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[ERROR] No.9313448 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Fucking shitty GW 5th edition rules.

Wanna take a Wave Serpent load of Banshees and drop it on a marine squad, will look cool, be effective, get around some of that dreaded codex creep.

Old problem; can't move, unload, assault. Also, can't park too near enemy otherwise WS will be charged and enemy will block the exit ramp.

Solution; have to park just far enough away so as to stop the enemy surrounding you, but not to far away to mean you can't move+fleet+assault.

Defence; opponent merely retreats 6" backwards, Banshees now cannot reach.

Counter-attack; really judge your distance well (by eye sight), place your WS in just the right place and roll high on fleet.

Conclusion; what could be a fun sweeping attack which would look cool gets bogged down in this stupid mechanic. The game becomes less about tactics and more about judging what 6" is by eyesight.

Result: RAGE!

Seriously I think I'm going top bin playing my Eldar until something gets done about this, I hate having to play like this, I want FUN! Is that too much to ask for GW?

>> No.9313478

You Xenos and your feeble attempts at rivalling Astartes in close combat.

>> No.9313491

>going top bin playing

If you want fun, play space marines.

>> No.9313575

>>9313478
My sisters and I devour Astrates when we are within their ranks, our fury is reminiscent of our great enemies desire upon mortal flesh.

Translation; we rape the living shit out of you!

That is if we can get out of the cursed transport:s

>> No.9313609

>I want FUN! Is that too much to ask for GW?

Think about that for a second.

>> No.9313652

>>9313448
Cry some more, newbie. This is why you use tactics. Ensure that if that squad is retreating for imminant Banshee assault, it's going to be moving towards something else - a squad of Dire Avengers prepped to unleash a Guided/Doomed Bladestorm, for example. Or, use a fast unit like Jetbikes to get into combat and lock the Marines down, then send in the Banshees to finish up.

Actually *think* about how you're going to remove each enemy squad from the table, instead of mindlessly throwing units at the enemy and crying when it doesn't work.

>> No.9313663

>>9313575
Problem aspects?

>> No.9313669

>>9313609
What other reason would I play a game that costs me several hundreds of dollars and many hours of personal time painting?

Maybe you shouldn't answer that one...

>> No.9313673

>>9313652
Isn't this pretty much how the whole of the eldar army has to be run, anyways?

>> No.9313683

>>9313669
because you weren't getting enough out of masturbation.

>> No.9313685

>>9313663
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

>> No.9313699

>>9313652
>I play Spess Mahreens

>> No.9313713

Do Banshees blink?

>> No.9313723

>>9313683
>>9313669
I just need an excuse for posting this

>> No.9313730

>>9313699
No, I play Sisters of Battle, Orks and Dark Eldar.

>>9313673
Basically, yes. Individual Eldar units are excellent at one thing and one thing only. It is up to the Eldar player to engineer situations where he can get the best out of his units.

>> No.9313734

>>9313448
Its the price you pay for wanting to assault straight way. It means I get a chance to shoot at you one round before you rape my shit the fuck up and then jump to my next squad.

>> No.9313738

>>9313713
HAHAAH Oh god.

I think I need to buy some Blood Angels now, just to do that. Dammit.

>> No.9313745

>>9313652
This. Or play an army that doesnt 'AVE TO 'AS DER 'ELMETS SHINEY ER SUMFINK STOOPID WHEN DERS TIME FER SUM KRUMPIN'Z.

>> No.9313754

>>9313652

Been there, done that.

Suddenly rather than sending one squad of Banshees in a WS, you're sending two wave Serpents full of troops, that's nearly 700pts to deal with one enemy unit which could theoretically be only 5 men...

You then start trying to leave the Dire Avengers+WS in flexible positions so that the enemy knows you can do that (Bluff), while actually leaving them to play on their own... but that still restricts that units deployment, tying you up a tad more than you'd like

However the jetbikes idea isn't a bad one at all, I'd avoided jetbikes because I'm trying to keep a theme in my army (so no warlocks on jetbikes tournament lists)

>> No.9313763

Oh my god, thinking is hard! Have to plan ahead - why me no win all time? Bawwww!!!!!

>> No.9313852

>>9313754
No-one is going to be brain-dead enough to use 700 points of troops to kill 5 models, unless they're expensive Elites like Terminators or a Command Squad. Don't be an idiot.

However, using units to gang up on the enemy and wipe them out, ensuring you take no - or as few as possible - casualties in the process is not a bad idea. Who cares if you use 500 points to remove a 200 point squad? The enemy is down a squad, you are not.

>> No.9313944

>>9313852

I suppose you're right... munchkin point conceded. I'll consider myself served.

It's just I've been down this path before, before you know it rather than playing a game you're doing an exercise in mathhammer, building lists based on probabilities and playing a more expensive version of chess (only not as good).

Before you know it you've speced out a list Warlocks+Farseer+jetbikes, enough troop choices to make it viable and a tank of some kind to act as moving cover while you get that 3+ save, re-rolled up and working.

Shameless character defence; I don't mind thinking in a game, hell I play Eldar, I just object when rules such as (turning counts as full movement) interrupt the flow of the game. Would it really have smashed the game mechanic to let certain shock troops have a few rule tweaks.

Hell would it have hurt to give the WS a front hatch like every other assault vehicle in the game?

>> No.9313971

>>9313448
Um, guess what, you haven't been able to assault out of non-open topped/Land Raider tanks since 4th edition.

Dumbass.

>> No.9314025

>>9313944
>before you know it rather than playing a game you're doing an exercise in mathhammer

No. This is a huge, absurd logical fallacy. What part of planning out how your units are going to interact with one another means you're inevitably going to slide into running a cookie-cutter Tourny list? I base my unit selection on fluff and theme rather than just grabbing all the best things in the Codex. But you bet your ass once I've picked my units, I'm going to work out exactly what the best way for them to support one another on the tabletop is.

Let me turn your question back around. Why should shock assault units get the ability to hurl themselves straight into combat before the enemy gets a chance to bring them down? Why should a unit of Banshees be able to fly to the other side of the table and pile straight into combat on turn one? The only Transports in the game you can assault out of are open-topped, and thus monstrously fragile, or Land Raiders, and thus terribly expensive and still vulnerable to a Melta shot in the guts.

>> No.9314026

>>Hell would it have hurt to give the WS a front hatch like every other assault vehicle in the game?

The difference between Wave Serpents and every other assault vehicle in the game is Wave Serpents are fucking invincible, much faster, and pack considerably more firepower than anything that isn't a Land Raider or Monolith.

Sorry, but you can't have everything.

>> No.9314066

>>9314025
Though, I should add, being a bitter old Dark Eldar player, I didn't really have a choice so this sort of thinking comes naturally these day. I've got to plan every move and assault with utmost fucking caution, because one or two mistakes and I might as well throw the game.

>> No.9314181

>>9314025
>>9314026

I suppose you're right, I'll retract all arguments and suck it up.

Hell the wave serpent is shockingly good (even if you pay for it) and I'm probably just nit-picking. If the rules were changed in a manner I'm suggesting you'd make your entire army Banshees+WS & Harlequins+Falcon and mow the entire board down, neglecting the deliberate low toughness flaw.

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