Quantcast
[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / g / ic / jp / lit / sci / tg / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports / report a bug ] [ 4plebs / archived.moe / rbt ]

/vt/ is now archived.Become a Patron!

/tg/ - Traditional Games


View post   

[ Toggle deleted replies ]
File: 55 KB, 873x627, 1394276159057.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30707127 No.30707127 [DELETED]  [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Why have GW done a suppliment for a near unknown chapter (dork vongonce) when the old legions are still to be done!
FFS GW
Rant over thankyou

>> No.30707158

>>30707127
Because gee dubs is trying to take the CSM in a new direction, less legions more warbands

they choose to do this by focusing on a recent warband introduced for this purpose.

prepare your anus, i'm willing to bet the fluff hits to the major chapters in 7e will be..

Most significant

>> No.30707172

>>30707158
It just feels like a kick in the balls
As someone who has followed my loving papa nurgle for years, this just feels wrong

>> No.30707183

why red and gold

why

>> No.30707185

Crimson Slaughter are being made into new Chaos posterboys while Black Legion is pushed out of the scene.

Why exactly is GW doing this?
Well, for starters, because they can.

>> No.30707190

>>30707172
I bet it does.

I'm sure they'll bring in a new warband for nuglite marines to be

Something stupid like the cleaved or something

say goodbye to death guard, thats 30k now

>> No.30707193

>>30707158

why does GW want Chaos to be all about renegades but want normal Space Marines to be all about the Founding chapters?

>> No.30707208

>>30707193
Fucked if I know

Why does GW want the tyranids to be shit.

>> No.30707217

>>30707193
SM are "the good guys"*, they play by rules.
ChSM are "the bad guys"*, they don't follow rules.

* except that in the grim darkness of far future, everyone is actually just varying shade of evil.

>> No.30707233

>>30707208
Because they wrote in a galaxy-ending horror more devastating than chaos and then realized they didn't want one, so now they focus on making them lose at every turn in the fluff and being terrible on the tabletop.

>> No.30707242

>>30707208
>Why does GW want the tyranids to be shit.
GW knew the codex was bad, but reworking it would take time and sprues were already made and ready for shipping so they instead decided to push it out as is and hope for the best.

So basically "because speed of release is more improtant than quality".

>> No.30707247

>>30707242
this argument falls apart when its almost the same dex as 5e but worse

>> No.30707255

>>30707217
thats probably the best explanation

CSM don't want to follow the tactics of their legion cuz they're edgy and free and chaotic

>> No.30707260

>>30707183
The red as an opposite to Ultramarine's blue
Like Coke and Pepsi

>> No.30707268

so if its all about "renegades" why not hurons butcher boys? or is it simply they are unaligned?
oh well it just seems stupid to me sure as hell aint paying for it

>> No.30707273

>>30707268
Because the red corsairs are actually interesting

>> No.30707274

>>30707193

I don't play a founding chapter but I think it's kind of tacky to not have the focus be on founding chapters. Crimson Fists and BT are already pushing it, especially with the three of them forming a trifecta of Fist overrepresentation.

So on the other hand GW needs to get their shit together and focus on the original Chaos legions and not warbands.

>> No.30707275

>>30707247
The new book DID coves most important issues (as far as GW cares):
- cut Doom from the book
- cut Drop Pod Spore from the book
- introduced new Big Plastic Kit (two of them, actually)

>> No.30707277

>>30707260
Was the whole coke vs pepsi blind taste test ever proven?
Also be prepared for crappy warlord rules

>> No.30707283

>>30707277
>Also be prepared for crappy warlord rules
Also Posessed in Troop slot.

>> No.30707285

>>30707242
>>30707247

The newest Tyranid formations are retardedly good. They're basically charging you for their unfinished work and making you buy more models/rules if you want to "fix" your Tyranid army to actually be good.

Great way for them to salvage a shit codex they were forced to release prematurely and rake in money.

>> No.30707293

>>30707217
Even if you don't follow the rules, the chance of you coming from one of the traitor legions is much higher than with SM, where you got like 9 chapters that carry the name of the original legion and the rest are just successors. CSM were not split into chapters, so any old warband of them is still more or less part of the original legion or identifies as part of it.

>> No.30707296

>>30707277

Coke and Pepsi have very obviously different tastes. The current Coke straight from the can has a very strange tart taste, almost like lemon Coke. The fountain version/Coke in general has a more crisp taste than Pepsi. Haven't tried sugar cane glass bottled Coke.

Pepsi has a much sweeter corn syrupy fructose cola taste. It tastes heavier and thicker.

>> No.30707314

>>30707285
no shit

>> No.30707318

>>30707277
My 8th grade teacher set the experiment in class. Turned out most could tell the difference.

>> No.30707324

>>30707314
>no shit

Neither of you mentioned formations you stupid sack of shit.

>> No.30707348

Don't forget, all units featured in the new supplement get a new box, with the old sprues and now cost more, it was 1€ when I tried to figure out how much i save with the big box.
I guess this makes CSM Terminators the most expensive ones with the least options.

>> No.30707365

>>30707318
I wish I ever had teacher like that.

>> No.30707381

Well lets hope it isnt a crapfest like the black legion suppliment, just looked through it, only cool thing is the "it will not die" commander trait =/

>> No.30707424

So have Spiky Mehreens taken back the complaining crown from the Nids? Because, y'know, the Nids actually had something to complain about, not this 'GW won't let me buy an overpriced book about muh legion which makes pretty much no difference to how it actually plays' crap.

>> No.30707435

>>30707424
We'll see how long it lasts, Nids was a doozy.

>> No.30707440

>>30707424
I guess I'm among few who wants to see a ton of warbands instead of legions. Don't get me wrong, I love me some Iron Warriors but if I were to play those dudes I'd much rather be using 30k models anyhow.

>> No.30707474

>>30707435
Nids is still ongoing. We're still shit honestly.

i guess we're just more like CSMs now because instead of Heldrakes its take skyblight swarm

>> No.30707491

>>30707158
>ecause gee dubs is trying to take the CSM in a new direction, less legions more warbands.

Source?
>i'm willing to bet the fluff hits to the major chapters in 7e will be..
Based on?

>> No.30707504

>>30707491
Its obviously speculation, but i think its fairly well founded

>> No.30707516

>>30707474
>March, not running skyblight swarm spam, ISHYGDDTYDGGITYDOO

>> No.30707532

>>30707504
>well founded.
>speculation.
Which one of these is it? how exactly is it well founded? Given that the last release was Black Legion and they are essentially a reskin of the Sons of Horus with some added newbies and turncoats?

The only reason their aren't legion books is because they aren't ready to fully rinse our pockets yet, once they have some new kits they will either get their own codexes or supplements and fanboys will take out new mortgages or steal from their parents to buy it all.

>> No.30707553

>>30707440
>Not just playing an Iron Warriors warband

>> No.30707556

>>30707532
on top of which the 30k range hasn't been fully finished yet, releasing legions in 40k could feasibly damage the profit 30k is raking in for no significant gains

>> No.30707563

>>30707553
IW warbands wouldn't work well with the whole "THROW BODIES UPON BODIES UPON OUR ENEMIES' FORTRESSES UNTIL THEY CRUMBLE! IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT!" thing.

>> No.30707583

They earned it, I hope the Scourged get a supplement too.

>> No.30707591

>>30707556
This is a good point, especially with the website merge rumours.

>> No.30707592

>>30707532

Weren't the Black Legion already a Sons of Horus reskin?

/Shitty joke

>> No.30707609

>>30707556
This is a good point, its almost guaranteed 30k will do legion marines better.

>> No.30707612
File: 22 KB, 364x307, 1369998761702.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30707612

>>30707591

FW and GW online store mereger?

That would be great.
>GW's free shipping with FW's stuff

>> No.30707651

>>30707293
Sort of. Almost all of the Legion warbands, however, are restricted to the Eye of Terror since, aside from a few lucky breaks(like that one incursion into the Gothic sector and a few random jumps through war storms) they can't get past Cadia, so your chances of encountering them at all is about on par with encountering Grey Knights.

Renegade warbands, on the other hand, don't have to get through the Cadian Gate and rape, pillage, and plunder to their heart's content until someone manages to put them down.

>> No.30707682

>>30707563
>Not realizing that Iron Warriors use tons of human auxiliaries for just such a reason

Seriously, in almost every single piece of Iron Warrior fiction, they fight alongside human troops, I don't get why more people don't realize this.

>> No.30707697

>>30707682
I've been planning a IW army for the future. With either IG or Krieg allies.

Both would be used for massive amount of bodies and tons of artillery.

>> No.30707829

>>30707583

cant wait for Codex: Bleak Brotherhood

>> No.30707858

> This whole Loyalist-Codex thing is getting out of hand. We've produced too many and even then, nobody uses anything but White Scars.
> Let's roll back all of the Marine books into a single format, remove the special units for SW/DA/BA/GK, and just trust our players to use Counts-As.
> People want the original books back? They say that Space Wolves deserve more than a paint job and some bearded models?
> Fuck 'em. Lets release Codex: Novamarines instead.

>> No.30707892

>>30707697
Out of all the IG factions, Kriegers are least likely to ever ally with Chaos.

>> No.30707909

>>30707892
I know, their rules and models work terrifically with IW on the other hand.

>> No.30707920

>>30707892
He probably means rules-wise. Krieg style renegades would work with IW.

>> No.30707946

>>30707892
That's what the Emperor said about Horus.

>> No.30707948

>>30707858
>Implying Legions had special rules
>Implying they couldn't just spam unit x or got an extra slot somewhere a the expense of losing a slot elsewhere and had a smattering on generic USR they could buy.
>Implying current codex + ally system doesn't provide everything you need

The only thing Chaos needs is daemonic gifts not tied to a stupid mandatory challenge chart and to get rid of the cult units save Thousand Sons.

>> No.30707955

>>30707946
Emperor was terribad parent.

>> No.30708065

>>30707948

But they absolutely did have special rules. Even if you don't qualify FOC-shifts as special rules:

Alpha Legion had sole rights to *3* different vairants of Cultists.
Iron Warriors could purchase Servo Arms.
Word Bearers had sole rights to Dark Apostles.
World Eaters, Emperors Children, Death Guard and Thousand Sons all gave small freebies to their Marked units in exchange for the missing options.
Emperors Children had sole rights to mount sonic weaponry on their vehicles.

This is in addition to the swathes of FOC-shifts, USR availability and pricing, or Mark/unit restrictions in place.

It also kept Cult units and Marked units as the same thing, which meant that your Terminators, Havocs, Chosen etc. would have the Fearlessness, Plague Knives, Sonic Blasters etc. that exemplify the Cult units.
While I appreciate the distinction between Marks and Cults that is present in the newer books, it really stings to have your World Eaters Chosen as WS4, not-Fearless units and with no access to Chainaxes.

>> No.30708108

>>30707948
But they did...
The only one that was just like you mentioned was Night Lords.

3.5 Chaos was amazing. It completely shits all over every chaos edition and supplement since.
>b-but muh cultists
Which is why Codex Eye of Terror existed.

>> No.30708145
File: 84 KB, 510x383, Just fucking dreddful.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30708145

>>30707283
Can they even get any upgrades to make them better?
Or are they just like in the main codex, with no upgrades or anything?

>> No.30708351

>>30707381
If you only care about rules then you will never, ever be satisfied with a supplement.

Yo want to know what you're getting? Possessed as troops.
Enjoy.

>> No.30708357

>>30707651
How is Cadia stopping them? Just fly past it through the warp. The Gate is a massive area of space.

The only reason Cadia is important to capture for Black Crusades is because it's an enemy stronghold, which you don't want to leave in your rear and it makes a good staging area for further incursions into the Imperium. But a random warband out to fuck some shit is not going to bother with that stuff. Just fly past it, do your business and return.

>> No.30708391

>>30707440
I'd like if the two ideals could co-exist.

Not exactly sure how, but perhaps more strict rules for legions, like Undivided couldn't take Marks, certain Legions couldn't take certain units, etc. but then they could get tactical buffs. But then warbands would be free to take whatever they like, but get weaker tactical buffs.

>> No.30708414

>>30708391
>Legions
>More tactical buffs compared to the Warbands raised on the Codex Astartes

Kek.

>> No.30708422

>>30708414
Well if you fight wars in a certain way for 10,000 years you're probably gonna get really good at that specific fighting style.

>> No.30708439

>>30708422
If the fighting style is inferior it doesn't matter how good you get at it, it's still shit.

>> No.30708462
File: 61 KB, 470x800, 1394286402403.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30708462

>>30708439
But the melta-train has no brakes!

>> No.30708570

>>30708414
What chapter trait has only 1 buff? They all seems to come with 2-3 things they buff. If you gave CSM a mark (stat bonus) and the option for a USR, they'd be pretty much on the same level. AND they're paying for that shit, loyalist get those bonuses for free.

>> No.30708602

>>30708570
How much do vanilla space marines cost individually? And do they have to have a sergeant?

>> No.30708620

>playing 40k

you shitheads deserve ALL THE SHIT you get

thanks for

1. Killing off so many other minis game
2. Killing off so many non GW LGS
3. Attracting so many of the underage vidya gamers who cant even bother to read 10 pages of rules
4. Making an IP that has half its shit recycled from other IPs try to pass off as original

>> No.30708642

>>30708620
>thanks for
>1. Killing off so many other minis game
>2. Killing off so many non GW LGS
>3. Attracting so many of the underage vidya gamers who cant even bother to read 10 pages of rules
>4. Making an IP that has half its shit recycled from other IPs try to pass off as original

You're welcome, now don't you have a kickstarter to fund or something?

>> No.30708696

>>30708620
>Killing off so many other minis game
I suspect the opposite is true. Thanks mainly to its high street shops, GW is the only company that has any recognition beyond the very small group of geeks who already would go to LGSs. People get into warhams, and some of them move on to other games- I reckon the result is a net gain of players for other games, not a loss.

In fact you even mention this:
>Attracting so many of the underage vidya gamers who cant even bother to read 10 pages of rules
...although it's pretty stupid to refer to kids being 'underage' for the spectacularly mature hobby that is playing war with little plastic men. Point is, some of those kids stick around and maybe start getting into other games.

>> No.30708830
File: 305 KB, 414x466, 1378054892617.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30708830

>>30708620

>1. Killing off so many other minis game

I play bolt action and WH40k. It's not GeeDubs fault most other miniature look like ass.

>2. Killing off so many non GW LGS

That's cute, because there isn't any local GW stores here and I got my first warhams from a LGS.

>3. Attracting so many of the underage vidya gamers who cant even bother to read 10 pages of rules

Who needs new players and new customers so our hobby doesn't die, right? Us traditional gamers, eh?

>4. Making an IP that has half its shit recycled from other IPs try to pass off as original

Lel, 7/10 made me waste time replying.

>> No.30709124

>>30708602
CSM 13pts. a pop, SM 14pts.
Yes, yes they do.

Why?

>> No.30709244

Because the only ones that care about the legions are HH fags.

>> No.30709263

>>30708620
Dude, Games Workshop is the reason why wargames are as popular as they are.

>> No.30709342

>>30707127
>2014
>Still playing 40k
>Still caring about 40k

>> No.30709759

Possessed mutations have changed, for Crimson Slaughter as troops they now have on the D3 roll a 1 gives you shrouded, a 2 is beasts, and a 3 is the 3++.

There are a few really neat relics. One of which gives your sorcerers access to DIVINATION but prevents them from using their bonus to deny the witch. Another is for Lords only S User AP3, but it gives bonuses for each kill. 1 kill gives +1 S, 5 gives FNP (I think), 7 gives +1 S, 10 gives Instant Death. Another new one gives a 2+ save, Crusader, and It Will Not Die.

>> No.30709825

>>30707127

Because fuck you, Chaos in 40k Warbands now.

Go to FW if you want Legions.

They are not going to release directly competing product lines with another department in the same company you fuck wits.

Just because your ass backwards gaming group still wont accept FW doesn't mean its not the assumption the company operates on.

>> No.30709853

>>30707858
But space wolves don't deserve more than a paintjob and some beardd models...

>> No.30709870

>>30707858

>Codex: Novamarines

But Novamarines have been around for a while, you should say

>Fuck'em. Lets release Codex: Blood Antlions instead.

>> No.30709885

>>30709825
Except they already did: it's called Codex: Space Marines.

>> No.30709897

>>30709759
>Possessed mutations have changed, for Crimson Slaughter as troops they now have on the


Holy...Awesome..

If this is true Possessed are going to be fucking sweet. I assume you roll before the game?

Would Tzeench + a 3++ give them a 2+ invuln? that's fucking nuts

>> No.30709903
File: 10 KB, 200x200, second.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30709903

>>30709825

>Just because your ass backwards gaming group still wont accept FW doesn't mean its not the assumption the company operates on.

People can rage all they want about 40k Approved status. GW operates on the assumption that you are buying their products to play only with your BFFs who just want to roll dice while you knock back alcoholic drinks.

To them the sperglords of the hobby don't exist and no would should ever question you wanting to use a FW model or army so they are sure as shit not going to release a Citadel version of a Forge World kit jsut to please the sperglords.

>> No.30709909

>>30709897
Crimson Slaughter are khornate.

>> No.30709912

>>30709897
You roll at the start of each movement phase, and it lasts until the next phase.
Unfortunately that means the assault buffs are gone, now they're defensive/movement only.
I assume tzeentch would do that, I can't imagine it voiding that interaction from the start.

>> No.30709921

>>30709903
do people really get mad that others are using forgeworld? theres a reason all the good imperial armour books mark either 40k or apoc on the relavent pages

>> No.30709982

>>30709921

Yeah, especially the 40k Pure movement who push for NO SUPPLEMENT NO FW BRB ONLY CODEX ONLY FINAL DESTINATION

>> No.30710029

>>30709982
> 40k pure movement
i know a lot of the players at my local (by local i mean 3 miles away) GW occasionally complain about codex/rule changes inbetween 5th and 6th edition

>> No.30710203

>>30709921

Yes, those people are assholes.

>Implying FW stuff is OP

>> No.30710375

>>30707190
Nah, it will be The Purge. No Plague Marines and into death-aspect of Papa Nurgle instead of Decay. Though I'm not sure if they do not have actual ties to Death Guard - if yes: expect new Renegades.

>> No.30710482
File: 1.14 MB, 1177x1666, 1393861493194.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30710482

>>30710375

There's plenty of warbands around that could use a bit of fluff.

>> No.30710511

>>30709921
idk why anyone is complaining about forgeworld anymore. balance kinda flew out the window in 6th and with all the add ins it's hard to know what anyone will bring

>> No.30710537

>>30710029

If you don't follow the main 40k tournament & bloging sites you wont have been exposed to much of the 40k Purist Movement but it does exist, I see a lot of it IRL because I live in a GT hosting city with a number of active gaming stores and one of the major 40k online communities has their brick and mortar location in the area.

It was the second largest contributing factor to my LGC splitting up.

>> No.30710559

>>30709897

The Mark of Tzeentch very specifically states that it cannot provide a save better than 3++. You often hear people saying how they want to use the Grimoire on Tz Obliterators/Talons/Possessed to pull this off, but these people ARE WRONG.

NOTHING FOR TZEENTCH MARINES. CHOKE ON YOUR 6++ SAVES, EAT A DICK AHRIMAN, AND ENJOY YOUR THOUSAND SONS.

(Tz Daemons are the tits though)

>> No.30710588

>>30710537

Sad times about the LGC breaking up but fundamentally the members of an LGC all need to want similar things out of the game so it's for the best.

Also I assume your the anon who lives near the Miniwargaming brick & mortar store?

>> No.30710594

>>30710537

What does what is happening at tournaments matter at all to anyone who doesn't. I don't understand why people keep complaining about this and I am a tournament player.

>> No.30710716

>>30710594

WAAC Netlisters who ape tournament lists shitting up people's local metagames.

Trying to win isn't bad, but copying a list you know will stomp people not prepared for a super competitive game is bad table etiquette and a general dick move.

>inb4 don't play with these people.

The bigger a gaming club is the higher the group's tolerances for shitlords is. Once you have a club with 25-40 members it will easily maintain 5 or 6 shitlords without most people batting an eye just because once you have a club that big you need to maintain those numbers to actually take advantage of being a big club at all costs. And yes to all those small-towners who just play with their friends: Large cities often have multiple clubs this size, the largest in my city is over 60 members and hosts most of the local events. Letting 8 or 9 shitlords stay and keep shitting it up is something most clubs that big do because $$$CASH MONEY$$$, big clubs charge fees for renting space, communal terrain projects, prize pools for painting contests and tournaments.

>> No.30710748

So these guys are the new generic CSM now?

>> No.30710764

>>30710748

Yes.

>> No.30710797

>>30710482
>Bleak Brotherhood is named Apocalypse Company
Those guys could use some fluff. Like in "What is their actual name".

>> No.30710815

>>30710588

It splintered into a few smaller group, basically each of the intraclub cliques going it's separate ways based on their IRL friends and what they wanted out of the game.

Unfortunately for me my IRL friends didn't wan the same thing out of the game (they just wanted to drink and have a fun game, I was all about the club campaigns).

I am seriously having hard time motivating myself to play as a result of this.

>> No.30710816

>>30707158
Arguably, they've been fighting to push it in that direction since 4th edition.

They just weren't very successful back then.

>> No.30710847
File: 10 KB, 289x320, teal'c.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30710847

As a CSM player I don't really mind if the codex is kinda weak if you put asside the only 2/3 OP units in it (by the way, the Helldrake model is fucking ugly, I couldn't see how anyone would want to feild that shit if it wasn't for its rentability).

No, what really bothers me is that CSMs are really vanillarines with spikes and shittier gear.

In the fluff, CSMs are supposed to be an elite force, even less numerous than SMs but with chaos artifacts and other boons to back them up, a bit like GKs in a way.

But in the codex, CSMs are VERY similar to SMs if you put aside the ONLY 4 chaos related unites and the like 3 daemon/machines.

What I wanted from the CSM codex was the possibility to field more "chaosy" units. And don't tell me it's difficult to imagine :

>big Khorne terminator zerkers weilding two handed chainaxes
>Nurgle walker with two heavy flamers projecting huge amount of plagued pus on his ennemies
>Slaneeshi masochist cultits who gain rules like fnp or rending when they take losses
>Tzeentch farseer concil like unite but composed of sorcerers.

If I can pull out of my ass 4 unite concepts in like 5 minutes why the hell didn't they put more in the fucking codex

>> No.30710863

>>30707233
and yet necrons have 5-7 I WIN buttons that they just don't press because reasons

It can all boil down to one thing
>GW writing

>> No.30710868

>>30710847
also, sorry for my aproximate english

>> No.30710876

>>30710482
>Apocalypse Company
>Betrayers of Pain

Oh Dog.

>> No.30710911
File: 240 KB, 1091x835, 1393862319308.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30710911

>>30710876

Silly names, those wacky Chaos renegades.

>> No.30710915

>>30710847

>big Khorne terminator zerkers weilding two handed chainaxes

FW does it already, GW will never put out a box to directly compete with a FW product line.

>Nurgle walker with two heavy flamers projecting huge amount of plagued pus on his enemies

FW already has two units like this, Plauge Hulk and Blight Drones, GW will never put out a box to directly compete with a FW product line.

>Slaneeshi masochist cultits who gain rules like fnp or rending when they take losses

Daemonettes with one of the Icons, already exists and is your Battle Bro

>Tzeentch farseer concil like unite but composed of sorcerers.

Heralds of Tzeench work exactly like this, already exists and is your Battle Bro


Protip: If you don't know what the hell you are talking about, don't talk. The game literally already has all of these things and you have access to them through FW or allies.

>> No.30710943

>>30710847
>>30710915

[] Told
[] Very Told
[] Grumpy Told Men
[x] Batman: The Brave & the Told

>> No.30710944

>>30710915
You get me wrong, I don't want new models (it's kinda easy to convert these actually), I want rulesets for them.

also, we don't play Imperial Armour units in my local club so all the FW shit is out of question

>> No.30711029

>>30710915
also :
>Heralds of Tzeench work exactly like this

But they are not space marines, and that was my initial point

>Daemonettes with one of the Icons

Same thing

My point is about the fact that CSMs have no personnality as an army and the lack of typical chaotic unites overall.

>> No.30711041

>>30710944

GW does not release rules for units that do not have specific model boxes for them. They just finished taking units out of the Tyranid book because they were not going to release models for them. It is there company policy every since they lost the lawsuit with Chpater House Studios. CH was making model kits for units GW put in codexes and didn't have a product for. Judge ruled it was legal so they now no longer include units just to be conversion fodder.

Also it isn't GW's problem your local club bans official 40k products. See this post: >>30709903

>> No.30711053

>>30711029

It's still needless redundancy, use convert Sorcerers and Converted cultists and rules rules for Daemons.

>> No.30711061

>>30710847
*ONLY* 7 units are unique to the codex!

>> No.30711079
File: 113 KB, 600x450, FirstHeretic.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711079

>>30707283
that would be cool, if the possessed had the same stats as the legion Word Bearers gal vorbak in Massacre.

>> No.30711097
File: 30 KB, 848x480, Bro'tac.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711097

>>30710847
>big Khorne terminator zerkers weilding two handed chainaxes
>Nurgle walker with two heavy flamers projecting huge amount of plagued pus on his ennemies
>Slaneeshi masochist cultits who gain rules like fnp or rending when they take losses
>Tzeentch farseer concil like unite but composed of sorcerers.
That would be cool.

>> No.30711122
File: 926 KB, 2592x1944, 1381201327914.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711122

>>30711079
Real poss rules

>> No.30711145

>>30711061
yes, only 7, compared to like Ork codex which has every single of its units unique to the codex. CSM are just SM with spikes, deal with it

>>30711053
>>30711041

still have to take allies to have a trully unique army, which is sad

>> No.30711155

>>30710944

>also, we don't play Imperial Armour units in my local club so all the FW shit is out of question

40k Purist Group Detected. Just fucking leave /tg/ now, what none of you purists understand is that GW needs to do this to stay in business.

The endless minidexes, the endless number of new detachments, legal FW, Escalation, all of it because the market has hit saturation on their older kits. They can never count on sells enough new rhinos, tacticals, etc to stay in business because there are literally tens of thousands of the common GW kits or resale online at less than 50% off. They will never go away. They need to keep producing new shit and finding way to make people who already have 3000pts armies keep spending because they hit the drop off of new kids coming into the hobby and then burning out if it.

>> No.30711182

>>30711145

>handwringingkirby.jpg

FYI the books were literally written and designed at the same time to be used together.

>> No.30711192

>>30711155
hey, I didn't choose to live in a relativelly small town with only one wargaming club, the FW stuff rule was in place before I get in and it was always a thing

>> No.30711218

>>30711192

Explain to them why it's bullshit. Show them this thread.

>> No.30711226

>>30708620
Not our fault that the models and fluff in every other miniature game out there are total fucking shit.

Good rules, customer support and price cuts are literally the only thing GW needs to be superior in every way.

>> No.30711242

>>30710797

GW doesnt care, neither should you

At least the Crimson Slaughter had some time and thought put into them, the 4th edition Renegade warbands were a joke.

>> No.30711257

>>30707260

but the opposite of blue is orange

>> No.30711261

>>30711155

>there are literally tens of thousands of the common GW kits or resale online at less than 50% off. They will never go away. They need to keep producing new shit and finding way to make people who already have 3000pts armies keep spending

This pretty much right here. Keeping 40k "pure" will only kill it. Like it or not you are along for this ride so either get on or get off.

>> No.30711264

>>30711145
CSM share what, Vindicators, Dreadnoughts, Land Raiders, Rhinos, Razorbacks? Do they get Whirlwinds too?

If Chaos Space Marines are "just Tactical marines that can come in squads of 20 and can get fearless/+1T/FnP/Furious Charge/whatever else" then Necron Immortals are just Space Marines with I2, Ld10, and less wargear variety

Why do Necrons have to share a unit with Space Marines!?

>> No.30711320

>>30711122
That Dark Martyr is really fucking expensive

>> No.30711354

>>30711192

It's not a thing any more and your group is being ultra-grognards for not re-evaluating.

Seriously you have no one to blame but them, not GW. Stop being a passive aggressive little bitch complaining about it on 4chan and talk to them about it.

>> No.30711396
File: 1.21 MB, 600x800, 2014-03-05 16.20.39 (1).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711396

ossessed become troops, lose whatever the possessed special rule is and gain a D3 roll at the start of their owning players turn. 1 = change from 'infantry' to 'beasts'. 2 = 3++, 3 = (I believe) always wounds on a 3+ and gains rending.

A few new items, the only one I recall specifically is a 2+ armor save, crusader and 'it will not die' for 40 points. There was another one that gave access to divination for 25 points.

The only warlord trait I thought was 'nice' was warlord gains shrouded.

>> No.30711420

>>30711320
No, its that in the Horus Heresy to encourage taking max size units every unit cost much more for the starting size and much less for adding models. So the Gal Vorbak cost 40 points for the first 5 and 30 for every other. Or the Ashen Circle cost 35 points starting and only 20 to add models.

>> No.30711445

>>30711257
Nuh-uh.
Red is hot, blue is cold. It has been this way since the dawn of pokemon.

>> No.30711481

>>30707293
>CSM were not split into chapters, so any old warband of them is still more or less part of the original legion or identifies as part of it.

This. The old legion also increase their numbers either by making new marines through sickshit gene experiments (Fabius Bile being the best at this) or by press-ganging unaffiliated CSM into their ranks.

World Eaters have such shitty geneseed that they just stick the butcher's nails into the heads of SM/CSM prisoners, repaint their armour and call it a day.

"Legion" CSM are still the vast majority, with "warband" CSM being in the minority, especially when compared to the Founding Chapter/Successor Chapter divide.

>> No.30711499

anyway someone have a pdf of this shitty new codex ?

>> No.30711546

>>30710482

No group walking living warped death machine would call their war band "nightkillers"

That is what an 8 year old boy calls the ninja clan he invented after watching TMNT

>> No.30711548

>>30711499
Not even out yet.

>> No.30711565

>>30711499

Yes, as a CSM I am also interested in the rules. Not because I'm going to run my CSM in a new way (I don't play them anymore) but just so I can find new ways to complain about how GW doesn't 'get' Chaos

>> No.30711582

ITT = invent a chaos warband named by Games Workshop

Death Killers

>> No.30711599

>>30711546

I always imagine the worse the name the more belligerent the warband.

NightKillers *chuckles*
He laughs at our warbands holy name, eviscerate him my brothers!

Kinda like wearing a pink shirt at a bar and then glassing anyone who comments on it.

>> No.30711600

>>30711582

Badguys of Nastiness

>> No.30711612

>>30711582
Killy McChaos Chaps

>> No.30711620 [SPOILER] 
File: 306 KB, 798x1181, 1329015353483.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711620

>>30711582

Dream Killers

>> No.30711623

>>30711582

the knights of darkness

>> No.30711637

>>30711257
Well, the hue is kinda orangeish.

>> No.30711641

>>30711582

Eaters of Hope

>> No.30711649

>>30711582

slayer brothers

>> No.30711665

>>30711582

Soul Reapers

>> No.30711678

>>30711582

Bleak Bros

>> No.30711707

Possessed are troops? Gonna run a count as word bearer army.

>> No.30711734

>>30711582

Glorious Holes
Hateful Fucks
Killer Killers of Kill
Sons of Murder
Red Guys
Death that is Crimson
Commit Chaos
Everkillers
Lords of Kil
Kharnaths homeboys
Overkills
Red Death
Blood Killers
Preposterous Legion
Wrong Side warband
Backstabbers of Betrayal
Chaos Consumers
BloodCult

ah a

>> No.30711737

>>30711582
Stinky Pete and the Brethren of Cheat.

>> No.30711747

>>30711582
Helkillers

>> No.30711759

>>30711707
>Implying hordes of possessed aren't BL territory

ADB pls.

>> No.30711877
File: 219 KB, 885x613, Daemons_of_Tzeentch.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711877

LEGION FAGS GOT TOLD

THE GODS DO NOT CARE FOR YOUR MORTAL HIERARCHIES AND ORGANIZATIONS

>> No.30711881

>>30707948
>The only thing Chaos needs is daemonic gifts not tied to a stupid mandatory challenge chart

Fuck the mandatory challenge chart. Hell, fuck the 6th edition challenge rules in general.

>> No.30711890
File: 57 KB, 647x225, Black_Legion_Possessed_Marines.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30711890

>>30711759

>BL stronk!

>> No.30711924

>>30710847

>In the fluff, CSMs are supposed to be an elite force, even less numerous than SMs but with chaos artifacts and other boons to back them up, a bit like GKs in a way.


But that's the opposite of what is true. The whole LEGION part should've been a give away.

>> No.30712048

>>30709759
>There are a few really neat relics. One of which gives your sorcerers access to DIVINATION but prevents them from using their bonus to deny the witch.

>Crimson Slaughter can get Divination
>Ahriman cannot

Bravo, GW.

>> No.30712150

>>30711877
>‘I seek knowledge,’ said Ahriman. The daemon seemed to sigh. ‘I seek knowledge of Amon.’
>‘Another whose trust you rewarded with betrayal,’ said the daemon, and it was no longer grinning but standing still, arms by its side, its face solemn.
>‘A brother came seeking me. His name was Tolbek. He came to drag me to Amon’s knees. I have sought the other exiles of my Legion but they are dead or with Amon.’ Ahriman paused, but the daemon did not move or speak. ‘Do you know of what I speak?’
>‘Yes,’ said the daemon, and rolled its eyes. ‘Of course I know of what you speak. All we do is watch you, because your pitiful scrap of a Legion is our only concern.’

>> No.30712162

>>30709759
>Possessed mutations have changed, for Crimson Slaughter as troops they now have on the D3 roll a 1 gives you shrouded, a 2 is beasts, and a 3 is the 3++.

Compared to:
1 - Shred
2 - AP3
3 - +1 Attack, +1 Initiative

That sounds pretty bad. They'll be tougher/faster, but won't be able to kill things for shit.

>> No.30712183

>>30710915
>Tzeentch farseer concil like unite but composed of sorcerers.
It would be awesome if they brought back thrall wizards, they would act as squad leaders or stay in the command to act as batteries.

>> No.30712194

>>30707127
Why fuck is the marine on the cover ejecting a shell casing as if his bolter was actually a bolt-action weapon?

>> No.30712231

>>30709897
>Would Tzeench + a 3++ give them a 2+ invuln? that's fucking nuts

Mark of Tzeentch gives 3++ maximum.

3++ should be the maximum for ALL units in every codex. Fuck you, daemons.

>> No.30712247

>>30712194
could have got a skull fragment in there and he's trying to unjam it, or maybe it had a FTE (failure to eject) and he's trying to fix that.

>> No.30712286

>>30712194
Clearing a jam?
Bolt weapons are delicate things
Or it just looks cool.

>> No.30712289

>>30709903
>To them the sperglords of the hobby don't exist and no would should ever question you wanting to use a FW model or army so they are sure as shit not going to release a Citadel version of a Forge World kit jsut to please the sperglords.

Based Games Workshop. I really doubt anyone on /tg/ actually plays in tournaments, so I have no idea why everyone goes so fucking batshit insane over escalation and superheavies and whatthefuckever.

>> No.30712307

From the GW 'Whats new today blog':

>On top of Crimson Slaughter, the Digital team have another new digital download for iBook, How to Paint Citadel Miniatures: Helbrutes. With six colour schemes for the most prominent Chaos Legions, it’s a great way to make sure you get the colours right for your chosen Legion.

> your chosen Legion.

>> No.30712317

>>30712289
>I really doubt anyone on /tg/ actually plays in tournaments
Why would you say something so fucking stupid?

>> No.30712350

>>30709982
>Yeah, especially the 40k Pure movement who push for NO SUPPLEMENT NO FW BRB ONLY CODEX ONLY FINAL DESTINATION

Best way to play. Enjoy your quadruple heldrakes and baneblades or whatever, Supplement/Escalation fags.

>> No.30712439

>>30712247
>>30712286
>Crimson Slaughter
>A supplement for chaos space marines who cannot take proper care of their equipment
>Special rules: shooting to-hit rolls of 1 result in a jam - the weapon cannot be used next turn while the marine clears the jam and poses for the camera

>> No.30712481

>>30712439
>no cool allowed

>> No.30712501

>>30712350

Might aswell crack out the third ed rule book which has all the rules for each army in it.

None Purer then just one book.

>> No.30712514

>>30712439
> cannot take any vehicles besides hellbrutes and heldrakes without a warpsmith in the army because they keep breaking them.
> what you get for smacking someone with a reactor: plasma weapons that get hot place a small blast plasma explosion on top of the unit that failed the get hot test. if the user survives, the plasma gun is considered to have exploded itself and is unusable for the rest of the game.

>> No.30712579

>>30710482
Why are all chaos warbands so shit? Betrayers of pain? Fucking seriously?

>> No.30712584

>>30707504
Man its, "They're giving Warbands attention at all, LEGIONS ARE OVER!!!!!!"

>> No.30712663

>>30710847
>big Khorne terminator zerkers weilding two handed chainaxes
>Nurgle walker with two heavy flamers projecting huge amount of plagued pus on his ennemies
>Slaneeshi masochist cultits who gain rules like fnp or rending when they take losses
>Tzeentch farseer concil like unite but composed of sorcerers.

Yeah, more god-themed units would have been fucking cool.

>> No.30712687

>>30712286
> The cover is especially characterful, featuring a veteran warrior casually racking the slide on his bolter, his armour grossly mutated by the power of Chaos.

>> No.30712698

>>30712150
I think the demon was being sarcastic anon.

>> No.30712725

>>30710911
>The Flawless Host

That's the only warband that doesn't scream "The Edgelords of the Night 666" or "My Original Warcraft Character: Do Not Steal, by Cecil Dragonchild, aged 12".

>> No.30712729

>>30712698
Really?!

>> No.30712732

>>30711122
Dayum. I want those gal vorbak in my 40k. I love me some Word Bearers but chaos undivided is woefully underrepresented and underpowered.

>> No.30712733

as a word bearer who has an army based around possessed AND WHY DID DARK APOSTLES NOT MAKE POSESSED TROOPS ITS THAT SIMPLE. and the only person ive seen use possessed in a year this is a real kick in the nuts.

>> No.30712742
File: 251 KB, 1096x800, 1393862721017.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30712742

>>30712579

>> No.30712766

>>30712725

Night Lords is a pretty edgy name to be fair

>> No.30712779

>>30710847
Those concepts are badass, plz post some more

Unlike... seems like everyone ITT, if I have a cool concept I can just make up some rules for it and play it with my mates

>> No.30712789

>>30707296
>Haven't tried sugar cane glass bottled Coke.
You poor soul. Easy access to Mexican coke is one of the best things about living in California.

Anyway, personal opinion, I never thought the Legions were cool just because they felt like a direct Chaos Equivalent to the First Founders(which they are) and Chaos should go their own direction

>> No.30712791

>>30712733
I fully understand bro. I desperately want Possessed to be good, but it just ain't happening.

Just a small idea of mine, haven't actually checked or thought it out a bit better, but Huron can give up to three units infiltrate, right? Could that make possessed slightly less bad since they can be right next to the enemy at the start of the battle?

>> No.30712811

>>30712789
>Anyway, personal opinion, I never thought the Legions were cool just because they felt like a direct Chaos Equivalent to the First Founders(which they are) and Chaos should go their own direction

Chaos Legions predate the First Founding chapters.

>> No.30712816

>>30711122
Oh god 30k is so fucking amazing. Can't wait for some Orks or someshit in it I'll never play 40k again

>> No.30712822

>>30707172
So you didn't get something specifically for you. Time to grow up.

>> No.30712841

>>30711122
>2 Wounds
>WS, S, T, I 5
>Fuckton of special rules
>Champion has 3 wounds

Sweet Jesus...

>> No.30712842

>>30712816
>Xenos in HH

lel

>> No.30712870

>>30711320
It's less the champion being expensive, but 30k legion units getting a discount for any extra dudes they take above the minimum, to encourage you taking big blobs of 20 marines and the like.

>> No.30712873

>>30707185
This has constantly happened with Marines since the beginning. God, such short sighted tunnel vision children here.

Crimson Fists -> Blood Angels Ultramarines -> Crismson Fists -> Black Templars, etc, etc, etc

>> No.30712879

>>30712841

The Gal Vorbak as a unit fit perfectly in Kill Team.

>> No.30712888

>>30712779
Not that anon, but I recall another thread quite some time ago where we were discussing some legion-based rules like the SM have.

Can't actually remember more than that Word Bearers would get possessed as troops, but it could some interesting to do some more. of the like.

>> No.30712912

>>30707277
>>30707318
People can tell the difference, yes, but not usually which is which.

Generally, they identify Pepsi as 'preferred'; this is a now well-known consequence of Pepsi being sweeter.

>> No.30712915

>>30712842
>doesnt remember Ullanor
>doesn't remember Eldar trying to save the imperium and Fulgrim fucking them over
>doesn't remember fighting exodites
Did you not read the books or what?

>> No.30713019 [SPOILER] 
File: 68 KB, 550x361, jeff-wayne-tripod.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30713019

>>30712915
>Ullanor

Ulla?
UUUUUULLAAAAAA!

>> No.30713028

>>30712841
They cost 350pts for 10 though, that's practically terminator cost.

>> No.30713082

>>30708414
The Codex Astartes is a tactical handicap that focuses on set-piece battles and is missing entire modes of warfare (for example, asymmetric warfare, such as Alpharius proved), and even if it were good, it could never compare with 10,000+ years of actual combat experience.

>> No.30713098

>>30713028
With that statline, I'm ok with that.They're daemons so they already have the same invul.

>> No.30713129

>>30708570
But loyalists don't get to pick and choose; they get several, but always the same one on all units.

>> No.30713131

>>30712915
>>doesnt remember Ullanor
>>doesn't remember Eldar trying to save the imperium and Fulgrim fucking them over
>>doesn't remember fighting exodites

>Doesn't remember that we're already way past that Great Crusade shit and into the Heresy.

>> No.30713159

>>30712915
>>doesn't remember fighting exodites

Which HH novel had humans and Exodite Eldar living peaceful together who later got exterminated by Salamanders because coexistence with Xenos offends the Emperor?

I wanna read it!

>> No.30713226

>>30712766
Thats because they're evil batmen

>> No.30713242

>>30712811
>chaos legions predate the first founding

Maybe in real life, but not in fluff

>> No.30713267

>>30713098
5t, 2w, 5++ and 3+

Seems pretty fucking legit.

And at that points cost? Tyranids would kill for their warriors to be that

>> No.30713328
File: 31 KB, 429x429, absolutly not compliant.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30713328

>>30713242
I think you have that one reversed buddy

>> No.30713358

>>30713328
No.. The first founding was definitely before the HH

>> No.30713373

>>30713328
How the hell would they pre-date the first founding in fluff? They're PART of the first founding.

>> No.30713379

>>30713328
The first founding was what created all the legions in the first place retard, none of them could rebel before they were born.

>> No.30713401

>>30713358
>>30713373
Wait, I think I may have it reversed. I thought first founding referred to the splitting legions into chapters. Gonna stop drinking now.

>> No.30713414

>>30713082
It's not 10,000 years in actuality, though Because of warpfuckery etc.

Not saying that you're not right, mind you.

>> No.30713418

>>30713401
Thats the second founding.

>> No.30713477

>>30711155
>>30711261

I remember (way) back in the day, this problem didn't exist because stuff was interesting enough that when you finished one army, you started another. If you played 40k, you might have started a fantasy army, or vice-versa. Don't know what changed, exactly, but there wasn't as much factionalism, that's for sure. Probably you didn't need so many $$$ worth to have a decent force, so it was easy to start another.

Now people play one army, and maybe have another small force that they take as allies but will NEVER add enough models to, to get to a full-sized force because they don't like them, they just have them for the force multiplier or other special rules.

>> No.30713649

>>30712162
>They'll be tougher/faster, but won't be able to kill things for shit.
But that's okay, because they're now scoring, so no-one cares that they're less killy if they survive longer.

>> No.30713804

>>30712742
>In the grim darkness of the Eye of Terror, there are only Linkin Park lyrics for inspiration

>> No.30713884

>Chaos should get Grav
>Chaos should get Legion Rules
>Chaos should get Centurions
>Chaos should get classical space marine weapons, such as THSS, Thunderfire Cannons, Assault Cannons, and so on.
How many do you agree with?

>> No.30713892

Crimson Slaughter is just gonna be the Khorne supplement. I'm sure we'll see a warband for the other chaos gods, eventually. Maybe we'll even see some unaligned chapters. They probably wouldn't be legions, or close to legions, but I'm totally ok with running my favorite legion (World Eaters) with a codex that's pretty close.

As long as it isn't like Codex: Legion of the Damned. Straight up retarted.

>> No.30713931

>>30713884
> Chaos should get everything loyalists get, with some chaos options instead of emperor options
I agree with that. They get the entire Imperial Guard codex in apocalypse. I don't see why that shouldn't cross over.

>> No.30713951

>>30711565
>Yes, as a CSM I am also interested in the rules. Not because I'm going to run my CSM in a new way (I don't play them anymore) but just so I can find new ways to complain about how GW doesn't 'get' Chaos

CSM players in a nutshell.

>> No.30713957

>>30713931
Then we run into the problem of Chaos gets everything marines get and more, and now marines feel fucked

>> No.30713958

>>30713892

Legion of the Damned was them just trying to figure out how to give the minis to other Imp factions for the selling of the models and stuff.

Hell, does it even take up a secondary attachment spot?

>> No.30713964

>>30713931
So you're gonna give Loyalists T5 troops and Helturkies?

>> No.30713971
File: 28 KB, 318x320, gw-money.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30713971

>>30711582
The Heldrake Spammers

>> No.30713981

>>30713884
>Grav
Reasonable
>Legion Rules
As equivalent of Chapter Tactics? Yes. Especially that many of the Warbands people are pointing out of "taking place of Legions" would technically play by majority of the rules of their Legion, with only some exceptions, maybe.
>Centurions
Technically, -tilators are Chaos Centurions.
>Chaos should get classical space marine weapons, such as THSS, Thunderfire Cannons, Assault Cannons, and so on.
Warbands of fresh Renegades should have something to compel for not being Veterans of the Long War, especially that they should have some of their equipment still working, especially THSS, though not all of new equipment should be still working or available.
>How many do you agree with?
50% of what you wrote make sense.

>> No.30714011

>>30713892
>Crimson Slaughter is just gonna be the Khorne supplement.

It's not though, it's for the Crimson Slaughter, they've got an item for sorcerers and everything.

>> No.30714023

>>30713931
>Chaos would be Marines+1
Man, it's just like 5th ed all over again!
I sure do love other books being literally Marines + 1.

>> No.30714124

>>30713981
How about this?
Oblits and Mutils are the Chaos Centurions, so Chaos cannot ever access Centurions.
Grav weaponry, Assault Cannons, THSS and so on are only available to Warbands. Warbands have no Legion rules or VotLW, but get newer shit to emphasize the fact that they are recent defectors.
Chaos cannot ally with itself as BB like Space Marines though.

>> No.30714171

>Legion rules condensed to two special rules per legion
What would it be for your favourite legion?

>> No.30714251

>>30711582

Bob Johnson

>> No.30714253

>>30713477

There are way more companies competing for wargamers attention and money now. People don't want 3 or 4 40k armies; they want one 40k army and some allies, they want two Malifaux gangs, a Infinity Sectoral force and a maybe Warmahordes army too.

All of these minidexes and allies give people a way to spend a little money at GW at a time without the expense of collecting a 1500pts or larger force.

>> No.30714323

>>30714171
>Iron Warriors.
>Sturdy
-1 to the result of attacking Iron Warriors vehicles. All Iron Warrior's Vehicles gain Venerable.
>The Iron Cage
All units with the Iron Cage Special Rule gain +2 to their cover saves, and all weapons are considered twinlinked if the unit is in cover and did not move in his movement phase.

>> No.30714365

>>30714323
That shit would be cash.

>> No.30714366

>>30714323
>I want to win

>> No.30714424

>>30714323
Shit. Sturdy was supposed to be >-1 to the result of attacking Iron Warriors buildings. All Iron Warrior's vehicles gain Venerable.
To contrast with the IF chapter tactics.

>> No.30714500

So /tg/ I just learned that Ultramarines have the ability to permakill Daemon Princes as of Graham McNeill's The Chapter's Due.

What is your opinion on the fact that now Daemon Princes can be erased from existence?

>> No.30714561

>>30714124
I agree with those, but I would like to have a note on
>Chaos cannot ally with itself as BB like Space Marines though.

It would really depend on a Warband. Some Renegade Warbands could cooperate with Legion Warbands of the same God, but there are some in-Legion Warbands that would have problems to cooperate with each other (Death Guard suffers from this.


>>30707651
>Almost all of the Legion warbands, however, are restricted to the Eye of Terror since, aside from a few lucky breaks(like that one incursion into the Gothic sector and a few random jumps through war storms) they can't get past Cadia

I have only one thing to say to you: Siege of Vrax.

>> No.30714565

>>30714500
To be fair, the Ultramarines can permakill ANYTHING. Especially considering they are the greatest chapter of the greatest warriors in the galaxy.

>> No.30714631

>>30714561
Limiting it by god might work then.
Khorne can only ally with Khorne.

>> No.30714651
File: 120 KB, 510x546, ultrasmug.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30714651

>>30714565
And each such a feat belongs to Calgar. Regardless of who actually performed it.

>Alfonso Tsment
Say who, Captcha?

>> No.30714703

>>30714500

Shits given zero.

This means that Daemon Princes who aren't permakilled are now better by default.

>> No.30714844

>>30714171
>Thousand Sons
>Sorcerers Supreme
Opponents subtract 1 from their Deny the Witch Roll against spells cast by a model with this rule(this may mean it is impossible to succeed at times).
>All is Dust
Sorcerer Lords with MoT gain Inferno Bolts on all Bolt Weapons. Once per game during your shooting phase all units with the Mark of Tzeentch may choose to gain Ignores Cover on their weapons until the start of your next turn.

>> No.30714881

>>30714844
I'd rather have the 1k Sons gain +1 Warp Charge, and let them use two Witchfire powers a shooting phase.

>> No.30714891

>>30714171
>Thousand Sons
>Cabal of sorcerers
1-3 Sorcerers per HQ slot(Alternatively Unit champions can be upgrades to Psychic Mastery level 1 for X amount of points)
>Chosen of Tzeentch
Any model equipped with a boltgun or bolt pistol may upgrade them with inferno bolts for 5ppm. In addition. Models with the Psyker special rule Equipped with a Mark of tzeentch or with the Daemon of Tzeentch special rule generate an additional power from the discipline of Tzeentch(I know its shit but whatever).

Something along those lines and I would be happy

>> No.30715068

>Thousand Sons
>All is Dust
Psykers with this rule automatically pass psychic tests
>Fires of Tzeentch
Soul Blaze effects caused by models with this rule cause 2d6 hits on a successful blaze, instead of d3

>> No.30715094

Wow lotta people dig the sons. Not that I blame them.

>> No.30715129

>>30714171
>Night Lords
>Absolute Terror.
When in close combat, enemy units gain no benefit from Fearless, ATSKNF or stubborn, and their Morale tests are done on 3d6 in close combat.
>Rule by fear
Whenever an enemy unit is destroyed in combat or destroyed in a sweeping advance, all enemy units within 6+2d6 inches and LoS must make a leadership test on 3d6. If they fail, they can only fire snapshots next turn.

>> No.30715213

>>30715129
>Night Lords are so terrifying even mindless zombies/automatons are afraid

>> No.30715214

>>30715129
>enemy units gain no benefit from Fearless, ATSKNF or stubborn, and their Morale tests are done on 3d6 in close combat.

Bullshit.

>> No.30715244

>>30715129

Night Lords prey on the weak, having them scare astartes is pure fanwank.

>> No.30715322

>>30714631
I see no reason why a Khornate wouldn't be able to cooperate with Nurglite. And while Khorne might despite Tzeentch, it's not as great hatred as the one he have towards Slaanesh.

>> No.30715351

>>30715322
Honestly, just to make it simpler rules wise.

>> No.30715364

>>30715094

Speaking of the TS, is the upgrade kit from GW's store still metal or is it resin?

>> No.30715410

>>30715244
True. Scaring Astartes is only something Curze himself could do.

>> No.30715455

>>30715351
Well, most of such stuff is fluff stuff, honestly. Especially with in-Legion Warbands. Because while same God = Battle Brothers would make sense in theory, it's not true for that one Apothecary-turned Sorcerer of Nurgle member of Death Guard that hates Typhus.

>> No.30715471

>>30714881
+1 Warp Charge and the ability to fire 2 guns a turn is silly and far stronger than chapter tactics.

>> No.30715487

>>30715455
You're a dumbass. Astartes are Battle Bros with IG for god's sake and Astartes kill them all the fucking time.

>> No.30715575

>>30715487
Unfortunately, opposing Warbands do not work this way. Though it could be easily fixed by simply not allowing to have both of the opposing Warlords. So yeah, I'm simply not good at thinking at this hour (not mentioning that I can't remember this fucking Allies Chart).

>> No.30715814

>Word Bearers
>Embrace the Warp
All characters gain a free gift of mutation but lose the ability to buy them.
>Teachings of Lorgar
All independent characters gain the And They Shall Know No Fear special rule.

>Is this any good? I cannot into balance most of the time.

>> No.30715845

>>30715575
Dude, it's easy, there are plenty of handwavium explanations for it to work. Jesus, Even the Necrons battle-broed it up with their Blood Angel enemies who they were previously fighting to team up with the nids.

Just say they're working together for a better(or worse?) cause.

>> No.30715907

>>30715814
>>Teachings of Lorgar
>All independent characters gain the And They Shall Know No Fear special rule.

Word Bearers are cowardly and craven, so no, I don't think so.

>> No.30715931

>>30715845
>Even the Necrons battle-broed it up with their Blood Angel enemies who they were previously fighting to team up with the nids.
That was fucking stupid though, even with newcron personality.

>> No.30715966 [DELETED] 

>>30707127

Does anyone besides me think these guys might be pretty interesting? The fluff paints them as tragic figures, haunted and eventually corrupted by the voices of daemons.

Night Lords and Alpha Legion definitely deserve supplements before these guys,

>possessed as troops
>new artifacts mentioned, this probably means more daemon weapons and wtfpowerful uber gear, based on what artifacts Chaos has already been given

>> No.30716001

>>30715931
Okay fine.

My point still stands though, there are a million and one explanations for two warbands to operate together on a single fucking battle, whether it be fighting loyalist scum who intervene in their conflict, splitting up the region, one warband having been consumed by the other, or even (gosh?) two smaller warbands attacking a planet that neither could take on alone.

It takes 0 effort to come up with. You don't seriously think that after 10,000 years in the Eye of Terror that no two warbands teamed up for a single battle or longer? Have you even heard of a black crusade?

>> No.30716006

>>30715931

No it wasn't. A faction within the Newcrons see Tyranids as the biggest problem and are seeking to actively cooperate with other races to fight them.

>> No.30716012

Does anyone besides me think these guys might be pretty interesting? The fluff paints them as tragic figures, haunted and eventually corrupted by the voices of daemons.

Night Lords and Alpha Legion definitely deserve supplements before these guys, but still, there might be good stuff in this one:

>possessed as troops
>new artifacts mentioned, this probably means more daemon weapons and wtfpowerful uber gear, based on what artifacts Chaos has already been given

But if they charge $50 for it...

>> No.30716058

>>30716012
All I want is the ability to take an allied detachment of 1 Chaos lord w/Daemon weapon and 1 Squad of thousand sons but noooooo, can't have that , even the 4E codex was too good for csm players. I don't even care how viable it is, I just want my old warband in my daemons army.

>> No.30716115

>>30716012
>Night Lords and Alpha Legion definitely deserve supplements before these guys

Why?

>> No.30716144

>>30715907
>Word Bearers are cowardly and craven, so no, I don't think so.

>The Word Bearers follow the words of their Dark Apostles with utter loyalty and faith in battle
>The unshakable belief of the Word Bearers that they alone can save the galaxy and Mankind has seen them marching towards certain death, yet unwilling to take a single step backwards. Any victory won over the Word Bearers is only won at a terrible cost, as their fanatical attacks will only ever end when all are dead.

This kind of cowardly and craven?

>> No.30716167

>>30716115
I don't get it either. Night Lords are just regular chaos marines except raptors everywhere, Alpha Legion is just cultist spam. Alpha Legion can currently be done perfectly in the current rules whereas the addition of something like "if your chaos lord has a jump pack, raptors are troops" would make Night Lords a done deal.

>> No.30716179
File: 52 KB, 906x400, Perturabo the boss.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30716179

>>30714323
>The Iron Cage
>Take control of any enemy Imperial Fists models whenever the fuck you want and have them blunder blindly into your trap fortress

>> No.30716217

>>30716144
>This kind of cowardly and craven?

Yes. Read about them and you'll see they're all just politicking amongst themselves and desperate for power.
ATSKNF requires selflessness.

>> No.30716245

Does anyone know what artefacts will be in the Crimson Slaughter dex yet? Someone early ITT mentioned an item for sorcerer despite the Crimson Slaughter being predominantly Khornate iirc, anyone know about this?

>> No.30716271

>>30715907
>cowardly and craven

You didn't read their novel word bearers did you? They fucking crack planets into demon worlds just to harvest necron tech to stop all warp travel from happening in a sector. Oh and they will single handedly take terra from abbadon

>> No.30716366

>>30716271
>You didn't read their novel word bearers did you?

I did.

>They fucking crack planets into demon worlds just to harvest necron tech to stop all warp travel from happening in a sector.

A coward's move, attempting to deny enemy reinforcements. Also trying to kill each other all day and running like little bitches from the Necrons.

>Oh and they will single handedly take terra from abbadon

Erebus even admits that the Black legion are ten times as strong. Be'lakor and Shon'tu have better odds.

>> No.30716391

>>30716366
>A coward's move, attempting to deny enemy reinforcements

More like you'd be a brain dead tactician if you DIDN'T try to do something like this.

>> No.30716397

>>30716217
>ATSKNF requires selflessness.

Since when? Marines just get mindwashed into loyalty as children via chemicals, brain tinkering and good ol' fashioned propaganda.

>> No.30716413

>>30716115
>>30716167
Yeah, besides that supplements are also mostly fluff, and the Night Lords and Alpha Legion already have a lot of it, having a more indepth renegade chapter is not bad.

>> No.30716434

>>30714171
>Night Lords

>Sons of our Father, in Midnight Clad
All non-bulky models who have purchased the Veterans of the Long War upgrade have the Hit & Run special rule. Chaos terminators, raptors and warp talons with the Veterans of the Long War upgrade instead only scatter d6" when entering play by deep strike.

>We Bring the Night
All Night Lord chaos space marines have the Night Vision and Fear special rules

>> No.30716448
File: 23 KB, 260x269, ATSKF.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30716448

>>30716391
Not really, battles are still fought with honour by many in the 41st millennium.

>>30716397
>Since when?

Since Chaos don't get it because they are too self interested.

>> No.30716478

>>30715129
>Night Lords
>Absolute Terror.
>When in close combat, enemy units gain no benefit from Fearless, ATSKNF or stubborn, and their Morale tests are done on 3d6 in close combat.

Loyalist marines, orks and necrons canonically do not give a fuck when the Night Lords try to spook them.

>> No.30716517

>>30716448
>Not really, battles are still fought with honour by many in the 41st millennium.

Fuck Honor, it's the dumbest shit that gets so many killed for absolutely no reason.

If you're in a war you do what you have to to win. Everything else is meaningless.

>> No.30716542

>>30716478
I'm wondering, does it say in the books whether Tyranids give a fuck? Doesn't seem like they would.

>> No.30716549

>>30707277
It depends on the country too. Coke and Pepsi taste very different in America compared to in Australia.

>> No.30716550

>>30716448

>Since Chaos don't get it because they are too self interested.

Because they have self preservation instincts that have been mindwashed out of loyalists. Courage requires being able to feel fear. If anything the heretics are the braver of the two.

>> No.30716554

>>30714171
>Thousand Sons
Sorcerers with Mark of Tzeentch have access to Divination powers.

That is all.

>> No.30716557

>>30716167
Yeah, lets forget about fear, infiltrate and nightfighting, you know, the REAL rules NL show in all of their books. The raptors fled the legion long ago and now are mercenaries, even if there are many still working for the legion. Their loyalty? First the brotherhood, then the raptors, then the legion, then chaos.

>> No.30716559

>>30716542
they would not.

>> No.30716649

>>30716517
To win without honour is to not win at all.

>>30716550
No, each and every loyalist Space Marine is willing to die for his brothers, while a Chaos Marine would rather stick a knife in their's, especially if it means saving their own hide.

>> No.30716672

>>30707948
>claims legions didn't have special rules
>next point is literally a listing of those special rules
Ignoring this imbecile, the issue with turning Codex: Chaos Space Marines from a focus on legions to a focus on warbands is that it's not the army that a lot of people bought into. It's telling a massive chunk of the players that they should play a different game with different models, where there are only rules for a small handful of the armies.

The other big issue would be that warbands wouldn't lack all of the recent Space Marine inventions and wouldn't be demonically influenced. Basically, renegades would be better served using the Codex: Space Marines. They could even make a supplement with Renegades Chapter Tactics and some Chaos wargear/options.

>> No.30716728

>>30716649
>To win without honour is to not win at all.

Dude...

You're talking about Chaos. That talk about honour and whatever might stir the circuitry of a tight-geared Triarch Praetorian, but with Chaos it goes outta the window and into the Nurgling pit.

>> No.30716746

>>30714171
>Alpha Legion

>I am Alpharius
If your Warlord is killed, you may immediately nominate another HQ choice as a replacement, gaining the benefit of your warlord trait. Your opponent must kill this second warlord to gain any "Slay The Warlord" victory point(s) offered by the scenario.

>Hydra Dominatus
Cultists may purchase those fancy special ops abilities they had in the 3.5 dex.

>> No.30716757

>>30709825
>go play 30k
>weeping thousand sons
Seriously, it will be years before there are rules for each legion, and then even more years before we get those legions chaosified.

>> No.30716787

>>30716728
>Dude...
>You're talking about Chaos.

I know, about Chaos and how they are cowardly, craven and so should not get ATSKNF.

>> No.30716832

>>30708620
So what shitty loser system did you love?

I'm fucking glad it's dead!

>> No.30716835

>>30716649
>To win without honour is to not win at all.

And where did you read that trash from?

>> No.30716865

>>30716672
>it's not the army that a lot of people bought into

5th and 6th Tyranid books say hi.

>> No.30716947

>>30716649
>To win without honour is to not win at all.
Well, it makes the victory bittersweet, that's for soure, but you might still be happy about keeping your other honour.

>> No.30716974

>>30710943
Half of his retorts were "go play a different army that doesn't even remotely behave like what you wanted." The other half completely ignored that GW has taken shit from FW before.

His entire retort missed the original point, which was that focusing on warbands has resulted in an ultra-bland Chaos codex.

>> No.30717161

>>30716649
>each and every loyalist Space Marine is willing to die for his brothers, while a Chaos Marine would rather stick a knife in their's, especially if it means saving their own hide.

That's right. Every chaos space marine willing to die for his brother probably did exactly that, several thousand years ago. You only get to do it once :-)

That's not at all to suggest that those who are still kicking ass after 10,000 years are scared of much or lacking in military discipline, though.

>> No.30717191

>>30711924
In 40k they are meant to be elite and rare. They have to deal with the fucking warp everyday and the recruitment process is a nightmare.

You to be hard as fuck to have daemon attacking your mind all day, have everyone on your force trying to stab you in the back or get you killed, and be low as shit on supply's.

It's just like tzeentch sorcerers. These guys are meant to be the epitome of the imperiums fear of psykers, have absolutely no restrictions when it comes to forbidden knowledge yet some how end up shitter than librarians and the eldar who both are so stupidly cautious and weary of the warp its retard.

TL;DR renegades should be marines with spikes, but marine from the eye of terror should be super elite with cultists for cannon fodder. It would actual make chaos district from marines.

>> No.30717228

>>30716649
>To win without honour is to not win at all.
To lose with honour is still to lose, though.

>> No.30717249

>>30717161
>That's not at all to suggest that those who are still kicking ass after 10,000 years are scared of much or lacking in military discipline, though.

It does mean you won't trust the guy next to you very much. When loyal Marines quit the fight they all know they've got each others backs and so can fall back well. When Chaos Marines decide to ditch it's every man for himself, which is why they get their asses swept.

>> No.30717268

>>30712501
Sounds good, loved 3rd Ed.

>> No.30717316

>>30717228
Better to lose with your head held high and your values uncompromised, rather than simply lose.

>> No.30717423

>>30717316
No it's not. It's exactly the same. To lose is to lose, nothing else matters.

When your life is at stake.

>> No.30717501

>>30717423
>When your life is at stake.

That is when you should be most uncompromising, the ultimate test of character, to stand unyielding or bow your head to a corrupt universe that would have you do otherwise.

>> No.30717568

>>30714500
It's discrimination against daemon culture and their right to live forever

>> No.30717602

>>30717501
>That is when you should be most uncompromising, the ultimate test of character, to stand unyielding or bow your head to a corrupt universe that would have you do otherwise.
Whether you should or shouldn't is immaterial; you still lose.

>> No.30717624

>>30716649
>No, each and every loyalist Space Marine is willing to die for his brothers

SM don't have a choice. They're brainwashed mooks.

>> No.30717634

>>30717568
That right was well-paid-for.

Few can afford to pay, even among those who are willing to.

>> No.30717657

>>30717191
>They have to deal with the fucking warp everyday and the recruitment process is a nightmare.

Being spewed out of Bile's flesh pits is hardly "recruitment".

>> No.30717681

>>30717602
Then lose.

>>30717624
They all have a choice, hence why traitor and renegade scum exist.

>> No.30717797

>>30717657
In old fluff single recruits were taken from 10000 man free for all deathmatchs and other crazy shit like that just to get the implant.

It was outright stated that chaos recruits went through far more than loyalist and the odds or far more against them.

>> No.30717833

>>30717501
>>30717681
Loyalist plz leave. Heretics only up in this bitch

>> No.30717989

>>30717797
Space Sharks do that now.

This is what pisses me off about csm; everything that they originally had (good and bad; fluff and crunch; from overheating plasma to fear as a weapon) eventually gets sucked up into the space marines and wider imperium. But nothing ever flows back the other way, even though it logically should; like grav weapons, grav vehicles, assault cannons, etc.

>> No.30718022

>>30714500
It pretty much means Chaos isn't worth turning to. "Be a semi-immortal, nearly cosmically powered daemon!" isn't as appealing as
"We're the fucking flagship army!"

>> No.30718378

>>30717989
Can't wait for my imperial baledrake!!!

>> No.30718442
File: 67 KB, 550x495, chaos-up-in-this-motherfucker.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30718442

>>30717833
You forgot your pic, brother.

>> No.30718557
File: 49 KB, 535x437, 1391495799709.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
30718557

>> No.30718978

>>30717989

What pisses me off is how CSM only see the grass is greener on the other side and completely ignore all the shit they get, like larger squads, GEQ alternatives, zombies, shit tons of different unlockable troops (only bikes scouts and tacticals for C:SM), daemonforged stuff, daemons, etc.

>> No.30719596

>>30718978
That's a retarded line of thought, NONE of what you just mentioned is actually any better than what SM get.

Larger squads? Who the fuck cares? Lack of ATSNF, can't put in a rhino so you have to footslog, no other way of deployment. and horde marines is among the worst army types in the game.

GEQ alternatives. Cultists suck. You only ever take a minimum squad for some backfield objective holding.

Zombies suck

You get 4 types of unlockable troops. 2 of them are outright terrible. 1 is semi-viable, the other one is a bit more viable. SM bikes are about 10x better than the benefits of these unlockable troops.

Daemonfoged stuff. 1 is overcosted out the ass, the other only works if you spam them, and the last one carries the entire shit codex.

Daemons in CSM are a points sink that will be taken out in combat by any other MC int he game

Comments like these make me wonder if /tg/ is devoling to warseer/dakka dakka tier

>>
Name (leave empty)
Comment (leave empty)
Name
E-mail
Subject
Comment
Password [?]Password used for file deletion.
Captcha
Action