to be rules-lawyering to allow, and that if you have to push it then it's just not a good idea to do so.

>>11228528
>I am going to create a thread about World of Warcraft, a 2001 game, talking about The War Within announcement
TF2C/OF is more akin to a private Vanilla/TBC/WotLK server with custom content, like Turtle WoW or Project Epoch. We aren't discussing live TF2.

>>11228567
TF2C is more akin to a private Vanilla/TBC/WotLK server
OF is more akin to a Cataclysm server

>>11228568
Actually now that you made me think about it, OF is more akin to Ascension.

We could host AVP games, that's kinda like Team Fortress.

>>11228571
idk how to do that man I never played it

>>11228571
Or maybe like the TF mods for Quake or UT.

>>11228562
And even with that, according to the rules, current TF2 is not retro. It is a live service game (had events, updates, added content to kept is player base). It requires Steam which dropped support back in 2019 (that is why this guy could played it back in 2015 >>11228532)

And most important, "the rules" says:
>homebrew console games made after this date will be permitted.

homebrew console.

Open Fortress was released back in 2019.

Open Fortress is not retro and current TF2 is not retro.

If it is allowed then I am going to make a WoW General and talk about the latest expansion because base game was released back in 2001.

>>11228574
Good news, we have an Unreal Tournament server! It runs every Friday, start joining that shit broskis

>>11228573
There's quides online, people have been actively playing both AVP1 and 2 for a bunch of years now.

>>11228447
>jargon /jär′gən/
>Nonsensical or incoherent language.
At least something these anime skinwalkers got right. You ain't getting me with your language perversion there pal, come see me and I'll hit you up with a dictionary instead.

>>11228578
American or Yuro time?

>>11228560
Wanting to see all the spells isn't being a completionist, retard.

Freeman, right? I've got a message for you. MAKE SURE YOU DON'T

>>11228571
I could check out setting up a server for it. I just never have since I've always considered it a strictly team-focused game and therefore need the commitment of at least 8 people to play.

>>11228578
Isn't it US West? Can be rough considering UT's netcode.

>>11228565
>Brand new games for retro consoles that technically wouldn't really fit since it's released in 20XX

>[...]homebrew console games made after this date will be permitted[...]

>>11228583
Murican unfortunately, it's hosted in California. Nobody in the eastern hemisphere seems real interested in hosting for /vr/ unfortunately.
My server (OF, doom stuff) is hosted in Canada btw

>>11228586
Just wish they didn't give him a voice.

>>11228590
Huh, nice. I always remembered the rule as being romhacking.
But also this means that /vr/ has fallen

>>11228594
That rule is silly and should be broken.

>>11228575
Do it, pussy.

>be me
>have friend who likes fps games, but hasn't really tried older ones
>introduce him to doom 1 on woof, he thinks its decent
>try and encourage him to try mapping and modding, eventually he loses interest after a few weeks and moves on
>later, plays doom eternal and finds out about brutal doom
>ohboyherewego.deh
>ffw a couple months
>hit him up again, say "hey man you wanna try doom deathmatch? i forgot to show it to you but its really fun, i even made some maps for us to play on"
>"yeah sure, as long as its on brutal doom"
>stare at my screen for about 3 minutes
>attempt to pull this poor soul out of the quicksand but hes too far gone
>refuses to play doom without brutal doom
this and also him going on a month-long autism hyperfixation about ultrakill is why we aren't friends anymore

>>11228592
I don't mind hosting. I just usually prefer to grab a couple of "seed players" first to make sure I can play the game regardless of whether /vr/ musters, and recently my seeds have been spurting elsewhere for a while now. That, and I know the main preference is DOOM, and I started to run out of wads that were on the easy to scour lists and of the short-to-medium length that I prefer.

>>11228592
I've played DXMP with a guy from Canada once, and it felt like 90's Quake over modem. That said, DX has exceptionally shitty netcode.

>Notice the new Doom ports have Steam integration
>Decide fuck it, and host a public server for the master levels
>Some console guys join
>Going pretty good, no one speedrunning the levels, pretty decent players all around
>Reach the catwalk
>Explain to them that they cannot cross the catwalk until we have the red key
>Tell them to wait for everyone to be there as to not fuck up progression
>Mfw someone crosses
>Mfw he falls off

>>11228615
>That time we played Valiant for SNS and we make it very clear in chat to not kill the mancubus
>One guy does it anyway and brings on the arch vile gang rape

>>11228557
The third episode actually does have some semblance of real level design from time to time, but it also doesn't do much new or interesting besides having a different visual theme.
And yeah the weapons all feel underwhelming with lackluster animations and sound effects. Enemies also don't give much feedback, so that's probably the biggest issue. I don't know how you make a Quake engine game with direct analogues to several Quake enemies, yet somehow manage to make them this lifeless and boring.

>>11228618
That guy knew exactly what he was doing.

>>11228620
The funniest part is he didn't

https://is2.4chan.org/wsg/1725955494001358.webm
Ancient Aliens, map 1. I want you to take note of how the music builds and compare the two. The first part is gzdoom and the last is Woof. Why is it that gzdoom just nails the song right when you exit the portal while Woof takes a bit longer, like the song started off cue. Why do you think that is?

>>11228578
will do

>>11228630
Nice, I'm not into Unreal myself but I hope the rest of the fans here can get some games going.

>>11228628
GZDoom has the ability to skip a track to a specific time, as well as change it on the fly. Most ports like Doom itself just load the track and play it on loop.

>>11228625

>>11228625
>>11228641
Я вижy мoнcтpa, я cтpeляю

>>11228665
Power in truth

>>11227814
Ohh no

>>11228619
>doesn't do much new or interesting besides having a different visual theme
yeah, i'm good, that's my biggest issue. thanks for the heads up though.
tbqh the only guns i actually hated were the crystallizer and the railgun. everything else, if put into a better game with enemies that actually sell hits, would be much more serviceable. i cross my fingers that some autist will at some point cobble together one of them weapon rip mods for that there gzd, but considering that wrath is already barely talked about, it's empty hope.

>>11228463
It absolutely would have. The hub world is neat and all, but it introduces way too much right away and runs out of gas just as quick. Every level starts to feel the same because, outside of a couple of levels, you see everything new in the episode with the first map you pick.

>>11226249
2000s ZDoom mods were so soulfun and fun. Most mods today are gay and suck. It's so sad.

>>11228807
Accessibility lowered the bar.

>>11228571
How do I shot web?

What are some good 1994 wads? (aside from the cacoward ones)

>>11228846
Only decent one I played myself was Fava Beans. Aside from The Darkening 1, Memento Mori and probably some other WAD I don't remember I just don't play 90s stuff. I understand it's where modding started but I'd rather have the full product instead of suffering through experimentation and shitbrained ideas like what you see in Jens Nielsen maps.

>>11228850
That experimentation is exactly what i love about early mods, people just coming to grasp with the fact they can make their own little worlds. But to be fair, i'm also one of the autists who enjoys running games with no enemies to take in the ambience.

>>11228856
I do that too, no shame in it. I just think it's easier to swallow when the map actually looks good, most 90s maps look worse than vanilla maps. Before some belligerent autist gets upset, I don't hate 90s WADs so much as they're not really my cup of tea. Anyway, Requiem has some really nice views and 99 Ways to Die laid the foundation for lighting.

Fuck Nielsen's contributions to Memento Mori though. Map 07 is fucking rough on the first time but it has undeniable charm, except the shitass maze.

>>11228435
Inquisitor 3? I started playing that after Abysm 2 now that I downgraded my monitor from 1440 back to a 1080 IPS.

>>11228846
Cringe is a good one

>>11228869
Yes. I hate it

>>11228256
I honestly can't remember if I've ever played it. I have it in my wad folder.

>>11225826
I was sleep-deprived as shit when I posted this before so I don't know if I was clear enough with what I was asking.

How do I include other flags in an A_Explode without also activating the one that makes it hurt me?

>>11228907
Yeah I'm not a fan of the opening. Haven't played it since I finally left town. The more build engine aesthetic is nice (I think Abysm would benefit from something like this - Ashes already has it and is amazing but it also doesn't just throw you into towns either until you have played the game a bit and have money) but the very first quest was read a bunch of boring text then go punch a few rats then fetch poison to go back to rats to place it. Didn't leave me with high hopes.

I hope the rest of the mod isn't like this. I was playing Inquisitor 1 earlier - it still lagged even with the change in monitor but at least I could fix this now with the commands the author put in.

>>11228256
I think it’s still holds up and is very fun. The second half of the wad starts feeling very different from the first, maybe around map 13-14

>>11228934
It's a TC that's broken on a fundamental level. No amount of impressively sized maps will fix the utterly garbage balancing and encounter design

>>11228815
>Accessibility
I don't know Anon. I'm retarded and Decorate+ACS (the old way of modding) is much more understandable to me than ZScript. I can read and understand any Decorate and ACS code rather well but anything ZScript might as well be Chinese to me.

>>11228850
>Fava Beans
that's 1995 and it's on the cacowards list

>>11228982
I mean accessibility to modding in general, regardless of language used. Modding for (G)ZDoom is piss easy so anyone can try to make their OC donut steel mod.
>I can read and understand any Decorate and ACS code rather well but anything ZScript might as well be Chinese to me.
I will never understand this logic or how it's almost always used as an excuse to not make any effort whatsoever. That or you're reading some truly shitty ZScript code, which is more likely. Not a lot of people write code with the thought that maybe someone else would actually read it at some point in time with intent to learn, so a lot of the logic is hidden to all but those who already understand ZScript and the author himself. Every other mod I've opened out of curiosity has some super schizophrenic mixture of DECORATE and ZScript which makes it a nightmare to parse by a normal human being. I don't have enough mushrooms for this shit.

>>11229030
>Modding for (G)ZDoom is piss easy so anyone can try to make their OC donut steel mod.
Well, that isn't exactly what I mean. In the olden days, people would make crude looking maps, with crude looking enemies and weapons with jank behaviour (like those Zombie City mods or whatever they're called, or Temple of the Lizard Men for example) and nowadays all the mods are super polished with well drawn sprites, well written code with very little jank, yet it doesn't feel as... Juicy I guess? I don't know if it's because people have moved away from partial conversions to smaller mods or something, and I don't wanna sound like a bitch-ass, but I definitely think something's changed.

>>11229048
Don't know then. Sounds like it might just be the effect of nostalgia because what you say doesn't make much sense.
>and nowadays all the mods are super polished with well drawn sprites, well written code with very little jank, yet it doesn't feel as... Juicy I guess?
While I don't agree entirely with that statement, those that do have good sprites/code tend to also have fairly decent gameplay because those things are the direct result of modding experience. I can, if hard pressed to do so, think of maybe one person who has extensive modding experience but makes (subjectively) bad mods. It just doesn't work like that 99% of the time.

>LOR/ID24 skies and intermissions work in latest Woof commits
Britty cool.

>>11229048
There's plenty of those mods lucking in moddb, they just never get any sort of announcement or anything.

>>11229116
Pull request =/= commit, but yeah, it's nice that they are working on that.

>>11228878
cringe

>>11227450
That level has two exits. One is real, the other is fake and leads you into a pit filled with enemies where you're almost guaranteed to die if you aren't prepared for it. That map is filled with dick moves.

>>11228878
>>11229480

>>11229442
Pardon my vernacular. Have tried the binaries for myself, though. They work handily.

>>11229442
I mean technically a pull request is made of commits.

So anyway, here's a plan for /vr/ hosting
>Wednesday Night Wipeout
Now only runs on Wednesdays and bleeds into 6 AM on Thursday
>Saturday Night Smackdown
Currently this runs Open Fortress, though people did express this is kind of a gray area so I'm open to ideas for this. I thought about an "anything goes" sort of deal with what game gets hosted this night, but it seems people prefer consistent games.
>Neo Sunday Night Shitshow
We're not going to get SNS back in it's complete form, but hopefully this will come close. I've set up Zandronum to put itself up at 6 PM EST as usual with a random mod configuration. For instance, a random megawad will be picked with a random gameplay mod (i.e. Malefactors) and it will always load vrskins and vrsounds. Also available in the rotation for non-survival is Doomware, Push, WDI, Zombie Horde, and some Invasion WADs.
Thoughts?

https://junegloom3d.blogspot.com/p/about-author.html?m=1

What trans person are they even talking about here?

>>11229786
>Thoughts?
Canada is too far away

>>11228975
I spent way too long trying to figure out how to get into the church. At this point I might as well finish the thing so I can bitch about it properly.

>>11229829
The church is barely a quarter of the way in.

>>11229832
I know.

>>11229835
well, if you intend to continue, my advice is not to mix stat upgrades. Choose two at most to level, I ended the game at level 15 and there are, iirc, 4 stat point potions

>>11229816
This is a good question. I genuinely have no idea. Esselfortium certainly didn't lay much groundwork but she's the most influential one I can think of.
There's also that person who ported Doom to Jaguar under incredible circumstances but obviously the Jaguar port is hardly relevant to Doomers.

>>11229854
Mod deleted my post asking about a Trans person? It wasn’t even negative.

I was just curious.

>>11229915
desu these subjects usually devolve into pure shittery here so I can understand it. Why we can have nice things etc. etc.

>>11229842
At this point I think I'm going all in on Strength and Dex. If it's a problem I'll just open up slade and brute force my stats to be good enough and give myself the spells I sold if I find my offense to really suck. And yeah I don't like the encounter & weapon design at all.

>>11229938
Stats are limited in game to 25, but I guess you could change that if you start fucking around in the code. Problem with str+dex build is melee is dogshit, and the actually powerful ranged weapons take a while to get, as well as the double ammo backpack..
Problem with the magic builds is that mana dries up really fucking fast when using the strong spells, and you can only hold 5 mana cubes + 5 mana chalices, and the latter aren't common.

>>11229957
I really hate when games go all in on melee and then have dogshit melee. I've played so many things that got melee right and weren't melee focused and then you have this shit here. Crossbow feels like ass too.

>>11229967
Boy, you don't even know how bad the melee gets, you still haven't seen the "melee" enemies that have triple your melee range or attacks that just send you flying half way across the map (like most bosses).
The crossbow sucks because the projectile is too slow to snipe and has some really finicky hit detection. Trying to hit someone both at range and elevation is an exercise in frustration and waste of bolts.

>>11229980
And those are the options they actually either give you unlimited ammo for (melee) or reusable ammo (crossbow). Sounds like I should go restart and respec now. Or just drop it. Prob will just drop it.

>>11229786
I've been thingken... thingken of Build games for smackdown.

>>11229990
I'd say fire up god mode and do some progress just to see how bad it gets. Genuinely baffled how that wad got into "top 25 missed cacowards"

>>11229992
Those games are P2P so there's nothing I can really do there

Other than Phobos, ware there any good mods for Doom3? Doom3 "perfected" was ass

>>11230028
o wait maybe they aren't. idk I don't really play build games
we'll see.

>>11230028
I think there are programs such as Classic Gaming Arena that I think have something that allows to play them more or less normally. I think there are even ports for MP for Duke and Blood has NotBlood that supposedly can use ZeroTier(dunno if it's built-in or you need to install it separately) for online games.

>>11229048
The real problem isn't a lack of juice, it's just a lot of higher profile mods that get attention nowadays strive to be like a AAA mainstream game with fancy pants overly fluid 60FPS animations and blurring, with relatively safe and standard gameplay. I fucking hate it.

Go play BYOC, I think it has what you're looking for.

>noooooooooo, you can't do what you want when you want you must le seize opportunity when it presents itself reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee because that will be your only chance to do this and that

This has been a bad year for me compared to last year. If it wasn't for Dumptruck it would easily be a worthless year. I'm sorry if I ever spoke poorly about you 2023.

>>11228962
Yeah I'm playing it now and its radically different starting at map 12. Everything before that felt high concept and atmospheric and everything after feels like its trying to be yet another Plutonia follow-up. I still like a lot of the later maps but map 10 was so good that I can't help but want more of that kind of style.

>>11230036
It's an acquired taste but I've been enjoying In Hell. You could also choose one of the gameplay mods that's been discussed here like Weapons of Mars Destruction or even Phobos itself and play some vanilla custom maps through them.
>>11230204
I just feel like those two Vorpal maps back to back can be rough to digest if you're not into those 'kill many demon' monster clumps.

>>11228587
Damn, actually might not be able to, or at least in an immediate capacity. Trying to grab the AIO version from the website with wget just constantly redirects itself recursively for some reason, despite not having that problem through the browser or using the download link that any presumed redirects grabs at the end. Would have to be whenever I can be bothered to upload it locally, which takes a while for me, but I can do if there are actually people interested in playing some AvP2