[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / g / ic / jp / lit / sci / tg / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports / report a bug ] [ 4plebs / archived.moe / rbt ]

Due to resource constraints, /g/ and /tg/ will no longer be archived or available. Other archivers continue to archive these boards.Become a Patron!

/tg/ - Traditional Games

View post   

[ Toggle deleted replies ]
File: 103 KB, 672x936, tsr-350-past-in-flames.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
77948462 No.77948462 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

storm edition


>Current meta, complete with deck list

>Build and share casual decks

>Build and share cubes

>Search engines
>Proxy a deck or a cube for cheap
>Play online for free

Your printer + bulk cards + sleeves can also do the trick
>Library of in-demand alters


What's your favorite old border card?

>> No.77948492

>TQ: Sengir Vampire and Plague Witch.

Sengir Vampire was my first rare and it honestly scared the shit out of while simultaneously fascinating me. He was no fucking weepingbell that was sure.

Plague Witch was in the same pack and BOY THEM TITTIES


>> No.77948624
File: 2.65 MB, 3264x2448, 20200501_123058.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.77948655
File: 270 KB, 672x936, EF082894-E0E6-41EA-AA13-2BF3DC107904.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


Pic related.
FoW both allows powerful combo decks to exist without needing a ban, and adds a super unique dynamic to the game. Your opponent tapping out doesn't mean that you can do whatever you want, you still have to analyze what they could have. Each player ends up making a lot more decisions during a game where you both have FoW.
At the same time, it encapsulates the core game concept of card advantage. 2-for-1ing yourself is less of an issue post-FIRE, but it's still a real cost. Is that Brainstorm more valuable than countering your opponent's threat?
Also the art is sweet.

>> No.77948691

Get the fuck out, underage.
They used to be the first successfull streaming platform, then they lost licenses when all the big studios started their own platforms but normalfags stuck anyway because they were too emotionally invested in the platform at that point.
Now piracy is on the surge again because of the infinite amount of subscriptions you need to have to be able to keep up with the consooming habits.

>> No.77948694
File: 257 KB, 672x936, jud-62-cabal-therapy.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


Nothing in mtg feels better than naming the right card. NOTHING.

>> No.77948716

>a free counter adds such a heckin super cool unique dynamic bro! Like and subscribe!

>> No.77948737

man I hate death's shadow

>> No.77948744
File: 246 KB, 768x1024, blue lives matter too much.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.77948746

>opponent goes first
>Scrubland, pass
>I play Swamp, Cabal Therapy naming Bob
>he discards all 3 in his hand

almost nutted myself on the spot

>> No.77948768

It hates you, too.

>> No.77948980
File: 270 KB, 672x936, 9ed-59-annex.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

could this be printed today at 3 cmc with some kind of downside like "whenever enchanted land gets tapped, destroy this enchantment"?

I want to punish people for playing a low land count but I don't have the rest of the cards for a proper RG Ponza build

>> No.77949008

if theres anything thats the opposite of fire its stopping enemy gamers from casting their spells
the only time you're allowed to do that is by killing them with your questing beast haste creatures before they get to cast their cool fun card

>> No.77949011


>> No.77949167

Could this see play in a deck with Boomerrang and Eye of Nowhere? Basically U land "destruction".
Or is it too slow, as I suspect? Maybe combined with Blood Moon...

>> No.77949232
File: 230 KB, 672x936, fut-93-yixlid-jailer.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

why didnt they bring back the cool frame
why did they tranny up blade of the sixth pride and mass of ghouls
why is anyone consooming this garbage

>> No.77949245

>Still no Phyrexian creature type update

>> No.77949269

>why is anyone consooming this garbage
The only things still tying players to the game are sunk cost fags and EDHtrannies who unironically consider mtg to be part of their identity.
The game simply isn't good. And I don't just mean "reeeeee FIRE bad!" either. The core gameplay is an antiquated remnant of a bygone age, and even cleaning up the convoluted mess it has become can't fix it.
Sure, mtg was definitely the pioneer, the catalyst that put the collectible card game concept on the market in a meaningful way, but even Richard Garfield has lamented the numerous flaws that are too ingrained in the system to solve.
That's just part of the process of innovation, though. When we first set out into uncharted territory we're going to make mistakes. We've had nearly three decades spent learning in an industry that has seen explosive growth not only in sales but more particularly in design. Countless ideas have been tested, refined, scrapped, and rebuilt. Our knowledge about what works well has increased exponentially.
Mtg is the Wright Brothers' plane of CCGs - a remarkable achievement, for sure, but one that is long past its prime and should be retired to a museum. Those of you still desperately clinging to this rust bucket need to let go.
The sky is the limit, and we have so much farther we can fly.

>> No.77949277

thanks chef, I needed some pasta to keep me going

>> No.77949279

This is the third time the animutranny shitposter is posting this exact same "Magic is outdated" thing. He must have spent a lot of time on it.

>> No.77949314

>he's counting
I appreciate all that free rent. Also I'm not the animutranny, but you do you, anon.

>> No.77949443
File: 728 KB, 680x1031, 1600188445808.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

if we didn't offer you board and rent, the ghetto would claim you for good.

>> No.77949482

My ebonics is way too terrible for me to even be allowed anywhere near the ghetto.

>> No.77949535
File: 267 KB, 672x936, 1582260418597.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Especially dangerou for you then. We'll keep a spot for you and your fine menu here.

>> No.77949627
File: 53 KB, 1280x720, 156214074_1302519190141441_3202524020499704925_n.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

You do realize that no matter the thermonuclear-tier amounts of rage, seething and "wallet voting," TSR, UB, SLs and FIRE have been, are and shall be financial sucesses? A single whale has more "voting power" than all of /mmg/ combined. So, why bother? You either will learn to love casting Spongebob, equip him with Cloud's Buster Sword which gives him haste to attack your opponent's Sheldon planeswalker; or you can just leave mtg all together.
Why are you still here? Don't lie to yourself by larping as a wallstreet wolf: if WotC doesn't abolish the RL, they will FIRE it up in the upcoming years. Don't believe me? Look at Jeweled Lotus. I bet my anal virginity we will have Jeweled Mox in Commander Legends 2.

>> No.77949670

Someone's son posted that

>> No.77949672

my god those milkies

>> No.77949677

he's at it again boys

>> No.77949944

>Why are you still here?
Just to watch the trainwreck. I don't even pop in here that often anymore.

>> No.77950484

You do realize no one takes your posts seriously, right? No one even reads them, why put so much effort into it?

>> No.77950540

He's replying to himself now.

>> No.77950790
File: 29 KB, 621x502, 1607379746142.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>haha this game sucks lmao
>I sold all of my cards (again) haha
>I can't believe you all waste your time here
>You're all cucks, let me post the same messages in each thread to show you all how you all waste your time
>lmao you're all mad
pic related

>> No.77950793
File: 6 KB, 118x215, 156242886_2835697093315358_325971429263388703_n.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Because I find you schizos fucking hilarous. I can leave for a whole week (like I just did) yet you still yell "ANIMU TRANNY" left and right at any dissenting post. Face it, you are literally paranoid schizos, drunk from your own hatred and frustration at a game that no longer appeals to your demographic. I can whip out a small text and rile you all up. I know you read them whether you asnwer me or not.
So, seethe, dilate and literally, have sex. For I shall always live rent free inside your head.

>> No.77950853

I don't need to sell cards anymore. All of my cards are from China at this point.

>> No.77950897

>I shall live rent free in your head
>but I'll keep posting and replying relentlessly
Pick one, sweaty.

>> No.77951079

Personally, my number is $75 or more for a card is where I ask the Chinamen. I still have some really expensive shit for decks I will love and play forever, but beyond that, it's fakes all day.

>> No.77951140
File: 1.73 MB, 909x1225, blue ponza.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I present you the new tier 0 deck in Modern.

>> No.77951195

Does playing an artifact land in your turn also count as casting an artifact spell?

>> No.77951249

Play mtgo and give me some results and I'll want to believe you.

>> No.77951255

No. You don't cast lands.

>> No.77951271

You played, not cast.

>> No.77951273

looks like a good concept but I'm not sure about running 4x Crypitc + 2x Jace with only 20 lands, even with all the cantrips you have

no, playing a land doesn't count as casting an artifact spell because you're not casting anything

>> No.77951325

No, but it does count as an artifact entering the battlefield for Glaze Fiend.

>> No.77951380

Yeah, I suspected as much, unfortunately. Sorry for the dumb question, was fantasizing about flipping Erayo on turn 1.

>> No.77951629

This looks awful. Not enough creatures to actually be threatening, Opt over Serum Visions when I don't even think the deck should be running cantrips in the first fucking place, 4 mana cards in a Delver deck only running 20 lands, Snapcasters that basically don't come online until you have 4 lands, and zero fucking Spell Pierces for some reason.

>> No.77951634

>was fantasizing about flipping Erayo on turn 1
You can do that only if your name is "LeChiffre".

>> No.77951787

If you replace Opt with Visions you can't change your draw when you have Delver down and your opponents will know you don't have Twiddle up so they can easily fetch a tapped shock on your endstep instead of having to wait their mainphase.
You also can't flash-draw a Snappy in your opponent's turn.
The threats are more than enough, might consider spell pierce.
>the deck should not run catrips
>why are you running only 20 lands
Considering it's all blue spells I think it's enough. Maybe remove an islet or a fetch for another basic. If you draw lands you're guaranteed to be able to cast spells on curve.

>> No.77951794

jeez what a trash list

>> No.77951811

I have feelings you know ;_;

>> No.77951846

I'm sorry, i luv u

>> No.77951895

Citadel, Drum, Orni, Mox Amber, Emry, Mox Amber, Erayo
Pass the turn :^)

>> No.77951918

Just run Owling Mine if you're gonna be playing land bounce

>> No.77951920

>If you replace Opt with Visions you can't change your draw when you have Delver down
Why would you want to change your top card? You're either drawing a land you need to be able to cast your 4 mana spells, or you're drawing gas.
>your opponents will know you don't have Twiddle up so they can easily fetch a tapped shock on your endstep instead of having to wait their mainphase
Why the fuck are you even running Twiddle to tap shit when Gigadrowse exists? You don't even know the card pool.
>The threats are more than enough
Every single one of your threats dies to W&6, dipshit. And even without W&6 you literally have 9 threats in the deck that are just 2/3 power beatsticks. Without the extra reach from something like Lightning Bolt you won't win a single game. It's like you took the already weak UR Delver lists in Modern and convinced yourself you don't need Lightning Bolt.

PLEASE play this deck online so you can get crushed and realise the truth.

>> No.77951940

>there's new art for tarmogoyf on the promo images for tsr
>the art is not bad
>it's not on the actual card

>> No.77951980

>Why the fuck are you even running Twiddle to tap shit when Gigadrowse exists? You don't even know the card pool.
What an insufferable cunt.
I haven't even played this stupid game in over a year because of how enraged it made me and you pretend I remember every single existing card?

>> No.77951996

Collector boosters?

>> No.77952006

So maybe you shouldn't be desperately trying to defend your deck from criticism?

>> No.77952029

>could this be printed today at 3 cmc with some kind of downside
>When ~ enters the battlefield, draw a card
This is a downside because you are now one card closer to decking out

>> No.77952057

When will idiots realise that delver will never be good in modern?

>> No.77952080


>> No.77952092

some yt chick made this deck a year or two ago. It's shit

>> No.77952104

Back in 2019 I was winning weekly Modern events at my LGS (~12 players, all meta decks) with UR Delver. I had about a dozen different meta decks I could play with my collection but I kept coming back to Delver since it always felt like it had the most play in the most matchups. The viability of UR tempo and Tarmogoyf are the yardsticks to a healthy format.

>> No.77952106

This happened for Dig Through Time as well for Ultimate Masters.

>> No.77952128

I think the whole set has been spoiled and it's not in there. So I guess this is just to waste money.

>> No.77952133

I'v played with Delver and won too. Doesn't mean it's good in modern. Just play prowess creatures

>> No.77952148

I hate reddi t, soifags and their hugbox wishes for the game so much. Locking your opponent out was some of the best that magic had to offer.

>> No.77952149

Vapor Snag and Young Pyromancer are pretty good against Prowess creatures.

>> No.77952166

When they realize that interacting is meaningless in this dog of a format

>> No.77952194

>vapor snag
How is that good against prowess creatures? They cost 1 mana.
>Young Pyro
Just as unplayable as Delver. Just play legacy if you want to play with those cards

>> No.77952236
File: 125 KB, 238x343, simic-charm.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Has simic charm ever seen any play in Modern?
Seems good in a tempo deck.

>> No.77952247

>How is that good against prowess creatures? They cost 1 mana
1 mana for a 1/2 is a pretty shit deal is why. You spaff your hand pumping your dudes up, then before combat they get sent back to your hand. You now have a bunch of 1/2 creatures and no spells to pump them. And if you don't think a bunch of free 1/1 tokens are good against creatures without Trample then I don't even know.

>> No.77952250

There were never any good UG decks outside of Uro/Oko, and those decks never needed something like this

>> No.77952263

Unban looting and I could see some wonk6 legacy lite shit being ok.
>Turn 1 looting pitching phonix and visions
>Turn 2 dreadhoard.
>Turn 3 (unimpeeded) draw 3, get it all.
Christmas land, sure, but I want delver phonix to make a comeback.

>> No.77952348

As shit as my deck is I think some of your criticisms was retarded. How can you say that list has not enough threats when it runs 9 creatures and 2 Jaces?

>> No.77952366

All right chum, let me break it down for you.
1.If you vapor snag a 1 mana creature, you're not gaining anything out of it. If your opponent is smart, they'll neve go all in on an opponent that has open mana.
2.I've played against multiple vapor snag user on cockatrice(kinda popular for some reason, might be the same guy), and I've crushed them with Mono Red Prowess every time. Vapor snag is literally just delaying the inevitable.
3.They proof is in the pudding. NO ONE plays vapor snag dude, cause it's just generally bad against any creature that isn't Gurmag og Tasigur.

As for Young Pyro
>"I play lava dart"

>> No.77952368

Yes, Meryn. She used Frost Titan lol.

>> No.77952370

Weren't there Miracle-Gro decks or bogle decks that were are in UG?

>> No.77952387
File: 136 KB, 672x936, emn-85-collective-brutality.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

There are better alternatives.
>Blossoming Defense pumps AND hexproofs for just 1 mana.
>Lazotep Plating does hexproof for you and your shit AND gives you a 1/1.
>Vapor Snag is a more practical bounce spell.
The only upside is Simic Charm can either Unsummon or do half a Blossoming Defense.
Modal spells are usually lame, but make up for their lack of power with versatility. I consider the Commands to be abominations because there's no mana inefficiency drawbacks like with the Charms.
Pic related and Blessed Alliance are Charms done right. They're powerful, but their power comes from their versatility outweighing its lack of power, not from being busted do-whatevers.

>> No.77952417
File: 44 KB, 958x960, 1604900797812.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>tfw I play 4 mainboard Needles at my lgs
>tfw this led everyone to run suboptimal fetches

>> No.77952435

9 creatures and two planeswalkers that win on a completely different axis to the creatures just isn't enough. Your creatures will just eat a Bolt or Path and you'll be out any ability to pressure your opponent. Countering spells does not win games.

>The proof is in the pudding
This is the sort of incestuous mindset that creates stagnant metagames. I played UR Delver into a varied field of meta decks back in 2019 and performed well. The MagicAIDS example works perfectly here. Humans was a terrible deck with no results to its name before it was the best deck in Modern. Critique the cards, not the results.

>> No.77952444
File: 75 KB, 1038x408, 593710637690170679031706.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Are you living in some sort of fantasy wonderland? Young Peezy and Monastery mentor will never be good in formats like modern, cause there is now free counterspells, and the format is so aggressive and filled with kill spells. You're essentially paying 2 mana for something that dies to a W&6 down tick, lava dart or push/bolt. That's the reason you don't see Dark Confidant anymore either

>> No.77952481

What deck plays Wrenn? Show me one that placed since the bans.

>> No.77952484

Tapping out for Peezy against a deck that runs W&6 instead of just hitting with Delver, casting Visions, and holding up Spell Pierce is obviously dumb. Fortunately Delver is a deck with a modicum of decision making to it, hence why I liked it.

>> No.77952505

If they spend their few mana to kill my creatures I'm already winning.

>> No.77952531

Your opponent's lands untap at the start of each of their turns.

>> No.77952579
File: 66 KB, 1280x720, Wrong.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>I played UR Delver into a varied field of meta decks back in 2019 and performed well
First of you idiot, it's not 2019 anymore, it's 2021.

Secondly, you think you're some kind of mastermind brewer, who has unlocked this secret vapor snag tech, and the only reason it's not more well known, is because we want to be rude? God you're a crybaby. Just face it. Some cards, as such as you love them, just aren't good. Ofc you can win with them here and there, but they'll never be viable is my point.

>Critique the cards, not the results
How about I do both, by calling vapor snag a bad card, therefore having no results, therefore being unplayable?

>> No.77952610

>playing not 1, but 2 fucking creatures that dies to W&6

>> No.77952635
File: 84 KB, 1022x444, W&6.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Don't know where you are trying to go with this, but ok

>> No.77952663

And they get either bounced before that or tapped in their untap.

>> No.77952670
File: 31 KB, 247x302, 8a6.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.77952685

So basically only in irrelevant decks, got it.

>> No.77952699

>FoW both allows powerful combo decks to exist without needing a ban, and adds a super unique dynamic to the game.
All this does is turn formats into fast combo vs. free permission.
>At the same time, it encapsulates the core game concept of card advantage. 2-for-1ing yourself is less of an issue post-FIRE, but it's still a real cost.
The card disadvantage only matters if you and your opponent are trying to play the same role. If you're the beatdown, FoW is to prevent the control player from interacting and is at best "0: Take an extra turn." If you're the control, FoW is there to remove the card that kills you while allowing you to pull ahead.
More and more I'm convinced that FoW constrains deckbuilding rather than allowing more decks to exist.

>> No.77952750
File: 122 KB, 218x300, 267497.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Sorry for slightly off-topic, but would anyone here happen to know where I could find scans of the English 8th edition rulebook? It used to be available at the official site a few years back, but not anymore.

>> No.77952756

Would Force of Will/Negation be better if they were Mana Leaks instead of hard counters?

>> No.77952769

Not as irrelevant as yours LMAO

>> No.77952839

They would trigger you less but it wouldn't make them better, no.

>> No.77952852

>the face of magic back then: a fucking awesome white elf with a bow in his hand ready to break your bones if you dare to snap a fucking twig underfoot
>the face of magic now: a fucking black tranny faggot with soul patch and sidecut that's full of sass and became a planeswalker by force of smug alone just because he felt like shitposting irl that day, also drawn like shit

>> No.77952891

By better do you mean reasonably weaker? I don't think so. On paper there would be some way to go over them sure, but with the speed those formats play at I don't think it would make a meaningful difference, Daze is still busted and that's just Force Spike.

>> No.77952902
File: 108 KB, 700x450, Avacyn-Guardian-Angel-MtG-Art.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

What compelled winona nelson to do it? Her art is normally so nice and pretty, was it intentional to make the tranny ugly? Is she based?

>> No.77953008

"Better" as in making the game more fun and nuanced. Obviously more powerful cards are going to be better metawise, so really it's more about "What ifs".
Making a good card is difficult because it has to be balanced between unplayable and bannable, and it also has to promote or let be the popular play patterns.
Overall I believe force cards are kind of dumb because tapping out should be punishable, and force cards are just a cop-out. However, because of the existence of bullshit Legacy combos, force cards HAVE to exist in order to keep them in check.
It's easy for me to look at Force of Despair as a "good card" because of its blowout potential, but should free spells even exist in a FIREless meta?

>> No.77953122

I find FoD and even FoN and FoV to be better designed than FoW as they are more limited in what they can actually answer. You still have this insane blowout potential but they only have relevant text vs certain strategies, while nearly every deck in the game wants to resolve spells.

>> No.77953165

Infect chads, where you at?

>> No.77953179

God infect was so good before they banned OUaT.

>> No.77953219

Adding on to this however, more narrow answers would want to exist in a game with weaker threats overall.

>> No.77953227

Force of Negation hits a lot of things. While I'm grateful they put the "not your turn" thing to prevent obnoxious Force wars and combo protection (unless you're Ad Naus), it's still kind of obnoxious to get Forced.

>> No.77953335

Force, like thoughtseize, is a necessary evil. The only free counterspell I truly hate is Daze

>> No.77953360

True, but in addition to only being live on your opponent's turn it can't hit creatures. People like to say that fair creature decks like Maverick dunk on FoW decks when in reality they get tempo'd out trying to stick threats on curve. FoW looks pretty good when it lets your opponent tap out to get on board then counter your Knight.

>> No.77953610

Is it? Combo decks are slower and much more fragile than in legacy. Recovering from a force in legacy is often as easy as brainstorming and fetching, but in modern getting forced at a critical moment is practically a death sentence with minimal effort from the forcer. With no monke to power out turn 1 combos I don't think force is at all needed in modern. If we had more busted combo decks I could see it.

>> No.77953662

I was thinking more about legacy desu, haven't played much modern in a good while

>> No.77953737

Oh yeah force is 100% required in legacy or else decks like belcher would have an 80% winrate

>> No.77953814

We're still here, snakeskin is a huge boon and will be a solid help vs the gut shot/lava dart stuff. The discord is mostly shitposting though

>> No.77953896

When people can combo off on turn 1, 2 or 3 free counterspells are a must.
If anything it's cards like Pact of Negation that shouldn't exist because they can be played in slower formats for basically free to protect combos, while they're pretty useless to counter those very same combo decks by every other deck.

Stopping a threat by 2 for 1 yourself is not good against any fair strategy so, no, forces are not a problem.

>> No.77954378

imagine the titty-edit

>> No.77954523

>where you at?
Playing Hammertime, a better version of their antiquated deck :^)

>> No.77954614
File: 114 KB, 636x851, magic cuck.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>it's still kind of obnoxious to get Forced

>> No.77954658

You know for a fact you just played your own JtMS and brainstormed with a smug ass look because you had a 0 mana counter to blow me out.

>> No.77954695
File: 29 KB, 223x310, Image (5).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Here I was, thinking you were going to defend the Twiddle with
>It can untap my Delver for combat tricks :-D
And instead you just make excuses for your brew.
>My 60 card deck runs 11 threats
Your amount of winning cards to total deck suggests you need to stick creatures and then protect them/clear the way. You have too much bounce and not enough hard removal/counterspells. Your counterspells are too high CMC and you're putting too many value engines in a tempo deck when you need to be getting that value damage in. You would run pic related if you were a Chad.

>> No.77954741

Leave it to Greentards to not understand the concept of card advantage and how "free" counterspells are not free.

>> No.77954783

And what's wrong with it? You can counter it with your own force or attack it with the creatures you could cast in your first 4 turns.

>> No.77955038

Force of Will is an extremely healthy card that is pretty much the sole reason Legacy is even playable. I would argue that it is also an extremely fair card even when resolving for free
>You have 7 in hand
>Opponent has 7 in hand
>Opponent puts BigFuckSpell on stack, 6 in hand
>You pay alternate cost for FoW, -1 for alternate and then -1 for playing, 5 in hand
>You have 5, opponent has 6
>If you go 1-for-1 trades on the rest of your cards, opponent comes out ahead from your initial Force of Will
Funnily enough, the Force I have the most problem with is Force of Vigor because it costs 2 to break 2 for free, making it an even trade. Yes, being able to counters spells while tapped out is powerful, but you HAVE spent more resources than your opponent in order to gain something for "free". To the anon who pointed out Maverick in Legacy, this is actually why Maverick and other fair decks dunk on FoW in Legacy. The Maverick deck will be able to continue pumping out threats that must be answered, and if they can stall out the game and force those trades with the opponent they will end up ahead. In fact, many decks in Legacy will end up sideboarding out the Force of Wills for efficient 1-for-1 removal or counters or sometimes even just more draw pieces in games 2 and 3 when they know they are playing against a fair deck. Even with the ten thousand pieces of FIRE card advantage to recoup the cost of playing Force of Will, the answer is to board out because all your opponents have access to the same card pool as you and you will lose the mirror where your opponent did board out the FoW for more card advantage engines.
This anon understands. These cards come at significant cost that will cause losses if your opponent has a deeper conceptual understanding of card advantage than you (except Force of Vigor because lulz Maro luvs Green)

>> No.77955085

>fair green decks that don't run Force of Will
>relevant in formats with Force of Will

>> No.77955129

>Even with the ten thousand pieces of FIRE card advantage to recoup the cost of playing Force of Will, the answer is to board out because all your opponents have access to the same card pool as you and you will lose the mirror where your opponent did board out the FoW for more card advantage engines.
That was straight up false up to the last ban wave. You kept Force against fair decks because going down a card didn't matter if it meant keeping DHA or Oko for another turn.

>> No.77955173

Look at this faggot trying to justify FoW as a fair card lmao

>> No.77955204

>Board out force
This x1000. If you're playing against a fair matchup, you should have many other options main and sideboard to deal with fair cards. Breaking combo pieces is what force is made for and helps keep the format in check. A slightly more obtuse example where you'd keep force in even though it's mostly fair magic is against decks that play crop rot because you even the playing field when they go down a land and you go down a card, plus the fact that those decks tend to be psudo-combo anyways

>> No.77955248

Depends. Doomsday boarded out FoW against Delver because it stuffed in tons of REBs and removal. If you don't have enough redundancy in your delver hate you probably do still need FoWs.

>> No.77955373
File: 497 KB, 2048x2048, Lurrus.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

It's the toppest of keks. I drop in once or twice a month, and they insist you and I are the same person. It's nice to be thought about so much. Maybe one of them will send us flowers.

>> No.77955407

>To the anon who pointed out Maverick in Legacy, this is actually why Maverick and other fair decks dunk on FoW in Legacy. The Maverick deck will be able to continue pumping out threats that must be answered, and if they can stall out the game and force those trades with the opponent they will end up ahead.
But that's not good enough somehow, if it was we'd see an actual rock-paper-scissors meta, but fair non-blue isn't good enough against fair blue to make up for a 10-90 combo matchup.

>> No.77955624

There is a differnce between "can" and "should"

Like is there a cost for this effect were its not broken? Yes. But would that make the game overall better as an entertainment system? I would argue no.

Like if you have a land so powerful you need land hate like this to deal with it, that land shouldnt exist in the first place.

>> No.77955661

What is unironically a more based form of entertainment, Playing mtg, or shitposting in mtg generals?

>> No.77956066

>not playing the strictly better dream's grip

>> No.77956071

Holy cringe

>> No.77956099
File: 482 KB, 4096x2048, Modern Data.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Lets discuss some actual data /mmg/

>> No.77956133

Wow it's almost like people have been saying for months that Heliod Combo and Prowess are broken and only being held back by Uropiles

>> No.77956178

Heliod is strong but there are plenty of answers imo, its the toolbox style of the deck that makes it insanely strong

>also you're reading the graph wrong if you think prowess is op you fucking fag

>> No.77956180

Force is also obnoxious IN combo decks, though, because if you're playing a fair deck that can only interact with combo in a few ways (thalia et al) then Force blows you out entirely.

FoN is infinitely less powerful than FoW but it also has a similar annoying dynamic where it's used to stop answers a lot more than it's used to stop threats.

>> No.77956244

>aggro deck with the synergy of a midrange deck that can go infinite at instant speed and win at any time just because with the ability to toolbox an answer against the whole field
>"you can answer it lol just hope it doesn't answer your answer... pre-emptively"
>a quarter of the meta is prowess
>"prowess is totally ok looool"
I can smell the mana on you that you morphose into semen

>> No.77956281

>This is straight up false up to the last ban wave.
Oko is a degenerate format warping card that had unforeseen consequences on card quality.
>It can set your opponents best cards to a 3/3 elk (threats, answers, board control, all of it)
>Any of your cards that are under a 3/3 elk can turn into a 3/3 elk (your mana rocks double from broken acceleration to wincons when they gain valuable 3/3 bodies)
It simultaneously lowers your opponents maximum card quality to a set point while raising your own minimum card quality to the same point. It doesn't matter that your opponent has access to more resources, because all their resources are the same as your worst resource. As soon as you draw into one thing of better quality than your opponent, you will almost certainly negate the -1 from using Force of Will. To all the lurkers out there who don't understand why this is important, imagine you had a card that read "All cards in your opponents hands are basic Forests". It doesn't matter if they're holding 3 cards or 300. Oko works along a similar concept, except it is for permanents on the board. Basically, it doesn't matter you're down a card with FoW against a fair deck because Oko will singlehandedly neuter every fair deck you face. The card quality advantage on Oko is subtle and format warpingly strong.
I'd agree, you're correct. The old heuristic of "Force of Will boards out against fair decks" is outdated. When there are cards capable of that level of card quality neutering like Oko, traditional ideas of card advantage are no longer relevant. However, when card advantage is more relevant to winning games than card quality, the old heuristic will hold true.
There are a handful of fair match ups where I'd still want the Force of Will due to back up combos or explosive game ending plays. There are also a handful of combo match ups where I'd want to board out the Force of Will (Cavern of Souls and Dark Depths come to mind)

>> No.77956314

>boarding out force vs dark depths
What did he mean by this?

>> No.77956337
File: 998 KB, 1360x1020, IMG_20210308_113855.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

MPC vintage cube came in and got it sleeved and play tested a bit. I added some conspiracies and a handful of fun cards as well. Still working on getting enough cool basics for 8 players and I didn't think to order enough tokens for it.

>> No.77956384

Like how hard this filtered memedernettes

>> No.77956389
File: 1.19 MB, 1820x1820, 1611448493746.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Should Manamorphose be banned? It's a free spell that enables too many shenanigans, but technically there's nothing wrong with it in a vacuum.
Also I miss Aquaposting.

>> No.77956424

>he will always be an avatartranny shitposting stupid questions on /mmg/

>> No.77956442
File: 174 KB, 1594x1128, 1613676430241.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Official /mmg/ hymn.

>> No.77956450

7% =/= 25% you moron

>> No.77956504

I like that song, but it no longer identifies me.
This one does more.

>> No.77956510
File: 2.72 MB, 1344x936, image (21).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Yeah tell me where you're gonna Force of Will in these triggers.
Dark Depths + Cavern of Souls (Vampire or Shaman) then cast Vampire Hexmage

>> No.77956656

Nobody plays cavern and you keep it in to counter crop rotation, sylvan scrying and hexmage.

>> No.77956767
File: 157 KB, 500x500, 1589227317688.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Beautiful play Mr. Bond. However...
>*plays Entrancing Melody 0*

>> No.77956898

I saw a BUG list running that in the side lol.

>> No.77956966

Should add Red for Stone Rain and friends because Twiddle is too weak in a deck like this. Delver isn't that great either. Bolt is nice too. Might as well play Annex too.

>> No.77957215
File: 836 KB, 500x500, 1590033499874.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I know this is /mmg/ but if we're talking about Force of Will in the context of Dark Depths we're talking about the legacy build. Sylvan Scrying isn't run, Elvish Reclaimer has taken its spot, being one mana cheaper, having a body, and having the land come off a trigger (although the creature itself can still be FoW'd). You're correct in that nobody plays Cavern anymore, but that's because Veil of Summer exists and will 3-for-1 a FoW if you can afford to hold a G when you cast an important spell. However, you might run into some people who are holdouts and still running cavern, the deck did used to run it before it got better options for grinding. It is also still a very real possibility as sideboard tech, especially because of dollar cost of paper or just a matter of personal preference/taste.
There's also just the other aspect of the Dark depths deck in that it runs 4x dark confidant and 2x sylvan library and will out-grind your Force of Will. Plus pitching your own (specifically blue) cards against decks running Thoughtseize is going to make your hand easier to ruin in terms of card quality. It doesn't matter whether you Force before or after the Thoughtseize, because either you've pitched and have smaller hand size (easier to ruin) or your opponent can see the FoW and it becomes additional information when selecting the discard (they can turn off FoW by getting the only blue card, or make it costier by leaving only 1 pitch target of high quality like Oko, causing either big card quality drop for using the FoW or stalling the FoW entirely). You guys act like the FoW exists in a vacuum against one card but it is still relative to deck versus deck. Against a deck that has
>one guaranteed land combo that FoW can't stop any piece of
>many ways to reach combo from 1 mana
>many ways to grind card advantage
>hand disruption
>can run Veil of Summer
Yeah you should board out Force of Will here.

>> No.77957390

Eiffel 65 is unironically the greatest italian contribution to the modern world, with Monica Bellucci.

>> No.77957424

You really should take a look at the legacy metagame. I'm not even going to read your post because it's just so incredibly wrong from the two first sentences.

>> No.77957451

Yes if it cost 1BB. Theft should never have been a blue mechanic

>> No.77957480

Question: during a kaldheim paper draft do I have unlimited access to snow basics or am I forced to only use the ones I open from boosters?

>> No.77957598

So what should we do?
Ban Heliod (or ballista but spike feeder is still there) and ban monastery swiftspear?

>> No.77957607

Take your own advice retard

>> No.77957615

end your life redditor

>> No.77957678

Ballista, Heliod, Manamorphose

>> No.77957795

Convenient how you choose to dismiss information that proves you wrong. Here's the 5-0 list from two days ago
>everything I don't like is reddit
Calm down son, it's just a website.

>> No.77957800

The second one.

>> No.77957816

Ban Heliod, obviously. Prowess is fine.
Kill yourself.

>> No.77957831

The combo decks FoW checks are usually very good against the non blue decks that are supposedly allowed to exist. But those decks are almost always worse overall than the blue cantrip decks. So we are right back to what you were saying about combo v permission. Though my takeaway here is that BS and Ponder need to be banned to hit the combo decks and blue decks to give some breathing room to the non blue decks.

>> No.77957873

Still think you're wrong. Slowing them down via countering one of their fast ways to get out depths is going to slow them down so much, and most of the time you're pitching another force or 'late game' cards to stop their combo. When they thoughseize you on turn 1 and look at force drawspell plowshares, they're eating the plowshares every time. Ifyou can stop them from doing that, it's a win in my book.

>> No.77957912

Ur a dumdum. Decks durdle a hell of a lot and there's plenty of times where the blue player looks at trash and shuffles with ponder or brainstorm locks themselves because they brick with their low land count.

>> No.77958070

I'm sure people will definitely not run the best consistency tools because sometimes your deck shits on you. If you think that's enough to not run those cantrips or that this is enough of a downside to not make BS and Ponder the some of the most ubiquitous cards in the format for over a decade then I don't know what to tell you.

>> No.77958098

you mean this?

>> No.77958133

The question is not
>Is countering a tutor that fetches a combo good?
The question is
>Is pitching a card better than paying the mana cost in every match up?
The Force of Will will most likely get boarded for another counterspell, if not some other way to interact. You do understand this right?

>> No.77958173

>10% of the format is tier 0
Since when

>> No.77958931

Boomerang does it too


>> No.77959290
File: 3.15 MB, 4952x2092, 65464563456.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Anon, play bant company!

>is a fair creature strategy so will never have anything banned
>has game against artifact strategies, enchantment strategies, and even graveyard strategies before sideboarding
>Spell Queller is one of the best creatures ever printed and gives you game against must-counter cards
>bodies will always be relevant, even the smallest 1/1 will eventually win the game if not dealt with
>Meddling mage gives you game against uninteractive goldfish strategies, and can always name removal in fair matchups, never bad


*on a scepter I meant to say

>> No.77959446

quick question about the history of magic. Did the people that use to be in charge of card design quit and get replaced, and thats why were getting FIRE and these crossover cards now. Or did they just decide they wanted to sell out?

>> No.77959614

They promoted the guys behind some of their biggest fuck ups and now the head designer is the Jew that made Affinity. He spends his time making more broken mechanics and getting into arguments with his coworkers if they suggest reprinting a card he personally doesn't like. He's also stated many times that he doesn't play Magic anymore. A few years ago they also hired some "pro players" to test their cards but shit got even worse after that.

>> No.77959829
File: 2.61 MB, 4032x3024, CC5D931C-11E8-475F-8ED3-B65EFF208B76.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

What did the mailman bring you /mmg/

>> No.77959944

good shit bro

>> No.77959974
File: 67 KB, 844x913, AD7936DB-A975-4A43-8CF8-F63BE791D3A3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Thanks friend

>> No.77960150

They hired women. That was the problem

>> No.77960309

do you have a bant deck that isn't for homosexuals?

>> No.77960374

>implying there's any mtg deck that's not for homosexuals

>> No.77960583
File: 74 KB, 620x400, Hatred (2).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>a delver deck is still the best deck in legacy

wow what a shocker

>> No.77960693

already? it's only been 3 weeks since the bans
I thought Legacy would take more time to settle since the format is so much bigger than Modern

>> No.77960776
File: 22 KB, 594x484, 1599709824593.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


UR delver is far and away the best deck in the format even without dha, and it's not even close
people are just so jaded due to wrenn and six + oko back to back double team buttfucking that the format went through that they're stuck pretending things are fine

>> No.77960798

What should be banned from Delver without killing the deck outright? Maybe ponder?

>> No.77960799

>ban cards newer to the format
>be surprised when the meta immediately reverts to its former incarnation
Do you think about things before you post them?

>> No.77960882
File: 244 KB, 672x936, tsp-274-gemstone-caverns.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Reveal Chancellor of the tangle opening hand
>Island, Erayo (1), Mox Amber (2), Ornithopter (3), Another Zero drop or use the one blue from amber on a cantrip or somethin before she flips(4)-> Erayo flips. This is all assuming she doesnt get FoW'd or some shit of course.
You also have gemstone caverns if your on the draw. RIP mana monke tho

>> No.77960908

Its also leaving you with fuck all in hand but hey you flip her turn 1

>> No.77960936


Not true. Miracles won the challenge on saturday. What the bans did was bring down the power of delver and 4c snow control, but the decks just reverted into the pre oko/snowlabe versions by going back to ur delver and miracles while the rest of the field got stronger by keeping FIRE cards that didnt quite make the cut before with DHA/Oko edging everything out.

>> No.77961056

>Heliod is strong but there are plenty of answers imo
That's not the fucking point.

>> No.77961092

>please stop making me interact with my opponent I'm trying to play my own game of solitaire over here

>> No.77961129

Combo decks can't start interacting just because you Spell Pierce them. They just continue doing their thing. It makes for extremely unsatisfying gameplay. If you showed this shit to anyone who isn't entrenched in the game they'd laugh at you.

>> No.77961281
File: 594 KB, 530x686, 20210308_190127.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I did it, I bought the last Magic card I wanted, and it's just arrived.
I'm done now. I'm free.

>> No.77961326

that's a shame, I only play the format casually on mtgo (I have black lake reanimator, burn and dredge) and it has been pretty good after the bans

>Do you think about things before you post them?
I don't know man, I started playing after DHA was already the norm, I didn't really get to experience what legacy was like before it

>> No.77961557

i dont know anon im having plenty of fun playing legacy post ban

>> No.77961565

Jund is a t1 deck now thta Uro is gone. Dumb nigger.

>> No.77961586

Why are words like retard such a big deal in English? It's not even a swear word. Coming from a language with infinite swear words and profanities I don't get it.

>> No.77961597

Kill yourself

>> No.77961608

Sure thing, mr. sunk cost.

>> No.77961623
File: 162 KB, 672x936, 4DFAEB20-FCC2-4016-BDE6-218E8302541B.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>abloo bloo bloo heliod is too strong
That’s why the sideboard exists, stupid. If you want Heliod removal, look ip deicide or unravel the aether.

>> No.77961645

It's considered a slur against retards so language police get booty blasted. But it's funny because retard is a kinder way of referring to them than what came before, which was schizos or mentals or something. Before that it was imbeciles, then pinheads. There's always some new thing to call retards to be nicer that becomes the new slur in less than a generation and then has to be replaced.
Well whatever the card gives me a giggle.

>> No.77961709


Legacy was actually kind of similar to right now. Letting a bomb slip through did not mean you weer automatically buried in FIRE value you could not recover and the cards you fight over arent as obviously windmill slam as before. Never thought id miss it but losing to TNN feels infinitely more fair than losing to oko or 4c being immune to blood moon and still value engining you to death with oko/uro. Miracles still has the strongest lategame, but now can stumble early game because it bricks on mana or getting wastelanded by playing too safe instead of having astrolabe fix everything. Decisions feel meaningful again in legacy (though im sure this wont last very long when the next FIRE set comes out)

>> No.77961719
File: 17 KB, 300x300, ir-eks_2_400x400-300x300.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Seriously fuck this fat sack of shit. Jund has been a laughingstock ever since he started making fun of it.

>> No.77961733


It is pretty hard to hate out when the main pieces are an indestructible enchantment and a card that laughs at removal spells. Deicide? Come on

>> No.77961765

>If you showed this shit to anyone who isn't entrenched in the game they'd laugh at you.
I mean, mtg isn't exactly a good game. They'd be laughing with me, not at me.

>> No.77961855

Jews, white women and men who have the same test levels as women.

>> No.77961866

He is trolling

>> No.77961877

Modern wouldn't benefit from you standard retards banning more decks.

>> No.77961887

He's just a whiner that plays in his local small group filled with that deck. It's still a contender for the best deck of the format, but big paper tournaments are still gonna have less combo representation and less of the extremely high money cards. People are more comfortable running fake duals than they are running fake LED's.

>> No.77961902
File: 30 KB, 1024x576, 1567832838361.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Even Saffroncuck is making fun of Jund

The absolute state of Jundfags

>> No.77961941

Reminder that if you play fake RL cards in sanctioned events, you are pretty much guaranteeing your opponent will loupe it if they start losing. I've made it to day 2 before purely on the back of my loupe.

>> No.77961967


>> No.77961977

Are you even allowed to touch other people's cards anymore during these trying times?

>> No.77962048
File: 7.57 MB, 4032x3024, 20210308_164336.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Too many to count, here's a selection of my favorites though.

>> No.77962070

The left has an obsession with banning words. This is why their insults suck (like chud, applesponge, pissbaby, shitlord, etc.), since it's hard to have an insult that isn't offensive. Meanwhile, the right has been blasting faggot, retard and nigger constantly

>> No.77962071

This video is funny, but of course Jund loses to a pile of 2-for-1s.

>> No.77962075

Mox Repeal Mox neatly gets you three spell count and doesn't even cost you a card, I was trying to resurrect Erayoffinity for ages when opal was still around and it was never any good.

>> No.77962087

Aren't most legacy tourneys 75 proxy nowadays?

>> No.77962160

wtf is applesponge

>> No.77962161
File: 199 KB, 220x117, 1548363123204.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Checked and rekt

>> No.77962353


>> No.77962436

I think the idea was that /pol/ack insults were just "random nonsense words" (read: "I don't want to admit they got under my skin"), so applesponge was meant to parody that. It didn't take off because it had no actual bite.

>> No.77962442 [DELETED] 
File: 17 KB, 1000x1000, 1615195271940.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>> No.77962717


>> No.77963297
File: 30 KB, 678x525, photo_2021-01-23_17-14-19.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

How did Doomsday win before Thassa's Oracle?

>> No.77963355


emi / lab

>> No.77963381

And before that? This list -> http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=546&d=207040&f=LE from 2010 makes absolutely no sense for me. How do you win with just Tendrils?

>> No.77963474
File: 38 KB, 620x400, 657564563456.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Wizards....please....finish the cycle of ally colored horizon lands....it's been years...


>> No.77963570


>> No.77963613

Jund is considered a laughingstock because it's shit, not because of what some eceleb says. Classic jund couldn't even beat standard decks when standard was filled to the brim with uro, omnath, wilderness rec, field of the dead etc.
Jund as people remember it for, an aggressive beatdown+pseudo control (mass discard and creature removal) deck, will never EVER be good again. Cope jundfags, your deck was the boogeyman of modern for years and nobody actually enjoyed having modern be gatekept by the #1 deck costing 2000 shekels.

>> No.77963620

I see, thanks

>> No.77963636

>your deck was the boogeyman of modern for years and nobody actually enjoyed having modern be gatekept by the #1 deck costing 2000 shekels.
fuck jund
u wont be missed

>> No.77963664

Hadnt thought of bouncing the mox clever shit right there.
But yeah I couldnt imagine going further then one round with it before they sideboard in and mull till they can fuck the combo

>> No.77963995

By casting 9 spells before it.

>> No.77964285
File: 29 KB, 223x310, toad.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Also just go into modern, since Standard was a money sinkhole and I've only been playing for about 3 years.
Playing B/G midrange, since the cards I like are in that deck.
Is it worth it to jump to Jund if I want to be a lot more competitive, or is Jund just the thirst for nostalgia? (Although ik it's far better than B/G)

>> No.77964408

Protection and Landwalking should be evergreen again. Fuck faggots crying about color hate.

>> No.77964422

>That brief moment where you only needed to cast 7 before Tendrils because LED -> Lurrus -> LED was 2 free storm

>> No.77964624

>Be me, a tron shitter back when lattice was legal
>roll up to weeklies
>R1 vs someone who saw me play infect the week before.
>He makes a joke and puts the deck he was shuffling away, and pulls out jund "I think this will be better for you, considering what you play"
>I win the die-roll
>T1, Mine, Map, Pass
>His smirk fades "Oh so you're playing THAT deck.. fine"
>Fetch, shock, thoughtseize, takes a payoff
>Assemble tron on T3 when my opponent interrupts me
>"Just show me the karn"
>Show him the karn and he scoops to g2
>G2 he GQs my t1 tron land and surgicals my land
>"So game 3, anon?"
>"Nope. I think I can still win"
>He over extends with all of his pay offs and w6, and liliana over the next few turns
>Sylvan scrying for blastzone, put a second counter on it
>Jundfriend looks annoyed
>take another 8, untap pop blast zone and murder his clock.
>Next turn rip O-stone, slam it
>count to five manually, nuke his walkers, lili was one turn away from ult
>peel a land
>he's top decking
>peel wurmcoil
>he scoops

>R2 another jund shitter
>G1 Assemble Karn/Lattice
>Jund player declares "I'm not scooping, you'll have to play it out"
>He has goyf and bbe
>He thinks he's punishing me, passive aggressively looking at his hand and taking a minute or two on his turns
>I let him, I play draw go, casting creatures here and there knowing full well I have my all is dust in hand
>when the clock runs out, I wipe his board
>On turns I finish him off with the creatures I've been playing
>He realizes there is no g2, he packs up and drops, no gg, no hand shake


>> No.77964749

Even in its heyday, Jund didn't come anywhere close to oppressive. It was great against Twin, and drooling morons think Twin was bad for the format.

>> No.77964844

>Jund didn't come anywhere close to oppressive
This is such a load of shit. Jund was basically what humans/spirits are nowadays - the best "fair" deck in the format. When Jund existed, it was THE only choice to play if you were going for a creature based deck, it strong armed every other deck out of modern unless they were a fast enough combo to pop off before lily+thoughtseize shredded their hand. Burn suffered g2 onwards because scooze and drs could keep them alive, control lost the topdeck war if lily ever resolved since they had no good PW answers. DRS was such a ridiculous powerhouse and a complete joke, a 1 mana planeswalker that does everything you'd want and more, AND it's even on a 1/2 body just to make X/1s or 1/Xes absolutely useless.
There was basically no good answer to goyf at the time. Push didn't exist, bolt didn't do it by itself, path just 2 for 1'd yourself against a deck that already thrived in card quality, dismember was probably the best option but then you're probably doming yourself for 2 or 4 life to cast it. Jund was the goodstuff.dec of its time period, it forced every game to topdeck mode and jund's topdecks were head and shoulders above what any other deck could hope to draw.

>> No.77965087

Fair enough. I forgot about 2012, but I was referring to 2015 when Jund came back in the wake of Modern Abzan following the Pod and Treasure Cruise ban.

>> No.77965394

Wtf dude? No way you are frogfren

>> No.77965707
File: 34 KB, 392x389, 1614684668179.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>all frogposters are the same person
Secret society AMPHIBIAN spreads it's influence further...

>> No.77965904

It's almost as if pepe was the most popular meme on 4chin and thousands of anons were using it or something.. Only /tg/, /diy/, /lgbt/ and /lit/ are still mostly pepe-free.

>> No.77966238 [DELETED] 
File: 2.90 MB, 406x720, 1615263268215.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Black Lives Matter.

>> No.77966263
File: 87 KB, 512x385, unnamed (4).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


All you have to do is let go, anon.
Let go of Thoughtseize
Let go of Trophy
Let go of Liliana
Let go of Push
Let go of Goyf
Embrace the way of the Ponza
The God of thighs is waiting for you to rest your weary head.

>> No.77967875

TQ: most of the old bordered cards from the early sets have so much more soul than the modern cards. the art and flavortext is so much better.

>> No.77968047

Niv to light has a 90% winrate? I know what deck I'm building.

>> No.77968683

I just want Scales to be playable again bros...

>> No.77968954

I want to go back to being 12 and have teenage Jennifer Connelly as a babyitter.

>> No.77968958

the deck is definitely playable if you're a dedicated player, there's this one guy on MTGO called MrSeri and he's 5-0s with multiple different variations of Scales at least once in a month

I don't think the deck will ever be as strong as it was with Opal (not that was anything that impressive to begin with) but the next artifact/counters matters set could give the deck some help

>> No.77969072

I want to go back to being 12 and watch the WTC getting false flagged live once again.
Best TV drama ever in the history.

>> No.77969147

Modern Horizons 2 confirmed for June 11th release: https://wpn.wizards.com/en/article/modern-horizons-2-all-dates-and-scheduling-info-you-need
What legendary creatures will break Modern and Legacy this time?

>> No.77969152

Wrenn and Seven

>> No.77969181

>June 11th
holy shit, so we're getting spoilers in 2 months?
jesus that was fast

>> No.77969230

Wrenn and Seven is in Innistrad

>> No.77969275
File: 129 KB, 672x936, emn-109-tree-of-perdition.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

While I doubt Wrenn will be in MH2.
I feel id be a major missed opportunity if he doesnt show up in Innistrad as Wrenn and Thirteen.
Afterall we didnt get to see his first 6 trees. Why not have him burn through 5 more getting to innistrad?

>> No.77969277
File: 157 KB, 672x936, 5FA7AAAA-7944-4F15-BECB-03D70CDDF605.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

*buries you in an insurmountable stream of card advantage and disruption*

>> No.77969319

If it is like the original MH the stuff everyone is afraid of (Phyrexian Mana, Elves) will be too balanced to be useful and something totally random will end up being gamebreaking

>> No.77969325 [DELETED] 

>at the beginning of your precombat main phase
oh that's cool, I always thought it was at the upkeep
maybe you could put this in some sort of aristocrats deck as a way to keep their hand in check

>> No.77969398
File: 284 KB, 672x936, lea-54-counterspell.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Hmm... what are the chances they try to make new 'balanced' mana monke?
Do we see them revisit snow lands once more or maybe they try revisiting artifact lands and try balancing that shit? Im still waiting for them to really go balls deep into giving suspend a real FIRE approach. The possibilities are truly endless thinking about it.
Maybe they give us some reprints to bring some older cards into modern?
So many avenues for them to just fuck our shit up.

>> No.77969425

>what are the chances they try to make new 'balanced' mana monke?
None since monke was banned two weeks ago and MH2 has finished development at least six months ago (see Plague Engineer which was a clear answer for that time around 2018 when Humans was the top deck).

>> No.77969429
File: 45 KB, 1261x521, 1603850666142.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.77969483

What was the logic behind Hogaak in MH1?

>> No.77969499

Ahh fair. I know standard sets are done a good amount of time in advance just wasnt sure about supplementary sets.
So best clues would be to look at what was ravaging the format some 6+ months ago or so huh?

>> No.77969505

>dude you don't get it it's very hard to cast since you can't use mana!
>okay now you're really getting on my nerves with your negativity, you're fired
t. maro sometimes around 2016 to a poor intern that was trying to save the game

>> No.77969510


>> No.77969525

no clue
my best guess is that they genuinely convinced themselves that not being able to cast it with mana was enough of a drawback for a big body and they stapled Trample onto it at the very last minute to prevent "feel bad" chumps

>> No.77969563

Because even when wotc is designing sets exclusively for eternal formats, they forget to balance the cards around eternal formats
They thought hogaak would be fine in a standard environment

>> No.77969713
File: 91 KB, 1024x804, 1600482122016.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>standard is broken.
>pioneer is played by no one.
>modern is a joke.
>LGSes are kill.
>Legacy is gurgling on FIRE semen.
And Time Spiral sold as a nostalgia trip for draftniggers. Just in the middle of a pandemic where almost no one can gather without breaking the law.
So, where do we go from here?
I just cannot see arena existing into the future: I mean, not even the scummiest of gacha games efectively renders 50% of your game pieces obsolete within a year, and most of them rely on rather interesting world-building and lore. What does MTGA have? Butchered lore with niggers and no-man-needing women IN A VIKING SETTING.
I am just perplexed, /mmg/. What the fuck will wotc do with mtg now?

>> No.77969764

You underestimate the power of zoomers. Arena will survive and maybe even thrive, although wizards will likely find a way to drag people along even more. Perhaps they'll give players a little bit more reward for playing, more free cards, but push cosmetic skins for the client, more custom card art and effects, shit like that. Modo will become a ghost town but will stay online, possibly just due to legal concerns involving shutting it down. LGSes will largely give up on returning to MTG, instead favoring other TCGs like pokemon and yugioh. The secondary market will continue to inflate in its bubble for another year or two up until the cold hard reality drops where absolutely nobody is left to play the game, and of those that do remain, they will play using exclusively proxies.

>> No.77969819

I keep reading this but never see the flaws mentioned.

>> No.77969923

confirmed larp bullshit

>> No.77969971

Basically. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a FIRE answer to Uro that cucks half of the format.

>> No.77969985

The squirrel legend was real though.
I think, as said in earlier threads, that WotC is seeding fake info mixed in to pinpoint the leaker.

>> No.77970025


>> No.77970087

Confirmed legit leaker.

>> No.77970209

What's his stock list? I want to start by deciding if I'm running either Lurrus or Scrapyard Recombiner.

>> No.77970422

>And Time Spiral sold as a nostalgia trip for draftniggers
All their sets are supposed to be for draft. TSR is the best set they have done in years and I will not apologize for hoarding unopened boxes of it to sell to draft niggers in the future.

>> No.77970429

how do I hose tron in 2021

>> No.77970476
File: 261 KB, 1246x948, BG Scales.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

this is his most recent list

>> No.77970643

Wear a wig, makeup and your mom's dress and say your opponent's deck is oppresive and insulting because the word "tron" sounds too similar to "tranny"

>> No.77970774

Guys, I'm sorry. I am the problem. I downloaded MTG Arena. On mobile. I spent $20 in it even, to get enough resources to make a mono red deck. For Historic. And the worst part is that I'm having fun. I haven't played magic since m15 was in standard, and I had forgotten why I loved the game in the first place. I've been so angry and bitter for so long, and I'm finally at a point where I can just enjoy a few casual games on the toilet and not take everything so seriously. I am everything I hate.

>> No.77970805
File: 3.06 MB, 2700x3600, cards.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


why would you be trying to hose a deck that's ~2% of the meta and has almost no overlap with other decks in terms of effective hate?

>> No.77970908

That new red land destruction spell for 2 that cantrips. Ceremonious Rejection.

>> No.77970951

>LGSes are kill
Not here, have 3-4 events a week. Mostly standard/draft. But we still get 1 pauper event a month.

>> No.77970985

Slivers????? since when

>> No.77971014

>jamming 4 masticores in each slot instead of just buying more 10 cent plastic sleeves

>> No.77971079

Imagine if Lurrus was definitively banned.

>> No.77971081


they've sat there since ~2000, so no reason to disturb their peaceful repose

>> No.77971089

But... it's not even out on mobile yet.

>> No.77971186
File: 454 KB, 2340x1080, Screenshot_Magic_2021-03-09-08-30-14-758.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Yes it is? It's been early access for a couple weeks.

>> No.77971200

Oh boy. An so it begins...
How's it running on phones? Is it smooth? Does the interface work well with the touchscreen?

>> No.77971232

Just because shit's dead by you doesn't mean it's dead everywhere. One of the LGS's near me got 8 people for a proxie friendly legacy tournament this weekend and most of them are keen on coming back, which is pretty good for how many soi bois hate the coof and proxies.
LGS's survive by allowing limited proxy play while also selling singles to the same people who earn store credit in their proxy events. People want to own the real cards if it's reasonable to them and guess what happens when you win a few 100% payout tournaments? You've got enough for a lower end RL playable card. Either that or people buy things like fetches from the store to meet the proxy limit or to just slowly make their decks real. In the end with what stores pay to get singles, even at 100% payout, the store is netting 40-60% profit off of the singles sales and 20-30% off of the sealed product someone might get with their winnings. WotC's promos ain't shit compared to the number of players gained from allowing some proxies.

>> No.77971235

>Spend $20
>All you can afford is knuckle-dragging mono-red grinding deck
It's amazing. WotC has actually invented a way for people to spend real money and then still end up working like slaves for pixels. I guess if you enjoy being a paid punching bag for whales then more power to you. I'm not one to kink shame.

>> No.77971270

Just craft the shitty trickery deck in historic, get all 15 daily wins done casually in like 30 min max, and enjoy ez cards and gold to spend on draft/boosters for the next set. Whenever you actually feel like playing and have accumulated enough wild cards, make whatever deck you want with all the free stuff you got.

>> No.77971275

Lurrus isn't that powerful in that deck, it's almost a complete free roll (you have to give up the 3 drop with Modular from Modern Horizons), it feels more like a bonus for splashing Black for Thoughtseize/making your Dismembers less painful than something that actively wins the games for you. So much so that the deck still runs 3x Gemrazer in the sideboard since dealing with artifacts/enchantments is more important than having Lurrus as a companion against certain matchups in games 2 and 3.

The only REAL Lurrus deck in the meta right now is RB/Jund Death's Shadow, that's a deck that would definitely lose some win percentage if Lurrus got banned.

>> No.77971316

>Just work for 30 minutes a day
I work enough without donating 3.5 hours of my free time to Hasbro. I'd rather just pay china for physical proxies I can play with the lads at my kitchen table using whatever formats we want.

>> No.77971347

>work enough in a week

>> No.77971348

that is assuming you wont run in to slow players.
pro tip: you will.

>> No.77971353

I have basically no problems, besides server side issues. The deck building interface is slightly awkward, though. Like, you tap on a card name to remove the card in your deck on the right, but you tap the number next to it to add the card. Kind of counter-intuitive if you ask me. Overall, the touch controls are pretty decent, but sometimes turns and phases aren't clear, especially if you go first. There have been a couple games where I didn't realize I went first and end up skipping my first turn completely, and I've seen opponents do the same.
This is basically what I'm doing. Have a realish deck now, a few cards to switch around if I need to, and I'm just gathering resources and waiting for the next set. I do play quite a lot of mobile games, and the overall cost of Arena is basically the same as cracking real life packs (about $4 a pack). F2p can afford a free pack every day or two with dailies alone. I've seen gacha games way worse than that.

>> No.77971366

i never noticed the jaw, and honestly the art looks great
too bad it wasn't a modern buster. Is he even a dollar rare?

>> No.77971663

So, Vorniclex stole the essence of the world tree well, killed Esika in the process and returned trough the planar brigde talking to Elsh Norn on the other side of the portal. There was also a hint that Sheoldred is in Innistrad. Thoughts?

>> No.77971692

*cosmos elixier

>> No.77971748
File: 111 KB, 1788x263, absolute legend.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>There was also a hint that Sheoldred is in Innistrad.
I hope so

>> No.77971764

Eldrazi are just low-rent Phyrexians

>> No.77971787

>The squirrel legend was real though.
Easy thing to guess since a squirrel is part of norse mythology. There was no wolf god in Kangzeim nor God of War SL. I have very little faith in half of that shit happening (new shock lands? how would they even work?).

>> No.77971813

>(new shock lands? how would they even work?).
fetchable tricolor land untapped for 3 or 4 damage

>> No.77971870

They would be boltland then, not shocklands (we'd forget very quickly of original boltlands from nunuZEN). Or whatever the 4 dmg red spell is.

>> No.77973358
File: 293 KB, 1000x1257, Blood Knight.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>> No.77973372

>antifa knight

>> No.77973441
File: 169 KB, 672x936, mh1-213-ruination-rioter.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.77973707

They are the urbanites, though.

>> No.77974396

>What makes this offering different to the previous supplemental sets is that Set Boosters and Collector Booster will be available for Modern Horizons 2. As a result, Modern Horizons 2 will be the first supplemental set to receive such treatment which could be a regular occurrence for future sets.

>> No.77974562

>Wizards can't get more jewi-

>> No.77974574

Gruulfags with sidecuts are acceptable. They've had that for a while and they're counterculture punks. Also because sidecuts belong perfectly with the worst guild.

>> No.77974632

Why is WotC talking about a set that releases in June, now? Reeks of desperation

>> No.77974682

>small brain: be excited u got an expensive gard when it waz cheap
>big brain: dont give a shit if a gard is expensive or not coz ur not fkn poor

poor ppl are so lame

>> No.77974737
File: 59 KB, 604x417, 1615220867705.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

They lost 40% of players in 2018, and it has been downhill since.
Secret lairs and scalpers hoarding masters boxes don't count.

>> No.77974751
File: 59 KB, 624x434, 1603281086530.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.77974792

>They lost 40% of players in 2018
Please give me a source, I feel the urge to masturbate right now.

>> No.77974878

Literally the whole "Dominaria, welcome home..." was a massive campaign to win back leaving players and encourage returning players to come back to magic with a massive nostalgia set that felt "like the good old days".
Too bad wizards still hasn't figured out that people need to eat first and buy overpriced, artificially scarce luxury cardboard second.

Just google "magic lost 40% players".

>> No.77974988

There's an obvious joke right there.

>> No.77975012

>Just google "magic lost 40% players".
Only two relevant results are Plebbit (lmao) threads where they quote a 2015 Maroberg statement and the 40% itself is compared to 2013. Honestly considering what was going on around at that time in Magic I see no reason for the playerbase to drop that dramatically, it would actually make much more sense for such a drop to happen NOW if ever.

>> No.77975036

n-no magic is doing better than ever
players loved companion
our data says so
players love secret lair
black people
we have blacks
we have the blackest blacks
you have to give us money

>> No.77975074

And that's exactly why a 40% drop makes much more sense now that in 2015. None of the shit you mentioned was happening back then.

>> No.77975212


Brian (((Goldner))) said so!
The data?
Uuuh... Ahem...

>> No.77975297

The data is Hasbro's shareholders meeting where they announced they will absorb Wizards to cover for their toys line failure.
Last week's news, retard.

>> No.77975302


>> No.77976127


>> No.77976380

Yes Arena is not bad desu. You get a lot of standard cards with the dailies and with the wildcards if you grind a month or two you can easily make any deck. I wish modern was playable on it.

>> No.77979590


heliod dies to skyclave and thus can stay!

-t. maro

Name (leave empty)
Comment (leave empty)
Password [?]Password used for file deletion.