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[ERROR] No.30328049 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Anyone have any general tips for a first time Pathfinder player?

>> No.30328108

Don't play Pathfinder

>> No.30328132

Isn't telling a first-time pathfinder player to not play pathfinder like telling a baby it to kill itself?

>> No.30328167

Convince your group to play another system as quickly as possible but enjoy your ignorance fueled blissed while you can before the grognardism sets into your bones and makes you hate hate hate hate hate.

>> No.30328181

Welcome to 4chan

>> No.30328241

That's a pretty cute dragon. I must add it to my cute lizard folder.

>> No.30328243

Paizo is the prince of lies, Pathfinder is the castle from which they rule.

Once you enter the castle, there's very little chance you will ever escape, even when you realise that the castle is built from shit and rusty knives.

>> No.30328438

So let's assume that telling me not to play has failed and all is lost. Any tips for beyond that point?

>> No.30328481

Since you came to /tg/ to ask about pathfinder you either A: Weren't expecting a bunch of sperged out "muh sitem is betr, stop having bad wrong fun" answers or B: This is a bait thread. I'll assume you went for the first and give you an actual answer.

Pathfinder isn't great, it's a flawed and unbalanced system. This does not mean you can't have fun playing pathfinder. If your group is a bunch of sperglords who can only have fun if they're playing the most powerful or edgy thing you won't have much fun playing pathfinder. If YOU feel the need to play both what you want AND the need to be powerful AND you're not into wizards you won't have fun. If however you trust your group and are willing to have fun without freaking out over real or perceived imbalances it is a playable system.

The main complaint is caster power level (especially wizards) vs everything else. Everything else is playable, Fighters, rangers, barbarians, and what not can keep up with late game monsters fine it's just possible that a wizard who knows what he's doing can make a party obsolete.

>> No.30328489

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/ This would be a good thing to keep with you.

>> No.30328539

Well, what's your party make up, what do you want to play, and most importantly, how experienced is the rest of your group with the system?

Otherwise, try not playing a martial character so you'll have a better skillset and options past the few opening levels. Try not doing something too gimmicky with your first character, keep yourself open to figure out what part of the game you enjoy and then mold yourself into that spot later on down the line.

>> No.30328587

Not OP but if I'm beginner and pathfinder is not the best option to get into tabletop RPGs then what can you suggest? Dnd?

>> No.30328598

>playing tabletop games

>> No.30328611

Make something. Have fun with it.

It's actually fairly simple, and despite the horror stories, most horror stories are propegated by people who do exactly the thing that PF is very bad for - they play ridiculous wizard characters that their GM's allow them to play in an overpowered and horribly minmaxed and over the top manner.

Most games actually lack those kind of casters because the system mastery required to play them is lacking in any group that is into having fun. The 'awful caster problem' is backed up by white-room-math...but very rarely is it backed up by actual play.

>> No.30328623


>> No.30328630


Nobody cares Chris

>> No.30328641

The group is all fairly new with the exception of the DM. I was planing on making a gunslinger.

>> No.30328651


You funny guy,
I kill you last.

>> No.30328665

not OP, but I've never actually played pathfinder, and although I am vaguely aware that martial classes are underpowered, I've never seen anyone elaborate on why wizards are overpowered.

I've read the SRD, but the first few spells don't seem that exciting.

>> No.30328666

Savage World

>> No.30328672

Pathfinder is actually somewhat ok for beginners, it's when you play with someone who knows how to really bend the system over its back it get's bad. A poorly played wizard isn't especially powerful, an okay played one is a fun addition to the party, but once someone takes the time to actually read what you can do with half the spells (or more likely just looks up powerbuilds online) a good caster can break the system in half.

That being said 3.x and (oh god I'm going to get destroyed for this) 4e are good beginner systems despite their flaws. Unfortunately I can' think of a single system that's flawless or perfect, especially for beginners.

>> No.30328673

Preferably something rules-lite but with a solid mechanical base. It depends on what you want out of the system but the most important is whatever your prospective GM would be comfortable with.

Simple d6, Engine Heart, and a plethora of DnD-likes are pretty solid and simple mechanically. Early editions of DnD aren't bad, 4e is really easy to GM if you're new and don't try much more than a standard dungeon crawl.

If you want to grow into a system that's generic enough to use for most anything you'd like, Savage Worlds isn't bad. It's kinda like GURPS but without the never ending crunch.

>> No.30328713

Gunslinger eats gold for breakfast, second breakfast, elevenses, luncheon, afternoon tea, dinner, supper, dessert, and midnight snack. You can mitigate it with the feats you get but wait until enemy AC climbs a bit before you use it regularly.

>> No.30328746

I'd talk with the GM before going with the gunslinger. It can be built pretty strong but its almost universally weaker than simply using a longbow mechanically until you have a lot of feats under your belt and even then its situational and you have to work at a much shorter range.

Another aspect is the reload rate as defined by the rules and the expense of operating guns and the rules for them misfiring/breaking. A good bit of that can be eased by a cooperating GM which I advise you discussing with him beforehand about.

>> No.30328775

>oh god I'm going to get destroyed for this
despite /tg/'s throbbing, hungry hateboner for fourth edition, a lot of people on either side seem to concede that it is indeed good for beginners (although that makes it more casual and thus badwrong, as a result, of course)

>> No.30328776

Wizard spells come in a lot of flavors: Blow things up (surprisingly balanced), make buddies cooler (pretty powerful), make your foes suck (crap to OBNOXIOUSLY powerful).

A good wizard can identify monsters on sight, estimate their low save, throw a saving throw or suck at that saving throw (save or dies are talked about a lot but are somewhat overrated, much more reliable to make the foe terrible at everything), if things go bad your contingent spell teleports you away you sleep it off in an extra dimensional study, divine your opponents every weakness, and teleport on him while he's sleeping/on the john/mid coitus and annihilate him with a cocktail of specifically prepared spells

Fighters can do stuff, they can do it well, but they can't do anything near on the level wizards and clerics can

>> No.30328782

Broken game apologist please leave. It is trivially easy to break the game as a caster using spells that make sense for you to take and using them as intended. You can break the game by simply doing what you do.

>"B-but the game doesn't break if you're not a min-maxer, ie. you purpously make poor descisions that your character would never make so you don;t have the power the game gives you!!!"

>> No.30328808

The GM was fine with it.

>> No.30328847

Pathfinder is horrible for beginners for the same reason that 3.X ruined an entire generation of players. The game gives you brain damage. It makes you think in the fucktarded way the game works rather than in the way a good game works. It sets players down the path of forgiving a system for being unbalanced trash and horribly designed, and makes them beg for more while actually argueing that its flaws make it better than more well designed games.

>> No.30328878

>playing pathfinder
>alchemist rules lawyer
>>turns out he actually has no clue what he's doing.

>> No.30328906

Fine with it or willing to allow you some concessions not written in the rules such as reducing the expense of ammo which will eat up a lot of your money if using the default rules, and letting certain feats apply to guns (its been awhile since I've pathfindered but some of the rapid reload ones don't let you reload at the same speed as crossbows/other bows if I recall correctly).

>> No.30328907

People are going to tell you the gunslinger is shit...
That's a lie.

The Gunslinger functions backwards from most other classes though, yet you won't notice.
Play the Mysterious Stranger Archetype.
Archetypes are basically like "Sub-classes" that work by swapping out specific abilities for new ones, but you can't pick-and-choose, you have to get all of them. Now the Mysterious Strangers use Charisma instead of Wisdom for Grit points, but being able to deal sixteen times your charisma modifier times in damage as a minor for one grit point is powerful.

Essentially you'll want to get fast reloading feats absolutely first and build yourself another pistol as soon as possible.

Invest in the Two-weapon-fighter feat (and also improved and greater when you get to be that level)

Your fighting style is mostly going to be trying to hover around EXACTLY 4 squares away and unloading everything you have, while the other dudes hold them still.

Guns ignore armor bonuses in the smallest "range increment" and the gunslinger's pistols have a range increment of four. And you can improve that range increment, meaning you've got more room to get armor ignoring hits.

Touch AC is really powerful, because the Touch AC of your average Level 30 monster is like 16 at the most, meaning all you have to do is not roll a "1" on the die when you attack.

However Gunslingers will suck against shit like Fairies, and Goblins, because they are small, dodgy and desterous... But you will kill a dragon in a single turn guaranteed.

>> No.30329011

>ruined an entire generation of players

>I don't like thing
>wahhh people aren't playing my game
Eat shit and cry more

I hope you realize how much of a fucking spoiled brat you sound right now. And I hope you realize that your entire post is a non-argument.

>> No.30329012

Our GM was fine with one of the newer players playing a drow. He didn't explain that drow are nearly blind in daylight.

>> No.30329035

Aye, it might be beneficial to keep your gun stowed for the big foes and use a bow for fighting the usual fodder. Its cheaper and it saves on grit usage for when you really need it and keeps you at range.

>> No.30329058

Huh, gunslingers properly explained. I didn't expect that.

Those are always the best. I like the "3.5 player who tries to build casters like 3.5 casters". It's hilarious to watch their faces when they realize their masterstroke moves simply don't work.

>> No.30329074

>Mysterious Stranger Archetype

While it's great for Damage, I'd avoid it.
You lose out of "Quick Clear" which is basically the only thing that will keep your weapon from exploding on you if you start rolling crit failures for no reason.

>> No.30329089

Get used to them. they show up in any thread that is remotely about PF.

>> No.30329241

To be fair, 3e-pathfinder and the ogl stuff was kinda hugely overshadowing in the market for awhile that caused smaller games to suffer in playerbase. And that the ogl stuff tended to be rubbish with it all working off a base that tended to be spotty at best when taking the math into consideration.

>> No.30329282

Yeah but you don't see me rolling up in the Exalted thread or oWoD General with my dick out, masturbating to my own voice.

Nor any other Pathfinder-fag.
Are they REALLY that threatened and defensive over the fact that a single game is popular?

>> No.30329333

I think the idea is, oWoD and Exalted are kinda old, and while biggish games are significantly more niche so anyone playing them knows what they're getting into. Pathfinder on the other hand is just, big. Its what people start with in some DnD-playing circles and thus tend to lack perspective on the greater games community so it tends to be the focus in a rather brutish but well-intentioned hate.

>> No.30329349

probably more annoyed with the fact most people exclusively play a poorly designed game. that tends to lead to a lot of other people getting stuck in pathfinder groups when they want to play something else, just because everyone else is playing pathfinder and are unwilling to try anything else.

>> No.30329396

I'm new to Pathfinder. I ended up making an Urban Druid with the Charm subdomain.

Is there anything I should pick in particular with this character?

>> No.30329439

Some rope, rope is always useful. Wildshaping into something that can get into hard to reach places with a rope tied around them for the others to climb once you get up there and tie off.

>> No.30329478

>getting stuck in pathfinder groups

And I honestly don't understand how this is a legitimate issue

Is it really that hard to use the internet to find a group, and learn a new game?
And that's even assuming that you've already found a kind of system you like and suggested it to your exist group already... Which it doesn't even hit that step most of the time.

I mean, the regular "I want to play X kind of game, what system is good for this?" and Game-finder threads are pretty much proof that someone with enough internet access to whine on 4chan can just as easily find another group and game.

>> No.30329530

Its actually really hard to find a GM for smaller systems, even on the internet. Really, unless a player is willing to GM something new its unlikely another system will get played in irl groups since the GM doesn't usually want more work learning a new system and often it'll get shouted down by players who don't want to learn a new system.

>> No.30329551


>Have fun
>Don't be a dick to the other players
>Don't be a dick to the DM
>Don't be a dick as living person
>Choose the class you prefer, with the race you prefer, but always double-check with your DM.
>If you have problems with your character or issues within the group, IN THE NAME OF WHICHEVER DEITY OF YOUR CHOICE, TALK. IT. WITH. YOUR. DM. AND. GROUP.
>Check out the pathfinder d20 system site, to find all you need in a short time.
>Try to roleplay at the best of your possibilities, and don't take it bad if it doesn't work well the first time. Everyone started somewhere.
>Take it easy, and have fun.

And remember: no gaming is better than bad gaming.

>> No.30329604

Can you make a list of reasons why pathfinder is bad and what systems would be better for a fantasy roleplay?

>> No.30329677

Hi. If I planning to start at 1st level in 6-man group, what's better - pure witch or scarred witch doctor? Doctor gets casting from CON, it's good, yes. But then I must wander at first level without any Hexes, and gets only one Hex on second level. 'Pure' Witch (or with other archetype) gets two hexes on first level, including feats, but more MAD
What is your opinion?

>> No.30329726

Well you also can't discount the fact that some people, like myself, actually like the D20 - Invisible DC system.

linear math means easier adjustment of challenges on the fly.

No offense to GURPS, but with a probability curve from 3d6 and a known roll under system, just makes it a pain for me to play or try to make shit for. Especially on the fly.
And I'm not a fan of essentially knowing what you need to roll. Takes out a lot of the bewilderment for me.

The core dice system itself matters JUST as much as every other aspect in the game.

>> No.30329777

I think you commented on the wrong post

>> No.30329848

Oh no, I know the meaning of his post, it's just that it's actually pretty damn easy to point out PF's flaws and point out that another Fantasy system exist.

I'm just saying that it's largely irrelevant if someone actually likes pathfinder for whatever reason.

>> No.30329855

Sorry OP, but I'm going to borrow your thread a minute.
New into Pathfinder and DnD in general guy here, I'm going to start a campaign as a ranger and my DM refuses to tell me which races/creatures are going to be the most common so I can choose my first Favored Enemy on them (He says that's metagaming), so I ask you, guys, what should I choose?

>> No.30329898

Whatever your character's backstory makes sense. Don't be a munchkin.

>> No.30329905

Pathfinder only or 3.5 allowed?

>> No.30329934

One: It shouldn't be metagaming as your character lives in the world and thus knows that it's being overrun by orcs/undead/demons/whatever or that it has a huge elf population and thus is likely to take them as his favorite enemy.

If that doesn't make the gm budge favorite enemy human is always a healthy first, in the long run undead and evil outsider will also get a ton of mileage.

>> No.30329949

I'm a bounty hunter, but the thing is there're tonnes of humanoid races with cultures and civilizations worth hunt, like orcs, elves, halflings, humans, etc.

He only allows the pathfinder game core rulebook

>> No.30329973

This guy knows his shit.
First Human, then Undead (improve your humans), then Evil Outsider (improve your evil outsider), 4th should probably be magical beast

>> No.30329978

It's pretty hard to munchkin ranger, they're not exactly hyper powerful and favorite enemy isn't exactly a stellar ability. I don't see why it's munchkining to want it to be useful every now and then or how it's necessarily more role play relevant to take it as something less useful (skyward scream: "GNOOOOOOMMMMEEEEESSSSSS!!!!!!")

It makes as much sense for his family to have been killed by ghouls, dragons, or a demon cult as orcs

>> No.30329993

Humanoid (Human), Undead and Magical Beasts are pretty common

>> No.30330007

Yeah I like it but if there is a better system I would like to at least try it. The only system I didn't really care for was 4th ed and even then I still had fun. But I want to see what else is out there.

>> No.30330041

>FATAL isn't great, it's a flawed and unbalanced system. This does not mean you can't have fun playing FATAL.
Fun is a buzzword, please stop treating it as an argument.

>> No.30330074


I need more cute lizards. Can you spare some?

>> No.30330084

I take you don't know what that word actually means.

>> No.30330100

Ya' tried Fantasycraft? I haven't played it myself but I see it come up often enough here that its on my to do list after we finish up the current traveller campaign.

>> No.30330108

I've had fun trying to play FATAL.

>> No.30330213

Play Fantasy Craft. Miles better, still d20.

Fun is irrelevant when talking about systems. Fun is the natural byproduct of playing with friends under a not-shitlord. The fact that you have had fun playing FATAL proves this. I had fun playing Black Tokyo, and it's fucking awful.

>> No.30330225


>> No.30330254 [SPOILER] 

terrible lizards

>> No.30330296 [SPOILER] 

Oh if you want to go like that.

>> No.30330340 [SPOILER] 

I only have ducks.

>> No.30330342 [SPOILER] 

Not quite a lizard or dinosaur descendant but reptiles, close enough.

>> No.30330363


>> No.30330383

See, it's okay to like Pathfinder. You aren't committing some kind of cardinal sin by playing it and having fun.

It's just not okay to think it's a good system.

>> No.30330400

Geckos are pretty great.

>> No.30330513


>> No.30330550


You're doing God's work. Thank you very much.

>> No.30330577


I'd love to have a Tegu as a pet.

>> No.30330615


>> No.30330661


>> No.30330690


>> No.30330742


>> No.30330760


>> No.30330794


>> No.30330804

>mfw no snakes

>> No.30330875

There's one, but I don't mind more.

>> No.30330946


>> No.30330957


i fucking love hognoses

i plan on getting one some day

>> No.30330976

And that's the end of my lizard folder.

>> No.30331002

Am I doing it right?

>> No.30331054

here's a lizard

>> No.30331071

Aw, cute.

>> No.30331092

>> No.30331105

So in nature would that thing stand a chance or no?

>> No.30331149


Probably not, sadly

>> No.30331156

This is my favourite pathfinder thread.

>> No.30331187


here's a baby for you

>> No.30331212

with their spines intertwined like that they probably have problems eating.
A shame that, 5 meter long two headed snakes would be awesome.

>> No.30331236


Nope. The big advantage of the snake shape is that you can smoothly and easily get a pretty large animal through paths that are only an inch and a half in diameter. Trying to navigate that environment while leading with a big fork would be like trying to move through a dense thicket while standing up straight with your arms spread wide. You'll catch on stuff, have a hard time getting around. And the weight of the second head and neck would make it hard to strike prey quickly and accurately.

Cool looking critter, though.

>> No.30331237

dem spines

>> No.30331252

Real life hydras then?

>> No.30331267

pictured: your next campaign's BBEG

>> No.30331285

Snakes in clothing are great.

>> No.30331288

Of all the things my thread could have become, this is the best.

>> No.30331307

snakes yawning is one of the best things

>> No.30331321

I would post snake girls, but not today, not in this thread.
Only daaww now.

>> No.30331333

I agree.

>> No.30331338 [SPOILER] 

These are really cute snakes. It would be a shame if anything happened to them.

>> No.30331347

You monster.

>> No.30331350


only the cutest today

>> No.30331363

Don't take it seriously.
There's a proper way and an improper way to look at D&D and Pathfinder. The improper way is to get like some of these 3.5 assholes who absolutely refuse to play anything that isn't 3.5, or at least d20. Honestly, d20 isn't a great system. There are systems that do everything that d20 can do better.

The proper way to think of D&D and PF is with the mentality that OD&D had. Beer and pretzels. You and some buddies roll up characters and go explore a dungeon. They have programs that make rolling a PF character take minutes, and there are even dungeon generators out there that generate and populate your dungeon, so you have a half-hour prep time, plus however long it took to read the rules.

>> No.30331367

Professor Snake.

>> No.30331370


thanks for spoilering that

>> No.30331375

>> No.30331386


>> No.30331390

The man with the same codename as you.

>> No.30331393

>> No.30331407


>> No.30331411


>> No.30331434


>> No.30331447

It's kingseeker frampt.

>> No.30331468

>> No.30331485


whenever one of my snakes yawns i really wish i was recording video

>> No.30331519

brushie brushie

also fuck these retarded captchas what the fuck man

>> No.30331522



>> No.30331554

Also bats are the best kind of flying dogs.

>> No.30331577

>> No.30331598


bats are really fuckin cute but at the reptile show I went to a few weeks ago had a dead bat in lucite that I kind of really want

>> No.30331604


>> No.30331625 [SPOILER] 

These birds are also cute. Shame if something were to catch them.

>> No.30331656


>> No.30331681 [SPOILER] 


What was this thread about again?

>> No.30331692


>> No.30331707

who knows

>> No.30331711



>> No.30331713

Looks like a spider that took a trip through the Warp.

>> No.30331717


>> No.30331744


>> No.30331748

Nah, just the natural cycle of life.

>> No.30331754

>> No.30331758

>> No.30331768


That said, there's been a sighting of an adult two headed adder somewhere in England. Somehow they learnt not to bite each others faces for long enough to grow up.

>> No.30331822


>> No.30331841


>> No.30331851

Make way for a real dinosaur.

>> No.30331899


>> No.30331933


>> No.30331966


>> No.30332004

Those colours are pretty neat.

>> No.30332006

Why are iguanas so photogenic?

>> No.30332043

>> No.30332059

Lazy yet attentive.
Like fat cats.

>> No.30332096

>> No.30332145

>> No.30332155

Fat Tegus are the greatest.

>> No.30332179


>> No.30332255

You may choose a party of 5 animals in this thread to awaken and send on an adventure.

>> No.30332282

Can this just be the response to these threads from now on? Just, two hours of lizards and birds and snakes and turtles?

>> No.30332292

They look like they're chewing while they smell the water, that's darling

>> No.30332308

monitors are real stand-up dudes

>> No.30332326

>> No.30332363


they're very cute when they drink

>> No.30332368

Another issue that hasn't been mentioned: snakes are asocial predators. When the two heads are feeding, they get confused and literally start attacking each other, thinking that the other one is a rival or just dinner.

They aren't cognisant of their bifurcation, they just assume that another snake that looks like them is following them around all the time.

>> No.30332395

>> No.30332405

I had a bearded dragon that would do all sorts of poses for me. He'd cheese so hard if a camera was ever pointed his way, I swear he'd even smile. He'd also sit on my head and watch tv with me. Basically, he did all the cutesy lizard things.

But only after he whipped me with his tail. EVERY time I reached into his terrarium, he whipped me like fucking Devo. Welts, welts everywhere. Just once, though, and then he was cool. It was like Viggo Mortensen and the headbutt thing.

then one day he stopped eating and died. RIP ZORAK U MA BRO 4 LYFE

>> No.30332435

What would a snake with a chin look like?

>> No.30332442


>> No.30332444

>angry flying fox as dickass thief
>dickass spider as dickass assassin
>Top hat lil snake as enchanter
>disfunctional Iguana as reserved veteran defender
>lil turtle as party face

>Mostly intelligent discussion (Few posts)

>> No.30332451


they can also be huge pussies. My pop had a ball python get eaten by a box turtle.

>> No.30332472


>Peace was never an option.

>> No.30332498

six baby turtles, adventuring under the sea.

like finding nemo but with wizards and shit.

>> No.30332499

That's like a really slow laugh

>> No.30332504


>> No.30332563


>> No.30332590

Who would've thought the greatest allies of the flies would turn out to be the mushrooms?

>> No.30332622


>> No.30332632

Beardeds are amazing. Now I really want to play a bearded dragon lizardman.

>> No.30332654


>> No.30332670


>> No.30332688


>> No.30332693


>> No.30332706

Basilisks, because /tg/.

>> No.30332712


>> No.30332723

>> No.30332739


>> No.30332749

>> No.30332765


>> No.30332807

In our group of level 6 characters, we have 3 martials and occasionally take a wizard NPC with us. In every battle so far, he has been either useful exactly once (haste spell) or less effective than our PCs otherwise. Opponents very often save and the limited spells per day are, well, very limiting.

Wizards aren't overpowered if you play sensibly and don't abuse the rules (said hit-and-run teleporting).

>> No.30332889

Shhh, shhh. Only cute now.

>> No.30333072

Yo dawg, I heard you like Chameleons so we put a Chameleon on your Chameleon so it change colors while its changing colors.

>> No.30333084

Tell your DM he's kindof being a shit. Granted, it COULD be considered metagaming for him to straight up tell you what type of monsters he's going to be throwing at you. Try rephrasing and just asking which types of enemies are most prominent in the region that you're starting your game in. If he still refuses to give you any sort of hint towards it, just compare it to the "Favored Terrain" in which you obviously wouldn't choose desert if you're playing in an underwater campaign.
All things said, I've been DMing a game in which I actually allowed the ranger of the group to forego choosing his favored enemy until after the first two sessions or so. That might be an option.
Worst case, >>30329934
this guy has the right idea, humans, undead and evil outsider are great choices.

>> No.30333105

>> No.30333155

My favourite thing about pangolins is that they walk on their back two feet a lot. Cutest walk.

>> No.30333193


My favorite thing about pangolins is how they taste. They're so tender the juice drips down your chin.

>> No.30333199

I mean just look at these guys.

>> No.30333234

>> No.30333284

Aren't pangolins supposedly incredible escape artists?

>> No.30333298

Go die in a hole Shas.

Yes. At least a +4 racial bonus to escape artist.

>> No.30333326

Please post every gif you go.
I love pangolins, they just look cartoony in a good way.

>> No.30333397


>> No.30333441

Last pangolin gif I've got, sorry mate.

>> No.30333552

Iquanas are very photogenic.

>> No.30333577

>> No.30333606

>> No.30333608

>> No.30333642

Wow that is a beautiful picture. Those scales are like tiny leaves.

>> No.30333713

Love this pic. Such a pretty snake.

>> No.30334028

I love sharks

>> No.30334198

If you're going to defend PF, don't do it by using reaction images and screaming autism!

Nobody will take you seriously, or think you are so edgy

>> No.30334242

The only thing I'd add is this:
Metagaming is not bad if you use it to increase the enjoyment of everyone at the table, especially in the long term.

Things like going along with a dumb plan once in a while, or coming up with a reason to drive the plot. I'm not saying to betray your character's deepest principles, but sometimes it's better to make the concession to the fact that you are playing a game.

>> No.30334281

>Assuming PF players don''t play anything else.
Let's see some statistics please.

>> No.30334760

No. A first time Pathfinder player has other options.

>> No.30334781

There's just too many trap options in Pathfinder. A dualwield build for instance sounds fine until you realize how many feats you're burning on the build. A Monk sounds cool but it's horribly crippled. (I think Sean K. Reynolds, Pathfinder Designer has been on file saying he hates the Monk class.) The Rogue has been crippled as well (Quick Draw nerf, flat-footed nerfs, tumbling nerfs, sneak attack nerf, new skill consolidations etc making the skill monkey position unnecessary). Even playable classes frequently have archetypes that despite sounding nice and flavorful are actually devastatingly bad, like Sacred Shield Paladin. Dualwield builds are so ridiculously feat intensive that very few classes can manage it to proper effect. New combat maneuver system is also really unreliable due to size/str/dex/BAB modifiers strongly favoring monsters and the relevant feat chains are just too long. What all this leads to is a very large number of decisions players can make that would utterly cripple their character. But the Paizo retards will frequently bitch about how it's supposed to be about roleplaying (then why the fuck is Pathfinder such a mechanics-heavy game, eh?) and you're just not a fun guy if you focus on making effective builds, so really if you have a lousy time playing a character that is dead weight it's all your fault for lacking the proper sense of fun.

>> No.30334807

Saying Pathfinder has some "potentially gamebreaking flaws" is an understatement. Pathfinder is built atop a poorly balanced system and it exacerbated the imbalances. Sure, they tried to reign in the biggest excesses, but at the same time they widened the caster/non-caster divide by nerfing a lot of combat feats (power attack, expanding feat chains, etc.) and sometimes classes outright (rogue, monk), while giving the casting classes more shiny toys (Paragon Surge, Create Pit, better hitpoints, less drawbacks to being a specialist wizard, favored class system rewarding single-classed characters when martials multiclass a ton). Casters can often trivialize encounters with a single spell at just about every level (level 1? Sleep and color spray mainly. Level 3? Create Pit Level 5? The list keeps going) and the divine casters get shiny domain powers and can frequently be more powerful in melee than the martial classes and this is without factoring in possible animal companions and shit. The Summoner's pet Eidolon has been proven to do better damage than an entire Fighter player character and the Summoner has FAR more up his sleeves than the Eidolon.

>> No.30334874

This is pretty much all spot-on.

Seriously, SKR is a dick who arbitrarily punishes certain kinds of play because it's more "realistic".

>> No.30335324

Obligatory AD&D picture explaining what the original D&D designers thought of demanding "muh realism!" in D&D.

FYI: Pathfinder is nothing more than a slightly altered D&D 3.5, and mostly for the worse

>> No.30335385

This has become a stereotype for a reason.

>> No.30335449

The quote from SKR about why crossbows are worse than bows:
>I want my water-balloon-throwing fighter to be able to deal the same damage as a longbow-shooting fighter. Why does Pathfinder have trap options for some ranged characters?

>> No.30335541


That reason is buttmad 4th edition fags making shit up.

>> No.30335560

Sound defensive there, threeaboo. Played anything not dnd recently?

>> No.30335586

Didn't that result in people calculating that a water balloon throwing fighter was actually way the fuck superior to a crossbow fighter? At which point SKR threw another bitch-fit?

>> No.30335617


>> No.30335705

I put on my skin and wizard hat.

>> No.30335715

Not even. My hatred of d20/3.5 has burned since the OGL slashed and burned its way though the gaming market causing abortions like Call of Cthulhu d20, Legend of Five Rings d20 (3.0's Oriental Adventures), 7th Sea d20 (3.0 Swashbuckling Adventures), and so many more. Before the d20 Apocalypse there were many games on the market, during those dark days it was d20 based garbage, White Wolf, Rifts, and GURPS. We are just now starting to recover.

>> No.30335763

Why roll d20 when you can roll 3d6, seriously. At least 3d6 gravitates more towards average rolls while d20s are full of stupid crits.

>> No.30335878

That's exactly it. Camouflage.

>> No.30335920

How could they use camouflage man they're animals!

>> No.30336659

Look at this snake holy shit

>> No.30336723

Because it's 5% for each possible outcome.

It makes improvisational adjustment of the game's math really easy.

The GURPS probability curve fucks that up unless you took a statistics and probability curve.

Also not a fan of Roll-under systems

>> No.30336803

In other words, it was an effective business policy.

>> No.30336871

So you hate 3.5 and by that extent Pathfinder... Because of games that aren't' D&D...

Wow, astounding logic there.
You may have a hyperactive association disorder.

>> No.30337490


>> No.30338746

Is that creature of one mind? Or is it two separate entities piloting the same body. I always wondered about this.

>> No.30338997

Considering that it has two separate brains, I believe it would be two entities, similar to conjoined twins.

That being said, shit's weird.

>> No.30339449

So that's where they get the name from, fuck

>> No.30339484

What a nice bird. No wonder pagans liked them, they must have used them before they got demonised by christians.

>> No.30339638

The only thing I could think of while watching that is
>muh shekels goyim, ehehehe

>> No.30339700

Now look at this champ here. This is the reason the southern americans worshiped snakes with feathers. These beautiful little fuckers practically had them. What a treat.

>> No.30342571


In pathfinder, the opium water balloon mightier than the sword.

And the crossbow.

And most of the actual weapons the fighter could be using.

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