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72569341 No.72569341 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Witches. Talk about Witches. Post about Witches. Witches.

>> No.72569356
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>> No.72569389
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>> No.72569392
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You don't want to mess with the best

>> No.72569409
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>> No.72569432
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>> No.72569435
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I really need to read these books

>> No.72569457
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>> No.72569466
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>> No.72569467
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>> No.72569479
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>> No.72569481
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>> No.72569500 [SPOILER] 
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Posting the OG witch herself

>> No.72569525
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>> No.72569552
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Witch Hat Atelier is always welcome

>> No.72569582
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>> No.72569628
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>> No.72569665
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>> No.72569684
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>> No.72569715
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>> No.72569740
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Do witches bathe regularly?

>> No.72569784
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I'd assume so. No reason they wouldn't be able to make soap as well as any other mixture.

>> No.72569820
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>> No.72569832
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So what are witches good for, other than high impact sexual violence

>> No.72569854

A Witch, caught young and properly tamed, make a great companion for the heroic knight on the go.

>> No.72569868
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>> No.72569873

They do live in swamps

>> No.72569941
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Why are all witches white? I introduced a dark skinned witch last session and I'm trying to make a good token for her but I can only find tumblr-y art.

>> No.72569952
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That just means a bit more effort to clean if they went off the beaten path.

>> No.72570010

Yes, profusely with the cum of the demons they serve.

>> No.72570035

Ah yes, my favorite. Poisoned apple pie, with extra poison. I hope the pastries she makes with my body when I'm dead are good.

>> No.72570118
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So how would you go about making a witch class? A mix of sorceress and alchemists?

>> No.72570153
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In my setting in one region witches have recently been elevated to the level as wizards (functionally the same thing with just a few tweaks). Witches were the medicine women of the area and served as first line responders to most incidents, calling wizards from the academy if needed. Kind of like nurses and doctors. The witches also served as the wise women in their villages and were consulted on issues that arose or would be asked to give advice about an important decision.

With the last war killing off like 40-60% of the men in some areas the witches have been pulled into the faculty of the Arcane Academy and now women make up most students. It's a bit of a shock for some young girls arriving thinking they are going to be living nothing but magic but find they are also drilled mercilessly in hygiene, midwifery, herbs, and basically classes about all the random crap a non magical wise woman is expected to learn.

Area is basically Maine mixed with Roanoke and Innistrad.

>> No.72570168

Take the Hag stat block, space out their abilities and score increases for 20 levels, and give them some illusion, transmutation, and necromancy spells.

>> No.72570220

why necromancy?

>> No.72570255

Hexes mostly, plus occasionally talking to the dead.

>> No.72570261


The Tiffany Aching ones aren't a bad place to start by any means, but they're aimed at younger readers - that said, even if you start with the Wyrd Sisters (Equal Rites is barely a Witch book, though it does technically count), you'll REALLY want to read Shepherd's Crown and honestly Wintersmith and I Shall Wear Midnight are good lead-ins to SC, and if you read them you might as well read the other two YA books for a better continuity of Tiffany.

>> No.72570389
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thanks for the advice!

>> No.72570395

Because most of the mythology and the literature around witches is from Europe. There's equivalent myths in other places of course, but you're gonna have to go on non-English speaking web for that or use some nappy headed tumblrina.

>> No.72570406
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>> No.72570462
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>> No.72570468
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no one cares about personal settings, keep it more general

>> No.72570492
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>> No.72570555
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Needs more hags.

>> No.72570562
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>> No.72570586
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Are hags their own creatures, the natural end for witches, or witches that went too far?

Also, what is education for witches like?

>> No.72570588
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>> No.72570620

i fucking hate the anime-witch aesthetic

>> No.72570645
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>> No.72570651
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Pretty much.

>> No.72570658
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>> No.72570675
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>Also, what is education for witches like?

Either they're students at magic school, maybe the goth equivalent, or they apprentice to an experienced witch the same way others might apprentice to a wizard. Just in a swamp instead of a tower.

>> No.72570692
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>> No.72570705
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>> No.72570708

Discworld in general is very good, the Witches are just one good subset, they're far from the only one.
(though they do have the slight distinction of having the last book released (it was posthumous, but also clearly mostly written quite a bit before the previous couple of books) be largely focused on them - and it's much better than the last one published while he was alive)

>> No.72570740
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why does this picture hurt my eyes?

>> No.72570768

Depends on your game/setting really. For example in Pathfinder witches gain all their arcane knowledge from their familiar, so witches happen when a girl stares into the mouth of a toad and has forbidden knowledge revealed to her

>> No.72570830
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>> No.72570932
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Why yes, I do write my witches as decrepit ugly grannies who speak in limericks. How could you tell?

>> No.72570936
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I dunno Froppy.

>> No.72570951
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>Witch thread
>Only cute anime girls
>No Goya

I will now post all six of Goya's Osuna witchcraft paintings.

>> No.72570974
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>> No.72570982

It will completely change your view of how witches should be portrayed but for the better. You'll realize the truth that the right boots are more important to a witch than a pointed hat.

>> No.72571006
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>> No.72571016
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somebody really needs to make a witch edit of this.

>> No.72571027
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You got a weird definition of cute.

>> No.72571040
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>> No.72571061

Wizard not sorceress. A sorceress wouldn't be a witch. Can't call yourself a witch if you didn't put in the work learning the trade.

>> No.72571106
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>> No.72571129

Sounds like proper witches work. It's not all about the magic. That's how wizards think. They want to be big thinkers and throw around fireballs to make loud noises like monkeys experimenting with firearms. Witches need practical working knowledge and do practical work. And most times magic ain't even the most practical solution and your job is more often taking care of problems magic caused more than doing magic.

That's the big difference. A wizard lights a fuse to see what will happen and a witch has to clean up blood and debris.

>> No.72571144
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>> No.72571174
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Jenna:-a young witch from the tropics picks up a list and in a very bad attempt to speak your language she tells you- I must collect bone, marrow, tissue or skin. with that you can use it for hexagons depending on how strong you want it and the damage you want. There are many types of witch spells and many ways to use those that, you have not seen the evil that we are capable of my dear friend.

-She gets a contract for you-

Jenna: Nothing like a good deal with devils or demons to cause the damage you want to your enemy, of course you are my customer and I am your friendly sales lady and I will gladly do my job in the specific way you want. ¿me entiendes?

>> No.72571175
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>> No.72571196
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Another bonus

>> No.72571326

No you.

>> No.72571372

What's the most 'witchy' system? I always felt that a generally more free form system like in ars magica feels more witchy rather than wizardy (though I think that the order as a magical organization feels a lot less witchy).
Or do you think that mechanics aren't that important for getting a 'witchy' feel?

>> No.72571439
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Are there any settings where they're not totally sanitized/clean but not 100% evil either?

>> No.72571504
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Well that is true.

>> No.72571533
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>> No.72571588

Depends, what's your platonic ideal of witchery

>> No.72571596

They're not, witches are found in folklore from all over the world. Many of the trappings we associate with them are derived from European folklore, however...

>> No.72571705

Maybe RuneQuests ritual magic but then in a more 17th century setting?

>> No.72571820

I never played it, but for all that's worth there's a game called CJ Carella's WitchCraft.

>> No.72572040
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Mana tanks

>> No.72572088
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More witches, bitches.

>> No.72572104

I'm not sure exactly what you mean. Could you give your platonic ideal of witchery as an example?
Could you give me a short run down? I couldn't find any comprehensive information with a quick search and runequest always scared me off with how absolutely massive it is.
seems like some weird alternate version of mage, I'll have to look into it.

>> No.72572116

What are the benefits of being nude while practicing witchcraft?

>> No.72572153

Hecate, Circei or another?

>> No.72572214

None, witches are nude because it mocks christian values, just like all witchcraft was supposed to be. Another example is that during the rite of initiation, instead of kissing the Pope's ring, witches were thought to have kissed the devils anus.

>> No.72572235
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>> No.72572237

Sure. Witches...
-live on the fringes of society
-are helpful and harmful in turns
-live in some community with other witches (a tight coven or just loose confederacy doesn't matter)
-receive occult knowledge from some outside source which outsiders will never know
-have a deep and probably supernatural knowledge of the lands they inhabit
-seek power for it's own sake

>> No.72572251
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>> No.72572258
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'Nude'? Dude, you're wearing the universe. Clothes get in the way...

>> No.72572290
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>> No.72572313
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>> No.72572323

Witcher TTRPG has both the Crone/Hag Witch variant and the Enchantress/Sorceress variant, and they tend to come in varying shades of white, grey and black.

>> No.72572354

>Could you give me a short run down?
>An initiate of a cult can cast the Rune spells known to that cult. The caster relies on power supplied by that god to cast the spell. When an adventurer casts Rune magic, the caster acts as the deity. The caster imitates the deeds of the deity and thereby evokes the deity’s power. The caster always exhibits some form of manifestation of the deity while casting the spell: they might appear to grow larger, burn with an inner glow, crackle lightning from the fingertips, or even start to physically resemble the deity. The more Rune magic cast, the more the deity manifests in the world.

In this case the god should be Satan/the Devil.

>> No.72572413
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Fuck I though I'd have to go the entire thread without anyone posting best witch. Good show, anon!

>> No.72572446
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>> No.72572567
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>cursed image

>> No.72572591
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This perfectly normal witch is looking for a big brother figure to help her reach the high bookshelves and ingredients. Won't you help her, anon?

>> No.72572613


I'm partial to the Folkwitch hedge tradition in Ars Magica.

You don't need The Gift to learn the tradition though you DO have to undergo initiations to acquire the abilities if not.

Their default repertoire of Supernatural Abilities are:
- Animal Ken: Communicate with animals by reciting a short song or rhyme.
- Cursing: Afflict the target with a curse by crafting a fetish containing an Arcane Connection (hair, blood, apparel, etc) - examples range from causing fever or miscarriage to turning transformation into a wood louse.
- Dowsing: Locate a substance or object using a specially prepared divining rod.
- Flight: Soar through the air on a specially prepared broom, washtub, magic carpet, etc.
- Healing: Restore wounds or fatigue instantly albeit at the cost of Vis.
- Second Sight: Perceive the unseen - spirits, regiones, invisible beings, etc.
- Shapeshifter: Take the form of one beast per point of Ability by donning a specially prepared hide or mask.

They have a few other tricks like:
- acquiring a familiar - they're generally too stupid to help in the lab/kitchen, but the witch can see through their eyes by entering a trance.
- brewing life extending potions (very weak by hermetic standards, but nice).
- Sabbats allow groups to work together to improve their casting totals.

Their Warping variant, Witches' Moon causing them to temporarily lose their powers and take a Medium Wound per month until they manage to overcome it.

There are few variants like the Basque Sorginak, and the African Bouda, but they differ mainly in having a few abilities swapped out and differing reactions to Warping...

>> No.72572622


>> No.72572665
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>> No.72572847
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Lore: Lewd DC 20

>> No.72572851

No because paganism isn't real.

>> No.72572868
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>> No.72573084
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>> No.72573235

look up voodoo if you want black witches

>> No.72573253

that doesn't get you clean

>> No.72573439
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That doesn't even make sense. I'm pretty positive that the terms "glamour" and "charm" were originally used specifically to describe a "witches" ability to entice or seduce others with her "magic". This didn't mean a "witch" was necessarily a beautiful woman, but they could be a kind and sweet unsuspecting old woman. This makes sense when applied to the real world as witch accusations were mostly used a form or character assassination to seize someone's property or potentially have them killed if they were too stubborn to confess and receive pentenance. It pretty much meant even the kindest and most genuine individuals in a group were susceptible to persecution.

TL;DR: Only weird European (Germanic) pagan religions had hags and nobody gives a flying fuck about those anyways.

>> No.72573523
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They're the interesting version of witches.

>> No.72573527

I feel personally attacked

>> No.72573592

>They're the lame version of witches.

>> No.72573605


>> No.72573648

I love witches of all types. The comfy town witch that is more like the town grandmother. The evil witches trying to sacrifice virgins to stay forever youthful, the young but determined witches who want to see a better world. Witches who shoot machine guns or fight aliens.

Witches are great

>> No.72573670

Brujas and Mambos are still things, my dude.

Shit, I teach in a primarily Hispanic area and one of my student's abuela is a lowkey practicing bruja. My hair's thinning a lot and when I met her on teacher's night she told me she could get me a salve for it, and offered to do a proper exorcism of a haunted house my sister lives in. Great woman.

>> No.72573690


false witch enthusiast get ye gone

>> No.72573705
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>> No.72573734

I definitely agree that witches acting as protectors of their communities are the best. I like the idea of witches using their power to protect the people they care about.

>> No.72573739

Man, you spics are crazy as fuck

>> No.72573778

I'm white as snow.
Makes it even better, honestly.

>> No.72573783
File: 55 KB, 556x740, the-swamp-hag-jake-perez.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>tfw my players trusted the little girl who wanted to show them a treasure hidden in the swamp after dark and nearly ended up eaten by the coven of the swamp

>> No.72573851

That's a water hag, not a witch. There is a difference.

>> No.72573883

I've been Beewitched

>> No.72573891

Tell the dirty, demon-serving witches that.

>> No.72573935

Don't worry, my players will soon go from hags to witches

>> No.72573969


Speaking of spics and witches does anyone find translation a bit confusing at times?

Witch = Bruja

Hag = Bruja

>> No.72574042

Witches be bitches that give people dancing stitches.
Lust and magically busty, their true insides are dusty.
Hags and slags whose smell causes gags.

>> No.72574090
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>> No.72574156

>Good Witch
Learns and practices magic in an unconventional, occult, or unnatural way.
Is separate from society, either literally or figuratively.
Has disfigurements or imperfections.

>Bad Witch
It's a wizard but a girl.
>B-b-but she has a pointy hat!
Wizards wear pointy hats too.
If she's in an elite magic school and everyone loves her it's a girl wizard, not a witch.

>> No.72574215
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>> No.72574223
File: 176 KB, 720x960, __bahamut_greed_drawn_by_agnidevi__da867a4121fc0ce1430b7d998e03ff36.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Do oversized bosoms count as a disfigurement?

>> No.72574224
File: 424 KB, 1365x766, Kikis-Delivery-Service.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Still no best witch

>> No.72574269

This anon knows how to witch. Tired of all the witches that aren't really different from conventional spellcasters

>> No.72574276

No, bitch.

>> No.72574280
File: 134 KB, 850x850, gbf-aletheia.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Meet the staff

>> No.72574320
File: 1.42 MB, 250x250, tumblr_pjn7uiDLHa1s7mr5ho2_250[1].gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Then why didn't you post her?

>> No.72574323

Our witches depend a lot of the region we are talking about.
Bruja (female witch) and Brujo (male witch but no really, it goes from witch doctor to wizard)
Culturally it is a mix of old american civilization, African, european, asian and Catholic

>> No.72574482
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>> No.72574555
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>> No.72574801

he just did

>> No.72575132
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>> No.72575230
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>> No.72575302
File: 545 KB, 1920x1920, fernando-correa-6.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>> No.72575357

Play Pathfinder they have a witch class.

>> No.72575392
File: 125 KB, 850x578, witch.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Either protecting or tormenting.
Just like lords rule over baronies, collect taxes and fund projects and troops, witches rule over communities, mediate spirits, lift or bestow curses.
Just like lords, they can use their power for good or evil. Their form of oppression just takes the form of convoluted curses and transformations.

>> No.72575472
File: 584 KB, 500x468, mim.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>That doesn't even make sense.
Hideous witches can still polymorph into an an anime thot if you really need them to look non-threatening.

>> No.72575634
File: 102 KB, 800x1399, 1547703316712.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

"What's that Mr. Toad? The slots are all rigged and Black Jack has the best odds?"

>> No.72575828

You don't understand witches, my post, the posts I replied to, or DnD.

>> No.72575894

I'd think that was a man in a dress were it not for the tits

>> No.72575954

Pratchett might have been making some play on gender equality in a lot of it, but that aside his stuff about the differences between a witch's magic and a wizard were pretty interesting. The wizards were about the big and powerful magic for its own sake, to study it, write about it, etc. The witches just applied it in a practical method in their community based on what was proven to work by past witches. They were servants of their communities and their protectors "between the edges of things" and magic was just one of many tools, including tools for cleaning and basic medicine. The pursuit of wizards though was just knowledge of a kind they kept locked up because it was dangerous if let loose.

>> No.72575963

God, it's like she WANTS one of her tits to flop out if she shifts the wrong way or moves too quickly

>> No.72575998
File: 1.44 MB, 1876x1061, Screenshot_7.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.72576041
File: 12 KB, 317x267, 385.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>REEEE D&D BAD fag getting triggered by anything that sounds vaguely related to D&D

>> No.72576248
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>> No.72576539
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>> No.72576555

>tfw love witches so much I have a hard time drawing anything that isn't a witch
I think it's autism

>> No.72576603
File: 213 KB, 675x900, 5e680c4815084a822ef8d1e30f952a8cd661a031.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I went over 10,000 images of witches to get down to 756 that I saved

>> No.72576643

But anon every witch is best witch.

>> No.72576645
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>> No.72576666
File: 479 KB, 423x1297, Espella Cantabella - Layton vs Wright.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

behold the accused, the witch-girl that started the great fire that burned our town to the ground!

>> No.72576922
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The threat of exposing her boobs helps to teach her precision. She probably has a few gazers floating around whose only job is to cat-call loudly when there's a nip-slip.

>> No.72576923

I just make my own now

>> No.72576997
File: 55 KB, 736x1082, witch.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>> No.72577127

All witches got their power by getting fucked by the devil.
You are all simps who got cucked by the big red man himself.

>> No.72577187

Disemboweling chickens to curse people and rolling hollow knuckle bones to see into the future

>> No.72577259
File: 26 KB, 208x320, pfchangeling.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I like witches

>> No.72577275
File: 37 KB, 420x431, RUSSIA'S GREATEST LOVE MACHINE.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

When do Russian witches turn into babushkas

>> No.72577544

That monk knows one absolute motherfucker of a glamour if he can turn himself into that...

>> No.72577611
File: 35 KB, 540x304, tumblr_q09lu2gecH1rqt8ws_smart1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

would you give her the blood?

>> No.72577643

Weren't Glamours a fey thing

>> No.72577869

For anyone confused about what types of magic to associate with witches, if they've got pointed hats you need to acknowledge that all the the aesthetics of witches are associated with brewing, and a lot of folklore about them are simply traits common in any women who lived alone and were for some reason unmarried.

For much of history beer was a drink made for and by women. There's a lot of history on that, but what's relevant is at a certain period in a few parts of western culture, brewers were the source of inspiration for witches. Due to a lack of education, trades would be advertised by clothes more than signs. The tall pointed hat was the symbol of a brewer. It was one of the few trades a single woman could have, especially after a certain age, so widows (who wore black) would take it up out of necessity. A broom outside the door was another symbol, one that advertised they had beer to sell. Cats were kept to keep pests out of the hops. So an old woman in black with a pointed hat, cats, brewing strange potions (because all things of women are strange to the denser ones in the world of man).

That's the aesthetic of witches.

>> No.72578216

And I feel no shame whatsoever.

>> No.72578248

>2 INT

>> No.72578271

That's pretty fucking boring desu. I despise trying to defantasize fantasy games

>> No.72578335
File: 146 KB, 600x835, 8b4438412c374c2b549e226877e1bbd0247a64b4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I actually thought that was super neat.

>> No.72578440
File: 139 KB, 517x623, Zero%2C_the_Flashing_Mage-Warrior_PR2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I'm surprised to come across Zero in the wild and it not being the booty promo.

>> No.72578447

of course I would, she NEEDS it!

>> No.72578504
File: 130 KB, 1000x720, 1585556286135.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Very interesting anon, thank you for your sharing of the lore.

>> No.72578525

It's getting your themes in order so you're not reinventing the meaning of things and then confusing people on definitions. Witches brew shit. Unless it's a setting specifically using the paranoid puritan concepts, then having an idea of where the commonly associated design choices comes from is important for knowing where to go forward in your creative endeavors.

For example if you understand that the reason vampires are supposedly weak to a stake through the heart is because the idea was to literally pin them into the fucking dirt with a stake so they don't get out of the grave, you can use that knowledge to make your setting more gritty, or removing a somewhat bland weakness from an undead enemy.

>> No.72578634

'A witch is an old lady who brews beer and has a cat to keep pests out and a broom on her porch' is useless to me. There is nothing gameable or interesting in that at all and reducing a witch to that is the opposite of fantastic.

>> No.72578687
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>> No.72578700
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>> No.72578831


>> No.72578898

>you can use that knowledge to make your setting more gritty,
The issue here isn't the use of historical basis, it's letting that historical basis dictate your decisions on a world that isn't your own. It's the kind of thing that a lot of people don't like about Local-lord dolts. What does it matter that witches in our world were a bunch of single ladies? The witches in a lot of people's settings are actual witches with magic and shit. Historical material only serves worldbuilding when you have an understanding of WHY things work rather than treating it as how things SHOULD work.

>> No.72578905

A witch brews is the takeaway. If you're that anon talking about how witches are all about the glamour or if you think a dnd game's witch should be a sorceress then you've got your theme all wrong.

A witch is the matriarch of a community but an outcast and fringe element, not acknowledged among the male leaders of the community unless forced to. A witch's magic and skills are geared towards that position, giving them a practical application of magic and working knowledge of it and the world, but not a scholarly understanding. A witch might be an actual outcast, shunned entirely and living in solitude out in the woods, sought out by women in need of something without their husbands knowing, or by desperate people hoping for miracles but getting what they need or deserve instead.

You seeing that information as useless and "not gameable" just shows off your failings as a GM and isn't my fault.

>> No.72578930

"letting" is a nonsense jump from knowing history and lore and applying it when desired to insisting that knowing is is pointless and will control you in some way.

Basically you're full of shit and your entire argument is pointless.

>> No.72578940

Good to know
When you grow up you'll learn to appreciate more than your Saturday morning cartoons

>> No.72578996

Most colleges began as religious institutions. Your logic is that most magic academies should be catholic schools as well.

>> No.72579045

Or you could use the whole "dressing in black" widow thing as a way that witches avoid attention, by pretending to be widows. They brew beer, to hide the true nature of their alchemy and herb collecting. Their familiar's serve dual purpose arcane/practical, in the sense that they serve as pest control. Using real world history to add nuance to your setting is a very common suggestion if you look at or listen to any tips from veteran GM/DMs and writers.

>> No.72579049

It seems to me the point isn't to have history define the archetype, so much as to understand how the concept was inspired so you can be consistent with that defines that archetype, even with original concepts added in.

>> No.72579061

>but what's relevant is at a certain period in a few parts of western culture, brewers were the source of inspiration for witches.
The traditional herbal mixtures used to flavor beer before hops became the exclusive flavoring agent often contained psychoactive and stimulating substances. When consumed in moderate amounts gruit beer was noted to cause stimulation, excitement and increased libido and when consumed to excess apparently caused delirium and hallucinations on top of the aforementioned effects. Hops produce the opposite effects -impotence and somnolence. The most common herbs used in northern Europe were apparently myrica Gale, rhododendron Tomentosum (Marsh Rosemary) and achillea (Yarrow) but in addition to innocuous ingredients like mint, lavender, lemon balm, juniper and coriander, the aforementioned trio of traditional herbs are reported to be psychoactive to a degree when fermented and mind-altering substances like henbane, mandrake and wormwood appeared in brewing mixtures regularly. The death of gruit is mostly "no fun allowed" and "fuck catholics and fuck peasants". The first reason is simple enough to understand given the properties of gruit beer, especially when you learn that it took the reformation to dislodge gruit from its preferred status in northern Europe; tying into the first reason, the second reason has to do with the fact that the Catholic church had a monopoly on the sale of brewing herbs and also that many folk beliefs [read: the parts of paganism that the church wasn't able to stamp out yet] were tied up in brewing and the ingredients used for the same and protestants really hated both of those things.

For those interested in learning more about gruit I highly recommend Stephen Bhuner's book "Sacred and Healing Herbal Beers"; despite being basically the first and only book of its kind and being more than two decades old it it still the definitive work on the subject and is in no danger of replacement.

>> No.72579126

Either you're trolling or you're not even reading what anon>>72578930 has been saying. Use history to inform your worldbuilding. You don't have to let it dictate your choices.

Sure some magic academies could be religiously based. Some could also be created purely for profit and actually contain mostly charlatans. Some could be funded by the imperial treasury. Various educational facilities and institutions have been founded in these ways and many others. Again the point is to inform yourself and in doing so add more variety, depth and a base of realism to ground your player's immersion in.

>> No.72579161
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>> No.72579192

This is actually really interesting. There's definitely a lot of room for inspiration in the subject. Bless you historyfags.

>> No.72579210

That's what I was saying in the first place, in case you didn't read what I posted, unless you're trolling too.

>> No.72579313

thanks for that. i love learning about the pagan practices that still shape the way we think and act today. it makes a lot of the inane or out right bizarre things we do make more sense.

>> No.72579372

I remember reading something that posited that the witch archetype comes from alewives (like anon said), but that it was the rise of beer brewed with hops that shifted alcohol production from independent women making ale to groups/guilds of men making beer, and the article then drew the conclusion that because alewives were seen as loose women but tolerated cause they make the alcohol, once that wasn't the case they were demonised pretty quickly
IIRC this was specific to England, with the hopped beer coming over from the Low Countries in the high middle ages

>> No.72579535
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>> No.72579664

I mean I'm just saying I don't run games to emulate history at all. I'm perfectly aware that digging through history for inspiration can be shockingly productive but that's because some things in history are way more fantastic than we realize based on our typically stereotypical and generalized understanding of history. There's a huge difference between realizing historical magic is way more fascinating than the played out old 'lmao wizard school bro' model, and realizing 'bro witches are just demonized old brewery bitties' though

>> No.72579698
File: 156 KB, 933x1243, 1588228554264.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Now this is a good thread.

>> No.72579793

Yes, exactly this. It inspired me to create a region in my setting that is ruled by witches of different types, with a Not!Lancre up in the mountains that is the most "normal" and "sane" of the nations, the witches focusing on their communities while the barons handle the political side. Down below, you are more likely to get hag-queens and brood-witches lording (ladying?) over their subjects and warring with one another using beastman armies and devastating spells.

>> No.72579907

The book I mentioned is really fucking good; it has a lot of excepts from primary sources (including recipes) and scholarly papers and covers grains, microorganisms, meads and some wine in addition to plant adjuncts like the ones I mentioned. If there's one blind spot, it's that it doesn't really cover fruits at all.

If you think that's interesting then you should read Myths to Live By by Joseph Campbell and the Sacred and the Profane by Mircia Eliade.

>but that it was the rise of beer brewed with hops that shifted alcohol production from independent women making ale to groups/guilds of men making beer,
Eh. That had more to do with ale being made more and more in breweries in large amounts from standardized recipes instead of on location in relatively small and non-standardized amounts and qualities.

>and the article then drew the conclusion that because alewives were seen as loose women but tolerated cause they make the alcohol, once that wasn't the case they were demonised pretty quickly
Also eh. On the one hand it's pretty easy to see how the authorities (not to mention married women) would frown on young single women selling alcohol to men but on the other arguing that alewives went away because men were threatened by women making money from ale is a bit like arguing that the same motivation was behind the mechanization of weaving.

>IIRC this was specific to England, with the hopped beer coming over from the Low Countries in the high middle ages
In addition to various social reasons, hopped beer became popular and much more profitable because it is much more shelf stable than gruit beer. However, I personally believe that this has as much to do with the Reinheitsgebot and its imitators as it does with hops - hops are a relatively "clean" ingredient, especially when dried, and if you don't know to sanitize your other adjuncts before adding them you can easily sour your beer or worse, especially if you add them after the boil.

>> No.72580004
File: 95 KB, 359x277, KyubeyMadokaMagica.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Sup witches

>> No.72580321
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>> No.72580697
File: 83 KB, 850x638, 1450614069094.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Time for din-dins Kyubey

>> No.72581736
File: 48 KB, 500x733, 15fa1147c1c174f3b1f1f33fbd9fc520.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Because witches are European. Thats like asking why there is no black dwarves or gnomes.

>> No.72581763

rude ass nigger.

>> No.72581772
File: 99 KB, 557x800, francisco_goya_witches_sabbath.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I would say Warlock or Druid as the base. Maybe Ranger Beastmaster.

>> No.72581777

I'm looking for a picture of an old hobbit witch with an extremely long ponytail. I'm also looking for pictures of malicious-looking little boy and girl witches (they are her apprentices). Does anyone have a good image?

>> No.72581787


>> No.72581858

No one intelligent believes spics can't be pasty. guero is a slur for a reason, and a guero can still be a spic.

>> No.72581864

Pathfinder's take on it is probably the best unique class the game offers. Has lots of flavorful subclasses like gingerbread witch.

>> No.72581895

Oh, and one more thing I forgot to mention about beer: part of the reason that hops became so dominant is that they're easy to grow and process and even easier to use and that spells profit. Gruit consists of many different plants have to be individually grown or foraged, harvested, dried and then blended - carefully blended, too, as mixing up the proportions of something innocuous with something nasty could turn your beer into poison and your profit into a fantasy. With hops, you plant cuttings of one species of plant which is no danger to anyone and which then proceeds to grow into a jungle perennially while producing a massive number of cones that require nothing more than simple drying before being added to beer at basically any point from boil through secondary fermentation and which keep well enough to use them all the way until the next harvest. In 2017 (napkin math incoming), the global production of hops - ie the hops for pretty much all the beer made anywhere in the world between that harvest and the next, roughly - totaled ~139,000 acres, or ~88 square miles according to the 2017 statistical report of the Hop Growers of America. An area the size of Columbus, Ohio, produced enough hops to bitter about fifty billion gallons of beer.

>> No.72581935

Witches shouldn't have tiddies smaller than double G.
Probe me wrong.

>> No.72582075

>88 square miles
Disregard that, I suck cocks. The correct number is 217 square miles.

>> No.72582078
File: 338 KB, 750x1250, witch hero.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Consider the following:
Witch positions aren't as formalized and oficial as noble titles.
The ruling class, especially if they're an empire with a different cultural background, dismisses these witches as cooks with some midwife skills.

>> No.72582092

But africa has a long-ass tradition of superstition and killing witches.
Theres places today where people are executed for evil magic.

>> No.72582632

That's actually his half sister in Pathfinder

>> No.72582885

>Ice Witches everywhere
>Daughters of Baba Yaga
>Go to a caricature of late 1800's Russia and save Anastasia and fight fucking Rasputin
What were they thinking?

>> No.72583227
File: 45 KB, 433x512, Smithcface.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Because witches are European.

You wanna spend some time on google, and try that again?

>> No.72583514

I want you to know I appreciate this post, even if no one else replied.

>> No.72583548

Every society on earth has witches dumbshit.

>> No.72583602


>> No.72583659
File: 1.43 MB, 2026x2865, 53315596_p0.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I desire more like this.

>> No.72583947

Morrigan from Dragon Age. A swamp witch voiced by Claudia Black. Her romance in Dragon Age Origins is probably the reason I can't get enough of bitchy spellcaster women

>> No.72584138

Worst girl, i would choke her, but she's probably into that.

>> No.72584199
File: 113 KB, 721x571, 1403428879080.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I prefer artificer.
Offer infusions as temporary blessings.

>> No.72584913
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>> No.72584954
File: 1.34 MB, 1920x2519, jihae-park-asset.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

What makes the difference between a witch and just any mage girl? The hat? Is it just the big pointy hat that makes witchy?

>> No.72584965
File: 585 KB, 800x1335, jaehong-jeon-sorceress-f-logo.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>> No.72585016

So do most places.

A brief examination of the phenomenon will illustrate that witch panics occur when peopke are undergoing major sociological changes. The Protestants Reformation, for example.

>> No.72585038

In Asian countries it was levied against political rivals, or as a way to explain eccentric behavior.

>> No.72585074

Witches differ in them being the bigger attention whores.

>> No.72585268

Tomatoe Tomato

>> No.72585429

Mages are done through formal book learning.
Witches are apprenticeship

>> No.72585625

Really beer was made
>for and by women
I dont refute that women made the beer, but beer was a womenly drink?

>> No.72586067

chromatic aberration

>> No.72586083

Wrong, Beer was made by Charlie Mopps, brainlet.

>> No.72586107
File: 370 KB, 1448x2048, smug.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I need white-haired witches. It's for a sci-fi setting, but they can look fantasy-ish as well. The only requirement is they MUST have white hair and be female. Other hair colors are fine but only if they are young apprentice-looking witches

>> No.72586125
File: 680 KB, 1014x763, karaba_la_sorciere.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

first thing i think of when someone says black witch is karaba
tbf kirikou is a pretty good movie altogether, y'all should give it a shot

>> No.72586137

Beer and ale was everybody's drink. Everybody drank all day.

>> No.72586157

First time I see this pic on /tg/ without the post being about the dilemma of keeping prisoners or what to do with the smug cuties you capture. How the times are changind.

>> No.72586159
File: 667 KB, 1280x1810, BattlerPortrait.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

They don't exist

>> No.72586194

Absolutely patrician taste

>> No.72586263
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I'll see what I can dig up.

>> No.72586278
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I love the witch aesthetic.

>> No.72586299
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>> No.72586313
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>> No.72586324
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>> No.72586341

>Glances at OP pic
>Looks over OP text
You don’t play games.

>> No.72586350
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>> No.72586481
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>> No.72586531
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>> No.72586599
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>> No.72586680

I thought only girls could be witches

>> No.72586727
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depends on the setting. a lot of fantasy have witches be more focused on healing and subtle magic and wizards be more focused on big showy magic and the manipulation of nonliving things. Harry potter really popularized the idea that male=wizard and female=witch.

>> No.72586783
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>> No.72586835
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also, finally loaded the webm, all of those characters are female. the one doing the tricks is just flat.

>> No.72586844
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Hexenjagerfag here, you're all in big trouble with the Holy Office.
Repent while you can.
Maleficos non patieris vivere.

>> No.72586966
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>> No.72587275

that's a boy

>> No.72587290
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>> No.72587341

it's really not, her name's amanda. She's just a rowdy tomboy.

>> No.72587363
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>> No.72587421
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Cucked witch

>> No.72587496
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>> No.72587659

Witch has been a gender neutral term since the beginning.
Priests would be relatively often accused of witchcraft.

>> No.72587705

I mean witchcraft was consorting with demons, but for a long period priests were believed to be empowered by god to command demons to do shit or to fuck off or whatever, it seems a natural evolution.

>> No.72587917

Just because she doesn't have tits doesn't make her a boy.

>> No.72588030

Best witch. Favorite scene of the whole anime; music was dope.

>> No.72588073

I'll buy it if you can give me a good reason why these witch rulers live on the fringes of society in a little cottage instead of in a mansion with servants.

>> No.72588156

>Dream I was a villager in a fantasy world
>Visit a forest witch to buy a love potion to get the girl I was in love with
>Witch makes me pay her with my body
>When we finished she asked why someone as cute as me would need a love potion
>Marry her instead and had a bunch of cute little witches & wizards with her.

Best wet dream I ever had. Ever.

>> No.72588185

dude... I am so high right now...

>> No.72588746

New Thread

>> No.72589235

witchcraft is based off of nature and the human body is natural. why wouldn't you show it off?

>> No.72589352

>Either protecting or tormenting.
And for the best (or most aggravating) witches, those are the same thing.

>> No.72589355

Baby shark do doo da do doo do

>> No.72591344

I like the witcher series. Where witches are the stay at home community alchemist/magic users

where as witchers are the male alchemist/magic users who go around and hunt the supernatural, sort of the whole women are caretakers men are hunters.

>> No.72591441


Its called being skyclad and it was made up by Gerald Gardener who invented Wicca, basically Gardner was a bit of an old perv and so instituted ritual nudity and spanking into his religion.

>> No.72591536

Wicthes ain't shit but hoes an' tricks

>> No.72591549

more likely to exist than small bombs in your food desu

>> No.72592207

warlock means male witch so i would guess warlock

>> No.72592724

Warlock means warlock.
A male witch is just called a witch.

>> No.72592822

I mean, small bombs exist

>> No.72593256

Witchcraft was consorting with spirits before church declared everyone a demon.

>> No.72593660

show me a male witch

>> No.72593737

witch noun
\ ˈwich \
Definition of witch (Entry 1 of 2)
1: one that is credited with usually malignant supernatural powers
especially : a woman practicing usually black witchcraft often with the aid of a devil or familiar : SORCERESS
— compare WARLOCK

warlock noun
war·lock | \ ˈwȯr-ˌläk \
Definition of warlock
1: a man practicing the black arts : SORCERER
— compare WITCH

merriam-webster definition

>> No.72593864

I have no idea but i would assume that if women were the ones making it, then, statistically, they would be drinking it more than men. If they talked about brewing to other women they could share some beers and men would see it as a womanly act
Also, you could reason that, because it has a significantly lower alcohol content than wine, beer could be seen as a soft option

>> No.72593935

That's what dictionaries do. They describe how people use the language.
But if you want to be correct about it, a male witch is just a witch. Or he-witch if you want to put emphasis.
Witch comes from wicca.
Warlock means oath breaker.
The etymologies are unrelated.

>> No.72594030

My dictionaries have a neutral definition that goes "a practitioner of witchcraft" but every other definition is explicitly about women, if that's of any help.

>> No.72594075

Search Results
Featured snippet from the web
The most commonly accepted etymology derives warlock from the Old English wǣrloga meaning "oathbreaker" or "deceiver". In early modern Scots, the word came to be used as the male equivalent of witch (which can be male or female, but has historically been used predominantly for females).

this is wikipedia, technically we are both right. My only point is warlock is the best class in dnd to play as a warlock.

>> No.72594109

as a witch*

>> No.72594275

You think so?
I think they're too flashy to be witches.
Their signature move is belasting things apart with a magical bullet.
Quite a bit different from sneaky curses and potions.
But then again, maybe that's just dnd. Anti-mysticism at the core.

>> No.72594279

Most underrated post on /tg/ right now.

>> No.72595801

They were seen as loose women and many other things because they were unmarried and didn't need a man to take care of them, which in history usually makes a woman the target of any insecure man's ire.

>> No.72596030

I think the idea is that it's meant to contrast the more modern ideas about beer being a manly drink for manly men, and colorful sweet cocktails are girly despite being harder by far. Some idiots still fall for that who aren't boomers.

But I think historically when women were making beer they were drinking it more, and if hard liquor was available that's what the men would drink while woman would stick with their lighter brews made by the widow down the street that they purchased while stopping to gossip with several other woman there.

>> No.72596052

That's just a male approach to magic vs a female one desu.

>> No.72596147

No really, historically everybody was drinking beer and ale all day with every meal. It was the default drink. Not only was hard liquor not even properly distilled in Europe before the 12th century (and not widely consumed for several more centuries) you'd be stupid drunk if you were drinking it all day. All men, women, and children were drinking beer and ale at any given time. Feel free to replace beer with wine in more Mediterranean settings.

>> No.72596233

That's a pretty loose definition of "beer and ale" I'm thinking. Mead was more common.

>> No.72596372

Mead was more common in some places and some times. It is a kind of loose definition that I'm comfortable including mead under. It's just in modern times with clean water and great excess of food beer is just something to get drunk on but it was intimately tied with civilization and life itself in days gone by. Grain cultivation is pretty much the bedrock of human civilization, and beer is intimately tied to grain cultivation. It's so fundamental to humanity the Egyptians considered it a gift from the god Osiris.

>> No.72598807

>That's a pretty loose definition of "beer and ale" I'm thinking.
No, not really. The average beer was a small beer of <2% ABV or so and as such it was cheap to produce and quick to brew.

>Mead was more common.
No, it wasn't. Honey showed up in a lot of places (braggots, pyments, hydromels, etc.) but what we think of as "mead" (ie. what would be considered a sack mead today) was a special beverage.

>> No.72599708

Persecution look at alchemists in history they where tolerated enough that they did practice there craft but not so much as to be open or showy about it. This is why a number of achemists who where professionals kept it quite sir Isaac Newton is a good example.

>> No.72601967

Magic, fucking witches posting their pics with their enchantments still on them...

>> No.72603192

can boys be witches?

>> No.72603676

so what you're saying is that in Pratchett, wizards handle theoretical magic while witches handle practical magic?

I guess it would be an interesting way to divide magic users up, the equivalent of scientists vs mechanics. Not sure where engineers would fall in that, though.

>> No.72603786

the one on the right looks like a basic thot with a pointy hat and a stick, not a witch

who the fuck even calls this garbage a witch

>> No.72603834

You're pretty fucking boring. Defantasizing fantasy tropes is fascinating and gives loads of material to build on when playing tabletop.

Have some imagination, faggot

>> No.72603843

Some of the wizards of the Unseen University have been making stuff I'd consider to fall under engineering, like making a sentient magical computer to do magic faster.

>> No.72604897


Isn't "witch" technically a female term? Generally I see "Warlock" as the male version of it but... well, English ain't my native language.

It's fascinating how the language used by most people who wanted to burn people for the usage of magic is the one with the biggest terminology for them.

>> No.72606390

It's also more of a big picture little picture thing too. But yeah the wizards have a university, can cast big dangerous spells but make a point of not doing that cause it's dangerous shit, and then the witches look after their communities and the magic is something they diffuse more than they use, their understanding of it being for utility. The wizards as well educated and intelligent, but the witches are damn clever.

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