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57184889 No.57184889 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

We'ves got us some cards

>> No.57184897
File: 775 KB, 2448x3264, le spoal.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57184897

>> No.57184928
File: 674 KB, 2448x3264, spoal-3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57184928

>> No.57184976
File: 732 KB, 2448x3264, spoal-4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57184976

looks like they might have been hiding all the alright playables in rivals.

>> No.57185163

>>57184889
>that ult
>yet I can't run traumatize, or fleet swallower with it
It hurts to live boys.

>> No.57185224

>>57185163
>3 color mill damage deck
do it.

>> No.57185282

>>57185163
Why now run Traumatize with it? Just load your deck up with a bunch of mana rocks like Darksteel Ingot or those diamonds from Mirage so you're more likely to have the right colors, and a bunch of black or blue tutoring spells. Hell, asl ong you have a shitload of Mana Rocks, might as well use it with Boom/Bust too. Nuke everyone's lands but you're okay because you have artifact mana. Then they lose an assload of life to Angrath's ultimate because people tend to play lots of lands.

>> No.57185304

>>57184889
WOAH it's terrible.

>> No.57185327

>>57185224
I think it'd be pretty spicy to run it in a Kess variant, then I"m pretty sure you can strionic the trigger on the ult, so if someone has as little as 20 cards in their yard, which is piss easy, they get hit for 40 damage. If you're real slick, drop deepglow skate/doubling season and ult it the turn it comes out.

>>57185282
Honestly, I just want to run Consuming Aboration and Lord of Extinction in the same deck, now this bitch comes out and I have to make 4 colour mill... Sometimes being a millfag is suffering.

>> No.57185469

>>57184889
I like that +1 and -3. The -8 is meh.
>>57184897
Power creep.
>>57184928
A tough-ish mana dork I suppose.
>>57184976
Dino hate.

>> No.57185475

Reposting thus one.

Zacama, Primal Calamity
Legendary Creature - Elder Dinosaur
6 (R)(G)(W)
9/9
Vigilance, trample, reach.

When Zacama enters the battlefield. If you cast it, untap all lands you control.

2(R): Zacama deals 3 damage to target creature or player.

2(G): Destroy target artifact or enchantment.

2(W): You gain 5 life.

>> No.57185620

Angrath is...pretty average. He has lots of competition in the 5 cmc slot and his minus is akwardly costed.

Why can't B/R have nice things anymore?

>> No.57185636

>>57185620
Straight into the Rakdos, Lord of Riots EDH deck.

>> No.57185656

>>57185620
Fuck why cany ANY colors have anything nice anymore. Ever since Kahns we have fucking jack shit in terms of cards.

>> No.57185727
File: 127 KB, 223x311, Image (1).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57185727

>>57185656

Shut your whore mouth

>> No.57185896

>>57185636
Did you mean Kaervek the Merciless and/or Mogis, God of Slaughter?

>> No.57186412

>>57185469
Power creep from what?
>>57185475
Where did you get that? looks like theyre bringing back playable mythics and legendaries this time around. Christ ixalan was garbage for that.

>> No.57187729
File: 7 KB, 312x63, banned.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57187729

>>57185727
>Finally get a good card
>Can't use it.

inb4
>Playing Standard

>> No.57187768
File: 46 KB, 600x632, 343.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57187768

>>57187729
>>Playing Standard
You deserve it for idiot

>> No.57187969

>>57185475
Really, REACH is what they give this for its green ability? Are you fucking kidding me? At least now flyers won't be able to race you!

The rest of it doesn't really matter beause
>etb
>untap all lands

>> No.57188016

>>57185620
Because BR is a dumb combo played by retards who can't see how much the colors overlap.
>can't even deal with enchantments, while all other 2 color combinations hit all permanents

>> No.57188036

>>57188016
If you reduce your opponent's life to zero all of his enchantments go away, that's LIKE enchantment removal.

>> No.57188081

>>57185656
SOI block gave us plenty of playables anon, apparently while I wasn't looking, half the cards in my Modern BGx got replaced by stuff from EMN and an entire new Jeskai Nahiri deck sprouted up.

>> No.57188109

>>57188081
EMN was one of the best recent sets, it also spawned the entirety of the Modern Spirit Deck.

>> No.57188490

>>57184976
>can't be blocked by dinosaurs
wizards are you fucking serious?

>> No.57188579
File: 174 KB, 265x370, Drake_Haven_EN[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57188579

>want to make another shitty homebrew for standard
>almost all my deckbuilding ideas are just Amonkhet Block with a couple of Search for Azcantas

How can Wizards make a tribal block, and then make almost none of the tribes standard playable?

How can they print not a single playable treasure-producing creature?

>> No.57188637

>>57188490
It's a limited card and a 3 drop 2/3. You won't love itb ut you'll paly it in your draft. And if the environment is anything like XLN's, 3 of the 8 archetypes are dinosaurs anyway, even ignoring incidental ones.

>> No.57188816

>>57186412
>Power creep from what?
Not him, but over-statted with flexible upside. Its less a power creep of something, more a power creeping of creatures as a whole.
I'm not really a fan of "being green makes you get an extra stat for free". Big bodies should be at the cost of abilities. I wouldn't care if red never got a bear, but if red gets bears then green has to have better bears with upsides otherwise "green isn't the creature color".
>>57188579
>How can they print not a single playable treasure-producing creature?
There was one. Pic related.

>> No.57188919
File: 10 KB, 256x256, 1343009671635.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57188919

>>57188816
>Pic related.

>> No.57189069
File: 13 KB, 190x265, Deadeye Plunderers.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57189069

>>57188919
Rip me, thought i added it

>> No.57189081

>>57188109
>block with a spirit theme
>spawned a spirit deck
Thanks, Captain Obvious.

>> No.57189113

>>57185475
Sauce?

>> No.57189157

>>57187969
It has trample too.

>> No.57189932

>>57188816
Green's had bears with upsides since forever. WHITE has had bears with upsides since forever.
And that dinosaur isn't a bear anyways.

>> No.57189994

>>57189081
>Shadows over innistrad
>Block with Zombie theme
>Didn't spawn jackshit

Wow

>> No.57190079

>>57188816
Come on, this isn't Vampire Nighthawk. This isn't even Qasali Pridemage. It's a 3/4 for 1GG that can Naturalize something by sacrificing itself. If it tapped to destroy, then maybe you'd have a case (you still wouldn't).

>> No.57190093

>>57189994
>>57189081
Tbf the original innistrad provided the foundation

>> No.57190117

>>57185727
>Arcbound Ravager, artifact lands, Disciple of the Vault
Yeah it's easy to see why these were banned.

>JTMS, SFM
Pretty dumb cards, easy to understand the banning

>A FUCKING 2/3 FOR 3 IN 2 COLOURS THAT BOUNCES A CREATURE
NIBBA

NO

>> No.57190138

>>57184889
>>57184897
>>57184928
>>57184976
These all feel like they're shitty because of limited.

>> No.57190184

>>57188816
Utility creatures had to scale with all the other creatures. Tin Street Hooligan was a relevant body when it came out, but now 2/1 for 2 is hot garbage. The utility bear isn't really usable anymore outside the fiddly formats.

>> No.57190207

>>57190138
WotC focuses on Limited first, then Standard second. By balancing shit for limited it can also make things shitty for standard, along with complexity not being allowed at common or uncommon much anymore.

>> No.57190210

>>57190184
>Tin Street Hooligan
Christ the art was so much better back then.

>> No.57190307

>>57190207
Not having 'complexity' is all well and good, but most of the time the shit at common/uncommon are made terrible on purpose, like they're just straight up strictly worse versions of a rare.
Whenever a common/uncommon sees play (or, let alone becomes some kind of staple), it always feels like it was unintended.

>> No.57190318

>>57190117
This is the proof of the lack of power in Standard at the time, that Collected Company could put together a deck that would lead to the banning of Reflector Mage.

>> No.57190468

>>57184928
>3 mana dork

will this be the norm from now on?

>> No.57190554

>>57190468
Stop doomsaying, it's three mana because you can sac it to recur a card, and it's a 2/3.

>> No.57190630

>>57190554
None of the things you want or care about in a mana dork. Make it two mana and a 1/2 and now we're looking at a playable card.

>> No.57190667

>>57190630
I don't think the mana dork is the point, it's clear they needed a three-drop that recurs a card from the grave, so they tacked on an activated ability that just happened to be mana generation.

>> No.57190698

>>57190667
Unfortunately, it's shit recursion because the budget from being a mana dork eats it up.
Should have just reprinted Eternal Witness except make it for dinosaurs and keep it as a 2/3.

>> No.57190789

>>57190698
Whether it's good in playability or not i think its a well designed card. Dinos are big mana and it has a secondary effect for some recovery when you don't need the fixing/ramp and topdeck it late game. It will make a good number of kitchen table players happy. And as a post NWO uncommon i can't fault it. Though don't even think it would've be broken as a 2 mana dork that sac'd for 1 (just probably would have been eating a rare slot).

>> No.57190809

>>57190554
nearly all ramp in standard except the 1/1 from the last set starts at 3 mana. you can argue we’re not in a zen meta of necessary ramp, but it’s pathetic, desu.

>> No.57190850

>>57190698
You're missing the point. It was always going to be a card that only recurs Dinos. The mana dork part is just filler. When Design makes a card, they have a budget for stats. It likely started as a 3 mana 1/1 or 1/2 that had the 'recur dinosaurs' part, and then evolved into what it is now.

>> No.57190873

>>57190850
That's what I mean, "What it probably started as" is what it should have been with the recurrence as an ETB rather than a sac effect. It just completely ruins playability, even in limited.

>> No.57190905

Ixalan was a mistake

>> No.57190930

>>57190850
First, you're an idiot. Second, the argument was for mana dorks, not ramp in general. All of these mana dorks are two mana.
>Servant of the Conduit
>Channeler Initiate
>Drover of the Mighty
>Druid of the Cowl
>Naga Vitalist

Of course non-creature ramp starts at three mana. You want to go back to Wolf Run Ramp in Standard? It'll be even more boring to play/play against than Energy decks. Get your head out of your ass, you faggot.

>> No.57191339
File: 170 KB, 623x527, 1479120483365.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57191339

>>57184928
>low cost Dino enabler
>is a human

The Sun Empire was a mistake.

>> No.57191404

>>57191339
Most dinosaurs aren't small so some need to be non-dinosaurs. They encourage you to play non-dinosaurs by giving them the tribal abilities.

>> No.57191729

>>57185327
Planeswalker abilities are activated abilities

>> No.57191751

>>57184889
It's awful, but it's a planeswalker so I'm happy. Just hope I don't open one.

>> No.57191786

>>57184976
>Merfolk
>Blue
Well, color me surprised.

>> No.57191922
File: 20 KB, 297x257, fe5.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57191922

>>57191404
Actually the average size of dinosaurs that we know of is like sheep size, and the true average is likely much smaller since the fossilization process greatly favors bigger things.

>> No.57193440

>>57190468
3 CMC UNCOMMON ANY COLOR MANADORK?!?!?!?
ZOMG!!! OP!!
I'm thankfully that we're allowed such overpoweringly good cards.

>> No.57193459
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57193459

>>57191922
I was referring to magic but okay.

>> No.57193539

>>57191404
That's retarded for two reasons. First, as >>57191922 pointed out, there were dinosaurs sized between housecats and apartment complexes. There's no reason we can't have small dinos(especially as plenty have already been printed).

But more importantly, why the fuck would you want to run non-tribe cards in a tribal deck, even if they have an advantage. They don't benefit from things that help the tribe, like lords, can be tutored for tribal tutors, etc.

There's only one reason to run off-tribe cards in a tribal deck, because it fits the DECK. Merfolk(in modern) runs Kira because it's a creature aggro deck, and Kira's ability is really strong against removeal that can target your lords or key attackers.

This guy isn't worth it in a dino deck(outside of draft) because it just doesn't do enough.

If i'm running off tribe I'd much rather run Kinjali's Caller or Otepec Hunter, reduce the mana cost of all my dinos for a much cheaper investment.

>> No.57193690

there will be a strictly worse mogg fanatic and a 3 mana mind stone

>> No.57193796
File: 10 KB, 386x381, AngerUnlikeTheWorldHasEverSeen.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57193796

>>57193459
Then you're being ackchyually retarded.

>why isn't this small Dino enabler in the game a Dino?
>Because the games Dinos aren't small so it couldn't be small

IT FUCKING COULD BE SMALL IF THEY MADE IT SMALL

>> No.57194011

>>57193796
But Anon, it's not that they can't at all! It's that they can't without violating the """"rules"""" sorrounding ixalan dinosaurs

>> No.57194146

>>57193796
>>57194011


There's no rule. There's at least 6 dinos at or smaller than 2/3 in the first Ixalan already. The only reason it's not a dinosaur is because Wizards wants to cripple Dinosaur tribal. They don't want it to get out ofthis standard and into somewhere like Modern.

They sabotage all of the decent support by putting it off-tribe and overcost anything with a decent ability.

WotC doesn't want to see a dino anywhere but the kitchen table.

>> No.57194211
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57194211

>>57194011
I am angry

ANGRY ABOUT WIZARDS

>> No.57194266
File: 51 KB, 620x372, johnhammondjurassicpark.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57194266

>>57184928
>Dude holding amber sphere?
Needs some custom art.

>> No.57194449

>>57193796
looks like the recovery magic failed

>> No.57194756

>>57189994
Didn't Zombies literally win a pro tour?

>> No.57195834

>>57194756
They meant in Modern.

>> No.57196020

>>57190138
>>57190207
>>57190468
>>57190630
The reason everything feels so overcosted nowadays has nothing to do with limited and everything to do with standard.
New players did not enjoy dying to RDW on turn 3 or getting wrathed on turn 4 then countered for the rest of the game. This is why standard has been midrange/agro for the last two years. Ever since origins, wizards have been moving the power of cards into the 3+ mana range in order to make standard less 'toxic' to newer players.
This is why we see amazing midrange creatures like TKS, Reflector Mage, Spell queller, etc but monastery swiftspear or even elvish mystic are "too strong for standard"

>> No.57196425

>>57184889
I like this, I should be able to play this as a 1 of in modern. The -3 is essentially removal, evasion, and reach all in one, and the +1 isn't irrelevant

>> No.57196476

>>57184889
dead sjw game.

>> No.57196526
File: 94 KB, 620x422, LFl2QSj.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57196526

I fucking hate Ixalan and the whole dinosaur / pirate theme. It's even worse than Amonketh.
When do we go back to Lorwyn?

>> No.57196575

>>57196526
Never because they'd fuck it up.

>> No.57196594

>>57196575
True

>> No.57197207

Rating the Ixalan tribes

>Vampires
3/5, the inclusion of white in their color pie is a nice way to fan out the traditionally BR vampire theme without blowing them out of proportion. Conquistador vampires are totally underrated.
>Pirates
1/5. Ugly as hell and annoyingly pushed in the lore. They also don't appear to be very menacing considering how awkward they look within the setting.
>Merfolk
2/5. I mean they're merfolk and work well in gameplay terms but they don't really stand out. A missed opportunity to expand on them like the vampires. A branching into G would've been really cool.
>Dinosaurs
4/5. Fuck the people who ride them, but the dinosaurs themselves are patrician tier. A neat tribe I can get behind playing often.

>> No.57197271

>>57197207
I wish Merfolk were expanded on, and some more love given to the Conquistador Vamps, 2cool4school. I hope the new Vamps we see in RIX are actually good, but I doubt that.

>> No.57197320

>>57189081
You say that but
>Block with a dinosaur theme
>didn't spawn a dinosaur deck

Wizards are garbage at designing any tribe that aren't Slivers, Elves, Goblins and Merfolk.

Humans, Allies and Spirits are entirely incidental.

>> No.57197370

>>57196526
It is amazing that they have managed to make some as simple as Pirates, Dinosaurs, and Vampire Conquistadors boring and uninteresting.

>> No.57197507
File: 53 KB, 265x370, droverofthemighty.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57197507

>>57190468
>>57193440
considering this was in ixalan, i highly doubt it.

>> No.57197572

>>57190809
>servant of the conduit
>1 mana white dork for dinos
>2 mana red and green for dinos
Ok

>> No.57197870
File: 71 KB, 312x445, 75.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57197870

>>57185469
>power creep
but it's just expensive Qasali Pridemage except it can block slighty better.
>inb4 doesn't die to Push

>> No.57197911

>>57191339
The entire idea of the tribe is that the enablers are the ones summoning and riding the dinosaurs. Mono dorks are always some kind of shamans or druids (or a fucking bird I guess), having a dinosaur manadork just sounds weird

It's just a shame that this completely fucks up dino matters cards

>> No.57197956

>>57188816
>otherwise "green isn't the creature color".
Green is the color of big creatures. Green gets more and better 5/5s than the others. White is the color that gets the most and best bears.

>> No.57198071

>>57197911
What matters is that Dinos are 3-power-matters.

There's a 3/4 for 1GG. A 3/3 for 2G is already above curve, a 3/4 buying that extra toughness for one more colored mana is almost negligible. That means this fucker is going to be able to crew things like Heart or Sky Sovereign or whatever boat abomination they decide to put in RIX.

I won't comment on whether that's going to beat the Energy onslaught because I don't know. But we've got a while until Kaladesh rotates. I guess we should be grateful it's not War Monk or a spider.

>> No.57198246

>>57198071
energy decks have 3-4 vizier of many faces in the 75 now, it doesn't really matter what creature you slam down against it

>> No.57198351

>>57194211
>A raptor will do whatever it's told
>Except it actually doesn't

Who writes the flavour text of these cards?

>> No.57198479

>>57196526
Never because it's one of the worst-selling planes alongside Kamigawa, Mercadia, and Ulgrotha.
It just didn't sell well, apparently, and they'd do anything else rather than go back because once bitten twice shy seems to be their motto

>> No.57198578

>>57197370
>It is amazing that they have managed to make some as simple as Pirates, Dinosaurs boring and uninteresting
Yeah, it's really strange that they could have so easily fucked it u--
>and Vampire Conquistadors
Nigga the Legion of Dusk is the tightest shit.

>> No.57198606

>>57190117
>>57190318
This. The issue is that Standard is less about playing with a tighter pool of cards from the most recent set, and more a sea of shit with islands of playable cards here and there.

Cards are either powerful, just playable enough to fit the curve, or garbage, and they're banning the powerful stuff if too many people get wise to that.

>> No.57199026
File: 479 KB, 536x369, palemoon_2018-01-01_10-56-05.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199026

>> No.57199028
File: 55 KB, 265x370, journeytoeternity.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199028

More spoilers are coming out, apparently its a short week, and they should all be out this week.

>> No.57199032
File: 33 KB, 265x370, IMG_4798.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199032

More cards coming through

>> No.57199033
File: 51 KB, 265x370, tendershootdryad.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199033

>>57199028
>>57199026
sonvua

>> No.57199037
File: 207 KB, 258x360, palemoon_2018-01-01_10-57-20.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199037

>> No.57199042
File: 161 KB, 749x1007, IMG_4799.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199042

>>57199032
Translation is something like: ~'s power amd toughness are equal to the number of different named lands you control

>> No.57199051
File: 175 KB, 265x370, IMG_4806.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199051

>>57199042
Other art for Ghalta

>> No.57199057

>>57199037
Isn't that pretty good for modern?

>> No.57199058
File: 204 KB, 265x370, IMG_4803.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199058

>>57199051

>> No.57199068
File: 196 KB, 265x370, IMG_4802.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199068

>>57199058

>> No.57199079
File: 170 KB, 265x370, IMG_4801.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199079

>>57199068

>> No.57199090

>>57199051
both arts, real ugly. This one tops the other art for being shitty at conveying a 12/12 trample.

>> No.57199091
File: 186 KB, 265x370, IMG_4804.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199091

>>57199079

>> No.57199098

>>57199026
This is pretty cool, I wonder if this will see play. Interesting that it only happens when the creature dies, not when it leaves the battlefield

>> No.57199100

>>57199068
Thumbnail made it look like that was pissing.

>> No.57199102
File: 177 KB, 265x370, IMG_4800.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199102

>>57199091

>> No.57199110

>>57199102
It looks like the game plan is to stick to getting ascension asap.

>> No.57199200

>>57199057
they can bolt/push your dude in response

this card is also worse than a mana dork

>> No.57199254

https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/arrival-rivals-2018-01-01
>Hercules
>2GG
>Legendary Creature – Human God
>12/12
>CARDNAME cannot attack or block unless you control twelve permanents.
>we didn't get this card
Goddamn

>> No.57199286

>>57199033
>>57199026
Muh Golgari dick

>> No.57199296

>>57199254
Ghalta is fairly similar

>> No.57199386

>>57199026
Wew, fucking Meren getting another boost.

>> No.57199441
File: 62 KB, 265x370, IMG_4810.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199441

>>57199102

>> No.57199453

>>57199441
we animorphs now

>> No.57199477

>>57190318
It wasn't banned because of Coco, Coco had rotated by the time this was banned.

It was banned because of fucking UW flash. You remember that deck that kinda existed for about half a set and was really just "Windmill Slam your Avacyns.dec".

>> No.57199490

>>57199441
>6 mana
>requires an entire turn before you decide which creature you'd like to see put you down to 0

>> No.57199559

>>57190930
>do you want to go back to a standard that can't happen again because the cards that broke it are never going to be standard legal again?

Not really, I just want a viable ramp deck again. I wanted more of a RG monsters feel, ramp to 5 mana turn 3 and drop a dumb dino. Go too big for aggro, present my boipucci to control, that style.

But I've long since given up on standard being fun, even dumb fun like RTR/Theros/Khans.

>> No.57199566

>>57199441
What the fuck

>> No.57199582
File: 32 KB, 244x308, 5C90724B-C5C8-41F3-B8ED-AAA761BF6A1D.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57199582

Man I really hope they keep making these kiddy, cartoony bullshit Hearthstone-esque sets to use in Magic Arena! Clearly that idea has caught on!

>> No.57199585

>>57199441
>and that creature deals damage equal to its power to you


WHY

Why the fuck does it need this rider, its 6 mana and takes a full turn before it becomes a once a turn fight card based on your life total.


This seems like an incredibly flavorful card that is being hampered. Would this have been to strong in standard if it didn't hurt you?

>> No.57199674

>>57199585
it's this way because 15 health when you are actually controlling the field it's actually a lot. this way it gives the opponent one last chance to react and or make some cards with damage trigger still function.Keep in mind that once you cast it and survive a turn it's super oppressive; opponent is not meant to get out of it.
it's also more flavorful to fight the creature and seems similar to th enrage mechanics of dinosaurs.

also it seems you read the card wrong: it has an instant effect of putting you at 15, which is substantial if the enemy was beating you up.

>> No.57199676

>>57199100
>Nothing says trouble like a reedy piss

>> No.57199715

>>57199674
if he was beating you up, you've just fogged yourself for a turn and will go back down under 10 life. Then you shoot a dude and go even lower.

>> No.57199755

>>57199674
>its super oppressive.

Yeah, if you are already ahead it can be, but its also a 6 mana enchantment that does nothing the turn it comes down. Even then the oppressiveness is hampered by the life loss.
If you are already behind that turn loss means you aren't going to stay at 15 life and the first creature you kill drops you even faster.

>> No.57199832

>>57199755
>>57199715

you die if the opponent has 8+ damage on the field, otherwise you keep going and we have to assume that you'll find a way to regain life in such a deck.

>> No.57199868

>>57184889
Shit

>>57184897
Very good

>>57184928
Interesting.

>>57184976
Shit

>>57185727
Kinda shit.

Why does this set exist?

>> No.57199873

>>57199441
Oh look it's the Red Do-Nothing Enchantment™ of the set!

Where's the full-retard Alternate Wincon, is that next? What about the trap build-around 3drop?

Fuck these are becoming formulaic.

>> No.57199878

>>57199873
>he thinks sun bird's invocation "does nothing"

>> No.57199889

>>57199878
I actually love Sunbird's Invocation,
but you can't deny that it took them an unreasonable number of attempts to get ONE of these right.

>> No.57199908

>>57199582
I fucking hate how low Magic has fallen, it lost all identity.

>> No.57199910

>>57199889
oh no, you're totally right

>> No.57199923

>>57199868
Reflector Mage isn’t from Ixalan, why mention it with “Why does this set exists?”

>> No.57200020

>>57199868
>Kinda shit.
:^)

>> No.57200043

>>57199441
why does every 5+ cmc red card has to be shit?

>> No.57200098

>>57199868
How can one person be this retarded

>> No.57200312

>>57200043
Is it really so difficult to add a "When ~ enters the battlefield..." to the "At the beginning of your upkeep" clause? Why does WotC hate enchantments doing things the turn they are played?
But planeswalkers are fine, I guess

>> No.57200634
File: 42 KB, 600x451, ce1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57200634

>>57199037
Hold on, Ornithopter is still in standard

>> No.57200672

>>57199079
>8 lands + 2 creatures
>casting 3 cards for 3 during opponent turn
>my turn, draw 1, total of 4 free cards with full mana
This is amazingly good.

>> No.57200694

>>57200672
It's a sorcery

>> No.57200698

>>57200634
...Oh, that's not bad.

>> No.57200727

>>57200698
>>57200634
>>57199037
>Ornithopter Ramp
Consider me intruiged

>> No.57200928

>>57184889
Legendary DoNothing pirate. Red/Black, no surprises.

>>57184897
A good brotodon

>>57184928
sauron prequel? pretty good

>>57184976
"Don't make splash, make trash".

>>57199026
Lots of mechanics to improve late game, nice.

>>57199032
lel

>>57199033
Nice it's creating token every turn. Would reach 10 really fast.

>>57199037
adding another land is not

>>57199042
pretty cool design

>>57199051
damn, why the half shadow picture? they are supposed to have great colors, it's like the illustrator is saying, "fuck you, I want a shadow giant T rex"

>>57199058
Again a pretty cool rule

>>57199068
meh

>>57199079
generous

>>57199091
still late game enhancing, cool

>>57199102
meh

>>57199441
>dealing 15 damage to kill a support 1/1
>on turn 7
wew

>> No.57200948

>>57199441
This could actually be kind of useful in some kind of control deck with red. But for a 6 mana enchantment it should also help you win the game, not buy a lot of extra turns. If it had some line like "If there are no creatures controlled by opponents, instead deal 2 damage to all opponents" it would be a lot better.

>> No.57200984

>>57199051
The shadow and the pose make it look like there's something much bigger behind it that's chasing it. Which is not the kind of atmosphere you really want on your 12/12 trampler.

>> No.57200995

>>57199037
I love this because this may be what makes the dino deck work, but we all know energy is gunna run this and be cancer incarnate still... Why change my strategy when I can get all the pluses wothout reducing the power...

>> No.57201021
File: 61 KB, 312x445, 154[2].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57201021

>>57198071
>2/2 for 2 in green needs significant upside to not just be draft chaff
>yet 3/3 for 3 in green is above the curve, especially when we've had exactly that since fuckan Tempest

>> No.57201038

>>57199441
neat, but I really can't see anyway this can be good. Is there any type of card like soulfire grandmaster that can give enchantments lifelink?
Otherwise, I would have like to see this in green, so that you can attach a life gain mechanic, like gain life equal to the toughness of the creature you just destroyed.

>> No.57201052

>>57201021
Kalonian Tusker and Leatherback Baloth say hi.

>> No.57201059

>>57199026
into child of alara it goes

>> No.57201065

>>57199051
Wait, it's the total power and not the number of creatures?
3 2/2 and it's a 12/12 trample for 6?

>> No.57201099

>>57201038
You can make it a creature witb opalescence/starfield and give it life link, but eh.
>>57201065
Yes

>> No.57201103

>>57199032
I actually like this a lot. It's a lord that has various effects going on. I don't think it will see standard or modern play, but I think it's a really cool and versatile commander.

>> No.57201151

>>57201103
I feel like hes on the threshold of being a combo machine but probably falls just short. Hes probably still the defacto merfolk commander now though.

>> No.57201186

>>57199254
We've known about that. It ended up becoming Mistcutter Hydra.

>> No.57201201

>>57200984

It looks to me like it’s coming out of the shadow cast by being in a valley or something, not being chased.

>> No.57201252

>>57201151
yeah, I think he was intentionally made to not be a combo machine, but again, he does everything that the blue green merfolk tribe want.
But yeah, he is definitely going to be the merfolk commander, he just works to well with all the other merfolk.
I hope that they will also make a traditional merfolk lord, either a reprint or a new one, but I am not holding my breath.

>> No.57201274

>>57199091
this actually seems really decent to me. All colors can use ramp and it's a, well I can't even call it a decent body, but it has a big butt.

>> No.57201280
File: 450 KB, 1280x1094, Dusk-tan.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57201280

>>57198071
>What matters is that Dinos are 3-power-matters.

>> No.57201289

>>57199026
the cycle of enemy colored double face cards all seem really powerful.

>> No.57201291

>originally magic was about angels, zombies and elves
>now magic is about pirates and dinosaurs
Did Disney bought WotC?

>> No.57201304

>>57201252
Pretty sure there'll be a traditional lord (probably not a 2 drop, though i find the thought of a UG lord more appealing aesthetically than UU)) in the set, though id hazard a guess itll be closer to thalias lieutenant due to themes of the ixalan merfolk.

>> No.57201310

>>57199441
>Next turn your opponent plays Blightsteel Colossus, his only creature

>> No.57201318

>>57201291
Its one set. This one block is about pirates and dinosaurs. Its like saying magic was about horror and not fantasy anymore during Innistrad.

>> No.57201324

>>57184889
Is he bad? He actually seems decent to me. There is better stuff in standard right now, but I like him.
>>57184897
this seems bonkers to me.

>> No.57201335

>>57201291
players have been asking for both pirate and dinosaur themed sets for years. I agree it was kinda fucking dumb to roll both of them into one set, but acting like this is some sort of betrayal of magic's identity is retarded. The whole point of having a story set on different planes is so each new block can feel different in terms of flavor and gameplay you fucking mongoloid.

>> No.57201376

>>57201335
The dumb part was having a tribal set with only 4 tribes, and providing them with little to no support.

>> No.57201394

>>57201376
It worked well for innistrad, but innistrad actually had more going for it than just tribal.

>> No.57201420

>>57201394
Even in Innistrad the tribal aspect didn't really do anything in standard. The only tribal matters card that appeared in competitive play was Gravecrawler. Diregraf Ghoul was just a 2/2 for 1, Geralf's Messenger was just a strong card. Innistrad wasn't really a tribal set, it was just a spooky set with tribes in it.

>> No.57201433

>>57201376
I would rather have fewer tribes than more. Lorwyn was a neat set, but it tried to support too many tribes.
I am hoping that the support for the tribes is in Rivals.

>> No.57201435

>>57199026
This could probably slot into Meren pretty well.

>> No.57201438

>>57201376
Sorry, what exactly is the problem of having a tribal set with only 4 tribes? Ixalan has problems, but the factioning and how it was divided was certainly not one of them.

>> No.57201448

>>57201335
>you go into a plane with pirates and dinosaurs
You realize it, no? That the block after this one will be about princesses and speaking mouses?

>> No.57201450

>>57201304
Sounds logical, because of the +1/+1 counters theme.
However I wonder if we are going to get it in Dominaria. They already made lord of atlantis there, so there might be more support.

>> No.57201477
File: 14 KB, 252x224, 9826840.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57201477

>>57199026

>Turn 2 Sakura Tribe Elder
>Turn 3 this
>Have 6 lands by the end of turn 3

>> No.57201482

>>57201448
We loterally already know the next set, and the irony of what it is knowing the complaint that Magic departing too much from what it is, because apparently pirates and dinosaurs are too fun, is palpable.

>> No.57201501

>>57201433
>it tried to support too many tribes
There are so many bad an unplayable cards in any given set these days that this isn't even an argument.

>> No.57201514

>>57201448
>That the block after this one will be about princesses and speaking mouses
dude, why do you think that switching to different tribes suddenly means that the entire tone of mtg will somehow shift?
angels, zombies, and elves don't have a direct tone attached to them, they can be made goofy or serious. Same with dinosaurs and pirates.
It's more in the execution.

>> No.57201548

>>57199032
>getting hyped for merfolk lord
never again

>> No.57201561

>>57201052
The point was that he was claiming that three mana 3/3s in green were 'above curve' in and of themselves when that's not true when the fuckan elephant has existed for so long, nevermind those two.
Nobody show him what four mana gets you or he might have a heart attack.

>> No.57201566

>>57201501
I'm a newfag, so I have no idea what you are talking about. When I look through the lists of older sets it seems to me there are just as many cards that are useless/unplayable that have been forgotten in them as the recent sets.
All those class lords in lorwyn are neat, but they seem to be completely forgotten.

>> No.57201586

>>57201566
B-but muh wizened cenn...

>> No.57201689

>>57201438
I actually really like how they managed to split the factions in the colors. Hope they do something like this again.

>> No.57201752

>>57201252
Buy your Herald of Secret Streams copies now, investors.

>> No.57201781

>>57201420
That's kind of my point. Ixalan is just a shitty core set "with tribes in it."

>> No.57201792

>>57188016
Really, you'd think with how black is supposed to be the "power at all costs" color, it would get SOMETHING to deal with any given permanent type. Maybe not as efficient as other colors would get, but why couldn't there be something like a sorcery with an additional cost of paying life to destroy target permanent?

Or maybe for BR specifically, you could combine black's "power at all costs" with red's "reckless/short-sighted" to do some form of soft removal that ultimately might give your opponent a greater advantage a couple turns down the road. Maybe a suspend-type effect where the opponent gets to draw a card when it comes back in or something like that.

>> No.57201795
File: 55 KB, 265x370, stormthevault.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57201795

>>57199026
I love this

>>57184897
I don't use dinos, but this guy is fine

>>57199079
eww, I guess this is what I can get with ascend

>>57199026
this and Storm the Vault are part of a enemy legendary enchantments that transform.

Boros will be an Aura that gives double strike and when the creature inflicts damage it flips into a land with TAP: add R to your mana pool. 2,WR, tap 1 creature you control: all your creatures gain +2/0 and first
strike until end of the turn.

Simic will be an Enchantment that puts 2 +1/+1 counters on up to 2 creatures you control during your unkeep and if yoiu have 7 or 8 counters across the board it flips into land with 1,Tap: add UG to your mana pool. 1UG,Tap: add 3 +1/+1 on up to 3 creatures you control.

Orzov will ne an Aura that gives indestructible only during your combat and if the creature you control detroys an opponent creature it transorms into a land with Tap: add W or B to your mana pool. 1,Tap, sacrifice target creature you control: another creature you control gains indestructible.

>> No.57201829

>>57201752
Also, Merrow Commerce while you are at it.

>> No.57201846

>>57199033
Since it's a permanent, does that mean you get the City's Blessing if you hit 10 permanents when she's already on the field?

>> No.57201856

>>57199032
Sooo, can the second and third effect be done on opponents turn? Cus it doesn't say it can't be done?

>> No.57201873

>>57201846
As said by the mechanics article, yes.
>>57201856
All three can, though the first isn't very useful on an opponent's turn.

>> No.57201883

>>57201846
yes, the article didnt explicitly say it was a state based action but they said permanents are always checking to ascend and it doesnt use the stack. Which makes it every much seem like its a state based action as long as you have a permanent with ascend on it.

>> No.57201886

>>57201846
Yes. It's a continuous ability, not a triggered or on cast effect, so when you hit 10 permanents before or after she's cast, Ascend activates.

>> No.57201889

>>57201846
yeah, the mechanics article seems to say it works that way.

>> No.57201920

>>57199033
does this mean saprolings in dominaria?

>> No.57201938

>>57201889
Ascend seems kind of ham-fisted. It works, but requires some clunky knowledge. There will be judge calls for basic stuff.

I still think it was a missed opportunity to make it be "first player to get it keeps it" - as in, only one player per game can have Ascend. It would have made it like an actual race and you would care about removing your opponent's permanents more. But, that isn't "fun" to the new player I suppose...

>> No.57201962

>>57201938
I think it's pretty obvious that ascend was meant to be monarch from conspiray, but changed last minute to not be the same. Monarch honestly would have worked better, but I guess that it's only a conspiracy mechanic.

>> No.57202022

Honestly I'm really liking the look of this set.

>> No.57202044

>>57199051
This unironically seems inspired by Hearthstone's Jungle Giants + 12/12. This whole set's theme, if not mechanics, feels very Hearthstone-y.

>> No.57202094

>>57201962
They actually explained this a while back they were designing an edge-style mechanic for both Ixalan and Conspiracy. They wanted monarch to go into ixalan, but conspiracy design couldn't find a better replacement, so they kept monarch and Ixalan had to figure out something else.

>> No.57202134

>>57197207
>Ugly as hell and annoyingly pushed in the lore. They also don't appear to be very menacing considering how awkward they look within the setting.
Lore wise they have the same problem good-guy pirates always have in fiction; that making pirates good guys being chased around by evil vampires/East India Company is completely missing the point of what pirates actually are and what they do.

To paraphrase Confused Matthew;
>Pirates are murderers and thieves. A crackdown on pirates is a good thing.

Then again I guess Vraska's characterisation and her backstory would be a bit ruined were she the jolly cap'n of a boat full of rapists and bandits.

>> No.57202176

when does the set release? When does the story start?

>> No.57202205

>>57201477
heckin heck
id love to do this in gitrog

>> No.57202217
File: 32 KB, 223x310, Image.ashx.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202217

>>57201038
found card to give it lifelink, would be neat to try out, but definitely not something for anything competitive.

>> No.57202226

>>57199068
Neuman!

>> No.57202243

>>57202134
angraths pirates feel more piraty than the rest of them, being that they're essentially just a riot on a boat

>> No.57202247

>>57202094
that makes a lot of sense. I don't like ascend and how it's a non-interactive mechanic. You just hit a limit and then that's it.
But I guess that's what happens when you have to rush a mechanic.

>> No.57202304

>>57202247
>I don't like ascend and how it's a non-interactive mechanic. You just hit a limit and then that's it.
I don't want to defend ascend, but at least you can say you can interact with it. If you kill your opponent's permanents then he doesn't get to ascend.

>> No.57202374

>>57202304
to a point, but lands will eventually push you to the point where its easier to ascend then not.

>> No.57202403

>>57202304
alright, I guess that's the wrong term for it. However I think monarch is a lot better because you can actually take away monarch from your opponent.
Maybe there will be some cards that will prevent a player from ascending or remove their ascension, but I doubt it.

>> No.57202405

>>57202374
Which wouldn't be a problem if they wanted land destruction to be viable but I guess it's just not fun enough for the contemporary player.

>> No.57202461
File: 107 KB, 229x408, image.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202461

what the fuck?

>> No.57202480
File: 291 KB, 600x399, yo dawg.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202480

>>57199037
>>57199057
>>57200634
>>57200727
>>57200928
>>57200995
so i heard you like explore...

>> No.57202492

>>57202480
Two explores actually.

>> No.57202529

>>57202461
Booooring.

>> No.57202551
File: 130 KB, 223x311, Image.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202551

>>57202461
tags the creature of the set. Why do they make these big boring creatures and out them in the rare slot?

>> No.57202559

>>57202492
so we put Explore in your Explore, so you can explore when you Explore.

>> No.57202562
File: 209 KB, 672x936, hou-161-god-pharaoh-s-gift.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202562

>>57202461
>4/4 double strike vigilant trampling indestructable hasty flier

>> No.57202595

>>57202562
not hasty.

>> No.57202599

>>57202461
Is there anything that can take advantage of having that many keywords?
Otherwise seems a decent dino to stick in to a commander deck.

>> No.57202603

>>57202595
GPG gives haste

>> No.57202641

>>57199051
wow a double digit trampler for GG, really flexing those creative muscles MaRo

>> No.57202655

>>57202599
GPG and scarab god.

>> No.57202659

>>57202559
In my Ford Explorer?

>> No.57202677
File: 587 KB, 752x358, share.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202677

>>57202599
In standard you have >>57202562, the scarab god and miriach, in modern you have the rest

>> No.57202742

>>57184889
What's the point of this having legendary if you can't have two planeswalkers with the same type anyway?

>> No.57202765

>>57202742
The Planeswalker Uniqueness Rule no longer exists and was replaced by errata that makes all existing planeswalkers legenedary, with all future ones having it printed on the card.

>> No.57202792

>>57202742
But now you can. That's the point.

>> No.57202797

>>57202599
NeoOdric too i guess.

>> No.57202922
File: 67 KB, 312x445, 01B0E073-5DE6-415B-A288-E8E4232CC97E.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57202922

>>57199032
time to meme brew. how do i get maximum value out of this guy?

>> No.57202924

>>57190630
It's only incidentally a mana dork. You're thinking completely backwards.

>> No.57202940

>>57198351
Congrats you got the joke

>> No.57202961

>>57202922
paradox engine

>> No.57203003

>>57194146
Which is strange. I guess they're afraid of another Eldrazi winter, but Dinos have no previous support cards to create broken interactions with, and you'd think that a Dinosaur deck in Standard or Modern would get people way more excited than an Eldrazi deck.

>> No.57203083

>>57202461
Thats a hell of a reanimator target (for Standard anyway).

>> No.57203118

>>57203003
It's entirely flavor-driven.

>> No.57203222

>>57202599
That dredge guy that pulls keywords off of the things you dredge for it. Actually might be an interesting deck. If you can get that thing into your graveyard consistently that's a 4/4 double strike, vigilance, flying, trample, indestructible for 5 mana or less.

>> No.57203248

>>57203222
delve guy

>> No.57203285

>>57203248
Yeah, that

>> No.57203351

>>57202677
Why can't they just say keyword abilities? Legitimate question, is it just not possible in how keywords are in the rules or would that lead to something easily overpowered?

>> No.57203422

>>57203351
kicker is a keyword, to give an example of why you don't want to do that.

Outlast is a keyword. splice is a keyword

>> No.57203501

>>57203422
And just saying 'keywords' gives you keyword actions like discard.
And people will always and forever swear up and down that 'unblockable' is a keyword.

>> No.57203677

>>57203422
>>57203501
oh yeah, I keep forgetting about all the stuff that is keyworded. It's probably not worth it to make a term for the few cards that do refer to keyword abilities like the ones above.

>> No.57203723

>>57202461
>fearless attacker
>giant fuck-off wall
Love this guy.

>> No.57203847
File: 91 KB, 895x975, DDBwvg9VwAAIGqa.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57203847

>>57201477
Wow, that's almost tron mana!

>> No.57204204

>>57203847
It's tron without the whole feeling like a dirty cheating whore part of tron!

>> No.57204346

>>57204204
>spending the whole of turn three to get to 6 tapped lands is the same as having 7 mana to spend turn 3

>> No.57204485

>>57202461
Yunno, it's funny, but Elesh Norn is still a better card in Commander.

I feel it is strange how they print these cards and they're flagrantly for the Commander crowd and yet the one fucking thing we know they do for certain they can't even do fucking right. In what fucking world does a discussion at Wizards around this card's appeal in Commander not bring up Elesh Norn and the fact that this thing is pretty much entirely inferior to it as a big White thing. You can't even build around this retarded thing, and what aspects you can do like suit it up you can just as easily do with Elesh Norn.

All this is going to do is break Limited games. Man, I fucking love it when there are must-answer threats in Rare, nothing makes me love Limited more than that.

>> No.57204500

>>57198351

>needing to be angry this badly

Jesus.

>> No.57204595

>>57204485
Why does it need to be for Commander as a Commander?
Why does every legendary creature now have to fit as a commander?
And if, as you say, Elesh Norn is going to be better as a large monowhite commander than pretty much anything else they try, then why should they even try to do anything Commander-based with large monowhite legendaries in noncommander based sets?
It's not there to be a Commander. It's there to use the set's Big Angel Slot, except it's a dinosaur and thus gets to be even fatter than normal.

>> No.57204655

>>57204500
Maybe you're not an American but in America every kid pretty much learns that a quote from Henry Ford, the founder of Ford Motor Company, said something like, "You can have a car painted in any color so long as it's black". There's another saying, I don't know who the fuck said it but it goes, "Brevity is the soul of wit", which means if you're going to say something smart, be quick about it and that'll make it funny.

Ford's quote is to the point and uses the minimal amount of words (unlike me) and that's what's nice about it.

The thing is, the quote they used for the Raptor repeats itself twice. It could've simply been, "kill" and it would be a nice joke. The other two orders are pretty much the same as "kill". Whoever the fuck wrote and edited this thing bungled the structure of the Ford quote and not only that, weighted it down with synonyms for people who are too fucking stupid to identify synonyms.

You're right, it's nothing to get angry about. But it does mean that absolutely nobody working in that building has any taste. And they're producing lowest-common-denominator trash.

>> No.57204685

>>57202403
It's confusing due to its similarity with the monarch, but Ascend is a straight threshold mechanic, like threshold and delirium. But while those mechanics tracked cards in graveyards, that don't change all that much in a normal game, permanent counts change constantly due to removal and combat. Tracking all that constantly would be a huge pain in the ass, so they made it stick on. Given that 8 is quite a lot, if you're not in a good position when they ascend, chances are you weren't going to be doing well in either case.

Also, unlike the monarch, ascend doesn't do anything on its own, so there's no real need to 'take' it.

>> No.57204725

>>57204485
Elesh Norn is a completely absurd magic card. If that's what you're comparing 8-drops to, disappointment is completely inevitable, unless you'd like yugioh-tier powercreep.

>> No.57204820

>>57204725
There's no doubt Elesh Norn is an absurd card, but it does something unique from other large beaters like Yosei or Reya, who are special in of themselves.

This Dinosaur is really no different than Akroma. Or old-Avacyn. Or new-Linvala. It's just lame and will serve only to ruin limited games.

>> No.57204931

>>57204820
except it is bigger, doesn't have haste and has double strike. Guys not every single card needs to be a special snowflake made exactly to make you happy, they wanted a fat flier like akroma, but they translated it into a more fitting dinosaur form. What is so wrong with that?

>> No.57204995

>>57204931
Apparently giving dinosaurs a big fat flying beater is a horrible terrible thing to do, because it can't stand up to the Grand Cenobite and all must bow down to the whims of a single format.

>> No.57205006

>>57204931
Because it ruins Limited. And for that cost it yields no advantage in any other category or format. The net impact is negative and purely negative and benefits nobody except to randomly steal wins.

>> No.57205029

>>57205006
If you want to get past the big angry dino wall draft more unblockable Merfolk.

>> No.57205048

>>57205029
>lol 8 damage a turn by something that can only be sacrificed or exiled is okay bro
Reminder that the edict effect we've seen is at rare.

>> No.57205075

>>57205006
it makes timmy happy, both the Standard playing kind and the casual kind.

>> No.57205084

>>57205048
Ixalan Limited is fast and Rivals doesn't look like it's gonna slow it down any.

Kill them before they get to 8 mana and kill their mana dorks.

>> No.57205088

>>57205006
If a non-hasty 8-drop is ruining limited, draft better decks. There are some very stupid cards in limited, such as the gods in Hour, but this is not one of them.

>> No.57205101
File: 6 KB, 228x221, IMG_20180101_152223.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57205101

I can't believe there are people still excited about this fucking game.

>> No.57205127

>>57204655
brevity quote is shakespear

>> No.57205183

>>57205088
Fuck hasty 8 drops though, like god damn

Fuck you nigger, that deck was trash. Wizards just printed bullshit you happened to open

>> No.57205242

>>57205127
Was it? The way it was mentioned made it seem like that was just thing he heard people say, and was making it fun of it. "If brevity is the soul of wit, I shall be brief, - (insert overly long and repetitive monologue about how fucking crazy Hamlet is)". Definitely from that era, though.

>> No.57205304

>>57205242
The full quote, just because:

LORD POLONIUS
Therefore, since brevity is the soul of wit,
And tediousness the limbs and outward flourishes,
I will be brief: your noble son is mad:
Mad call I it; for, to define true madness,
What is't but to be nothing else but mad?
But let that go.

QUEEN GERTRUDE
More matter, with less art.

Polonius proceeds to not shut up for the rest of the scene.

>> No.57205700

>>57202461
I hate how every big guy gets indestructible now. Just a lame mechanic.

>> No.57205764

>>57205700
t. regenerate

>> No.57205785

>>57205700
>>57205764
This. It's just a more streamlined regenerate.

>> No.57205813

>>57205700
They've consolidated mechanics to streamline creature resilience. Regenerate and "when this dies return to battlefield tapped" and all those other effects just got rolled into Indestructible. It makes sense from a design perspective because it makes it easier for people to design cards that would normally interact with creatures.

The problem is that we've grown used to the word meaning significant power in Magic. It used to belong to things that were impossible to kill like magic-metal or in the case of White creatures - imbued with the power of the soul of Planes and/or empowered by Planeswalkers. Now it's just an effect any old mage can whip out.

>> No.57205832

>>57205764
>>57205785
Except regenerate has a cost, so people have to pay attention to their mana instead of just face-rolling indestructible stuff.

>> No.57205836

Yeah, of course bomb fatties are good in limited. This guy won't break shit. Do you scrubs whine every time Timmy bait is printed?

>> No.57205855

>>57205785
Except you have to hold some sort of payment up for regenerate, usually.

>>57205813
Their 'streamlining' and consolidating mechanics is not really doing the game any favours. Complication and complexity, even 'unnecessary' complexity is usually a good thing for the sake of design space long term, and we all know how worried they are about feeling chafed by design space, apparently.

Protection from X was a good mechanic, so was regenerate. Fight me.

>> No.57205858

>>57199051
*BRRRAAAAPPPPPP*

>> No.57205883

>>57205832
Yeah, and you have creatures that can pay to get indestructible until end of turn if you want that, like Spearbreaker. What part about streamlining aren't you understanding?

>> No.57205906

>>57205855
Finnicky mechanics don't make the game complicated. Game states do. A game that needs to resort to shit like Banding to fake "complexity" is poor design.

>> No.57205910

>>57201548
>>57199032
i wonder if this is the "legacy playable" merfolk that one guy from wizards said was in the set

>> No.57205921

>>57205855
I play a fair bit of pauper, and yeah, protection from x is more tactically interesting than particularly powerful.

>> No.57205937

>>57205883
not understanding =\ thinking something is lame

>> No.57206007

>>57205127
Brevity is the soul of wit is Shakespeare
Brevity is wit is Wilde

>> No.57206026

>>57205937
You really think paying to get indestructible until end of turn is less fun, or more "lame" (what the fuck does that even mean?) than regenerate?

Indestructible is simple if you want it to be, and can accomodate "leave mana open" ideas if you want it to. It's a game design slam dunk.

>> No.57206061
File: 208 KB, 672x936, sok-27-rune-tail-kitsune-ascendant-rune-tail-s-essence.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206061

Remember when Magic did crazy shit and people either really loved it or despised it?

We're done with that. The last few years, their design team has just went with the safest options. All new mechanics are "here's a little more value" and they're going to stay that way.

>> No.57206077

>>57205910
he probably meant the Silvergill Adept reprint :^)

>> No.57206110

>>57206061
if by that pic you're implying that they haven't experimented with card formatting, we just had the aftermath cards from amonkhet ffs

>> No.57206127

>>57199441
It should be10 life but reset at the beginning of each turn. Damage wears off of creatures and this is just flavorfully you turning into a creature.

>> No.57206136

>>57205855
I don't disagree that reducing the complexity like they have was a good thing. I don't like that they're using the phrase "only do this at sorcery speed" or "creature you control" or "opponent controls" that make board states much less complex than they could be. Sometimes you just need to shoot your own creature at Instant and they don't let you do it now.

I don't believe their excuses or explanations for anything anymore. I'll admit their design space is limited and reaching peak potential soon; but that is because of the self-imposed restrictions they have on that space. The set skeleton is a fantastic tool if used properly but the only thing it does is create assembly-line sets and they're leaning on it hard to phone in pretty much every set. I feel like that wouldn't be a problem if they did risky shit. Unstable shows they could do something good with the game but won't like Naturalizable Contraptions. But instead they're focusing on garbage like Emblems and non-interaction elements like Planeswalkers and this new Blessing of the City garbage and even things like Monarch.

They're compensating for lack of meaningful mechanical development with art, writing, and bullshit we really don't care about. They're focusing on "what players think they want" instead of "good things that everyone should want". They're not focused on exploring new mental states anymore with new drugs; they're just making the same boring entry-level drugs.

I didn't like Protection or landwalk; it was too easy to use for a player and didn't take any thought; interactive cards like Deathmark and Flashfreeze were better color-worded-hate cards. Killing or bricking people with Protection or landwalk creatures is not satisfying or take any skill.

>> No.57206179
File: 108 KB, 223x311, Image.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206179

>>57206110
it's not the formating you mong

i just posted a fucking legendary fox monk that transforms into an enchantment that prevents combat damage

meanwhile with aftermath cards

>> No.57206212

>>57206136
>Killing or bricking people with Protection or landwalk creatures is not satisfying or take any skill.
hey merfolk is fun

>> No.57206230

>>57206179
We have legendary enchantments that flip into powerful and classic lands from magic in these two sets. Those are the splash. Also a fucking double digit trampler than can have its cost reduced very easily.

>> No.57206245

>>57206136
People are getting stupider.
>only do this at sorcery speed
You should see how much questions i got about 'can this counter target instant and sorcery spell card counter a skill with sorcery speed', or people trying to Dispel (counter target instant spell) a flash creature.

>> No.57206282

>>57199032
Well, Deeproot Waters merfolk deck?

>> No.57206310
File: 19 KB, 394x379, 1509061851715.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206310

>>57206230

>A DOUBOW DIBID TWAMPWA

>> No.57206318

>>57206230
Yeah the transform lands are actually really neat, but fucking please a 12/12 trampler is not exciting.

Now the enchantment lands are what, 0.3% of the entire set? Go browse Kamigawa and Ixalan side-by-side and tell me which set at least tried to be more creative. Shit not just Kamigawa, compare it to Mirrodin or Coldsnap or fucking anything.

>> No.57206321
File: 30 KB, 500x500, My hoys are a bit different.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206321

>>57206282
I like the way you think

>> No.57206328

>>57206245
Those are both reasonable new player questions as players learn what terms mean and stuff. If it's a newer player asking me about countering an ability with a Dispel, I'm inclined to be nice and explain why that's a no-go. If it's a dude who's been playing for two years, I'm gonna insult him with image macros. I think that's reasonable all around.

>> No.57206330

>>57206230
they're good but the dual colors might push them into the unplayable zone.

>> No.57206402

>>57206321
Get yer one and two cmc uncommon merforks boys, cuz they're going 5 dollahs in a month.

>> No.57206423

>>57206212
Merfolk is proactive with its landwalk through the use of Spreading Seas, which is acceptable. I'm talking about reactive landwalk or protection stopping decks cold especially in Limited. The pro-Red Merfolk guy is especially not okay. There were too many games where I killed people with Couriers in Scars draft. Too many, it was an unacceptable result in a draft format that was dogshit to begin with.

>>57206245
People were always that stupid. They were never taught correctly so they taught another generation of people who weren't taught correctly. The only thing keeping this game in check were the people who took the time and care to explain things properly AND the people who appreciated doing things properly to learn well.

The problem is that Wizards has depended on good teachers at every store to enforce the structure of the game in the absence of their personal effort. The neglect of the Judge Program to me is symbolic of how much they don't care and so to express their independence of dedicated players Wizards has just made things fuck-up proof - specifically text that does not require understanding of the rules to understand their function. Teachers need incentive to play too and they've made it very hard for teachers to say the "right" thing about the game. If a new player asks for "what to play" the teacher shouldn't have to start with, "depends on your budget". The teacher shouldn't have to shit on every single product sitting on the shelf to give the honest answer that, "the cards you want aren't here, you have to order them online, thus fucking the store". The store owner teacher shouldn't have to push crap product.

Most players are just drug pushers now, just telling you all the good things about the game while ignoring the side effects. The fact that the side effects and bullshit are so much more prominent now is all the worse. It's the system and customers Wizards wants, addicts and the pushers.

>> No.57206425

>>57202461
I love how this card is fucking impossible to deal with outside of Black and White. 10/10 good design.

>> No.57206490

>>57206318
So what gives you the all powerful will to decide what is or is not exciting?

>> No.57206523

>>57206318
There werent that many flip cards in Kamigawa.

Also you are way underestimsting the deck builsing ask of Ghalta. We have people left and right speculating how best to drop this thing in standard or commander or whatever. Thats the sign of a very good design. The cost reduction is a big aspect of the card. The 12/12 is your reward for figuring out best to its cost the fastest. Its a very splashy card. Id say you dont know jack shit if you need shit like kamigawa flip cards, which werent even well executed, to make you think.

>> No.57206536
File: 24 KB, 224x216, 1494841271940.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206536

>>57206425
Yeah man, standard can't do shit on this one.
>Blue
Counterspell, remand, tapping
>Green
It just has the worst creature removal ever deal with it
>Red
Soulscar mage&bolts, hijack into fling

>> No.57206574

>>57206061
we got the flip lands, we had the aftermath cards last set, vehicles before that.
I don't know, maybe they aren't as out there anymore with their designs,but they do keep innovating.
Plus we just had an un-set and depending on how people reacted to the stuff in there, we may get some of it in black border.

>> No.57206592

>>57189069
>playable

>> No.57206629

>>57206061
didn't we get meld cards this year? That seems pretty out there.

>> No.57206646

>>57206425
But anon, it's a game design slam dunk, didn't you read the thread?

>> No.57206701

>>57206136
Honestly, I can understand most of the 'do this at sorcery speed' stuff. Most of it.
When it's emulating things like casting a creature or other thing that you only play on your turn? It makes sense there, otherwise you're giving it free flash on top of that. The same can be said of some abilities that are supposed to emulate sorceries specifically (that whale that picks up the board, anything involving activated discard or wraths)
But yeah, they've been slapping it on things a bit too much where it's not necessary. There's 250 cards in Modern that have the text 'only as a sorcery'. 88 are Equipment, 1 is Darksteel Garrision - which leaves 161 plus false positives with that specific version of the restriction.

>> No.57206743
File: 953 KB, 330x300, 1506034651466.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206743

>>57206423
>>57206136

Fucking This. I stopped buying boosters most of the time and i feel much better now. i have a nearly empty trade binder because i only buy cards to go into my deck.

>> No.57206747

Reminder that sorcery speed often increases skillful decision making while instant can decrease it

>> No.57206777
File: 145 KB, 223x311, soul_scar.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57206777

>>57199441
wait this doesn't say fight, and you deal the damage first. Does that mean with soul scar mage that you can destroy it and take no damage?

>> No.57206795

>>57206777
by it, I mean the creature you are targeting.

>> No.57206816

>>57206777
No both deals damage at the same time.

>> No.57206826

So where's the vampire monument deck support?

Is Saint Elenda going to be the jank 7CMC Legend to follow in Vona's footsteps?

Adrian Adanto when?

>> No.57206835

>>57206777
Still dealing damage at the same time, despite it not being the fight keyword action. It would have to be 'You deal 15 damage to target creature. That creature deals damage equal to its power to you." to work that way -see Tahngarth for example.

>> No.57206843

>>57206826
I dunno man. vampires were the only cool things i got out of ixalan and it seems that, just like me and my necrons, i bet on the least popular and supported horse.

>> No.57206889

>>57206843
>the only playable tribe out of Ixalan
>least supported
I mean try as they may, Wizards failed in making the conquistator's ineffectual in the gameplay. Mono White Vampires is actually legit.

>> No.57206946

>>57206889
You should know that tg is filled with closet timmies. They bash and diss giant creatures but they immediately deemed tribes without giant creatures useless.

>> No.57207097

>>57206946
to be fair, while vampires are the most played cards, they don't really go into vampire synergy decks.

>> No.57207111

>>57200995
Are you implying this won't see play in energy decks?

>> No.57207123

>>57206946
>>57206889
well i never said i wasnt a timmy. christ i have +1/+1 tribal EDH deck and a casual eldrazi tribal deck (think eldrazis mixed with every artifact tribal thingy). then again with stuff like level up+proliferate and Defender Tribal im a bit johnny sometimes.

Either way, i quite like vampires but i had no idea they were competitively viable in standard. All i heard was energy this and ramunap red that. I do have a pretty killer BW vampire attrition deck http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/living-the-vampire-life/

>> No.57207323

>>57206946
I don't subscribe to Wizards stupid classification of psychographics. That is for THEM to use to categorize us for their design purposes. For all intents and purposes the label of "Timmy" is no different than "people who are offended by attractive art/characters" or "people who play Red".

For players there should only be two categorizations, "People who want to learn everything about Magic" and "People who don't". Retards who restrict themselves by Wizards stupid categorizations like Merfolk or color or political views in Magic are useless tribal-minded people who are functionally useless or even regressive to the well being of the game.

>> No.57207329

>>57207097
There wasnt that much vampire tribal in the set yo begin with. Merfolk and vampired gotbkess dedocated tribal because of how the set was divvied up tribally, and those two were the tribws with plenty of existing tribal. Vampires mechanically though were a weenie/token deck with a lifegain subtheme.

>> No.57207354

>>57207323
t. Literally Spike

>> No.57207365

>>57207323
Hi, Spike.

>> No.57207376

>>57207323
I'm sure there's a few more buzzwords you could have used here, bud.

>> No.57207671

>>57201477
Gotta tap the enchant to use the second effect m80

>> No.57208038

>>57207671
It IS a land. Play a third land as your land for the turn, enchant STE with the aura, sac STE (four lands), STE comes back and aura comes back flipped (five lands), sac STE again (six lands)

>> No.57208340
File: 33 KB, 265x370, elenda.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57208340

>>57206826

>> No.57208391

>>57206061
Crazy shit is now delegated to unsets only, sorry.

>> No.57208394

>>57208340
Wew thats bad. Cool dream to imagine but man its bad.

>> No.57208397
File: 45 KB, 221x228, file.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57208397

>>57208340
>W/B knight

>> No.57208431

>>57208038
You can't tap it for mana and tap it for the effect, bruv.

>> No.57208473

>>57206423
christ. i was on the fence before, but this just killed the game for me. The magic is gone.

>> No.57208491

>>57208340
Decent for hedging bets against board wipes. I'm actually quite okay with this. She likes Yahenni, too.

>> No.57208571

>>57208491
This doesnt help with board wipes unless you also have a sac outlet at the time to sac everything in response. She also doesnt worknas a commander so shes relegated to the 99. She does work well with yahenni though i guess. At least that explains why they put a costless sac effect in standard.

>> No.57208633
File: 33 KB, 339x425, fonzie.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
57208633

>>57208571
Hey man, if you keep telling people she's bad, she'll be cheap on release and I can pick her up for my deck.

>> No.57208653

>>57208340
VOSOTROS

>> No.57208664

>>57208633
Pretty sure I never refered to her as "bad" in my post. She actually combos off in commander like breya. She just doesnt work as a board wipe protection there very well.

>> No.57208885

>>57208340
4 mana Doomed Traveller.

>> No.57208921

>>57208394
Sac outlets

>> No.57208946

>>57208431

No, but it returns Sakura Tribe Elder to play before it transforms.

>> No.57209009

>>57208921
Whoa, looks like we have a regular genius over here. Now I wonder if you can use those brains to find out if theres something better to do than make a bunch of 1/1 lifelinking tokens by saccing real creatures besides in the very niche situation where you have her, some creatures, a sac outlet, and the opponent board wipes you.

>> No.57209077

>>57209009
Yes, if only there was a vampire which was exactly what we're looking for here...

>> No.57209089

>>57208340
Rather meh.

>> No.57209111

>>57209077
If you thought the missing link or problem there was the lack of a sac outlet to play with, you are one dumb fuck.

>> No.57209125

>>57208664
She's an aristocrats card. But aristocrats isn't really a vampire thing either in Standard or Commander. So she feels like she doesn't do anyhing until you forget she's a vampire and drop her in Teysa or Ghave instead.

>> No.57209209

>>57209125
Vampires were kind of aristocraty in Dark Adcensi9n but yeah. Obviously her vampireness is not the point of the design. They really underpushed the lofegain them they had in Ixalan. Their whole gimmick was life payment as a cosy padded by lifegain which is pretty cool but they didnt make very many cards with it, much less one that also was a tribal guy for commander.

>> No.57209304

>>57208340
>>57208340
>all these people who don't understand magic at all
Are you fucked? This is another perfect combo piece for my ghave deck. This, Hardened Scales, Ghave and Ashnods is infinite lifelink vampire tokens. Swap the scales for blood artist/altar of the brood, and the game's over folks.

>> No.57209335

>>57209209
Blood Artist and Viscera Seer are the basis of Aristocrats with Falkenrath Aristocrat being an on and off finisher. But them being vampires never mattered.

Vampires in Standard are Wb Weenie and vampires in Commander are Aggro Swarm. She really doesn't fit either, Specially when the prime mass removal in Standard right now exiles rather than destroy.

>> No.57209372

>>57209304
>this goes perfect in my commander deck!
And
>This combos with Ghave!
I've almost got bingo, got anything else for me?

>> No.57209449

>>57208340
She could be a frail but potent Voltron/Control commander. Just let her die and send her to the Command Zone from ther grave with Mistveil Plains. Make the whole deck discard, removal, hate and pumps.

>> No.57209469

>>57209372
>this goes perfect in my X deck
I feel like this statement is the pinnacle of Magic player self-importance, it's like the middle square of your bingo card. Regarding cards that are bad for the game or just bad in general the people who actually say things like this wholly ignore how other players have to interact with it.

It's like saying, "it's good for me, how could it be bad?" or the opposite, "it's bad for me, why is it good?".

People just can't separate what they like/dislike from what is good/bad when any mix of the two is possible. When people say something is utter dogshit that's probably a fairly objective statement but the people who like it won't admit that and take it as a personal slight against a card they like but can't realize sucks.

>> No.57209494

>>57209335
She was clearly meant to be anti board wipe for the weenie deck. How good she is in that role, probably not very.

>> No.57209543

>>57209469
To be fair, the latter (its bad for me how ould it be good?) is probably a bigger problem/more prevalent.

>> No.57209544

>>57209494
>>57208491
I don't get this anti board wipe thing.

>> No.57209584

>>57209544
The plan is probably for you to sac/attack aggressively/kill their stuff to build her up, then when they try to deal with your board she discourages it. But theres a lot of flaws and it very roundabout.

>> No.57209606

>>57209544
In Magic ChristsmassLand you have her and Yahenni out at the same time and sac your shit with Yahenni in response to Fumigate/Sweltering Suns.

In reality your shit will dissapear in a Settle the Wreckage and you'll be left with a 1/1 for 4.

If Bloodthrone Vampire and/or Viscera Seer get reprinted things change a little.

>> No.57209653

>>57209584
>>57209606
>don't kill my vamps before t4 bro
Yeah a huge flaw. I can maybe see casting her after t3 Mavren but that's not anti board wipe, more like continuation of beating.

>> No.57209749

>>57209543
They're both problems.

When I was starting there was a guy who told me Lightning Bolt was bad and he didn't like it, half of which is contrary to the fact that it's a really good card. And this was Jund right? So when Bolts were repeatedly thrown at his shit Bant creatures he didn't understand. And he STILL didn't understand when I told him to play Rhox War Monk but he wouldn't cut a Rare/Mythic for a measly uncommon.

There's a poison in the brains of Magic players. People in general. Nobody wants to communicate both in objective and emotional terms so instead they constantly misinterpret one for the other. If I say my deck is a piece of shit garbage but I like it it just baffles some people. Or when I say I hate a deck but am playing it because it's really good, it doesn't make sense to them either.

It's why we can't talk about Magic very well. People make objective statements and people get all fucking emotional about it. A shit card is a shit card; liking it has nothing to do with that fact. I love tonnes of shit cards but you have to call it for what it is.

>> No.57209825

>>57206425
You mean outside of green?

>> No.57209890

>>57208340
it's SHIT

>> No.57209955

>>57209749
New players (or maybe bad players?) often have a very different mindset.
Like when i was doing Amonkhet draft, a new guy came to me and asked me to look at his deck. He was playing Scribe of the Mindful (sac return instant/sorc from yard) with only 2 instant/sorc in his deck. It's my 3rd kill spell he said. When i explained why the Scribe is more suited if he have more instant/sorc he was like naw man, why would i play it if i have a shitload of spells already.

>> No.57209965

>>57208340
Not sure how good she'll be. I like that knight part though so I might grab a foil for the fun of it.

>> No.57209977

>>57208340
So this is the power of the Legion of Dusk............

>> No.57209999

>>57209955
New players I can forgive of any amount of retardation. I was retarded as a new player and said and believed a ton of shit.

The problem is that there's this horrible number of long-time players who seem to have an air of authority due to their age but fucking suck to an exceptional degree. I mean no new thought penetrates their brain. Their ignorance and habits are so inappropriate for their time in the game yet you see them mentoring players.

>> No.57210123

>>57209999
Yeah that's why i said new or bad.
Bad players never improve and still have a new player view of the game but they acted like they're good only because they played it longer.

>> No.57210219

>>57208340
>Actually decent Knight Commander never ever
I expected nothing and I'm still disappointed

>> No.57210788

>>57210123
I like those people on /tg/.
They make spoiler season a wonderful time, full of laughter and joy.

>> No.57210875

>>57210788
In real life it feels like you're trying to squeeze reason out of a stone.

>> No.57210916

>>57210875
Unfortunately, yes. Thus the 'on /tg/' qualifier.

>> No.57210960

>>57199441
How come there's one of these 4RR Bags of Shit every set for the past few years?
If red isn't allowed to have good enchantments, stop printing them and pretending that the color pie is balanced.

>> No.57211089

>>57210960
Because MaRo really wishes R didn't exist despite claiming he's an "UR Mage" at heart.

>> No.57211126

>>57211089
He's still mad about Sligh causing the game to no longer regularly go to turn 20 on a proffessional level

>> No.57211145

>>57211126
Sauce on that? I know you're probably exaggerating, but I wouldn't be surprised if that was true.

>> No.57211167

>>57211145
My ass

>>
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