/vr/ - Retro Games

I don't like Kiddy Kong, and I don't really like collecting stuff.

The first one is my favorite, because you actually play as Donkey Kong.

Bump.
I liked it too. Haven't played the first boss but the levels are nicely done. The secrets seems harder to find do to using Kiddy to break floors or heavy shit, or the overworld birds and vehicles and the collectibles feel more rewarding in getting them and not so punishing like in DK2 in my opinion. It controls just fine like any dk game and the music seems good.

>>1083781
But Kiddy Kong was so much more useful than Donkey Kong. Collecting stuff was optional anyway.

>>1083786
Yeah, I know collecting isn't mandatory but I feel like I have to. Call it autism. I feel like there's a ton of shit going on in the third game, it just feels a bit overwhelming. I like the simplicity of the first game more.

>>1083778
>So, can anyone tell me why exactly DKC3 is treated as the black sheep of the DKC series?

You can't play as Donkey Kong Diddy was at least grandfathered in through DK1. Rare occasionally got Sonic cast embarrassing with their additions to the DKU.

>>1083778
It was a nice game, I preferred it more than the first, but it wasn't as much of a master piece as the second. It came from some new angles, but I think, in all honesty, that the biggest reason people hated it was Kiddy Kong; a terrible character who controlled terribly and whose only benefit was to contribute to tedious collecting. But other than Kiddy Kong, it had A class music, level design, and gameplay for sure.

>>1083801
I see. Though I think we can agree that this pov is just a minority, and probably not the reason why people shit on DKC3.

>>1083802
>>1083803
Well, I can see why Rare shoehorning in characters can be seen as Sanic-tier, but I never got why it was Diddy Kong that got so much hate. He controlled just like Donkey Kong, and on top of that had more abilities like jumping on water, throwing Dixie, stomping or letting Dixie ride on his back while rolling.

And one thing I'll have to say about DKC2, while this is not really criticism, but rather something I feel like noting: in DKC2 the Kongs are too similar. Yeah, they have slight quirks, Diddy is a little faster while Dixie can glide for a while, but all in all it just feels like one monkey with two hit points.
In DKC3 the two Kongs were so different and so useful together as a team that you always cared about which one you currently have. Getting hit in DKC2 just makes you go "Eh, I still have the other one.", if you get what I mean.

I think if you have a cast of two protagonists, you might aswell make them as different as possible while still making them cooperating well. Otherwise you could just replace one of them with a powerup.

Also, official thread music:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qntu2QvHQRE

>>1083778

>>music is not as good
>>enemy designs are just awful
>>level design isn't half as good
>>swanky mini game is shit
>>bears and banana birds
>>funky looks like a faggot now

2, 1, returns, 3

>>1083823
>music is not as good
I disagree. It usually was a great fit for the ambiente it was made for.

>enemy designs are just awful
I think it was about the same. Can you give more examples?

>level design isn't half as good
This is a very vague statement. I don't see why the level design in DKC3 was any worse, and it had a lot of fresh ideas everywhere.

>bears and banana birds
The bears were funny and made up for some entertaining sde quests. Don't see what's wrong with optiona collectables.

>funky looks like a faggot now
I think the music from DKC1's Funky was gayer than anything DKC3 could throw at him. Especially if it's just a belt.

2 > 3 > R > 1

>>1083814
I think another issue is that players, and especially reviewers, can be harsh and touchy when it comes to video game animal characters. There's always a tone of disgust of despising them, with the exception of "classics". Then there's the dread accusation of furriness. Cute characters get a lot of hate, because they're seen as being "below" older players; just cute-appeal for kids. I think that played a role in killing these sorts of games off besides a few major franchises.

Reading game magazine reviews as a kid of these kinds of platformers were always frustrating because you could tell a lot of reviewers had vitriol for reviewing this sort of thing.

>>1083853
Eh, thing is DKC3 came out in a time when cute animal anthropomorphs were the vast majority of vidya protagonists. People even criticize Kiddy if they loved Donkey Kong Country 1 and 2.

Personally 2 is my favorite. My main issues with 3 are that when you happen to lose Dixie, you feel like all you are doing with kiddy is running and hoping to survive to the next barrel full of monkey.

2 goes through so many environments, has music that draws out the feeling of each environment, and has so much more variation to levels that doesnt have the same gimmicky feel that lots of 3 seems to have.

>>1083875
Eh, you get that feeling both games - because, well, Dixie is pretty overpowered with her gliding - but I think Kiddy is more useful.than Diddy within the game because he simply has abilities that you cannot do with Dixie. Kiddy is just a faster Dixie without the pony tail.

And I think about the level design, you might want to play both games again. DKC2 had its fair amount of "gimmicky" levels, like the one where you have to jump through green barrels to keep the monsters from waking up, and stuff like that. Yeah, maybe DKC3 did have more levels with "gimmics", but it never got in the way of the enjoyability. Except that level that reverses your controls holy fuck that was a bunch of crap It usually took it more to the extreme than the other games, which resulted in levels like the one with the burning rope, the water fall boss, the level where someone is constantly shooting at you or the level with Nibbla.

All in all I think what is so great about the Donkey Kong Country series is that no level is truely like the others. There always is some gimmick or idea or quirk that puts it apart from the other level in the respective worlds.

>>1083882
>Kiddy is just a faster Dixie without the pony tail.
I meant Diddy.

Damn, these names are stupeed.

>>1083814
>I never got why it was Diddy Kong that got so much hate. He controlled just like Donkey Kong

He really didn't... try replaying both the original the this one, and then see if you can say the same thing. Controlling Kiddie was like trying to control a boulder with weak springs for legs.

>>1083778
>It has the better boss battles and the best animal friends, that's for sure.
Riiiight.

>>1083950
Ellie was great, and much more useful than Rambi. She could di stuff luke carry barrels and shoot water. Rambi was just a boring "invincibility" power up.

Also, that water fall was a great boss. What do you find wrong with it?

>>1083827
>>music is not as good
>I disagree. It usually was a great fit for the ambiente it was made for.
>>enemy designs are just awful
>I think it was about the same. Can you give more examples?
>>1083827
Did you even play the first 2? The music doesn't compare. That anon had it right 2 > 1 > Returns > 3
As for the enemies the just seem like less thought was put into them. The barrels that run at you are good examples. They look so much better in 2. In 3 they have those painted faces and look extremely childish even if it isn't an adults game.

>>1083956
Thought it was the least fun boss in any of the DKCs. The thing even looks retarded. I don't really like the animal boss fights either except for King Zing Sting in 2. 3's World environments are also lacking. It has the least replay value of any of them. Not to mention it's not even hard to get DK coins as they are out in the open.

It is a good game, it's just the worst of the series.

>>1083958
>Did you even play the first 2? The music doesn't compare. That anon had it right 2 > 1 > Returns > 3
It might not be as good as the music in 2, but it is always a good fit for the environment.

And I really don't get your criticism about the enemy design. Painted faces look childish? All the enemies have something silly to their design, so what is wrong with an enemy trying to appear more threatening by painting a aggressive face on his barrel?

>>1083964
I don't get it. What is not fun about the water fall? How is it fun compared to, say, the flying ghost sword? You dodge the attacks until you get the opportunity to grab the weapon you need to defeat him, attack him, rinse and repeat. Is it because there are no second forms or something like that?
The bosses DKC3 were just so much more creative than the ones in previous games. It was dissapointing how much of a step backwards Returns was to that, where it was basically "wait for thing to jump on, then jump on it", atleast for the most part.

And how is King Zing Sting so much better than, say, the giant clam in DKC3?

>3's World environments are also lacking.
Less vague please. Give examples.

>It has the least replay value of any of them.
What? It has the most collectables, and many "sidequests" if you want, something that was completely absent in DKC1. And actually any other DKC for that matter.

>Not to mention it's not even hard to get DK coins as they are out in the open.
Not really. Some of them are in the earlier levels, but they are usually about how to get the coin, not where it is. Like the cannons in DKC2, just that they have a funnier design.

>>1083882
>>1083875
I dont disagree that there are some gimmick levels in 2, and I am also not saying 3 isnt worth playing. I am saying that when I pick a DKC game to replay, 2 is where I start.

You know, I haven't played the game in ages. I stopped halfway somewhere when I was small, but I don't remember why -- it just seemed to lack something the other games had.

I'm going to go play it and give you a review on whether I feel it's worse than the other two, and if so why.

>>1083982
>>3's World environments are also lacking.
>Less vague please. Give examples.
I'm not even sure what to call these worlds that would be different.

>>1083778
>It has the better boss battles
2 has better ones. Though 3 is still way, way ahead of 1.
>and the best animal friends
Ellie ahead of Rambi? lolno
>It also has the most diverse cast with different abilities, while still having the best cooperation between the two Kongs
Diverse, yes. Best, no. While the Dixie/ Diddy combo was less diverse and gave less options, it suited the DKC gameplay more.
>It has much more creative level ideas
Quite.
>It is way, way better than DKC1
Quite.
>And I'd say it is up to debate if it is equal to DKC2.
Quite.
>So, can anyone tell me why exactly DKC3 is treated as the black sheep of the DKC series?
Because the first world is a piece of boring shit and a lot of people quit playing the game before reaching worlds 3 and up, where the game starts to get genuinely great (World 2 being okay-ish).

>>1083982
>What is not fun about the water fall?
You jump around in a circle on tiny platforms while dealing with a heavy Ellie that controls like shit. The only challenge is trying not to land too far to the side of a platform which makes you slip and fall out of the screen with no chance of recovery. "Heavy" characters is one of the main problems that makes DKC3 so much less fun to play than the two previous games.

In >>1083882 you wrote that Diddy is just a faster Dixie without the pony tail. This isn't blatantly wrong, but Diddy isn't "just" faster, he's a lot faster. His rolls and jumps get you a lot further than every other character in the series, which makes a really huge difference when you're playing the games for the nth time and are coming back for the speedy platforming which makes the games so enjoyable to replay.

Dixie's hover ability makes her the easier character to keep from falling off the screen and accurately land on the precise spots of your choosing, but that's the extent of her usefulness; making play easier. Once you've mastered the game and are playing not to see the next stage, but to find out how fast you can progress through the obstacles, she is just too slow to be of any use.

In this way, both of the first two titles had balance in their characters, one quick and one slow. Donkey's perk of being able to jump on certain enemies that Diddy can not isn't as useful as Dixie's hovering, but he also wasn't as slow, making him less frustrating to play.

>I think Kiddy is more useful.than Diddy within the game because he simply has abilities that you cannot do with Dixie.
You keep mentioning how useful Kiddy is, but in reality his only useful special move is being able to jump on water, and there are very few places in the game where you actually get to do this.

post is too long, i'll have to split here

continued from >>1084019

>>1083814
>throwing Dixie, stomping or letting Dixie ride on his back while rolling
Throwing Dixie was not something unique to him in the bigger picture, it was a mechanic introduced in DKC2 that worked just the same there. The difference here is that they decided to add that stomping, making Dixie unable to throw him properly due to the weight, which just made you need to switch characters more often. Being able to roll Kiddy and ride on top of him was a nice touch, but it's not Kiddy but Dixie that performs the move, and it's more of a novelty than in any way useful.

>He controlled just like Donkey Kong
This is just not true, Kiddy is way slower and heavier, making him a very different character to play.


In this post I have only addressed the problem of the game featuring two equally slow characters, contributing to make it a sluggish experience to play. This is only part of the problem, where an equally damaging factor is the generally shoddy and gimmick-ridden level design hindering the flow of movement that previous games allowed, but that is something to write about in another post.

Contemplating on DKC3 has caused the anal frustration to start manifesting, so I'll have to take a break from posting.

>>1084006
>>1084008
Oh, that. Well, I can see where you are coming from here, but the levels themselves still had very different themese, so this is just a very minor nitpick.

>>1084014
>Ellie ahead of Rambi? lolno
Ellie was more useful than Rambi and more than just a "move faster invincibly" power up.

>Diverse, yes. Best, no. While the Dixie/ Diddy combo was less diverse and gave less options, it suited the DKC gameplay more.
Probably. I am just arguing here that there was certainly a thought process behind putting Kiddy Kong in, and it wasn't just for the sake of putting in OC Donut Steal, like some people tend to imply it.

>>1084019
Okay. I think I should replay DKC2, last time I played it was a few years ago.

>Throwing Dixie was not something unique to him in the bigger picture, it was a mechanic introduced in DKC2 that worked just the same there. The difference here is that they decided to add that stomping, making Dixie unable to throw him properly due to the weight, which just made you need to switch characters more often. Being able to roll Kiddy and ride on top of him was a nice touch, but it's not Kiddy but Dixie that performs the move, and it's more of a novelty than in any way useful.
I didn't say that DKC3 invented the throwing, but it was certainly perfected here. The characters work well together, because they explore this mechanic. The fact that you have to switch characters is a good sign in my opinion, because it indicates that there IS a difference between which character you play.
And this is also one thing that I attribute to one of Diddy's abilities: teamplay. The two Kongs have a better teamplay than the two in 1 and 2. Sure, you can be nitpicky about if this is an ability of Kiddy, but I hope you see my point.

>This is just not true, Kiddy is way slower and heavier, making him a very different character to play.
Hmm. I might have to replay DKC1 aswell then. They felt very same to me last time I played.

>the generally shoddy and gimmick-ridden level design hindering the flow of movement that previous games allowed
I don't think it was that gimmick-ridden, really. It just had more vertical levels, like the trees, waterfalls and mountains. This, combined with the slower character movement you already explained, might lead to the idea that the levels themselves are hindering flow of movement.

>>1083989
So, I'm on world 2 now.
1. ... Is every DK coin going to be held as a shield by those crocs? It was neat the first time I saw it, but I'd like some variation...
2. The barrel boss didn't exactly... seem like a boss. It couldn't HURT me, and I got a bonus coin for beating it? It kind of seemed like an extra stage more than a boss. No sense of closure at all...
3. The stages seem kind of scattered. There's factory stages and water stages and a random snow stage all in the same world, no sense of unity at all.

2>3>1 for me

>>1084019
>You keep mentioning how useful Kiddy is, but in reality his only useful special move is being able to jump on water
>his only useful special move is being able to jump on water
How do you do that? I can't get it to work.

>>1084074
>Is every DK coin going to be held as a shield by those crocs? It was neat the first time I saw it, but I'd like some variation...
Yes, like said earlier, it is kinda like the cannon in DKC2: it is about finding them, and the finding our how to defeat them. It is extremely easy in the first few levels, but that curve will go up heavily.

2. The barrel boss didn't exactly... seem like a boss. It couldn't HURT me, and I got a bonus coin for beating it? It kind of seemed like an extra stage more than a boss. No sense of closure at all...
Yeah, it's a pretty weak boss. You get a coin because the next world is just down the road. usually you get a part of a vehicle to give Funky, who then builds a vehicle for you to reach a new world with.

>3. The stages seem kind of scattered. There's factory stages and water stages and a random snow stage all in the same world, no sense of unity at all.
Yeah, the first world just feels like a generic jack-of-all-trades introduction to the gameworld in general. The worlds later have much more coherent themes.

This thread makes me crave some DKC. Might plug up the snes and hit up 2. Speedrun time.

>>1084081
You need to roll off a ledge and press B when Kiddy touches the water surface. This can be chained into a triple jump, speed and altitude increasing with each consecutive jump.

The timing is very delicate, making it one of the most difficult moves in the series to pull off. It's not very useful though, unfortunately. I can't think of many places where it cuts down on times outside of world 1, and if you're aiming for speed you'll be using the warp barrels anyway.

>>1084124
Thanks! And nah, nothing like that - I'm a completionist, not a speedrunner. I've just seen bonus barrels and stuff I can't get to normally.

>>1084179
Are you the guy from before who made this post?
>>1084074


If yes, how much further are you? What do you think so far?

>>1084194
I think it sucks compared to 2.

>>1084194
Actually I am, yeah! I got distracted by a manga my friend linked me, so I ended up pausing after I beat Riverside Race -- I'm gonna go fetch the bonuses I couldn't reach and then move on.

>>1084232
Ah, cool. Let me know what you think, it is always interesting to "follow" people on their first playthrough through a game.

I might be gone for a few hours when you post, but I doubt threads 404'ing is much of a big deal on a board like /vr/.

>>1083778

When the game came out the N64 was at the door. So it was overlooked without deserving that...

>much more creative level ideas

Hell yeah. My absolute favourite one is that one where that crosshair is following you and trying to track you and shoot you. That keeps it so interesting, forcing you to always keep moving. It also has the best bonus room (annoyed by the crosshair? Well now YOU are the crosshair...). I was so sad when reaching that sign where it cannot follow you, it felt like leaving an old friend behind (that shoots at you...)

>>1084261
>Hell yeah. My absolute favourite one is that one where that crosshair is following you
You're that guy who talked about the crosshair in a previous DKC thread too, right? That bonus room is so great

>>1084261
It blew my mind as a kid when Wrinkly Kong was playing Mario 64 before I did!

>>1084264

Actually, no.

Nice to see there are more fans of that level

>>1083778
i wouldn't call it a black sheep, cuz i fuckin' loved it. just not as much as DKC 2 hehe

>>1084026
>Ellie was more useful than Rambi and more than just a "move faster invincibly" power up.
Useful because she had levels tailored towards her, while Rambi was pretty universal. Plus, she was really fucking slow, which is, well... WRONG for a DKC game.

I see your point, re: Rambi basically just being a quasi-invincibility power up, and there's certainly better companions (Squitter master race represent), but he still beats Ellie.

>Probably. I am just arguing here that there was certainly a thought process behind putting Kiddy Kong in, and it wasn't just for the sake of putting in OC Donut Steal, like some people tend to imply it.
Not denying that.

>>1084074
>1. ... Is every DK coin going to be held as a shield by those crocs? It was neat the first time I saw it, but I'd like some variation...
Yes. The way to get them changes, though. From Koin simply being somewhere along the way, to Koin being hidden, to having to crack quasi-puzzles to get the barrel beyond Koin's shield. World 3 starts to have the first genuinely interesting Koin challenges.
>2. The barrel boss didn't exactly... seem like a boss. It couldn't HURT me, and I got a bonus coin for beating it? It kind of seemed like an extra stage more than a boss. No sense of closure at all...
It's a terrible boss. It and the world 3 boss are basically DKC1 Boss level challenges - I.e. there is no actual challenge.

World 5, 7 & 8 have pretty great bossfights, though. Arguably 4 and 6 as well. World 2 is meh.

>3. The stages seem kind of scattered. There's factory stages and water stages and a random snow stage all in the same world, no sense of unity at all.
Yes, it's a problem. It's a problem previous games had, too. Random jungle and temple stages in the temperate zone in DKC, indistinct cave stages everywhere but the ice world... DKC2 had this problem the least, but even it had swamp- and hive stages on a quasi-random basis.

>>1084124
>>1084179
Not that this jump is required to get to a bonus barrel in Riverside Race, world 2.

That's literally the only part where you've to pull it off for 103/ 105%, though.

Yeah, not the brightest design choice.

OP, I hope you realize the music of DKC3 was not composed by the composers of the DKC1 and DKC2 OST. The music team left after DKC2.

>>1084493
I think david wise was still in charge of the music. He's in the kredits.

I also didn't mind kiddy, although he was kinda underpowered compared to Diddy or DK. I pretty much did the entire game with Dixie in the lead.

>>1084492
>That's literally the only part where you've to pull it off for 103/ 105%, though.
You also need it in Tidal Trouble, world 1. It's actually trickier there, because you fall so long before the first jump, it's very easy to mess up timing.

These two bonus barrels are the extent of what you'll be using the mechanic for, yeah.

>>1084493
>The music team left after DKC2.
lel, /vr/ in charge of talking out their asses

>>1084520
>I think david wise was still in charge of the music.
nope, he wasn't. dave wise did ONE track for the game, Crazy Calypso (the file select theme), the rest was all eveline fischer (now novakovic). dave did the whole soundtrack for the gba port, though.

i can't say i liked eveline's work on dkc3 very much to be honest, but the factory music was good at least. her work on dkc1 was brilliant though, with fantastic tracks like voices of the temple and northern hemispheres

>>1084242
Just beat world 3. (Currently searching for that second bonus barrel in Fish Food Frenzy...)

1. I have to say, all the overworlds look very similar so far. Even the area supposedly taken over by machines is just sort of... grassland with wooden houses and a metal pole.
2. The enemies... A lot of them are just old enemies, given a makeover. I don't understand, why did they do this? It's the exact same bee enemy, except with a buzzsaw attached to its butt. Same clap trap, except less cute. Same barrel kremlin except now they draw a big evil face on their barrel and completely lose the stealth aspect for some reason. Why would they change the design?
3. I am NOT fond of Ellie, at all. She's too clumsy and fragile for my tastes, no better than using the kongs. She also comes off as the developer team's sweetheart -- I've seen the others, but in all but one case they had optional and short-lived appearances to make things easier. Ellie's gotten a major role in three stages now, AND her own boss (which I died ten times on just because of her slippery clumsiness). I kind of miss Rammy...

>>1084564
Actually I bypassed the need for that one with Dixie's hovering and a good running start. It really is only needed in Riverside Race.

>>1083827
>I think it was about the same. Can you give more examples?
Compare the grunt in DKC3 to the ones in 1 and 2.

I don't know why they gave it big, soulful eyes when the others had beady and shifty ones.

>>1084602
>2. The enemies... A lot of them are just old enemies, given a makeover. I don't understand, why did they do this? It's the exact same bee enemy, except with a buzzsaw attached to its butt. Same clap trap, except less cute. Same barrel kremlin except now they draw a big evil face on their barrel and completely lose the stealth aspect for some reason. Why would they change the design?
DKC3's enemy design is one of its weakest points. This being said, while the bees and the bogstandard kremlings are shit, some others, like clasps, krushas, Koins, Kopters... Are pretty great. A pretty mixed bag.
Also lol @ dying to the W3 boss.

>>1084621
The Chinese Immigrant Association complained about the shifty eyes.

>>1084602

At least with the Zingers this change is kinda explainable.
The Zingers are staple enemies, often used as an obstacle to complicate an else easy path, this type of enemy is essential. Now, the game has an overall mechanic theme, with K.K. Rool being not in the game and replaced by the robotic KAOS *wink wink* so they wanted to replace this type of common enemy with one that fits the theme, so now the wasps are half-robot and therefore now carry buzzsaws.
Now why they did not use that theme at the other enemies too... I think they just wanted to do sth. "different"...

>>1084670
>Now why they did not use that theme at the other enemies too... I think they just wanted to do sth. "different"...
>Steampunk Kremlings
All my wants

>>1084609
That bonus barrel was actually among the very last ones I got on my original save file on the cart, I just couldn't pull off the water jumps consistently enough as a kid to get over there and thought I'd tried to fly over equally as many times without success. Thanks for the correction, I'll try to use Dixie to hover over there my next playthrough (probably in a few years time, I'm still mad as fuck at the game after the 104% playthrough I did last Christmas).

>>1084680

I used the water jump and got it after a few tries. I don't think it's THAT hard...

>>1084691
i know it's not, i just sucked too much to pull off the triple jump as a kid. it's gotten better over the years

I never liked 3 because Kiddy Kong's controls feel very sloppy and shitty. I always feel like I'm pressing my controller telling him to do something and it takes him a second to actually do what he's supposed to.

>>1084670
going to go off his post

Don't forget, you fought "king" zing in 2, and in 1 you fought "queen" b. I imagine it might be a continuity thing as well, since both were dead KAOS had to make robot bees instead of relying on natural ones.

>>1084667
As I said, I do not like Ellie. The boss was easy once I got the hang of it, but I kept falling off due to her slipperiness (often even without being hit by water).

Anyway, just got to the ice world. I love snow stages, so this will be fun! (I've started skipping bonus barrels now, since there's some I just can't find despite going through the stage several times...)

By the way, what are the banana birds for? I accidentally skipped grandma's bird talk. Also, can you use the silver bear coins for anything other than the minigame tent where you win more bear coins?

>>1083786
>But Kiddy Kong was so much more useful than Donkey Kong

how so?

>>1084871

As with DXC2 the game has different endings. The banana birds are needed to get the best ending

>>1083956
But Ellie looked fucking gay

>>1084871
>By the way, what are the banana birds for? I accidentally skipped grandma's bird talk. Also, can you use the silver bear coins for anything other than the minigame tent where you win more bear coins?
You need the Banana Birds to get the second (Final) ending, and all DK coins to get all Banana Birds.
You need at least fifty bear coins for a purchase - forgot which one exactly - that yields you either a banana bird or something else in the trading sequence, I forgot.

DKC2 > DKC1 > DKC3

>>1084983
Addendum: Also all Bonus coins. It's possible to cheat oneself to all bonus coins, though. Not so with the DK coins.

One reason. Timing.

Donkey Kong Country 3 was released around the same time as the Nintendo 64, so by then most gamers already had their fill with two Donkey Kong games and were ready for Super Mario 64. Other gamers had already turned to alternative consoles such as the Playstation and were playing games like Tekken 2.
There were so many new and different-looking games coming out in 1996 that it made DKC3 look like 'just another SNES game.'

Most people fondly remember DKC2 because it was released in 1995—a year the SNES ruled over. That's the only reason I can think of why DKC3 gets overlooked is because of its timing.
Gamers may say "I just didn't like Kiddy Kong," but I think the other games available coupled with their bellies already full of two previous years of DK action ruined the game for them. Therefore, they forever look back and assume DKC2 was the best game in the series, when DKC3 arguably did everything far better.

I would argue the soundtrack for all three games are equally good, however.

>>1084871
Bear coins are for sidequest items.

>>1085002

The first reaction to Donkey Kong Country 2 was "Oh wow! A pirate ship! This game rocks!"

The first reaction to Donkey Kong Country 3 was "What's up with these weird water and snow levels in world one? Gosh darn I'm sick of Donkey Kong. I'm going back to play Tomb Raider, Tekken 2 and Super Mario 64."

Once a game makes the initial memory with someone, it is hard for them to overcome it.

>>1083778
It fucking sucked. I cannot believe how much this was a let down compared to the other 2.

>>1084983

>forgot which one

Cranky's mirror

Also genarally speaking you need the bear coins to obtain banana birds cause that's what every trade and purchase ultimatly leads to, e.g. that shell you buy from the one bear and give it the other to coplete his shell collection, for which he gives you a banana bird...

>>1085027

DKC3 has an open overworld with motorboats and hovercrafts and shit, that is FUCKING AWESOME.
No way the linear path of 2 is genuinely better...

>>1084871
... The ice world had a grand total of two winter stages, one of which was one of those minecart-type stages and thus doesn't really count.
The ice world had as many snowy stages as the sunny lake world.
I just... I'm just sad.

>>1085002
Trying to excuse away all complaints against DKC3 because of the timing it was released is nothing less than retarded. I could see that angle being relevant if it sold like shit, but that is not what we're discussing. People say they don't like Kiddy because he's slow and not fun to play. DKC3 gets "overlooked" because it's slow and generally not fun.

The guy in this thread is playing DKC3 for the first time and not finding it a lot weaker than the two previous installments. Do you think that is because he's ready for Super Mario 64 or busy playing Tekken 2? No, it's because the game is a fucking mess is what it is. A slow turd with little variation, ugly enemy (re)designs, and 99% of all stages being designed around gimmicks that start boring you before you even reach the flag pole.

I'm dead serious, the number of stages in the game that are actually fun to play can be counted on one hand. Which is why people rightfully proclaim it to be the shittiest part in the trilogy.

I've been playing all three games since they came out, but DKC3 is not something I feel like going back to as often as the two others. The first one is my absolute favorite, but DKC2 is fantastic as well. After my last run through DKC3 I decided not to play it for at least three or maybe even five years, because it was such a sour experience I don't believe I can recover the little love I had for parts of the game unless I stay far away from it for a long while.

>>1085224
>not finding it a lot weaker than the two previous installments
I of course meant "finding it a lot weaker than the two previous installments"

>>1085224
>>1085232
Hey, don't put words in my mouth. I haven't said I find it weaker than the previous two (yet).

So far, my opinions are: 1. The overworld is a mess, it all looks roughly the same environment-wise and as a result the stages seem almost random. Like the random snow stage in the lake area, lack of snow stages in the snow area, and so on. It makes the whole thing lack coherency, and hinders people from remembering a particular area as opposed to "the stage where that thing happens".
2. I do not like Ellie.
3. Kiddy is a bit slow, big and clumsy, but makes for a great meat shield/sacrifice if you need to get through a dangerous area or miss an item you need to get through an enemy.
4. There are WAY too many different gimmicks, and it feels like a waste to program so many when you know they'll never be brought up again. Hell, you spent half the low-gravity stage as a parrot that's NOT affected by the low gravity, so that's just half a stage they waste time and effort coding a gimmick for.
5. I find it funny that Funky pretty much just pushes a toddler onto you. It's like he got babysitter duty and just decided "screw it".
6. I don't like the new designs for some of the enemies. The bees are fine, but those clap traps and krems are a mess.

>>1085150
Did you at least enjoy Squitter's stage? It's one of the best levels in the game, so if you didn't like that there's honestly not much to look forward to. Razor Ridge is all shit, and KAOS Kore not much better.

Try playing through Koindozer Klamber with only Kiddy once you get there, and you'll get to experience all of the best slipping from the waterfall boss multiplied tenfold.

i'm playing DKC2 for the first time. i'm 3/4 of the way through world 2 and it's not fun yet.

maybe i only enjoy DKC 1 and 3 because of nostalgia. i didn't enjoy DKR either.

>>1084928
Interactivity with Dixie, jumping over water surfaces. Even though the latter is really not all that useful.

>>1085270
I kept dying to things while trying to avoid getting shot at, instead of trying to dodge the shots... It was an alright stage though, just a bit frustrating since I kept mixing up the web controls.
Definitely better than certain other gimmick stages though.

>>1085267
>Hey, don't put words in my mouth. I haven't said I find it weaker than the previous two (yet).
Sorry, that was intentional. I must've added in a few extra bits of my own bias while recalling your post history. We'll have to await your final verdict when you've gotten through the game.

>>1085270

I would so love a romhack where the crosshair follows you in every level... I mean it is obvious why this isn't the case in a game amied at casual gamers and children... But as an adult gamer this added difficulty leading to you always moving would be awesome...

>>1085274
DKC2 isn't my favorite, but it's a very tight and enjoyable platformer. If you're not having fun, maybe you've stopped enjoying platform games.

DKCR was alright, but nothing more. Its physics went in a very different, "looser" direction, and the controls were horrible thanks to the absolutely unnecessary waggle bullshit they added, making rolls an unreliable mechanic while at the same time making them absolutely necessary for properly getting around when controlling Donkey. I played through the game in co-op the first time, and it was a very frustrating experience.

The 3DS port is slightly better, but having grabs and rolls/running set to different buttons is not easy to get used to when you've played the rest of the trilogy for almost twenty years, and I didn't manage to progress past the first world before I put it away.

That there are only a few memorable stages doesn't help the game. I still have hopes for the new game, but in no way do I believe it will come close to the Rare trilogy.

Rayman Origins was a better game than DKCR in every single way, and if Michel Ancel continues to deliver we will at least have get our needs fulfilled that way, even if it isn't by the Donkey we know and love. If you didn't enjoy the new Rayman, you really don't like platformers.

>>1085332
That would've been a great mode they could've easily added in with cheat codes. Much more challenging than the uninspired "lel let's take out some barrels" hard mode.

>>1085341

could be a lack of interest in platformers. not sure. haven't played the new rayman game.

>>1085351
Yeah, I'd recommend you get yourself tested. It's the most fun I had since DKC2 was released. Not that this is very relevant for the board, but once I started typing I didn't realize that almost my whole post was pushing past /vr/ territory, sorry.

As for DKC2, I'd recommend you try to go at it a little while longer. It's not a good sign if you're having absolutely no enjoyment of it yet, but world 4 and forward is where it REALLY gets amazing.

>>1085267
Right, just got to Kaos Kore and I think I may stop for now. Barbos was just creepy and weird and Floodlit Fish made me want to stop completely. Probably would have if not for stubbornness and the fact I get to stab them repeatedly in the face.

Something I noticed with animal companions: this game is not handling them well at all. Pot Hole Panic made me absolutely delighted, because I actually got to RIDE the animals. I think it's only been one stage where I got to ride on an animal instead of being one (and that time it was only Ellie. I seriously considered skipping over her box before remembering she's not nearly as bad when you can actually get off at any time).
It just... seems a bit backwards from how it usually is, to me. I'm pretty sure in the other games, the animals were mainly mounts. But here, even in the brief "here's a shortcut and a no-animals sign" appearances, you become the animal... What gives?

>>1083778

It's fucking bland. That's why.

After the creativty fest that, for the time, was DKC2, DKC3 was thematically dull. The game itself is fine, but it lacks themes and atmosphere, two of the main strong points of it's predecessors.

The music is also definitely not-on par with DKC1 and 2. It lacks, again, atmosphere, and opted for sounding almost like ambient noises. In a franchise known for it's god-tier catchy yet atmospheric music, it was a dissapointment.

And "best animal friends" my ass. While the replacement of Rambi for Ellie is debatable , Parry fucking sucks, and that's a fact.

>>1085270
>Razor Ridge is all shit, and KAOS Kore not much better.
Sperak for yourself. KAOS Kore and the lost world are best worlds.

>>1086149
They are a lot of be good or learn them step by step if you are not. Can get repetitive for guys that are not that good with reflexes

>>1086149
I have to agree, Lightning Look-Out was one of the most fun stages I played yet. Sure, I died ~20 times, but I actually had so much fun running around, dodging the lightning, that I didn't mind.
Razor Ridge is definitely shit though, so many annoying gimmick stages. For every good gimmick in this game, there seem to be two shitty ones -- a lot more stages have annoyed and frustrated me than actually amused me, even ones I didn't die that many times on because they're just so slow it feels like getting back to where I were takes ages.

Got my first game over on Koindozer Klamber, so I'm off to farm some lives and then I'll beat this game. I think I'm near the end...?

Ellie might not have as cool of a design as Rambi, but I like her mechanics a lot better. Rather than just running forward and hitting everything, you had levels like Bobbing Barrel Brawl where you had to aim projectiles at enemies to proceed.

Speaking of that level, most underrated music in the game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xN3W9wQp3t4&list=PLD78B807E27C6B2BE

>>1084008
How do you have a sunken a ship in lava? How do you get get a ship to lava in the first place?

What I most hated about DKC3 were the DK coins.
Finding DK coins in DKC2 was actually fun, but it was a chore in DKC3

>>1086532
I hold the oppostie feeling. Finding the DK coins was one of my favorite parts about DKC3.

>>1086436
Alright, I beat the game. 70%, all DK coins, no lost world. Verdict:
1. The overworld is very boring and same-y. Because of this no area stands out at all, and the worlds become unmemorable.
2. The stages barely seem related to the overworld, causing confusion and making it hard to remember what stage is in which world.
3. Too many gimmicks. There isn't ONE case where they reuse a gimmick in the whole game, and at least 80% of the stages have a gimmick. Some are fun, but most are boring, uncreative or even frustrating. Some are just stupid ideas, like the low gravity one or reversed controls. They should've picked a few gimmicks and polished them.
4. Too many factory/house stages.
5. Music's nice, but often low-key and calm, making it very unmemorable. I'd listen to it when relaxing, but none of it will get stuck in your head.
6. There's no buildup to anything. The last stage before the final boss is a poisonous sewer with a control-switch gimmick. The first boss doesn't seem like a boss. There's no trace of evil in the last world. There's just no sense of risk or reward.
7. Kaos is a disgrace to all villains. All he does is float around with a dopey look on his face...
8. Ellie got too much attention and exposure for her own good. An okay companion rendered annoying by overuse.
9. Kiddy is far less useful than Dixie, so most people will always use Dixie. Meaning if they die, it's as Kiddy, and his annoying baby wail when he dies would cement his status as an annoying, useless sidekick.

All in all, the game's not really BAD, but it's... mediocre. The fun stages are outnumbered by the bad ones, the game doesn't give you any sense of accomplishment. The other two DKC had better level design, coherency, aesthetics and villain, giving DKC3 a lot to live up to, and it just doesn't manage.

>>1086563
Addendum: The game is slow-paced at times due to some of the gimmicks. This makes a lot of the stages much more frustrating than they have to be and tempted me to use savestates, because I kept dying and had to redo a long, boring part of a level multiple times because due to the gimmick, it wouldn't let me progress any faster. I believe this is why I stopped playing as a child -- I got stuck on a level in the Meckano world, and the game just became too annoying and too boring so I lost interest. (I'm guessing it was the Meckano world, it was a factory stage. I just know I got the hoverboat but not the skis.)

>>1086536
Out of all the ideas DKC3 throws at you, Koin is the absolute best.

>>1086532
What >>1086536 and >>1086714 said. rather than the game dicking with you with split-second DK coin appearances and similar, it throws genuine puzzles at you. Koin much improved the DK coin hunting. The bonus coins were a chore in both games - DK coins are only a chore in 2.

>>1086563
>1. The overworld is very boring and same-y. Because of this no area stands out at all, and the worlds become unmemorable.
I can see why one would see it this way - and I agree insofar as I really like 2's overworld. This being said, it's thematically consistent, you can see why it is actually ONE place, where 2 was rather more disjointed.
>2. The stages barely seem related to the overworld, causing confusion and making it hard to remember what stage is in which world.
Never had that problem. Shrugs to be had by all.
>3. Too many gimmicks. There isn't ONE case where they reuse a gimmick in the whole game, and at least 80% of the stages have a gimmick. Some are fun, but most are boring, uncreative or even frustrating. Some are just stupid ideas, like the low gravity one or reversed controls. They should've picked a few gimmicks and polished them.
The reversed control gimmick was shit, yes. I liked the majority of the gimmicks, though, and some are reused - whether it's a burning rope or a giant jogsaw trying to catch up to you doesn't make much of a gameplay difference.
>4. Too many factory/house stages.
I liked the factory stages. The mill stages... One is too many, I agree there.

>>1086820
cont.
>5. Music's nice, but often low-key and calm, making it very unmemorable. I'd listen to it when relaxing, but none of it will get stuck in your head.
Difference in taste. I like it equally to 2's, and better than 1's - but as said, taste differs.
>6. There's no buildup to anything. The last stage before the final boss is a poisonous sewer with a control-switch gimmick. The first boss doesn't seem like a boss. There's no trace of evil in the last world. There's just no sense of risk or reward.
A valid point, and I suppose 2 handled it better with the castle stages. Bit of a throwback to 1.
>7. Kaos is a disgrace to all villains. All he does is float around with a dopey look on his face...
Well, given that he's just a tool, not a villain per se...
>8. Ellie got too much attention and exposure for her own good. An okay companion rendered annoying by overuse.
Agreed.
>9. Kiddy is far less useful than Dixie, so most people will always use Dixie. Meaning if they die, it's as Kiddy, and his annoying baby wail when he dies would cement his status as an annoying, useless sidekick.
Agreed.

>>1086820
>>1086823
Oh, I thought the scientist guy was named Kaos, too. Unless he was the tool? Is there another villain out there who's more capable (like his wife, maybe)?

As for the overworld, it's true that it's thematically consistent, but even the area supposedly filled/polluted with machinery there's barely anything different to be found. Sometimes you have to exaggerate things to keep them interesting.

The stage thing was probably badly worded, but I kept getting stages I wasn't expecting to - like a factory stage because there was a hut nearby I'd overlooked, or a mountain stage when I was quite clearly on a snowy area but it was near a cliff. It's not much of a problem while playing, but it seems like it'd make it harder to remember where I played a certain stage later on, especially for the factory stages where every world has them.

>>1086874
The scientist is Baron K. Roolstein.

>>1086874
>>1086883
When Dr. Wily put on a pair of sunglasses and a trenchcoat and started calling himself "Mr. X" I thought it was the stupidest fucking thing. It was Wily the 1st through 5th times. Who's that mysterious stranger with Wily's build, haircut, and modus operandi? Couldn't be.

But that fucking crocodile put on a lab coat and suddenly actual people think he's a different person

>>1086490
>Speaking of that level, most underrated music in the game

Yes! This has always been my favorite.

>>1085060
What good is an open ended overworld if the levels are still streamlined?

>>1086563

>Too many factory/house stages

There is no such thing as too many factory stages. For me the whole game could consist of factory stages. I love that setting, and I relly liked the music...

I was 9 or 10 when I played it and I didn't like it more than the first but I did like it a lot

>>1085351

it does improve as it goes--and it's best if you really try to find all the stuff (and succeed)

>>1084008
man that game is truly a masterpiece.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61snn8v1ZiM&feature=player_detailpage

>>1086947
What are you talking about? King K. Rool, Kaptain K. Rool and Baron K. Roolstein are entirely different people.

>>1087049
Bit monotone.

One, two more would've been nice, though. And thematically consistent.

Also needed more jungle stages. The three it had were awesome, but well... Only three.

Personally, I loved the mountain stages, too, but it probably had just the right amount. Same with beach stages.

And the mills get canned entirely.

>>1086436
God, I hate Lightning Look-out so much.

I always died way too many times on that stage.

>>1087161
Wat. They're all just K. Rool's different personas, man. Where the heck did you read that?

>>1085002
dkc 3 is a good game, but it just isn't better than dkc2 in any way, shape or form.

>>1087194
Thatsthejoke.jpg

>>1083778
DKC3 is much, MUCH easier than DKC2. Rare gave you a lot of hints to get all the secrets.

I completed the 100% of DKC3 on my first play years ago, whereas I have never finished DKC2 with all the bonus and secret areas.

Also Downie Kong. And the kill-inducing bears. And some cringeworthy designed enemies (a more childish design compared to the other 2 games).

>>1087237

Agreed. DKC2 is definitely the toughest game in the trilogy. For me, DKC1 was the easiest.

I just finished 3 for the first time yesterday. My thoughts:
Te level design was incredibly varied. The lightning level, the Kloinpusher enemies, Ellie being afraid of rats and shooting water, all the snow levels, the sleigh levels, the swimming level where you have to feed the piranha and the one where you need light, the saw blade level, and that's just off te top of my head. It has a worse soundtrack than 2 or returns, but a few songs (treetop tumble and water world) are excellent. The boss fights are varied, and there is a healthy amount of side quests. The swanky mini games suck, I wish they had the quizzes from 2 back. The only country game I have not played yet is 1, gonna download it on Zsnes tonight and play through it.
So far I would rank them like this:
2 > returns > 3
I've enjoyed them all thoroughly.

>>1087441

>gonna download it on Zsnes tonight and play through it
>Zsnes

Uh oh... Oh no, you opened Pandora's box!... /vr/ literally shits itself over that emulator.

>>1087205
Although in Japan, they ARE all different people.

>>1083778
Because no Donkey nor Diddy. You play as a monkey woman and a baby and no kid would ever like that.

>>1087441
the thumbnail of that looks like "Dock Sockers" and I laughed so hard I shot a booger on my arm.

>>1087503
I chuckled

>>1085535
This is pretty much how feel about DKC3.

The world, the Banana Birds, and even the Brothers Bears seem like they come from a different game.

You know those crazy Sonic hacks that combine 1,2,3, and Knuckles and let you play as Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles?

Why has no one done that for Donkey Kong Country yet?

>>1085535
Donkey Kong Country was a fight to save your home turf.
DKC2 was invading the enemy.
DKC3 was a pleasant European vacation complete with hiking and a tour of historic mills.

>>1087664
Because Sonic has obsessive fans and they disassembled the games.

The game is too sluggish for my tastes. Kiddy and Dixie are both slower than Diddy, which is an unwanted change in pace after the speed and fluidity of Diddy in the previous two games. There is a lot more variety in level design, which is a blessing and a curse. Some of the unique features in levels can be fun, like Ripsaw Rage. Others disrupt the game's flow and make the levels into a chore, like the levels with Ellie and the mice. The music is good, and I like that it's a bit moodier than previous games, but it lacks the catchy stand out tunes that DKC and DKC2 had. The graphics are gorgeous, but the visual design is uninspired. I guess that's because the world is more coherent and believable instead of being made up of completely different biomes, but it's visually uninteresting, especially compared to DKC2. Just think of the worlds:

DKC: Jungle, mines/temples, forest, snowy mountains, factory, caves
DKC2: Pirate ship, volcanic region, swamp, theme park, haunted forest, evil castle
DKC3: All worlds are woodland with water in it, one has snow, two have factory type things, one has castle

>>1083958
>Did you even play the first 2? The music doesn't compare.

DKC3's soundtrack wasn't composed by David Wise. DKC3's soundtrack is much more about using the samples in the SPC to create ambient and atmospheric music, whereas DKC and DKC2's soundtracks were more melodic.

They cannot be compared apples to apples since they set out to do different things. DKC3's soundtrack is awesome.

>>1087668

lol nigga

shit like this post makes me wish this was place had upvotes. But alas we must fight such cancer.

>>1087751
I smiled when I read that post. I like the comparison where people say the third one is a trip to Canada lol. I did like the realistic overworld but after beating 1 and 2 and now going through 3 for like my 5th time it does seem really slow and easy compared to the first 2. And I do agree with the random levels and the lack of continuity being stupid. I did absolutely love the second to last area with the fire rope level. That has to be my favourite level because of the music fitting so well with the view.

>>1087668
No it wasn't, you were saving Donkey and Diddy from being captured, read the manual.
>>1085535
>and opted for sounding almost like ambient noises.

That's funny considering half the tracks in DKC1 are "ambient noises" according to your logic.

>>1087768

Yet those are, somehow, more memorable and stay in your mind a lot longer than the forgettable OST from DKC3.

And I'm not talking nostalgia here, DKC1 was the last of the trilogy I owned, before that, I must have replayed 2 and 3 hundreds of times.

>>1087668

This.

>>1087774

Except the factory music.
That stuff has burned itself into my brain forever. ANd often, mostly when excited, I hear it in my "inner ears"...

I like DKC3, instead of trying to out do DKC2 they just went a different way.

The level design etc of DK2 was phenominal, so all DKC3 did was add a different gimmick to every level. Viola fun and interesting!

Because I don't wanna play as a giant retard baby.

Because it looks fucking awful. I remember seeing this shit as a kid and going NOPE. Not playing a game as a fucking baby. I did play the demo anyway and toys r us, and wasn't impressed by the horrible enemies and lame levels.

DKC 2 had some of the most amazing areas and levels of the era, but even DKC 1 killed what 3 had to offer.

Also, despite both this and MW 2 looking "kiddty", MW 2 had a crazily surreal feel that made it glorious. While this left you thinking "who could possibly like this shit?"

>>1087035
It gives kids the sense of adventure and discovery.

>>1087942

>>1087942
>I did play the demo
>but even DKC 1 killed what 3 had to offer.
so you played a demo one time for a few minutes 15 years ago and you think that somehow qualifies you to give an even half-informed opinion on the game?

>>1087971
Same amount of game time was enough to hook me on the first 2, so yes. If the first entire zone (I played to the first boss) suck, why bother with the rest?

Okay kids, you did beat the final boss twice, but to beat him for REAL, go do Simon Says a bunch. No I'm not joking, go do it.

>>1087942

>>MW 2 had a crazily surreal feel that made it glorious.

sorry, but what's "MW" ?

>>1088012
Mario World.

>>1087974
Wow dude! How ingenious! What levels of wits and insight you possess! Why aren't you in game reviews already?