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[ERROR] No.43306135 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

How do you make an immortal character interesting while at the same time not over powered?

>> No.43306156

>>43306135
Make his immortality costly, painful, and crippling. You're going to live forever, no matter what, but if you keep fucking up, you're going to be splinters flying across the galaxy howling in agony and insanity.

And then that's how you make a sterotypical immortal villain.

>> No.43306170

>>43306135
Immortal but not indestructible. Has to avoid getting shot, run over, or sick because while he is young forever, he's still perfectly mortal in every other way.

>> No.43306215

>>43306135

You might be impossible to kill, but that doesn't mean you can't be wounded and put out of commission for a considerable time.

If I were doing it I'd say he has technical immortality, but if he suffers damage that would kill a mortal member of his kind he has to spend a month (at least) in a kind of healing coma, or in a pocket afterlife dimension from which he reincarnates, or something.

>> No.43306225

Immortal is not invulnerable. If you take damage normally and regenerate from apparent death in several days, I wouldn't call that overpowered as long as the other PCs get something special too.

>> No.43306235

Eternal youth, but not unkillable.

Raz Al ghul style

>> No.43306255

>>43306135
If you mean immortal and invincible, just don't make him omnipotent. Its just that simple. It doesn't matter if you'll always survive if you can't get everything you want.

>> No.43306291

>>43306135
Everytime he dies he loses some memories.
On Topic the game Lost Odyssey while being kinda shitty did a good job on using him remembering stuff from his past to tell minor stories, so maybe check it out.

>> No.43306367

>>43306135

He made a pact with the devil for his immortality. Whenever he suffers a fatal injury, a dozen little demons pop out of a portal and rape him in the ass. When they're done his injuries are healed.

>> No.43306437

>>43306135

I once had an immortal character whose schtick was the whole "cursed to see those around you die" thing, so whenever he slept it was for years at a time unless physically roused; his wounds reset during that time and the same thing happened when he would have been "killed". He'd been doing this since the American Revolution and was relatively well adjusted to the modern world because the stimulants he needed to stay awake and functional for long periods of time got easier to come by; he actually missed out a whole mess of time in the 18th and 19th centuries and only started being able to operate for long periods of time when drugs like meth and speed really started hitting the market. He was most of the time off of his head on every upper he could get his hands on, going on binges until he crashed and needed to be basically electro-shocked back awake.

He was your typical super-skilled immortal, but actually physically kind of shitty because he was constantly wracked with sleep deprivation and the side-effect of the cocktail of uppers that was keeping him going.

>> No.43306451

>>43306135
You ever play Dark Souls?

>> No.43306531

>>43306135
It's really not that hard. He can be immortal and invincible, but he just doesn't get to be as powerful as other characters. He can still feel pain. He may or may not be immune to disease. If there's magic in your setting, you could have all his latent magical ability directed to preserving his health.

Give him some critical weakness that can be worked around. Check out Mnemosyne, it's got a some of these elements of immortality to keep the characters interesting but normal-powered.

http://myanimelist.net/anime/3342/Mnemosyne:_Mnemosyne_no_Musume-tachi

The Rising Stars comic also has an invulnerable guy (Peter Dawson) in the first part get killed. It's not immortality, but it's an example of how you could make a normally invulnerable character still vulnerable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rising_Stars_%28comics%29

>> No.43306536

From the "Overman" books (I think one was called "The book of silence" - consider the plight of the wizard/lich charater. He's sort of an immortal, but actually still ages. Fell down a mountain once, broke numerous bones and had to crawl for years to get back to civilization (100 broken bones and bleeding a lot - takes a bunch of time to heal naturally. Still needs food and water, body just won't actually die.
Immortal can mean other things too - some RPGs have elves as immortal (no age after a certain point), but they can be killed.
Immortal doesn't mean it doesn't hurt, it means it hurts a lot. Losing family, losing whole nations of people and cultures hurts too. Recommend this kind of thing for experienced players.

>> No.43306569

>>43306135
Previous game I ran had an immortal BBEG.

Here's what I did:

He had been around for a long time. He was one of the first humans. He wasn't invincible, but he did regenerate. In fact, when the party found him he had been trapped in rockslide for 3 months. He was emaciated and had chewed off his finger repeatedly to stave off hunger pangs.

He had experienced everything life had to offer. Its highs and lows. He had been through unimaginable torment and tasted every delicacy. He had loved deeply and stood vigil over entire cultures.

He had mastered more fight styles than they had ever heard of, he had forgotten more history and magics than they could ever hope to know.

There simply wasn't anything left for him in life, and he wanted to die. To do that he would have to take the whole world with him.

He was powerful, but not omnipotent. He was very resourceful, but not omniscient. He couldn't relate to mortals anymore, but he wasn't malevolent.

>> No.43306580

>>43306135
By Fire and By Iron

>> No.43306590

>>43306135
Your race were the chosen ones, perfection incarnate and made to serve as stewards of the world, the vassals of the Archangels. But they failed. You were not there to see the great failure of your race in person as you were born long after, but you feel the burden of the failure of your race on your soul. By the failure of your race the world has grown permanently corrupted, permanently diverted from the vision the Creator God held.

And then you see them fail again, but this time as your own fault. While damnation may fall truly on another, you -could- have done something to save the world, countless lives, and permanently purge all evil from the face of the world. You could have tackled him, dragged him into the fire with you and destroyed the great enemy once and for all, but you cared or respected him too much. Your emotions held you back, and for that now tens of thousands of people are dying to the endless hordes of the Great Enemy returned due to your reluctance to do the duty your people was forged for. You will know only guilt for eternity, and will only find solace in the creation of the next world.

>> No.43306592

>>43306135
The body may be eternal, but the mind is not so lucky. After a century or two it's just some blurred or missing memories, can't remember what your home town was like. Then those few scattered memories multiplied. At times even your conscious thought is hard to keep track of. You become extremely reliant on routines, patterns, anything to help focus on and give you a sense of consistency in your life.

Have them be extremely obsessed or fixated on certain things. An old, worn-down ring that they habitually rub every once in a while. Extremely protective of a large trunk of journals, the oldest of which are fraying or decaying.

Also, like everybody else is saying, they can still be hurt just as badly as anybody else.

>> No.43306644

>>43306536
>lich
I'm pretty sure liches can take any kind of beating short of Terminator 1 death scene. Even in the shitty DnD (where an average person has 4-12 HP) liches have DR 15, which is a lot.

Liches are actually pretty good immortal antagonists, because there's always a reason why they become immortal, and they're not overpowered, just really powerful. And even if the party can't find lich's phylactery, a few centuries inside the cemented pit would probably change his disposition.

>> No.43306697

>>43306592
So basically, immortality turns you autistic?
Sounds like it could be very interesting.

>> No.43306729

>>43306590
In Tolkien, Elves were actually considered (by the Valar) to be the unlucky ones, as they were bound to Arda and not gifted with death. They would remain on Arda for all time, whereas humans could die, and perhaps be brought to live with Iluvitar.

>> No.43306781

>>43306135
A world full of immortal characters whose most prized possessions is their memories, basically. As they age they'll extract out some of their memories and seal them away in magical objects, books, etc and keep them well-hidden as a way of preserving who they are.

In turn the most valuable objects are memories, and to gain access to an immortals library is to gain incredible power. Said immortals may also trade memories for objects of power, or other memories for either sentimental purposes or practical ones.

>> No.43306834

>>43306697
Just take a look at an elderly person with Alzheimer's. Their body may be perfectly fine but their mind can't keep up with the constant mass of information being thrown at them. They forget things.

In the Syfy show Alphas, there was an immortal who lead a terrorist/supremacist group of superhumans. He had been alive since before the American Civil War. There was another superhuman who could hold people's memories, and he relied on this person to keep his memories and his history because he was starting to forget.

I got the idea of the attachment to certain items and patterns because people with OCD will use those things to keep anxiety away. It's comforting for them and older people will often reminisce about certain associated memories with a certain item.

>> No.43306873

>>43306135
Being immortal has its ups and downs.
On the one hand, there will ALWAYS be new things to experience, new skills to master, et cetera.
On the other hand, all your mortal friends and loved ones will eventually die on you. And you're stuck watching it happen.

>> No.43306879

>>43306135
The thing which comes to mind is a series of books by Max Gladstone.

Basically, it's the modern-ish fantasy where gods are real, but must abide by certain laws. The Craftsmen are basically mage-lawyers that can sweet-talk the universe into believing that something they wish is true, but they waste their own "soulstuff" in the process. That's why there's whole soulstuff economy going on (you can lose your soul at the game of cards, for example), and law firms are the most powerful organizations. Strong lawyers can actually "shed the flesh" and use their lawyering skills to tell the death to fuck off, thus becoming immortal. They still have much to lose though.

>> No.43306900

Immortality isn't overpowered just because you cant die doesn't mean steamroll through an adventure. You can still be captured or stalled or otherwise prevented from completing your objective.

>> No.43307177

>>43306135
Forgetful

The human mind has a limited capacity in terms of memory. The Immortal has no control over what his mind will choose to save or forget. He could easily recite you a stanza of a long forgotten war poem, or sketch out the battle lines of the battle of Marathon, but don't ask him for the name of his first born child. As a result the Character is terrified of learning new things as every single new scrape of information could mean the loss of something truly precious. He has taken up writing down his memorise to counter this of course, but not only did he start this well after his memories began to be destroyed but books by their very nature are easy to destroy. The character would react nigh-psychotically to any sort of threat to them as the loss of a page could mean anything as insignificant as a road trip, to the birth of one of his children. This allows for a myriad of story elements to be introduced such as descendants, old foes, and riddles only he knew the answer to but has long forgotten. While at the same time instilling severe weaknesses in the character.

>> No.43307196

>>43306135
Allow him to be killed just like any other human, but have him 'respawn' periodically.

>> No.43307212

>>43306291
Represented by him losing a significant Chunk of XP. Which explains why he's level 1

>> No.43307271

>>43306135
Immortality works like this for me: You are fully capable of dying and when you do you resurrect yourself and in doing so wake up with a new personality and no memories of your past life. You are trained by the your past incarnations through your dreams but because of how limited their means of training is the process is slow.

>> No.43307351

>>43306135
There are many things worse than death. He might be immortal, but nothing he cares for in life is.
Immortal is not all-powerful. Maybe the Dark Lord can never put the hero down for good, but that alone does nothing to actually stop the Dark Lord. Survival is a cold comfort when he watches the city he failed to save burn.

The only way he can be truly safe from this pain is to care nothing for anything. And if that becomes the case, he faces either an eternity of misery alone, or enlightenment.

>> No.43307364

>>43306135
Make your character kinda like Groot: you're functionally immortal, but your body can still die, you'll just reincarnate like a Phoenix.

It'll also be painful as hell and take a while to do.

>> No.43307393

>>43307271
That's not immortality, that's just ancestor ghosts. The root of personality is person. If the personality changes utterly, the person is dead.

>> No.43307431

>>43306135
immortal but not invulnerable but make their immortality a condition of his employment to a much more powerful being like a god or demon ect. if the players can make him look like a incompetent moron to his boss and he gets fired and losses the perks.

>> No.43307439

>>43307393
>theShipofTheseus?WhatMockeryisThis?.jpg

>> No.43307502

>>43307439
>Ship of Theseus

>>43307271
>wake up with a new personality and no memories of your past life.

A person is a personality given context by memory. If you come back with neither, you haven't come back. Instead, a stranger was born.

>> No.43307505

>>43307393
What if the memories remain but the personality changes.

>> No.43307569

>>43307505
Most of the time, that's also death. It just leaves a very confused stranger behind. You can see it after sometimes if traumatic brain injury has caused a personality shift. It's not pretty.

>>43307439
Isn't the whole point of that thought experiment that the ship is replaced piecemeal with identical parts? This situation is more like tossing the whole ship at once and replacing it with a fiberglass flyfishing boat.

>> No.43307578

>>43306225
Does it apply even if you're turned to dust? Or what?

>> No.43307602

>>43306592
But the mind comes from the body does it not? It should be repaired as well in that case.

>> No.43307685

>>43307602
Define "repaired." Amnesia is a defect, right? So memories should be preserved.
But dementia is also a defect, so memories need to be pruned before the brain chokes up.

It's a catch-22. You can't fix something that's simply reached the limits of it's specs.

>> No.43307843

>>43307602
You can only regenerate so much. And cells, even brain cells, can only survive for so long before they are worn out.

For example, Wolverine can regenerate completely provided that a single cell survives. However he can't completely regenerate brain cells because each one is uniquely formed by a unique experience, so he can't perfectly reform his mind after nearly being obliterated. He can get the basics pretty easily but it's not a perfect process. That's why in pretty much every story Wolverine cannot remember who he actually is.

>> No.43307886 [DELETED] 

>>43307177
most retarded thing I've ever heard kill yourself

>> No.43307905

You know, even invulnerability isn't such a big deal. Ultimately it is only one guy. How many people can, say, one immortal swordsman really take out at a time without them exhausting/entrapping him? One on one you should run away, but two or three people could probably restrain him without getting hurt.

or, you know, distract him. Pic related kind of proves how easy that can be.

>> No.43307932

>>43306135
He cannot die by natural causes. Mundane diseases and old age won't kill him. Being stabbed, cursed and stuff like that will kill him, he's not invincible

>> No.43307944

>>43306135
Immortal does not mean they're unbeatable. Or even particularly tough for that matter. Even if they're completely immune to damage, it doesn't mean they can't be overpowered or incapacitated.

>> No.43308007

>>43307271
Thats not immortality thats Americans not realizing that in Europe each country has a look and everyone looks like it.

Its not on the level of creepy clones, but on the level of how cousins and siblings look like their parents aunts uncles etc. America has people from everywhere else its rather shocking to go to small town Finland and the variation in facial structure is so limited.

>> No.43308098

>>43306879
>certain laws
Mind explaining about them? It seems to be an important part to how they play in the world.

>> No.43308211

>>43307578
That depends on what kind of immortality OP had in mind, but since OP is a faggot who never gives context, we will never know.
If you stop being immortal when your body is in small enough pieces, then being turned to dust would be fatal.
If you absolutely can't die, then it just takes a lot longer to regenerate. Your spirit pulls in loose atoms from the air and ground until you can make a new body.
Don't ask me, ask OP to define immortality.

>> No.43308235

>>43306170
Alternatively he is invincible, but he doesn't have eternal youth.
He goes around like some cross between a malnourished elephant and a flattened toad, throwing out his back and constantly complaining about his aches and pains.

>> No.43308282

>>43308211
>Don't ask me, ask OP to define immortality.

I specifically didn't define what I mean by immortal so people would make their own assumptions and I would get a variety of ideas.

>> No.43308305

>>43308282
Cell regenerating immortality. Anyone enjoy that?

>> No.43308343

>>43306135
Can you clarify what kind of character you want this immortal to be? Is it a player character, a protagonist in a story, a side character, a villain, or a ruler?

It seems like having a role for them should be the first step to determining how an immortal character should act or be treated in any story or game.

>> No.43308351

>>43308282
>so people would make their own assumptions
because that NEVER leads to misunderstandings nor infuriates people just so you put in less effort.

>> No.43308359

He's only immortal while awake. While he dreams he is mortal.

>> No.43308375

>>43308359
While that's interesting, what are the limits of his immortality?

>> No.43308383

>>43306135
By making him the man from earth

>> No.43308412

>>43308375
He can only be killed by the events he dreams about. IE dreams about falling you have to drop his ass off a cliff.

>> No.43308430

>>43306135
You give him challenges that only an immortal can handle. Villains that don't stay dead. Threats to humanity as a whole. Things of that nature. Any interactions with mortals are a) part of the greater scheme of his battle, or b) to help him stay sharp until his big threats appear and remind him why he keeps fighting.

It's like the purpose of the Winter Court in the Dresden Files. Your mortal PCs are on the inside, holding the world together, while the Winter Fae keep the Outsiders away. They occasionally rotate back to earth and all the Realms in between for RnR, just so they remember what they're protecting.

It's a little Mary Sue-ish, but also a compelling reason for them to be doing ANYTHING.

>> No.43308878

>>43306135
Have immortality provide experience, not power.

>> No.43308966

>>43306729
The only reason death was feared is because Melkor and his ilk spread the idea of death being a horrible thing that is an evil cast on mortal man, rather than the unknown gift of Eru.

>> No.43309034

>>43306135

After a while, his memory of events becomes so poor that he can barely recall a few days ago. He may not even remember he is immortal, merely an improbably skilled 30something year old who can barely remember his name.

>> No.43309201

>>43306225
This, and not be combat oriented. If dnd/pathfinder, play an NPC class. Anything else, keep your physical stats fairly low and don't put too many points into fighting things, so you're basically an immortal commoner.

>> No.43309206

>>43306135
Play Tenra Bansho Zero. You can still be knocked unconscious or fail, but if you never tick your one box of death damage, you can't die. (or, if you have Blade of the Immortal style blood worms ... you just can't die)

>> No.43309279

>>43306135
How indeed?

>> No.43309305

Complete physical immortality via reincarnation but each time he comes back a little less himself.

>> No.43309328

>>43309305
Reincarnation as a baby or what?

>> No.43309371

>>43306135
Power level has nothing to do with wether a character is interesting or not.

>American writers often say they find it difficult to write Superman. They say he’s too powerful; you can’t give him problems. But Superman is a metaphor. For me, Superman has the same problems we do, but on a Paul Bunyan scale. If Superman walks the dog, he walks it around the asteroid belt because it can fly in space. When Superman’s relatives visit, they come from the 31st century and bring some hellish monster conqueror from the future. But it’s still a story about your relatives visiting.

>> No.43309409

>>43309371
Well, to be honest, Superman is a pretty shitty example.

>> No.43309548

>>43309409
Such is the talk of the adolescent who can't appreciate the supergod of the working class.

>> No.43310333

>>43306135
an immortal that is reborn after each death at the beginning of his life, he only remembers his past and around one second into the future.

>> No.43310359

You can use your DNA to create younger clones of yourself that will have memory of all previous copies. Everything is of course fully mortal

>> No.43310360

>>43309371
None of those two premises sound interesting. Relatives visiting from the future and walking your dog around an asteroid belt are one-liners jokes that don't even make a story and if they did, would be on a "stupid american forced sitcom" way.

>> No.43310646

>>43310360
Those are merely examples to show you that Superman has exactly the same problems and fears as we all do, but on a different scale. He's also afraid of being rejected, of losing his loved ones, of dying. The normal complaint that he's too powerful to write interesting stories about is no than an admition to being an incompetent writer.

>> No.43310718

Could make him physically perfect but a mental mess. After thousands of years, seeing the worst kind of atrocities and everyone he knows die again and again, after seeing war after war, and mind destroying events hundreds of times, he is a shell shocked, half mad, isolationist shut in who dislikes being close to anyone, and has no interest in getting involved.

>> No.43310752

>>43306135
In body, he's immortal. His mind is tired, he has no reason to fight. The world he sees is grey.

Yeah, bleak.

>> No.43310764

>>43310752
In the same vein, he has stopped giving a shit. His physical condition is shit, atrophied beyond recovery. Can't die, though.

>> No.43310768

>>43306135
have him "respawn".
everytime he dies, he reforms at a specific place. the more he dies, the longer the " respawn time" becomes.
respawning is also costly; he loses something, like an arm, a spleen or backbone, and must go into a coma to regrow what was lost.

>> No.43310928

>>43306367
http://www.comicvine.com/suicide/4005-14770/
Sort of like this character's background, he wants to die but the guy he needs kill him won't do it. And the guy is like Spawn Wolverine, he can heal from pretty much anything but it hurts like hell. And he just wants to die but can't. Kind of sounds like a fun character to play but a bit edgy in concept.

>> No.43311150

>>43306135
I once did an immortal character, DM friend of mine needed a fleshed-out, semi autonomous pseudo-NPC, sort of a supporting character for a campaign he was running for some newer players.

Physically, he could be destroyed, had exceptional but not supernatural pain tolerance, and could regenerate from anything that might happen to him, though it may take a while. He'd been alive for a very long time, and though he didn't have the gibbering incompetence that extremely aged characters sometimes get, he did have an issue with memories: after a while, no matter what he does, they just fade away.

Now, what with everything from his past slowly being destroyed, all he has left of the vast majority of his past is his memories. And, so he feels, without his past, he wouldn't even be himself, a fate worse than death in his eyes. Hence his bargain.

Essentially, he went to a demon that was closely connected to why he was afflicted with immortality in the first place, and made a deal: this demon would save his memories at the moment they faded from his mind, making them freely accessible at any time, as if he'd never forgotten them. The catch: periodically, he would need to kill someone, sacrifice them to this demon, and then perform a ritual that would erase all memories and records of the sacrificed, except that he would remember everything about them in perfect detail.

This leads to a situation where he routinely commits what he believes is the worst thing you can do to someone in order to keep that same thing from happening to him. Also, he's lived for so long that many of the people he murders are probably his descendants, but that's a more minor thing.

>> No.43311172

>‘An elderly man was sitting alone on a dark path, right? He wasn’t certain of which direction to go, and he’d forgotten both where he was travelling to and who he was. He’d sat down for a moment to rest his weary legs, and suddenly looked up to see an elderly woman before him. She grinned toothlessly and with a cackle, spoke: “Now your *third* wish. What will it be?”

>“Third wish?” The man was baffled. “How can it be a third wish if I haven’t had a first and second wish?”

>“You’d had two wishes already,” the hag said, “but your second wish was for me to return everything to the way it was before you had made your first wish. That is why you remember nothing; because everything is the way it was before you made any wishes.” She cackled at the poor berk. “So it is that you have one wish left.”

>“All right,” said the man. “I don’t believe this; but there’s no harm in wishing. I wish to know who I am.”

>“Funny,” said the old woman as she granted his wish and disappeared forever. “That was your first wish.”’

>> No.43311226

>>43306135
>How do you make an immortal character interesting while at the same time not over powered?
So would you call this character's background interesting and not over powered or is he a bit too sue to fall into that category. He is a powerful warrior in CC but he can be killed if you do it right which kind of comes down to something like using field guns at distance to take him out but whatever.

>> No.43311332

>>43311172
so an immortal man found a djinn and with all his memory loss he wished to know who he was, knowing he wished to forget it all and then wished it back oh this is tragic

>> No.43311340

>>43306135
The way I create an immortals backstory is like this.

Think of a significant event in the past.
Roll a 1d6
If 1 to 5 he was not there at the time
If 6 he was around there at the time
Roll a 1d6
If you get a 6 again then he participated in the event.

Repeat for all the historical events that you can think of. Then build a character around what events he was there for and what events he took place in.

Usually works out well.

>> No.43311365

>>43311340
and if you never roll a 6 he was never present nor involved? heck thats some boring shit

>Old McDonald, The Eternal Farmer

>> No.43311383

>>43311365
Just because he was alive at the time doesn't mean he was there.

>> No.43311400

>>43311340
I think I might use this next time I need to make an immortal character

>> No.43311407

>>43311365
Well, it means that he basically participated in 2.72% of all world events. That's a big number.

>> No.43311409

My campaign is going to have an undying, essentially indestructible characters as the BBEG, except he's essentially powerless.

>> No.43311555

>>43310646
Ahahaha "I CAN SAVE EVERYONE!"

Sure there are good Superman stories out there, but saying "If you can't think of a way to make Superman interesting then you're a bad writer" is stupid and ignorant. People tell different stories and not every story is a Superman story.

Ultimately, when people want to read a Superman comic, they're there for the SUPER part. Sure you may enjoy Clark Kent as a character, but he isn't what got you there in the first place. Nobody got into Spiderman because "Hey he's a fucking nerd like me", they got into "Hey he swings on webs and is also a fucking nerd like me". I sure as hell wouldn't want to read a Superman comic where Superman is powerless and can't use his Superpowers to solve the big crisis. Is there a place for them? Absolutely, but they're not the norm and it's stupid of you to assume they are.

>> No.43311618

>>43311555
Honestly, people read comic books instead of actual books mostly because they're uneducated american niggers, and images are easier to comprehend, just as simplistic stories about powerful men in tights fighting crime.

Please, let's not talk about Superman anymore. He's not an example of good immortal character (and he's not even immortal, as far as I know).

>> No.43311690

>>43311555
All-Star Superman, where that page is from, is all about Superman being super and very little about Clark Kent. He's even more powerful throughout it than he normally is, being immune to kryptonite and several hundred times stronger than he normally is. It's considered one of the best, if not the best, Superman story ever told.

Birthright on the other hand, is also generally considered to be one of the best Superman stories, is almost entirely about Clark Kent and how he can do things that Superman can't - in fact throughout the entire climax of the story Superman IS powerless.

>>43311618
Oh please, Europe has a thriving market for comics as well.

>he's not even immortal, as far as I know
He pretty much is.

>> No.43311830

He should've destroyed the heart. Fuck trusting witches.

>> No.43311843

>>43306569
>wants to destroy the world
>not malevolent

>> No.43311911

>>43308007
Nothing wrong with the Finns. Global highest rate of AIDS immunity so there is something going on right there genetically.

>> No.43312103

>>43306135
Updated my journal

>> No.43312643

>>43306135
http://infinityblade.wikia.com/wiki/The_Deathless

The main character in this universe suffers from the consequences of his past actions. Despite his immortality he's unable to move on from the things he's caused that have thrown the world into utter misery. After a damascus conversion is forced upon him, he goes through hell to set everything right. Along the way he accidentally makes everything worse and has to deal with the consequences. The entire story revolves around just the fact that immortality itself corrupts people and has destroyed the world.

Throughout the course of the story he's repeatedly shot, dismembered, decapitated, incinerated, eaten, pretty much killed in every single horrible way you can imagine, and after having been bumped off, takes months or even years to just get back to where he was.

Immortality is only a good trait if it causes problems.

>> No.43312713

>>43309279
>not using the duo that transcends everything

>> No.43312842

At a certain power level in glorantha, immortality actively becomes a drawback. You can fight your trick or sneak your way out of the underworld if you're dangerous of clever or sneaky enough, but if you're immortal people can just chop you into bits and scatter then across the world.

>> No.43313142

>>43311226
Lucius seems pretty easy to deal with.
Kill him then kill yourself and have the body cremated.
Boom, no more body to posses

>> No.43313183

>>43311843
He didn't explicitly want too, it just was the only way to kill himself.

It's not like he hated people. They were just unfortunate collateral.

>> No.43313665

>>43313183
Once you view the entire world population as collateral, you're malevolent just by your display of extreme callousness

>> No.43314490

>>43313142
slaanesh just brings him back anyways. the take over the person you kill thing is just for funsies, not an actual restriction

>> No.43314523

>>43306135
>Ctrl + F
>"Squee"
>0 results

>> No.43314539

>>43312103
>not overpowered

>> No.43314631

>>43314490
Cheeky bastard

>> No.43314757

>>43308007
It's a joke mate.

>> No.43314832

>>43307393
>>43307502
I've never like the concept of immortality with no sort of consequences or sacrifice for that immortality.

>> No.43314854

>>43311690
Euro comics have depth, and aren't capeshit.

>> No.43314887

>>43313665
Malevolence implies intentional hatred and evil.

If some termites die because you cut down a tree, that doesn't make you malevolent.

>> No.43314907

>>43314887
>knows all kinds of wicked sick magic
>doesn't send himself to a pocket dimension then destroy that

>> No.43315607

South Park Kenny.

>> No.43315634

>>43314887
Termites aren't self-aware.

>> No.43316477

>>43314854
Americans are the only people who believe this. Not to mention that some of the best American capeshit is written by Europeans.

>> No.43316489

>>43311830
But it's Ygritte....

>> No.43316551

>>43306135
Option 1: He is a young immortal. In effect he is just a normal human being who in the future won't die of old age while others would
Option 2: He is not very driven. Sure he is 300 years old, but rather than honing his skills to become godlike he spent most of it carousing.
He is absolutely godlike in bar games, not so much in anything useful

>> No.43318856

>>43316477
Example?

>> No.43319119

>>43318856
Of what? That European comics are just as shallow, or that Europeans write the best American comics?

>> No.43320726

>>43306135
I made a guy for a super hero game who was fairly average, but every time he was killed he would come back with healed up wounds and shit. He was actually pretty shit in game but he survived the whole campaign unlike everyone else who had to make at least one other character.

>> No.43320832

>>43320726
How did he come back though?

>> No.43321719

>>43306291
Ehhhh, fuck off, Lost Odyssey was good.

Some cringe worthy moments, but I thought the short stories from his memories were heartbreaking. Game played well, too, with some great music. It's an underrated gem, really.

Immortality has been romanticized forever, but really has more drawbacks then it does advantages. I imagine someone who lives forever could only retain so much information, and would lose knowledge to gain knowledge, although not as binary as I make it sound.

He should be covered in scars if he fights, terrified of prisons or anything that could entrap him. While nothing could kill him, he feels pain, and while he can regenerate, its a painful, horrific process, and costs him greatly in power, knowledge, memories, etc.

It wouldn't be easy for someone who is immortal to also be powerful.

>> No.43324301

>>43319119
Not that person, but I wouldn't mind seeing examples of the latter situation.

>> No.43325897

>>43316489
If even Frodo backstabs you, no one can be trusted

>> No.43326263

>>43324301
Alan Moore and Grant Morrison are both European.

>> No.43326420

>>43306135
This may or may not work, depending on the alignment, temperament of the character in question, but here's an idea:
The character's immortality comes from the mortality of others. When the character is harmed/grows old, they can "feed" from a willing participant via ritual.

The participant must be knowledgeable of the intent of the ritual and willing to participate.

The character may heal any injuries and/or regress in age until they sufficiently healthy. The participant acquires all of these injuries and/or advances in age by an equal amount.

If the participant is already weak and/or old, acquiring these injuries and/or advancing sufficiently in age may kill the participant.

If the character is near death, whether from injury or old age, they are compelled to seek out a participant. They gain the ability to briefly influence a target's mind to make them willing to participate in the ritual, though this ability may be resisted by a target of sufficient will. The character is compelled to use this power if near death, whether from injury or old age, and no ordinarily willing participant can be found..

>> No.43326464

>>43306135
Senility. All the immortality in the world can't fix a brain with more shit to sort than it can handle.

>> No.43326470

I just make 'em smart with base stats

>> No.43326476

>>43326470
But stats include smartness.

>> No.43326526

>>43306135

Simple. People don't get especially smarter or more skilled from immortality. He's just a normal, if well-travelled, guy with a lot of existentially terrifying anecdotes.

> "This reminds of Verdun. Been a long time since I had to use a plug bayonet."
> "I always told Alexander he would come to a bad end. No patience at all, that man."
> "Hey, I haven't been here since...1834, was it? It was a lot cleaner then."

>> No.43326599

>>43326526
>retaining memories from that long ago

>> No.43326747

>>43306135
Put him on the Supreme Court.

Lifetime appointment, bitches.

>> No.43326830

>>43326599

You don't forget based on time, you forget based on impression.

He doesn't remember his first wife of 70 years well, but can still recall the poems of a certain french girl he had a whirlwind romance with back before WWI.

He's forgotten the dinner party he attended with Woodrow Wilson, but he'll never forget the one he had with Rasputin on a rather violent night.

>> No.43327235

>>43326830
But his perception of those events would change over time too. He might have glorified Alexander early on, especially when he declared himself the son of the Egyptian sun god, and it was only in later years, long after his death, that he truly undestood the scale of what Alexander was up against, his brashness, and his own flaws even as a brilliant commander.

>> No.43327278

>>43327235

And he would remember all the better for it.

We remember triumph, but nothing quite sticks as much as shame or regret. Broken monuments are far greater legacies than when they were whole.

>> No.43327412

My foray into immortality turned out to be interesting by being an utterly flawed character. He was a guitarist who sold his soul to be the best but somehow managed to burst out of Hell.

His heart no longer beat and he couldn't feel pain anymore but whatever hellish life drove his body still allowed him to feel and heal.

The most important part was that he never seemed to get the hang of being immortal. When the party got into shit and it was time for someone to go be brave he was very rarely the one to volunteer. At the end of the day he was just a semi-immortal guitarist who got good with a handful of things you could stave off demons with when they came to collect your soul.

It was this weird dichotomy between the fact that he absolutely was not meant to be the hero and every now and then he had to grit his teeth and deal with the fact that he was the immortal one. Sometimes the plane has three passengers, two parachutes, and you'd rather splint every single bone you have so you can stand upright again than land safely near your friend's corpse.

This being GURPS it was also worth noting that basically all of his points went into being immortal and awesome at metal so there were plenty of fights where he was just that guy trying desperately to help out with the knowledge that if he fucked up by being useless he'd be the only one to get back up.

>> No.43327879

>>43327278
>Immortal character
>has endless "Remember that time when I fucked up, did something incredibly embarrassing, or otherwise made a fool of myself" flashback moments
True hell on earth.

>> No.43327904

>>43326263
Neil Gaiman too, though Sandman barely touches the realm of DC's capes.

>> No.43327997

>>43306135

He is eternally stucked at a fixed mid/low level, cant become stronger no mater what

>> No.43328370

>>43327997
>his immortality has simply locked his body out of time
>if he takes damage at all, it just resets
Would be interesting if he also experiences short-term memory loss, if he's able to commit anything to memory in the first place.

>> No.43328438

>>43307905
While he might not personally kill all that many people, he has all the time he needs, and takes so little risk, to achieve his evil goals.
He can just keep trying to become UberHitler and there is not much you can do to stop him.

>> No.43328445

>>43308412
>Get wasted every night until you can't remember your dreams

Works for me

>> No.43328460

Make him a normal guy that just happens to be immortal.
What's with the tred of "the guy is immortal so he must be like super smart and powerful". Just a normal guy that happened to stumble upon immortality at some point for some reason.

>> No.43328470

>>43314490
This.

He was killed by a rubric swordsman before and because the dusbin didn't feel anything about it he wasn't possessed slaanesh bought him back anyway

>> No.43328474

>>43307905
>How many people can, say, one immortal swordsman really take out at a time without them exhausting/entrapping him?
Not sure aboud swordsmen but one man's kill record with a pistol is 7000 / month.

>> No.43328478

>>43328460
He isn't normal once he's immortal. That's why there's a trend of those.

>> No.43328513

>>43327904
He has written plenty of other comics that aren't Sandman, though. Like Marvel 1602.

>> No.43328526

He also needs to have a compelling reason for being immortal.

I remember the first time playing Kotor 2 and the justification for this guy tickled my fancy. That and the fact he doesn't heal completely and still feels all the pain these accumulated injuries cause him.

mostly he's just too fucking hateful/determined/prideful/ to die and you eventually kill him by making him calm down and doubt himself until he sees how futile his existence is. If you play as a girl it's easier because he thinks you're a qt3.14

>> No.43328571

>>43328478
Hence why I said "A normal guy that happens to be immortal".
Outside of the abnormality that is immortality make the guy be a completely normal adventurer, farmer, tavern-keeper, whatever. The "he is immortal so he is smart / evil / misanthrope / strong" trope is boring and most of the time poorly portrayed.
Not like OP is helping much by not being more specific about the kind of character that wants to make immortal.

>Did he actively (re)search immortality? What were his motivations? When did he achieve immortality?
Those are questions that if answered would help tailoring the character one way or another.

>> No.43328577

>>43314523

>> No.43329542

>>43327278
You know the more you recall something, the less accurate the memory gets. Everything would be exaggerated, details would be lost and added, eventually it'd just be flat out wrong. The human mind is really shitty at data storage.

>> No.43329639

One of my 'enemy' NPC is a old man that can't die and regenerate from any damage he receive
But he is still a old man, weak and with all the problems that comes with old age

>> No.43329997

>>43311618
I enjoy the pacing in comics. Some authors get stuck up their asses with purple prose and waste 20 pages to tell a page of story, comics put all of that in the illustrations which makes it easier to ignore if it doesn't interest you. Busting out a thesaurus every time you want to describe something isn't very impressive and adds little to a narrative. That being said I definitely still enjoy descriptive writing, I just can appreciate that comics have the ability to bypass it and offer a more direct presentation of a narrative on a first pass. If the story interests you enough you can go back and spend more time with the illustrations and develop an appreciation for the visual themes in the context of the narrative. Comics and novels are simply different ways of presenting a story, one being easier to consume in some aspects than the other does not make it inherently inferior. Not liking comics because you can't appreciate visual storytelling while insulting people for failing to appreciate writing is silly.

>> No.43330096

>>43308383
Are you referencing John Carter here?

>> No.43330181

>>43330096
He's probably referencing The Man From Earth, a film about an immortal guy that tells his friends about being immortal before fucking off to a new town.

>> No.43332460

>>43330181
was literally about to mention that film. Fucking awesome for such a simple concept and production.

OP should make the immortal just be unexplained. The guy wouldn't necessarily know if he was born that way. Maybe he was just a messed up genetic evolution that hasn't caught on with his kids if he had any.
He'd not be super super smart necessarily, as he'd have learned with the times - ie the cumulative knowledge of an age is as far as he can know, so he's never ahead of the curve with knowledge. And theres nothing to say he'd be super rich either. People get rich and go bankrupt in single lifetimes, imagine living for a few 1000 years...

>> No.43333827

>>43310646
That panel right there perfectly shows that zack snyder fundamentally doesn't understand superman.

>> No.43334483

>>43333827

There were some good things about the movie, and Henry Cavill made a great Superman (and a wonderfully smug asshole as Napoleon Solo), but yeah, there was a just a ton wrong with the movie.

>> No.43334624

>>43306135
Make the immortality simply immunity to death rather than injury, so the character can be hurt, feel pain etc as normal. They simply return to life after dying, or recover from injuries that would have been fatal.

Make the consequence of dying a long, painful period of regeneration, perhaps with memory loss or loss of abilities.

Most important of all give them a kryptonite. Some sort of hard counter unique to them.

>> No.43335729

>>43311555
>not every story is a Superman story.
That was never stated or even implied. What was stated was that power level is irrelevant to wether a character is interesting or not.

>> No.43335765

>>43334483
I'd say that this page does that even better, actually.

>> No.43335823

>>43314832

That's just you being mad-jealous of the people that can get immortality and you want it to be hollow as fuck.

>> No.43336331

>>43306135

>> No.43336485

>Quick storytime

Back when 3.5 was all shiny and new, I was allow to play (by a DM who was very tolerant of my teenage bullshit in retrospect) a character that just kept coming back like an Agent in the matrix, except slower.

The character itself was based on a Psychic Warrior, and the whole shtick was that he'd been pretty much reduced to nothing but a spirit by magical bullshit. He was barely sentient in this form, and did not enjoy it to say the least, so he found a being with a nice-empty mind, jumped in, and slowly took control. Then after a few months or years, he got killed again, and the process repeated. Who he possessed was semi-random, since he had very little control while in spirit form. He preferred hosts as close as possible to his personality and abilities, or ones that were just particularly weak willed if he'd been a spirit for too long. The last point meant he was rather prone to possessing children, and since he more or less permanently overwrote the mind of the possessee if he wasn't exorcised before taking full control, this made him a rather unpopular person.

All rather edgy, I know, but I was fifteen or so at the time, so forgive me my teenage angst driven character creation.

>> No.43336546

>>43335765
wtf is this?

>> No.43336557

>>43336485

Anyway, it was a pretty fun character to play mechanics-wise if nothing else. He was typically weaker than the other party members, but would still hang out on the front lines, so he died quite a few times. When that happened, sometime he'd be able to hop into a nearby enemy, or expendable friendly and things would immediately continue, other times he'd wander off and possess some random person, and the party would have to track him down and kidnap the confused possessee, or wait until he took control and joined them. After he rejoined the party, he'd then have to level his new body back up, and deal with the problems that come from taking over an unwilling host.

Over time the party streamlined and ethicalized the process a little by setting up a spirit catcher thingy for him to hang out in while they found a condemned criminal or bandit for him to take over, and sometimes they'd keep a few in cages as backup. Eventually though, there was party infighting, and when my psychic warrior died it turned out that the spirit catcher had been turned into a rather well-made trap. They wound up deciding to reinforce the trap a few times, then (because trying to figure out a way to permanently kill him was too much work) they opened a portal to Limbo and tossed him through.

Fun times.

>> No.43336632

>>43336546
A paladin.

>> No.43337041

>>43306135
Like this...

...though he wasnt really immortal... but it was a really good movie for me

>> No.43337317

>>43307439

Look, don't bring up shit you obviously do not understand.

The Ship of Theseus is the question about whether or not something taken apart piecemeal and replacing the parts with perfectly identical parts fashioned in the same perfectly identical way is the same meta-object as the original.

What he described has nothing to do with the Ship of Theseus, he basically decided to take the object in question, burn it down to it's component molecules, scatter those molecules to the winds except for a single one, and then constructing something entirely and completely new out of foreign materials and fashioned in entirely foreign methods in foreign lands and just having that single molecule left over be tossed in there willy-nilly.

Basically, he is retarded by trying to make that some method of "Immortality" and not simply ancestral imprinting - the person in question is fucking dead as a conceptual being given it no longer has conscious thought or even a shred of independent agency, and YOU are retarded for bringing up a philosophical paradox you do not understand.

>> No.43339971

>>43336331
good taste

>> No.43339978

>>43337041
The first half was pretty decent.

>> No.43340250

>>43337041
Really underrated IMO. Though the second part with him figuring out who he is and his connection to the Charlize Theron was done poorly, I really liked the premise and a lot of the execution. The part where he goes to prison was also very cool, as I don't think I've ever seen a superhero movie where that happens to the superhero knowingly, rather than their normal self by chance.

In general, still one of my favorite Superhero movies, and certainly my favorite one not strictly based on established settings or characters.

>> No.43340373

>>43306135
Mutants and Masterminds character I had

'The Ragdoll'
Nigh Unkillable but not Invulnerable.
He can't die even if you cut him to pieces.
In fact, he made his own super suit, not to protect him, but to keep himself in one piece while he does reckless things.

Immortality also doesn't mean you've got any other worthwhile powers. In a city full of people will eye lasers, super strength and teleknesis - being immortal but being an average human in stats means you're not the most useful in a fight.

>> No.43340383

Everyone seems to want to focus on the Immortal becoming senile/losing most of their memories as the "drawback" to being unkillable. That's fine, but I think the character is more interesting if they CAN remember everything and are simply just very tired/disturbed from all the shit they've seen.

Plus, the only side benefits from being immortal require some semi-permanent memory retention, mostly just speaking the majority of languages, having strong insight into many cultures, and just being a generally worldly and useful person.

Maybe I'm just a huge faggot, but I like the idea of playing a weary traveller with semi-PTSD who can travel to the ends of the world and still defend himself in court, and even if he goes to prison can just claw at the wall until it collapses.

>> No.43340460

>>43337041
He definitely was immortal. Several thousand years old as far as it was mentioned.

The key was that if he got back together with his partner they'd both lose their power, and essentially become human again, aging normally.

>> No.43340507

>>43306135
He is inmortal and that's it. No other powers.
And he suffers a lot because of this.

>> No.43340626

>>43306135
In contrast to the whole "immortality is a curse" thing the thread is going for, what if the character strives for it, but it has an upkeep?

Like, they found some potion that makes them immortal (any kind, take your pick. Regenerating, indestructible, respawning, etc), but they have to keep drinking the potion. It's difficult to get the ingredients and make the potion. They can live as long as they have access to the potion, but their desire consumes them, as they spend nearly every waking moment just working towards living another day to repeat the cycle.

>> No.43340667

>>43340507

angstfest is a sue quality all its own.

>> No.43340998

>>43306135
Had a character in a scifi game who reached physical immortality.

>Eternal youth
>Regenerating body
>Supercomputer brain

Their only weakness was getting catapulted into the sun. Which happened with the nemesis character of this PC.
They achieved true divinity when they reached metaphysical immortality then was eaten by a great old one
While he still KO'd at zero HP, he just didn't have any death-saves or whatnot.

>> No.43342298

>>43340250
>The part where he goes to prison was also very cool, as I don't think I've ever seen a superhero movie where that happens to the superhero knowingly, rather than their normal self by chance.
Thats one big part of why i like that move. He wasnt really a superhero. He was just a very powerful guy that would listen to others when they asked to help but since he wasnt really onto it he would turn everything into a mess. Doing more damage than what he should have prevented

>>43340460
>He definitely was immortal.
>if he got back together with his partner they'd both lose their power, and essentially become human again, aging normally.
Wich is why he isnt truly inmortal IMO. A truly immortal being has no way to truly die. He might be sliced into pieces. Or lose his body and create a new one while retaining his own essence. But he would never truly die and stop existing.

Still a good movie to me. Would watch it any weekend anf i hope that if hey make a sequel they make it greater. Like, he finds another inmortal that has turned evil and has to somehow find the inmortal's partner to get it close enough to weaken him/her or something like that

>> No.43342440

Immortality with upkeep. You're gonna need to consume something in order to maintain it, even if it takes AGES between your moments consuming it, but the longer you go without refreshing your immortal-ness, the more vulnerable and mortal you will become. A primary villain could be waylaid by simply having that resource be taken from him extensively long, or a protagonist could be in peril knowing that he COULD be immortal as long as that stuff is in his system, but he'll have various choices to make surrounding it.

>> No.43342854

Making a character who's generally immortal and can't die is pretty tricky, if anything I'd suggest make his flaws major without making them constant, because angst is dumb if you do it to death. Don't want to fall into "That Guy" categories. I'd suggest that you make something along the lines of envy being his biggest flaw, being an immortal means you're obviously incapable of having things regular people have. A loving relationship, children, so on and so forth. From there envy makes the character spread out into different trees; I.E angry because he can't. Hell, if you want, you can make him immortal, but still feel the pain of past injuries. Every time he fucks up he carries a past mistake with him physically.

>> No.43343295

I think we've all got the same basic idea - make them immortal, but not invulnerable. They can reconstitute themselves over time, but their real power is the knowledge and time towards applicable skills that this immortality has gained them.

They've had 800 years' more practice than you, son.

>> No.43345180

>>43306135
A) make it not without condition. ie, does not age, and may eventually heal from wounds (except loss of heart or brain).

b) make it have a cost: ie, upon death to be reborn a loved one must die, they would die from a twist in fate (ie final destination)

c) immortal =/= invulnerable and maybe they are just covered in scars, have lost whole limbs etc.

d) you might be immortal in the reincarnated sense, when you die you are reborn and throughout that persons life they slowly regain the memories of their past lives.

e) add a destiny factor. ie: you cannot die until the 7th son of the 7th son kills his own kin. Or you will not die until you face your greatest fear. Or until you've taught your final student his greatest lesson.

>> No.43345481

>>43306569
>had chewed off his finger repeatedly to stave off hunger pangs.

As someone who has just finished a survival ex and went 2 weeks without food, and then 2 more with very limited food I can tell you this would not happen. The pain from injury is nowhere near the hunger you feel.

Granted 2 weeks is nothing compared to 3 months but I have a hard time imagining it could change that much, especially if you knew you wouldn't die.

>> No.43345624

>>43345481
>2 weeks is nothing compared to 3 months
just refuted yourself. You can't even imagine what being that hungry does to you. If I may pun, it consumes you.

>> No.43346447

>>43306135
Chosen. Undead.

>> No.43346920

>>43306135
Make his immortality just "regeneration". He doesnt get cancer, doesnt get old, and his flesh slowly recovers while he is alive.
But if he dies, he is dead. His regeneration requires that he is alive.

>> No.43346946

TNO nigger.

>> No.43346991

>>43306135
Dark Souls style! Upon death, you awaken a new. But every time you do so, it chips away at your sanity. With enough deaths or the loss of purpose you become hollow, a shell of your former self. No will or purpose, simply a husk.

That would be an interesting NPC I would say. He is cursed with this immortality, but he must always try to be the hero (or the villain) to have a purpose in life. The PCs foil his evil plans or even exceed him in being good, making him obsolete. Maybe they even kill him a few times. But each time he returns as less. Soon he won't be able to speak very well, pay attention to things very long, or be the hero/baddie they always try to be...

>> No.43347031

>>43346991

>implying they didn't steal it straights from the Crucifixes in the Hyperion Cantos.

>> No.43347037

>>43347031
>implying it matters

>> No.43347093

>>43306834
In a recht episode of doctor who, there is a girl thats been alive for ninehundred years. She keeps this fuckhueg library with all her memories in diaries. She couldn't even remember her birth name. And She was indifferent to anything that happened, and did insane things just for the thrill. She essentally became bored with life and did not give a single fuck. Pretty good episode.

>> No.43347140

Your soul is cursed to migrate to a new body when you die.

You retain your levels, skills, feats, mind and personality but must roll up a new body to inhabit, including physical ability scores, random race, sex, and background. You must also recover your old body if you want your old gear, and have it refitted if necessary.

You displace the soul of the body's owner, and you don't know what happens to it. If your character is good, this should be upsetting.

>> No.43347173

Code Geass.

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