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39893269 No.39893269 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Has anyone ever come across a GitS RPG? The only one I've ever come across is a shitty d20 game. If not do you know a system outside of Eclipse Phase and Cyberpunk 2020 I could use to make the setting work.

>> No.39893431

You presume to render the entire complexity of Shirow's cyberpunk in tables and lists. This is doomed from the start.

Instead use something flexible that can find solutions on the spot without ruining a giant rat tail of balancing. Something with a simple difficulty rating for challenges and no reliance on class features or level-unlocked feats to tell a story.

Wushu, Fate, DRYH-mod, you know, fast and loose.

>> No.39893550

>not d20
>not EP
>not CP2020

You're too picky and won't find anything.

>> No.39893569
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I wrote a long reply and lost it very fast, but the short answer is GURPS, specifically 4e, Ultratech, and that one pyramid supplement on Cyberpunk.

It's got you covered for gunfights, investigations, hacking, and tech-porn; vehicle porn is more difficult to pull together, but possible (spaceships, assorted spaceships supplements, pyramid thing on vehicles that adds mecha). Navel-Gazing is a predominantly roleplaying based exercise anyways, so it won't get in your way there. There is also a cyberpunk setting, Transhuman Space, which I am not too familiar with-but one of its supplements is Meme Squad, a book about Memetics and their use. So you can stand alone complex all up ins.

>> No.39893619

Shadowrun 4th Edition is shamelessly ripped off Ghost In The Shell Stand Alone Complex.

As such I've always found it easy to make Shirow Characters and plots in that game-verse.

Just don't mention the magical Elvin Ninja and you'll be fine...

>> No.39893721
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If there's electricity, my games always become GitS one way or the other.

Motoko in the first movie was what ramjetted me through puberty.

>> No.39895284

Have you seen the d20 version? It's terrible, then again most things past the fantasy stuff is. As for Eclipse Phase and Cyberpunk I say that because I don't actually have their rulebooks.

>> No.39895452

> As for Eclipse Phase and Cyberpunk I say that because I don't actually have their rulebooks.
>Eclipse Phase

Why not dude? They're free.


>> No.39895504

Your best bet might be the Infinity RPG that's in the works.

>> No.39895505

I was not aware of this fact, also I'd like Shadowrun if you have it.

>> No.39895542

You say you don't have the Cyberpunk 2020 rulebook, google that bad boy up, it's good shit.

>> No.39895549


>> No.39895901

One of the weird things I've been having against using a more cyberpunk setting is the fact that GitS is more post-cyberpunk and I question how I would handle the cruder nature of cyberpunk technology in that sort of setting.

>> No.39896025

Nova Praxis is like Shadowrun without the fantasy elements.

>> No.39896046
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>he had her in bed
>she offered
>the fucker said no

Until the end of time, I shall be mad.

>> No.39896058

I am highly interested in this game, personally.

Highly interested.

>> No.39896066

Won't CP 2020 just work?
According to my knowledge it has stealth suits and everything.

>> No.39896364

Post-cyberpunk ain't wholly about the technology, it's more of an approach to the story.

>> No.39896628

Yeah; post cyberpunk doesn't have glam rock anarchists and derogatively call anyone with a job that isn't killing people for money a suit.

>> No.39896915

Sage for off-topic.

Is Alternative Architecture the retelling of the 6 Arise films or does it have new content in there?

>> No.39897064

It's basically the films but with some additional content.

>> No.39897431


Well the thing is, EP is legally free. That blog is one of the creators'.

Fortunately, someone else had a link.

>> No.39897601

I see, thanks.

>> No.39897672

No, but it it would be easy to do. Get a book of pop culture philosophy quotes and a softcore porn dvd. Read some random quotes, watch some porn. Alternate between them. You're set.

>> No.39897751
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>You will never have the opportunity that little rat had

>> No.39897791

GitS:SAC has an absolutely beautiful premise for a tabletop game (you're a high-tech anti-terrorism police unit with terrifying military-grade hardware and basically zero oversight and accountability except to your political wizard of a CO), so I'm amazed that it doesn't have a game.

Of course, that does sound reasonably similar to the standard Eclipse Phase premise, but the ease of bodyswapping there combined with the absolutely ruined Earth would kind of squash all the philosophical and sociological issues that make the show fun.

>> No.39897853

Infinity is the closest to GitS-type black ops.

>> No.39897855

Set it on mars then.

>> No.39897942

To be honest, she was probably going to play a joke on him.

>have sex with the major
>halfway she turns invisible
>slips away

Goddamn cyborg blue balls mang.

>> No.39897999


>> No.39898030

She's a canon nympho. She would've done it.

That kid is just a faggot.

>> No.39899276

Someone made an EP conversion for GiTS, I haven't used it so I can neither confirm nor deny if it is good.

>> No.39899300
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Yeah, this isn't the face of messing around.

>> No.39899301

It looks like some of the rules are from older versions of the EP rules though, so stuff like initiative might need to be updated.

>> No.39899319

>those eyes

She's already halfway through in her head.

God DAMN it, kid.

>> No.39899470

How much work would it take to refluff Eclipse Phase Earth into Ghost in the Shell Earth, and restrict morph-swapping some?

>> No.39899557

EP earth is a destroyed hell covered in sleeping war AI.

>> No.39899578

My question is more "does it destroy a bunch of mechanics if you're using it to run something other than the default setting".

>> No.39900771

The biggest problem will probably be some of the implants being too powerful for use in GiTS. Hyper spectral vision is cheap in EP, but not common in GiTS for example.

It would also require reworking the rep (as GiTS doesn't use a real rep economy) and changes certain skills (like nanofabrication)

>> No.39900828

You could use 4th edition Shadowrun, Augmentation had rules for full body prosthetics.

>> No.39901479

No. Avoid GURPS like the plague. You have to KNOW what you need and KNOW what to carve off of the system so it doesn't make character creation a nose-bleed inducing nightmare and ends up being an aborted fetus of a game. There is a reason why you can obtain character creation programs for GURPS, because it is a horrible point management game.

Also avoid d20 for most modern and beyond games unless it's heavily modded (like Mutants and Masterminds) as d20 doesn't do firearms well at all and those that have made modern supplements make firearms useless.

To be honest, people keep looking at all the tech but if you look at the series it is very Psychological in scope. I'd go either with using the Storyteller System, or Fate.

>> No.39901493

I'd say casual morphing is a pretty big part of it, outside of a Jovian campaign or something.

>> No.39901522


You play a group of characters that fall somewhere between agents from Syndicate, Section 9, and Shadowrunners.

If you want to play it legal, acquire licenses and dispense justice, that's doable.

>> No.39901573

>halfway she turns invisible
ghost blowjob

>> No.39901580

>Avoid everything that has rules

Look at this cancer. Look at it and laugh.

GURPS is only as complicated as you make it. If you actually take some time to bother reading the damned book, it's very clear and open with what it's mechanics do, why, and what changes with each supplement.

Just because some faggots refuse to not run 12-splat abominations doesn't mean that GURPS is difficult.

>> No.39901585

So does 5e.

>> No.39901589
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Can your cyborgs look this good, though, or are you relegated to being a whirring roboman?

>> No.39901646

Eclipse Phase has tachikoma clones, and they have rules for brainhacking too.

>> No.39901676

>To be honest, people keep looking at all the tech but if you look at the series it is very Psychological in scope.

This. Crunch-heavy games with lots and lots and lots of catalogs full of awesome superhightech gear are fun to look at, but that's not really what GitS is about.

I'm not saying crunch-heavy games are bad, but please feel free to argue as though I am.

>> No.39901739

How are you going to argue over weapon choice with your partner if there isn't an extensive list of weapons to choose from, and the few choices you can pick between have clear and balanced differences?

>> No.39901800

>How are you going to argue over weapon choice with your partner
By rolling our relationship dice for the argument, I guess.

Why yes I am currently playing in a Ghosts in the Vineyard game

>> No.39901803

Depends. I'd use GURPS and GURPS Ultra-Tech, with the old 3e Cyberpunk as well. It works well for everything you could want it to contain - exciting shooty combat? Fire-arms rule are good in GURPS. Melee? Hacking? Varied character possibilities? Yep.

You'd need to figure out a lot of the specific cybernetics yourself, though, designing advantages so that they're "cybernetic" packages and that could take a while / not be much fun. You could of course also just say people get 200 (or so) points for "Upgrades" that they can reasonably justify as cyber-enhancements.

That's a rule focused approach. FATE or Wushu might also work, because they're more story-telling and idea focused.

And here's an odd-duck idea - I actually wrote a hack for myself and my group that used the Only War rules to run a few sessions of a GiTs inspired game. No, wait, don't run away - hear me out. You create a regiment before making characters, so the "Regiment" in this case is really the "Organization" the players work for, standard equipment is their basic field equipment and so on. It works pretty well. The standard combat rules work fairly well for high impact / deadly combat, and I just gave everyone plenty of cybernetics and made up a few too. Filing the serial numbers off of the lore was easy enough, and it's not the hardest task in the world to give people the option of picking a general "class" of agent with a grouping of aptitudes that match. You ad-hoc hacking by having people roll tech-use and finagle what they want to do, and it stradles the line between rules-light and crunchy enough to be meaty. Worked pretty well.

Alternatively EP, change the lore a bit (which is easy enough) and there you go, basically the perfect system for running it because the idea of cyborgs are baked into the rules.

Shadowrun 4e could also work, with a stretch, but you'd be bugged down in minutae more than I really feel you want to be.


>> No.39901976

I've only touched EP out of those games, and it gets points for body swapping and actually discussing the social ramifications of such a setting (with mixed success, according to The Internet In General).

I wouldn't straight port it though; the setting's a little too future for pure GitS imho. I'd either see what you can cannibalise, or just run straight EP with heavy GitS overtones and accept the spiritual nod to it.

>> No.39902010

5e has rules for jarheads? I thought it's equivalent to Augmentation wasn't out yet. Or did they put the rules in Run Faster?

>> No.39902080

Not jar heads; cyber suites. In Lockdown.

It means you can buy a full set of limbs / torso / skull / eyes / ears / other without dying. You just can't use any 'ware that wasn't included in the suite.

>> No.39902179

That's not the same thing, Kusanagi and possibly Batou(I don't recall it ever being clear on that matter)are full body replacement cyborgs, the only organic parts left are the brain and brain stem. Cyber torso and cyber skull are stated to not be true replacements, but shells.

>> No.39902305

>ctrl + f "food"

It's functionally the same thing. Jarheads, by comparison, flush their brain tank with nutrients during weekly maintenance.

>> No.39902330

Post cyber punk such as GitS doesn't have humanity/essence loss and cyberpsychosis like CP2020 and SR.

>no captcha, that's a fucking hamburger, not a sandwich

>> No.39902364

That's another reason to try >>39901522 - your only limitations on what you can cram into your body are expenses and social reactions.

>> No.39902391

>that's a fucking hamburger, not a sandwich

A hamburger is a type of sandwich.

>> No.39902433

I've not heard of this game. Do you have a PDF of it?

>> No.39902507



>> No.39903376

depends how much you pay for a hot robot body

>> No.39903902

I like it though I think there needs to be more backgrounds.

>> No.39905864

Agreed. It's a good start, though.

>> No.39906928

My problem when people talk about 'post' cyberpunk is it's a lot like the 'post punk' music genre.

There's no coherent vision of what is a post cyberpunk or isn't a post cyber story only that's it's not 'your father's cyberpunk.'

The style and general attitude maybe be different the issues and even technology really isn't.

And yes a hamburger is a type of meat flavoured sandwich.

>> No.39906934
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Does anyone know if these rules are any good?

>> No.39907032
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>And yes a hamburger is a type of meat flavoured sandwich.

>> No.39907367

I love GURPS, but it's a simulationist system with little concession for genre or story telling.

Fate on the other hand goes way (way…) too far the other way. It's a narrative game where only the story matter and the systems has the barest refection of reality.

> And here's an odd-duck idea - I actually wrote a hack for myself and my group that used the Only War rules to run a few sessions of a GiTs inspired game.

Actually that seems like a good choice. The war hammer world has a lot in actually with ghost in the shell. The tech level and cartoonishly cynical fascist politics are about the same. Only the aesthetic is more space gothic then clean and shiny.

The combat rule set is 'gritty' enough to feel deadly and realistic more 'this is the sort of tone you should be going for' sort of way rather then "our tables based of actually combat statistics and that's what's going to happen.

>> No.39908383

Only if those big breasts have a purpose...

Seriously, The Major isn't sporting a front end -that- big.

>> No.39908971

I'd say a D100 system would be best because of non-biased reasons

>> No.39909124

>Only if those big breasts have a purpose...
They're gel-based cortexes for enhanced hacking and targeting. They need to be exposed like that in order to dump excess heat.

>> No.39909186

Orrrr their single-use missile launchers.

>> No.39909256

Something tactical, where full body cyborgs don't cost you the entirety of your essence or turn you into a raving psychopath. Which takes Cyberpunk 2020 and Shadowrun off the table.

I'd personally go for something on the mechanically light side. Considering the main cast of characters, any sort of rules heavy system is going to either see a character like Togusa dragging heavily, or the cyborgs winding up spending too much and becoming too limited to become cyborgs.

>> No.39909269

>Seriously, The Major isn't sporting a front end -that- big.
she is hacking your eyes in real time

>> No.39909424

It'd be what, half an hour's work at a body shop? Think big, anon.

>> No.39909670


Or you could just take SR without essence. I mean you're already throwing out magic so...

Still think EP with the futuretech inventories scaled back would be the best.


At first glance. Pretty good. Some small odd things here and there. Like how .50BMG deals tons more damage than actual antitank warheads.

And as someone else mentioned. Needs more backgrounds.

>> No.39910589

I think "Cybernetics isn't seen as in fundamental opposition to humanity" might be a big post-cyberpunk thing, rather than just being "not your dad's cyberpunk", actually. I had actually forgot the cultural assumption twenty years ago was a full-body cyborg would be a raving psychopath until it got brought up.

>> No.39911028

>She's already halfway through in her head.
Or she's having perfect fun just trolling the kid, because she KNOWS he's all talk and full of shit.

>> No.39911039

Yeah. Just remove the the humanity and essence then. If you want to 'balance' the cyberwear just bring up the the issues of maintenance, weight, rejection and cost.

Well if that's the a sharp divide between CP and PCP is to be drawn it's 'transhumanist' elements.

I'm sure if that's a opening a totally difference kettle of fish or not but.

>> No.39912790
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I miss cyberpsychosis. Not the mechanic of it, that's always been cludgey, but the idea, the implications. The notion that the body is a complicated and integrated system of chemicals, impulses, and ingrained responses and that when you go fucking with it sometimes there are unforeseen effects on the way one perceives and interacts with the world.

Things like the old story about the guy with the cybereyes who had trouble relating to people because now they all looked like they we on TV, all the time, and when he killed them it was fine because they weren't real.

Or the tweaked out war veteran with wired reflexes who blew the head off of a grandma because his body reacted before his brain could sort the difference between a purse strap breaking and a hammer cocking.

This is the stuff that got me off of fantasy and into cyberpunk in the first place. I understand why it gets glossed over now, too many people taking the short road to slavering killbots gunning down malls full of people, but in streamlining the genre a bit I can't help but feel something is lost.

Maybe I just have too many friends on meds.

>> No.39912877

>doubting the major

You underestimate her sexual deviancy. If she said she was gonna fuck him, she was gonna fuck him.

>> No.39914056

Sha's a canon nympho? Where'd you get that from?
Because I want to read/watch it

>> No.39914130

Manga. She's pretty sexual.

>> No.39914147

He was just curious about how cyborgs function, he didn't want to stick his benis into a piece of metal.

>> No.39914402

"pretty sexual" as in "Almost all she does in her downtime is hang with her lesbo fuckbuddies"

man I love the manga

>> No.39914455

He didn't because he was gay for dicks.

>> No.39914631

Yeah okay.

Listen here sonny, when a kid grows to your age, things start t'change. A body start'st'b'n'eedin' some special at-then-ti-oun at certian' times.
You see a girl that's mighty fine an' purdy, an' you'll gonna be feeling a right tingling down'thar in the dangly-parts yahear? An' mebbe your face'll start to go all red-like, and it'll feel like it's'a' much'a too hot outside nomatter how much or leetle clothings you 'be wearin'

Now I know that you've always been kind'a slow on the uptake so I'll make this right clear an' proper fer ye. Guys, like you 'an' me sonny, we have them needs. Them Se-xhu-ahl needs.

And I promise you boy, if you fin' yourself in a bed with a lady as purdy an' fine as that there Major? You're gonna be wantin' to put them dangly parts in her dangly parts, silicone tits be damned. An' if you don't, sonny, you'll be a mighty queer fella'.

>> No.39914954

>Or you could just take SR without essence.

Then you have a game where there's even less reason to not fill yourself with as much ware as you can afford.

>If you want to 'balance' the cyberwear just bring up the the issues of maintenance, weight, rejection and cost.

Balancing something by making it such a pain in the ass to book-keep that no one will want to take it just punishes people for making use of options.

>> No.39915256

You would have to include Backgrounds such as military, various positions medic, heavy armor, and such.

>> No.39915382

Not that I don't agree with your position but in the GitS universe the only reason people don't upgrade is personal reasons (religious, ect.), or possibly cost of prosthetics.

>> No.39915385

Oh so that one scene in (I think it's second Gig?) where she's hanging out with her lesbo fuckbuddys is pretty much the usual "off work" major?

>> No.39915495

pretty much yeah. Girl loves her sexings. One of the most famous parts of the manga is when Batou tries to sneak a peek on one of her virtual (I think it was virtual?) Boat rides of lesbo-sexitude and fucks up his head because of interfacing issues (Guy: No girl parts, brain blows a fuse trying to interpret the signals)

>> No.39915507

Or Brain-AIDS

>> No.39915529

Not the original guy but they never really go into detail about her outside life, although it is implied that that she is a regular. Though in the manga and in Arise she has a boyfriend.

>> No.39915562

I have no idea what that is.

>> No.39915654

I seem to recall that it was a on-again off-again thing with her boyfriend.

>> No.39915720

That's true enough. But any sort of game with substantial crunch to its cyberware is pretty much a guarantee that you'll never see someone want to play as someone like Togusa. Especially since sitting out combat encounters in most games is a good way to spend most of a session doing nothing.

>> No.39915724

Cyberbrain Sclerosis

>> No.39915749

"Makoto, I really enjoy our relationship but I feel like the constant lesbian flings mean you don't."

"What, I can't value a personal and sexual relationship while keeping a dozen casual sexual things on the side? What is this, Victorian England?"

>> No.39915827

In the manga I remember that she broke with her boyfriend and it was never brought up again.

>> No.39915864

We all know she did it because she enjoyed her girl-lesbo sex orgies far too much to be tied down to one dick, even if it was a good dick. (Must'ave been too for her to stay with him for as long as she did)

>> No.39915961
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>> No.39916313

Considering the usage of devices such as Tatchikomas it might not be as bad of a limiter. I think that one way that you could get around it is by limiting the additions that certain prosthetics can take in the buying options and ones with more ability to upgrade be ludicrously expensive. Also another thing that could help is that organic bodies have lower starting stats but can be infinitely increased.

>> No.39917758

Isn't there a James Bond system that does asymetrical party power levels well?
You could just copy mechanics from that so that people would play Togusa

>> No.39918107

Are you sure thats who you were quoting?

If I were running this, I'd break out Mutants and Masterminds. PL8, 120pp, characters are allowed a single Power Array for their cyborg stuff. Togusa isn't a lesser character because he's not a combat cyborg, he's the party's investigative skill monkey and party faceman with contacts coming out of both ears.

>> No.39918148

That was also a sideline that made her a fuckload of money.

>> No.39918179

there fixed

>> No.39919692

Alright if anyone has mutants and masterminds that'd be great.

>> No.39920541


I've got it, but it's too big to upload. You can find it on kickass torrents by looking for mutants and masterminds 3e.

It's a really good system. I'd actually love for there to be more discussion on /tg/ about it.

>> No.39920565


Also, it's all online here:


>> No.39920950

I thought it was just that everytime she had a boyfriend her work ended up catching up to the guy. With lead.

>> No.39921085
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Got it.

>> No.39921235

>Golly gee
Please tell me this is a fan translation or something.

>> No.39921292

Manga always frustrates me, I always have to fuck around with figuring out whether or not I'm reading it left to right or right to left.

>> No.39921307
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Here. The only thing you NEED is the core book. The power profiles and the Gadget Guides don't actually open up anything you can't do with said corebook, they just give new ideas and offer premade power-sets and flavors.

Basically? The corebook is one bigass toolbox, with the guides as little pre-made sets to help you think. Power Profiles does it for powers, while GG does it for...well, equipment and crap. From guns to bases to spy gadgets to simple ideas for cyberware.

I managed, after a lot of hunting, to find the compliation PDF for GGs, but never did for PPs, so. That's why one's a RAR file.

Oh, and the GM's guide and Kit 'cause why not.

http://wikisend.com/download/301304/M&M 3ed Core.pdf

GM's Guide
http://wikisend.com/download/875150/M&M3E- Gamemaster's Guide.pdf

GM's Kit
http://wikisend.com/download/397838/M&M3E - GM Kit.pdf

Power Profiles

Gadget Guides
http://wikisend.com/download/948718/Gadget Guides.pdf

>> No.39921372

I think he's fucking around with the Major.

>> No.39921457

Which hilariously enough is something that happens in Arise as well.

>> No.39921461

It's always right to left unless it's an early official translation by some shitty publisher like Dark Horse. They're mirrored everything.

>> No.39921528


er, they've

>> No.39921591


>> No.39921860
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I just never really bothered getting another version. Quality's decent enough even though sometimes the remastered sfx'ses look a bit weird and some idioms are a little off. Except the color pages. Scanner seems to have shat itself on those.

>> No.39923820


Or you just use Transhuman Space and make appropriate characters. Not hard.

Ghost in the Shell could slot right into THS without a ripple.

>> No.39923903


Most of the cyber/bio that you'd want is in Ultratech, Biotech and a couple of Pyramids.

Sounds like a lot, but really - compare to Shadowrun, which is just a low-power Ghost in the Shell with a shitty system that has gear scattered everywhere.

>> No.39924332

or expanded fuel tanks, though that one is a bit cliche.

>> No.39924516

>>There's no coherent vision of what is a post cyberpunk or isn't a post cyber story only that's it's not 'your father's cyberpunk.'

Uh, it's just if the protagonist isn't a punk, post cyberpunk is about the man

>> No.39924579

I'm essentially going though GURPs, Eclipse Phase, and Mutants and Masterminds and seeing which gets me a result that looks like this: https://youtu.be/exn4wluiqCE?t=24s

>> No.39924775

Also this.


>> No.39925585


God. The thought of trying to do something like this in one-second GURPS combat rounds fills me with a sense of existential fear the likes of which the world is not fit to behold.

>> No.39925951

Post-Cyberpunk is basically Cyber punk but if all the hyper corporate nonsense got toned down a lot and everybody wasn't street urchin. It's really the economic disparity and the fact that Corporations basically act as Russia that defines cyberpunk. It also focuses on the Transhumanist elements of cyberpunk even more.

>> No.39928368

A massive plot point through season 1.

>> No.39928445

It has been many moons since I have seen Stand Alone Complex.

>> No.39928720

Wait what?

I have not touched Arise yet. Was that Bato? What is going on?

>> No.39929024

There was a conspiracy around a problem with cyberbrain death and the laughing man was trying to expose it. .

Specifically, some people's brains randomly calcify, killing them, and there's a cure but it was covered up even though high-level people have access to it, common folk don't.

>> No.39929114

>Balancing something by making it such a pain in the ass to book-keep that no one will want to take it just punishes people for making use of options.
>Not that I don't agree with your position but in the GitS universe the only reason people don't upgrade is personal reasons (religious, ect.), or possibly cost of prosthetics.

Well movie said the big draw back of going 'full cyborgs' is cost an arm and a leg and need constance tuning so most people (even super spies) simple don't bother with any more then the odd replacement cyberlimb and the cyber brain implant.

Oh and they can't float. Which is an issue as their brains are still organic.

Still pretty small price for being a super man….

>> No.39929265

Yes that is Bato, Arise is more or less the origin story/new continuity to the GitS universe. He's working for a former Sergent who's been arrested for war crimes he (did)n't commit.

>> No.39929455

If you're excluding all systems for which you don't have the books, then why are you here? 99% of anything worth recommending is going to require that you buy or pirate one or more books.

>> No.39929508

>Post-Cyberpunk is basically Cyber punk but if all the hyper corporate nonsense got toned down a lot and everybody wasn't street urchin. It's really the economic disparity and the fact that Corporations basically act as Russia that defines cyberpunk. It also focuses on the Transhumanist elements of cyberpunk even more.

That's a good rule of thumb for defining post cyber punk but it's still simply saying what PCP
*isn't* rather then what it is.

Would a 'post' cyber punk story become a straight cyberpunk story if the character lose his job and turned to street crime to make a living? Would it still be cyber punk happen if he then later gets it back?

>> No.39930101

I imagine the elements are mostly revolving around large economic restoration and the resurgence of government power, The government keeping a close eye on the political games of corporations to make sure that they don't mess up the world again, Dealing with the parts of the world that are in an unstable state due to corporations not having an iron grip on government and bringing trade and work, things like that.

As a post cyber punk, the sorts of stories that would deal with crime would dealing with mafia-esque organizations that have sprung up due to refuges and immigrants and large operations such as gun trafficking. The key difference between the two would be the level of visibility that organizations like that would have. In a Cyberpunk setting organized crime would be much more visible because maybe 10% of a city would be high class/middle class whereas the rest of the city would be slums. In a Post-cyberpunk setting they would be more organizations on the fringes of society, having to be more secretive knowing that they don't have the massive backing and cover of mega-corps.

>> No.39930436

Well Neuromancer crystaised the genre as 'high tech low life'. If you ditch the the 'punk' from cyber punk what exactly is their left? I suppose the cyber tech would be the same.

Neuromancer might not be the first cyberpunk novel, or perhaps even a good novel in it's own right. But it never the less epitomised the zine that had been brewing for a while. The setting had a consistent set of themes, style and attitude to easily define it

Post cyber punk however doesn't have that. The only unifying factor is that it st if the only unifying factor is that it's technologically advanced but not necessarily dystopian . Which is really just a return to conventional science fiction .

>> No.39931093

I'd Ghost in her Shell, if you get what I mean.

>> No.39931106

Okay, fair is fair, that made me laugh.

>> No.39931777

Problem with that is that conventional science fiction covers a wide spectrum, Star Trek and Warhammer 40K could be qualified in that case. The tag of Post Cyber Punk basically gives people the idea that this is a more "realistic" setting that deals with the issues that remain from the cyberpunk genre.

>> No.39931980
File: 133 KB, 550x818, Gynoid Problems.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Is she actually equipped for sex?
I thought she wasn't, that's why she's having cyber-sex with her girl-friends in the Manga.

>> No.39931995
File: 542 KB, 1200x819, Warforged rolls to seduce.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Is she actually equipped for sex?

>> No.39932044

Even if her main body isn't she can just use another body that is.

>> No.39932480

Come over to the Eclipse Phase general, we've got cyborg prostitutes. (Also, because bio-engineering is so effective, cyborgs are actually considered to be an inferior option for anything that still wants to be humanoid shape. Biomorphs are more expensive than pods, but often better... unless you want a twelve foot tall roaring spider tank for a body, in which case you probably want to go full synth.)

>> No.39932534


What episode was this?

>> No.39932549

Eclipse Phase only really hits you with it when you outright switch bodies. Which makes sense, I suppose, because if a person can copy what is debatably themselves onto another brain, then the process of getting a new arm or a new set of eyes is pretty minor in comparison. Also the aforementioned "bioware isn't weaker than cyberware" thing, so your augmented eyes aren't necessarily mechanical unless you're a deviant.

>> No.39932556

'not equipped for sex'

Fucking robots, we made you capable of thought, use your imaginations for once.

>> No.39933762
File: 548 KB, 1920x1080, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

True but it's still basically just the same stuff only not gonna as ridiculously over the top about it. It's a different approach would not necessarily a different genre.

It would be interesting if cyberpunk 2070 ever comes out how they handle it ( I don't count shadowrun returns simply because of the magic) Will they go for modern or retro?

Didn't the most recent tabletop version of cyberpunk have a division between the classic and 'modern' cyberpunk setting? The latter of which is basically the same thing only with less glamorous rock and this magical invention called Wi-Fi?

>> No.39933875
File: 167 KB, 680x986, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Shit it's like he's doing self-parody now...

>> No.39934145

He is, and even admitted to doing it unashamedly.

Dumbing of Age is pretty much one big parody of everything he's done so far.

>> No.39934288


>> No.39934481

>How much work would it take to refluff Eclipse Phase Earth into Ghost in the Shell Earth, and restrict morph-swapping some?
Why would you restrict morph swapping? Minds in GitS can jump from body to body so long as they have a cyberbrain. The first episode of SAC is about a congressman whose fetish is swapping with Geisha bots before sex!

Just drop egocasting (maybe) and eliminate alienation rolls, maybe.

>> No.39937778

Probably should have said brain backups instead of morph-swapping, yeah.

>> No.39937799

Sure she is. The cybersex lets her lover feel exactly what Makoto's feeling on top of what she's already feeling, which makes it feel both better and more intimate.

>> No.39939808

>Sure she is. The cybersex lets her lover feel exactly what Makoto's feeling on top of what she's already feeling, which makes it feel both better and more intimate.

>enjoying sex
> ever

>> No.39939932

tbh if he has been cyberized then he is rich enough for women to enjoy sex with him

>> No.39939976


>> No.39940084

But, that's from shortpacked, not dumbing of age, and questionable content is by someone else. There's, uh, no self parody going on there.

>> No.39941621

>capable of fellatio
Man, do cyborgs even need to breathe?

>> No.39941670

I think they might, in the same way they need nutrients.
I can't imagine why else diving would be dangerous; If cyborgs don't need to breathe than the major could just walk back to shore

>> No.39941933

Presumably air doesn't solely go through the nose; the oxygen demand of "just a brain" isn't going to be as substantial as the entire body, so presumably discrete areas for air intake could be added to allow them to evade standard squishy human weaknesses such as choking on dick. It does make me question why there's nothing like an internal air store for sudden immersions, though, that seems like it'd be fairly high priority. Maybe cyborg designs just assume drowning's a rare enough hazard they don't need it?

>> No.39942158

Her body can indeed have sex, and she's depicted as quite sexual in her downtime in many of her incarnations.

I remember in SAC she was working a case where rich old men flaunted about designer women/gynoids in prosthetic bodies. She subdues someone by guessing their fetish to have sex with her empty body, then locking them in a barrier maze dream of such a thing.

>> No.39942256
File: 61 KB, 342x429, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.39942771

>women not enjoying sex
Lrn 2 Tiresias

>> No.39942811

And just in case anyone isn't familiar with the story:
>Tiresias was drawn into an argument between Hera and her husband Zeus, on the theme of who has more pleasure in sex: the man, as Hera claimed; or, as Zeus claimed, the woman, as Tiresias had experienced both. Tiresias replied, "Of ten parts, a man enjoys one only." Hera instantly struck him blind for his impiety. Zeus could do nothing to stop her or reverse her curse, but in recompense he did give Tiresias the gift of foresight and a lifespan of seven lives.

>> No.39942921

I remember one of the short stories in Clive Barker's Book of Blood had an undead woman suck off this one guy. Best blowjob he ever had until he realized she was dead.

>> No.39943590

That's the Dark Horse translation, the one Shirow redrew the manga to read left-to-right for.
Fan translations seem pretty rare because the usual sites for hosting translated manga don't allow fan content when there's an official version, which they also don't allow for a mix of legal and not-fan-made reasons.

either way,
>reading translations

>> No.39944014

That's more your fault then a failing of any women you may have been with.

>> No.39945454


What episodes are all of these? I hardly remember any of that but I guess I was paying attention mostly to the tachikoma.

And I heard somewhere that they could only have sex with the same gender or something.

>> No.39945744
File: 484 KB, 793x1168, Motoko cyber-sex censored.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I don't know the ep in question myself however,
>same gender
In the manga that was only her cyber-sex threesome because of how they were linked and the drug they were using was only compatible if all the people involved are the same gender. Otherwise you get sensation feedback on anatomy you don't have.
Batou ended up feeling really sick from it when he linked to Kusanagi to talk to her.

It's explained in the author notes that this was a special case and that hetrosexual cyber-sex is possible.
Plus this was just for cyber-sex, if a robot body has the right equipment, physical sex can work with any sex and gender.

>> No.39946055


Shirow certainly was thorough in his worldbuilding.

>> No.39947052
File: 50 KB, 231x306, Untitled.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

priceless face

>> No.39947435

Ever know sex is an incredibly painful experience for a woman which she graciously tolerates for love/affection/children/money/ect

Why else would find willing sex partners be even an issue?

>> No.39948356
File: 1.10 MB, 1600x1200, Motoko.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I dont know why I did it

>> No.39948455
File: 958 KB, 500x3899, Can cyborgs have sex.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.39948537 [SPOILER] 
File: 68 KB, 288x499, 1431587053799.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>It's cool

>> No.39948727

Is this a reference to Revolutionary Girl Utena? I don't read western comics.

>> No.39948752

More likely reference to this >>39933875 (the ginger is tranny)

>> No.39948919
File: 356 KB, 1920x1021, NoYou.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Interface Zero, Outbreak Deadspace (the new one), OVA, possibly The Void if you drop some of the weirdness. I mean come on mate there are a lot of games out there.

>> No.39949009

I'd imagine the same reason a lot of people don't get flood insurance.

>> No.39949113

Out of in interest would you count deus ex as post cyberpunk or old school?

JC Denton is not a punk by any standard and 'mechs' are already seen as outdated compared to nano augments but the world is still a shit hole by the haves or the haves nots.

>> No.39949621

It seems weird for a super military robot body to lack it though. I forget, is Makoto's drowning weakness "I'd die immediately" or is it more like "she gets fifteen minutes under water, but is still at risk of dying if there's no easy way of climbing out"?

>> No.39949849

In the scene she has a buoyancy pack and a re-breather.


All that's really said is "If something goes wrong, you'll die".

Built in air tanks are difficult from a physics point of view... they have a heavy minimum tank wall thickness so they don't scale down well.

I guess she could take an air tank down just like a human scuba diver if she wanted to, but that's not what she feels like doing. Motoko seems to be big on the being naked thing.

>> No.39949982

Wouldn't the size be reduced quite a bit since only the brain needs oxygen?

>> No.39950113

Yes, but it's still going to be as heavy as hell for the small amount of air it contains. It's a square cube law kind of thing.

At some point I assume the designer decided "no, too heavy, too big, only a small amount of air, I need this space/weight for much more useful stuff, if you want to go swim take a scuba tank like everybody else"

>> No.39950119


There's nothing remotely 'post' about it.

And the themes of the story do intimiately mesh in with a lot of punk sensibilities. JC's a bit of a punk himself, he just knows how to play ball. And he leaves, in the end, and it's not like CP doesn't have a history of working for the man.
That would imply that a few specific aesthetics are remotely relevant when it comes to CP as a genre. Replicants are almost seamlessly human, but Blade Runner wasn't 'post' cyberpunk. Molly Millions didn't look like a killing machine, but she was, even though all you saw of it was effectively implanted sunglasses.

It's a risk thing as well, and I suspect it might be a bit of a womb metaphor.

I assume the internal space of a full body cyborg is pretty spare. No spare internal cavities anywhere.

>> No.39950212


>Because (for a given pressure) the thickness of the walls scales with the radius of the tank, the mass of a tank (which scales as the length times radius times thickness of the wall for a cylindrical tank) scales with the volume of the gas held

Apparently small air tanks are not that bad, ignore the square/cube comments.

>> No.39950241


Yep, that's it. Geez wat,


yeah same batou

>> No.39950274

Also having a high pressure air tank embedded in the chest isn't going to do much for survivability in a frame expected to see combat.


>> No.39950703

Alternatives to high pressure air tanks? Oxygenated fluorocarbons?

>> No.39951295

DX is pretty much 'straight' CP but the sequel invisible war is different enough that's it's an example of post cyberpunk. The setting goes pass bladerunner to star trek and there's a more greater focus on tranhumanism.

>That would imply that a few specific aesthetics are remotely relevant when it comes to CP as an genre.

No. It's not aesthetics. Mechs were seen as outdated not because they were ugly but simply becuase using mechanical upgrades were seen as less high tech as nanotechnology.

Merely being 'cybernetic' had become seen as old hat.

>> No.39951870

The point of the that scene is that if the buoyancy pack fails she'll sink to the bottom, and the air tanks will run out before she can walk to shore (assuming she can even figure out in which direction the shore is.) Having built in air tanks wouldn't solve this problem, she'd still eventually run out of air

>> No.39952833

Yeah, that was what I was wondering, whether it was "immediately fatal" or just "more risky than average".

>> No.39953022

Not that I disagree with you. But even my shitty phone with a carrier that only works 7/10 times has a GPS that reliably works. I am sure that a future where wifi/cyber links are ubiquitous that a simple military grade GPS could probably point her in the right direction. And thats the bare minimum. I would not be surprised if she could get a connection down there and then just send for help.

>> No.39953059

I'd say Deus Ex IS post-cyberpunk.

It's just that the POWERS THAT BE have set up a conspiracy about ensuring that society at large remains a cyberpunk world despite all these secret organisations running around in the post-cyberpunk age.

>> No.39954800

I'm early in the process of making a simple one, which will basically be a conversion of DnD 5e set in the Stand Alone Complex universe, with unique mechanics relative to the setting. I think it will be pretty fun, and I'm going to make some neato character sheets, but I doubt my game will be as intricate (needlessly complex?) as what OP wants to play.

>> No.39955234

(OP) I'm actually not a fan of games like Shadowrun that make the calculating the crunch like pulling teeth. Personally I enjoy games like 7th Sea, where the mechanics have enough crunch to be a satisfying game when you get a success run on the rule of cool.

>> No.39955535
File: 938 KB, 3000x1616, Motoko - The many bodies of the Major.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

On a related note, there is two new GitS films in production. Another anime following on from Arise and a live action Murrican film (which fills me with nothing but dread).
The Anime is this or next year, not sure when the live one is coming.

>> No.39956053

ARISE was boring and poorly made. SAC has been gone forever, and now it's Hollywood bait.

GitS as a franchise is over as quality is concerned, it's best to just remember SAC at this point

>> No.39956057

>Love 1st GIG's plotline
>2nd GIG is mostly okay
>Love that 2nd GIG Major started wearing pants
>Spend most of 1st GIG wondering what is the fucking purpose of even wearing those legging things

Suffering, man. Suffering.

>> No.39956175

I'd reasoned that the major never wore any sort of practical clothing was due to the fact that she never saw her body as something that needed protecting.

>> No.39956219

I don't know my Steven Spielberg isn't taking control of the film direction considering he's the only one that has actually seen all the GitS franchise.

>> No.39956280

I actually liked ARISE but I will agree that the elements that they tried to fit in there didn't work with one another. The political aspects where never properly explained, but I do feel that they had their hearts in the right place.

>> No.39956363


I agree. The bad guys were kind of meh too.

>> No.39956435

I liked ARISE because it slowly constructed her team, had some awesome brain fuckery going on, and I dig the "lobby" or cyberplace is "underwater"

>> No.39956506

That pic's missing the girl from the end of the first movie.

>> No.39956701

Eh, keep in mind when the mango was written. Such things barely existed to the point where the shit we have today was things people thought we'd not have until the year 3,000.

>> No.39956726

>Spend most of 1st GIG wondering what is the fucking purpose of even wearing those legging things

She uses a mass-produced body, so she's not very personally attached to her appearance, because there are a lot of other people who look just like her (without all the hideously-illegal mods). This results in a lot of shamelessness.

>> No.39956899

>There's a lot of peoples walking around looking like the major

Excuse me, my dick and I have something to discuss in private

>> No.39956976


Not only was she kidding, but you also want to stick your dick into an abomination of flesh and metal
The fuck is wrong with you

>> No.39957031

Funny how in the show the looked pretty much down on a male pervert. It was in one of the earlier episodes i believe.

>> No.39957032

>That sultry look and bare boob coverage

Chick is a freak.

>> No.39957076

>(Guy: No girl parts, brain blows a fuse trying to interpret the signals)
So the manga isn't as feminist as say the movie?

>> No.39957566

What? What's that got to do with feminism?

>> No.39957995
File: 160 KB, 1362x738, cyberbrain autistic mode.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>she kidding

>> No.39958165

I think you need to read up on 2nd wave feminism and things like 'gender is in the mind and not the body' in the original and not the modern sense.

>> No.39958226

Where is the blonde one from?

>> No.39958273

You know, I always was a bit confused by that.

>> No.39958287

The manga. Ghost In the Shell 2: Man Machine Interface.

>> No.39958322

He was receiving singles for a body part he did not have, that's got nothing to do with gender. it's closer to having a phantom limb.

>> No.39958685

I'd argue it's less feminist and more transhumanist.

>> No.39958689

> But even my shitty phone with a carrier that only works 7/10 times

90% of the time it works all the time

>> No.39959732

No I meant that even with a shit service, I still had a gps that always worked. It was a comment on the robustness of the GPS rather then the service.

>> No.39961529


What the picture? If so it's meant to represent operating one's brain in a manner that doesn't connect to any external networks or really anything at all. No signals in or out except to your local body.

>> No.39961880

It's also missing the dozen of so Motokos from Man Machine Interface.

I think it was just focusing on Motoko's primary appearance in each.

>> No.39961990

Which you think in a world of ghost hacking, most people would be doing that a majority of the time.

>> No.39962079
File: 190 KB, 1228x955, Motoko Aramaki.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Forgot my pic

>> No.39963808


>> No.39963812


I see it kind of like how cell phones turned out. Before they became pervasive it was expected that you'd be out of contact or only able to be reached at certain times. Now you're almost socially obligated to be available 24/7. And that's not even touching on how easy it is to use said device to get entertainment.

>> No.39964309

Do you have the one where the kid is about to say yes, but the closet opens to reveal Batou with a knife?

>> No.39964808

this is sad... get a life, fat sad virgins.

>> No.39965154
File: 253 KB, 500x281, 135[1].gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>You right now

>> No.39965228

Was this ever stated in SAC? I know it's a plot point in the movie, but I never saw another body like the Major's in SAC.

>> No.39965294

>Important Government agent
>With a off the shelf (in appearance at least) body

That's just asking for trouble in the form of framing you for murders.

Actually wasn't that a plot point in one episode?

>> No.39965346
File: 6 KB, 200x200, 5150322+_4f382332d3463fb00cfb972fe31d612e[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.39965512
File: 65 KB, 563x601, transdimentional bait.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>talking about a show is for sad fat virgins
bait harder anon, i'm also underweight, for the record

>> No.39965772
File: 67 KB, 625x626, i am become bait.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>talking about a chinese childrens cartoon made by a porn artist isn't for sad fat virgins

>> No.39965887
File: 12 KB, 251x205, 1332314303962.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>children's cartoon

7/10, got me to respond.

>> No.39965923

>i'm also underweight
human sofa pls go

>> No.39966307


> human sofa

I saw something like that in a movie once.
"Tokyo Gore Police," I think.

>> No.39966492

>Tokyo Gore Police
Truly a modern classic. I'm not ashamed to say the ending made me weep.

>> No.39967520

Not sure about the anime show, in the manga it is stated that her body appears off the self.

If you have a $25mil cyber body
A) Your a top agent in a mega corp - only way you can afford it.
B) Your a Gov agent - only way you can afford it.
C) Your a member of a crime syndicate - only way you can afford it.
D) As a member of A thru C normal people don't want to get involved with you, and members of A thru C want to tail/track you to see what your up to.
E) It's a $25mil body rob that bitch that shits worth money.

So she has a top of the line cyber body but it looks off the self on the outside because it's less troublesome.

>> No.39968243

Then you sir are a moron. Except during strenuous exercise, the human brain uses the largest percentage of O2 then any other organ, and the central nervous system uses the most of any group of organs. There is a reason why the two carotid arteries are the same size or larger then the femoral artery.

Think about it a moment, you have 2 arteries feeding an area of the body that is perhaps 1/4 to 1/3 the size used by each leg and it's SINGLE artery.

Oxygen, VERY important to the brain. It lasts 5 minutes before it begins to take irreversible damage. Muscle tissue takes around 4-6 hours to do the same. Bone, around 12 hours.

Yes a cyborg could choke, assuming that the Cyborg has living tissue and is not simply a program written into a computer. And without some form of oxygen storage tank, would choke in the same time as a normal human. Perhaps you could gain a few minutes if the lungs of the cyborg could be completely emptied and then refilled as the tidal volume of air exchange on normal breaths is far smaller then 100 percent.

>> No.39968448

The first movie touches on it when she sees another one of the same bodies out in public and the two of them lock eyes for a moment and also later on her body is mentioned as being a 'Special Order' body.

SAC tended to err more towards her being unique in appearance but people do get surprised when they learn she chock-full of expensive tech, so it probably still looks like an average model.

>> No.39968978

>reaching this hard for your BS
C'mon faggot, it's obviously the same idea as your olfactory senses suddenly getting re-routed as visual imput, it's going to break something because your brain can't translate the signals properly.

>but muh feminist persecution complex
Is the worst stand alone complex ever.

>> No.39969413


>> No.39971023

Hello everyone, I'm the guy making the SAC tabletop. I'll have a preview of the character sheets up to show you pretty soon.

>> No.39971085
File: 170 KB, 728x1096, h002.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Fubuki trying cosplay?

>> No.39972222


Please no

>> No.39972439

Creative Commons is great. Basically you can do whatever you like with the EP material as long as you attribute Posthuman and don't try selling it.

Posthuman makes all their money selling physical copies (and PDFs too for some reason).

>> No.39972546

SciFi has gone through various ages. The early stuff was largely pulp fiction stories about how amazing technology was and how it'd solve everything. Stock characters and simple plots. Basically the same kind of adventure stories that inspired Indiana Jones, just usually in space or involving robots and rayguns.

Fast forward a few decades towards the end of the social scifi era and you get cyberpunk. Basically the opposite of the early pulp stuff. Pessimistic instead of optimistic, The Man (either government or corporate) always has you done, you'll live in the gutter even if you have a kickass robot arm. Technology is just going to exacerbate our problems.

Turns out it never got that bad. A lot of the themes of cyberpunk are still around today but they never got to the degree those authors portrayed. Those kind of stories are fun if that's the theme you're going for but don't really apply to the same social problems we have today.

That's how you end up with post-cyberpunk. Lots of the same themes but more grey than the black and white of The Man and the punks. You often end up with government or corporate protagonists now (GitS being the obvious example). Post-Cyberpunk is more defined by what it isn't that what it is.

>> No.39972660


>> No.39972761
File: 185 KB, 500x513, 1327119217319.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

why would you make me think of that again?

>> No.39973733

Oh I know what it means, I just think the word choice is weird. Why call that autistic mode?

>> No.39973825

I don't get the context. I mean I see that its titled suicide song but I don't know what exactly is going on.

>> No.39973859

Nevermind I followed some links from the posted video. I do not recognize that scene. What movie/series is that from?

>> No.39973929

IIRC it's the finale of 2nd Gig.

>> No.39974311

2nd gig finale. The tachikomas discovered not too long ago that [spoilers]during maintenance at one point their consciousness were stored on a satellite and they're connecting to their bodies remotely. Later they have the idea of redirecting satellites into the path of a nuclear missile to stop it from killing a bunch of refugees. Unfortunately the only one in the perfect position was their own satellite. They save everyone by tossing their brains at it.

They actually survived by copying themselves to the net like Kuze was planning and reappear as the Major's hacking assistants in Solid State Society

>> No.39974594


I appreciate the alteration you made

>> No.39974677

I don't see it.

>> No.39974731


>> No.39974761

Open both and skip back and forth paying attention to the eye and brow region.

>> No.39974767

Open both up and change back and forth between them.

Hint: Eyebrows.

>> No.39974779

Not this anon but to add to this, the song is called 'We are all alive' which ties into all the Tachikomas's wish to actually have a Ghost.


>> No.39974893


Wait, where's slutty teen Major from that one Tachikoma episode? The one with the dog?

>> No.39975288

CS was an affliction of those who had undergone cyberisation but is nothing to do with prosthetics, other than cyberisation being a prerequisite for FULL prosthetics.
e.g. Togusa had a cyberbrain, but had an otherwise natural body. Eka Tokura had one of the first cyberbrains, but also had an entirely natural body. Ishikawa is only partially prosthetic (it's never explained exactly how much though, but sufficient that being next to their exploding tiltrotor is life-threatening while it wasn't to the rest of the team). The girl in episode 8 would have needed extensive prosthetics (her heart, and other organs that would fail under the strain of supporting the prosthetic heart) but not necessarily cyberisation.

In GiTS, and Stand Alone Complex in particular, prosthetics come with the downsides that they are expensive - enough that refugees would risk their lives in obviously shady and life-threatening work for the promise of one, and that effectively the only people with high-grade bodies are military or ex-military like the PKF - and are pervasive - people are generally all-natural or fully-prosthetic, due to issues integrating prosthetics with the natural body. You might have someone who has lost an arm with a prosthetic replacement, but internal organs are treated as an all-or-nothing prospect.

>> No.39975311


One aspect that doesn't get much coverage is how the Major differs in control of her body compared to most prosthetic users. The Major grey up from an early age in progressively upgraded prosthetic bodies, in the early days of total prosthetic development. She was controlling her body directly. Users that swap to a prosthetic body later in life as an adult (which is generally encouraged due to the issues with child prosthetics and growth, and as a patter of practicality due to the cost) do not tackle this learning curve head on, and instead utilise control software to interpret the commands their (cyber)brain is sending - or rather, would be sending - to their natural body, and interpret that into commands to the prosthetics for them. The Major exploits this to hijack the body of a full-cyborg policewoman in Dejima by attacking the control software. Other members of Section 9, Batou in particular, are similarly skilled, but still noticeable less effective in their ability to use their bodies to their full capability. This is noticeable in Batou and Kuze's knife/fist-fight in Etorofu, where Kuze's similar childhood cyberisation and full prosthetic development to the Major gave him an edge, even with a notionally older and inferior PKF body to Batou's modern body.

>> No.39975465

I know both Zealot Miniatures and Reaper Bones have Kusinagi minis.

>> No.39975574

>I liked ARISE because it slowly constructed her team
First episode:
>Major turns up, is a total moron to do with anything hacking related (let's just shove this random object directly into my brain! WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG?!
>Aramaki turns up, is actually competant
>Togusa turns up for NO REASON WHATSOVER OTHER THAN 'WE NEED TOGUSA IN THE SHOW'. He serves no purpose for the entire episode other than to tag along
>Batou turns up. The Major immediately calls him "Batou the Ranger" like some fucking famous superhero, even though they've never met. A famous active spec-ops guy. For fucks sake
>Saitou turns up as a piece of shit., Let's recruit him anyway for no particular reason other than he's nearby!
Arise shit over everything that made Stand Alone Complex enjoyable. SAC had a cast of intelligent, competent characters, solving difficult problems (whoo, government corruption and extortion scandals!) to the best of their ability. Arise has a cast of people with no particular competence toss the idiot ball around until the bad guy ends up holding it at the end of the episode.

>> No.39975651

>Arise shit over everything that made Stand Alone Complex enjoyable
>2nd Gig shit over everything that made Stand Alone Complex enjoyable

>> No.39975683

It wasn't as strong a plot as the first season tl;dr Gouda has Brain Problems, but it was still a solid show, even when compared to SAC.
Arise wasn't even a solid show on it's own.

>> No.39975760

I dunno m80.
I feel like mary sue regenerating cyborgs kind of shit on a lot of the world building from the first series

>> No.39975769

Rewatching 2nd GiG during the run up the the UK elections, the parallels are hilarious
>hot-button refugee^h^h^h^h^h^h^h 'immigrant' naturalisation issue
>Interceptors^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h police-work body-camera ethics debate
>Political infighting between ostensible government partners
>watching ideas get seeded and propagated at awfully convenient times to coincide with upcoming speeches

>> No.39975853

Kuze's PKF body regenerated awfully slowly, and in overall performance was far superior to modern bodies (remember, he got the PKF body nearly a decade before the events of 2nd GiG), and it was a mass-produced soldier's body rather than a personalised and tuned ultra-spec body like Section 9 receive. Mechanically he was outclassed, and most of what he achieved ideologically was due to Gouda abusing the resources of the CIB to prop him up until he achieved a 'critical mass' of refugee support.

>> No.39976074
File: 270 KB, 2550x3300, SACCSHEET1ROUGHDRAFT.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Here's a rough draft of a character sheet for the Stand Alone Complex tabletop game I'm working on.

I'd love it if I could get some reactions and feedback from everyone. Am I going in a good direction? Do you all feel the new skills are appropriate? Etc.

>> No.39976928

> Tranhuman space

You'd be the first person on TG to even be aware that it exists

>That's how you end up with post-cyberpunk. Lots of the same themes but more grey than the black and white of The Man and the punks. You often end up with government or corporate protagonists now (GitS being the obvious example). Post-Cyberpunk is more defined by what it isn't that what it is.

And that's terrible.

Beside apart from working for the man none the characters of GITS are really that more white that an average Gibson Street punk. The characters are all incredibly cynical and brutal, committing murders for trivial matters or simply because the man told them to.

>> No.39977007

>Beside apart from working for the man none the characters of GITS are really that more white that an average Gibson Street punk. The characters are all incredibly cynical and brutal, committing murders for trivial matters or simply because the man told them to.
You've never actually read or watched GiTS, have you?

>> No.39977050

With how big a role hacking plays in Stand Alone Complex, I feel like just boiling it down to a single stat doesn't cover it well.

>> No.39977133 [SPOILER] 
File: 38 KB, 429x343, 1431729590958.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Literally the first thing she does in Ghost in shell movie Is brutally murder a guy because they can't get an extradition order .

She slightly better in standalone complex but not by much .

Despite the character wondering if she lost her humanity by becoming a cyborg she needed not worry, she lost her humanity long ago.

She was always a monster, they just gave her claws.

>> No.39977811

>Literally the first thing she does in Ghost in shell movie Is brutally murder a guy because they can't get an extradition order .
No, they kill the guy from the Republic of gavel attempting to abduct Daita, the head programmer of Project 2501.

>> No.39977937

From what I remembered he was attempting to leave under's his own free will because he got a better offer from other nation.

Regardless she totes a wasted a guy simply because he try to object object on diplomatic grounds .

But hey that piece of paper could've been sharp. What if he knew origami?

>> No.39978229

Hey isn't there a copy of that infinity Rpg floated around the net at the moment?

That should work perfectly

>> No.39978232

>From what I remembered he was attempting to leave under's his own free will because he got a better offer from other nation.
The guy who was shot was NOT Daita, it was the unnamed official from the foreign nation (implied, but never stated, to the the Republic of Gavel).

>> No.39978874

So she brutally kills a guy to prevent a programmer requesting asylum from a foreign nation. How does this support your argument, again?

>> No.39979148

- Japan has a national security emigration exemption law. Basically, if you're working on a classified project, you're prohibited from leaving the country.
- Gavel had literally just been through a military coup-de-etat
- A whole episode of 2nd GiG was dedicated to making the point of how difficult it is to take down a cyborg, and how 'reasonable force' against a prosthetic body is dramatic overkill for a normal one. The official is a full-prosthetic cyborg (as can be seen by checking the freezeframa)
- Section 9 aren't going around killing people for fun. They're a paramilitary unit, if something has come into their purview it's already escalated past low-energy solutions

>> No.39979485

>Literally the first thing she does in Ghost in shell movie Is brutally murder a guy
Still this.

>> No.39982260

She still murders a man dude.

Beside I think there is some confusion between stand alone complex and the movie.

She's a lot more Sympathetic in TV show then the the 90s movie (which oddly was set in Hong Kong not Japan which rises the question as to who section 9 was working for) she is still however portrayed as a hardened cold blooded killer, and not in sanitised 'pulpy' secret agent fashion.

You can't help but think Masamune Shirow might be the Japanese frank Miller. You can't think he's making some subtle satire about sexual objectification and crypto fascism and gratuitous militant homoerotic fetishes but then you realise he's actually serious.

>> No.39982661

Well yeah, it's going to show them but they're distinctively not part of her team yet. It would be fucking stupid if they suddenly came together. Technically the unit isn't even made yet, not even the Major works in Section 9, she's a freelance contractor for Aramaki.

It's like you don't pay attention to what you're watching.

Also quit expecting everything to be like SAC. SAC was amazing, but Arise isn't SAC.

>> No.39982725

>subtle satire about sexual objectification

No, the guy is quite the pervert, even if he gets scientific with it.

>> No.39985563

Tells a good story, though.

>> No.39985748


Perverts usually do, that's why we love 'em.

>> No.39985754

So...DnD 5E?

>> No.39985953

I can't figure out why you'd bother, but for a complete lack of access to anything more suitable. If they're posting, that can't be the case.

>> No.39986312

Anyway infinity sounds perfect for this. Not only is is it's look pretty much a rip-off of GITS but it's rules is pretty realistic and 'tactical' by tabletop war game standards.

There is an actual proper RPG coming out soon. I don't know much about it but apparently it's pretty close to the main rules but with a 2d20 system.

>> No.39986358
File: 27 KB, 384x384, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Forgot pic

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