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36566312 No.36566312 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Android: Netrunner General

Last thread at bump limit!

Post Netrunner things here!

The Source Spoilers here -

All spoilers from the System Crash draft -

O&C Spoilers here -

Previous Thread - >>36528718

What should I buy? - http://www.reddit.com/r/Netrunner/wiki/buyingguide

>> No.36566373

I know, right? I was planning to slowly try to catch up to the recent releases too, so I could jump in with the playerbase and not feel left out, but I guess not.

Dear God, I hope so. What packs are being reprinted? Just the early ones? I know I have some time, but I'm trying to get the Genesis ASAP, so I can open up my options and play with different styles that having other identities gives me.

>> No.36566415

Game sounds like 2 people playing single player games and seeing who gets the highest score.

>> No.36566417

>Anyone who thinks any deck has a better than 60% win rate against the field has almost certainly never played any game at a even moderate level.

>> No.36566477

Fucking hope so.

The only problem with all this new info is waiting for it to get printed/delivered.

With SanSan packs 1 and 2 announced, and O&C spoilered, I feel like a kid that's seen the presents on top of the wardrobe

>> No.36566498

60% is damn high, no way RP is that good.

>> No.36566516

Only Jinteki RP and PE both break 60% win rate at the top level of play.

Dan says he is still seeing a 85-90% win rate as RP and Minh Tran says his PE sees around that rate VS decks that don't run Feedback Filter and 60% VS decks that do.

>> No.36566539

Yeah, the Genesis Cycle and Creation and Control is currently being reprinted.

Try and organise lends by your playgroup in the meantime. It sucks, but whatever.

>> No.36566566

It's easy for people to make up numbers about their private testing. It's completely meaningless, just like it was when NEH was supposedly scoring 90% in testing.

>> No.36566605

> I know I have some time, but I'm trying to get the Genesis ASAP, so I can open up my options and play with different styles that having other identities gives me.

You don't have to buy them in order! It'd be totally fine to start from non-Genesis.

>> No.36566612

I love how hard /tg/ works to listen to the top players in the world about the state of the game.

I am better none of you play in top level metas (likely mostly OCTGN players). When you are in the top metas playing the top players they mostly agree on how powerful those decks are in the hands of a master.

>> No.36566615

>Shapers don't run Feedback Filter
>Shapers do run Deus X + Clone Chip and Levy, which are significantly better.
>Shapers win 10-15%
This analysis sounds accurate.

>> No.36566619

These sound fabricated.

Dan's the best player in the world and he's playing a VERY good Corp deck, of course he'll win a lot in his local meta...

>> No.36566649

Read his own report.

>> No.36566669

Stimhack is a total circlejerk and the vast majority of the jerkoffs are not the top players.

I made the top 4 of 2 regionals, and just missed the top 16 in nationals this year, I play regularly with 4 of those top 16, one of whom was top 16 at worlds. In no way does anyone believe any deck is winning 80% of it's games.

>> No.36566695

>Circle jerk
>Consistently the best players in the world from tournament results.


>> No.36566755

The vast majority of regular posters are not any good. As far as I can tell, 2 or 3 very strong players post regularly, and others only very occasionally.

Quotes 90% but gives no details as to how this number comes about, says nothing much about Clone Chip + Deus X which destroys him once set up.

Putting big numbers on the internet gets attention from idiots. No deck scores 90% against it's best matchup, let alone the field.

>> No.36566819

Clone Chip + Deus X is really fucking easy to beat as PE and if you don't get that you are at most a Tier 2 player.

>> No.36566897

It's good, yeah, but a good PE player has tools against it (e.g. Overwriter).

It's not instant win, but it helps the matchup a LOT.

>> No.36566923

(I've played both sides of the matchup quite a bit)

>> No.36566928

>Anything in the deck that does more than 1 damage turned off.
>Easy to play around.
No it isn't, it's dead easy for a competent runner to deal with everything else in the deck, and there's nothing in that build that actually deals with Deus X.

>> No.36566942


Wow, this general is cancerous.

>> No.36566961

It is turned off once per Deus X hit. You force them to burn it when you want them too and not when they want too. They can only use it so many times and you can deal big damage more times then they can recover it.

>> No.36566971

Just so you know, the person who posts the spoilers frequents the thread, but 4chan is not a good place for permanent spoilers.

>> No.36566985

Never said it was easy to play around. I said you *can* play around it.

Deus X doesn't stop Cerebral Overwriter.

>> No.36567014

Generally the corp doesn't get to choose when the runner hits Snares and Fetals.

2 free hits against Snare/Fetal ought to be enough for the runner to win really. With 3 clone chips and 1 levy (and maybe test runs), there's likely to be far more than that available.

>> No.36567028

(and she also only posts the big spoilers to reddit and that's about it)

>> No.36567029

You are entirely ignoring Ronin, the card that won him near all his games.

>> No.36567032

>Clone Chip + Deus X is really fucking easy to beat as PE
>Never said it was easy to play around.


>> No.36567091

Okay? So i was right when i said that this general is cancerous.

>> No.36567100

The supposedly 90% deck doesn't have Cerebral Overwriter.

If the corp is spending a card, 5 clicks and 4 credits to take out a Deus X, I am a happy man. Furthermore, I'm probably not in the habit of ending turns with 2 cards in hand, so I may not even use it.

>> No.36567162

You keep saying how easy it is for you to beat but the Deck has the results to counter your claims.

Kate decks with Deus X, Clone Chips, Lev did not have the results. So all the supporting data shows you are just wrong.

Unless you want to be another one of those 4chan posers who keep saying "I'd have been those decks if I had wasted my time going to worlds" just drop it and listen to the people who did get their results.

>> No.36567199

It does have other ways to play around it though, e.g. Shattered Remains.

>> No.36567242

>a card, 5 clicks and 4 credits
It's like you didn't watch any of the PE matches where a Mushin no Shin'd Ronin was the cause of a flatline a dozen turns of attrition later.

>> No.36567251

He literally says in the deck you linked to that he wins 30% vs Feedback Filter. Deus X and Clone Chip are definitely worse for him, and Kate was the second most successful runner ID at worlds.

The deck is extremely easy to beat if you respect that it exists when you're building. It's much better as a surprise threat, but it's not anymore.

>> No.36567283

Just stop fighting with the retard he has no idea what he is talking about.

He says that FF is the worst card for him to deal with and he beat many Deus X - Clone Chip decks at Worlds (I watched his games).
FF counters his deck hard as it is just a better card for dealing with his style of deck, Deus X is annoying but it is not that hard to play around if you know what you are doing.

>> No.36567284

I'm happy if he's wasting Mushins to kill Deus X too.

>> No.36567292

>and Kate was the second most successful runner ID at worlds

Kate came third, did she?

>> No.36567323

Highest Kate deck is 9th.

>> No.36567360

The top Kate came 9th. The entire top 8 was Crim, 7 Andys with a Gabe at 3rd.

>> No.36567364

It is hardly a surprise threat when it has has been a consistently good archetype for months.

Jinteki PE and RP have both been getting strong results for a long time and you just seem to be discounting them entirely.
Have you played VS Tier 1 players using them? Have you watched Tier 1 matches with them?

You are getting into the "Ha ha I am acting retarded, I tolled you!" area.

>> No.36567369

>One player does well with Gabe in knockout round.
>Multiple players do well with Kate.

Kate came 1st in the swiss, which is much more relevant, 2 more finished ahead of that Gabe deck.

>> No.36567420

I think they're fine decks. RP is probably around 55% right now. PE is probably below 50% because people are now very aware of it and every deck has feedback filter or deus x.

It was a surprise deck because plenty of players hadn't prepared their decks for it.

And I've played 50+ matches both with and against it against the national champion of my country to help prep him for worlds. He did run FF.

>> No.36567426

How is that more relevant, Who you matched VS in Swiss was really fucking random (It was based off the first letter of your last name) that it was almost meaningless,.

For all you know that Kate player only ran into good match ups the entire way.
Top 18 matches are what matter as they are all recorded and we know what played what.

>> No.36567451

>That many rounds of swiss
>Completely random

Do you even understand how a swiss system works?

>> No.36567452

There were *far* less Gabe players.

Gabe placed overall higher and there were more people playaing him.

>> No.36567481

Gabe didn't place higher overall. You can't count 1 or 2 knockout matches that might not even have been the relevant identities above lots of rounds of swiss. 3 Kate decks finished above Gabe.

>> No.36567516

Yes I do but FFG did it wrong and fucked it up badly. Did you even go to Worlds or read the complaints after?

Their new system crashed before the start of the tournament so they just matched people up on a excel sheet based on the first letter of your last name.
After the first round they just took people with the name number of points and did the same thing. Then did anything that did not mesh up by hand.

I train with Jens and Jeremy at the FFG Center all the time, They both agree that PE and RP are the best decks in the game by far right now.

>> No.36567571

Players who made the top 16 did not go up against shit decks all the way. It's ludicrous to suggest that's even a possibility.

55% would make a deck one of the best in the game. Anyone who thinks PE is one of the best decks doesn't understand metagaming. Understanding metagaming is not necessary for being able to play the game well.

>> No.36567627

Never claimed that. Just said some people got good match ups all the way and the swiss was done wrong.

Have you ever thought you might just be wrong? You seem to refuse to listen to anything people are saying and just screaming "I AM RIGHT".
PE's power yes can be soft countered with a FF build right now, the top player of it even admits it. Is that card worth dropping in all decks just to deal with PE? With it's win rate maybe, but that is up to the designer of the deck to make their mind up about.

RP can't really be countered in the current card pool and beating it mostly comes down to luck. If it gets rolling it just wins.

>> No.36567652

At this point I can't tell whether the two of you are agreeing or disagreeing.

>> No.36567707

Have you considered you might be wrong? There's no way a deck that is 30% against the most common deck in the game (Every Andromeda is running FF right now) is one of the best decks. RP is good, but it isn't winning 90% of it's games against good opponents, and it is attackable.

Given that my objectionable statement was saying that a deck winning 90% was ridiculous, there's very little to actually debate.

>> No.36567743

I have NEVER seen a Andromeda with a Feedback Filter outside of Minh Tran him self at worlds.
Now you are just lying to try and prove your point.

You have yet to show anything to disprove this claim while I have proof so far from the worlds results and reports. You can also look at reports at other tournaments where RP and PE won and see them also so more or less the same thing.

>> No.36567775

I've played 2 tournaments since worlds, and everyone was running FF. That PE deck has been moderately popular on this side of the atlantic forever. It doesn't score better than anything else.

>> No.36567795

list the tournaments and their results on stimhack. Prove you are not just lying.

>> No.36567810

>Last tournament listed on Stimhack

Guess nobody's played this game in months.

>> No.36567828

Ok if they are not on stimhack link to reports from them. Prove the tournaments really happened and people run decks like you claim.

>> No.36567840

>People writing reports for a GNK event.

What universe is it you're living in?

>> No.36567841

I don't see it at all, and it wasn't in any big tournaments.

I think it's popular in some metas where PE is big, though, Minh Tran said that 50% of the top 8 were running Feedback Filter at the Dutch Nationals.

>> No.36567850

Deus Ex is great for if you grab a Snare!, but outside that it really isn't great against PE. You need consistent defense against small amounts of ND, not occasionally recur able defense against bunches. Feedback Filter, even Net Shield are the way to go against PE.

>> No.36567869

Levy AR is the other piece of the puzzle. That and a willingness to draw plenty.

PE tends to be pretty dependent on you hitting something nasty, or you running out of cards. Deus X prevents the former, and Levy prevents the latter.

>> No.36567929

>What even is a "sign" of power creep. Either power is creeping or it isn't.

It's pretty simple: it's something that look like it could be power creep in action but you're not certain it goes beyond what would be healthy for the game.

It may trouble you to discover that some people do not see the world in binary absolutes, and have enough humility to doubt their own observations.

So: it looks like it may be to me, but I may overstating things and am aware I need more data before I can make a claim. So it's a sign. A hint if you prefer. That is: not a proof yet.

>> No.36567949

/tg/, I have seen zero interest in Edward Kim since the other O&C IDs were spoiled. Have any of you looked into him?

>> No.36567993

Deus X is in more or less every Kate deck, along with things that work well with it that you're playing anyway (Clone Chip, SMC). It's only relevant in the Jinteki match. If Feedback Filter was better, it could easily be swapped out for it. As such, it's clear that Shaper players think Deus X is better.

Like Whizzard he's too matchup dependant, and he's also kind of luck based. Not especially exciting.

>> No.36567995

Whizzard is better is the current train of thought here.

>> No.36567997

I know you guys work a little slower than Reddit when it comes to spoilers, but I'm guessing you guys have already talked about Breaker Bay?


>> No.36568019

Covered it last thread before Reddit even had a topic up.

>> No.36568117

That would be impossible, because I posted it last thread after seeing it on Reddit.

>> No.36568132

Yup, my thoughts were:

Breaker Bay is 0 inf, 0 cost

Every asset and non-region upgrade, save two are free

Free Eve.
Free City Surveillance
Free Hostile Infrastructure
1 cred Root
1 cred Off the Grid (which isn't a region)

Blue Sun loves it

>> No.36568154

Prove it. I am tired of shitty lying on 4chan.

>> No.36568156

It counts for the Blue Sun pickup too, so you'd have to trash it.

>> No.36568164

>Blue Sun loves it
I think that unless you had some way of trashing Breaker Bay they'd only be worth 0-1 credits each for the ability.

>> No.36568167


I think you're misrepresenting the case, last conversation we had on the subject matter ended on the opinion that Whizzard's innate ability was a bit stronger, but that both abilities were basically swap-able - not to mention emulate-able within the faction card pool - and which would end up performing better would heavily be meta dependent.

I'm mostly exited because we have a Vietnamese player named Kim that looks enough like the card that it's going to become his ID, like it or not.

>> No.36568217

Mouse over "4 hours ago" and it displays 15:35:04 UTC.

10:38:07 EST (I think it's EST? Either way, they're within the same hour, but this is 3 minutes later)

>> No.36568238 [SPOILER] 
File: 79 KB, 900x675, 1417725311556.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Prove excepted!

>> No.36568245

Is there anything that states you get the current rez cost, rather than its normal rez cost with Blue Sun?

And you can pick up Breaker Bay before you pick up the asset, if you really want to.

>> No.36568264

Can confirm it's est. Anon's story checks out.

>> No.36568276

It's the same way it interacts with Xanadu and Rook last I checked.
Can't pick them up in the same turn, which nerfs it a bit.

>> No.36568287

We already know it's functionality with Rook, Xanadu and others. Blue Sun says rez cost, these cards affect the rez cost, so they affect Blue Sun.

>> No.36568289

There's nothing that explicitly states it, as this is part of the rules.

The rez cost goes up by cards like Xanadu even if they are rezzed - rez cost changing cards never specify only unrezzed things.

This interaction has been established to work this way in the past.

>> No.36568328

Having to waste a Blue Sun activation and replay the grid kind of ruins it.

>> No.36568358

That's not something I would ever have assumed, is it in the latest FAQ?

Still, you can use Breaker Bay to have a silly number of upgrades protecting a server, which is pretty cool.
And free assets is very nice.

>> No.36568379

It doesn't need to be. Blue Sun cares about the rez cost. These cards change the rez cost. There's nothing remotely unclear about it.

>> No.36568592


I know I'm tired and all, but for a sec I read that card as: "you may install another card of the same type from your grip *instead*.

And then my mind went blank from the "what the fuck?" induced.

>> No.36568632

I would assume standard rez cost, not rez cost at the moment of taking the card back, but whatever.

Hayley Kaplan looks like a pretty good ID.
I believe one spoilerfag (maybe even snow-jax) said they liked the new "astronomy-focused shaper". I can see why

>> No.36568653


Better if I don't forget the card. I didn't lie about being tired.

Oh "Duplicate exists", so I'm talking about... Hayley Kaplan.

>> No.36569352

When FFG makes decisions on card interactions, do they look them up in a rule book that dictates what happens when our is it what Lucas thinks should happen?

>> No.36569409

Mostly what Lucas thinks at the moment.

>> No.36569684

Well, obviously the're designed in a specific way, but Netrunner has a very specific and well-established set of rules (i.e. what constitutes a "successful run").

If you really knew all of Netrunner's rules you'd be able to tell what a card did by looking at it, pretty much without exception.

>> No.36569885

Having played since the start of the game, and also being able to talk to Lukas a few times (last GenCon in particular when Netrunner wasn't going on) it's a combination of both. When a new mechanic or interaction is introduced (the Caissa interaction with Scheherazade is a good example) it generally comes down to the intent and/or design of the cards.

After that point though, once a certain interaction style is defined, either through errata or elsewhere) they reference back to that. A good example of that is how the various 'prevention' mechanics interact (can't trash Sacrificial Construct to save Deus X after it fires); after the first instance was defined, everything goes back to that ruling.

>> No.36569940

Grumble grumble psychographics grumble donut grumble grumble

>> No.36570290

Honestly that does make sense, and I'd be very surprised if every other X card didn't work that way.

>> No.36570453

Complete random musings time:

Recruiting Trip


Trash X connections. For each connection trashed this way, you may install a sysop, executive or clone from HQ or Archives.

Play only if the runner is tagged.

>> No.36570520

Not double, you can see it's just a pure Operation

>> No.36570568


Yup, hence why "complete random".

I'm just trying to match the fluff/flavor with a card effect.

That being said, if you want the same effect as a simple, I have no issue with it.

>> No.36570602

Magical Hats
As an extra cost to play this card pay [click] [click]
Install up to 3 Agendas, Assets, or Upgrades in new remote servers from HQ, R&D, or Archives.
Place 5 Advancement Counters on each card you install.
The Runner looks the other way and you may move the location of your remote servers.

>> No.36570624

Oh and you can't rez or score any cards installed this way this turn.

>> No.36570660


a) I hadn't noticed they had announced a Magical Hat card. Where ? I want to see it !

b) You didn't even introduce a slap your opponent mechanic, I'm disappointed in you. And so are your parents.

>> No.36570778

I was just making shit up off the top of my head. But I'd love to see this card.
Did they just install 2 Junebugs and a Overwriter?
Did they just install 7 Agenda points?

Only one way to find out! (use drive-by and make the runner cry).

>> No.36570908

Actual potentials for cards, from the text of the announcement page

Does "boiroid neural channeling techniques", apparently
>Gore School of Network Architecture
"educates the sysops and cybersec administrators"
>LibArts School
Less likely to be a card, but maybe. Shaper, Anarch or NBN?

>"intern with Jinteki Biotech"
Probably is/related to Recruiting Trip (or Interns)
>"Research grant from Haas-Bioroid"
I'm expecting something like "take away BP for a big stack of cash?", but could easily be corp or runner
>Something to do with Student Loans
Courtesy of Weyland, natch

NeoTokyo Daigaku University may also turn up at some point way in the future

>> No.36571325

I'll just leave this here:

>> No.36571369

You mean that shit site that almost killed NetrunnerDB?

>> No.36571411

that's actually not true. Watch the interview with the owner of FFG, it was just the guy who owned NetrunnerDB being a cunt, essentially

>> No.36571471

Alsciende is a fucking champion of freedom in gaming and women online. So fuck your shitlord bullshit and go back to sucking corporate cock.

>> No.36571577

db0 pls go

>> No.36571661 [SPOILER] 
File: 128 KB, 423x600, 1417735848515.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

While I am not that glowing hero of women and social rights that you speak of it is an honor to be called such.

We can all hope to only be a pure and honest as him in our dealings and lives. For without men like him fighting back at the edges of this rape loving culture we'd go back to the dark days of women slaves in each home and poor PoCs working in the fields. All while the white demons sit in their homes patting them selves on the back for being foolish and abusing the poor people around them to get what they want.

>> No.36571743


Have you ever visited a Turkish prison ?

>> No.36571827

While the plight of people in third world nations is awful I and others like me feel that the suffering of women in the first world nations is worse over all.
Women here in the first world do not have the chance to fight for their rights like women in the third do. If they speak out they are doxxed, given death threats, and pushed from their homes out of fear for their lives.

You can't understand the pain a women feels each day when even walking to the store they get assaulted by hundreds of men constantly assaulting them for their own sexual pleasure and desire.
The only way women can become the strong perfect angels they are is for men like us to protect them from other awful men, so that they get a chance to grow up to be what a women in this world needs to be.

Disagreeing with me just means you hate women and want to keep allowing the constant rape in our culture.

>> No.36571847

Damn right

>> No.36571869


>> No.36571922

This is a great guide for getting a local community going. Add it to the OP for the next thread please.

>> No.36571928

>"Research grant from Haas-Bioroid"
I'm expecting something like "take away BP for a big stack of cash?"

I'm somehow liking the idea of that, if priced correctly.

"Take that load of cash to fund cancer research or whatever is fashionable these days, and let's forget about me having some guy working on a toaster's brain plastered on a screen. No, we shall not mention the code the toaster was running either.".

>> No.36571961

Sounds like an Agenda to me honestly.

>> No.36571966


Which is the strongest ? The hippopotaroid, or the clonephant ?

>> No.36571993

Yeah, the OP is missing lots compared to other generals.

Will add it to the next thread.

>> No.36572005
File: 336 KB, 600x385, Screen-shot-2012-05-25-at-12.15.51-AM-600x385.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Ancient Psychic Tandem War Elephant.

>> No.36572132


Hmmm... BP removal agenda.... nope, don't really need another one do we ? Or maybe yes, what do I know ?

Oh well, I liked that anon's idea of paying the runner to remove a BP... interesting trade off.

>> No.36572165

Spend money to add Agenda Counters and Burn one to remove a Bad Pub?

>> No.36572298


No... see, maybe I'm wrong on that call, and it couldn't be a lone card, it would have to come along play-set designed about playing this way, but what I like is the idea that you're encouraging the corp to go for the long game.

You know, let the corp give some cash to the runner *now* because it's making the estimation that on the long it's going to win on the transaction from the BP removal, even if it's going to suffer for a short while.

There's an interesting risk to be taken here.

But then, well, I'm still the one hoping for development for the Link/Trace game, so what do I know ?

>> No.36572299

>Game Day
>Off-Campus Apartment
>Beach Party

These Runner cards make no fucking sense. I've been so impressed with the theme and worldbuilding the cards provide from every single fucking card, but the damn cards here make no sense if you play any Runner that is not Hailey or Professor.

Imagine splashing this. The god damn autism alert inside me is saying 'why the fuck is Edward Kim at an off-campus apartment. why is this important?'

And Game Day? If I'm playing Exile, a depressed, probably desperate avenger of his girlfriend/wife/sister, why would I have a card about 'Game Day?'

The theme here is too tight. I hate it. These aren't god damn signature squads, these are cards made to go with any Runner.

>> No.36572340

Replicator is pretty crazy with Hayley.

>> No.36572375

>But then, well, I'm still the one hoping for development for the Link/Trace game, so what do I know ?

There are link based disposable breakers coming out soon, apparently, with an ID that has good synergy with them.

>> No.36572393

Game-Day: Spends time with other people at the school getting closer to them. Those connections you make fills up your hands with new options you can take.

Off-Campus Apartment: Offer up a crash house to your Connections, they reward you with more trust. That translates into a extra card in hand from a little extra info or goods they gave you.

Beach Party: You burn some time during your hack to hang out at the beach party (The time frame of Netrunner is never really laid out so I can see a game covering just a a day or two). Being there with the best and the brightest opens all kinds of new options for you use and having so many friends around allows you to have them act for you as well. You see this in having a large hand size as you now have a bigger network to work with.

>> No.36572412

>And Game Day? If I'm playing Exile, a depressed, probably desperate avenger of his girlfriend/wife/sister, why would I have a card about 'Game Day?'

Just because you're not part of the cheerful crowd and event doesn't mean you can't capitalize on it.
They're part of you're network, those students.

>why the fuck is Edward Kim at an off-campus apartment. why is this important?'

Because he can lend it to people to crash ? It's not as if there wasn't strong connection between union/labor and student movements. Though I'm more bothered by the fact that having such a resources would help protect you connections, not make them more vulnerable. But, oh well.

>> No.36572415

I for one am enjoying the Meat Space side of things for once.

>> No.36572495

>Connections, they reward you with more trust. That translates into a extra card in hand from a little extra info or goods they gave you.

Good point. Having used such a free, open, rolling location in the past, one thing is that, many people just come and go - and meet briefly - and it creates tenuous but numerous small new connections.

>> No.36572578


Yeah, I'm really enjoying what they've done with new Criminal breaker suite for that set.

As I was saying when it was introduced, it's really going to force to change your evaluation of the board state. Situations that would have seemed safe enough as the corp might no longer be.

Can't just use money as an evaluation of the potential of action of the runner. Not as definitively as it can be right now.

>> No.36572713


Was thinking about that. You're really going to want rock solid econ for her though. And I'm kinda worried how her income/spending is going to have to be balanced to make those free clicks worthwhile.

Oh well we have month ahead of us. We still have a hard time building properly for Nasir right now.

>> No.36572782


>> No.36572825


Meat, net, doesn't matter as long as you can trash things.

>> No.36572906

Just build her entirely recurring Econ. PPVP, Cyberfeeder. Cybsoft MacroDrive, Inside Man, Omni-Drive, etc.
Outside of that toss out an Opus and go to town!
Get the most insane rig ever going and just hammer away with a Maker's Eye and a Leg Work in one click.

>> No.36573057

>Just build her entirely recurring Econ. PPVP, Cyberfeeder. Cybsoft MacroDrive, Inside Man, Omni-Drive, etc.
>Outside of that toss out an Opus and go to town!

The Opus and the recurring builds are going to come with very different pacing. Not that they're exactly mutually exclusive.

What I mean is: ok, you're going to get those free clicks (from ID and probably console), but if you have to wait for the money-clicks to be able to act, you're not exactly faster, you're acting on mini-rushes, alternated by resource-gathering.

If you're acting on recurring econ, it's your initial set-up that's going to take some time hit in exchange of a stronger, more aggressive middle/late game build.

Optimally, you're probably going to want to balance the two in the deck. And that's where it's going to b tricky.

>> No.36573068

Hayley's Comet ultra combo!

Modded Install a Program -> Hayley install a program -> Comet play a Event.

2 Programs and 2 Events for 1 click. COMPRESSION!

>> No.36573096

What do you expect from the Jewish Runner?
Greedy as shit with her clicks.

>> No.36573254

She has some pretty nice synergy with ProCo already, this sort of stuff just adds more cherries to the already sweet cake.

>> No.36573332

I'd like to pop the cheeries in her cake if you know what I mean.

>> No.36573368
File: 45 KB, 421x577, Team Sponsor.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Who said it was a University game?

>> No.36573466


I'm wondering about ProCo myself. On the one hand, it seems like it's hitting the right notes of draw + econ power for her... on the other, I think for now it's only really going to come in support of whatever else econ you'll use - or you'll focus on cheap cards maybe ?

I was so focused on hardware/programs I totally disregarded the fact that she works also with resources... Nice.

>> No.36573510

Yeah, exactly. Stuff like Daily Casts is already sweet in ProCo based decks, and her ability has such a natural synergy with having cards in hand.

>> No.36573533

Why did FFG even print this card

>> No.36573606

Why not? We already have ICE that installs if subs fire. We even have ambushes that install other ambushes. Why not a free install on score? It's not like it rez it.

>> No.36573670


To spite you obviously.

They have an AI tied to some surveillance drones working full time on monitoring your psychological profile and behavior, and an algorithmically calculated optimal number of times each cycle, they develop cards for the sole purpose of causing you some form or other of mental arm.

Then they record the results to refine the process.

The end program developed ends up uploaded on a toaster.

>> No.36573973 [DELETED] 
File: 327 KB, 974x1138, Scientist Ice.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Some of the ICE from UCBB.

>> No.36574006

Why do you people keep referencing a toaster

>> No.36574060
File: 366 KB, 972x1276, Scientist Ice.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

It was from last thread

Here is some of the ICE from UCBB

>> No.36574092


Apparently, the guy that gets killed on Vulcan Coverup was working on something that looks like a toaster when you have the full uncropped image.

So now the question becomes: why did they kill him for a toaster ?

>> No.36574095

Gutenberg, my love, 6 strength, trace 7 for 2.

>> No.36574115


I like the idea of that fictional scientist among real historical figures.

>> No.36574117

But it just gives them a tag. If you wanted that, why not Data Raven?

>> No.36574139


Well, the runner can always choose not to take the tag with Data Raven.

>> No.36574158
File: 238 KB, 1012x900, tumblr_na2crgAZce1t02mc4o1_1280.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Huh? I just see GRNDL

>> No.36574169

He can etr, data raven cost 4, and it's only 4 str.
The only thing that beats Gutenberg is Chum into Data Raven. He either takes 3 damage or the tag.

>> No.36574172

Data Raven is also 100% safe to facecheck. Which is why I had considered replacing it with Virgo.

>> No.36574195


I don't know, just following a claim by another anon here. I just ran with the idea. Was too silly not too.

>> No.36574196

It's actually the GRNDL platform, but that's no fun

It's an old trick, but a good one.
And the flavour/faction thing is spot on: Meru Mati is the scientist that made a Buckyweave structure, the super-strong material used to build the Beanstalk.

>> No.36574235


Too bad it's kinda underwhelming compared to the other ones.

>> No.36574327

It's very good in-faction. Might even replace Ice Wall... for me at least. Outside of advance.dec, of course. A half-cost Bastion on HQ, and a simple Ice Wall outside of it, I'd say it's good enough for a barrier.

Turing seems to be the one to watch out for, though, especially after Eater becomes a thing.

>> No.36574338

Yeah, it's easily the worst one there.
Not terrible, it's not Salvage, just not that great.

>> No.36574381


It's not bad by any means, it's just, you look at the three other and they all introduce some interesting bits of mechanics or numbers.

And then a pretty decent ETR. End of story. Not bad, just... well wouldn't it have been nice if it had been something cool too ?

>> No.36574400

Gutenberg is amazing in Tag Storm. Insanely taxing for the Runner to avoid that tag.

Meru Mati is ok in faction when trying to avoid advancable ICE.

Crick Is great over all. It goes nicely on remotes even as just a 3 str code gate for 1 credit.

Turing is just insane, it is a fucking beast when it comes to click tax. I highly expect it to go right into RP decks.

>> No.36574416

Just because no-one wants to splash a card doesn't make it bad. When's the last time you saw Curtain Wall out of faction? Or even Hadrian's? It's just the world we live in.

A world of boring, but incredibly efficient, walls.

For the record, I don't expect any of these ICE to be splashed, save perchance Turing, as previously stated.

>> No.36574441

We won't be getting The Source or Order and Chaos any time soon.


My suppler said early next year at the soonest with the slow downs. February most likely.

>> No.36574472


Yes... I'm not following you, where/when did I mention splashing ?

I just said that the three others had some cool bits and Meru Mati was just decently efficient, which is kinda disappointing by comparison.

That says nothing about the intrinsic value of the card. Or splashing, which wasn't even mentioned.

>> No.36574524

Perhaps I conflate some measure of "value" with the frequency other factions will want to spend their limited influence on them.

I'm okay with boring, though. I just think Meru Mati is great and fits verrrry nicely in my Weyland decks. As I said, barriers tend to be boring as shit, so I'm plenty used to it. Shit, Fire Wall and Asteroid Field are exciting in comparison, and even then they're just.... barriers.

>> No.36574526


Too bad if true. Hopefully at least this produces the best possible deal for everyone involved in those negotiations.

Worse I wish them. At least would have been worth the wait.

>> No.36574657


Now that I've made the rational post...





Please no !

I have an event to run for the end of the year !

>> No.36574713

It's the 4th of December, nothing getting shipped from that port was going to be sold this year.

Bad news for San San, maybe but if FFG planned to release O&C for christmas then it'll be fine

>> No.36574739

That report if from the 11th of last month.

>> No.36574746


My stimhack-eaten nerves thank you.

>> No.36574833

Ah, didn't notice that. But where does the West Coast ship to?

'Strya, and Asia?

Europe and the US should be okay, I think.
Though this could delay the next cycle.

>> No.36574861

The print in China and the games ship TO there to go to the USA.
So O&C and such are sitting in a metal box on a ship in that port right now.

Printing in the USA for Netrunner is still a ways off.

>> No.36574960
File: 69 KB, 600x804, B1w54hQCYAA6Fna.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Are you going to play this card /tg/?

>> No.36575011

Does not trigger from Archives so it is shit.

>> No.36575033

I can see it being good in Never Advance but I am not sure if there is the space.

>> No.36575143

Fun fact: you can tell if it's a corp cycle or a runner cycle by looking at which side comes first in the packs / expansion numbers.

This has to be deliberate.

>> No.36575179

It is. They said that in some interview I thing.

Really Corps are in a good place and with Clot and Traffic Jam coming out the FA annoying shit will become less an issue.

RP will be the only thing left and I expect some nerfs to that in the upcoming cards with all the action compression.

>> No.36575252


Two gained, two lost if trashed. I guess behind a RSVP could see several uses. Going to wait on new cards.

Right now how much value can you reliably hope to get out of this ?

>> No.36575300

Most the time it is a 4 credit tempo swing. Not awful but not that great as well.

>> No.36575378

Much like many people did with Shell Corp, I didn't notice it was an upgrade.
Still not great, but nowhere near as bad as I first thought

>> No.36575734

Had a rough idea of using it on a central in gangarin deep space, where I'd be running RSVP anyway.

>> No.36575790

Might be funny in Industrial Genomics, give it a stupid trash cost and play Hostile Infrastructure

>> No.36575866

The problem with nerfing Fast Advance is that you're nerfing ALL Advance, which requires that you beef up Corp econ and ice to compensate for slower play, which means you need to beef runner programs and tricks for better access, which leads down to a slippery slope of power creep.

Let's hope these guys have it figured out.

>> No.36575891

Clot does not nerf Fast Advance at all. Traffic Jam does a little but it is just a Current so there are other counters.

>> No.36576803

I wasn't referring to any card in particular, though.

>> No.36577588
File: 39 KB, 200x295, netrunner-aujourd-oui.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Anyone think we'll get more french criminal cards? A card like pic attached might be fun to play around with.

>> No.36577823

Not the picture, the code. I have the deckbox as well, and can verify that it is indeed toaster code.

>> No.36577935

In O&C?

>> No.36578061

>Turing is just insane, it is a fucking beast when it comes to click tax. I highly expect it to go right into RP decks.

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills since everyone seems to be going ga ga over this. It is not click tax, because runners will extremely rarely go through it that way. It's a 5 strength (on a remote, 2 on a central) code gate with one non-hard-etr subroutine that can't be broken with AI. THAT COSTS 3 INFLUENCE. The only reason to use this is if you want to fuck with AI in HB without using any influence.

>> No.36578150

What? O&C has nothing to do with this. The winter Game Night Kit has Weyland deckboxes in it that feature the Vulcan Coverup art. The art is big enough that you can see what the code is about.

>> No.36578249
File: 212 KB, 800x720, WitnessTamperbig.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I did not know this, and had not heard about any kits, people talking about Weyland Boxes led me to think that O&C had gotten out early.

So the code next to the oil rig is toaster code? cool

>> No.36578334
File: 2.16 MB, 2836x2380, IMG.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Here, scanned it.

>> No.36578445

Toast is serious business.

>> No.36579987

Because of Domestic Sleepers.
Thats some great flavour, sleeper agent sports team.

>> No.36580065

Pretty sure order and chaos is already in the us, maybe some sansan stuff too.
The stuff ffg says like "on the boat" is nothing but lies.

>> No.36580167


He was second place at Worlds... Do you really doubt him? And he swapped the inf from Cerebral for Sweeps, which, against as heavily Andy a field as it was, was a good call.

>> No.36580211

What happens if you Mod out the Comet?

>> No.36580555

It can't trigger off the Modded as it's already been played.

>> No.36580802


>> No.36581075

Imagine playing against a PE with 23 credits after turn 1 because of double sweeps. I'd be terrified.

>> No.36581078

I like that the screen is broken, but since the image comes from a projector it isn't distorted at all.

>> No.36581183

Soo... why isn't the text mirrored even though we are looking at it from the wrong side of the monitor?

>> No.36581196

I was revising my stronger together deck and thought.
What if:
Industrial Genomics
Hostile Infrastructures
Red Herrings

>> No.36581248


If you build it, they'll come.

>> No.36581264

Colored toast is. Especially when you can choose the color.

>> No.36581265
File: 458 KB, 430x600, bc0f047c-01b1-427f-a439-d451eda02075.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

That feel when your favorite card rotates out soon.

>> No.36581276


>> No.36581294

2017 is not that far when you are as old as me. Years just fly past.

>> No.36581311

The only time I've ever seen this card was when I used it to proxy.

>> No.36581316

Really? With all the Runners here running at least 4 Link most games I always need it.

>> No.36581341

>see spoilers for new cards
>don't want to play anymore until those cards are released
>when the cards get released there's spoilers for new cards
>have to wait for those too
>tfw you never actually play again

Netrunner is a waiting game.

>> No.36581359


Another Link heavy local meta !

>> No.36581376

Tag Storm was ripping us all apart so most people went Link Heavy. Cloud Breakers + Opus + Battering Ram is the big deck right now.

NEH Speed decks never really took off as we have a few really nasty Noise and Roja ICE hate decks that it just can't seem to overcome.

>> No.36581746
File: 68 KB, 300x418, hudson-10.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Is anybody using this?
I'm thinking... Red herrings/Ash/Caprice, and this guy. Now the runner have to choose between accessing whatever is inside, or trashing it and never encounter it again.
The downside is that 2 clicks get you through, so... Heinlein grid/more bioroids/Tyr hand?

>> No.36581807


Decent taxing + limited protection against multi-access focusing decks.

Can be used for some funny tricks (Sakai swap, red herrings + trap, upgrade on central server etc...)

I like it.

>> No.36581833

Multi-Access is not the massive issue it was before.

Does nothing to stop Noise or Keyhole decks and those two are quickly becoming a major issue Corps have to focus on.

>> No.36581853

It works on Archives too, doesn't it?

>> No.36581877
File: 84 KB, 300x418, bc0f047c-01b1-427f-a439-d451eda06059.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

True but that almost helps Noise and Keyhole as that allows them to avoid ambushes while picking up Agendas.
Also most the time those decks win the game with the Hades Shard as the closing move.

>> No.36581894

It does nothing against Hades Shard, that much is true. But then again, there's nothing one can do against Hades Shard except preemptively using Jackson. So it's a non-issue.
>ambushes in the archives in HB

>> No.36581931

Cyberdex Virus Suite and Space Camp are both good fits for HB when they come out so it is something to think about.

>> No.36581968

I won't argue CVS, it's probably my favourite ambush and it's not even out yet. But how does Space Camp helps HB?

>> No.36582025

Thomas Haas combos/bluffs
Dropping extra tokens on a failed Cerebral Overwriter or Aggressive Secretary to make the Runner more likely to hit it just to be sure.

It is a good bluffing card and can also let you speed up Agendas on the table up by a click.

Architect on Archives with with 3 Space Camps in there.
They run it and let Architect trigger.
You install a card and advance it 3 times when they access. They are more or less forced to check that card just to be sure they did not give you a free Agenda.

>> No.36582282

The Twins: When is the last window to rez them if you wish to use them, and at which window do you actually activate them? I can't wrap my head around that card.

>> No.36582336 [DELETED] 

3.1, when the runner encounters the ice, after he uses icebreakers, but before the subroutines resolve.

>> No.36582342

Rez them on approaching the ICE, It triggers when they pass the ICE.

>> No.36582504

There's no window to rez non-ice at 3.1. You'd have to rez The Twins at 2.3 (the ice is being approached, but has not yet been encountered) which is also when the ice can be rezzed, and the runner has already decided to continue the run at 2.2 so he can't jack out. If the runner then passes that ice, that's when The Twins can trigger.

>> No.36584687

So who's the best Anarch to run Eater-Keyhole?

Or do you want that pair out of faction?

>> No.36584798

Noise. He would want to access archives anyway.

>> No.36584819

Matters on your goal Keyhole hammering likely Valencia as her Bad Pub and such allow for cheaper runs with Eater. You can run more Bad Pub giving cards to just keep free runs rolling.
Down side is 50 card deck means you need to run more ways to fetch Keyhole.

Noise is a good option if you are focusing on milling to win. Datasucker and Parasite will still be a big part of the deck to remove problem ICE so getting extra Mills for it helps. You also likely want to run Cache anyway for good Econ so that gives more Milling and low click Econ for Keyhole runs.

MaxX can be used to set up fast if you use Retrieval Run and Clone Chip to pull stuff out if it gets trashed, but you will just RNG lose games as her.

Reina Roja is not an awful option if you want to focus more on a ICE/Econ deny version of the deck with Account Siphons as well.

IMO it goes Valencia = Noise -> Roja -> MaxX -> All the other runners

>> No.36585854

I like this card, but I think will be phased out by Markus. I usually take Hudson when I want more cheap Bioroids with annoying effects. You can do some janky stuff with it, and it's neat. Too bad its a Bioroid and little unreliable for those janky things.

>> No.36586176


Gargarin is an additional cost so the runner can refuse to pay it to access product placement, making it less effective.

>> No.36586328

Until the runner access the card, all cards are facedown. He needs to pay to access a facedown card. The only exception to this is the archives, where all facedown cards are turned before the access begin.

>> No.36586456

Right, but if you see this in a server there's no reason to trash it. You can just avoid triggering it from then onwards.

>> No.36586462

This is wrong.
Before you access any card in Archives all facedown cards are turned faceup and then the Runner picks what they access in any order they want.

>> No.36586487

You both just said the same thing.

>> No.36586535 [DELETED] 

No he said he is a rape culture supporting shit lord that wants us all to keep digitally raping The Goddess Zoe.

>> No.36586906

I meant sticking it on centrals - makes RSVP a little more useful on other servers that way. Possibly with red herrings to stop agenda theft.

>> No.36587364


But then if it's on a central, the Gagarin ID effect doesn't trigger, so what do you think makes it interesting ?

Or is it just to capitalize on the fact that you were going to play RSVP anyway because it's Gagarin ?

>> No.36587770

Really loving the idea of three Subliminal Messaging in Industrial Genomics. If the runner doesn't run, you can take them all back and in HQ then Celebrity Gift + discard/Reuse/them the following turn, raising the trash cost of things again.

>> No.36588091

There's like, one archetype on each side for which this is even remotely accurate. The entirety of MtG is closer to that statement.

>> No.36588261

Industrial Genomics decks will need to have the perfect balance of making the choice of trashing expensive assets versus checking Archives a difficult decision.

If your assets and upgrades get out of control, I'll just Quality Time and eat the ~2-5 Net damage waiting for me in the archives, and reset the costs.

And while you set up those assets and upgrades I probably got some multiaccess in and have you pressured on points.

>> No.36588361


Yeah, the point is going to be taxing *just* the right amount.

One issue is going to be able to reset the Ar
chive tax when needed without burning your deck away needlessly.

On that front, I think Subliminal Messaging could prove invaluable.

I really don't think it's going to play like RP1.5. So to speak.

>> No.36588370
File: 424 KB, 625x626, FalseLead.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.36588400

I think the key is to run bootcamps along with several assets designed specifically to ruin certain strategies, and then use the bootcamps to find exactly what you need.

So, for example, you're up against shaper recursion. So you go find docklands crackdown and make their life hell with it.

Anarch keyhole decks? Put out two Hostiles as fast as possible, make them suffer for that keyhole.

I don't think you go sideways with IG. I think it's better to focus on only building one or two decently big servers specifically to ruin your opponents day, and then force them into taxing archive runs to make hitting those servers just that much worse.

>> No.36588411

I've been using him in front of Hokusai + Tori Hanzo.


>> No.36590208


Now I'm imagining a Sakai/Plan B troll deck with Gagarin.

Maybe even swapping Sakai for Sakai, just to see the runner's face.

>> No.36591305
File: 71 KB, 434x637, cards.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Game night kit tommorow

Need to spend 6 dots

>> No.36591408

2 Mushin

>> No.36591424

3 Counterstrikes.

>> No.36591495


>> No.36591522

(and -1 Biotic for the slots)

>> No.36591541

Architect is awful in that deck...

>> No.36591665

Why so?

I like that i can see top 5 for prepping turns

>> No.36591695

3 STR makes it easy to break and not really taxing. Not many cards in your deck reward you for the effect.

Roto is better in that slot with it's ETR.

>> No.36592327

2x DBS
1x Tollbooth
2x Lotus Field

Or 3x Punitive

>> No.36594324

(Or what the hell, Fuck the biotics, add Will-o'-the-Wisp to fuck with them trying to mess with your Architect)

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