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26290403 No.26290403 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Hey /tg/, how about a thread with general tactics in WH40k? I mean simple stuff, like "You can never go wrong taking X against Y" and such and others comment on these. I'll start off, but mind I'm fairly *new*, so I may be wrong as all fuck.

"Remember to bring plasma guns on cheap troops if you anticipate facing Terminators"

>> No.26290439

always screen your squishy troops

>> No.26290477

There are three things you should never underestimate:
1. Your opponent
2. The power of cover saves
3. The ability of the dice to royally fuck up your entire army

>> No.26290665

>three things

Four: lolrandumb is not a game mechanic. It is an anti-strategy Easy button for lazy developers. Only include it in your games if ALL relevant parties agree.

>> No.26290698

Never bring Tau to a city map.

>> No.26291564
File: 29 KB, 278x225, Tyranid_Carnifex_1.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Don't fall for distraction carnifex... wait what?! LOOK! A CARNIFEX!! EVERYBODY SHOOT AT IT!!!

>> No.26291571

any good tips on how to deal with AV12 specifically?

>> No.26291622

Autocannons and anything with S7 or even S8. Rocket launchers are also ok.
Bear in mind that S7 will struggle against AV13.

>> No.26291927

No matter how small your army, always bring at least two different units (tanks or whatever) that can blow up AV: 14 stuff.
Because otherwise that IG player with 2 Leman Russes at 500 points will rape you.

>> No.26291976

>Be IG
>Use armour company
>Field shittons of Russes

>> No.26292003

AV12 is where you start being better off with lascannons than autocannons.

>> No.26292191

I beg to differ. S7 glances on a 5 and pens on a 6. Autocannon have 2 shots so 33% chance to pen and 33% to glance without factoring in BS.
They are also cheaper and more versatile - after you pop a bawks you can slaughter anything that hid inside. Not so much with LC.

>> No.26292353

S9 glances on a 3+ and Penetrates on a 4+, that's a 16% tp glance and a 50% to penetrate, so you get, on average, the same number of hits, but they're more likely to penetrate and get +1 on the damage chart, and I'd argue what versatility ACs have is offset by LCs superiority against TEQ, MEQ and monstrous creatures (one's with a 3+ or better anyway), however that's roaming into a different point, which is that a lascannon shot is more likely to take out something at AV 12 than 2 autocannon shots.

>> No.26292578

Da Boyz before Da Toyz

>> No.26292745

Any suggestions on how tau can possibly do that since broadsides got a horrible nerf?

>> No.26294254


Tau don't let you get cover saves.

>> No.26294333


>> No.26294419

They aren't the av14 killers they used to be.

>> No.26294814


Use some context the post you're replying to is replying to a post about killing AV14.

Your missilesides won't even glance AV14.

>> No.26295245

>tactics in 40k
>immediately starts talking about list-building
Intredasting. I mean, no doubt the way you build your list is important and all, but surely if you want simple, basic stuff you should talk about how to deploy your dudes, move your dudes, grab obejctives etc?

>> No.26295309

1. Deploy dudes
2. Move dudes
3. Take objectives
4. Have dudes burned to death by heldrake.

At least those are my ork tactics.

>> No.26295549

Sounds like you have the basics covered.

What do Orks do for AA, anyway? A shit-ton of Lootas?

>> No.26295573


You should have enough shootaz and lootaz to just blow Heldrakes out of the air with snapfire.

>> No.26295600
File: 651 KB, 638x359, Miniwargaming-58543360.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Hey /tg/
I havnt played 40k for 10 years up until this last Friday. I went to a hobby place that has open gaming and met some cool dudes.They had an extra army and played a few practice games with me to catch me up to speed.

Anyway, I cannot decide if I want to play Orks or Chaos Space marines. Money is no issue.

Any opinions? =)

>> No.26295620

Yeah. I only have 5 though. I would get more, but I hate the way they look.

>> No.26295726

Learning target priority is very important, and it's best illistrated by this video. Which exhibits what not to do. The space marine player makes a key mistake by trying to down the MC's and not shooting at the gaunts which he can easily hurt. He was also dumb by parking his crusader right in area terrain, not behind it and he was also dumb by keeping his sternguard in the crusader, not shooting specialist ammunition at the on coming wave.


>> No.26295739


Build them out of Boyz.

>> No.26295802

Uh... follow your heart.

Codex-wise, Chaos Marines got a new one at the beginning of this edition, but /tg/ doesn't generally seem to like it- it's got one super-powered unit in the Heldrake, but that makes everything else look bad by comparison. What I'm not sure about is whether everything else is -actually- bad, i.e. it's hard to make a good army without Heldrakes. Also you should bear in mind that there are now allies rules, so you can add Imperial Guard (as traitor guard) or Daemons to a CSM army if you want.

Orks have still got a 4th edition codex, so they're very limited right now, but that also means a new codex should be coming up soon.

>> No.26296258

I was thinking of doing that with the big shootas.

>> No.26296508

That doesnt even make sense in the context of warhammer.

Youre one of those /tg/ GW trolls that doesnt actually play warhammer arent you?

>> No.26296706

Not the same anon, but this is a 40k thread. Playing Warhammer isn't an entry requirement.

Also I assume that was about weird things like Warlords and mysterious objectives.

>> No.26296854

I would go orks cause dat playstyle. Chaos is nice if there are aspects of fluff you like and you actually play warhammer (not i must take helldrake because reasons). I'd chaos for berzerkers, thousand sons and noise marines, orks for a green tide. The second you buy a funit you have no interest in is when your doing it wrong.

>> No.26296879


Orks are just ghetto IG acting like retards.

Well-played ork lists aren't orky at all.

>> No.26297299

thats an insult to orks! They're much better at the bayonet charge than IG

>> No.26297376
File: 278 KB, 600x1318, 1365466997022.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I would actually like some advice
since shooting is pretty good now in 6th and I play orks I was thinking about making a super shooty ork list. I already have alot of stuff for orks such as a big squad of loota boyz and boom gun wagons. and I know orks are meant for right gud stomping, but assaulting is a bit of a bitch now. So I was wondering about the following for sum good dakka!...

1- boomgun looted wagon? or a bunch of big guns with zzap guns and loobas with a bunch of gun crew grotz?

2- is a group of 10-15 tankbustas worth it?

3- are deffkoptas worth it now?

4- is it worth taking a battlewagon with the killacannon now since theres alot of things that can kill it quick? such as all the people that play SM, IG, Tau with plasma, lascannon, rail guns and so on and so forth?

5- Is it a sound idea to take my 12 loota boyz and put them behind a aegis defence line with the autocannon and go to ground? may not be able to move much but they will have high cover save and just sit there and dakka all day every day!

>> No.26297623

Ork player here. I'll try to provide some of my own insight (use with caution)

1. i'd take a bunch of grot gun crews, but armed with the free kannon. They're super cheap and alot harder to hurt than the shitty AV11 of the looted wagon. Zzap guns are too unreliable (rolling a 7 average, so take lootas instead) and lobbas just don't do it for me.

2. Your primary anti-tank should be a deffrolla-armed battlewagon. Run that shit into tanks for d6 auto str10 hits. The tankbusta models are cool looking, though, I won't deny. But you'll be better off investing in battlewagons in the long run anyway.

3. full squad of deffkoptas with twin linked rokkets are GRRRRRREAT. Keep em out of melee, so unless you're facing copious amounts of armor (orks have a shit ton of anti armor opportunities) then don't bother with the buzzsaw

5. YYYYYYYYYYYUP. lootas are so great for the pric you pay for them. Since they've all got autocannons anyway, might as well give them the lascannon (if you're going to be taking a gun)

I've found that one of the most useful units I use is a trukk full of shoota boyz with a power klaw nob w/ bosspole. If you want to piss off your dreadnaught-loving opponent, give it a boarding ramp and hit it with drive-by klaw attacks. Laugh as he gets frustrated he cant hit back

Stop by here for good insight on what to expect. Not the best, but a great start

>> No.26298025
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wut about at big mek wif da shock attack gun?! Its right gud dakka but it has the chance ta killy it self or kill da otha boyz

>> No.26298270


Big Mek with KFF is the best HQ for Orks.

>> No.26298324

Go Kustom Force Field aaaaaaaaall the way

>> No.26298810

Warboss on bike is best Ork HQ.... KFF is just meh when coversaves are dime a dozen in 6th.

Not to mention Pathfinders just say "NOPE" to KFF.

>> No.26298849

kff mek is amazing when added to 5~battlewagons.
ork biker boss is also taken because he straight up murders everything.

>> No.26298923

With 6th, the game is much more objective oriented than in 5th, so make sure to have a solid troop count. My general rule of thumb is for every 500 points in your list, you should try to have one troop choice.

Light transports (rhinos, trucks, etc) generally die much quicker now due to Hull Points being a thing, and are prone to coughing up First Blood. Use some care when using them, as many consider them death traps this edition.

Your list doesn't have to be amazing against everything, but it should have at least some sort of response to some major threats (fliers, monsters, high AV mech). Not all armies have means of dealing with fliers yet, short of allies, so bear that in mind when picking your army.

Terminators and their ilk got a buff in melee with 6th, as power weapons no longer universally cut through all armor saves any more, and most power weapons that do cut through their 2+ drop the attacker's init down to 1, the same time your powerfists punch them in the face. While this may not let you win the fight for sure, at the very least it lets you exact some retribution before they die.

Challenges are a thing now. If your army includes squads with a champion/sergeant/important dude, you might want to give them a melee option that isn't a power fist of thunder hammer. Many a time I have seen a Hammer Justicar and Aspiring Fist Champion DKO each other because they both swung at init 1.

Flamers are somewhat better in this edition, as they get automatic overwatch hits with their Wall of Death. Also keep in mind that while most vehicles can't overwatch, often the dudes inside can. There will be times when an overwatch killing all of one dude makes the difference between your charge connecting or failing.

As more of a general thing, rather than something specific to this edition or even game, try to plan out what your general ideal deployment is. If you can nail down a plan and stick to it, it makes play go faster and smarter, generally.

>> No.26299128


Apples and oranges. KFF is the multiplier/librarian/ethereal HQ while biker is the beatstick/captain/XV8 HQ etc.

>> No.26299351

5+ just doesn't wow me. I'd rather have a t5 or T6 beast with a power klaw that makes nob bikers troops. Take a normal biker boss and then Wazdakka Gutsmek for extra fun.

But to each their own. I'm not a fan of shooty ork. BS2 kills it for me, epecially with a low volume of shots on our higher str and Ap weapons (lootas not included). Not to mention unreliable high str weapons (looking at you zzap and shok attack gun).

>> No.26299382

Honestly it can go either way, neither codex is really good as a whole, CSM have one broken unit the rest of their codex is terrible to meh. Orks should get a new codex around spring 2014, so they might get better, but just choose whichever you like more. I personally would go CSM, but that is because I have zero interest in playing Orks, they are fun to play against, it is simply that I do not have any interest in playing as them.

>> No.26299424

>Better at the bayonet charge than IG
>Implying anything can beat a blob of 50 guardsmen with 5 commissars an 5 sergeants all with power lances modeled to look like power bayonets

40 Str 4 AP 3 attacks on the charge, toss in a priest and they can reroll to hits, and if you are feeling very lulzy toss in 5 all with eviscerators.

IG, the army of extremes.

>> No.26299493


>> No.26299506


>> No.26299775

Any time you buy a basic "power weapon" now, it's stats are derived from what it is modeled as.

Sword is base Str, AP 3.
Axe is Str +1, AP 2, drops to init 1.
Maul is Str +2, AP 4.
Lance/spear is Str +1/AP 3 on the charge, base Str/AP 4 the rest of the time.

If you have a model that comes with two power weapons, you can model them with a mix so you can choose which mode of smashing to use. I run Death Cult Assassins with a Sword/Axe mix, so I can slice up most things at init 6, or drop down to init 1 to open up Terminators/Monsters/things that trump my init anyway.

>> No.26299781

+1 Str AP 3 on the charge, regular Str AP 4 the rest of the time. Not really good, but they let you model them as power bayonets. In all honesty power blobs are best off with power mauls, the low AP doesn't matter against Ork or Tyranid blobs allowing them to rip them apart, and the +2 strength can easily wound marines, terminators, bikers, or MCs.

>> No.26299816

>If you have a model that comes with two power weapons, you can model them with a mix so you can choose which mode of smashing to use. I run Death Cult Assassins with a Sword/Axe mix
I forgot about that. Well, there is a reason to have a pair of power weapons instead of one power weapon and a pistol.

>> No.26299835
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the BS2 is a problem yes.... but if you get alot of shoota boyz and lootz and big shootas you can vomit dice every time its your shooting phase

>> No.26300078

So that'd just be on the Sergeants then, having a lasgun with a bayonet on it?

>> No.26300100

You could model a commissar with a power bayonet.

>> No.26300185

>not manticores

It's like you don't want to be cheddar or something

>> No.26300230

Okay, but it's by giving them a lasgun with a bayonet and saying "power bayonet"?

Seems kinda like a sneaky git thing to do.

>> No.26300304

Not the same anon, but I don't see the problem. Paint it glowing blue or something to make it super-obvious.

>> No.26300321

>IG laughs at line of sight
>tau laughs at cover
>without LoS and cover movement is largely irrelevant
>movement = skill, the rest is just army composition and dice rolling
>implying theres any skill left in this game

>> No.26300330

This, or give the regular dudes chain bayonets so the power bayonets can stand out from the rank and file.

>> No.26300345

Only thing is, looking it up, they can't take Lasguns.

>> No.26300379

Cut off the barrel and glue on a bolt pistol, bam commissars with power bayonets.

>> No.26300439

>Bayonet pistols
That's... just stupid enough to fit right in to 40k! I like it!

>> No.26300479

But at that point it can't really be called a spear. It becomes spear-like with a rifle because of the reach.

>> No.26300800

You are misunderstanding me. Get a lasgun with a bayonet, cut off the gun barrel, cut off the grip of a bolt pistol, and glue it to the top of the lasgun.

>> No.26300909

Oh, cannibalize a lasgun and use the body to make a spear.

>> No.26301036

Yep, or you could make a power lance with a bolt pistol at the end. I think that is similar to what the old Grey Knights and Custodians did.

>> No.26301075

Well, now that sounds interesting. Sounds like the perfect thing for an arbites inspired guard army.

>> No.26301099

Yeah cause there is so much av14 in the meta right now, and its like the one thing tau can't instantkill.

>> No.26301193

Ally Dark Angels, toss in Azrael, toss into 50 man blob. Now make sure said blobplatoon is lead by Al'raheim. Add priests and Commissars as needed. Laugh as the 50+man blob outflanks with Azrael, with FURIOUS CHARGE, rerolls on the charge, and 50 4+ invul saves.

>> No.26301212


Which is why a lot of MEQ like BT and assault CSM are turning to Land Raiders since what have they got to lose. BT have lance immunity and both CSM and BT can throw 4 LR or more at you, and I guarantee you most Tau players are idiots so they're only going to have missilesides, maybe a single longstrike railhead, and zero fusion.

>> No.26301259


LRs are immune to Heldrakes too!

I think we know what we must do.

Autolose to Chaos Daemons

>> No.26301576

Haha wow. Is that even legal? Because if it is, I'd just love to see that on the tabletop. Would be glorious.

>> No.26302487

No, you need
>Primaris Psyker
>Al'Rahem or Creed
53 models, 57 wounds, fearless, outflanks, rerolls to hit in close combat, in order to shoot it you need to pass a morale test, and the whole unit gets a 4+ invulnerable save.

>> No.26304191

Don't play NIdzilla against dark eldar

>> No.26304271

Any advice on a starting Tyranid player?
I'm brand new to Warhammer in general.

>> No.26304394


2 Hive Tyrant with Wings, TL Devourers

1 Doom of Malan'tai

10-23 Termagants
1 Tervigon
10-23 Termagants
1 Tervigon

1 Carnifex with TL Devourers or Trygon Prime or Biovore
1 Carnifex with TL Devourers or Trygon Prime or Biovore
1 Carnifex with TL Devourers or Trygon Prime or Biovore

This is like the only good Tyranid list until they get an update to lessen their reliance on guns and monstrous creatures.

>> No.26304421

Anyone ever thought of using Nurglings as screening units? Seems like giving your Plaguebearers or Great Unclean Ones a 3+ cover save could be worth the points it takes to field them.

>> No.26305368

>your face when you encounter 3 fusion suits, a longstike railhead, a riptide and commander Onager Gauntlet

>> No.26306479

Anything Nurgle has a 2+ cover save in any kind of area terrain already. Spending points on "screening units" in 40k is only worth it if you play on empty tables all the time.

>> No.26306948

Bumping with advice for building competitive lists.

If you want an army that has a shot at winning tournaments in 6th, you should bring an army that can deal with most or all of the following:
>multiple monstrous creatures
>drop pods
>AV 14 spam
>infantry blobs

Bring lots of troops. Then bring Heavy and Fast before you even think about bringing Elites. Especially in tournament formats where Big Guns or Scouring come up more often, Elites are bloated points that could be more effectively spent on units that can at least score some of the time.

Design your list in such a way that you do not give up bonus points (First Blood, Slay The Warlord) easily. Games come down to those last three points more often than you think when players are evenly matched.

>> No.26307142

Mother of God...

>> No.26307154
File: 337 KB, 1024x768, FLASH-EST-GITZ!.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

OIE!!! /tg/...
Sooooooo FLASH GITZ! they have been known to be a non-competitive unit because they cost too much for what they are worth. but they can now ignore cover after the change on git findaz....thoughts?

>> No.26307162

Ork burnas are not to be underestimated. With a cheap looted wagon, your 15 burnas get disposable armor. As long as they have it, they can stack all 15 templates out of the same port, easily allowing 50+ hits if you can position well. And 50+ autohitting burna attacks is fucking devastating to everything that moves.

>> No.26307181

The only way flash gits are worth buying over lootas is if you take all their upgrades. Then the already expensive unit becomes super expensive. Just use fucking lootas.

>> No.26307260

I do use lootas and a crap ton too for right propa dakka! I was just wondering if anyone thought they still had a point to taking them. kinda wish they where better they look bad ass

>> No.26307363
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It should be noted with the FAQ to flamers that even with 50+ scorcha hits, squads can survive if not entirely within the range of the template. Flamers can only kill within their range now, and wounds above and beyond that are lost.

>> No.26307380

I take flash gitz when my eldar friend takes tons of jetbikes

Fuck your rerollable warlock jink save and the bike you rode in on

>> No.26307824
File: 900 KB, 1337x1528, 1350434270329.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

for csm are noise marines worth it or whats a good strategy for them? also is it worth giving a bunch of squads icon of excess for feel no pain so they can have that and the +1 initiative? Im doing an all slaanesh theme and I am not going all nurgal plague marine spam don't even suggest it! cause slaanesh marines get all the bitches

>> No.26307875

OH! also forgot to add... mutilators with mark of slaanesh? good plan great plan?

>> No.26308136
File: 1.66 MB, 1000x1181, Slaan-prince-02.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Noise Marines, especially when made into troops by Slaanesh Lords, are the bomb. Read up on the FAQ on them, you can take one Blast master at 5 man and two at 10 man now. Mutilators are kind of crap. If you're going hard core Slaanesh anyway, get some MoS Bikers and pair them with a lord on a Steed of Slaanesh and a burning brand. On turn 2 you show up where ever you want to (outflank with acute senses) and wreck shit. Throw some melta guns on the bikers and you're about ready to take all comers short of fliers. And if you're rocking Noise Marines as troops anyway, grab a MoS Sorcerer while you're at it to turn your noise weapons up to 11.

And don't forget to have an appropriately rocking Daemon Prince of Slaanesh model ready incase one of your dudes rocks out too hard and explodes into one. I run a Nurgle centeric list, and even I keep one on hand for my Noise Marines.

>> No.26309638

pretty sure mutilators are never a good plan...

>> No.26309801

apocalypse unit, when u take both - lords of black crusade and legionare warband - lords make all cult marines and chosen troops, and u need 2 elites for the warband. only usefuul in land rider with a character actually

>> No.26310160

Noise marines are amazing. Blastmasters kick ass, and sonic blasters are also nice. Doom sirens...well, they're nice stat-wise but I've never really had to use them, since I generally don't get close enough with my noise marines for that (since using sonic blasters/single freq blastmasters prevent charging and encourage not moving, sonic blasters don't have rapid fire, and I have raptors/bikers for getting close and such).

>> No.26310180


You realise that in apoc making a unit troops is basically useless, right? Elites or troops, they still score fine.

>> No.26310733

You can do that, but at the same time every army's Troops are different. Space Marines are going to find that more difficult than say Eldar, Tau, IG, and even Chaos.

It depends on the durability and cost of the Troops. 1 Troop choice for every 500 pts is not a bad rule of thumb, but making sure list builders are aware that not every Troop is the same becomes imperative.

>> No.26311097

what if they are used as a very hard to kill distraction for your enemy?

>> No.26311400

Then you would probably be better served by Oblits, as they will likely kill something in the turns they are there, as opposed to the Mutilators which need to contact in melee to do anything, and have no option to run on turns they are unlikely to charge.

This is true, though it should be noted that in the case of Space Marines, and loyalist chapters in general, they have the option of Combat Squads. Thus, you can break up a big squad if you are looking at 4+ objectives, or keep them together if it is kill points or some such.

>> No.26311441

I see we are talking about chaos units. so fuck it! I will bump! what do you guys think is better? a forgefiend or a chaos vindicator? trying to find a good anti tank chaos unit

>> No.26311574

Heldrakes' Vector Strike works wonders for low to medium AV tanks, and it doubles as a rape machine.

For AV 13-14 you might want to take some autobots, because they are fast as fuck

>> No.26312045

A Chaos Predator Annihilator behind an Aegis Line is rather crazy.

>> No.26312373

I heard alot about how awesome they are and I was gona get one. but if you had to chose between the forgefiend or a chaos vindicator witch would you take or neither at all?

ya sure? would it get a good cover save being a large target behind a wall meant for foot troops?

>> No.26312379


The only AT you need is Heldrakes. For Land Raiders just use melta or melta bombs somewhere. All the armies that can take a LR will be utterly fucked by triple drakes anyway.

>> No.26312556

Vehicles only need 25% cover to qualify. On the rhino chassis, that maths out to just above where the bottom hull kicks in. Heck, if you have a Land Raider nosed right up to it, it qualifies for the save. Just be mindful of your side arcs.

>> No.26312589
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pic related

>> No.26315362
File: 44 KB, 1280x720, maxresdefault.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>Combat Squads and Space Marines

A very good point. Just have to make sure you have enough bodies in the first place. 20 Power Armour bodies is not enough for boots on the ground.

>> No.26317695


More like anything more than 1 power armored body is too much with Heldrakes flying around.

>> No.26317895


Chaos isn't bad, Depending on which flavor you they can be incredibly tough and deadly. I've been Current favorite army type is Plagues/cultists with deep striking Oblits.

And let me say this, anyone who says that the whole book is shit is talking out of there ass. There are still "dud" units, but even those could potentially find a place in some armies.

Like Oblits, people are all the time talking about how their over priced and they can't use the same weapon in a row or they are vulnerable to every type of fire, but there is no feeling more satisfying then pulling off the perfect Oblit drop and roasting 20 Guardsman. They are not meant to sit in a ruin and go BANG once a turn, your suppose to deepstrike them were they can cause the most damage, kill the target you sent them after, and then wreck havoc (The lighter armoured races will lose a unit a turn to these fuckers). If you want a static dakka splooge take Havoks

>> No.26317986

Speaking as a necron player?

Aim for the ghost ark first. The giant blob of Warriors is my equivalent of a distraction carnifex, and while I have the ark you're never going to take them down.

>> No.26318057
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People are just fixated, for some reason, that CSM should be super generalists like SM. They aren't, they need a goal and a focus. Once you have those two things, they work fine.

And I agree, Oblits are great, especially the Nurgle marked kind. I like deep striking in two or three with Typhus to act as a body guard for him, or alternately have him tank shots with his 2+/5++/5+++. I often find that when that squad enters the field, death just radiates out from them. I also find it a great time to blast other squads across the field, because distractions oblits.

>> No.26318248

Im running chaos/IG for a traitor guard set with 2 squads of 6 plague marines in rhinos, and 45 IG in a foot blob, is that enough?

>> No.26318656

Just starting out using DA, what units should I get, and what strategies work well?

>> No.26319053

>not running 7 man plague marines
Depends on how you want to play. For Deathwing, it's terminators galore; take Belial and deep strike. For Ravenwing it's Sammael and bikes. Black knights bring rape in rad grenades and plasma talons. Greenwing is MEQ mode. Take librarians, the standard of devastation and gunline everything. Hybridwing with Azrael is possible too. The flyers are meh

>> No.26319658


>Olits are awsome
>CSM are not generalists


>> No.26320475

Oblits are totally awesome, especially when they punch Kharn in the face so hard he just dies.

>> No.26320634

>And let me say this, anyone who says that the whole book is shit is talking out of there ass.
This 100%. Chaos has a lot of nasty units for good prices, termies, CSM with marks, maulerfiend,and bikes are all nasty and cheap. Raptors arent half bad ether, considering what they are for the cost.

>> No.26321596

>good prices




>> No.26323601
File: 32 KB, 250x250, Crunk.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Chaos has a lot of nasty units for good prices


If, by 'lot,' you mean 'one.'

And if, by 'one,' you mean the Baledrake. The Drake that makes any other FA choice overcosted by definition, when our Heavies are marginally effective at best - i.e. Havoks or nothing - and our Elites are a bad joke we can only laugh at in Apocalypse games, and only 1 or 2 HQs aren't utterly heinous (Jugger Lord actually aspires to adequacy) and our Troops are all outshone by their cheaper Imperial analogues because the whole dex is caustically mediocre by dint of having been written by Phil Kelly for the purpose of amusing Phil Kelly.


>> No.26324321


Yeah you can always tell who is either bad, doesn't know the average point per unit these days, or just plain is deluded by their opinion on CSM minus the Heldrake. Without the Heldrake CSM is bad. Not super bad, but not "good" like the other books that don't rely on a single unit as a crutch.

CSM units are either "good" but slightly overpriced, or not as good as they should be considering their price.

CSM's strong point is NOT value per point.

>> No.26328838

bump for interest

>> No.26329248

If there's something you can't kill, don't shoot at it.

It sounds really obvious, but when there's some big tough guy killing models, you're probably going to get scared and shoot at it. You're better off ignoring it if you don't have the means, and work on the objective. If the enemy is fielding 3 riptides and you only have the means to kill one of them, kill one and have all your other models ignore the riptides, instead killing his troops.

>> No.26329563

What if they are fielding 5 riptides?

>> No.26330029

Obviously if they are fielding 5 riptides it is time for sniper or poison spam, or better yet Deathmarks.

I will admit the helturkey does do a lot to skew point perceptions in that book, but it's presence doesn't automaticly make all other choices in the book bad, especially given that not everyone is going to run triple/double dragon. Bikers are solid with either MoN (T6/3+/5++) or MoS (outflank with a lord, surprise melta buttsex). I have even seen some efficacy locally with, of all things, MoN Spawn Spam, where you toss around max sized Spawn squads backed by a Sorcerer casting Invis on them. It's actually kind of scary.

There are also more good HS options than just Havocs, though they are super versatile. Oblits have been nothing but good to me. Preds are affordable, even in the full out Predator Annihilator load out (140 ain't bad for AV 13 and 3 Las Cannons). Maulerfiends have a tendency to scare the shit out of whom ever I field them against, thus bringing the need to field them in pairs given the amount of turn one shooting they draw. Mind the fact that they are much cheaper than a distraction-fex, are fast, and come with a 5++. Given that you know just how much hate those two Fiends will accrue, use that time to advance the rest of your army across the field.

On troops, zombies are great at 4 points a head with FNP and Fearless. Why are you hating on Zombies? Kind of wish they had infiltrate, though. Plague Marines and Noise Marines are great as troops, and taking an appropriately marked lord isn't really that big of deal.

>> No.26330647

If you're playing CSM and not trying hard to get into melee, you're missing the point of the codex.

>> No.26330802

its always time for deathmarks

>> No.26330913

How does having MoN on Bikers give them 5++?

>> No.26330916

I do like me some Deathmarks. I took a break from them for a bit, but now they're finding their way back into my lists with attached Despair Tech and Overlord with Gauntlet of Fire.

>> No.26330930

A punch in the face

>> No.26331463

Considering I have pre-heresy Dark Angels already I may very well end up fielding such a formation. I'm thinking Dark Angels with allied Imperial Army, the DA have Azrael (or some count as), some bikers, and some black knights, the Imperial Army is a Primaris Psyker, a platoon lead by Al'Rahem with 5 infantry squads, and a priest (I'll model it to be some remembrancer or something, maybe a poet). Bikers take what they can while the blob trudges towards the mid field objective, grinding all in its path to dust. For extra lulz I'll give all of the sergeants power mauls for 15 str 5 AP 4 attacks on the charge.

>> No.26331487

It doesn't. The 5++ is the jink save conferred by the bike.

>> No.26331716
File: 117 KB, 500x400, tut13_tyranid_13.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

As cool as it is talking about Orks and Chaos, does anyone have any solid advice for working with 'Nids? I'm starting out, and so far I've worked out that I should spend all my hard-earned money on Flyrants, Tervigons, and Hive Guard. Any advice?

>> No.26332107
File: 2.17 MB, 2448x3264, 20130725_155823.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Bumping with my Tyranid work

>> No.26332135

Got bad news for you Op, there isn't much in the way of tactics, its a list builders game now son.

>> No.26332324
File: 2.06 MB, 3264x2448, 20130730_121930.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Fluffwise, I'd like to play a swarm; the kind of army where the foe just doesn't have enough bullets to make a proper dent on my list. So far, I only really have about 30 gants, but I'm working on it.

>> No.26332614

The big issue is that ig, tau, chaos, and necrons all have the ability to go 'loltictacs' courtesy of the way bombardment, markerlights, baledrakes, and night scythes respectively make mockeries of positioning and cover.

if you're not facing them, there's still some strategy in terms of maneuvering to minimize the impact of the enemy's shooting phase.

>> No.26332745

>that feel when you don't play bombardment Ig and like using uparmored calvery chimeras.

>that feel when the WAAC kid and netlist kid say you have a shitty army for the fact you like smaller scale non cheese lists. Or you refuse to fire a fucking heavy weapon out of a hatch because how the fuck?

seriously, I know we've got firepoint but goddamn it GW limit it to fucking lasrifles so it makes some goddamn sense with it being enclosed.

>> No.26332965

These look great. Maybe put some devlan mud/umber shade on the brownish skin, or whatever that shit is?

>> No.26333033

Thanks! I'm going for a clean bone-ivory sort of look, and layer up from a fleshtone washed with sepia.

>> No.26333717

Yeah the Chimera was poorly executed in that regard. I would say it should have been something like this.
>Regular armament, heavy bolter or flamer, and a multi-laser, heavy bolter, flamer, or whatever for the turret
>The lasguns can be fired by passengers, counting as regular vehicle weapons, but may only be fired if there are enough passengers to fire them (so if you have three passengers you can only fire 3 lasguns).
>The top hatch can be opened allowing 3 models to shoot from the top with heavy weapon teams counting as two models (I can see them fitting an autocannon albeit with great difficulty, I cannot see an autocannon team, 3 special weapon guys, and the sergeant all shooting out of that tiny hatch at once).
>If the top hatch is opened the vehicle counts as open topped ONLY for the purpose of rolling on the damage chart (a grenade can land in there, but the entire squad isn't crawling out of that tiny hatch as one group).

At least then mech Guard would need better tactics than camp in a chimera shooting heavy and special weapons,exit at the last second to claim objectives. Maybe let storm troopers replace the chimera lasguns with hot-shot lasguns, could make them somewhat more useful in comparison to other choices then.

>> No.26334516
File: 10 KB, 500x400, tyranid_gaunts_adrenal_gland_large.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Come to think of it, is wysiwyg very important on nids? Is it cool in tournaments to have adrenal glads on my gaunts without modelling the stupid-looking sacs on their backs?

>> No.26334581

> 40k

> tactics

checkers is a more interesting game

>> No.26334754

agreed, Or make it so you can fire from the back hatch or something like that, I'm not a very finicky guy but goddamn it I like my games to have at least a little logic when put together. That being said I'd kill for pintle mounts to be able to snapfire charging units nothing like sitting there with my thumb up my ass as fucking nids hump a tank to death.

>> No.26335438
File: 46 KB, 750x600, Tyranids4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

My #1 rule, Rule of cool. Who wants to play an army that looks stupid....like Tau.

My #2 rule, Shoot the Close Combaty, Close Combat the Shooty.

What this guy said minus the Carnifexs, huge point sink. Always ask yourself, Did I add enough Gaunts? .....I bet you didn't.

get in with the boyz.


>> No.26336219

>Implying Tau aren't God Tier looking army, alongside CSM and DE

>> No.26336255

>My #2 rule, Shoot the Close Combaty, Close Combat the Shooty.
Thoughts on overwatch?

>> No.26336575
File: 65 KB, 640x512, 40kImperialGuard02.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Any advice for a starting guard player?

>> No.26336635

Have money. Buy tanks and dudes.

>> No.26336698

expect to sink a lot of money into vehicles. And to lose to tau...constantly.

>> No.26336756

Please dont put shit tier armies like DE and tau near god tier CSM please, the HIV might spread.

Thank you

>> No.26336792

Thanks for the help I shall start saving up for a couple of russ's and a vendetta.

>> No.26336804



>> No.26338096


IG shouldn't lose to Tau more than 50% of the time with a good TAC list.

>> No.26339214
File: 15 KB, 480x360, hqdefault.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

you'll make it, hits on 6s.

>> No.26339482

Zombies don't do anything. They are a unit that is completely and totally useless unless an opponent is dumb enough to run themselves at them

>> No.26339497

You know how I know that you've

a) Never played the chaos codex
b) are probably bad at 40k

>> No.26339568


CSM does have a viable assault list with Kharn and Abaddon and Land Raiders. It's just not as good as Daemons. Actually I don't know if it's viable anymore now that Eldar got an update.

>> No.26339599

If by "viable" you mean "technically possible but a terrible use of points across the board"

Sure. Its viable

>> No.26339651

Greetings, elegan/tg/ents! I intend to start 40K as soon as I can piece together enough money to do so! Which army is better for a man just starting, Orks or Blood Angels? Which performs better, which costs less money, which does better against Tau, and which does better against Nids?

>> No.26339838







>> No.26341003

They don't have to do any thing, they just have to sit on a back field objective and not die, and for that, they are remarkably cheap and good at what they do. The rest of your army can worry about mid field objectives as well as the ones in your deployment zone. I have sat a blob of 21 zombies on objectives in tournaments before, and they weather things quite well. If big guns get turned on them, then those are big guns not pointed at things that actually cost me a lot of points.

>> No.26342498

>CSM are better at melee than SM with worse shooting options
>don't use melee
Just play loyalists retard. inb4 MUH HELLDRAKES

>> No.26342597



>> No.26342682

When doing objectives, never EVER underestimate jump infantry or deep strikers. They can not only take objectives, but keep the enemy from taking them just by being nearby.

Flamers vs hordes is good, pieplates vs hordes is better.

Never half/half a unit. Make them dedicated to a single purpose.

>> No.26342695

So for any daemon players (nurgle specifically) whats the best all-purpose upgrade for plague drones?

>> No.26342758


>> No.26343521


>> No.26343585



>> No.26343595

20 zerkers + abby and kharn in a spartan would like to say hi

>> No.26343957

Orks are rumored to get an update in October.

>> No.26344376


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