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26835858 No.26835858 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

I style my Grey Knights as direct descendants of the Eisenstein survivors. I use Crusade and Iron armour to represent them. Handheld autocannons as psycannons, rotor cannons as psilencers, crusade era heavy flamers as incinerators. A mix of off-brand polearms with added bolters (and volkite weapons) as nemesis force halberds. I use a mix of Deathshroud and Tartaros terminators to represent GK termies, with a 1980s Grey Knight as my Grand Master. They are loyal descendants of the traitor legions, which makes them the only Space Marines to truly know what's at stake. They adhere to the Imperial Truth and retain a semblance of Space Marine legion organization. Their shenanigans are only tolerated because they are an integral part of the Inquisition, the fighting force of the Ordo Malleus, given incredible leeway by the Emperor Himself.

tl;dr: I reject Ward's fluff and substitute my own.


>> No.26835869


>> No.26835872
File: 57 KB, 399x302, grey_k02.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

There is no Kaldor Draigo. It is a carefully manufactured legend. There is, however, a master crafted nemesis force greatsword tempered in the waste of the Golden Throne. No one knows exactly what that stuff was, but it gave the blade psyk-out properties. This gives it the exact profile of the Titansword. It is always given to the Legion Champion, who also dons the Draigo armour to fuel the propaganda machine.

There is no Grand Master Mordrak. This is another manufactured lie. There is the Legion's Assistant Grand Librarian though. One of the foremost psykers of the Grey Knights, he can summon the ghosts of fallen warriors to fight by his side. His affinity with the Warp gives him Mordrak's First To The Fray rule too. All that requires full concentration, so his Mastery Level is 1 for all intents and purposes.

Brother-Captain Stern exists, but the whole daemon backstory is a lie. He is just one of the mightiest Centurions of the Grey Knights. How could a daemon hope to corrupt warriors guarded by psychic wards engraved within their very bones? Body and soul would incinerate in a bright flash if a Grey Knight were corrupted!

Castellan Crowe is a filthy lie made up by the Grey Knights' enemies within the Inquisition. No Grey Knight would touch a daemon blade with any intent other than to incarcerate the daemon within in a tesseract labyrinth.

Justicar Thawn might be another example of mythic exaggeration. The only thing known is that there is a terminator justricar who refuses to stay down. Maybe there is an Anval Thawn, maybe his real name is Jack Harkness, maybe it's all a lie. Nobody knows.

END. Opinions?

>> No.26835875

there is a reason Matt gets to write official fluff and you don't

>> No.26835898

>END. Opinions?
Way much better than official approach.
Good job OP.

>> No.26835904

thats harsh

>> No.26835915

Why are you taking every piece of established material and addressing it as a lie perpetuated by whothefuckcares instead of just disregarding it completely and going from the ground up? It reads more like you're being spiteful towards what's in the codex instead of it being born out of some sort of genuinely creative desire to do your own thing, and that approach is real stupid.

>> No.26835921

There is a reason why every existing GW fan rejects the matwart's drivel. Get out.

>> No.26835926

Eh, doesn't do it for me - but I've seen far worse, so I won't bitch at you for making something you like and I don't, cus opinions.

>> No.26835932


Crudace pls go

>> No.26835951

>>my opinion is everyone else's
I forgot shitbags like you existed.

>> No.26835956

My approach is built using Black Library sources and the look of the first Grey Knights models. I had to address the codex's rules part because I can't play tournaments with homebrew codexes. There might be a dash of spite owing to the fact that IMHO, Mat Ward should be banned from touching 40K fluff, but the approach itself is born out of pragmatism. He writes passable rules, you know. It's just his fluff that stinks.

>> No.26835960

>ITT: fanon headcanon

You're free to believe what ever you like.

>> No.26835992


I'm talking about purely the fluff. In regards to rules you say "counts as." If you want your dude to work using Draigo's rules, you say "this dude counts as Draigo," and then you're free to believe whatever you want in regards to the model's fluff and whatever else. Going so far into it that you feel compelled to say "Draigo is a LIE," and likewise for the other named characters, just comes across as really petty and childish is all.

>> No.26836030

OK, supplement. One specific vehicle (or rather, monstrous creature) should be addressed.

The Nemesis Dreadknight. What a mouthful to address the Nemesis pattern Knight suit. Smaller and more sophisticated than the Knight Paladin, the Knight Nemesis is a suit assigned to questing Knights who travel the galaxy in search of artifacts for the Adeptus Mechanicus. Since there is no room for a full cockpit, the Knight is strapped to the chest and protected with an armoured shell that serves as the cockpit. An auto-sense suite is placed as the head so they can perceive their surroundings. Model wise, the Terminator is replaced with a cockpit-like shape, and the sensor from a Land Raider sponson is put on top. Looks far better that way.

>> No.26836046

>master crafted nemesis force greatsword tempered in the waste of the Golden Throne


did you seriously just come up with a force sword tempered in the emperor's piss?

>> No.26836079

Why are they making up lies ?
Why would they need propaganda ? Or maybe they aren't secret anymore ?
It would be better to fix those stories, it would be clearer to discard them entirely.

>> No.26836159

There's an amazingly strong anti-Ward faction on /tg/. It used to be ubiquitous.

>> No.26836163

Makes sense in fluff, seeing that psyk-out grenades use the Emperor's shit anyway. My fluff is about as shitty as the original, and needs far less explanation.

Just a smokescreen, in case anyone finds out. It doesn't sit well with me that they explained stuff at all, especially in such a hamfisted and contradictory way. I don't want to win awards, I just want to have fluff that's consistent with the universe.

>> No.26836346

I can't respect this because it's just petulant butthurt.

>> No.26836369

Yes. Yessss! Give me all yoiur Wardian arsepain!

>> No.26836458

HH series already has Garro & co. as the founders what will be GK's. I wouldn't be surprised if even the "Emperor's own geneseed" is written out to be a legend (which it most likely is, considering what happens to Emprah's lab in Deliverance Lost), considering that even Vulkan's disappearance is going to be written as a denialistic rejection of his death.

>> No.26837136

Can't wait for the next official GK codex.

>> No.26837659

That's all I'm reading.

>> No.26837697

>used to be a game where you were encouraged to make your own chapters, customize your heroes, use "Counts As", and craft a story for your dudes as you fought with them

>no counts as
>only special characters and chapter tactics
>everything else is butthurt
>final destination

>> No.26838355

That's because you're illiterate. This stuff is objectively better than Ward's bullshit.

Welcome to 2013.

>> No.26838721

Funny considering, Necron codex aside, he doesn't change much fluff-wise, he just adds to it a bit.

Grey Knights had little to no fluff beyond them killing daemons(which they sucked at before the 5th ed update) and having 1 character, but such was to be expected since it was Codex: Daemonhunters and now it's Codex: Grey Knights

I don't think you know the meaning of the term "objectively."

>> No.26839032

Let's use the phrase "consensual" instead. Last time I checked, /tg/'s consensus about the 5th ed. GK codex was "Nice rules, but ditch the fluff, it stinks". Same goes for all Ward codexes.

>> No.26839073

>GK codex was "Nice rules, but ditch the fluff, it stinks".

No it wasn't. It should have been 'Ditch everything'. The rules weren't nice at all. They were a clusterfuck of gamey bullshit that sucked the fun out of the game for anyone except the person playing the army. It was an entire army of "marines + 1", which could be effortlessly tailored to take on any specific opponent to the point where they might as well not even fucking bother playing the game.

>> No.26839135

Except for the fact that you can rout them with two or three well placed templates. There simply aren't enough of them to hold a front. Also, that's your subjective assessment, not the consensus.

>> No.26839341

>It was an army that could fight against all other armies if you took the right units!

That makes it good, not like the rock, paper, scissors, nuke. I wish more books were like the Grey Knight codex.

>> No.26839351

Go fuck yourself. I don't want another fucking book with "all players of faction x should just concede on the spot."

>> No.26839364

Except it wouldn't be like that if the books were written to the same quality so that they could all deal with each other.

>> No.26839378

A book that can take on anything if the army is set up properly shows flexibility.

Some builds will destroy some armies but falter horribly against others, but such is the way of things.

>> No.26839385

That makes no sense.

GK hose Daemons super hard and can spend points to hose even more
Daemons get released and because this is rock paper scissors they are built to hose say Tau.

The game isn't any better.
Daemons players still autoconcede to GK.
Your idea is terrible.

>> No.26839403

well he had a sword made out of shit

that's what the byproduct of the golden throne is

the "grey knights are Eisenstien survivors" is what Ward implied in his codex so you're not rejecting Ward's fluff just taking out

everyone is just LoL! Special characters are just lies!

Because Grey Knights never deal with logic breaking bullshit on a daily basics or do things that are impossible for normal Space Marines

>> No.26839430


> just taking out bits you don't like

>> No.26839447

>That makes no sense.

It does though, Grey Knights were great because they could fight everyone pretty successfully if you gave them the right tools. Give everyone else more options so that they can also build to fight everyone and you're good to go.

>GK hose Daemons super hard

They wouldn't if Kelly had done a good job on the daemon book though. Daemonhunters and Daemons were a bad idea to begin with, but they could easily be made to be workable if daemons were given some counters. Removing EW from Greater Daemons was a terrible idea, because now they can be FW'd and daemonbaned after.

>> No.26839493

Daemonhunters and Daemons was alright. It was a bad matchup for sure but at least the fucking Daemonhunters book gave Daemons something in return. GK just buttfucks daemons and doesn't provide any lube.

If a codex is designed to hose one faction, it is that book's job to fix the issue, not the job of the one faction's codex. Saying anything else encourages imbalance and needless complexity. Ideally nobody should be built from the ground up to hose x faction in a FFA tournament meta unless they also suffer a titanic vulnerability to y faction where x=/=y and even then that's just making it so that who you face first determines who wins period.

>> No.26839550

You realize that tempering something doesn't magically turn it into the substance, right? Sticking a white hot sword into a bucket of piss was standard fare in the middle ages. Didn't make the swords turdlike at all.

Also, the fluff for psyk-out grenades goes back to 1st edition. They're literally fueled by the Emperor's shit.

>> No.26839600

>Daemonhunters and Daemons was alright.

Nah, both were shit. Daemon Hunters had poor rules since the start, and were made to fight one part of one army that really didn't need much in terms of fighting.
Daemons were also a bad rules book, painful because it split chaos, and a bad idea in general because you had an army called daemon hunters that specialised in fighting daemons running around which needed to be updated eventually.

>It was a bad matchup for sure but at least the fucking Daemonhunters book gave Daemons something in return.

Yeah, crap scenario rules that were intended for use against only a few daemons nd not whole armies of them.

>If a codex is designed to hose one faction, it is that book's job to fix the issue, not the job of the one faction's codex.

No, the faction getting hosed needs to make the counter. Daemons came out after Grey Knights, they could have tuned them much better, but they just made Grey Knights even stronger by taking away EW.

GKs had the ability to take on anyone if built right. if everyone else had the ability to take on everyone else if built right the game would be far better. Nobody would just hose everone else, because they've all got the ability to fight each other more or less squarely.

>> No.26839649

Daemons can make effective TAC lists and has the ability to beat everyone but GK without massive tailoring. The only reason they can't beat GK without tailoring is because GK got a shitton of specific anti-that army rules.

>> No.26839689

Not really. Preffered Enemy(Daemons) and Psylincers(seriously, who takes those) were about it.

Most of their stuff pulls double-duty of countering psychers or drop pods.

>> No.26840295

Much better than the official fluff.

>> No.26840368

pls stop samefagging, OP

>> No.26840533

OP here. That wasn't me. Not every sane comment is by the same person. Oh, and if you know a mod, you can ask them. They can compare IP addresses.

>> No.26840565

Uh huh. Sure.

>> No.26840566
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Sorry old chap, entirely different person.

>> No.26840684

Don't bother, he believes that there's only three people on /tg/. Care to help me expand that fluff a bit?

>> No.26840780
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Is their geen-seed still that of the Emperor or is that a fabrication as well?

Only other gene-seed to boost the psy-blessing was that of Magnus the Red.

>> No.26841022

Last time I checked, the official fluff is still that it was Emps's geneseed, which is inconsistent with other fluff. His lab was destroyed even before the Eisenstein returned, he's not a Primarch so there isn't any chance of geneseed etc., so it's all very fuzzy. I bet he just mixed up a traitor geneseed cocktail to use on the GKs. Without Word Bearers, mind. Their religious fervor fucked up everything.

>> No.26841169
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How did they handle the First War for Armageddon?

Did they round up the survivors and execute them or send them to a quarantine world?

>> No.26841230

Actually, they rounded up and sterilized the survivors, put them in secret concentration camps, and repopulated the world with settlers. That includes the IG units involved, mind. High officials were mindwiped instead.

>> No.26841659


>> No.26841868

>His lab was destroyed even before the Eisenstein returned

He could make another lab.

>he's not a Primarch so there isn't any chance of geneseed

But there is. Primarchs did not have gene-seed built into them, they had gene-seed created from their genetics, the Emperor could logically do the same for himself.

>> No.26842186

So with his resources depleted, his lab destroyed, the final attack imminent, and a viable source readily available, he'd spend valuable time to make a new primarch lab and extract his own geneseed? In terms of really dumb fluff, that actually makes sense.

>> No.26842271

>he'd spend valuable time to make a new primarch lab and extract his own geneseed?

Yes, because...

>a viable source readily available

Is simply not true, his Primarchs and their Legions had already proven fallible.

And as for

>the final attack imminent

We'll be lucky if Horus even looks at Terra funny within 50 years real time at the glacial pace of the HH series.

>> No.26842556

Question: Are you the same idiotic faggot shitting up the other GK thread?

>> No.26842638

Nope. This is the only GK thread I've seen today. Now instead of slinging insults how about you make your rebuttal.

>> No.26842825

The Primarch genetics was a mishmash of human and non-Human DNA, put together (in addition to Emprah's own wits and psionics) with arcane science from DAoT and supposedly Emprah pulling a JUST AS PLANNED on Chaos Gods, and it still took years if not decades of tinkering. Logic follows that it was a one-off creation, and there is no way Emprah would be able to replicate it in the 7 years it took Horus to reach Earth.

Much more logical assumption is that Malcador rounded up suitable candidates ie. the eight original grandmasters including Garro, Loken, Qruze, Rubio, Varren, plus three others, because they each had valuable qualities besides being particularly Chaos-resistant. Splicing all this together into one would both save time and combine their individual strenghts: "Emprah's Own" geneseed, with the ├╝ber-psychic gifts of Rubio, the resilience of Death Guard, the close combat prowess of World Eaters, the wisdom of the "Half-Heard", etc. The rest is just superstitious hogwash which is used to explain most of the things in the Imperium.

After all, admitting that the ultimate weapon against the Ruinous Powers contains the gene-seed from Traitor Legions would be kinda HERESY! *BLAM!* The same reason why BLUD REHVENS (aka Thousand Son Loyalists Formerly Known As Corvidae) and Minotaurs (no, our gene-seed is certainly not from World Eaters but we won't tell from who it is from, nyaa!) have "mysterious" origins.

>> No.26842858

that's really retarded when you think about it

there whole reason they need Armageddon is because they need its production facilities so they killed all the people who run it

and what about Cadians they deal with choas shit dayil

So they want to cover up Chaos but that means noone knows what it looks like meaning when a cult is form no one can stop it until its too late

how the fuck does the Imperuim lasted for 10,000 years?

>> No.26842989

>Logic follows that it was a one-off creation

That may be true if he were creating another batch of Primarches, but he was just making more gene-seed based off of himself.

>Much more logical assumption is that Malcador rounded up suitable candidates ie. the eight original grandmasters including Garro, Loken, Qruze, Rubio, Varren, plus three others, because they each had valuable qualities besides being particularly Chaos-resistant.

The Marines had proven resistant but their gene-seed certainly hadn't.

>Splicing all this together into one would both save time and combine their individual strenghts:

How do you know that it would save time? You're not a gene-seed engineer methinks, I think it is more logical that starting from scratch would be a more efficient solution than trying to attain perfection through substandard parts. Besides, if you're going for a captain planet thing, each Primarch has been said to have a bit of the Emperor in them, so rather than just taking bits of 8 Marines, not even half of the Legions, why not just take direct from the source itself?

>> No.26843036

>So they want to cover up Chaos but that means noone knows what it looks like meaning when a cult is form no one can stop it until its too late

But there are people that do know, and it's safer if the plebian masses don't know they can gain power and immortality if they're desperate enough for it by playing with Chaos.

>> No.26843497

So your goal was to turn the shining example of the God-Emperor's finest warriors, living legends that defy human limits, into some puppet show?
Seriously, your whole lore thing here makes it sound like the Grey Knights are just normal Space Marines with fancier gadgets and lies circulated by the Inquisition because, "lol, myths keep the worthless masses happy."
>They are loyal descendants of the traitor legions
That sounds like bad wording, but why would the Inquisition tolerate a force that came from their greatest enemies?

>> No.26843584

Because when the Emperor's Sigilite, under His own orders, says that these dudes are alright then these dudes are alright.

And if the Cain books have taught us anything it is that the Imperial Propaganda department is at least up to the task.

And this fluff, for all its faults, is still notably better then the mary-sueish crap Matt Ward shat out.

>> No.26843625

>And this fluff, for all its faults, is still notably better then the mary-sueish crap Matt Ward shat out.

I disagree. This shit stinks. Bad.

>> No.26843636

And the Ward fluff didn't?

>> No.26843641
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bravo, op. I humbly suggest that this be accepted as official /tg/ cannon.

>> No.26843643

Not as bad a this.

>> No.26843657

I don't know what exactly is wrong with living heroes. Hell, every other faction has them. While I do agree the Ward fluff has a lot of contradictory points, it is still a better direction than smoke-and-mirrors puppet show Marines.

>> No.26843668

>Objectively better.

So, Ward paints them as a machine forged to fight a futile battle, with all the glamour of silver knights fighting for the Dawn... and OP does.... the exact same, but they specialised less.

Basically, he made Grey Knights regular space marines using outdated armor and equipment, and we're supposed to praise this?

>> No.26843680
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>> No.26843697

>All Ward Codexes.

What is the fluff in Daemons, the Fluff in Wood Elves and the fluff in Necrons?

Call him a Smurf fanboy all you want, he's the one who invented all the non smurf characters and actually made them useful.

>> No.26843709

>They disagree with me
>They can only be trolls
>No! Only a single troll!

>> No.26843723

then don't bump the thread.

>> No.26843784

Seriousl OP, stop samefagging your shitty fluff that's just Ward's fluff with less Knightly heroism countered by brash stupid actions.

>> No.26843872
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This thread. This whole thread.

>> No.26843906

If by "love it" you mean "OP samefags a whole lot" then sure.

>> No.26843911
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thanks for helping with the publicity for this post. As op I give you the official 4chan gold star of being a post-bumping-help-friend.

>I am curious how many people actually do support wArd.

>> No.26843961

So let me get this straight OP.

You basically took Wards fluff, and made it GRIMDARKER.

The Grey Knights are not a small brotherhood of Silver guardians of the Imperium, tasked with a grim task of fighting against the terrors of the warp.

Instead, they're.. a full legion's worth of regular marines who are made using the Emperor's geneseed ( retarded as fuck, why would the Emperor have geneseed ) and they use outdated models of equipment and armor?

So gone is the idea of the Noble Grand Master who strides forward, Mind and Blade shattering the hosts of Daemonspawn, then hanging his head with a heavy heart, if those who fought beside him need to be purged for the greater good of the Imperium.

Ward's fluff for them is not amazingly written, but it has an ideal behind it that was good.

Grey Knights are tradgeic figures, caught between their noble goal and noble rising, and their grim duty to work for thebig picture, all the while in each of their hearts, the uneasy truth that their goal is a fruitless one.

You basically want to take the fluff, reset it back to being "Dick space marines+"

I'm sorry, but thats terrible. The last thing we need is more grimderp from the 3E.

>> No.26843988
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I think you're OP in a devious attempt to raise publicity for your good idea. Your a clever one. a clever-clever one.

>> No.26844006

>Having a good idea

>> No.26844017

Ward might not be JRR tolkien, but he does the one thing that I think every codex writer should do.

He writes it so the armies, their backgrounds and their crunch. Are fun.

He let's you do many different things with the armies, and the fluff is filled with often strong, battles or even comedic moments or often dire moments of bad things that happened to the army.

Cruddace makes all the armies he likes super strong and broken, and all the ones he hates fucking terrible, neither really having any customisation or fun fluff.

Phil kelly is the exact same. And Vetock seems to be going down that road alot if you compared DA to Tau.

>> No.26844025

I do think its a good idea! but then again you keep bumping the thread.

>> No.26844039

Because the thread being bumped is a huge issue right?

Because wanting a discussion over OP and his hilarious Ward butthurtt isn't a just cause to bump the thread.

>> No.26844066

Difficult though it is for you to believe not all of us are the OP.

>> No.26844073

just learn to sage if your going to post every five minutes. sheesh.

>> No.26844090

Why? Saging doesn't count towards the post limit, thus edging the thread one step closer to death

>> No.26844106

Why do yoyu like OP's drivel of fluff then?

It's basically ward's fluff without the heroism and using old shitty versions of armor and weapons.

>> No.26844120

Why bother?

>> No.26844139
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true, but the magicfriends and the battle-techfriends get mad if there are more 40k threads than quest threads front page.

>> No.26844141

Don't forget puh-puh-puh-propaganda-a-a.

>> No.26844149

Who gives a shit about them?
Maybe they should learn to use the catalogue.

>> No.26844177
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>> No.26844189

Because its the Imperium/Humanity at its finest.

There are no heroes, no god-slayers and nothing to look up to.

So people create an image of one and have the masses believe it hard. They want them to be real so badly. They think they are real and if they can do it then maybe, in a small way, so can they.

It doesn't matter that their faith is based on utter bullshit, it doesn't matter the heroes name they scram as they berserk charge and eviscerate a deamon is a fabrication because they believe to them it is solid truth.

These are knights in grey not knights in white. They aren't heroes but they make them out of others.

>> No.26844196

whoops, meant this >>26844177
for you!

>> No.26844256

>These are knights in grey not knights in white.

Ward's Knights are hardly white knights, but they are also not just shitter knights.

>> No.26844269

Then why not simply do the clever thing and delete the post.

>> No.26844317

So basically, you like them because they're Super Grimdark and edgy bullshit? Good to know.

>> No.26844324

boy-howdy I didn't know I even could! jk I dont care if people see me fail - a bit. but what would a raging ward-fan such yourself know about admitting mistakes.

>> No.26844350

Hardly edgy.

It's hopeful.

Humanity can still make heroes to aspire to.

>> No.26844387

Yet the entire fucking premise is the contrary.

>No heroes, they are all lies, everyone is just a murderer! NO HEROES!

>> No.26844475

Speaking of Bad Asses that have been written out by GW. Ollanius Pius has been written out. Go read about him weard fans and manly tears will be shed.

>> No.26844505

OP, you've changed nothing about the actual GK chapter, other than using counts-as in the way you model them, and saying the characters are lies(which is retarded, why design a lie when no one is supposed to know they even exist). I'm surprised at how few people are acknowledging this.

>> No.26844550

>Ollanius Pius has been written out

No he's not. But I don't expect that you actually know his fluff past or present. Probably just read some shit on 1d4chan.

>> No.26844556

Ollanius Pius is in and has been in for a while. If you actually paid attention to the fluff instead of dismissing everything new as trash.

Also, he just took a bullet for the Emp during the fighting on Terra. It was always a terminator that stumbled into the fight with Horus.

>> No.26844557

Abnett was allowed to write him back in, but he had to make him super immortal.

>> No.26844570

No it fucking wasn't. it was a guardsmen you retarded fuck.

>> No.26844574

you say 'written out' he was never really expanded on, he's now just a perpetual.

>> No.26844617

No it wasn't.

the Original story says this

"Suddenly, the battering stops. Through his good eye the Emperor sees a solitary Terminator has entered the room. The marine charges towards the Warmaster, stormbolter blazing. Horus looks at him and laughs. For a moment he stands triumphant, allowing the marine to see what he has done to his Emperor.

The Emperor knows what is going to happen next, sees the gloating triumph on Horus' face. There is no trace of his friend left there. There is only a daemon driven by insane destructive fury.

Horus turns his burning gaze on the Terminator and the marine's flesh flakes away to reaveal his skeleton, then even that is gone, reduced to dust."

>> No.26844632

Isn't that the stupid shit they replaced Pious with?

And wasn't it a custodian?

>> No.26844716

Cite the source that said it was a guardsmen.

Protip: You can't, it never happened. Deal with it.

>> No.26844718

>Isn't that the stupid shit they replaced Pious with?

No, Pius was never there. He was written as taking an attack meant for the Emperor during an assualt on the Imperial palace.

>And wasn't it a custodian?

The Terminator would later be changed to a Custodian in another account. So if anyone is pissed about retcons it should be terminator fans.

>> No.26844783


>> No.26844795
File: 123 KB, 476x562, Ollanius_Pius.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


How about you read the ORIGINAL original story?

>> No.26844864

Yeah, see that story is different. No Vengeful Spirit, and no Horus destroying him on purpose. All that's the same is that Horus and the Emperor were there with a third guy. And even with all that it's only something Pius was supposed to have done, it's not actually presented as happening.

>> No.26844977

Nice, it says exactly what I said. Pius was never on the Vengeful Spirit.

>> No.26845026

It says he's real though.

>> No.26845036

It says Pius was human though, thats what you wanted.

>> No.26845052

So because it didn't include the entirety of Horus Heresy in the small piece reserved to describing the saint, fluff that wasn't even fully fleshed out yet, it does not count?

Horus and Emperor fought, dude stepped between, got killed by Horus. What ever was Horus' motivation for killing him doesn't matter, he stepped in, saved the Emperor, got venerated as a saint.

>> No.26845064

No, he wanted a source saying it was Guardsman rather than a Terminator.

>> No.26845091

I know he's real.

What I wanted was proof that he was the one that interfered with Horus and the Emperor's battle on the Vengeful Spirit. He wasn't. It was a terminator or one of the Custodes. He may have given his life for the Emperor, but there are many others who have done that.

>> No.26845109

The story is different.

- Happens during assualt on Terra
- Takes an attack meant for the Emperor

- Happens on a Space Ship
- Horus attacks him directly, he doesn't get between Horus' attack and the Emperor

The event is different.

>> No.26845143

Siege of the Imperial Palace contains the battle on the Vengeful Spirit, since it's what finally broke the siege.

And the new HH fluff hasn't gotten to that point yet.

If by "human" you mean "immortal who has lived since antiquity and destined to fuck Chaos and save the Emperor," then yes.

Seriously, Abnett can go fuck himself with his superhero obsession.

>> No.26845157
File: 19 KB, 176x240, Skub.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

well it goes to show how as 40k gets more and more fleshed out, the more skub there is to be had by all.

>> No.26845196

>Siege of the Imperial Palace contains the battle on the Vengeful Spirit

But it wasn't the siege in general, it was the assualt on the Imperial Palace, not the counter assualt on the Vengeful Spirit.

>> No.26845224

That's true. Signs point to Ol' Ol being there at the end now, but it wasn't the case before. If anything, changing the story to have him be there will be the retcon. Although if he happens to be wearing terminator armor, laughs will be had by all.

At this point we should just wait 'til the novels get to that point, since that will be the version that sticks.

>> No.26845268

Assault on the Imperial Palace. You know, the massive battle across the entire palace Horus could not touch from orbit. So he lured the Emperor to his ship, which ended up breaking the Chaos forces and end the battle and the assault. Nothing says the actual events happened in the palace, but that it happened during that event. While Emperor was aboard the Vengeful Spirit, the battle continued down below. It was part of the same battle.

And the piece does not say he just dove in slow motion, shouting "NOOOOOOOOOOOO!" and gets stabbed instead of the Emperor.

Is there another event during the battle where Horus and Emperor met and He was saved by someone? Because if there's not, it's the same event with merely one having more details thanks to the whole HH era getting fleshed out, along with writers going "fuck this shit, I'm doing it differently."

>> No.26845281

>since that will be the version that sticks.

I disagree, I already see an under current of rejection forming.

>> No.26845294

>wanting skub

>> No.26845355

>Assault on the Imperial Palace. You know, the massive battle across the entire palace Horus could not touch from orbit. So he lured the Emperor to his ship, which ended up breaking the Chaos forces and end the battle and the assault. Nothing says the actual events happened in the palace, but that it happened during that event. While Emperor was aboard the Vengeful Spirit, the battle continued down below. It was part of the same battle.

It says it happened in the assault on the palace, not the assault on the Vengeful Spirit. It wasn't the same.

>And the piece does not say he just dove in slow motion, shouting "NOOOOOOOOOOOO!" and gets stabbed instead of the Emperor.

But it does say he took an attack meant for the Emperor, which is not the case for the Terminator who took an attack meant for the Terminator.

>Is there another event during the battle where Horus and Emperor met and He was saved by someone?

There's the time with Pius and the time with the Terminator who later got retconned into a Custodian.

>> No.26845397

>Ward's fluff for them is not amazingly written, but it has an ideal behind it that was good.

It does when you think about it

>kaldor draigo
Pretty much sums up the Grey Knights in one person, super badass can do things no other can do but in the end its all for nothing, nothing he does to Chaos ever effects it for long, Burning Nurgle's garden? it just grows back in seconds, being able to walk the warp? Its because the Gods are just dicking with him, and yet he just keeps going.

>castellan crowe
Sums up the purity of the Grey Knights, he's the best cage for a demon that has god like powers and what does he do with it? He uses it as a normal sword and nothing the daemon does, even buffs people castellan is fighting can do to change his mind.

The Will of the Grey Knights they're so determin to fight chaos they come back form the dead as ghost

In other words what you expect form dudes who get their gene-seed form the Emperor

rather than OP's bullshit about them just some normal Space Marines and every cool shit is a lie which has no reason because only a few know the Grey Knights are even real

>> No.26845457

>that will be the version that sucks


Why couldn't they just let it be? Because making him into some superhero with a reality splitting knife (Didn't he use that to escape from Calth? So it's possible it's how he's getting aboard the Spirit.) just raises more questions than answers.

For one, if he just appears there, how does anyone know who he is? Here, at the climax of the battle, a random dude nobody on the loyalist side brought with them to the Spirit just charges in and saves the day. Even if they find tags on him, he's probably found to be the dude that went missing during the sacking of Calth, and being aboard a traitor vessel doesn't make him a prime example of sainthood.

People object to him with "Why would the Emperor bring mere humans with him?" Well, if he's a super human disguised as a guardsman, he'd still be a mere human in everyone's eyes. Even if they knew what he was, he'd still be no better than any other dude in fighting. If they knew he'd save the Emperor, why the fuck didn't they just do a better job at protecting the bastard instead?

Just have the Emperor take anyone he can find aboard the Spirit, even if they're not match for Horus, they can help draw attention to other parts of the ship and cause damage. Imperial Army dudes weren't petty conscripts, after all. Even if they'd die in droves, it's still extra guns. But no, lets be fair and only bring a small elite force that adheres to the point limit of the battle.

>> No.26845576

>It says it happened in the assault on the palace, not the assault on the Vengeful Spirit. It wasn't the same.

It's part of the same overall battle. The battle down at the palace didn't just stop. The attack on the Spirit was an attack that was part of the battle of the palace and of Terra.

>it does say he took an attack meant for the Emperor

It says, "given his life by interposing his body between Horus and the Emperor". Like coming between the two. Not "taking an attack meant for the Emperor."

>There's the time with Pius and the time with the Terminator who later got retconned into a Custodian.

So you admit that the ORIGINAL interposer was a guardsman? What ever they went with later, be it custodes or fistinators, the original person, the very first version of someone getting between Horus and the Emperor during the end of HH and saving the Emperor's life, was a guardsman.

>> No.26845884

The necron fluff is SHIT, SHIT, SHIT. Even the bland fluff from before with all the mary-sueishness of their masters was better than that tomb kings in space wankfest.

>> No.26845904

Stoip pretending to be me, you braindead shitbag. Reported for avaturding too.

>> No.26846466
File: 37 KB, 434x300, This is what Wood Elves love now.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

The only fluff that Ward added for WE I liked were Wood Elves liking Boku No Pico to the point of kidnapping delicious French shotas and having them as servants forever..

>> No.26846767

Nah, they just molest trees. Ever wondered where dryads come from? Ayup, delicious magical elf semen fertilizing innocent young supple trees.

>> No.26846824

Then did Ward add in Boku No Pico because he likes shotas?

>> No.26846986

I wouldn't put it past Ward to molest children IRL either.

>> No.26846994

care to explain how it was better?

Because we'll settle this right now.

They were not scary

They were not mysterious

They were fucking bland.

>> No.26847054

Does /tg/ like shotas?

>> No.26847651

Jack Harkness? Hell yeah!

>> No.26847999

Simple: it wasn't fucking Tomb Kings IN SPESS. I wonder why GW can't have natural story progression. Everything has to be fucking retcons.

Hey, it's an immortal. Gotta use some name.

>> No.26848179

Tomb Kings are better than Oldcrons though, since Oldcrons were just Tomb Kings but with no fun.

>> No.26848514

anything is better than Oldcrons

they were shitty Lovecraft knock offs with nothing to go with because in order to still be "Mysterious" you couldn't add new units

and no the C'tan were crap

the Nightbringer was just Khrone with no character and bullshit he instilled fear of death AND the Grim Reaper in every culture and race (minus orkz) fan fact a Dude in robes with a scythe = death is rather new

the Deceiver was a Laughing God/Tzeetch copy to a point were people think he's really one of them

the Void Dragon was the only cool one but even he was shoe horned into the fluff

>> No.26848658


No they can't they fuck themselves with Nids because if they play threw the "the hive fleets of just scouts" would fuck the glaxey

meaning they have to retcon them as leviathan being the main fleet

which would piss you off like the bitch you are

>> No.26849758

Ah, the old fashioned ad hominem, used only by people choking to death on humungous penises of African-American gentlemen.

>> No.26850771

Only when they get raped by Sisters/Daemonettes/Macha(though any elf will do)
Source all those lewdfic threads last week.

>> No.26854381

ITT: Shitposting in response to someone trying to be creative

I knew 40kids were trash but i didn't think you could be so buttdevastated to someone simply making his own fluff because he didn't like the mary-sueness of the last codex.

>> No.26854422
File: 49 KB, 491x636, 1350112536388.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>scroll through thread
>no pictures of said models

Yah, nah, yer a cunt.

>> No.26854493

thank you anon for correcting that faggot.

>> No.26855241

its not being creative, its removing the parts that make the Grey Knights stand out form other space marines for no reason

like why would they need to lie about shit? the only people who know about the Grey Knights are the Inquisition, chapter masters, high lord and all the top people

Does that mean the "not one Grey Knight as ever fallen to Chaos" also a lie?

nice rebuttal

>> No.26858836

Will happen later, once the complete faggots are back to sleep.

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