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[ERROR] No.30617495 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

I know you've probably been asked this question a lot but I have to know.

Which one did you prefer, the oldcrons or the newcrons?

>> No.30617543

>>30617495

Newcrons. I don't play any miniature games, so the only interesting bit about of any of it is when people discuss it -- and people discuss new things.

>> No.30617558

>>30617495
Eldar.

>> No.30617670

Oldcrons seemed scarier. Not knowing anything about them was better than newcrons. Also they took away FTL from them..

>> No.30617732

What's the difference

>> No.30617749

>>30617495
Newcrons.

>>30617670
>Not knowing anything about them was better than newcrons.

Except we knew everything about them.

>> No.30617785

>>30617495

Oldcrons infinitely better IMO.

>> No.30617796

>>30617732
One are zombies

The other are mummies

>> No.30617820

Oldcrons. They went from being tools of genocide to a bunch of angry farmers wanting their land back.

With Egyptian aesthetics.

>> No.30617839

>>30617820
>yfw you realise the Oldcron's whole purpose was farming people for C'tan

>> No.30617864

oldfag here. oldcrons sucked and c'tan did it was retarded.

newcrons.

>> No.30617878

I'm torn.

Oldcrons did have that unstoppable, merciless, constantly coming zombie anroid feel about them.

I do quite like how much more character the Newcrons do and for a Ward backstory it's not Khornite Knights terrible. I just really hate how they became SPACE TOMB KINGS. HOW ABOUT SOME MORE FANTASY IN YOUR 40K?

>> No.30617920

>>30617878
>HOW ABOUT SOME MORE FANTASY IN YOUR 40K?
>40k is Fantasy in space
>HOW ABOUT SOME MORE FANTASY IN YOUR FANTASY?

>> No.30617941

OP here for me I prefer newcrons

both because they seemed kinda broken fluff-wise. An unstoppable army controlled by living gods, one of which may or may not control all human tech, out to destroy the warp and all living things with nothing really to stop them from doing so.

that and their relations with Tomb Kings. 40k is big on changing it's original "Warhammer IN SPACE" fluff to "the GRIMDARK future of GRIMDARK", but this is the few times they did the opposite.

>> No.30617944

>>30617495
Oldcron.

>> No.30618095

>>30617495
It's simple OP. Apart from stray conformists and people without taste the following rules apply:
>born after 1990? Newcrons
>got into 40k through Dawn of War? Newcrons
>joined 40k fandom late 4th ed or later? Newcrons
>watched too much television as a kid? Newcrons.

Oldcrons only good crons, fuck the haters.

>> No.30618124

>>30618095
Elitism isn't any better.

>> No.30618143

>>30617820
You meant they went from farming tools for a bunch of angry farmers, into the angry farmers themselves.

>>30617495
newcrons

>> No.30618196

>>30618124
I never said I'm not a conformist :^)
In complex organisations conformism leads only to cliques and ineffective comunication while elite lead to decisive leaders and competition so I'd pick elitism any day.

>> No.30618201

>>30618095
>>got into 40k through Dawn of War? Newcrons

But DoWtards are the most die hard Oldcron fags because of Pariahs and DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATH, GUVONERRRRRRRRR.

>> No.30618204

>>30618095
Be better summed up as

>You liked Necrons when they were introduced? Oldcrons
>You hated them with a passion and called them "noobcrons" in the beginning? Newcrons

before the change, Necrons weren't a very popular race (big 4 being Marines, IGs, Nids, and Orks).

>> No.30618225

>>30618204
>IGs, Nids
>Bigger than Eldar

Mon'kek

>> No.30618232

Newcrons.
Tyranids do the mindless killing machine thing better.

>> No.30618250

>>30618225
>elf detected

>> No.30618256

>>30618225
I believe they have (had?) bigger playerbase.

>> No.30618260

>>30618095
Buy newcrons still include oldcrons. There's just more variety now.

If you want your old omnicidal zombie bots you can still have them.

>> No.30618287

>>30618256
Nope. Eldar have classically been a very powerful army, and are so currently as well. This draws them a big fan base as well as the people who just like Elves.
Marines sit on top as the undisputed king, and below them sat the triumvirate of Chaos, Orks and Eldar.

>> No.30618292

>>30617878
Sure, I'd love Lizardmen in SPAAAACE. Not even joking.

>> No.30618359

>>30618292
Probably the best time to introduce Lizardman.

>> No.30618384

Oldcrons for me. I like some aspects of the newcron lore, but it took away my favourite aspect of the oldcrons, their slumbering terror from beyond the stars status, effectively.

I liked the c'tan controlling the necrons and rising up with them, and that went away in favor of the necrons enslaving them. It's not as scary, not as interesting, really.

>> No.30618421

>>30618384
>not as interesting
Impressive, it's hard to be less interesting then farming equipment driven by THE MASTER OF MELODRAMA

>> No.30618426

>>30617878
Don't be torn. Newcrons where added alongside the oldcrons. They didn't replace them.

>> No.30618444

>>30618201
On the contrary. Before DoW necrons didn't talk much.

>>30618204
I don't think they gained popularity due to new fluff. It's rather that they gradually rose to become a very strong army, that always attracts players.

>>30618260
Yeah, I hate this argument. I don't really mind the loss of zombie bots. It's the general feel of the faction and their origins that bug me. A mysterious, unified and eerily silent threat fits 40k better than warring dynasties of robomummies that troll everybody. C'Tan broken into pet shards? This feels wrong.

>oh look newmarines are as good as oldmarines, you totally can still have your dull warrior monks if you want to

>> No.30618470

>>30618384
There should be no c'tan one way or another.
There are no active gods in 40k: eldar ones are dead, Emps is incapacitated, Chaos Gods cannot manifest into reality.
C'tan were a disbalance.

>> No.30618483

>>30618384
If you want oldcron style dudes you can still have your mindless muder robots controlled by a starvampire and still fit the newcron dex fluff completely.

I don't get the newcron fluff hate. They added variety and took nothing away.

>> No.30618491

>>30618444
>On the contrary. Before DoW necrons didn't talk much.

So? It gave everyone the impression that they were one note death obsessed retards, which is precisely what Oldcronfags seem to like because it's "scary."

>> No.30618509

>>30618444
>I don't think they gained popularity due to new fluff
Well, not that anon, but I personally would have never even considered a Necron army until their new fluff.

>> No.30618524

>>30618421

I like him, actually, I think he would have been more effective as a rogue necron lord who managed to pry himself away from c'tan control, somehow. Or something along those lines anyway.

>> No.30618561

>>30618444
>oh look newmarines are as good as oldmarines, you totally can still have your dull warrior monks if you want to

bad argument since there are such thing as old marines (see: Beakies)

>> No.30618596

>>30618491
Not quite. Having no soul or sanity is kinda scary. At least better than LUL DEEMUNZ RAEP prevalent in Chaos. Which also reminds me that all factions in 40k are one-dimensional.

>>30618509
That's because you're a fluffy player and I respect that. But strong armies attract players. Just look how many Taufags have appeared lately.

>> No.30618602

>>30618470

I would honestly have preferred the c'tan as puppetmasters, rather than units capable of directly engaging in combat.

Their "purpose" on the field, as reality-shattering entities, would be much more fittingly filled by stuff conjured up by mad scientist necrons.

"good news, everybody, I invented a device that can literally turn someone inside out."

>> No.30618627

>>30618596
>Just look how many Taufags have appeared lately.

>> No.30618675

>>30618627
Now where are armies of eldarfags?
They are top 1 army for fuck's sake.

>> No.30618710

>>30618483
I myself can see the hate. Oldcrons were the stuff that gave Cain nightmares. Newcrons are much more characterized but a lot less scary. Like giving something in a horror movie a back story.

That being said I like Newcrons fluff more because oldcrons were a bit too powerful. I mean other races you had ways to stop them, but oldcrons you kinda didn't it was only a matter of time and since GW wasn't going to have the Necrons destroy all life and seal the warp (because GW) all you'll be left with is questioning why they didn't do it yet?

>> No.30618801

>>30618602
but there are already chaos gods

>> No.30618851

>>30618801

And when's the last time you fielded Khorne himself?

When's the last time Tzeentch opened a rift in time and space and appeared in front of an army of Eldar saying going "DO YOU WANT TO SEE A MAGIC TRICK?"

>> No.30618879

>>30618851
Never and that's why they are better.

>> No.30618880

>>30618851
>When's the last time Tzeentch opened a rift in time and space and appeared in front of an army of Eldar saying going "DO YOU WANT TO SEE A MAGIC TRICK?"

Then got scared away by a grenade.

>> No.30618898

>>30618710
Exactly. Why were The Harrowing, The Pale Wasting or The Howling interesting? Because we know little about them, and mind fears the unknown. It puts the entire setting in perspective, that there are primordial forces so evil that almost nothing can stop them.
And now one of these forces spends time stealing artifacts and walking their C'Tan.

>> No.30618979

>>30618898
>Why were The Harrowing, The Pale Wasting or The Howling interesting? Because we know little about them, and mind fears the unknown. It puts the entire setting in perspective, that there are primordial forces so evil that almost nothing can stop them.

But they were all stopped by the Imperium, the same Imperium that has a harder time stopping the Tau.
I find nothing interesting about flat spookums.

>> No.30618980

>>30618879

Which was exactly what I was trying to say?

>> No.30619044

>>30618979
It is implied that losses were catastrophic in each of these 3 events. Tau wars consumed what, 1% of Segmentum forces?

>> No.30619248

>>30619044
>It is implied that losses were catastrophic in each of these 3 events.

No more so than the Tau, the Howling was ended by the Black Templars, a single chapter, the most impressive thing was how it died. The Pale Wasting was a footnote compared to the Imperium's own internal problems at the time and the Harrowing was beaten was ass raped when the Admech found some guns.

>> No.30619914

>>30617670
this

Oldcrons were scarry because they were uncarry

newcrons are just another race of aliens slightly evil, like dark eldar or orks

>> No.30619998

>>30617495

Oldcrons.

Newcrons are boring. By giving them personality, now they paradoxically have become just another brown streak in the 40k lore shitstain.

>> No.30620433

>>30619044
>1% of Segmentum forces

off topic but
1% is a pretty big number when it comes to a Segmentum

>> No.30620572

2Ecrons >Newcrons >Oldcrons

The farther you get away from the C'tan the better they are.

>> No.30620925

Oldcrons. Wannabe eldar is not a good flavor, nor is successfully rising up against their gods that some are quick to point out shouldn't have been on the tabletop because of their powerlevel.

Shards were a good idea, though. Even if poke'tan was shit. Just refluff it as the C'tan being drained from the exertion of the war in heaven and retreating to rest, relying on the crons to harvest sustenance for them. And if the crons really need to, they can summon a portion of their c'tan's power into a shard.

Ta-da.

>> No.30621258

Newcrons.
Although I adore the whole "silent terminator liches IN SPAAAACE!"
I feel that giving them personality was for the best.
They don't have to be Egyptian-themed if you don't want them to.
You can make them however you want.
Robo Space Pirates? Hell yeah.
Nazi Doom Robo Cult Ninjas? Awesome.
Spooky Shiny Skeletons? 2spoopy4me!
The Oldcrons, although one of the only serious example of a truly fearsome juggernaut, just seemed too bland. Just like any horror movie, if the same brand of horror is used over and over again, it will get boring.

I would love to see a Tomb Lord who specializes in using fear. Not just silent troops or appearing behind you within a blink of an eye, but one that uses psychology against his opponent.

Bladda yadda yadda TL:DR:
Newcrons are better because we can completely write our own fluff if we so desired.

>> No.30621311

>>30617495
Newcrons

the fluff still lets you play your army like oldcrons, but gives you more options too

>> No.30621347

>>30620572
surely Necrons with the zombie robots or death but without the C'tan chaos god wannabes would please most people.

>> No.30621383

Everyone going on about how oldcrons are still a thing is full of shit, too. They're not canon anymore. If you refuse to play them as newcrons, you're just some autist trying to push your fanfic.

The c'tan are sharded. Anti-c'tan protocols are set in stone. The dynasties rule now.

>> No.30621510

>>30621383
Actually, you are wrong anon. Check it:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Empire_of_the_Severed#.UxVSh86oREM

Very much like Oldcrons in some ways, yeah? Big evil thing controlling a bunch of Necrons to take over the universe for it?

Even then, it's not like what's decided for the lore has to be present absolutely everywhere. Maybe there are Newcrons who work and act similar to Oldcrons. Maybe C'tan shards came together and gained enough power to control a Necron dynasty.

>> No.30621556

>>30621383
> They're not canon anymore
except they still are. The necron codex specifically mentions a tombworld whos guarding AI deleted all the stored personalities and is now going al Oldcron on surrounding systems. The codex's fluff also leaves open the space for still free or escaped shards who could well take over a dynasty and be fully capable of pulling a similar personality deletion to stop future uprisings.

If you want you can absolutely have EXACTLY Oldcrons and still be 100% inline with the current codex's fluff.

>> No.30621784

Something else I think the Newcron fluff does a good job of doing - it leaves kitbashing a bit more free. Why, you ask? Because not every dynasty went into/came out of their naptime the same. Some dynasties were wrecked during the war against the Old Ones and then the C'tan; some still had ancient stores of technology.

Now, if we didn't before, we get a better sense the Necrons are based around the physical bodies of the Necrontyr. Regular Necrons are more uniform, but the higher ranking Necrons with their unique personalities and their actual consciousnesses can look different from one to the next. Most of these upper tier bodies aren't just mass produced.

>> No.30621820

Newcrons, oldcrons had no depth.

>> No.30621832

>>30621383
>They're not canon anymore.

That has not stopped a 40kfag before and it won't stop them now.

Squats are alive I don't care what you say

>> No.30621865

>>30621832
also they're still canon, just not the entire species.

>> No.30621886

>>30621832
Actually yes they are it's canon!

Also, if you look on the Lexicanium, you'll find they never bothered to edit out the part in the Second War for Armageddon where an army of Squats comes in at the end.

>> No.30622365

I've been looking through my collection of BL stories that feature the Necrons and that were released after the 5e codex came out. Here's what I've found.

Cold Blood - The Bloodlords warband comes across an Imperial ice world prison planet. In the hopes of some easy slaughter, they go down only to find all of the atmosphere has been sucked out of the prison, leaving all of the prisoners to die in their cells, leaving the warband right in the middle of a necron tomb awakening. The dead silent necron warriors blast huge chunks out of the warband, who are basically going insane because they can't get any blood out of the necrons.

Mission: Annihilate - A Deathwatch kill-team is planting explosives in a sleeping necron tomb. When the bomb goes live, they're swarmed with millions of scarabs and spyders. As they fight, a necron lord begins to awake, basically freezing them with a gaze just as they manage to teleport out and the bomb goes off.

So yeah, I'm not really seeing anything among BL where the existence of newcrons have been detrimental.

>> No.30622602

>>30619248

The Black Templars are Legion sized. There's not much that's every been able to stand up to a space marine legion.

I've never heard about the Pale Wasting.

The Harrowing was only barely beaten back by inquisitors and Admech combining sorcery and demons and darkmech stuff together, and that was after they nearly got to Terra.

>> No.30622676

I prefer Newcrons.
Because you can still have oldcrons with the new fluff. That and I love ancient Egypt, so an army that actively has that as a motif makes me happy.
That and I plan on getting a few of these assholes for my army.

>> No.30622717

>>30622676
Only problem I ever have with the Egyptian theme is when Necrons and Thousand Sons fight. "Oh look! Egyptian Space Robots are fighting against Egyptian Space Robots!"

>> No.30622836

>>30618204
>>You liked Necrons when they were introduced? Oldcrons
BULLSHIT!!!!

I'm a Necron fan since the start the Nightbringer was the first 40k model got

and I can tell you Oldcrons are SHIT, they were boring to paint and play and the lore was a just Tyranids and Eldar fluff mixed in a blender

Oldcrons fans are the 2nd biggest faggots in 40k tieing between Chaos and Black Templar players

>> No.30622849

>>30622602
six to eight thousand is not legion sized.

>> No.30622931

>>30622849

Salamanders say what.

>> No.30622956

>>30622717
>not Egyptian space ghost armor wizards fighting Egyptian space ghost robots

>> No.30622977

>>30617495

All in all I think the emperor takes the cake.

>> No.30622982

>>30622849
it used to be until the HH books up the size

that's why the Ultramarines the largest legion who didn't fought the HH only made 24 3nd founding chapters when the current numbers should place that at 240 chapters

>> No.30623315

Dumping Newcron lore/fluff to celebrate their awesomeness.

>He stood before the xenos lord now, having fought his way in behind its guardians. It glared at him with its baleful green orbs. A burst of mechanised sound emerged from its throat. It took a moment for Cassiel to realise that it was laughing at him.

>It stepped forward, thrusting its staff at his chest. Cassiel batted the blow aside and lunged, the move perfectly timed. His blade slid between the lord’s slit of a mouth, silencing its ugly laughter. With a roar, he pressed forward, using all his strength and weight to ram Aruthel home until the hilt struck its face, a full metre and a half of blade protruding out from the back of its neck.

>Even as the light died in the xenos being’s eyes, its appearance changed. Its body grew larger in stature, heavy armoured plates appearing on its shoulders and chest, and the shape of its cranium altering. Before Cassiel’s eyes, its metal physiology had morphed into that of one of its bodyguards.

>‘What–’ he began, startled by this unexpected transformation. He felt the hairs on the back of his neck stiffen, and there was a crackling sound behind him.

>A blow struck him squarely in the back, accompanied by a sound akin to a thunderclap.

>He was slammed flat, twitching involuntarily. Green-tinged lightning danced across his armour. He struggled to push himself to his feet, but his muscles were convulsing uncontrollably, and he could not rise.

>The xenos lord stood behind him. It had taken over the body of another of its bodyguards and stood now in its place, looking down upon him, croaking its ugly laughter.

>One of the guardians, newly reformed from the damage Cassiel had wrought upon it, stepped forward with its blade ready. The xenos lord barked something in its indecipherable dead language, and the guardian halted, warily. Hunched and cowled, the lord shuffled in, leaning over Cassiel, regarding him closely.

>> No.30623336

>>30623315
>It was so close that he could see the intricate circuitry behind its armoured ribcage, and smell its repugnant stink, a strange mix of battery acid, oil and dust. Aruthel lay on the ice, just half a metre away. He could kill this abomination in an instant, he was sure, and he strained to regain control of his body. The convulsions were passing. His fingers twitched, and the veins in his neck bulged.

>With a roar, he shot his hand out and grabbed the blade.

>He was too slow, however. The ancient xenos placed its hand upon his chest, skeletal metal fingers spread wide. A pulse of energy passed into Cassiel’s body. He gasped, his eyes wide – in that instant, Cassiel’s twin hearts ceased to beat, and his breathing halted.

>‘You… are… mine,’ the necron lord said, his hand still upon the fallen Space Marine’s chest.

>> No.30623349

>>30622977
Guardsman is a total bro, though...even with the whole dying thing. We could just have a medicae around all the time!

>>30622982
Well, to be fair, they were taken by surprise at Calth and really cut down. And there was that whole bit after the Heresy where the Imperium had to take back all the territory Horus had taken during the Heresy. They were bound to take some casualties then.

>> No.30623366

>One of them was about to die.

>They stood at the epicentre of the battle, beneath a sky that was burning, and it seemed as though time stood still. The black-armoured paragon of humanity brought a golden-winged power sword around in a crackling two-handed killing strike. His pale face was twisted in hatred, and his eyes were tinged red with blood-rage. Despite the thickness of his enemy’s bull-like neck, the blow was perfectly timed, delivered with all his genhanced and armour-augmented strength.

>His opponent was a hulking green skinned monster that stood over two and half metres tall. It lived only for battle and knew – nay, cared for – nothing else. It roared as it swung its chugging chain-glaive around in a brutal arc, a blow that could carve the Space Marine clean in two.

>Either blow would be mortal if it landed. Both would land within a single heartbeat.

>But that heartbeat would never come.

>Trazyn the Infinite stepped between the two frozen combatants, inspecting his latest acquisition. He peered into the Space Marine’s eyes. Life blazed there, along with a frenzied, insane fury. He knew that the enhanced human creature could see him. He knew that its conscious mind still remained, trapped forever within the prison of its own body. If it were not so, then his display would be lacking.

>Satisfied, he shuffled across the battlefield, past hundreds more frozen statues, each carefully positioned as per his grand design. Some were firing weapons or swinging blades. Others were dying, trapped forever in the moment of their deaths. It was glorious.

>The holographic burning sky and the red-sanded earth flickered as he reached the edge of the display. Once again he stood upon the gleaming obsidian deck of his infinite gallery.

>> No.30623414

>>30623366
>Trazyn strode away, his staff clicking sharply with each step. He walked his halls, past countless other displays with primitive creatures of every description, breed and race; all arrayed and carefully posed; all living, trapped until the end of time. He passed beings that had died out half a million years earlier – some whose loss was mourned by the galaxy at large, and others that had simply disappeared without note.

>There were hundreds of displays on this deck alone, many of them far grander than his latest, humble effort. Thousands more decks lay above and below.

>Trazyn gave them no more thought. His mind was already moving on to his next project.

>He rubbed his metal hands in glee. It would be a masterpiece.

- Infinite Tableau

>> No.30623551

>> No.30623581

>>30623551

>> No.30623603

Newcrons

I think Nids fill our need for 'soulless overwhelming alien invaders' just fine

>> No.30623604

>>30623581

>> No.30623633

>>30623603
>I think Nids fill our need for 'soulless overwhelming alien invaders' just fine

Err..and how are the Newcrons not this?

>> No.30623635

>>30617495

Newcrons are sexy and Trazyn is my waifu

>> No.30623698

>>30617820
>>30617839
>>30618143

Farming Death Robots?
please make that happen

>> No.30623728

>Phaeron Ahmontekh, called in ages past the Crimson Scythe for the blood in which he drenched the sector, is the once and future king of the Suhbekhar Dynasty. The Phaeron was at one time counted amongst the most puissant of warriors and his name was feared across countless thousands of worlds. He fought at the side of the C’tan themselves, and is said to have once struck a blow that slew a god. He bore a warscythe of such potency that it is said to have shattered the planet Maldek into a billion chunks of rock in a single blow, an event which several of the Eldar’s mystic cyclesingers make reference to many aeons later.

--------------

>The last Phaeron of the dynasty— Ahmontekh, called the Crimson Scythe—was a general of great repute. It was Ahmontekh who, according to the Lamentations of Yr, defeated the proud Nuada, beloved of the Old Ones, and who plunged his mighty war-scythe into the hallowed ground of Xoth. As the War in Heaven neared its climax, it was Ahmontekh that breached the Walls of Ib and who was first to pass through the Dolmen Gate on the brink of the Ebon Void. It is said that Ahmontekh defeated beings the ancient Eldar revered as gods, and that even to this day the last of the Old Ones’ progeny hold him in a unique blend of hatred and fear. Yet, of all the legends told of mighty Ahmontekh, none are repeated so often as that of his betrayal at the hand of his cousin Setii of the Charnovokh Dynasty.

>> No.30623774

>>30623728
>Ahmontekh the Crimson Scythe did not go to such unimaginable lengths to hide his crown world on a mere whim. The Hollow Sun was constructed because the Phaeron of the Suhbekhar Dynasty had every reason to suspect that numerous of his enemies would actively seek out his resting place throughout his aeons of sleep. So many of the Old Ones’ servants had he slain during the War in Heaven that the Crimson Scythe was marked for death from one end of the galaxy to the other. The last of the meddlesome Oort might have fallen to his bloody scythe, the many faced Proteans sent to the pyre and the pale Seers of Leng scattered to the corners of the galaxy, but the Eldar had emerged from the War in Heaven as an ascendant power. These former warriors of the Old Ones seemed content to allow the Necrons to retire, or perhaps they believed the C’tan’s armies all slain. In the case of the Crimson Scythe, however, the Eldar were intent upon ensuring he could never return from whatever exile he had embarked upon. Ahmontekh, a master strategist as well as a fearsome warrior, knew the Eldar would not rest in their hunt for vengeance against the slayer of so many of their former masters’ progeny, and took the most thorough of precautions to ensure his sleep went undisturbed. When he awoke, so the Crimson Scythe planned, he would turn upon what remained of the Eldar. Then the hunters would become the hunted and the stars would be stained crimson with Eldar blood once more.

>> No.30623891

>The pyramid split down the centre, the pict-feed dissolving into static as a golden brilliance roared through the cracks like the birth of galaxies. A shockwave thumped through the moon’s crust, tossing aside mighty Space Marines like spent cartridges from a magazine. A kilometre away, even the Chimera jumped like water in a hot pan. With a curse, Drax held it steady.

>The pict-feed was clearing up, capturing a ring of devastation around the opening pyramid. There was a being inside it, bound in chains of stellar matter as though caged within the heart of a star.

>Except it wasn’t.

>Drax watched as the earth fell away, a vast canyon that tracked, to the precise degree, the pyramid’s rotation and the eyeline of that shackled entity. Where its gaze fell, Rhinos and Predators were flipped into the air and torn open, infantry consumed by withering waves of fire. Drax couldn’t believe what he saw, but he couldn’t look away. As he watched, a string of meteors materialised out of the sky, hanging like beads on a necklace before they spontaneously ignited, hyperaccelerated, and hammered through the Space Marine advance in huge explosions of ice and fire.

>No, Drax thought, as the pyramid continued to turn, that arc of devastation coming inexorably towards him, like an asteroid destined to cross the orbit of a sun. This being had brought the star into the cage with it.

>‘Try it!’ Drax roared at the screen. It heard him, he knew. He could feel it, just as he had felt its first stirrings from within his cell. ‘Come on. Come get some.’

>> No.30623941

>>30623891
>It turned full face.

>And then Drax really did feel it, the full epochal malevolence of the c’tan.

>The ignition spluttered. The lights flickered and failed and Drax found that he couldn’t move, not even to put his fingers to the ignition keys. He was a child, left in his crib of cold leather and plasteel by a cruel star-god. It saw him, but his eyes couldn’t begin to fathom it and he saw only darkness. Drax might have wept then, but it didn’t matter. The transcendent shard of the c’tan took the time to study him. Not because Drax was special. He was not. It took the time because it could, because time ran to its command. The instant stretched, to an infinity if the c’tan had so willed, but time enough for Drax to comprehend.

>The universe didn’t love him. The Emperor would never know his name. Only this entity, this god of ancient stars, would remember. And in the second that followed, the Chimera flipped onto its back, its belly splitting open. Air, heat and Drax himself were ripped through the hull and out onto the surface of the moon. He floated, falling so slowly. The world was black and silent. It was cold. And the c’tan looked away.

-Cold Steel

One of my favorite 40K tropes is the ''He isn't listening'' one. Always depressingly grimdark.

>> No.30623947

>>30623633
The Lords have personalities now, don't they?
And it's more 'rebuilding ancient civilization' instead of 'Harvest bioma- Ah, souls. I meant souls.'

>> No.30624002

>>30623947
Not to mention, different Lords have different ways of going about building civilization - or really just doing whatever they want.

You wouldn't find a Tyranid going, "You know, it'd be easier to get biomass if we convinced the humans were were going to give them all cake, and /then/ ate them." Hive Mind would slap them and tell them to nom.

>> No.30624006

>>30623947
Then you should have worded it differently because

Newcrons are
-Soulless
-Overwhelming
-Alien
-Invaders

(SOAI, for short)

>> No.30624022

>>30618095

I dunno sounds like you're the only one hating here..

>> No.30624032

Oldcrons were fucking retarded, their fluff basically just amounted to "You know that thing that (insert other race) did? Well it was the C'tan all along!" It was fucking lazy writing, even by 40k standards.

>> No.30624047

Are Newcrons....good guys? Or at least not mustache twirling evil?

>> No.30624078

>>30624032
>Then, from out of the madness of the maze, a towering figure appeared, its perfect form wreathed in golden light. Without a word, the figure beckoned for Abaddon to follow. Though the Despoiler tried to talk to the being and see its face, it remained hidden within a gauze of shimmering light, unresponsive and silent. The figure led Abaddon to the centre of the labyrinth where a shard of shifting darkness hung suspended in the air. Reaching out into the void, Abaddon felt the cold hilt of a blade meet his palm and he pulled it into reality; the Daemon sword Drach'nyen took terrible shape before his eyes. Raising the fearsome blade before him, Abaddon turned to demand the name of his golden guide, only to discover that the figure was gone.

-Black Legion Supplement

---------------------------------
>624.M36 A Blade out of Time

>Although impossible to fix in time, this seems to be the first recorded instance where Cypher is seen carrying the C’tan phase knife – a weapon similar to the C’tan phase sword used by the Callidus Assassins. The blade of the knife can phase in and out of real-space by dimensional realignment, so it is capable of bypassing armour and protective fields. The knife was at some point lost in battle with the C’tan known as the Deceiver in the opening stages of the 13th Black Crusade, however, the battle occurred in the Warp and seems to have been subject to a strange loop in either the time continuum or reality itself. Cypher is most often seen without the blade, but true to its name, the knife occasionally phases back into being beneath his cloak.

-Cypher Lord of the Fallen Dataslate

FYI, It's still a thing in Newcron lore.

>> No.30624103

OP again

from what I can tell the opinions are well divided, and both for good reason.
But there's one thing both sides seem to agree on. and that is C'tans suck

>> No.30624113

>>30623414
I love Trazyn. All the dickishness of Eldrad, all the Keikaku of Tzeentch (not really though), and he does it all for the same reason we do: cool models.
He even has an inquisitor waifu/nemesis.

>> No.30624147

>>30624047
>Are Newcrons....good guys?

Their alignments are ranged in the Neutral and Evil spectrums.

>Or at least not mustache twirling evil?

Necron Overlords cause tornados and tempests due to their excessive twirling of their nonexistent evil mustaches.

That's why one of them is called the Stormlord.

>> No.30624151

Didn't the necrons have FTL by screwing mass and inerta? I remember reading about that. And in the new codex doesn't it pretty much say necrons are doomed to stay sub-light? If that's true it pretty much ruins necrons for me. But otherwise newcrons are better.

>> No.30624206

>>30624151
Newcrons use the Webway or else they are doomed to isolation.

Says so in the dex.

>> No.30624229

>>30624103
>and that is C'tans suck

Nope, C'tan are cool.

Also one of the few sources of delicious beefcake in 40K.

>> No.30624230

>>30624206
Which I honestly find kind of stupid - how could they even get around? The webway is mostly broken now, and unlike the craftworlds, they don't know how to actually build their own webway gates, and don't have one connected to each of their tombworlds.

>> No.30624239

>>30623604
>"Your frozen godling is an old friend"
Wat

>> No.30624255

>>30624147
many of them seem to be more mustache-twirlers in that instead of wanting to end all life they instead want to conquer the galaxy

That surprisingly uncommon in 40k, conquering the galaxy for galactic-conquest sake. I mean the imperium, chaos and orks have an empire but the former is mostly focused on defending it and chaos and orks are all about the corruption and fight respectively.

>> No.30624281

>>30624230
>The webway is mostly broken now

Not broken beyond use. Even the small part open to the Necrons allows them to outpace all but the Eldar.

>they don't know how to actually build their own webway gates

Yep, they build Dolmen Gates instead.

>> No.30624339

>>30624255
>That surprisingly uncommon in 40k

Untrue.

Abaddon desires galactic conquest.

The Beast had dreams of galactic conquest and now these dreams live on in Ghazy.

>> No.30624377

>>30624339
oh yeah forgot about Abbadon

>> No.30624393

>>30624230
Webway is shattered, but not useless. Also, the Necron Dolmen gates are what cause much of the shattering it the first place. They use brute force to smash into the webway, and so there being many disconnects is less of an issue for the Necrons, considering they can bust in, travel as far as they can, bust out, and hop into the next section.
The Eldar used the webway like a man on the subway. The Necrons use it like the Hulk in an apartment complex.

>> No.30624396

>>30624339
>Abaddon desires galactic conquest

I don't know - I'm starting to get the idea that Abaddon is just using the idea of fighting the Imperium as a way to unite a bunch of warbands behind him whenever he needs to, so he can take something he wants and just leave. He's never seemed to use any of his Black Crusades for the specific goal of conquest - most of them seem to be raids built around sowing fear into the Imperium, or capturing certain devices or artifacts.

>> No.30624488

>>30624396
>He's never seemed to use any of his Black Crusades for the specific goal of conquest - most of them seem to be raids built around sowing fear into the Imperium, or capturing certain devices or artifacts.

He is gathering power and resources for the 13th Black Crusade where he plans to put his 10K plan in motion and conquer the Imperium and the galaxy.

Remember that Abaddon is playing this game not only against the Imperium. He is struggling with the Chaos Gods themselves. For him to sit on the Throne of the Dark Imperium, he must deny the Chaos Gods. And this takes a lot of planning and manipulation.

If you want it to be explained more clearly for you, try this link :

http://aarondembskibowden.wordpress.com/2013/08/22/lets-talk-about-abaddon/

>> No.30624608

>>30624488
That article does bring up very good points. It has been a while since I've read it, but it was where I got started on my idea anyway. I forgot how Aaron tied his works into an eventual goal of conquest.

Still, I don't think Abaddon cares at all about the warbands that ally with him. Whether they live or die is their loss, as long as they help him reach whatever goal he's working towards.

>> No.30624855

>>30624488
Doesn't explain why the Chaos Gods tolerate him playing hard to get when there are plenty eager to take his place and get shit done. Right now they're acting like little girls out of some harem anime with undeserved devotion directed at Abbadon-sama who is the dense MC.

>> No.30624899

>>30624113
>>all the Keikaku of Tzeentch

Nah, that would be Orikan. Who outplays Eldar farseers in their own game.


>He let himself slip from the skein, but was wrenched about, his spirit spinning away from the threads of fate. As he grasped for purchase, he saw stars moving and exploding, and a metal skull with a single green orb glowing balefully in its centre. It was haloed by a ring of gold and its monstrous, unmoving maw whispered to him…

>''Even your prophecies are not safe, Eldorath One-Hand. What does that leave you?''

>With a jolt, Eldorath felt reality reassert itself. He knew that yngiract, by reputation at least. The Diviner. Was it the source of the problems he and his seers had walking the skein? Senses returned, gravity took its hold and he felt the steady buzz of the infinity circuit, the whispers of seers long gone.

--------------

>A souldark stares. It is cyclopean, vile. It stares at her. There is no sign of Illic. It stares…

----------------

>She knew a route through the canyons. A route that they would take in the future, brought back to guide them in the now. The memory burned. It felt false, tampered with. The skein shifted. Catritheyn turned to Illic, witchlight fading from her eyes.

>He returned her gaze with disgust.

>‘We find our own path,’ the Nightspear said.

>> No.30625048

>>30624855
>Doesn't explain why the Chaos Gods tolerate him playing hard to get when there are plenty eager to take his place and get shit done.

Because he is Be'lakor reborn and the only dude they think is competent and worthy enough to be their everchosen ascendant?

It's said in the article that should any of the Chaos Gods win him to his/her cause, then Abaddon will grind and crush all the rivals of that god to dust. Dude is special and the Chaos Gods know that. He among the few in Chaos who can actually get things done and they desire to rob him of his freewill and victory in the end. Too bad, he is doing things his way not theirs and he will not allow them to steal his birthright.

>> No.30625065

>>30624855
It doesn't matter how eager the others are if they can't actually *get* shit done. Abaddon can and does.

>> No.30625267

All of this would have been avoided, if the Old Ones just cured the Necrontyr and granted them the secrets of eternal life.

>> No.30625709

>>30625267
That's oldcrons.
Newcrons just needed something to fight that wasn't themselves.
Basically what the Pope did to curb the violence in Medieval Europe. He called a Crusade and sent all the roving psychopaths into the Middle East.

>> No.30625840

>>30625065
> Abaddon
> Gets Shit Done

>> No.30625919

>>30625267
Pretty sure they weren't aware of each other till after the entire C'Tan shit happened.

>> No.30625932

>>30617495
They both appeal to me in different ways.

My only big dislike is that they took away the FTL drives. I really liked that they had the technology to counter-act the need for warp travel.

I also would have preferred they remain abit more mysterious but meh.

>> No.30626081

>>30624899
Who ooutplayes Starbane.
> implying outplaying that failure is an achievement of any kind

>> No.30626123

>>30617878
They were originally Tomb Kings in space. The Newcrons aren't a retocn, they're a return to the faction's roots. On top of that, if I understand the fluff right, only the higher up Necrons still have minds, the warriors are still mindless zombies due to their personalities decaying from to many regenerations.

>> No.30626191

>>30624229
Hahahaha

>> No.30626239

>>30617495
Newcrons. They're objectively superior. Why?

Besides having greater variety of options, newcrons leave room for old old chaos fluff, oldcrons don't leave room for new chaos fluff.

One of the first newcron bits in FFG is an adventure path... in which the necrons act exactly like oldcrons. Not remotely hard to justify.

>> No.30626259

>>30626123
Some fluff has it be a factor of regenerations, other fluff has it be that necron warriors were designed to be automata from the start.

>> No.30626266

>>30625919
No they were warring with the Old Ones long before they met the C'tan.

Though, the "eternal life quest" isn't the real reason why the nobility started the war.
It was because they had been fighting each other for so long that they risked division of their massive empire and its destruction. The Silent King and the other triarch demonized the Old Ones so they would have a common enemy and reunited the dynasties.

>> No.30626442

>>30625932
Don't they just use the webway?

>> No.30626750

>>30625709
>>30626266
Outside of the Triach (The three dudes on top), nobody knew the real reason the war was started.

The majority of the Necrontyr wanted to repay the Old Ones for their cruelty and hoped that they can force them to relinquish the secrets of immorality.

Had the Old Ones given the Necrontyr what they wanted in the first place, then the Silent King wouldn't have been able to unite the warring Dynastyies in a singular goal of ''Fuck the Old Ones''.

>> No.30626765

>>30626442
Oldcrons had intertialess drives which allowed them to move at arbitrary speed, even during encounters. Hence why entire fleets couldn't deal with a single small necron ship, they just had no way of hitting it.

Not sure if newcrons still have that, I'm not familiar with them.

>> No.30626834

>>30626765
Newcrons have intertialess drives as seen on in the ''Fall of Orpheus''. However, they aren't Oldcron intertialess drives.

The Necrons used them to pull some crazy combat speeds and impossible maneuvers against the Imperial sector fleet. A small Necron fleet that was nearly quarter of the Imperial sector fleet they were facing, managed to decimate the Imperial fleet before being driven off thanks to the actions of the Minotaurs.

It was an empty pyrrhic victory at best. The Necrons returned in force and drowned the whole sector in blood and ash.

>> No.30626898

Newcrons would be fine if they just weren't so fucking retarded.

Maybe by the next codex they'll have figured out what they want to do with them and their fluff gets somewhat more consistent.

>inb4 "consistent? 40k? pick one, fag"

>> No.30626929

>>30626898
>their fluff gets somewhat more consistent

''Rebuild the Kingdoms of Old and kick the lesser races out of our lawn''

That isn't consistent enough for you, anon?

>> No.30626987

>>30626834
Yeah they were only able to temporarily damage a tomb ship with a daring boarding action.

The Imperials lost 90% of their fleet and the Necrons lost 3 escourts and a crippled scythe. The Necrons just flew away for quick repairs that left the sector only enough time to finish evacuating.

>> No.30627060

>>30626929
>can't in to warp
>"nice warp you got here, it would be shame if something happened to it..."

>can't into FTL
>dimensional hopping and all sorts of other bullshit that makes them appear out of thin air across the galaxy

>time travel
>used to inflate the ego of one dude

>technologically advanced
>use vehicles with exposed crew even when not shielded

>upload minds into machines
>still use manual controls

>kicked the shit out of the old ones
>had to hide from the Eldar

>C'tan don't eat souls
>C'tan eat souls
>never explain how it works, what repercussions it has, etc.

>> No.30627318

>>30627060
>>"nice warp you got here, it would be shame if something happened to it..."

They don't understand the Warp. But they develop defenses against it with their technology. Using dimensional technology, it's not beyond reason to strengthen the walls of this dimension against the next. If humans can do it, then so do the the Necrons who had a longer history of fighting against Warp spawned beings.
>>dimensional hopping and all sorts of other bullshit that makes them appear out of thin air across the galaxy

To set up these hopping points, they have to travel using slow ships. It would take forever to establish them. It's like building bridges, you can't build unless you actually get to the other side with your slowpoke ships.

>technologically advanced

And EXTREMELY traditional and slaved to protocol.

>still use manual controls

''Muh Tradition'' followed by we are not machines. We are people!

>kicked the shit out of the old ones

With the help of the C'tan

>had to hide from the Eldar

After they were weakened by the revolt against said C'tan

This was explained in the codex. COME ON!

>C'tan don't eat souls
>C'tan eat souls

They eat life force/life essence (Aka souls). The new material is consistent with this.

>>never explain how it works, what repercussions it has, etc.

Because its not important. The C'tan diet is not important to the Necron lore or the setting at this period of time.
>used to inflate the ego of one dude

Canonically only one duy

>> No.30627351

>>30627318
>>used to inflate the ego of one dude

Needs more explaining.

Only Orikan has the ability to time travel, as far as we know. It's a closely guarded secret of his and the dude is possibly a C'tan in disguise The other time wizards can't even approach the feats of Orikan.

So it appears to me that the only consistency is in your HEAD!

>> No.30627365

>>30627351
inconsistency*

>> No.30627391

>>30618095
Not necessarily. TONS of us old fogies hated the C'Tan and their being shoehorned into every aspect of the galaxy's history. Seeing them taken down a notch was great.

>> No.30627478

>In practical terms, the employment of weapons such as a Tesseract Vault or Transcendent C’tan can vary enormously from one Phaeron to the next. Some Necron regents see them as a resource to be employed reluctantly, and only when a dire foe threatens their territory. Such individuals may see the employment of these mighty tools as somehow unfair, for what recourse can the young and ignorant peoples of the galaxy have to defend themselves against such preeminent marvels?

>The rulers of more aggressive Tomb Worlds take great delight in unleashing such weapons, seeing them as ideal tools with which to demonstrate Necron superiority over their backwards foes. To other lords this practice is considered gauche, dishonourable or simply wasteful. After all, one does not take up a sacred ceremonial sword simply to swat an annoying fly, a fact that the ever honourable Triarch Praetorians are quick to point out...

-Escalation

Daily reminder that the Necron might be soulless monstrosities from beyond the grave but they are not assholes.

>> No.30627524

Neither. I just pretend that Necrons, C'tan and Tau don't exist.

And there is nothing you can do about it.

>> No.30627781

>>30626123
>On top of that, if I understand the fluff right, only the higher up Necrons still have minds, the warriors are still mindless zombies due to their personalities decaying from to many regenerations.

Most, but perhaps not all.

>> No.30627804

>>30627318
>They don't understand the Warp

Yet can cause warp disturbances and calm the warp, plant warp messages, detect warp anomalies, etc.

>And EXTREMELY traditional and slaved to protocol.

Yet somehow managed to kick the shit out of the Old Ones and their allies by driving closer and hitting them with their sword. Hell, some of the stuff they use dates back to before they were robots.

>This was explained in the codex.

It's also explained the Eldar didn't have the resources to hunt down and destroy the Necron tomb worlds, so what exactly did the Necrons have to fear? They were afraid of getting destroyed by the race that couldn't destroy them even in their sleep? Where was all the fancy Necron tech like the celestial orrery and shit?

>Because its not important. The C'tan diet is not important to the Necron lore or the setting at this period of time.

The fact that a creature without psychic powers, maybe even without any warp signature, is able to reach into the warp and consume souls, without building up a warp signature in on itself, and the fact that apparently souls and energy radiated by stars are both equally good at maintaining them, does indicate a major questions to be answered.

>Canonically only one duy

Exactly. And what does he do with all this? Just fixes his own predictions so he can gloat about how brilliant he is.

>> No.30627915

>>30627804
>Yet can cause warp disturbances and calm the warp, plant warp messages, detect warp anomalies, etc

Doesn't mean that they understand it.

>Yet somehow managed to kick the shit out of the Old Ones and their allies by driving closer and hitting them with their sword.

So? That's how everyone does it in 40k. Ork and Eldar like to fight in close combat, why should the Old Ones and their other servant species be any different?

>It's also explained the Eldar didn't have the resources to hunt down and destroy the Necron tomb worlds

They don't now.

>The fact that a creature without psychic powers, maybe even without any warp signature, is able to reach into the warp and consume souls, without building up a warp signature in on itself

Except we don't know if either of those are true. I'd say consuming souls would be a psychic power and their own warp signature has never been commented on.

>the fact that apparently souls and energy radiated by stars are both equally good at maintaining them, does indicate a major questions to be answered.

It's clearly not though, when empowered with the souls of the Necrontyr the C'tan became near unstoppable, stars - if that's what they were feeding on as their origin is now ambiguous - obviously do not provide the same kick.

>Exactly. And what does he do with all this? Just fixes his own predictions so he can gloat about how brilliant he is.

And? Arrogant character is self serving!

>> No.30627946

>>30627804
>Yet can cause warp disturbances

The explosion of the star that was funneled through the Dolmen gate caused the Warp disturbance in Orpheus.

>and calm the warp

Easy for folks who can strengthen the walls of reality to the point where the Warp gets starved.

>plant warp messages

It's Orikan and Orikan is a mysterious character who does mysterious things.

>detect warp anomalies

Even the Tau can detect Warp anomalies. They aren't hard to detect once they manifest in real space.

>Yet somehow managed to kick the shit out of the Old Ones and their allies by driving closer and hitting them with their sword. Hell, some of the stuff they use dates back to before they were robots.

All Necron Codexes of battle preaches heavily that ranged combat is the way to victory. The Necrontyr and Necrons relied on firepower to win their battles. Melee combat was, at best, kept for traditional reasons and for dickweaving contests.

>It's also explained the Eldar didn't have the resources to hunt down and destroy the Necron tomb worlds, so what exactly did the Necrons have to fear?

What does it say that? It said the weakened Necrons could not stand against the ascendant Eldar.

>They were afraid of getting destroyed by the race that couldn't destroy them even in their sleep?

It was due to Eldar lack of interest rather than lack of ability.

>Where was all the fancy Necron tech like the celestial orrery and shit?

Exhausted on the C'tan, destroyed, or hidden by the Silent King.

>The fact that a creature without psychic powers, maybe even without any warp signature, is able to reach into the warp and consume souls, without building up a warp signature in on itself, and the fact that apparently souls and energy radiated by stars are both equally good at maintaining them, does indicate a major questions to be answered.

>> No.30627954

>>30627946
>The fact that a creature without psychic powers, maybe even without any warp signature, is able to reach into the warp and consume souls, without building up a warp signature in on itself, and the fact that apparently souls and energy radiated by stars are both equally good at maintaining them, does indicate a major questions to be answered.

The C'tan are no longer important in Necron lore or setting-wise. They are prepping them for a re-write where they will perhaps Warp entities or whatever. Currently they are the weakest link in Necron lore so you to wait for your bloody answers in the next codex or fluff content.

>souls and energy radiated by stars are both equally good at maintaining them

Pssst...Only the souls of the Necrontyr boosted their powers to incredible levels.

>Exactly. And what does he do with all this?

You have to be trolling. Because it's impossible for to have missed what Orikan is trying to do in the codex. Well, unless you haven't read the codex in the first place.

>> No.30628975

>>30627954
>You have to be trolling. Because it's impossible for to have missed what Orikan is trying to do in the codex. Well, unless you haven't read the codex in the first place.

Have you? It says Orikan often gets things wrong, at which point he uses his time travelling skills to go back and redo his predictions just so his reputation was kept intact. Says so in the fucking codex.

>> No.30629342

Oldcrons for the most part, though I do like the idea of a few special characters having been added such as Trazyn.

>> No.30629541

>>30617495
Oldcrons did a lot to enhance the "everybody's doomed" atmosphere of the setting. Now they're just another faction.

>> No.30629583

>>30617495

It's a choice between shit and even shittier, but Oldcrons. At least Oldcrons had a slightly different character to Tyranids despite serving the same purpose. Newcrons are just Eldar.

>> No.30629944

>>30617495
I'd like the Newcrons with some changes, namely:

- the story of them going to sleep is illogical and makes Eldar look like absolute retards. Just mention the Enslaver plague ruining the Eldar and reducing them back to stone age levels so they have to rebuild. It makes sense that a psychic race would be hit hard.
- don't ignore the possibility of C'tan controlled Necrons. While it's not strictly ruled out, some focus on it would be nice, so people could still use their old armies.
- don't remove the Pariahs. It's a nice touch. Come to think of it, mention some more Xenos Necrons. It makes sense that they'd experiment on other races to discover the cure for their own problems. It also introduces depth and diversity, if only in the background.
- the Necrons behave like human undead right now, even though they're nothing like. The focus of all their idiosynchrasies is on them being amnesiac robots. But they're amnesiac Xenos robots. Give them an even more alien outlook.
- make the Tomb Kings thing less obvious. The Koschei the Deathless hints are nice, get more of them. Make the Necrons more Chinese teracotta warriors. Or Aztec undead. Those are cool, especially given the hungry gods they worshipped.
- the fact that the Necrons have to use the Webway is somehow diminishing to both them and the Eldar. I know the developers made some explanations about that, but the damage is already done. GW was always against diluting archetypes, and every faction had its own stuff.
- do away with the C'tan eating souls. It dilutes the archetypes and makes them just Chaos gods with nice abs.
- do away with the Cryptek farseeing without the warp. It dilutes the archetypes and is impossible to explain given everything else we know about the setting.

>> No.30629991

>>30629541
We already have the Tyranids to do that, what with the whole "THIS IS ONLY SCOUTING FORCE THERE ARE MORE BIGGER TYRANIDS JUST WAITING TO FLY IN ARE WE SCARY YET" factor.

>> No.30631254

>>30628975
He does this in order to solidify his position in the Necron hierarchy so that his ultimate plan goes smoothly. It's more than saving face, it's all part of his plan!

>> No.30631350

>>30631254
Plan to keep his power and position.

It's still purely for vanity's sake.

>> No.30631433

New-crons
all the way!
New-crons
every day!

>> No.30631527

Newcrons, because the C'Tan are dicks.

>> No.30631536

>>30631350
His million year old plan to ascend to godhood and embrace his true destiny, you mean.

>> No.30631587

Oldcrons.

Newcrons are just Eldar with metal bodies. Moustache-twirling saturday morning cartoon villains.

Oldcrons actually felt like a credible threat and they were something different from the other factions. They lent a feeling to the setting that, you know, it doesn't matter if humanity can survive against the orks, it doesn't matter if the Tyranids can be beaten back enough that they give up and try an easier galaxy, it doesn't matter if the servants of Chaos can be destroyed, because in the end, as the Necrons wake up, all life is going to be destroyed and there's nothing anyone can do to stop it.

>> No.30631641

>>30631587
>Villian wank

>> No.30631730

>>30631641
More wank than actual Oldcron fluff.

>But I have seen many things, as my soul has wandered the myriad paths of the future. I have seen both the death and the birth of stars. I have walked the very borders of the universe within the confines of my mind, and I know that the future is not immutable. The Yngir can be stopped, their nascent labours undone before they come to terrible fruition. This knowledge is the most precious of all.

>I have seen the doom of the universe. And yet I have seen hope.

Also

>Oldcrons
>destroying all life

>> No.30631792

>>30631730
All that talk of Newcrons being inconsistent when the Oldcrons could not keep their ultimate objective consistent.

>> No.30631870

>>30631792
Within the codex it was perfectly consistent. But I suppose now you'll bring up Dawn of War as another totally valid example that proves Oldcrons wanted to exterminate everything.

>> No.30631917

>>30631870
No, I bring up the 4th (or was it the 3th?) rulebook.

''They want to exterminate life. Nope, they wanted to enslave it'' Back and forth,

>> No.30631923

>>30617495
Oldcrons.

>> No.30631927

I am a big fan of the ability to take a codex and make your own army from it, fluff and all.
You can give them unique paint schemes, add fluff to individual characters and the army as a whole, be it a chaos legion or a Tau sept.
Oldcrons really lacked that ability, one Necron tombworld was very much like another.
Newcrons have far more space for that customization, that unique fluffing and naming of characters.

>> No.30632004

>>30629991

Yeah, but now we have even more of that ya dingus.

>> No.30632036

>>30631917
Technically Necrons did want to exterminate all life, C'tan were the ones who wanted to enslave it. They used the Necrons to their own ends to wage war on the galaxy and conquer it.

>> No.30632056

>>30632004

Or uh, at least we used to. You know what I mean.

But anyway, I prefer Oldcron fluff. They had their flaws (I mostly disliked the parts where half of everything that ever happened was suddenly attributed to the C'tan), but in my opinion the Newcrons' fluff is worse. The mighty Star Gods are reduced to fucking Poke'mon, and the once creepy and badass Necron lords are turned into eccentric fruitcakes.

>Oldcron Lord: ...

>Newcron Lord: OH MY GOODNESS DEAR WINSTON, THOSE AWFUL FLESHY THINGS ARE TRAMPLING AND TROUNCING ALL ABOUT THE YARD! QUICKLY MY DEAR FELLOWS, WE MUST SALLY FORTH AND DELIVER TO THEM A MOST HARSH AND DECISIVE THRASHING!

>> No.30632136

>>30632056
If you wanted creepy and badass Necrons Lord, then look up Dynasties that embody these themes.

Like the Mayanrakh Dynasty. Newcrons have all flavors under the sun and they refuse to be locked in one of them.

>> No.30632144

>>30631917
The Dark Eldar description in the rulebook you're talking about also managed to clash with their established lore, despite there being so little to contradict in the first place. DEldar soul-eating was shown to kill the victim, but actually no, they never kill their victims, they keep them alive so they can torture them forever.

>They revel in every nuance of anguish and woe until their captives are gibbering wrecks pleading for an end to their miserable existence - a mercy the Dark Eldar will never grant.

And you can tell it was considered wrong even by Kelly and/or Goodwin, since when the DE codex was finally updated five million years later, that line reappeared but modified:

>They drink in every nuance of woe until their captives gibber and plead for death - a mercy the Dark Eldar are famously slow to grant.

>> No.30632265

>>30629944
>makes Eldar look like absolute retards

That's the point. It was suppose to highlight the hubris and arrogance of the Eldar. The Eldar codex says not even the War in Heaven (the many versions of it) and their wars with the Necrons could humble Eldar arrogance and pride. They thought they were untouchable and they thought they were all powerful, not even their slumbering ancient enemies could topple them. IMO this fits them perfectly.

>don't ignore the possibility of C'tan controlled Necrons
>don't remove the Pariahs. It's a nice touch

Agreed

>the Necrons behave like human undead right now

That's the point. You're suppose to relate to them and feel their tragedy and appreciate their villainy . It's also for the point raised in the Damnos novel that the Necrons are very human in their desires and drives however they are very evil. Not out of corruption or madness, they are evil to the core because they choose to be this way.

>make the Tomb Kings thing less obvious

No.

The more Tomb Kings they become, the more glorious they would be. Although, I agree with adding other ancient civilization themes to the Necrons.

>use the Webway

Personally, I like it because it makes the Webway sorta like the Under-Kingdoms in Fantasy or the Underdark. Also it opens up plenty of interesting scenarios (a Necron invasion of the Dark City).

>do away with the C'tan eating souls

Making the C'tan Warp entities would make things make more sense and return the setting to one of its roots (All Gods in the setting are aspects of the Chaos Gods)

>do away with the Cryptek farseeing without the warp

NAW!

Necron can manipulate causality and time. It makes perfect sense for them to predict events with their technology. A major point in Necron lore is that their impossible technology rivals the sorcery of the Warp.

Science vs Magic is a widely favored trope, you know.

>> No.30632286

>>30632056
>The mighty Star Gods are reduced to fucking Poke'mon

Where they belong.

>>Oldcron Lord: ...Am I intimidating or badass yet? Silence is scary right? pls ;_;

>>Newcron Lord: SHOL'VA KREE!

>> No.30632301

fluff of oldcrons

rules of newcrons

>> No.30632353

I don't know a whole load of fluff for either, nor did/do I play(ed) either, but perhaps that gives me a viewpoint on the matter without any nostalgia goggles or any "yeah that codex sucked"-goggles.

I prefer Newcrons simply because they (or the higher ups, at least) have free will now, which to me is more interesting than an army of automatons. If I were to play an army, I'd rather it had character and personality to it, little quirks and cool options for making my warlord "my dude" with a bit of a story to him, with feelings and motivations. I'd want to infuse some RPG into my wargaming, I guess, and that isn't possible with an army composed entirely of mindless robots. It's why, although I used to play them and still think they have sweet models, I don't want to play Tyranids anymore - I can't be excited about my army of cool guys I care about fighting if it's not an army of cool guys.

>> No.30632556

>>30632353
But newcrons aren't cool guys, they're malfunctioning automata (whereas oldcrons at least worked well) led by douchebags and senile old men. It's built into their background so deeply that fluffing out a cool newcron army requires at least as many retcons and as much disregard for the established fluff as the newcron codex itself displays.

>> No.30633002

>>30622931
>Salamanders
Too bad they were almost never at full strength due to dying so much. Nigger.

>> No.30633109

newcrons.
oldcrons had like 4 models. how the hell is that even a codex ?

>> No.30633138

>>30632556
Those douchebags and senile old men are "cool guys" in a sense though, no?

>> No.30633167

Yes, but what about the Orks?

>> No.30633174

>>30633109
Let's ask the Knights.

>> No.30633177

>>30633109
how many other codex updates have had this many new units with only 2 being removed/semi replaced with other models (wraiths & pariahs-lychguard)

stalker, deathmarks, ghostark/doomsdar ark, night/doomschythe, command/anihilation barge, preatorians, tomblades,.


play oldcrons now, i dare you.

>> No.30633221

>>30632353
>I prefer Newcrons simply because they (or the higher ups, at least) have free will now

oldcrons had this as well. they just focused on the C'tan (and did an admittedly horrible job of it)

newcrons are basically a reversal of the old fluff in that regard

old: HORRIFYING UNKNOWABLE MINDLESS ROBOTS OUT TO GET YOU. yes some lords retain some personality but we don't focus on it, mentioned passingly


new: LOOK AT ALL THOSE WACKY ROBOT LORDS AND THERE "PERSONALITY" oh and there are still some mindless killbots (who are no longer so unknowable) but we don't focus on them so much mentioned passingly

frankly newcron were done in just about the worst and stupid way possible. Hack the old fluff with a hatchet stick the new shit in and bash it with a hammer till its in there. a total fucking unnecessary mess.

>> No.30633232

>>30633109
>yfw you have no face when pic related

Also, they had warriors, immortals, scarabs, (heavy) destroyers, monoliths, wraiths, pariah, flayed ones, tomb spyders, (destroyer) lords, and 2 c'tan.

To be fair, that's not that much more than what the Tau had when their codex was made. Commander, ethereal, XV15, XV8, XV88, fire warriors, kroot, devilfish, pathfinders, drones, hounds, hammerhead, krootox and Farsight.

>> No.30633317

>>30633177
I'd like to point out that the new unit types aren't inherently incompatible with "oldcrons", as the devision is more about the tone of the narrative context that make these units more than a stat line. I think that a lot of people are quite fine with the rules of the book, all things considered.
For example, oldcron warriors were these eerily, silent and implacable death machines. Newcron warriors, well, when you pop a bolt into one's torso, it lets out a Wilhem scream.
I think that they overshot the admittedly needed revision of the faction flavor, personally. Though with a complete lack of internal integrity, I can safely keep my head in the sand if I don't like something.

>> No.30633322

I am not sure what the issue is. There is still C'tan running around doing stuff and the possibility of Necrons serving them see (>>30624078)

>> No.30633364

>>30633317
I always picture this was the original concept of a Necron warrior, and the solution was to just weld the mouth shut. So when they get damaged and the weld gives in, they can scream once more.

>> No.30633424

>>30633317
>Newcron warriors, well, when you pop a bolt into one's torso, it lets out a Wilhem scream

I think it's to intensify the creepy aspect of the Necrons. The fluff implies two possible reasons for this. Necron warriors programmed this way as a mockery of the living or it's the instinctive response of the poor beings trapped inside metal suffering a second death (Such is the tragedy of the Necrons etc).

>> No.30633449

Oldcrons by far.

>> No.30633453

>>30633424

Hey, "muh tragedy" belongs to the Eldar! Keep your metal claws away from it.

>> No.30633512

Newcrons because my army is no longer monotone and my own army's fluff dictated to me by someone else.

If you like oldcrons more, then fluff up your newcrons as oldcrons.

>> No.30633528

>>30633453
Necrons are now Eldar if they were the Impeirum (and robots). Only with more "HONOR" and therefore are the morally just side in every atrocity that they commit.
Didn't you get the memo?

>> No.30633579

>>30633453
What do Eldar know of our pain? We have etched poems of sorrow on our tombs since before your ancestors crawled on their bellies from the Old Ones birthing vats..

>> No.30633581

>>30633528

I did.
That didn't give them the right to cry about "the tragedy of the necron people" though.
Necrons aren't tragic. They are robot tom kings in spesh, with the best tech around, and their own mini empires to rule as they please. They ain't tragic.

>> No.30633602

>>30633528
>deem every non-Necron to be without honor
>give them the hilt

>> No.30633617

Oldcrons added something different to the setting.
Ancient alien robotic horror.
They took 40k setting beyond "Good Space marines vs Bad Space Marines, oh yeah and some aliens too"

Newcrons are just another generic alien race. Might as well be robot Eldar.

>> No.30633621

>>30633602
that picture bothers me because he's sliding his hand on the bare edge of a sword with no glove.

>> No.30633626

>>30633232
>To be fair, that's not that much more than what the Tau had when their codex was made. Commander, ethereal, XV15, XV8, XV88, fire warriors, kroot, devilfish, pathfinders, drones, hounds, hammerhead, krootox and Farsight.

Unless I'm misinterpreting you, there wasn't even a Commander upgrade kit until the 4th edition update. The original studio army Commander was literally an XV8 with the head painted a different colour.

I kind of like that actually. Having a unique mini is good for obvious reasons, but the idea of the commander's suit being no flashier than his elites' fits with the Tau being the 'sensible' army. And I think it's still a valid approach since the entry only lists a Crisis battlesuit, and the Enforcer suit of the new model doesn't have any extra rules.

>> No.30633640

>>30633581
They're not honorable either, but an unfounded sense of pride and a victim-complex are usually what you get with unfettered narcissism, entitlement, and egomania (with a dash of crazy on top).

>> No.30633641

>>30618675
*pops in*

Heya fagget you talkin shit?

>> No.30633654

>>30633621
That's what the original comic's about, actually.

http://oglaf.com/hilting/

>> No.30633660

>>30633621
It contextualizes why the character tells another to "use the scabbard" in regards to his missing fingers in the preceding panels.

>> No.30633684

>>30633641

I fucking love Warp Spiders.
In my second ever 40k game, my 5 spiders popped a fucking tervigon in one round of shooting, and sent the whole army of termagants of my opponent fleeing.
The fucker was mad as hell. Even tossed his expensive model around like a piece of trash when it got killed.
>mfw.

>> No.30633685

>>30633581
>Regal warscythes are masterpieces of workmanship, loving recreations of weapons long-lost to the entropic forces of the universe. Should such a weapon be forsaken upon the field of battle – or worse, stolen – then its owner will often go to great and violent lengths to recover it. Worlds have been laid waste and planetary systems brought under siege in this cause. Some Ordo Xenos Inquisitors point to this behaviour as an element of commonality between Mankind and Necron, for the Imperium’s forces often enter battle in order to recover an important relic. Alas, they misunderstand, as they so often do when it comes to the workings of the Necron mind. A Necron Lord’s warscythe is a tangible connection to the life he once knew; for those who desire to some day return to the flesh, it is a symbol of hope that such can be achieved. It is not a relic whose theft provokes cultural outrage, but a personal possession whose thievery provokes a very personal ire.

>Regardless of the wielder’s rank, a warscythe’s blade and power core always blazes with the heraldic colour of his dynasty. Power signature colours are often shared by different dynasties. This is a throwback to the days before biotransference, and shows the state of alliance between the various dynasties of that time. Inevitably, the War in Heaven and the tumultuous aeons that followed have done much to shatter the alliances of old. The power signatures are now, therefore, more misleading than useful. A phaeron could, of course, order the power signature of his forces changed at any time. However, the present configurations have been established for so long that, for most nobles, the notion of altering them is just as unthinkable as ordering that the dynastic glyphs be defaced. To Necrons, tradition is everything. Indeed, it can be argued that tradition is all that is left to them.

-Warscythe

You know not the torment of the soulless and the dead, mortal.

>> No.30633741

>>30633684
Bravest aspect is a typo. Meant BEST aspect.

>> No.30633768

>>30633741
Of course.

The bravest aspect are the Crimson Hunters.

>> No.30633796

>>30633617

No, they added very little different. They added a slightly modified flavor of "mysterious death machine". Tyranid do exist, ya know.

>> No.30633871

>>30633685
>Alas

>> No.30633878

>>30633741

Agreed.
Hopefully, we will get plastic Warp Spiders soon. I wanna get more of them, my metal models are lonely, but I don't want to touch any of that finecast crap, especially with the rumors regarding plastic Aspect warriors flying around.

>> No.30633940

>>30633796

How is the Old Ones/C'tan fluff not different?
Oldcrons were different to nids, there was an intelligent malign purpose behind them.
Nids are just random beasts.

Oldcrons tried to take 40K beyond the Horus Heresy and give aliens some importance..
Newcrons are just anither generic Xenos race.

Anyway a second Tyranid race is better than a 3rd Eldar race.

>> No.30633964

>>30633685
>Were it not for the all consuming hatred in which the Phaeron holds his rival dynasty the Charnovokhs, Ahmontekh would in all likelihood be leading the reawakening of the Suhbekhar Necrons as they rise across the Jericho Reach. But it was not to be, for that sliver of hate that the Phaeron bore inside his consciousness as he lay down in his stasis casket refused to slumber with him.

>Distilled for sixty million years, that iota of resentment grew to consume the sleeping Phaeron’s entire consciousness so that, when the Hollow Sun’s control program attempted to awaken him in response to the transmission from the Charnovokhs, it burst forth like a tsunami breaking through a fatally breached dam. All that Ahmontekh had once been was gone, consumed over the aeons by his own hatred even as the last residue of himself looked on helplessly. Perhaps had the Necrons not sold their souls to the C’tan, something of him might have survived to fight back against the raging bitterness within, but it was not to be. Now, the Crimson Scythe of old is no more, and that distilled essence of his resentment of his own cousin dynasty is all that remains of his consciousness.

Ahmontekh, Kutlakh, and many more noble and honorable kings and queens of the Necrontyr were consumed by the darkest of madness. All their glories as ash in their mouths and all what they were in the past was twisted and distorted. No more beings of regal majesty, transformed into beings of bitterness and hate. All thanks to the false promise of the vile C'tan.

Indeed, as the Eldar claim, soulless is the worst of fates.

>> No.30633992

>>30633940
>Nids are just random beasts.

I just heard the Hivemind's collective ''WAT''.

>> No.30634001

>>30633940

Tyranid and Necrons did the exact same thing: kill a ton of people for a mysterious purpose. One are mechanical robots, the other are biological robots. Both serve some higher and unexplained intelligence. Its a reasonably boring concept with minimal room for uniqueness and so they scrapped the oldcrons. At least the Eldar have some degree of societal complexity with which to build interesting fluff.

>> No.30634017

>>30633964
Soullessness*

>> No.30634425

>>30633964
This brings me to one the interesting parts of Necron lore.

>Miriya had walked in a place and encountered beings that could only be described as soulless. For one whose existence orbited around the light of faith and the power of the human spirit, to experience that chilled the Sororitas to her marrow. The necrons were antithesis, raw and real and made manifest.

>She fought down the cold in the core of her soul and snapped back to the moment at hand.

------------------------

>The xenos ghouls had descended from their perch on the maglev line and were now moving up the street in a wedge formation. The spaces between them were so regular, their steps so precisely synchronised, that they could have been a single machine. But the aura of death that radiated from them had nothing to do with the unfeeling and the inorganic. It was as livid as the green of the gauss rifles. As mechanical and emotionless as the actions of the necrons appeared to be, they were motivated by an ineradicable hatred, older than human civilisation.

It's noted that the Necron possess an aura that disturbs and terrifies the living especially the psykers. Those who experience it all comment on how they physically and mentally felt the soullessness of the Necrons. How the Necrons hatred for the living somehow penetrated into their very souls. The Necrons to the living must feel like death itself. It's noted that even soulless beings like the Tyranids are not immune to the horror of the Necrons.

So if anyone tells you that the Necrons lost their creepy factor in the setting, they are full of shit (at least in-universe)

>> No.30634942

>>30617495
Oldcrons.

They were mummy-terminators with some cool lore in the C'tan.

Something about the writing in the newcron fluff, going on about "shards" rubs me the wrong way, same as SC2 going on about "essence".

>> No.30636533

>>30634942
>going on about "shards" rubs me the wrong way

How? They also hardly go on about it.

>> No.30637233

>>30627781
heh, we even have that possibility on our creation tables, that said what's the sauce on that?

>> No.30637349

>>30637233
Necxron Codex: iShit edition.

>> No.30637500

>>30637349
bullshit I have the dex, well a PDF of it, and I never saw that

>> No.30637575

>>30637500
So you don't have the iPad edition then.

>> No.30637608

>>30637500
Well, I have iPad version of codex too but it's russian vesrion. But I can confirm that Thokt description is here.

>> No.30637680

>>30637575
wat. are you telling me that I am denied information that was rightfully pirated!?

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