/vr/ - Retro Games

>>1094146
I have only two games for mine: Doom (This port isn't that great) and knuckles Chaotix (Amazing game) I think it just had bad timing with the saturn coming shortly after.

Wasn't bad at all. At the time it came out I was a huge Virtua Fighter fan and it had the best version of the game until the remix came out on the Saturn. So I played my 32X a lot.

Zyrinx demo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F96yVYxNWPI

People are stupid and hypocritical. There are things out there that are popular BECAUSE you can attach stuff to them; with cool or interesting results. But when a game console tries to do it? With added performance and graphical benefit? NOPE! This is crap! What kind of scam are they trying to pull? etc.

Just think, if Sega was successful everyone would be doing it right now. We might even have prior gen consoles attaching to current ones and a blu ray drive for the 360. It would have been really neat.

Fun fact: The Dreamcast was made with this in mind. It was meant to eventually be updated with peripherals as well.

My view is that Sega should have released a Megadrive 2 with 32X built into it, delayed the Saturn by a year or preferably two.
Now, while the 32X was no match for Playstation, the Zyrinx demo showed that it could have held its own well enough to allow a delay in the Saturn, resulting in the Saturn being more powerful than the PS.

Why can the 32X and Genesis count as both fourth gen platforms while Saturn and Dreamcast cannot count as fifth gen platforms?

>>1094181
The Master System (had extensive expansion ports), Megadrive, and Dreamcast, were all designed with future upgrades in mind.

The Dreamcast was in many ways the spiritual successor to the SMS (the SMS cards could be seen as a precursor of the VMUs) and MD (adapatable and nimble).

The Saturn, because it was rushed, lacked those qualities.

>>1094187
I'm not even sure I understand your comparison. The 32X is a peripheral for a 4th generation console. It doesn't stand on it's own. The Saturn and Dreamcast are two completely separate consoles.

>>1094146
The 32x is an example of how NOT to design a video game system. Consoles are about cheap specialized hardware getting things done which would cost a lot more in plain CPU time. The 32x is literally just two CPUs attached to a framebuffer. It's got no video acceleration whatsoever - no 3D engine, no sprite engine, barely even the ability to scroll.

It's barely able to refresh the screen at 60fps, much less do anything interesting.

If the Saturn had been easier to develop for, it's powerful sprite handling capabilities could have been used in conjunction with its polygon aspect to overcome its short-comings (imagine using animated 2D sprites in the distance in a driving game to free up lots of polygons for detailed cars and foreground).

>>1094196
>peripheral
Doesn't look like a peripheral to me.

Besides, 32X was practically entirely new hardware specs that far surpassed the MD's. It is its own system, despite being plugged into a Genny.

My point is that a company can have more than one system concurrently running in the same generation.

>>1094198
You might want to take a look at >>1094171
then

>>1094217
The framerate is slow enough that you can see the judder on _YouTube_. Also, that's a demo - not a practical game.

The examples they show are all absolutely trivial to write on a PlayStation, run much faster, and don't require hand-tuned RISC assembly (SH-2 is a nightmare!) to work.

It's just math here - you're trying to fill over 4 million pixels per second to redraw the screen at 60fps. You're working with a 20MHz processor (we'll assume you're in an inner loop drawing the scene with one, and doing literally everything else - the game, the vertex manipulation, the rasterization, etc - on the other). As given in the manual, SH2 writes to the frame buffer incur between 1 and 3 wait states. So, on average you're taking 3 cycles to push a pixel. That's 12 million of your 20 million cycles per second, right there, just doing the write-out. Forget about loop iteration, pulling data from a texture, doing any kind of shading, etc. It's a RISC architecture (lots of instructions in the pipe to do anything) so this is really optimistic, too.

There's simply no way to hit a full-resolution full-framerate target on the 32x. Everything you do starts out with "let's use word writes and halve the horizontal resolution" or "let's run at 30fps (or lower)".

>>1094214

That's what SoA wanted to do, keep the Genesis alive and relevant with the 32X, for cheap, and target casual gamers with that while the hardcore crowd buy expensive Saturns

Then SoJ said ROR NO, ARR GAMU CANCERRED, GRORIOUS SATULN ONRY and the implosion began.

>>1094237
Addendum:
>A 4 word component of FIFO is held for frame buffer writing. Thus, 5 Clock is required
if FIFO is FULL and 3 Clock is required if FIFO is not FULL.

So you're probably taking closer to 4 SH-2 clock cycles to just write to the framebuffer.

Even if you're packing pixels in cache and writing word-at-a-time, that's a hell of a long time.

>>1094237
>60fps
>1990s

I had a 32X with a bunch of games and had no complaints whatsoever. wish I hadn't sold it in `97.

32X DOOM sure as hell ran a lot sweeter than on my 386DX-40.

>>1094245
Many (most?) Genesis games ran at a full 60hz because they were just sliding sprites around. Sure, 3D was impressive, but you're supposedly building a system to output to a 60hz TV.

>>1094245
That's barely 60fps if you're running a _2D_ game on the 32x. It struggles just to replicate what a sprite engine could do.

>>1094235
>>1094214
The Neptune was a great idea IMHO, shame they didn't release it and delay the Saturn.

>>1094247
>>1094249
>muh 60fps

Like I said, as a kid/teenager I had a Genesis, 32X, CD, and a SNES, and at no point do I ever remember saying "oh man this is so choppy," with any 32X game.

The 32X was a cheap system designed to keep the Genesis and its huge existing library relevant for a few more years, and it was great for that. Sure, it wasn't in the same league as Saturn or PSX, but it also cost half as much.

Given how SNES continued to print money for Nintendo up until the end of `96, I assume 32X might've even done what it was designed to do if Sega hadn't said CANCELLED LOL and screwed everything up again.

>>1094262
Sega cancelled the 32-X, then rushed out the Saturn (which was sprite-focused despite the fact Sega's own Arcade games were aggressively moving into polygonal games).

It would surely have been wiser to continue with the 32-X, release the Neptune as the "final Megadrive", then take their time getting the Saturn right.

But that would be sensible, so Sega Japan never did that.

>>1094293

Well, Sega cancelled all the 32X game, but they were sold side-by-side for a while.

Actually, the 32X version of Virtua Fighter came out after Saturn's launch, and played so incredibly better than the Saturn version it was terrifying.

But then, Saturn Virtua Fighter was truly terrible.

>>1094235
>>1094262
>>1094293
No, no, no, cut this out. The 32X was cancelled because it was dead on arrival. Poor sales, bad marketing, and the third party developers hated it.

Cheaply priced? The Genesis was $99 dollars at the time, the 32X was $150. A peripheral should not be more expensive than the core system. Sega made this same mistake with the Sega CD, but at least the Sega CD could also function as a CD player. The fact that some games required a Sega CD and a 32X meant that you were going to have as much invested in the system as you would have shelled out for a Saturn. Sega of America was initially opposed to the 32X, and it was Sega of Japan that forced it on them. While add-ons themselves aren't a bad idea, Sega in general was bad at marketing them.

The Dreamcast and Saturn were definitely cancelled before their time, sure. But the 32X was selling poorly from the day it came out.

is 32X true 32 bit? if so, then why isnt it considered 5th gen?

I got a 32X from Toys R Us when it was knocked down to $20. And I opened the box up and shoved a copy of Doom into the extra space inside. Best deal EVAR!

>>1094293
>which was sprite-focused despite the fact Sega's own Arcade games were aggressively moving into polygonal games

Sega accidentally caused that paradigm shift in gaming mind you. The Saturn was practically finalized when Virtua Fighter came out in 1993 December. In fact the Saturn was using practically the strongest arcade guts that Sega built in-house at that point (System 32). Model 1/2, which started the 3d boom, used what was practically military grade simulators.

>>1094349
>peripheral

It wasn't a peripheral, it was a system. Pay attention.

>But the 32X was selling poorly from the day it came out.
>Sega couldn't make them fast enough to keep up with orders in the first 3 months, managed to ship 600,000 on launch orders of 1,000,000

They cancelled it when it was still selling like hotcakes, because they wanted all development resources to focus on Saturn.

>The fact that some games required a Sega CD and a 32X meant that you were going to have as much invested in the system as you would have shelled out for a Saturn.

You mean the 3 or 4 32X versions of existing Sega CD games?

>the Genesis was $99 dollars at the time
>99 dollars dollars

No it wasn't.

>>1094368
Because it's an addon to an existing console.

>>1094409
>own CPUs, GPU vastly more powerful than Genesis, own RAM, and a totally different architecture than the Genesis
>games programmed in totally different language for said totally different CPUs and GPU
>don't work with anything but that system
>uses Genesis for controller ports, sound, and video outputs to keep costs low
>addon

lel

>>1094423
Be a snarky fuck all you like but if it plugs into the base unit, it's an addon.

>>1094390
>was practically military grade simulators.

I'm technologically impaired but is this true?

>>1094432

If it's got its own CPUs, GPU, RAM, and architecture, and its games could not possibly run on or even physically fit into the 'base uniit,' it's its own console, friend

>>1094390
But it was clear to Sega they had miscalculated, otherwise they would not have shoved the 3D stuff into the Saturn.

It would have been far smarter to sit on the Megadrive/32-X for a couple of years and release a more powerful Saturn a year or two down the road.

Sega Japan were obsessed with getting the Japanese games market with the Saturn. They succeeded in that, but fucked the American and European markets up in the process.
Sega Japan seemed to ignore the fact that the MD was successful in the West.

>>1094398
First off, it is a peripheral. It is a stand alone system? No. The Neptune would have been, but alas, we got the 32X, which is a peripheral as is it not a stand alone system. "But it uses it's own chips!" Well, it doesn't run on it's own, it's a peripheral. Stop being in denial and accept reality.

Oh, and those numbers? Demand among RETAILERS. Consumer demand was much, much lower. Out of it's year long lifespan, it sold only around 600,000 units. Even wikipedia quotes the highest estimates for total sales available as 665,000 units. It basically sold the amount available at launch, in a single year. Not good.

Second off, yes, I mean those. There were 6 Sega CD/32X games, out of 40 games for the system. 15%! If development had continued, we would have seen more. The argument that the 32X is was cost-effective compared to the Saturn is silly.

Oh no, I wrote dollars and put a dollar sign, my argument is demolished! Stop reaching. The Genesis core system with Sonic 2 pack-in sold for $99 at the time, I remember this because I bought my second Genesis back then after my original Model 1 got screwy.

Okay, let's get this straight. As a piece of hardware, the 32X is a fine, underrated machine. As a product, it was a complete disaster. I'm not blindly hating on the 32X here. I own one. I paid money for one when it came out. It didn't fail because Sega of Japan screwed it, it failed because it was a badly conceived product in the first place.

>>1094450
>Sega Japan seemed to ignore the fact that the MD was successful in the West.

The history between SoJ and the west is pretty much the history of SoA and SoE managing to succeed by going their own way, against what SoJ wanted, and then SoJ deciding all this huge success was clear proof of their own genius, taking over total control and promptly running the company into the ground.

Tom Kalinske made the Genesis/MD a huge success over the objections of SoJ, and they never forgave him for that.

>>1094462
>The Neptune would have been, but alas, we got the 32X, which is a peripheral as is it not a stand alone system.
>exactly the same system and hardware but inside one case is its own system
>exactly the same system and hardware in two cases plugged together is a peripheral

lel

>>1094468
Yes. It is a peripheral. Accept it and move on.

>>1094478
>autism slowly becoming hilariously evident

So if I take a 32X board and stick it inside a Genesis case, like this guy, it becomes a system instead of a peripheral?

Because that's all Neptune was.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSTCHG_XFco

>>1094450
>Sega Japan seemed to ignore the fact that the MD was successful in the West

Yeah, you're certainly right about that. The Mega-Drive (though I don't have any clear sources for this) was probably dead last behind the Super Famicom & PC-Engine in Japan

I mean what would you do in that situation? Sit on a failing console or try and make something new to attempt to reinvigorate interest?

>>1094490

Ruin all my finances trying to get a minor market than the one I'm actually doing well in, that's obvious!

The 32x port of Mortal Kombat II was the best version of that game.

>>1094485

I'm no economic nor marketing master, but I guess marketing an add-on is actually harder than marketing a new console?

After all that's why the WiiU is doing shit now, most people thought it was an addon or something like that for their Wii, shops even have to put a sign telling people WiiU games don't work on Wii's.

>>1094490

Well, when the overwhelming majority of sales and revenue were coming from America and Europe, it was by far the smart move to make

Unfortunately, all SoJ cared about was GRORIOUS NIPPON and so completely destroyed their worldwide business, and then their own, through their genius strategies that made the Master System and Genesis total market failures everywhere they were calling the shots

And then, hilariously, they somehow managed to interpret the success of SoJ and SoE as proof that they themselves really knew what was up and should just run the whole show.

Either that or Kalinske's runaway success reddened their sideways yellow anuses to the point that they couldn't stand it any more.

>>1094496

I was around for the 32X, and the problem was that after the things were flying off the shelves, suddenly all advertising and game announcements for them disappeared and the Saturn was all Sega was talking about

Sega of Japan had decided before the 32X even launched in NA that they were going to go all-in on Saturn.

>>1094485
Yes. The difference between a system and a peripheral is that one can run on it's own, the other must be attached to a core system to run. The Neptune would have been a system, and would have worked on it's own. The 32X was not sold as a stand alone system. Thus, it is a peripheral.

I don't understand why this upsets you so much. Being a peripheral doesn't necessarily make it bad. You don't need to be so damn defensive of an inanimate object.

>>1094502

So, literally, your definition of "system" depends on what plastic case the same hardware running the same cartridges is packaged in.

lel

>>1094146
Knuckles' Chaotix was a good game. Many of the games I've tried on emulator had great graphics and sound for the time. Still, I never would've bought one, it came out way to close to the next generation of consoles. For $30 I would've bought a 32X, maybe for $60 as well if there had been more games of interest to me than just Knuckles, but not fucking $160.

>>1094518
That's why I'm planning to get a Mega Everdrive cart as soon as the money rolls in

>>1094390
>get a used Model 2C cabinet
>it's a fucking giant box full of like a dozen boards and ribbons everywhere
jesus christ

>>1094442
The 3D engines were developed by Martin Marietta.

>>1094446
>>1094423
The 32X was originally developed as a new model of Genesis with an extended video chip (mainly, to give it a RGB555 framebuffer and enough RAM for that to be useful). They realized later that they would also need a dedicated processor set to draw into this framebuffer.

Also, the 32X has much MORE video circuitry than if it was standalone. It has to overlay its framebuffer output, with a transparency bit, over the Genesis' analog RGB.

So, good 32X games general then?

>>1094534

>>1094506
So is the Genesis two consoles at once? Is the CD 32X 4 consoles?

>>1094485
>So if I take a 32X board and stick it inside a Genesis case, like this guy, it becomes a system instead of a peripheral?
It becomes a more capable system, just like the X'Eye/Wondermega or CDX.

>>1094541

Genesis is a console, 32X is a console that can use the CD addon.

It's not hard to understand bro

>>1094545
>It becomes a more capable system

But it's the same hardware, you've just moved the 32X board into the Genesis case

>>1094553
Please stop getting baited by that poor troll.

>>1094553
You're not understanding what I'm saying.

The Genesis contains a complete 8-bit Z80-based computer system - typically used to drive the Yamaha FM synthesizer. It executes from its own separate RAM, too. It's tied to the 16-bit bus of the 68000 via a custom Sega bus controller. The SH-2 pair and the framebuffer in the 32X is tied to that same bus in the same way, with an additional bus controller, on the exact same bus.

Technically speaking, if the SH-2s and framebuffer are a different console, then so are the Z80 and YM2612.

Similarly, is the PlayStation 2 just two consoles in one box? It contains two separate CPUs, with two sets of RAM, and two different peripheral sets, again connected by a custom bus controller.

>people actually debating whether the 32X was an add-on or not

This is the worst thread on /vr/ right now.

>>1094565
The better argument is "Should it have been an add-on or it's own console?"

>>1094565
And you wonder why I don't trip anymore, this board went to complete shit and I feel bad about it now.

>>1094553
>32X is a console that can use the CD addon.
If you knew what the fuck you were talking about, you'd know that you can't control the CD from the SH-2s. Good thing one of us actually has experience with this hardware.

>>1094570
>thinks tripfagging is a good thing
>>>/v/

>>1094564
>Technically speaking, if the SH-2s and framebuffer are a different console, then so are the Z80 and YM2612.

>Similarly, is the PlayStation 2 just two consoles in one box? It contains two separate CPUs, with two sets of RAM, and two different peripheral sets, again connected by a custom bus controller.
>wrong about things

If the games are programmed for the hardware, and only work on that hardware, then it's a separate console. PlayStation 2 games are programmed for the specific architecture of the PS2. They don't work on a PS1, Saturn, or Dreamcast. 32X games are programmed for the specific 32X hardware. They don't work on a Genesis, Saturn, or anything but a 32X.

This isn't hard to understand.

>you can't control the CD from the SH-2s

But the CDs can contain SH-2 specific code, such as ran on the 32X. Which is what made the 32X CD games 32X games.

>>1094569
It should never have existed. Sega makes some dumb fucking decisions. Just think, they could still be relevant nowadays if they didn't come down with a case of extra chromosome

>>1094578
I tripped to start shit on here you moron, my post implied that I felt bad about doing what I did, because since then this board has seen a sharp decrease in post quality. Including you, shit for brains.

>>1094579
>32X games are programmed for the specific 32X hardware. They don't work on a Genesis, Saturn, or anything but a 32X.
So the Sega CD is a different console too? Sega CD games are programmed for the Sega CD hardware.

>>1094579
But can the 32x operate without a Genesis? No.

>>1094580
>come down with a case of extra chromosome

Those guys were always around, running Sega of Japan, the whole way through. There was just a period between 1990 and 1994 when they let Sega of America and Sega Europe do their own thing, who promptly turned the MD/Genesis into a massive success (outside Japan)

Then Japan took over again and destroyed everything.

>>1094585
>only posts ITT are "hey look at me"
>now just insulting people

It is good that you are contributing so much to the conversation

Sounds like you're just another retarded shitposter that's plaguing /vr/.

Again, gb2/v/

>>1094589
I just popped in to say that this board has gone to shit, simmer down kiddo

>>1094579
>But the CDs can contain SH-2 specific code, such as ran on the 32X
You have to move the code off of the sub-CPU RAM and into the SH-2 framebuffer BY USING THE GENESIS CPU.

The Genesis is in control of the entire system. The framebuffer is a peripheral that hangs off the side, as is the CD-ROM drive. Both have CPUs attached to offload their functionality.

>>1094591

Actually, that's a reasonable argument, since the CD contained its own 68000 and graphics chip.

>>1094592

Of course not, it was designed to also use the Genesis 68000, Z80, I/O etc to save money. Those were part of the 32X design.

Why is there a debate for this? It makes no sense. Should we debate whether or not the super gameboy is an addon for the SNES next?

>>1094579
>If the games are programmed for the hardware, and only work on that hardware, then it's a separate console.
Wait, so the N64 RAM expansion is a separate console? Is my Voodoo card a separate console? What about the SVP?

>>1094602
Yeah, let's start doing logical gymnastics segautist style and say some stupid shit! How bout it??!

>>1094601
>Actually, that's a reasonable argument, since the CD contained its own 68000 and graphics chip.
Alright, sweet, my Ensoniq Soundscape is a separate computer from my 486DX because it contains a 68000 and a sound chip!

>>1094601
>Of course not, it was designed to also use the Genesis 68000, Z80, I/O etc to save money. Those were part of the 32X design.
This doesn't make any fucking sense.

The SH-2 can't operate on its own. It can't operate with any arbitrary or generic equipment. It will only boot if attached to a Genesis with a Genesis cart header visible in the cartridge.

>>1094603
>RAM expansion
>same as two new CPUs running an entirely different instruction set, RAM, and a GPU, with exclusive software that cannot run on any other hardware

>upgraded GPU
>same as two new CPUs running an entirely different instruction set, RAM, and a GPU, with exclusive software that cannot run on any other hardware

>>1094610
>reasonable argument
>fact

lel

is super gameboy a console

>>1094585
Wow, I imagine you're quite the charmer with that kind of language

>>1094597
You're really not helping things

>>1094602
Should we debate that the Neptune isn't a legitimate console?

Let's face it, the 32X only relied on the Genesis for its PSU. Every other component was unique for the 32X, had its own games, and was only marketed along with the Genesis because it was popular at the time. Comparing it to something like a Game Genie is just absurd and overrides how much more powerful the 32X is over what it has to be inserted into to work.

>>1094617
You're asserting that the 32X is a separate console because it contains a new CPU, RAM, and an output device. How is my Ensoniq not a separate computer? It contains a new CPU, RAM, and an output device.

>>1094620
Well, kind of. They basically gutted a gameboy and stuck it in a SNES cart

>>1094617

>with exclusive software that cannot run on any other hardware

You know there were N64 games that wouldn't run without the RAM expansion, just like there are Genesis games that don't run without the 32x, right?

>>1094623
Neptune isn't real, it was never produced. As it stands sega marketed it as a "boost" for your genesis and it performs as an add-on. You're just arguing for the sake of arguing when the majority very obviously disagrees

>>1094620
Yes, obviously, because it has a CPU in it!

Guys, the Sega Channel is a separate console! The 64DD is a separate console! Every CD-ROM drive or IDE hard drive you've put in your computer is a separate console!

>>1094625
What's the point, what's done is done and this board will never be the way it was back in the early summer

>>1094617
>>upgraded GPU
>>same as two new CPUs running an entirely different instruction set, RAM, and a GPU, with exclusive software that cannot run on any other hardware
Yes, yes it is.

Especially nowadays, given that GPUs are fully programmable. Your Radeon or GeForce has a new instruction set, its own RAM, and a video output. It's connected to your computer as a peripheral, just like the 32X is connected to the Genesis as a peripheral.

>>1094623
Neptune as in the prototype that was never released is a console yes.

32x is an addon as it required a mega drive to work, even if you stuck it in a mega drive case it'd still require some modification to make it work properly because it can't do anything by itself.

>>1094639
Fucking this, 32x is pretty much a 3d graphics card for your genesis.

>>1094623
>Let's face it, the 32X only relied on the Genesis for its PSU
But that's fucking wrong. The 32X contains software which runs on the Genesis to start the boot process. It contains a memory mapper to expand the address space available on the cartridge. Games typically render at least some of the screen using the Genesis sprite engine. Most of the sound is done via the Genesis Z80+YM setup. The controllers (and any other peripheral that's not slapped in the cart address space) are controlled by the Genesis.

Hell, on boot, the Genesis 68000 controls the 32X framebuffer, its audio DAC, and the entire bus system. You have to initialize the SH2s and give them control of those.

>>1094638
The shitposting isn't nearly as bad as you think it is but if you want to have that kind of negative attitude, then so be it. I've been here since the first week and I have absolutely no intention of leaving

>>1094616
>This doesn't make any fucking sense.

It makes perfect sense. What, did you want 32X to emulate Genesis games?

>>1094624
>thinks a keyboard is a games console

I understand why you're having problems now!

>>1094628
>You know there were N64 games that wouldn't run without the RAM expansion
>this PC game requires 4GB of RAM and I only have 2
>therefore if I plug 2GB of RAM into my PC it becomes a totally different computer

lel

>>1094639
>PC games are written for specific graphics cards and won't run at all on anything but the one specific graphics card
>oh wait

That's the difference between a peripheral and a console. Your PC will run GTA IV whether there's a Radeon or GeForce in it, because those are peripherals. A 32X game won't run on a Saturn or a Genesis, because they're all seperate consoles.

Sup /vr/, I have a problem. I just plugged Doom into my 32X console and it doesn't work. Can anyone help?

>>1094643
This description is as accurate as you'll get. It looks very much like a modern GPU, in fact, with multiple programmable RISC engines attached to dedicated RAM and a framebuffer and controlled by a separate CISC CPU.

>>1094650
>What, did you want 32X to emulate Genesis games?
No, because it's a Genesis peripheral. If the Genesis boots and doesn't initialize the 32X, it's just a Genesis.

>>1094650
>I understand why you're having problems now!
The Ensoniq Soundscape is a 16-bit ISA card.

>>1094650
>>therefore if I plug 2GB of RAM into my PC it becomes a totally different computer
>lel
Well, this is what you're asserting. You're telling me that, because games require 3D acceleration, my 3D accelerator is a totally different machine from my PC. It's not. I plug a 3D accelerator into my PC to play PC games which require one. I plug my 32X into my Genesis to play Genesis games which require one.

>>1094650
>>PC games are written for specific graphics cards and won't run at all on anything but the one specific graphics card
You must be fucking underage if you don't remember this era.

>>1094650
>Your PC will run GTA IV whether there's a Radeon or GeForce in it, because those are peripherals. A 32X game won't run on a Saturn or a Genesis, because they're all seperate consoles.
I can't run MechWarrior 2: 3D RAGE edition on a Voodoo. I can't run Verite Quake on a Matrox.

>>1094656
Try putting your 32X Doom cartridge into a Genesis, that should fix it.

Oh wait...

>>1094665
In practice, this mode was never used. The hardware was designed to accommodate it. You can produce a cartridge which doesn't contain the typical MARS security+check as the first code, but instead load it into the 32X framebuffer (as 32X CD games do). It is entirely possible to produce a Genesis game which optionally uses the 32X.

>>1094662
>You're telling me that, because games require 3D acceleration, my 3D accelerator is a totally different machine from my PC.

I was actually mocking you, because that's the necessary assertion you'd have to make. Your PC can play anything no matter what brand of GPU peripheral's plugged in there, because GPUs are peripherals.

32X software only runs on 32X hardware, because it's a separate console. Try getting a 32X game to play on a Saturn sometime, let me know how it goes.

>You must be fucking underage if you don't remember this era.

I remember running a lot of games in software rendering because I didn't have a 3Dfx card, but the games still ran, just without GLide goodness because I didn't have that peripheral.

Try playing a 32X game on a Genesis!

>I can't run MechWarrior 2: 3D RAGE edition on a Voodoo. I can't run Verite Quake on a Matrox.
>branded versions of games

Same game, just with an unnecessary DLL check. If anyone had cared, a simple wrapper would've done it.

So you're still wrong <3

>>1094665
Eat shit, troll. /vr/ told me that 32X isn't an add-on. I don't need a Genesis.

I'm not getting any picture either. I think it's because I'm not using a CRT TV.

>>1094678
>Same game, just with an unnecessary DLL check. If anyone had cared, a simple wrapper would've done it.
Jesus christ, you're fucking dumb. The "3D RAGE edition", "Voodoo edition", etc were programmed at a low-level (or through a proprietary API) to work with one graphics card. This is why OpenGL was important - it let games run generically. You CANNOT run VQuake on a RAGE. It doesn't work. It's written to the Verite cards at a low level. That doesn't make the Verite a separate system, it makes it a peripheral with games tailored for it. Same thing with the 32X.


>So you're still wrong <3
Don't be a condescending prick. I'm trying to bring some actual technical knowledge to this thread, which I've accumulated (a long-ass time ago) working with the 32x.

>>1094684

It's a console that you add on to another console.

Other people are saying it's a peripheral, which it isn't.

>>1094684
>/vr/ told me that 32X isn't an add-on. I don't need a Genesis

Unless you own a modded console, I believe you're sorely mistaken friend

>>1094678
>I was actually mocking you, because that's the necessary assertion you'd have to make.
I'm not making that assertion. My Radeon GPU is a peripheral on my x86_64 PC, just like my SH-2 32X is a peripheral on my 68000 Mega-Drive.

>Your PC can play anything no matter what brand of GPU peripheral's plugged in there, because GPUs are peripherals.
No, because GPUs have an intermediate layer (the 3D stack + drivers) which allows this to work. I can't run a GeForce driver and expect that GeForce driver to properly set up and run my Radeon.

If you were around in the DOS days, you'd know how this works.

>>1094687
>Jesus christ, you're fucking dumb. The "3D RAGE edition", "Voodoo edition", etc were programmed at a low-level (or through a proprietary API) to work with one graphics card.

ur rong lol, software renderer still exists in the game. I mean, that's leaving aside the whole x86 bit, and we're only talking about the graphic rendering.

>I'm trying to bring some actual technical knowledge to this thread

lel

>it's a peripheral because you plug it in lol
>if it were in one case, then it'd be a console
>even though it is exactly the same chips and architecture
>such tehcnics

>>1094690
>add-on
>n. (computing, hardware, software) A software extension or hardware peripheral that provides additional functions or customization for a core application or system.
>peripheral

>>1094692
>drivers are consoles now
>if I use the wrong driver for my graphics card, it doesn't work
>therefore 32X is a peripheral

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>1094692
>My Radeon GPU is a peripheral on my x86_64 PC, just like my SH-2 32X is a peripheral on my 68000 Mega-Drive.
>Radeon GPU works with any game the x86 can run, can be interchanged with any other GPU without affecting system functionality one bit

This is why that's a peripheral

>32X games only run on 32X hardware, because it's a console

That's why it's a console

>>1094693
>ur rong lol, software renderer still exists in the game
No, it doesn't. Those games shipped with multiple versions (one software-rendering, one 3D accelerated for a specific hardware). You know, just like the CD32X games.

You can't run VQuake without a Verite. You can't run 32X Doom without a 32X. That doesn't make the Verite or the 32X separate machines. They're peripherals. They sit outside the main memory space on a larger machine, you know, in the periphery.

>>1094702
>>drivers are consoles now
>>if I use the wrong driver for my graphics card, it doesn't work
>>therefore 32X is a peripheral
>HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Please rebut the arguments as stated, not strawmen.

>>1094702
>Radeon GPU works with any game the x86 can run, can be interchanged with any other GPU without affecting system functionality one bit
I just told you, I can't swap out my Radeon for a GeForce without running different software.

>>1094702
I need software written specifically for my Radeon to use the Radeon's 3D capabilities, just like I need software written specifically for my 32X to use my 32X's capabilities.

You're not really understanding this, and I'm having a difficult time believing that you've got the requisite technical knowledge to do so. I'm gonna stop responding.

Welp, I gotta bail, but it has been fun trolling the Jesus out of Sega autists once more

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_32X

>The Sega 32X is an add-on for the Sega Genesis video game console.

>>1094704
>Those games shipped with multiple versions (one software-rendering, one 3D accelerated for a specific hardware).

Actually, that is completely wrong.

>You can't run VQuake without a Verite.

"The E-reader is a console and not a peripheral because it's the only thing that can read E-readers"

32Xfag logic

>>1094707
>>1094706
>a driver patch will let a Genesis run 32X games

You are just too much fun

>>1094709

>>1094656
>>1094684
Don't listen to the naysayers, the 32X is a stand alone console. You're missing one of these.

It's a Link Cable, it links directly to your brain and feeds the image there directly. The 32X is so stand alone you don't even require a television. You can find them online for like 4 or 5 bucks. Trust me, you don't want them used.

>>1094714

I actually owned that.

>tfw being an uneducated teenager, and buying a RAGE II+ just as the Voodoo2 dropped

>>1094712
>>a driver patch will let a Genesis run 32X games
>You are just too much fun
Yep, if you bypass the MARS Security/Check program (and dummy any code which tries to read back results, etc) you can run 32X games on the Genesis. You don't get the 32x graphics, though.

>>1094725
>a background is a game

>>1094728
Well, what did you expect? You don't have the necessary graphics peripheral.

>>1094731
>graphics peripheral
>executes the game's actual code

>>1094734

Sometimes I think I should have picked one up while they were dirt cheap at Kmart. But I never felt the need to own one. They should have made the 32x stand-alone in the first place. Although then again, why release the Neptune if the Saturn was already out in Japan. I'm glad the age of console add-ons is over. It was kind of cool at first. But the 32x was ugly and excessive. Knuckles Chaotix should have been saved for the Saturn.

>>1094734
A video game console is an interactive computer that produces a video display signal which can be used with a display device (a television, monitor, etc.) to display a video game.

>feeds trolls
So If I put an after market graphics card in my gaming computer... is it a new computer?

>>1094864
A computer isn't a single thing, mate. It's a collection of components that make up a personalized hardware. Consoles are standard and generally not customizable. PCs are not.

ITT: Masterful trolling. 9/10