/vr/ - Retro Games

>I had just 1 (!) dungeon. 75% of the game has been walking around and reading dialogue
Yes, the introduction of the game has exposition and a tutorial dungeon, zoom zoom.
>The characters in Zelda are all babby tier, and the plot so far is the most basic
You're in the beginning of the game, and you don't seem to be aware of how long it is. Very goofy that you think your whinging has any validity yet.

>>10161191

>>10161254
for all the "jarpig bad, OoT >>> FFVII"sentiment out there, the game has exactly same problems as a jarpig. HL1 gets enough shit for starting too slow, so OoT deserves it too. "Exposition" is nice in a game with plot (e.g. FF7 where you want to explore the world of Midgar), but if the setting is medieval bing bang wahoo, I don't really care what they're "exposing".

>>10161191
>the story is still presented in an impressive manner, especially for 1998…
Strongly disagree, most of the time, the direction of the cutscenes is really poor and consist on static characters looking at each other.

>>10161191
>>10161295
>FFVII
Oh, i thought this was a serious discussion about video games, not debating which brand of normieslop (OoT, FFVII) ick anime the least.

>>10161191
It's a game for kids, anon, you can't expect deep nihilistic brooding on the human condition. You have to judge it for what it is.
>>10161254
I agree with this post, although I also agree with OP that the start of OoT is incredibly slow and drawn out. It was probably my fifth Zelda game, and I actually dropped it the first time because I lost interest probably somewhere around where OP is -- and I almost never drop games. I did a second attempt years later and finished the game, but the beginning still stuck out as very poorly paced.
I don't personally think it's the greatest game of all time, but OP, there are a lot of cool things later on. It will pick up quite a bit once the game starts in earnest.

>>10161191
The interruptions ease up after the first 3 dungeons, but yes, it gets off to a slow start and feels especially sluggish if you played Link to the Past or Link's Awakening first.

>>10161191
Yeah every Zelda game has a lot of unskippable dialogue

>>10161474
Not really, I agree with anon above you. ALTTP has some dialog, but it's not very long, and the game never feels like a movie game slog.

Can't wait to see OP's seethe thread when he gets to Majora kek

it's a story game and a good vs. evil myth for kids, like The Hobbit or something.
and fuck man just keep playing the game, you're still just at the beginning.

>>10161513
I don't plan to play it. Maybe only if I really, really like OoT.

>>10161191
You may appreciate 2D ZELDA. I think it's just a good time in general to talk about 2D ZELDA.
Don't listen to >>10161474
He's talking about 3d zelda. Not 2D ZELDA. While 2D ZELDA has lines of dialog, there's not as much and they're quicker to go by than 3d zelda! It's simply always superior to 3d zelda as a general rule of thumb.

>>10161324
That's just not true though. There are POV shots, wide shots, tracking shots, etc.

There are a wide variety of camera angles and scenes.

>>10161618
>>10161324
name me 1 game that did it better in 1998 or earlier.

>>10161191
Zelda games do have a lot of cutscene/dialogue that interrupt the game to handheld you because they assume the player is a retarded 5yo kid
I dont know why grown men play this shit

A big part of the slowness is the text speed which just CRAWLS. Inexcusable for a 1998 game. The plot is basically LttP over again but with time travel instead of a mirror world. I think it has some interesting ideas and world building but it's main competition at the time, MGS, blows it out of the water in terms of story and presentation. I like Ocarina but it's massively overrated, even within the context of the Zelda franchise.

>>10161543
If you dislike Ocarina so far, you will probably chuck that monitor out a window because of Majora. Especially if you hate the minigames

>>10161191
>JRPGs have a decent story and characters

>>10161662
Majora is much tougher than Ocarina but is ten times more interesting in terms of plot, setting and structure.

>>10161662
I did say though, I do like it. By "it" I mean the first dungeon, it was great.

>>10161254
Fpbp.

Everyone hated that fucking owl, yes. He only shows up a few times

>>10161191
For once OP was not a faggot
3D zelda tards cope

>>10161543
don't, under any circumstances. majora is shit. it's an obvious asset flip cash grab with a cheap gimmick and zero good dungeons

>>10161535
It's not nearly as deep or complex as the hobbit. Quit trying to put oot on some grand pedestal. It's mediocre even by children's story standards. And no I don't hate it, I like oot. I like the story the way it's presented with the fun game world characters and such. I'm just not fucking delusional.

>>10161643
This is exactly what I can never understand about people who call this the greatest game ever made, or still play Nintendo style games. I played OoT when I was 9 years old. It was amazing and fascinating. I played it again when I was 17, and I got bored out of my mind. The games are literally made for young children, and I'm not saying that's bad, but how the fuck are 20, 30, 40+ year old men still playing these games and calling them great? They're insultingly easy, mechanically simple, and have the plot and storytelling ability of a nursery rhyme. Same with games like Spyro, or Banjo Kazooie. I simply cannot understand how someone over the age of like 12 can legitimately enjoy shit that more or less directly insults their intelligence.

>>10162248
People who fall under the oot spell. They look at the sparkles in the air in kokori forest and think
>"the designers put this here for a profound and secret message to the player"
>"It's a secret to kill enemies with certain weapons
>" what's this claw mark on this tree. OMG ITS A SEEEECREEEEET"
>"DID YOU KNOW THAT OOT HAS MORE SECRETS THAN ANY OTHER VIDEOGAME EVER"
>" DID YOU KNOW THAT OOT IS THE BEST RPG, JRPG, ACTION GAME, HKRSE SIMULATOR, PLATFORMING, DUNGEON CRAWKMLING, TOG. DID I M E N T I ON T H A T O O T I S A N R P G

>>10161191
It's the kind of game that has dialogue all the time.

>>10161191
yeah, if you have any exposure to actual video games (i.e. not Nintendo slop) the flaws in OoT are really irritating

>>10161624
FFVII. Much more expressive characters, more interesting camera plans, spectacular FMVs.
Metal Gear Solid. Better direction, better planes, far more mobile characters than those statues, voice acting...
>>10162248
That's a problem I used to have with Nintendo 64 games in general. They're just so fucking bland and insipid...

>>10162248
This is probably just bait, but what kind of games do you think are for "adults?"

>>10162278
Before mass degeneracy became the norm, people still tried to shelter kids from gore and violence and nudity, etc... So basically every game that was rated m or higher is for adult entertainment, as in, the themes of the game are adult in nature and kids shouldn't be exposed to them. Resident evil, mgs, leisure suit Larry, mortal Kombat, etc... Just because parents let their kids cut off their dicks these days doesn't mean it was like that when all vr games were realesed. There was a time in America when the exorcist made people faint in movie theaters. You're just a degeneracy saturated consumer, over stimulated non stop with violence and sex.

>>10161340
nta but im still kid link and im in a whale belly or something right now. has the game started yet?

>>10162278
Just of ones that came out around the same time as OoT? Fallout, Thief, MGS, StarCraft, Duke 3D, Legacy of Kain, GTA, Baldurs Gate, Gran Turismo, Resident Evil, Silent Hill, Syphon Filter, Tomb Raider.
People always love to say "Oh games like Zelda and Spyro aren't kids games, they're for everyone :^)" And I mean, no, sorry they're not. A kid can have fun and play Baldurs Gate or MGS or any other game I listed and an adult can also sit down and enjoy them either for their mechanics, or narrative, or challenge or combination of all of those. If you're 35 years old, what about Zelda is interesting or exciting? The narrative barely exists and the game is literally made for small children

>>10162332
>He thinks that a game like Baldurs Gate or MSG has a deep narrative

You are the one who actually does not understand anything at all. Games are just toys, there does not exist a single game that is not a toy, even more in the modern world.

All videogames are for children. The only difference is some are for actual children like Zelda, and others are for man children like Fallout.

You just revealed that you never read any serious literature. Compare those "adult games" to the narrative in a Tolstoy book.

And even Tolstoy is still baby tier compared to more serious stuff like Kardisnaska and Xenophanes.

>>10162307
Anon, kids back then seeked out that shit and tried to hide it from their parents. They weren’t Butters Scotch with a “oh gee whiz, this is too violent for a kid my age!” attitude. If Mom and Dad didn’t let you play Mortal Kombat you’d just play it at the house of your friend whose parents did

>>10162369
Fallout definitely deals with deep themes, the first one even has decent writing, it's just short. F02 deals even moreso with post apocalyptic society and it's struggles, it's sprinkled with humor that may or may not float your boat but it's definitely up there with b tier sci-fi from the Golden era. Metal gear solid is a James Bond flick on acid, i enjoy the fuck out of it, it's definitely adult male entertainment. Not deep like Tolstoy, but you're comparing one of the greatest authors of the 20th century with a medium where the story is secondary to the gameplay mechanics. theyre are games, not books, anon. A better comparison is cinema, but even then it's not interactive like a game. I'm not going to argue that games are as significant as great literature, but there is nothing wrong with indulging in other forms of entertainment. There's books with nothing written on the pages that have sold millions of copies, books with photos of crap on each page, self help books, L. Ron Hubbard books, George w Bush wrote a book. Books aren't magically better than videogames, they're a different medium. Videogames are new, they are still in their infancy, regardless of what /vr/ wants, videogames are the new avenue of storytelling. There have already been multiple games that have good writing and thematic portrayal, the kind you can't get from a book or movie. The reason why there really hasn't been a great Tolstoy tier videogame story is because, the media landscape of the world has been dumbed down and videogames as a new medium just happen to fall into this global pandemic.

>>10162378
>Reading comprehension
I said kids shouldn't be exposed to these themes. That was the ideology in the 90s, there were court hearing about mortal Kombat. I also saw rated r movies and played violent videogames as a child, that doesnt mean the product was created for children. That just means we had shitty parents or our friends parents were shitty and we thought it was cool because it's "something for adults". The whole reason you would sneak around and try and watch or play this kind of stuff was because it's edgy as a kid to rebel and want to do things that adults do. Doesn't mean it's right or somehow makes that content not for adults and A ok for kids.

>>10162369
Why are you posting on a retro video games board when you're 15 years old

>>10162258
That shit goes way back. Remember the UNICORN FOUNTAIN and the hunt for the triforce?(yes it exists in the game but only as a cutscene model). I still wonder what that little cave at the bottom of the Zora area was suppose to be for tho

>>10162369
No one can seriously think this. There’s plenty of games that use the medium as entirely unique storytelling experiences that tackle very difficult topics. If we’re discussing games purely as a narrative? You can’t play something like System Shock, Last of Us, Earthbound, Deus Ex, Spec Ops or any of the many man others and think this. Even keeping it light there’s tons of brief fun games suitable for most ages. This has to be a troll post

>>10162248
>>10162332

Horrendous take. Do you know what kind of games adults play? They play fruit matching games on their smartphones that have simplistic game play and no story or adult themes. You are basically those people CS Lewis wrote about who can't enjoy childlike things because they are always forcing themselves to act like an adult all the time.

>>10162258
>DID YOU KNOW THAT OOT HAS MORE SECRETS THAN ANY OTHER VIDEOGAME EVER
It's true though. People are still discovering neat little details even today

>>10162628
Adults play adult games like sports betting and betting on horse racing, poker and pool, Pokémon, shooting black people, they wear women’s clothing and hang around in bars, they want to be girlies just like their dear papas

https://youtu.be/FshU58nI0Ts

>>10162646
Every videogame has those details, it’s fanbase just gets super extra autistic over them. Ff7 has 10x actually secrets not to mention all the little extra stuff. You’re delusional.

>>10162658
Did you know that signs have two different heights depending on if you're a child or an adult?

>>10162662
Did you know that’s actually dumb and breaks continuity of the game.

>>10162654
10/10 for Monty Python's Flying Circus reference

OoT will pick up once you become an adult (in game).

>>10162628
>You are basically those people CS Lewis wrote about who can't enjoy childlike things because they are always forcing themselves to act like an adult all the time.
I really love this constant insinuation that if you don't like childish games, it simply can't be that you've matured and don't find them interesting or entertaining. No, you have to secretly be dying inside and longing to play them but unwilling to because it will ruin your reputation or something. The idea a 30 year old man would not be enthralled by Sonic doing a spin dash or Mario collecting coins is somehow so unfeasible it's actually just one big front.
Do you think anyone who watches the Sopranos or The Wire were just concerned with social validation too? Do you believe they would rather be watching Power Rangers or Space Jam?

>>10162710
Anon, but people who watched the sopranos also watched space jam. I’m not joking, many adults indulge in entertainment aimed towards children and in entertainment aimed towards adults. I watched peaky blinders while playing Pokémon red on my 3ds, you got a fuckin problem, that’s on you. And if you’re “so mature” it shouldn’t bother you that adults play games aimed towards kids and enjoy them, that’s fairly normal. Adults collecting only games aimed towards kids and collecting toys and funkopops n shit, that’s a fucking problem. Adults who sexualize anthropomorphic videogame mascots that are aimed towards children, that’s a big fucking problem, just ask Chris Chan. But, adults who just play games both aimed at kids and adults because they find them fun, it’s just fun. It’s a pass time, like baseball, but with less slave labor making the products.

>>10161191
It's called an adventure game.

When the genre started they consisted of 100% text. Adventure is a text-heavy genre, period.

>>10162710
When someone says that they don't like a a game because it's for kids, nine times out of ten they really are trying to look more adult because they think it makes them look cooler. If you don't like something that's fine, but saying that you don't like it because it's for children makes you look like a child.

>>10162743
I actually love you

>>10162658
FFVII doesn't have close to the variety of ways of interacting with the word that OoT does, in the field you're limited to walking up to things and pressing action, and in battle you select attacks that maybe have some weird property if they are divisible by some number or something. Riding vehicles/chocobos is the deepest the game gets in this regard.

Just things like using music to alter the time of day or shoot projectiles at specific things to uncover secrets are beyond the expressive power that a game like FFVII offers. Stuff like being able to find a key from a random minigame to re-unlock the starting areas is pretty cool though as a hidden gimmick, but the whole chocobo breeding/racing sequence is overrated nonsense and just a grindy sidequest dressed up really well

>>10162549
Sorry, but still no. All those games you listed are fine as kid experiences, that's it.

They might have a small modicum of almost depth, but they never truly grasp what makes for a post-adult narrative.

Like other anon said, most adults will usually play colorful fruit games in their tablets or Pokemon to rely their nostalgia, while kids play COD to feel pseudo adult. It's all rooted in weakness.

>>10162529
I'm actually 63 old mate. And thats why I'm able to explain to you why your vidya is just not as deep as you thing. I love vidya but I have no issues admiring they are a toy. To try to hold on to vidya as a superior media is to be a sad person unable to life the full experience of the real world.

>>10162397
I get the point of saying "duh, videogames have not yet reached their maturity as a medium compared to cinema and literature".

And that's true, but it's also true that due to the current state of society, it is a medium whose life was cut short. In this hyper capitalistic society videogames have devolved into cash grabs and movie slops. There is a not so small chance that they have reached their pinacle as medium already.

And even that pinacle is not narrative based like MGS, because that is just a medium imitating other. The pinacle of vidya will probably be stuff like Mario 64 and Pacman, games that eschews normal narrative and instead focus on ludosity.

>>10161191
>The characters in Zelda are all babby tier
It's a game for kids, anon.

>>10162278
the levels and dungeons in turok 2, daggerfall, and system shock make the water temple look like a comedy

>>10162273
I mean, if we take presentation and camera work of cutscenes per se, IMO OoT is still miles ahead. FF7 has way better plot, of course; but the in-game models are Lego men, the "cutscenes" barely have any direction to speak of.
Comparing CGI vs in-game cutscenes is comparing apples to oranges, so it's hard to be objective here; but I still think OoT does look more impressive because those cutscenes are in-game, they can show off the 3D environments, and there's a ton of them at every corner (unlike FF7 where you only had that many CGI videos through the game). FF7 scenes like Aerith's death look better of course, but… how many scenes in the game approach this in cinematic appeal, anyway? only the starting part of the game?
As for MGS—I don't think the camera work in it is any impressive, and the model resolution is just shit.

>>10162369
Out of the hundreds of games ive played the game I played that had the most mature feeling narrative. something remotely comparable to one of the greats of hollywood or one of those rock album classics is system shock 2 in terms of narrative or the way its presented in the game to the player. Other games of artistic value are daggerfall, dwarf fortress, nethack, unreal world, ultima underworld etc

>>10162369
Out of the hundreds of games ive played the game I played that had the most mature feeling narrative. something remotely comparable to one of the greats of hollywood or one of those rock album classics is system shock 2 in terms of narrative or the way its presented in the game to the player. Other games of artistic value are daggerfall, dwarf fortress, nethack, unreal world, ultima underworld etc

>>10161660
>A big part of the slowness is the text speed which just CRAWLS.
Is there any way to fix this? Or is it just programmed this way? You either see it scroll with turtle pace, or skip it all at once which sucks.

>>10162646
>>10162646
>Every videogame has those details, it’s fanbase just gets super extra autistic over them.
pretty much. N64 is the official platform of autism. SM64 community is obsessive over every small detail they find. speedrunners shat their pants when they discovered some previously unknown coins in DK64. and so on.
people who have played Street Fighter II or Heroes of Might and Magic III for years are still finding new stuff and strats in them to this day. when you play a game for 20-30 years, sure you will discover a ton of stuff in it, that was intended or not, or just some bug / whatever. it's only limited by your 'tism. these people would find "thousands of secrets" even if they looked at a black screen

>>10163674
If I have a collection of pet rocks, I too could look at them and say, hey most of them are shit but Bobby and Grog are good examples of artistic shit.

I played all those games you listed, but they still are toys. Specially half of them calling them deep could be seen as trolling, but in doubt I will spare your feelings.

>>10162646
>>10162658
>Every videogame has those details, it’s fanbase just gets super extra autistic over them.
pretty much. N64 is the official platform of autism. SM64 community is obsessive over every small detail they find. speedrunners shat their pants when they discovered some previously unknown coins in DK64. and so on.
people who have played Street Fighter II or Heroes of Might and Magic III for years are still finding new stuff and strats in them to this day. when you play a game for 20-30 years, sure you will discover a ton of stuff in it, that was intended or not, or just some bug / whatever. it's only limited by your 'tism. these people would find "thousands of secrets" even if they looked at a black screen

>>10161254
Oh look, another awful post by you.

>>10162278
not him, I'm OP. I think when people say a game is "for babies", they mean that it's very shallow, simplistic and dumbed down, only something a kid would enjoy. in other words—it's just mediocre, but it gets a free pass because it's E for Everyone.
I think OoT has (so far) babby plot, because it's the most cliched, basic, mediocre plot you can imagine.
>silent protag
>simple kid from a village is le chosen one
>evil man wants to conquer the world (gasp)
>find a princess who is key to all that (no way)
>must find 3 stones, 11 herbs and spices and the sacred fiddle to save the world
>good vs evil, pt. 8417521
I mean, this is about as cliched as it gets. But ok, this would pass, if only there was more to it. There isn't. Zelda characters are about as "deep" as Pokemon characters. They're absolutely flat cliched cartoons with barely any backstories, zero relationships, rationale, motivations, let alone personal philosophies, who barely have any character development. They're even ugly as all hell, because that's what OoT art director thought was cool.
Let's take something like FF7, a game so many people have ridiculed, called it a teen drama, etc. Take Cloud. Backstory? Check, it's pretty complex and interconnected too. Relationships? Check, they're not shallow either. Rationale / motivation? Check, and it evolves as the game progresses. Character development? Check. Character design? Check. I'm not going to exaggerate FF7, but you can see that as a vidya character, Cloud is at least decent where it counts.
Same goes for the overall plot. Again—hate it or love it, FF7 raises at least SOME themes and questions. Corporations, ecology, and all that. And Zelda raises what? Good vs bad? This is not a theme, it's a placeholder for a theme.
Hell, even something like Mother 3, while being "a game for Nintentoddlers", runs circles around OoT plot—and I don't even like the game much.

>>10162695
>game picks up after you beat half of it
truly, I can see it now… OoT really is the best game of all time

>>10163693
you replied to the wrong person, m8

I don't think video games actually need a great or mature narrative to be good. Tetris is often cited as one of the greatest games of all time and it has no story or even characters. Games in general don't actually need stories. People haven't been playing Chess for centuries because of its thrilling narrative.

>>10163841
Not sure anyone ever plays a zelda for the story?
Story (and characters) are shallow and usually just 1d stereotypes
Even the overworld is kind of bland, but it's the dungeons where the game comes to live for me at least.
(Majora's mask does this better, but that has its own flaws as well)

It's also probably what you want from a game, e.g. I remember playing tales of vesperia and while I liked the game overall, I do feel it was dragged down by the endless cutscene babbling.

>>10163862
that's what I meant though. if the plot isn't great, then why have all that endless dialogue and cutscenes?
it's either one or another. either have basic plot and jump straight to the gameplay, or have good plot and tell it through the text and movies. OoT has tons of dialogue & cutscenes for the most bland, cliched babby story imaginable. it makes no sense.

>>10161254
>Yes, the introduction of the game has exposition and a tutorial dungeon, zoom zoom.
I hope you realise you're defending a trash part of the game. The original Zelda had an old man give u a sword. Thats all the story/tutorial these games ever needed.

>>10163886
OK, I might've misunderstood your point.
Last time I played this was a long, long time ago, and I always throught it was super light in cutscenes and dialog. (except the part were fishking shovels his ass sideways, shit took forever)

>>10161191
This is why you play the 3DS version but according to /vr/ niggers it's a massive piece of shit because the lighting is worse in like one area of the game.

>>10163987
>the lighting is worse in like one area of the game
It's way worse than you're making out

>>10161254
I thought the narrative was that zoomers loved tutorials and movie game cutscenes? You zoomer haters are so schizophrenic

>>10164615
If you haven’t noticed, lots of the zoomers that come here get conditioned, they start to shed their zoomer skin because nobody here kowtows to them. Some stay infantile, but more than a few emerge from their cocoons with new found appreciation for challenge and critical thinking.

>>10162278
Baldur's Gate for instance

>>10162758
>trying to look adult
nobody does this

>>10165705
people think playing games with grey and brown setting with guns and cars makes you a grown ass manly man. similarly, they think calling everything else "baby games" will make you look even more manly. not really. gaming doesn't make you manlier or more adult to begin with. you're just larping and clinging to tokens of masculinity like picrel.
you become manly by having sex and working out / getting into shape. you become more adult by working hard, having your shit together and having a life. everything else is larping.

>>10162758
>>10165705
people think playing games with grey and brown setting with guns and cars makes you a grown ass manly man. similarly, they think calling everything else "baby games" will make you look even more manly. not really. gaming doesn't make you manlier or more adult to begin with. you're just larping and clinging to tokens of masculinity like picrel.
you become manly by having sex and working out / getting into shape. you become more adult by working hard, having your shit together and having a life. everything else is larping.

>>10163987
The 3DS version is the best version of the game by far, and I say this as someone who has played the original since it 1998.

>>10165705
Everyone does, even if you're not aware of it. Proving yourself to other people is part of life, people will often do it subconsciously.

>>10161191
People only like OoT because of childhood nostalgia.

>>10166718
Biggest cope on this board. It's the go-to shitpost when they can't think of anything better.

>>10161191
>This game has more dialogs and cutscenes than a JRPG
Stopped reading here.

>>10166718
This. It was a big deal in it's day (but aren't most Zelda games?) but it's a very mid entry overall. I wouldn't even consider it in the top 5 Zelda games. Twilight Princess does the overall formula better. Majora has a better/creepier atmosphere and a more unique structure - OoT is just Link To The Past in 3D (LttP is also a better game). I can't get nostalgic over clunky, chunky, blurry N64 games for the most part anyway.

>>10166764
>Twilight Princess does the overall formula better.
There are valid reasons to prefer other games over time. But if anyone has this opinion you can be completely sure that they do not get the game at all. I'm convinced that anyone who prefers Twilight Princess must have an innate lack of curiosity.

>>10161340
you have to have the attention span of a goldfish if you think OoT's intro is too long or drawn out. The beginning is only poorly paced if you're a moron. You're in the first dungeon in less than 10 minutes.

>>10166780
I've played every Zelda game since the original, at the time of it's release and most games (including OoT and TP) multiple times. TP is just Ocarina formula revisited but more interesting and plays better. GTFO with that "innate lack of curiosity" shit, you're just making shit up bro.

>>10166792
Yeah, you're in the first dungeon in 10 minutes, then you get another hour-two of dialogue, cutscenes, walking around Hyrule, sequence where you sneak into the castle and so on.

>>10166793
You obviously have not played OoT and TP multiple times if you think TP is just OoT revised. The games are nothing alike where it actually counts.

>>10166801
Ocarina is a very good game but the veneration it gets around here is beyond delusional cope shit.

>>10166798
The cut scenes suck but other than that this is probably my favorite part of the game. The game introduces you to the rest of the world, and you get a chance to explore and stretch your legs for a bit before the next dungeon. One thing I don't like about OoT is how (especially later on) they just kind of quickly throw you from dungeon to dungeon with little to do in between. Majoras Mask does a better job at this, but the dungeons themselves aren't as good in general. Twilight Princess has more outside of dungeon content, but the world feels bland-er and more tedious.

>>10166820
OoT threads are constantly swarmed by people who write essays about how the game is the worst thing to happen to mankind. It's probably the most divisive /vr/ game there is.

>>10161295
i love half-life 1 but god is the opening excruciating when you've already seen it so many times. i just set the game framerate really fast with cheats and hop around like a maniac until the game actually starts

>>10162758
When people don't like games for kids it's because they find them bland, because they don't inspire emotions on them, because they prefer more intense games or games with more defined characters and stories. Different people like different things.
And I say this as someone that keeps playing Mario games and loves several of his games, but I couldn't expend a whole generation playing nothing but familiar games, or games for all ages or whatever you want to call them. At one point I needed games that would allow me to be part of big, epic story lines (Xenogears, Final Fantasy Tactics...), or games that would make me feel alone in a dangerous world (Resident Evil, Silent Hill...) or even games that just have some edginess and violence (Tenchu, Driver...).
Even within the standards of family games, some people probably missed the slightly more agressive and roughish tone of series like Sonic and Sega games in general, and found Nintendo games too safe. That doesn't mean they are bad, it's just what I said before: different people like different things.

>>10166838
>The game introduces you to the rest of the world
OK. I kind of like the overall world of OoT, and I'd love to explore it, if only the NPCs weren't so repulsive. all of them are ugly and/or dumb. it's like the devs made them like this on purpose. this is shitty kids cartoon level, where having le quirky annoying characters like Scrappy Doo or ewoks or Jar Jar is somehow considered cool and funny. their stories are similarly shitty, if they have any. walking around the Hyrule and talking to NPCs has been some of the most stupid experiences I've had in an RPG.

>>10166925
>walking around the Hyrule and talking to NPCs
I will happily admit that this is something that MM was able to handle far better, OoT's NPC dialogue is far too tied up with the main story sequence, so while it does have something like a living world of its own, the characters stop and get stuck in ruts once you progress to particular points, while MM allows them to continue to have dynamic lives in more meaningful ways.

>>10167010
Yeah, I haven't played MM, but from the reviews this seems to be the case. The NPCs are far better written than in OoT, and actually seem to surpass those in a lot of "proper" RPGs. at least they'renot outright retarded like in OoT and have their own stories.

>>10161191
Play Dinosaur Planet. Literally like Zelda but without the gay elfling, better controls, a not-so-annoying computer assistant, and motherfucking DINOSAURS!!!

>>10166731
It's not cope. What's good about the game outside of childhood nostalgia?

>>10167272
I'm OP and I love how the game controls. It's just good ol' Zelda, but translated well to 3D. Solve puzzles, use items, find secrets. What's not to like? You're saying it like it's some mediocre game everyone pretends to love, like Earthbound or something. I don't know what I'm supposed to be "nostalgic" for, I've never owned N64 and neither did anyone I've known.

>>10161340
It’s probably tedious now because every 3d action game has z targeting and context sensitive buttons, but OOT was a lot to wrap your head around in 1998. I remember hating the automatic jumping at first and the deku tree took awhile for me to even figure out how to get to the basement

Jabu is the furthest I've managed to get into this game. I wouldn't call it a bad game but it's just not for me. Though, I bet I would have loved it as a kid with just a handful of n64 games to choose from and all the time in the world.

>>10166886
This is all true, but when people jump to the "it's for kids" argument it shows that they didn't respect the game from the start.
We're not talking about Barney the Dinosaur or Hello Kitty. People die in OoT. It's obviously marketed towards kids, but it's silly to say that an adult couldn't enjoy it because it's too immature for them.
When you say "it's just a kids game", you're saying that the game is beneath you. Even if a game is great if you go into it with that attitude you aren't going to enjoy it properly.
I have no problem with people who say OoT is bland or uninspiring or they prefer more intense games or the story didn't click with them. But saying they didn't like it because it's for kids just shows they never even gave it a chance.

>>10167272
It does a really good job of making you feel like a hero on an epic quest.
Lots of games do that, but Ocarina does it REALLY well. Every story beat just keeps pushing and pushing that you're the hero, you have to journey across Hyrule to save it, it's all up to you.
In most games you don't get to see what happens if you fail in your quest. Ocarina shoves it in your face. The whole second half of the game is trying to survive and do what you can to help in the terrible future where Ganondorf wins.
There is very little in Ocarina that isn't done better in other games, but the story of Ocarina imbues everything it does with weight. Dungeons that in another game would just be an obstacle between you and your next town are built up to be fateful arenas where the world hangs in the balance.
If you don't invest yourself in the story you won't get anything out of this, but making a game with that kind of atmosphere is very hard to do.
Ocarina isn't the only game that did it, there are plenty of others. But Ocarina managed to do it while also creating a truly 3D fantasy world, which was revolutionary. When I first saw my cousin playing the game it was entrancing just seeing Link walking around Kokiri Forest. If you can't get yourself in that mindset I can understand why you wouldn't get anything out of it, but at the time it was truly special.

>>10161191
I pity those who couldn't play OoT as a kid when it came out.

>>10167050
>actually seem to surpass those in a lot of "proper" RPGs
Zelda is better at doing most things RPGs ought to be doing better than most RPGs do them. It's really sad how little variety of interactivity is possible in RPGs in general. Like, WRPG fans frequently seem to even be proud of things as clunky as 'speech checks', but you rarely see games in the genre go so far as letting you set up quest events by time traveling and deliberately prompting characters to speak to you in certain ways in order to get things to happen after discovering certain things about the NPC's life in the future.

>>10162258
Faggot.

>>10162273
I get it, you don't understand the concept of the hero’s journey.

>>10162397
>war bad
>my people are dying of thirst
>fat successful ruthless businessman bad
>loser small town merchant McGyver good
>deep story
lol

>>10161191
Omae o korosu

>>10168435
Hello Kitty Island Adventure is pretty kino.

>>10162332
Only Legacy of Kain could even be considered to be in the same vein as OoT, and you're pretty much misunderstanding the purpose of the story. Retarded Americans are so obsessed with realism. Like why the fuck would you compare something that is similar to Star Wars in story structure with psychological horror like Silent Hill? You wouldn't unless you have no fucking clue what you're talking about.

>>10161191
every Zelda game has a lot of unskippable dialogue

>>10166780
I explored everything in Twilight Princess, it's the only Zelda game I've ever felt compelled to 100%, if you weren't the least bit curious in the best rendition of hyrule in the whole franchise then you're dumb.

>>10161340
I only had one dungeon left and I didn't know the last time I turned it off that it would be the last time I ever played it.

I still think about going back to my save and finishing it off every now and then.

>>10162258
Its what Soul does for a game. You wouldn’t know if it you only play souless cashgrab schlop

>>10162248
I play video games for the gameplay not the storytelling ability. Its fun to bounce around as a dragon.

>>10171091
Not sure why you thought that was worth a bump or retro related.

This thread is fucking terrible I feel like I'm surrounded by literal braindead normalfags that don't care about games. Holy SHIT this board is doomed.

>>10171094
Soul as in Soul vs. Soulless. Not anything to do with the Souls games.

>>10171128
You're trying way too fucking hard, dude.

>>10171141
Ok

>>10171146
She's right on account of the fact you masked a forced buzzword using a real word. Strike fucking 1, /v/tard.

>>10161295
You could write entire books on just the subtext of OoT, the fact that you called it "medieval bing bing wahoo" shows that you're just a retard and you should probably stop playing the game now because you'll never appreciate it. Try it again when you're older.

>>10171171
>She
My pronouns are they/them.

Are you guys actually serious? Oot does not have that long of cutscenes, introduction included. Theres like what? The cutscene after the deku tree and a little exposition before that?

Maybe if all you play are schmups and arcade games but mashing A for like 2 minutes of dialouge spread out over the first 3-5 hours is not bad at all

>>10171906
Not sure why you thought that was worth a bump.

>>10171321
Is this an ironic post?

>>10161254
People coming from Link to the Past thought it was long-winded and unnecessary. Because it was

>>10171981
I assume that 'subtext' was a poor choice of words there, as the 'meaning/message' of the game can be analyzed but is of no real importance, but there is an absolute fuckload of depth to how everything in Ocarina is presented/designed, including the way it uses cues and environmental storytelling etc. and that absolutely can be taken apart and looked at to levels of hyper autistic detail in ways that most games wouldn't be worth doing for. There are so many details in OoT and MM that you could end up being fascinated about to the point where an entire book focusing on just one aspect of the game would be worth writing just to help game designers understand how it builds up your experience of its world.

>>10172021
We get it. You watched "DEAR SEEGA" man's video on OoT.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyUcwsjyd8Q

>>10163903

I first played it as an adult and felt the way OP did, but only about tutorial-type stuff. I didn't mind reading story-related information, even though I wasn't engaged by the story. I just hate spoilers and handholding. That owl was awful. Even if he isn't in the game long, he's still a big problem. I hated that.

Zelda 1 did it much better. You're an elf or whatever and you're in the wilderness, now SURVIVE. That's a genuinely good story for a game.

>>10171332
let me she/them tiddies

I'm OP and I finally had time to play OoT after a busy week. Should I just skip all kinds of sidequests? Because it feels like the game just doesn't want to get to the point and constantly distracts me instead of giving me a fucking main dungeon. I pick all those quests because I thought they'd have important items, but I only find some bonus stuff
>Lon Lon Ranch
>play retarded "find the cuckoo" minigame
>now go to the Lost Woods
>half-dungeon half-whatever where you just follow the tune (with a minigame of course)
>now go to Kakariko
>find the cuckoos across town quest (not enough chicken minigames yet)
>couldn't catch the last 2 for the life of me until I read in a guide you could make a very awkward jump
>thought this was an important quest or something
>get rewarded with… bottle
>ok, go to Death Mountain
>…but guard's son wants a mask from Hyrule
>…but you also need a shield from Hyrule
>…but there's also a graveyard
>go to graveyard
>beat the boss, get a tune
>look up guide because confused if I should go to Death Mountain, Hyrule or somewhere else entirely
>picrel
>oh there's actually a secret dungeon under some random grave where if you play a random tune you get a piece of heart
>oh actually gravedigger comes out from 6PM to 12PM under one of the 12 dirt patches he can dig out a heart piece, it's random though and you need to pay 10 gold every time, just keep trying lol
wtf is with those 2 secrets? was I supposed to just know or something? or try every single option? well no shit they say this game has "the most secrets", when they are that random / cryptic. I'm NOT looking forward to finding all of those faggot spiders in the game.

>>10172509
but wait, there's more whining
>find windmill guy in Kakariko who wants a tune inspired by the one playing in the mill
>play 3 notes from the tune exactly, twice like with all the tunes so far
>nothing
>"guy who sits under tree at night is the other guy's sun"
>see him
>"you're disgusting"
>uh ok so what does he want
>no clue
>go to hyrule at night
>dog joins me
>come to the lady looking for her dog
>"no it's not my dog"
no, seriously—am I supposed to just read the guide? how am I supposed to solve this stuff otherwise? I've never seen anything remotely as cryptic / confusing in ALTTP.

>>10172509
>Should I just skip all kinds of sidequests?
Absolutely not. Both because they can be important to the main quest and because they can be some of the most interesting shit in the game

>couldn't catch the last 2 for the life of me until I read in a guide you could make a very awkward jump
>get rewarded with… bottle

Seriously dude, if you can't do something in this game without a guide, just drop it and possibly come back later. Don't keep spoiling yourself because you can't immediately figure something out, half the fun is experimenting to find the hidden crypic stuff. It's also clear that you don't get the point of the bottles. And no, you don't have to get all the faggot spiders.

>>10172523
>I've never seen anything remotely as cryptic / confusing in ALTTP

Continuing on, this stuff is really a huge part of why people who love OoT, and for that matter MM as well, prefer these games over LttP. It's precisely all these secret interactions and the like that people adore.

While I'd again advise you to avoid seeking too much help, if you really want to know you're actually doing surprisingly well figuring out the game's quests, I just have to tell you to be patient because the solutions to these things may turn up as you play through the game and unlock things, you're expecting everything to be handed to you too early.

>>10172531
OK so can you just tell me, does the solution to these 2 puzzles I've mentioned turn up along the game? Because otherwise, I was supposed to
1) just move every tombstone and then just guess you could play the sun/moon song in a dungeon
2) just pay the gradigger out the ass for him to just dig every hole and magically learning there was a heart piece there
and I surely hope I learn what to do with that gollum guy under a tree in Kakariko.
because if not, this is some Castlevania 2 level puzzle design.

>>10172537
>1) just move every tombstone and then just guess you could play the sun/moon song in a dungeon
This specific thing is "how was I supposed to know to burn THAT bush" tier. AKA, it would seem ridiculous if you didn't experiment or pay attention to things cuing you in to it, but if you are playing around with things it's completely reasonable to discover yourself, as I did do this myself.

2) just pay the gradigger out the ass for him to just dig every hole and magically learning there was a heart piece there
I immediately found the heart on my first dig, but apparently it's possible for this to glitch and just not let you find the heart at all unless you're playing a version with this problem patched

Castlevania 2 is underrated.

>>10172551
>it would seem ridiculous if you didn't experiment or pay attention to things cuing you in to it
there were flowers cuing me to move the tombstone under which was a hole that lead to the Hyrule shield. there was nothing arounf the other tombstone though. there was NO clue about it as far as I could tell. the guide just said "rear row, 4th from the right". it'd be ok if some character later says this or something, I could understand that. but you ALSO need to play that one tune there, despite the fact that when you pull out the ocarina, you don't see the note sheets.