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[ERROR] No.30015662 [DELETED]  [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

>Have enough acrobatics to do curazy shit on fucking everyth...
>Try to do acrobatics on a horse
>DM "Sorry, you need ride to do that"
>On fucking everything but any animal that can be rode
Tell me about the inconsistencies in your systems, /tg/

Pic related, the system lets me do this with acrobatics, but fighting while standing on a horse is impossible if I don't have enough ride.

>> No.30015759

HPs
Enough said.

>> No.30015807

The ride skill is your ability to keep the animal calm and under control while you're doing acrobatics on them. I bet even a world class gymnast couldn't do acrobatics shit on a horse the first time they rode one, their ass would get thrown off.

>> No.30015839

>>30015759
I really liked L5R's wound system, but I agree.

>> No.30015847

exp

>> No.30015848

>>30015807
Yep. how is it that this thought didn't occur to op?

>> No.30015853

>>30015759
>Stabbed until I'm down to 1 hit point.
>Near-dead and can start fatally bleeding to death if I get so much as a mosquito bite.
>Can run 5 marathons and bench-press a horse right afterwards with zero difficulty or penalties from being half-dead.
>Stub my toe on the stairs and immediatly fall to the ground and die.
>"HIT POINTS TOTALLY MADE SENSE GUYS."

>> No.30015868

>>30015848
Because logic means nothing if your stats are high enough!

>> No.30015898

>>30015662
>being able to balance yourself and do tricks is the same skill as being able to predict and control how your horse is going to react when you do tricks on it.
Nah, you're a cunt.

>> No.30015917

>>30015807
depends entirely on the horse. if it's an obedient and well trained one it does not give a fuck.

>> No.30015922

>>30015853
For the one billionth time, HP is based on luck, near misses, overall stamina, and so on. The blow that brings you below 0HP is the one where everything ran out.

Want realistic HP? Then halve it, and exchange penalties like halved movement speed, staggered for a few rounds, or a broken arm for some extra HP when you get hit.

>> No.30015961

>>30015922
I know.

The example I gave was one I cart out every time some idiot tries to go "Hit Points were all physical and totally made sense guys."

As a bonus, if you ever wanna see one of those guys who insist 4e ruined hit points by making them abstract from 3e's supposedly all-physical definition have a meltdown, show them the Phantasmal Killer and Nightmare spells. Last time I brought those, I literally had someone telling me that if you think you got stabbed by an illusionary dagger, your skin would spontaneously start splitting itself open.

>> No.30015977

>>30015662
>have enough smithing to do curazy shit with fucking everyth...
>try to smith something with clockwork
>DM "Sorry, you need Craft: Mechanism to do that"
>with fucking everything with gears

Pic related, the system lets me do this with smithing, but forging just a single gearbox is impossible if I don't have enough Craft: Mechanism.


>this is how dumb you sound

>> No.30015981

>>30015898
>Being able to balance yourself and do tricks is the same skill as being able to predict and control how the waves on the sea are going to...wait, it actually does
Nah, you just can't read for shit

>> No.30016003

>>30015807
Depends on the level of bullshit you can do with acrobatics, he said curazy shit, I assume shit like jumping from missiles and dance on bullets...so yeah, if he can do that why he can't fight standing on a horse?

>> No.30016005

>>30015981

>what is Profession:Sailor

Nah, you're a cunt.

>> No.30016052

>>30015981
>accounting for the simple, repetitive, and consistent effects of the unthinking waves while standing on a solid deck which moves with the same motion is the same as accounting for the complex and erratic movements of an animal intentionally attempting to throw you off, while standing on said animal's muscles which flex in directions opposite of it's actual momentum

Speaking as a sailor of eleven years who can't ride a horse for shit, you're an idiot.

>> No.30016056

>>30015922
I think a better solution would be to assign a set value of HP based on body type. Body type being determined by class. divide up the HP per body "location". (1D10) 1 being head, 2-4 being torso, 5-6 being arms, 7-10 for legs.
>Your arm is crippled and seared; you're going to have to make attacks with your offhand for now.
>climbing and acrobatic checks will be double difficulty until you get that healed.

>> No.30016064

>>30016005
But OP said that he could do that just with acrobatics, why are you assuming he is lying or the system has "professions"?

Also, this sounds like Anima, where you can do stuff like that, like fucking this >>30016003, but trying to do that on a horse? nope, you need ride for that.

>> No.30016090

>>30015662
that's weird.

DM will usually let you make the attempt with another skill if it seems justifiable, even if you need to take a pretty big negative modified to the skill you're using to compensate for your lack of familiarity.

>> No.30016113

Systems are an abstraction of real life, of course they're going to have inconsistences, specially because in real life there isn't "epic" levels on skills and "curazy" shit.

That's why we have DMs, to change things if they see fit. You can do "curazy" shit on fucking everything? well, a sensitie DM would ignore "ride" and allow you to do that just with your "epic" levels in acrobatics.

>> No.30016123

>>30016090
>DMs
>Allowing you to success
Get out, you filthy nazi communist.

>> No.30016199

>>30015662
>Not rolling (Acrobatics - Ride)/Acrobatics
>Plus negatives for not having Ride equal to 100-Ride

>> No.30016326

>>30015917
You've never owned a horse, have you?

>> No.30016337

Ok guys, my minmaxing nature talking.
If someone with the mounted combat feat rides a shapeshifted druid and the druid allows the rider to direct him will the rider be able to use mounted combat to grant ac to the druid?

Getting this even further. Can multiple druids ride each other to use this feat on each other?

inb4 orgy

>> No.30016349

>>30016337

>> No.30016413

>>30016003
>>30016064
Because if you're inexperienced with horses and you accidentally spook them, say by trying to do acrobats on top of them, they'll do everything they can to throw you off and then kick you in the face. Even if you're able to stay on the damn thing it's going to quit running and start bucking to get you off. People who are inexperienced with horses can't do crazy shit like that on them. Seriously, horses are living creatures.

>> No.30016420

>>30016337
I'm now thinking about a massive rolling ball of bears that has like 700AC and is deadlier than a awaken Tarrasque.
Fucking druids.

>> No.30016463

A spell called Create Food and Water and farmers exists in the same universe.

>> No.30016464

>>30016420
>A giant bear made up Druids shapeshifted into bears.

>> No.30016520

>Games with "Luck" skill
You already had it, it's called rolling a fucking die

>> No.30016523

>>30015917
I assume your variety of training involves sedatives.

>> No.30016560

The only way to become good at something is kill some creatures.

Want to be a good chef? A master painter? A virtuoso musician? A smart mathematician? The only way to do these is go out and kill some goblins.

>> No.30016584

You might be able to dodge a million arrows shot at you. But you want to take cover from a dragon's breath or a wizard's fireball? You need to be a rogue for that.

>> No.30016615

Ars Magnus Virgo in Anima.
>You attack with your attack or music skill, whichever is lowerst
Why? I understand is to not optimize one, but...there's no explanation, in fact if you read the lore is quite the opposite.

>> No.30016641

>>30016584
Or a monk, don't know why a monk would go adventuring knowing the suck, but a monk could do that

>> No.30016682

You are a wizard who have been visiting the gym every day for the past 20 years (Level 1 Wizard, CON 18). Too bad, you are less resilient than a skinny, weak man who knows how to stab with a spear (Level 1 Fighter, CON 8)

>> No.30016692

>>30016463
Same with create magic weapons and armors

>> No.30016718

>>30016682
Using magic makes you weak.

>> No.30016719

>>30016413
>Fucking with physics is fine
>Except when we're talking about horses

You're telling me your suspension of disbelief can take a guy walking on water, but the same guy standing up on a horse is too much for you ?

>> No.30016779

>>30016420

>> No.30016810

>>30015662
Swedish Eon...
You got a skill named "Supa" which basically is how good you're at drinking alcohol...
Wouldn't be bad... unless you already had checks for resisting poison.

>> No.30017126

>>30015662

Actually the standing on water thing (as well as the wall walking thing) is related to a device in his shoes that does *something* with Van Der Waals force. Nanotechnology, but not actually nanomachines.

>> No.30017237

>>30016615
That makes perfect sense.

>> No.30017308

>>30016718
Picking locks also makes you weak?

>> No.30017310

>>30016413
If your reactions are good enough you can do acrobatics on a horse by responding to its movements.

Just up the DC.

>> No.30017605

>>30016719

Some players and DMs will do anything to justify incoherent rulings.

In this case, it's obvious that a high enough level of acrobatics allows you to breakdance on a horse - even if it's thrashing like crazy to get rid of you.

Merely standing on a horse? No problem. Hell - acrobatics in Anima (if that is the system, as someone said above) has the Zen difficulty be "able to run along a beam of light" and someone who specialises in it can start capable of dancing upside down on a horse supported by their fingers, blindfolded.

And a warhorse wouldn't thrash, because it is trained to deal with biting off mook infantry faces while letting its rider chop away and be chopped at.

Having its rider stand on its back isn't suddenly going to spook it.

>> No.30017643

>>30017310
>>30017310
>>30017310
>>30017310
>>30017310

>> No.30018099

>>30017605
Actually, if you go by the book (and by the creators in the Spanish forum) you need ride, doesn't matter if you can "breakdance in a beam of light", to do shit on a horse, you need ride.

Stupid? yeah, but that's what you get from a Spanish system.

>> No.30018259

>>30018099
House rule it, if it makes sense. If you can dance on top of living beings, you can do same on horse.
It's not like you have to obey the rules word by word.

>> No.30018318

>>30016113
>in real life there isn't "epic" levels on skills and "curazy" shit.

Liar.

>> No.30018328

>>30017126
>Shoot him to break his concentration
Unless retconned, it werent his shoes

>> No.30018380

>>30018328
>You need to be focused to use those shoes
There

>> No.30018580

>survival vs knowledge (nature)
>Max ranks in survival, but no ranks in know:nature
I can follow these week-old tracks across solid rock in a snowstorm at full speed, and I can tell it was injured and moving at a reduced pace while favoring its left leg, but fuck if I know what we're following.

>> No.30018735

>>30016113

Sounds like someone is jealous they couldn't qualify for a prestige class.

>> No.30018739

>>30015662
Now, if he is saying that Ride is the skill you need to roll to be acrobatic on a horse, I would say that is silly.

However, I would say that that you would need some skill and experience in horseback riding and handling horses to attempt such, preferably you would want a horse that has been trained to put up with that kind of behavior on it.

Depending on the system, you'd either want a minimum skill in horseriding, and/or be making checks to keep the animal predictable.
However, as a DM, I wouldn't bar you from attempting to do 'curazy acrobatic shit' on a horse just because you lack any knowledge of your platform, but I would warn that it can be quite difficult as a moving/bouncing platform that may move erratically and even attempt to remove you.
But, with a high enough skill, i wouldn't say it was impossible.

http://youtu.be/nUqrYQI4trk?t=5m

>> No.30018815

>>30018580
At least you know it has legs.

>> No.30018904

>Moving a figger provokes Attack of Opportunity
>Doing somersaults don't

>> No.30018977

>>30018580
>Max ranks in knowledge (nature), no ranks in survival
These tracks come from a northwestern owlbear, of the screech owlbear subspecies native to the boreal forests north of here. I can tell from the size of the print and the lenght of the clawprints that it's a young adult, possibly a healthy juvenile. Judging by the depth, it was probably carrying a fresh kill.

Follow its tracks? I have no idea how to do that, don't be silly.

>> No.30018991

>>30018904
>DM tells me the AoO in ranged weapons are due the reload action
>"Makes sense"
>I provoke two different AoO in the fire action and in the reloading action
I almost hit him

>> No.30019205

>>30018904
Holding still in combat vs jumping out of combat.

>> No.30019334

>Move at the speed of light
>Still provoke attacks of opportunity, I even get negatives to defense

>> No.30019357

>>30015662
>Roll nat 20 to land on horse
>No ride
>Caught in eternal time paradox or destroy time itself

>> No.30019584

>>30018580
>Max ranks in knowledge (nature), nor anks in survival

I can recite you all the types of mushrooms and plants and which ones are edible and which ones are not. But drop me in a forest and I'll starve to death.

>> No.30019640

>>30015922
>For the one billionth time, HP is based on luck, near misses, overall stamina, and so on. The blow that brings you below 0HP is the one where everything ran out.
And again, I'll ask you to explain "Injury" poisons. Oh, your dude with 200 hp that's all represented by "luck and near misses" gets hit by a 1 damage blowgun dart laced with poison...gonna spew that bullshit that it WASN'T physical damage when he needs to save vs the poison? Clearly it broke skin and DID DAMAGE.

>> No.30019665

Hi, I am a Fighter. My basic training includes learning how to find with many kinds of weapons, sword and board, knives, longbows, slings, crossbows, two handed axes, rapiers, you name it. I can use them all with proficiency.

However, hand me pic related and I'll hav no idea what to do with it.

>> No.30019700

>HP is based on luck and near misses
>"Wow I fell 100 meters but I was so lucky the ground nearly missed me!"

>> No.30019765

>>30019665
Hi, I'm a dude from not-japan, but still I don't fucking know how to use weapons from my country, I need a feat for that.

Hi, I'm a human bred by dwarves, elves or orcs, but I don't fucking know how to use dwarven axes, thinblades or whateveritsname is ork weapon

Hi, I'm an elf, dwarf, orck bred by humans, and even I never saw one in my whole life I know how to perfectly use a thin blade, dwarven axe or whateveritsnameis ork weapon

>> No.30019825

>creating new realms of existence, summoning creatures from beyond reality, causing earthquakes and acid storms and fiery explosions, creating impassable barriers, teleporting across continents is perfectly reasonable for a caster
>give martial classes something nice? Shut up go away troll they're perfectly balanced and nothing needs fixing at all

haha okay bro, whatever you say

>> No.30019852

>>30019640
That was a hit because the narrative wouldn't make sense otherwise.

>> No.30019890

>>30019825
>Martials
>Not retiring and become farmers after they reach 5th level

>> No.30019892

That's not really a problem with your system as much as your DM.

And HP do make sense, when you consider that it is not based in any way in reality and DnD characters are full of a red slop called HP.

>> No.30019896

>>30015922
Ok so all of those cleric spells (cure X wounds) also cure near misses?

>> No.30019913

>>30019892
Actually it's a problem with some systems, read Anima Beyond Fantasy who states that to do acrobatics on a mount you need Ride, while there's already a skill called acrobatics that say you can do acrobatics, and with enough points, even "do it in a beam of light"

>> No.30019952

>>30019913
>implying anyone plays anima beyond fantasy
you can strawman it all you want, it's a DM problem

>> No.30019958

>>30019896
>Wow, that ogre nearly missed me a bunch of times
>I think I need a healing potion

>> No.30020004

>>30019952
>Says there isn't a system that does that
>Point one
>Strawman
Ah, we reached this level of stupidity already, ok, then, I'm going to watch Kamen Rider now

>> No.30020012

>>30019958
Well a near miss would be a hit, wouldn't it?

>> No.30020035

>HP is based on near misses

Hello, I am Grognod the Barbarian. I am slow as fuck but somehow enemies just keep nearly missing me hundreds of times.

Hi, I am Nimble the elven acrobat with 20 dexterity. I may be nearly missed once or twice but then I get killed.

>> No.30020040

>"Sealed room with a fireball trap"
>"Evasion! nothing happens"
>"Not even a tiny burnt?"
>"Nope"
>"Well, rock falls!!"
>"Evasion"
>"B-but you didn't even move..."
>"Yep"

>> No.30020071

>>30020035
AC, another inconsistence.

>> No.30020073

>>30020035
Grognod may be slow to think and move, but he's able to maneuver his body and block attacks where it counts. You know, like Cohen the Barbarian. He's not a nimble fucker DODGING blows, he's just so capable that he can be wherever his enemy's sword isn't, and make sure his sword is always three inches deep into an enemy's throat.

>> No.30020120

Kids, kids, HP makes little sense but it's better than the alternative which is rolling for hit locations and junk every time.

For what it's worth, using a WFRP-style death and dismemberment table when they go below 0HP really helps.
Plus fighting with a broken arm is way more interesting than unconsciousness!
Please find attached the best death crit table this side of the snickers galaxy.

>> No.30020129

>>30016560
I laughed hard.

>> No.30020130

>been playing D&D in one form or another since 1995
>all these people feebly defending it and trying to rationalize its nonsensical and contradictory mechanics
Guys, come on. Just admit it. I love D&D, but it kinda sucks.

>> No.30020215

>>30015662
Has your GM ever seen this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYNlcz3w4Z8

>> No.30020224

>>30020130
True advantage of D&D is the sheer amount of material that has been made and is being made for it on the day to day.

Other systems might have better mechanics or settings or whatever, but D&D has the monopoly on cool shit people made for you to have for free.
Unless you're still suckling on Paizo's rancid teat despite the experience of years of gaming instead of making your own stuff in which case I'm sure you are having fun you go imaginary strawman guy I just invented.

>> No.30022916

>getting spergy about HP
They're a gameplay device. The battles are designed to not be a lot of instakills because the game relies heavily on them AND random numbers, meaning that the outcome of a battle can be decided not only by your ability.
If this bugs you so much find a system that doesn't throw faceless mooks at you so you can have realistic fights.

>> No.30026720

>I want to retrain my weapon focus in X for proficiency in Y
>You can't just unlearn things
>Alright then I want to train for proficiency in Y
>You have to level for feats
>So I have to go kill things with X, to learn how to use Y?
>Shut the fuck up

>> No.30030550

>>30015662
You need Ride to make the horse still go where you need it going and not just flip out and buckle you (you can maybe stand on it's head even while it does so, but that's still distracting and puts the horse into the line of attacks)

>> No.30030968

>>30015922
>For the one billionth time, HP is based on luck, near misses, overall stamina, and so on. The blow that brings you below 0HP is the one where everything ran out.

Which would be justifiable if fucking dexterity and dodge, two things that are basically "You got out of hte way instead of getting hit" weren't added to yoru AC, the thing you have to get through before even lowering HP.

>> No.30031520

>>30019700
I just have to forget gravity and then it will forget you. Then you can fly! (as long as gravity is looking in the opposite direction)

>> No.30031635

>>30030968

>HP is luck and stamina
>have higher AC because you're good at dodging blows
>because of this, you don't have to rely on your luck as much, and you're so good at dodging that it doesn't take as much stamina for you to avoid blows
>this somehow doesn't make sense

K

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