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[ERROR] No.26110109 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

>Start thread
>go to sleep
>wake up to old thread at 300+ posts
>start new thread

Links:
Old thread >>26097121
Forums: opaque.freeforums.net
Site: opaquegames.com
System: dropbox.com/sh/mf9ihoh4kb2c2m6/BaZngRkqAl

This thread I want to talk about dinosaurs and ancient megafauna as well as the wider Song theme.
What iconic dinosaurs and prehistoric critters would you like to fight and/or ride?

>> No.26110139

>>26110109
It's been so long since I went through my critters folder, I don't even know what these pictures are anymore.
They look prehistoric, so I'm posting them.

>> No.26110159

>>26110109
...it is damn weird that the ending theme to Zyuden Sentai Kyoryuger popped up on my playlist shuffle as soon as I saw what you'd titled this iteration.

>> No.26110160

>>26110109
>What iconic dinosaurs and prehistoric critters
>prehistoric critters
Mastodon!

>> No.26110194

>>26110139

>> No.26110249

Playing warband, was knocked unconciouss. Anyone got the name of the mod where the dudes keep fighting without me?

>> No.26110263

>>26110194
My issue is I have no scale for these things.
Ideally I can have a list of critters "about wolf sized", "about horse sized", "about elephant sized" and "bigger than that"
Categories are my fetish.

>> No.26110269

I'm seriously looking forward to supplements on the Age of Sail and other bits on the late 17th to early 19th century. No armor unless you're a cuirassier, otherwise you just get a flashy uniform, a cool hat, a big-ass musket and a bayonet to go murder stuff with alongside a thousand of your buddies. Maybe you'll also have a sword, too.

>> No.26110276

>>26110249
it's called learn to suck less so that doesn't happen to you

>> No.26110279

you have a picture about huge prehistoric carnivores?

>> No.26110298

So, I need to convey to my players that their actions have drawn the attention of a much more dangerous group of enemies than the landswehr they've been kicking around for the last two sessions.

What's the sort of thing that, in this kind of game, if you saw mook level enemies doing or wearing it, would make you fear engaging them even on even terms? What signs can I show that these guys are NOT to be taken lightly, that they're here to kill the players and that they'll fucking do it if they face them in anything resembling a fair fight?

>> No.26110302

>>26110279
Sadly no. I've only really been collecting fantasy and niche pictures, since I'm reasonably sure I can convey the well-known examples with words alone.
"You see a saber-toothed lion"
"There is a huge, hairy elephant"
"Tyrannosaurus Rex"

>> No.26110314

>>26110269
I want this, and I want there to be a section on that era's battlefield surgery. And I want Rome to write it applying all his grisly wound and infection fetishism to it.

>> No.26110321

>>26110279
Sure.

>> No.26110325

>>26110298
Full plate, firearms or other powerful ranged weapons, no-bullshit murder tactics.

>> No.26110329

>>26110321
these are those asshole pigs, right?

>> No.26110339

>>26110329
Yup.

>> No.26110340

>>26110329
Yep, entelodonts.

Hilariously their closest living relations aren't pigs, but WHALES.

>> No.26110348

>>26110298
Organised units with consistent uniform.
General professionalism.
Huge numerical advantage.
Guns, guns are terrifying in this game. If the mere knowledge of guns doesn't make them consider their funeral arrangements point out the stat lines.

>> No.26110350

>>26110298
Hm, I thought, that in RoS/SoS fighting even mooks at 1:3 was dangerous.

>> No.26110358

>>26110263
Oh, I have some megafauna size thingies.

>> No.26110363

>>26110339
Rolled high on the anal circumference table.

Pic is the dream, being the one responsible for that skull.

>> No.26110367

>>26110298
Special uniform or warcry. Btw, is it a fleshlight on top of this hat?

>> No.26110369

>>26110298
Banners, good armors, lances, obvious hints that there are more of them then meets the eye.

>> No.26110371

>>26110350
There really are no true "mooks" in this game. If it's capable of using a weapon with any degree of competence, it's more than likely a meaningful threat to you.

>> No.26110381

>>26110358
You. You're awesome.

>> No.26110390

>>26110298
A bunch of guys with scary uniforms (high necked black coats seem to intimidate the shit out of people for some reason) and a really professional, seasoned attitude towards their work, that goes far enough.

Then add muskets, and just make them fight smart. That's the scariest thing possible in this game.

>> No.26110433

>>26110298
I empathize with this question, but for different reasons. I'm planning on running a campaign in which the players are members of the city watch of a brutal, dystopian industrial society, and I'm trying to convey to them that espirit de corps that makes them view everyone else, including the people they're supposed to be protecting, as less than human.

Then I'll see how far I can make them go towards abusing the shit out of their power, until finally they're faced with rioting people who go too far and hurt someone with a thrown bottle or cobblestone.
As my players are massive moralfags, I'm looking forward into trying to bait them into slaughtering a crowd full of hungry, scared people. If I fail, I'll know that I've genuinely got a group of Paladins here.

>> No.26110452

>>26110433
I love you.

>> No.26110464

Uniforms, war cries, professionalism, guns. Roger that.

>btw about the image, it's a crest. He's one of the deaths head hussars.

>> No.26110466

>>26110433
>As my players are massive moralfags

Stopped reading there.

>> No.26110471

>>26110433
You sound like John Wick. I don't like you.

>> No.26110474

>>26110160
Pterodactyl!

>> No.26110484

>mook enemies in Riddle of Steel or Song of Swords being a thing
You're doing it wrong.

>> No.26110509

>>26110298
Intelligent duelists who parade the fact they've killed their way to the top and don't give a shit. The crazy strong Austrian Zweihander, the agile sword and shield Spaniard, the best Welsh archer in the land, an Albanian Stradiot whose killed since childhood in a half dozen wars, a French knight in plate with a polearm, an English brawler, a Polish Hussar, a Swiss Merc with a Lucerne hammer, the Genoese Crossbowmen, the Turkish gunner, The Arab cut throat, the Norwegian Ax man.

There's some ways to do evil, uniformed elite or a group of specialists. I think your group will find the above an awe inspiring challenge. If you give this many distinct fighting styles and personalities your players will remember it much more than just another scary army. Each enemy is a new and different threat and them each being unique will be felt and responded to more personally by you and the group. Your PC Polearms expert just killed their Austrian? Well the league of Extraordinary Enlightenment Fellows will not appreciate that and the Frenchman might demand a duel or the cutthroat try to seek vengeance.

Hell I'd start by making them an offer to join the EEF as basically shit mooks just to try to piss of the players and fold them into provocation of one of them. Once they've killed a valued member then its basically a long hunt where your PCs try to kill off the best warriors in the world before they kill them.

>> No.26110515

>>26110452
I was actually asking earlier about city names for the fantasy setting. The group prefers fantasy, so if I can do this in the core setting it'd tickle their fancies a bit better. Slavic Fantasy Britain in particular sounds good because having that many ethnicities crammed into one country would make it a massive boiling pot of cultural pressure, and you'd probably end up with a major Black and Tans effect, with the Slavs using the English to oppress the Irish, the Irish to oppress the Welsh, the Welsh to oppress the Scotts, and the Scotts to oppress the English. And then oppressing all of them equally themselves.

Somewhere we'll work elves and dwarves into that, hopefully it'll be a mostly human show though.

>>26110466
Good thing I said it at the end, then. I was joking mate, joking!

>>26110471
I don't know who that is. Did someone do this already?

>> No.26110540

>>26110515
Just google his name. Any time I see something here that I don't recognize, I look for it on search or on wiki instead of asking about it.

>> No.26110546

Dunkleosteus!

>> No.26110554

>>26110484
Agree. Shield walls, mixed arms, archers, ambushes. There a lot of ways to make regular soldiers a formidable threat to players.

>>26110515
>I don't know who that is. Did someone do this already?
Yes. He made "7th Sea" and L5R and thinks, that good GM makes players suffer for every tiny mistake they made. Read about his idea of mastermind millionaire controlling superheroes.
John Wick is a sadist with long greasy hair.

>> No.26110579

>>26110263
cynognathus is about the size of a capybara. everything else on that page appears to be scaled accordingly.

>> No.26110583

>>26110363
Thats cool.
Also I love fauna and monsters in general, so I have a good supplie of them.
I will post a few more.
The biggest mammals ever for example.

>> No.26110593

>>26110540
I got a name, but I didn't want to seem pretentious by pretending that I actually knew who he was, or what he had done.

>>26110554
Putting your players in positions of power to see if they'll abuse them, and then increasing the stakes to see if they will eventually cross a moral threshold into genuinely atrocious behavior, is not the same as maliciously punishing them for making benign choices.

I view this more as the Stanford Prisoner Experiment, except in RPG form. I hope I didn't imply that they would be punished for using the Ring of Gyges. The whole point of the ring is that you can't be punished for it.

>> No.26110596

>>26110583
And of course, birds!

>> No.26110629

>>26110596
Excuse a little stupidity but is the 50 cm referring to the guys width?

>> No.26110633

>>26110593
My players Arcs are:

Gain Fortune
Bitches(PC 2 - Hoes)
Matching Bear capes
Bitches and Hoes

I have no delusions that they're not terrible people.

>> No.26110634

>>26110596
Fuck, nature was scary.

>> No.26110639

>>26110629
the length of the line, more like

>> No.26110641

>>26110634
>Giant Turtle

That is the cutest fucking thing.

>> No.26110667

>>26110639
Fair point, where they've placed it looks liek the height, thought it was weird haha. Also Dunkleosteus!

>> No.26110688

>>26110634
Now dinosaurs.

>> No.26110692

>>26110641

turtles are fucking metal

>> No.26110701

>>26110692
w-what am I looking at?

>> No.26110709

>>26110688
What's that large Pachycephalosaur in the middle of the image? I wasn't aware and species got that large.

>> No.26110718

>>26110339
SEE THIS

THIS IS AN ENTELODON

IT'S A PIG THE SIZE OF A FUCKING RHINOCEROS

KNOW WHAT IT LIKES TO DO?

EAT ANYTHING THAT PISSES IT OFF

KNOW WHAT PISSES IT OFF?

EVERYTHING

>> No.26110722

>>26110688
I wish I was a dinosaur...also just imagine if one of those bigger ones was a race that became sentient and we bump into them in space. How rad would that be?

>> No.26110725

>>26110593
>I view this more as the Stanford Prisoner Experiment, except in RPG form.
Are you his lost twin brother?

>> No.26110728

>>26110701
Inside of a Leatherback Turtles mouth I think, horrible looking things.

>> No.26110733

>>26110701

the mouth of a leatherback turtle.

>> No.26110741

>>26110725
Christ, I never heard of the guy until now.

>> No.26110747

>>26110433
In terms of actually helping you, here's some advice. In addition to merely dressing them the same and giving them an "elite" feel, give your players context for why they're "right" in any given situation. Let them know the big picture that the public is unaware of (even if it's actually just an opinion supported by authority to create this effect) that justifies all of their actions.

They have the moral highground, because of course, they and their leaders know better than the weak, licentious common man, who just doesn't /understand/ why they need jackbooted guards searching their homes in the middle of the night.

Be sure to stress that they are also resented despite their sacrifices. Have people call them names, generally not be thankful except in a pathetic, mewling way when they are actively being saved from some threat. If you can drag racial elements into it, do so.

If you can inspire personal loyalty in the men to their officers, or even to political figures. Give them a queen who is amazingly beautiful and regal, and notices one of the players personally early on. Make their Captain a likable cool old guy, who gets them out of trouble when they make a mistake, and backs them up when they run into resistance.

Make them feel as though the world is against them, but give them a lifeline, someone willing to support them whatever the cost, who just happens to be Hitler.

>> No.26110782

>>26110709
Searching a bit, I don't find any Pachycephalosaurus so big either. An error of the guy then.
>>26110718
Fucking proto-hippos man.
>>26110641
Until the fucker tries to eat you...

>> No.26110799

>>26110747
Well. That's dark.

>> No.26110839

Andrewsarchus.

Not much is known about it, but it is possibly the largest mammalian land predator that ever existed.

>> No.26110849

>>26110263
i can make some size comparison pics pretty quickly, but i'm at work right now and i need photoshop for that, so you'll have to wait like 4-5 hours.
So, like, maybe if this thread is still alive in 5 hours i'll make some.

>> No.26110868

>>26110839
The biggest and meanest goat ever.

>> No.26110874

>>26110839
also, it looks like a thylacine with the downs.

>> No.26110877

>>26110747
I think you're underestimating the natural PC tendency to thwart authority regardless of whom it favors.

>> No.26110882

>>26110868

Yep, it takes a farmer with huge balls to manage a herd of those.

>> No.26110915

Bleh, I can't wait to see the next beta

>> No.26110930

>>26110915
10-12 more days they said.

>> No.26110942

>>26110930
That's far too long to sit with so many half-done rules.

>> No.26110984

>>26110942
Better a few extra days than another Beta full of holes.

>> No.26110999

>>26110722
Man, those fucking things in space? Imagine the size of the fucking space-ships.

>> No.26111023

>>26110930
What, when, where?

>> No.26111046

>>26110999
> A long time ago the people of ancient lizards left for the stars, their technology advancing, until one day we saw them again, the dreadful space lords. The creatures no longer travelled by ships, indeed for they were now ships themselves, their colossal frames dwarfed by their new mechanical exoskeletons.

>> No.26111047

>>26110263
what the fuck am I looking at here?

>> No.26111058

>>26111047
Two hominids each riding a larger hominid in a duel to the death.

>> No.26111073

>>26110692
A turtle vagina

>> No.26111074

>>26110509
Do you mind if I steal your idea?
Because I'm stealing your idea

>> No.26111076

So I've been cooking up a system for languages for SoS since there are dozens in use at this point (and because my players insisted on both being Russians)

Ok so it's gonna go something like this; for every month the player is immersed in a foreign language they take an intelligence test(-2 TN if the Languages are incredibly similar Dutch-German, Portuguese-Spanish for example, +2 if the language is far removed from anything they know Arab-Welsh Basque-Anything). If they pass they raise their comprehension a bit. The levels are

Broken - You've spent a fair bit of time hearing this foreign tongue to the point certain words stick out. The most rudimentary sentences can be formed with effort and your accent makes you a chore to decipher. Perception Check for those you're speaking with to understand anything more complex than "Sword" or "We go there". Perception Check to understand the basics of a conversation. Vocabulary of 30-100 words

Commands(taught) - You've fought alongside or been trained by those who speak another language. Just like the Austrians must train their multi-ethnic army to all fight under German command, you've learned enough to fight in a foreign army and even return commands. You may not even know basic words like "Brother, Soup or house" but you do know a plethora of curse words as well as any common military orders such as "Charge, Halt, left, right" and numbers and ranks. Ja mein Kommandant! Vocabulary of 80-150 words

Accented - The minute you open your mouth you're ousted as a foreigner, but they can understand what you're saying, most of the time. It's still tedious to try to keep a conversation and you often find yourself throwing out words from your mother tongue or playing guess as to what word you're searching for. Despite all this you're capable enough to get things done in this tongue, even a bit of flirtation, the ladies love accents. Vocabulary of 600-1,400 words

To be continued in next post:

>> No.26111083

>>26111058
is this things that actually existed?

>> No.26111102

>>26111083
Gigantipithecus.
I argue it *could* happen, not that it *did* happen.

>> No.26111110

>>26111046

>> No.26111119

>>26111102
but why do they have small monkeymen on their backs...?

>> No.26111121

>>26111083

Nope, its a book called....Man after Man?

... something like that.

>> No.26111139

>>26111119
Australopithicus or Homo Florensis.
They have captured the large, stupid Gigantipithecus and are using them for amiusement.

>> No.26111186

>>26111076
I like this, it's simple, and it's a more in-depth way than usual to handle languages.

>> No.26111198

>>26111076

Functional - You're still recognizable for your accent but it no longer makes conversations difficult. You may not know all the words for house(Mansion, hovel, dwelling,home, hearth, estate, manor, villa etc) but you can get through most conversations without difficulty. Cha test vs. Awareness to pass off as a native speaker for a short period of time. Vocabulary 1,000-6,000 words

Ingratiated - Not only do you speak the tongue, but you've picked up a handful of sayings and have a regional influence to your speech. You could pass as a local from the region you've learned the language from with a Cha test -2 TN. Your speech will take an awareness test to note any accent if you choose to hide it. Vocabulary is the majority of common words in use, the few you don't know you can figure out their meaning in context when used.

Reader(taught) - You may not be able to pronounce "Die Landsknecht komme aus der Oesterreich" but you know what it says. You've spent hours pouring over dusty books learning the meanings of the foreign letters. You can write it at a Broken level if need be.

Intimate(or Native) - You were raised in this tongue, or at least people think so. You've been speaking this language so long you dream in it.

>> No.26111200

>>26111083
>>26111102
>>26111119
He's havin' a laff
It's from a book called Man after Man where a dude speculates what humans will become after civilisation dies. Or something. But all the illustrations are batshit ridiculous

>> No.26111207

>>26111186
Thank you, I know I'll be using it for all my campaigns with more than one language. Even if it's just something one other person uses I'll be happy.

>> No.26111231

>>26110999
Awww lookit europasaurus.

I want one.

>> No.26111267

why does SoS threads make me want to play Darklands?

>> No.26111300

Honestly, many of these mechanics you guys are suggesting have already been done better and more refined in other games. Take what those other games have done and copy them! GURPS's take in languages is much simpler and more elegant than this namefriend's and that's all that's required. We do not have to reinvent the wheel twenty times to make a game.

>> No.26111308

>>26111074
Take it bro. Glad somebody likes it.

>> No.26111363

>>26111300
I love the GURPs language system because it's clean, crisp, concise and functional for a Universal system. However in a time when almost no formal methods of teaching languages were common I wanted to create a more ambient learning curve along with the more unique problems someone with an obvious accent presents in this era.

My two players are playing Russian brothers, one a cut throat, the other a brawler/crazy flail guy. The cutthroat wants to sneak all day long but the campaign is in France so how do we deal with the Language barriers? I cooked this up to improve my own game nights and I believe it is good enough to warrant consideration for the game it was designed for.

>international ouggaon
Captcha, ever on topic.

>> No.26111364

>>26111198
>>26111076
delicious mechanics

>> No.26111629

>>26111363
I don't see the need to use a more complicated system than is necessary. Yours seems too involved for my tastes. Just a few simple levels of language understanding would work just fine, if such a system were to be in the game at all.

>> No.26111758

>>26111076
>>26111198
>>26111363
Okay, I like your delicious mechanics, but don't forget to make them optional.

Rolling dice every time you open your gaijin mouth or try to understand foreign speech is too much. Either players agree with outcome GM is proposing or roll dice.

was there name for this mechanic?

>> No.26111806

>>26111629
The same argument could be said about a 5 tiered wound system with multiple hit locations, 3 types of damage, hundreds of weapons, an infection system etc etc.

But I understand what you mean. I feel it is not overly complicated. It is possible to get by with less but I like where it stands as is.

>>26111758
I was careful not to make it so you were rolling everytime you spoke. Only if you're trying to convey something when you have no fucking clue how the language works. Want to tell them enemies are coming? Easy enough. Want to tell them they're coming tomorrow mid day and you should ambush them by the old mill? Gonna have to roll on that one if you insist that your character can pantomime enough info to get that across where words lack.

>> No.26111816

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klOc9C-aPr4
about 3 minutes in, he makes some good points about long weapons letting you hit more people in a line.
This is what I suspect is holding up truly massed combat right now.

Also, how do you people feel about having maneuvers you can only use in a group, like a shieldwall or testudo?

>> No.26111943

>>26111816
I don't even know how you'd factor something like that in in a game like this. This kind of combat seems like a nightmare.

>> No.26112001

>>26111816
Hm, I think hitting several people in a line requires you to pierce through at least one of them, which means loss of your weapon, not to mention you need herculean strength.

>> No.26112023

>>26111943
Reach man, reach.
Something like H reach can hit only the guy in front of you, longer ranges increase how many to either side you can hit. Maybe not at one per increment, but it might be preferable than attacking the guy directly in front of you because he's been forced into closer range than ideal, so you have a penalty to attack him.

>>26112001
Side by side, not conga.
Like a shield wall or front of a pike block.

>> No.26112157

>>26112023
You mean you want to be able to cleave through multiple enemies at once like Dynasty Warriors?
First, that doesn't seem at all common in the real world.
Second you would still need Herculean strength.
Third there already is the Bad War talent in the game.

>>26111806
The game is built around combat. It is not built around baka gaijin not knowing the language. That is why I believe a simpler system that gets to the point quickly and easily is best.

>> No.26112215

>>26112157
No, I want two lines of 5 facing each other and the guy at one end to attack the enemy at the other, reaching across everyone in between with his 8 foot spear.

Bad War is more of a Cleave effect, and not what I'm going for.

>> No.26112227

>>26112215
You mean, he chooses not the closest target, but one at the limits of his weapon range?

>> No.26112228

>>26112157

It depends whether you think of it as a combat game or a detailed game.

>> No.26112312

>>26112227
He can. Maybe the group is, if each member attacks the man directly in front of him, at only M range and he has a VL or even EL spear. Assuming Song does the same thing with Reach as Riddle he's at a -2 or -3 penalty to attacking, his direct opponent, but maybe the guy 2 or 3 spaces over is at the ideal range, and he can't respond because he's only got a piddly little Arming Sword (M reach).
What I'm proposing is Reach allows one to reach further in massed combat.
There may also be a component involving a second row reaching over their allies, a real Bad War situation of whole blocks being impaled at once by an enemy wielding enormous pikes.

>> No.26112333

>>26110634

Is Deinosuchus fucking Sarchosuchus?

>> No.26112337

>>26112215
You want formation fighting rules. We already know those are coming. Until then we have Bouts and certain talents like Bad War.

>> No.26112347

>>26110692

All for jellyfish. Fuck jellyfish.

>> No.26112348

How about Dextrocardia Minor Gift/Boon? Helps dealing with assassins and mutual kill situations.

>> No.26112351

>>26112312
2 lv. of reach per person away? So if you're front row with a halberd your ideal opponent is gonna be the guy two men back or one over one back.

>> No.26112373

>>26112337
Yeah, I'm just proposing a way it could be done. It's my thing.

>>26112348
How would that work? Lvl 5 wounds to the chest become Lvl 4 unless the enemy knows about the dextocardia?

>>26112351
In Riddle one step was 2', so maybe just one step per person in tight formation.
And now there needs to be formations of different tightness. The more you do the more you have to do.

>> No.26112462

>>26112373
Yep, still deadly, but you may survive, until your enemies goes for your guts and delicious belly pudge.

>>26112157
>That is why I believe a simpler system that gets to the point quickly and easily is best.
Relax, his system is quite good for optional rules. Let GM do the work, if you don't want complexity.

>> No.26112580

>>26112373
With the amount of arms swinging and weapons and armor each man should easily take up a square meter of ground space. But I don't care for this system, we are speculating towards a solution that may already have come to the developers.

>> No.26112766

>>26110554
>Yes. He made "7th Sea" and L5R and thinks, that good GM makes players suffer for every tiny mistake they made. Read about his idea of mastermind millionaire controlling superheroes.
He apparently has since recanted that, saying that he only did it because the players challenged him to kill PCs in a HERO game, as it was "impossible". He swears his style has changed since then, but his newest standalone RPG is about "samurai tragedy"; which seems to be a code for "samurai killing themselves in dishonour or being murdered by other PCs".
Due to the way the Houses of the Blooded/Blood and Honour system works, he's actually found a way to automate the process of dicking PCs over so long as the PCs are masochistic enough. And I think that's the crux of it. John Wick has never ran a game for someone who isn't a masochist.

>> No.26112795

Does murderhau with asian weapons exist?

>> No.26112826

>>26112795
or was it mordhau?

>> No.26112827

>>26112795
Chinese swords have the pommel, Japanese don't, as far as I know. And you need the pommel for this maneuver.

>> No.26112845

>>26112827
Yeah, but like, aren't asian weapons usually made pretty sharp, like sharper than europeans would make their swords?

>> No.26112881

>>26112845
Um, performing mordhau without gauntlets or thick gloves is idiocy, until you are using estoc or other dull piece of metal with sharp point.

>> No.26112958

>>26112881
>performing mordhau without gauntlets or thick gloves is idiocy
Why?

>> No.26112969

>>26112845
>Yeah, but like, aren't asian weapons usually made pretty sharp

They're all about the same, honestly. I suspect most of the rumors about the sharpness/quality/craftsmanship of non-European swords came about post mid-19th century after Europeans had stopped making decent swords. If all you had to compare them to is a shitty mass-produced civil war era cavalry saber, a katana probably looks awesome.

>> No.26112995

>>26112958
Then tell that dude about how some swords were sharpened only at their upper third.

>> No.26112999

>>26112958
Are you seriously asking the question I think you are asking

>> No.26113019

>>26112969
Wait... Does this mean that the stereotype of European swords being edgeless clubs was actually TRUE contemporary to the time that Katanas were in their overwrought mystified height?

>> No.26113060

>>26112845
As far as I can tell, no. It's much the same all around. The idea that Asian/Japanese/whatever swords are sharper (and lighter, etc) probably comes from comparing them not to actual Europeans words, but to the myth of the heavy, crude and blunt European sword of old.

>>26112881
I'm not so certain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwKZorhBLH4

>> No.26113096

Guys, can we keep this thread away from "dull-sharp" argument?

Also
>>26113060
>dem red socks

>> No.26113109

>>26113019

To a degree, yeah. There were still a few decent swords being made in Europe, but in the US especially they seemed to just give up on making decent shit somewhere around 1850 or so. I suppose once you have revolvers swords seem a little passe.

>> No.26113177

>>26113019
Well, if we really want to force some truth into things, then we can find a number of 19th century military swords which weren't sharp.

Now they weren't intended to be used like that, instead they were simply delivered and kept blunt in peacetime to reduce the amount of maintenance, wear-and-tar, and the risk of accidents. If fighting seemed likely in the near future, the regimental armourer was to sharpen them.

Around the late 19th century we also start seeing some swords which were probably not much use as anything but uniform accessories.

However, as hinted at in my previous post, the 19th century also created the myth of the medieval European sword being a crude thing, massively heavy, and with little in the way of an edge, and wielded by a knight (in armour so heavy he'd need a crane to get mounted...) who would just smash down his opponent with pure strength and no skill. This myth probably comes from a combination of people sued to smallsword and epee judging old swords by those standards, and from the notion that history was a steady progression from bad to good. IMO it's far more likely that this is what the katana has been compared to.

Or rather, this is what the just as mythical katana of Imperial Japanese propaganda has been compared to.

>> No.26113482

So I'm reading Occitan medieval poetry to familiarize myself enough with the language to mimic it when my players hear people speaking it. Also I need to differentiate it from the French, Latin, German and Italian they'll be hearing.

I've also figured out what year(1478) and month (march) they're in and where (The town of Mende, seat of the Bishopric of Mende which makes them count of Gevaudan, currently Giuliano della Rovere future Pope Julius II) and that the current Count of Ventadour; Charles de Ventadour is also Baron of Chateauneuf which falls within the jurisdiction of Gevaudan(Gavaudan in Occitan) finally I've downloaded dozens of pictures of the towns, castles and villages of the region as well as two maps. Pic related.

Finally I've got their backstory, they were defeated mercenaries, fighting for the Burgundians in the Burgundian War and being on the losing side lost out on their pay and are basically stranded penniless in Gavaudan for the time being. Now for plot hooks to ensue!

>My players must suffer my history geekery

>> No.26113496

>>26113482
>Mention pics
>Forget pics

>> No.26113513

>>26113496
>Adventuretown.jpeg

>> No.26113610

>>26113482
They are hired as brave vampire hunters. Mercenaries don't believe vampires are real, until they see the beasts with their own eyes. And these beasts are sparkling.

>> No.26113627

>>26113482

Dude; history geekery is the way forward.

I'm working on a D&D setting in which most of 'the known world' is part of a superstate that's effectively going through a protracted Crisis of the Third Century.

>> No.26113662

I don't understand how Europeans could live with so many different languages in such close proximity to each other. Did everyone know parts of three or four languages besides their native one?

>> No.26113686

>>26113662
They're all related, and geographical obstacles were much more significant before the modern age.
When your world consists of your village and those within a day's cart ride you don't tend to meet a lot of people who don't already speak what you do.

>> No.26113695

>>26113627
And I'm working on setting with catgirls and insect people.

>> No.26113696

>>26113662
Yes. People actually learned things back in the day.

Though way back your average peasant didn't travel too far anyways and just spoke whatever the local dialect was.

>> No.26113884

>>26113662
Reminds me of a guy who I studied jodo under for a short while. IIRC his home village had been part of three different countries in his lifetime, and despite none of the countries being Germany, that's the language they spoke there.

Anyway, as people have pointed out, most people back then never travelled further than the nearest market, giving plenty of room for local variations to emerge and grow, thus fracturing the common origins into a large number of different languages, and those languages into a large number of dialects which range from barely noticeable to effectively their own languages. Modern day masscommunication often treats these dialects like a blowtorch treats a snowflake.

Nobles, merchants and other people prone to travelling (and I guess people living in cities with a lot of travellers going through) would probably pick up at least one extra language, and a proper renaissance lord should probably be near fluent in at least half a dozen.

>> No.26113888

How about crazy Asian weapons?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aggOfsBuaSQ

>> No.26113911

>>26110109
I had that book, that encyclopedia was the shit.

>> No.26114032

>>26113884

>> No.26114052

>> No.26114073

>>26114052

>> No.26114097

>>26114032
>CARLS

>> No.26114300

>>26113662
Most of the are crazy close, within their (sub)families. Like, reading-without-learning-it close.

>> No.26114515

I'm really sad now. Why did you have to tell me about this /tg/? You guys suck. I'm super sad.

>> No.26114550

>>26114515
Dude, why did you not take the cues from people saying that they will go and cry because somebody reminded them of this bastard and his fucked up work ethics?

>> No.26114565

>>26114550
I was curious! I didn't think it was...like that...

>> No.26114612

>>26114565
Then it's your own fault. Welcome to the "I can't believe i want to hate a fictional character to death" brigade. We shall together wait for the glorious day when he kicks the bucket.

>> No.26114620

Anyone got a name for this?
It's apparently Celtic, and just about the only blunt weapon I can find between sticks and maces.

>> No.26114634

>>26114620
Looks like a simple truncheon to me.

>> No.26114649

>>26114620
Nevermind, reverse-image-search tells me it's a Burda.

>>26114634
In shape yes, but the spear is a simple pointy stick.

>> No.26114684

>>26113662
Almost all of the languages of Europe are related in fairly sensible ways Except Basque, fuck Basque, their closest relative is Russian Inuit Language. For example, English and German are incredibly similar, which makes sense since English is more or less the evolution of Germanic with Vulgar(the peoples) Latin and French influences.

I love how the Normans ruled England without really speaking our dirty backwards language. And because of that very fact our words for the meats of livestock are Franconized (Beef, Poultry, Pork) while the Livestock was English (Cow, Chicken, Pig). The ol' Frenchie nobility got all th' meat whilst the poor English got to raise 'em.

>> No.26114739

>>26114515
Let's hope one day Gatsu-dono will go through St. Gotthard Pass.

>> No.26114765

>>26114684
>spoiler
Lol wut?

>> No.26114832

>>26114765
Basque is this crazy language that is apparently 6 years of work to learn for non-related languages(all of them). The Romans passed them by in their mountain home so they got to keep their ancient language as the tide of Latin then German washed over other countries.

>> No.26114896

>>26114765
IIRC it's a reaming "island" of what was spoken in the area before the current Indo-European languages came and took over most of Europe.

>> No.26114899

TIL: there is a weapon called an Aklys which consists of a club which is thrown at the enemy and RETRIEVED BY PULLING ON THE STRING TIED TO YOUR ARM.

>> No.26114925

>>26114899
So someone tied a rope through a throwing club. What are you so excited for?

>> No.26114957

>>26114925
It's just not something which I'd heard of before or which was ever used again.
I got excited by the novelty.

>> No.26114970

>>26114765
Here's an example of Basque poetry;


Esklabu erremintaria
Sartaldeko oihanetan gatibaturik
Erromara ekarri zinduten, esklabua,
erremintari ofizioa eman zizuten
eta kateak egiten dituzu.
Labetik ateratzen duzun burdin goria
nahieran molda zenezake,
ezpatak egin ditzakezu
zure herritarrek kateak hauts ditzaten,
baina zuk, esklabu horrek,
kateak egiten dituzu, kate gehiago.

Pic is their number system.

For a reference here is a part of Boecis, the earliest Occitan poem. Notice how a lot of the words are straight up latin or Italian and it has a distinict correlation with Latin?

Bella·s la donna, mas molt es de longs dis,
No·s pot rascundre nulz om denant so vis.
Hanc no vist omne, ta grant onor aguís,
Si·l forfez tan dont ella·s rangurís,
Sos corps ni s’arma miga per ren guarís;
Quoras que·s vol s’en a lo corps aucís
E pois met l’arma en effern e somsís:
Tal li comanda qui totz dias la bris.
Ella metesma ten claus de paradís,
Quoras que·s vol, laïnz col sos amigs.
Bels sun si drap, no sai nommar lo fil,
Mas molt per foren de bon e de sobtil.
Ella se·ls fez, avia anz plus de mil.
Ta no son vel, miga lor prez avil.

>> No.26115006

>>26114899
There were javelins, which were used in the same fashion.

>> No.26115025

>>26114970
So how long did Basque last for?
Is it still alive?
What the hell makes a people come up with THAT number notation? Come to think of it, Arabic numbers are pretty fucking nuts too.

>> No.26115039

>>26115025
>Arabic numbers
Psssss, Arabs stole them from Indians.

>> No.26115042

>>26115025
Basque is still spoken to this day. It's got like 700k speakers left and I think they got organized enough that it'll stick around. We know it predates the entire tree of Indo-European languages so its thousands of years old.

>> No.26115065

>>26115042
700k natives or speakers?
Because Latin has plenty of speakers, but no natives.

>> No.26115075

>>26115065
Wikipedia says speakers.

>> No.26115114

>>26115065
According to Wiki there are several million ethnically Basque people and over 700,000 native speakers. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say there aren't many non-native speakers.

>> No.26115127

>>26115065
>Because Latin has plenty of speakers, but no natives.
And most of them are educated wealthy people.

Is it conspiracy created by Latins?

>> No.26115202

>>26115127
Latin was THE written language for over a millenium and a half. Hell my father was required to learn latin in high school when he was young. Most European languages are the degenerate children of latin. I'm honestly surprised we just didn't roll with what we had and kept the latin thing going, for most romance languages it isn't so dissimilar that it would be difficult to learn.

>> No.26115249

>>26115202
Rome fell, Britain rose and spread English across the globe.
The Empire is why America is as influential as it is, we lay the linguistic roots. Most countries speak English as a second, relatively few speak a Romance first.

>> No.26115261

>>26115249
That comment got away from me a little, the tl;dr is that English replaced Latin as the primary second language.

>> No.26115281

>>26115025
Don't be surprised if you car were to suddenly explode. Just saying.

>> No.26115283

Hey guys, can we get stats for using ranged weapons in melee? Like if you wanted to club someone with your crossbow or handgonne.

>> No.26115293

Man, I've been thinking of learning latin for some while. There's even a news spread in latin in my country, might as well try and do something fun with it.

>> No.26115320

>>26115261
It's called lingua franca.

>> No.26115343

Looking at the Aklys, it occurs to me that it could be used to constrict by slinging it around the target's legs.
I've come across a similar effect in the Bolas I included for Stone Age.
I considered setting this up as a weapon quality, putting it on whip weapons as well, but it might be better suited to a Maneuver since it is using these weapons in an unusual manner. Except the bolas, they're making it awkward.
Maybe on the whippy weapons it's just a Hook maneuver, but it's kind of meant to get entangled.
Maybe using them to Hook gives them Constricting? That sounds elegant.

Thoughts?

>> No.26116497

>>26115283
Yeah, I thought about this the other day. We need stats for that. We also need stats for clubbing someone with a bow, and how laughably ineffective it must be. We'll probably also need stats for stabbing with an arrow.

>> No.26116865

>>26116497
We don't. It's a waste of time for gamedevs. Wait for supplements, if you need this nonsense or homerule it.

>> No.26117069

>>26115283
Truncheon stats for now. Maybe light mace for a pistol with a big butt.

>>26116497
Bows are surprisingly sturdy, not as much as a staff but it is a big wooden stick at the end of the day.
Arrows: most of the bows deal 2 more damage than their Draw, but +2 is a lot for a dagger. A rondel does STR damage, so maybe that?

>> No.26117112

Also, will using two pistols at the same time basically be 'divide your pool, offhand pistol is at a penalty'? Maybe +1 ATN?

>> No.26117207

>>26117112
It's not DnD. Spending CP on two attacks at the same time is already a huge investment.

>> No.26117315

>>26117112
Divide, no penalty if it follows the Side Attack maneuver pattern.
I could see a penalty for attacking more than one target though, or a requirement to target one target with both attacks. Range attacks are a little more considered than melee, in melee you can at least flail around and hope to hit something.

>> No.26117922

>>26115065
The Basque are still around. Like, you can go there and talk to them still. They're like Spain's combination of Ireland and Switzerland. They always want to secede, and they are totally impossible to invade. Nobody has ever effectively displaced them.

>> No.26117949

>>26117922
They're the Kingdom of Nevarra in Crusader Kings 2. Great fun to play. Can get Absolute Cognac.

>> No.26117996

>>26117207
I suggested the +1 ATN penalty, because that was the penalty for using a melee weapon in the off hand in RoS.

>> No.26118203

>>26112827
Hilt strikes are a thing in Japanese swordsmanship. Generally instead of completely inverting the blade you do them from halfsword.

>> No.26118238

>>26117922
And you better refer to their home turf as Euskadi or they'll kick the shit out of you.

>> No.26118307

I feel missile weapon mechanics haven't been tested nearly as much as melee mechanics. We should get on that.

>> No.26118388

>>26118307
Aren't they getting redone heavily anyway in the next update?

>> No.26118439

>>26114515
>>26114550
>>26114565
>>26114612
What is this all about, guys? You didn't mention subject, so the curiosity is now killing me.

>> No.26118489

>>26118439
Some badfeels manga with a lot of Western medieval style called Ookami no Kuchi Wolfmund.

>> No.26118612

>>26118388
Isn't EVERYTHING always getting redone in the next update?

>> No.26118679

>>26118612
Considering how much shit was wrong with the first release, yeah, actually.

Seriously though, it doesn't do too much good to ruminate on mechanics that are soon to be discarded.

>> No.26118742

>>26118679
That's right, and that's why I don't feel very interested in testing the game right now. We're just going to have thread after thread that goes to autosage in a day and the threads will be about nothing until we get rules we don't expect to be changed right away.

>> No.26118924

>>26118742
At least we USUALLY have good discourse in these threads in the meantime.

And then again, the developers HAVE been open to suggestions as to what to do with certain things so perhaps there is some reason to deliberate on such matters.

>> No.26118944

>>26118742
On the other hand, testing, or at least inspection of the mechanics and what might be wrong with them, can help us point the devs in the right direction. We've changed their minds before.

>> No.26119051

>>26118924
I will say this. No series of threads has ever gone by so rapidly and held my attention for so long. It's been like six months, and all the lads are still here.

>> No.26119149

>>26119051
Reminds me of a much scrappier and less rapetastic Kingdom Death.

>> No.26119206

>>26119149
Please don't compare this to KD. The guys here aren't trying to peddle softcore porn for exorbitant prices.

>> No.26119256

>>26119206
No, they're peddling the porn for free.

>> No.26119353

Yae verily.

>> No.26119368

>>26119353
>dose minidresses
I fail to see how this is any less flagrant than Kingdom Death.

>> No.26119461

>>26119353
>Serbian knight

lel

>> No.26119635

>>26119368

That good, wholesome Bascinet, that's why.

>> No.26119957

I can't help but wonder how Specializations fit into the existing Proficiency setup. Would love to get a preview on that from the devs.

>> No.26120358

Hay guys, what is the best "cheap" suit of armor for a 14th century central European footman? Stuff like simple open helmet, and central locations armored with at least better than padded cloth. Would an open sallet and brigandine vest do, or can we go cheaper?

>> No.26120396

>>26120358
If you want something better than padded cloth but cheaper than a brigandine/coat of plates...hrm. Perhaps a leather jack?

>> No.26120625

>>26120358
You're a century too early for a sallet, and a good bit away from brigandine too.

Start with a padded gambesson and cap. Add a metal skullcap and/or a mail coif for your head. Or grab a bascinet from someone, probably without the visor. Kettle hats can probably be seen too. A mail shirt is probably the next step for your body, though you could put a coat of plates straight on top of the gambesson I guess. Gauntlets (Visby or hourglass) would probably be nice to have too.

The exact details will obviously depend on exactly when and where, but this should work for some point in the 14th century at least.

>> No.26121074

>>26120625
This sounds reasonable. I think I will go with bascinets, and coats of plates upon gambessons, hourglass gauntlets and shin guards of some sort - the combination in my opinion seems more intimidating. In addition to those, they will have heater shields, spears and axes.

If you guys feel like it, could you post some images of these pieces of gear? Mostly bascinets of the era, the coats of plates, and maybe shields with their devices?

>> No.26121211

>>26121074
Note that right now there are no distinct SoS stats for a 14th century coat of plates; as such you may need to substitute the stats of the Brigandine anyway for now.

>> No.26121286

Trying to come up with stuff for 17th century.
Musketoon: ATN 7, Reload 5/4/1, 14p Damage, Range 12/24/48/75, Ammo Types: Shot, Shrapnel, Wealth 2
Pistol: ATN 6, Reload 3/6/1, 12p Damage, Range 10/20/50/100, Ammo Types: Shot, Wealth 2
Dueling Pistol: ATN 5, Reload 3/4/1, 13p Damage, Range 15/30/50/100, Ammo Types: Shot: Wealth 5 for two
Musket: ATN 5, Reload 4/4/2, 14p Damage, Range 20/40/100/200, Ammo Types: Shot, Spike, Wealth 3
Carbine: ATN 6, Reload 4/3/2, 12P Damage, Range 15/30/50/100, Ammo Types: Shot, Wealth 3

I think I'm good on melee weapons, as most of them are already in, or are going to be in upon the next update.

Armor
Lobster Tail Helm: Cut DV 8, Pierce DV 10, Blunt DV 5, Coverage: Full Head, 1/2 AV for the back of the neck and to the face, Enc 2, Wealth 2
Heavy Cuirass: Cut DV 8, Pierce DV 10, Blunt DV 5, Coverage: Torso, Enc 2, Wealth 4
Breastplate Additive: Cut DV +2, Pierce DV +2, Blunt DV +1, Coverage: Front Torso, Adds its DV to the Cuirass above, Enc 1, Wealth 5

I know, real creative, but I think it's a decent start.

>> No.26121455

>>26121286
Since 17th century pistols tends to mean wheellocks, I suspect that the pistol should be more expensive than the (matchlock) musket, not vice versa. I'm also reasonably certain that the idea of duelling with pistols is by and large a good bit away still (for much of the century we probably won't see much of "proper" duels at all), making the duelling pistol a rather odd bird.

>> No.26121859

>>26121455
I was just going off of wikipedia, and what I remember from The Three Musketeers book, so I'm not really surprised I'm not all that accurate. All of those are supposed to be flintlock, though.
And I was going to add in some multi-barrel guns too, but I haven't figured out a way to really do that yet, and they're not exactly period either.

>> No.26121969

>>26121859
Well, we have pepperboxes in the 16th century.

Matchlocks and wheellocks will remains the "standard" by and large until roughly the turn fo the century.

>> No.26122017

>>26121969
They had cartridge firing breach-loading guns back then too. Doesn't mean they were common.

Funny to think that pic related is far more advanced than anything made prior to the mid 19th century.

>> No.26122117

>>26121969
Yeah. Flintlocks existed at the time, but they would be the absolute bleeding edge in the 1600s.

>> No.26122159

>>26122117
I miss the days when weapons were popular among the upper classes, so that richfags would own a handful of guns centuries ahead of anything governments or commoners owned.

I'm imagining Bill Gates with an unreasonably fancy plasma rifle hanging on the wall of his office.

>> No.26122571

>>26122159
"Unreasonably fancy". Fuck having a masterwork bastard sword, I want an Unreasonably Fancy one.

>> No.26122610

>>26122571

>> No.26122624

>>26122571
Unreasonably Fancy is definitely a thing.

I have been in the presence of this pistol, and the photo does not do it justice. The engraving on the metal parts is like looking at a fractal; no matter how closely you look, there is still more detail too fine to perceive.

>> No.26122837

>>26122017
I'm intensely interested in the mechanics of this device.

>> No.26122972

>>26122610
That's just reasonably fancy. We need to go fancier.

>> No.26123108

>>26122837
Take the (loaded) chamber-piece, insert into breech and push all the way forward with the tab aligned with the cut-out in the barrel (so the touch-holes in barrel and chamber align), fold down the breech block making sure the spring-loaded catch at the back engages, and you're good to go.

>> No.26123119

>> No.26123185

>>26121286
I like the ideas. The notion of additive armor is actually very close to our line of reasoning for a few things (plackarts were the start) which suggests that our thinking is in synch with the audience on this one.

The guns are also pretty good. Because of complaints with the reloading scheme, we might be switching it up a bit, but there's not much there mechanically which is different from what I would've done, which I think bodes well.

>> No.26123223

>>26123108
>>26123119
>>26122017
Also, this thing is amazingly sexy, thank you for showing it to us. We'll have to stat this puppy forthwith. Is there anywhere where we can find additional information on this particular weapon? What was it called, was it one-of-a-kind?

>> No.26123325

>>26123185
Yo, Jimmy. While you're around, might you be able to answer anything relating to >>26119957 perchance?

>> No.26123480

>>26123325
Absolutely. I apologize for my long absence, it's that time of week again, you know how it is.

Right now, Specializations are essentially... Well, specialized versions of a core Proficiency. 1H Sword has Messer, Sidesword, Scimitar, Rapier, etc. These are represented in compact blocks that state the changes that they make to the core proficiency clearly and succinctly. Each will have its own Mastery, and modified activation costs, maneuvers, special talents, etc.

An alternative that we're also toying with is Specializations as an upgrade that you can buy for any core Proficiency (more than once if desired) that gives special bonuses when using weapons favored by that Specialization, akin to those that would be included in the above model.

It's really just a matter of practicality, and how well which option would mesh with the rest of the system.

>> No.26123501

>>26123223

There's all kinds of similarly crazy shit from that time period. Take a look at this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_hnC6x036Q

And that wasn't even the earliest repeating-fire design. The Kalthoff repeater was developed somewhere around 1630:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalthoff_repeater

Plus of course there's superposed flintlocks, like in <-- pick. You load it with powder, ball, powder, ball, powder, ball and so on, then fire off each shot in turn. You need very carefully formed balls or a spark will get past and ignite the next powder charge and the damn thing will chainfire and probably blow up in your hand.

>> No.26123617

>>26123501
Good God.

>> No.26123645

>>26123223
No special name that I know of, breech-loaded wheellock pistol with removable chamber-piece, mid 16th century. You'd probably keep half a dozen or so extra chambers at hand, all pre-loaded, to speed up firing. (More shots than that and the amour of fouling build up in the barrel will start being somewhat dangerous).

The basic idea of breech loaders with replaceable chambers for hand-held guns go back to the mid 15th century.

>>26123501
>Plus of course there's superposed flintlocks
Also available in matchlock. 17th century I think.

>> No.26123693 [DELETED] 

Some more bits which might be of interest. Triple-barreled pepperbox matchlock carbine. North Italy, ca 1530.

>> No.26123716

A few more of possible interest. Triple-barreled pepperbox matchlock carbine. North Italy, ca 1530.

>> No.26123769

Arquebus (carbine?) variant of >>26123108

>> No.26123791

Late 16th century snaphaunce revolver.

>> No.26123816

And a triple barrelled dart-shooting wheellock pistol.

>> No.26123850

Here's a breech-loader from a ridiculously early period. Something like 14th or 15th century.

>> No.26123854

>>26123791
>>26123816
Anachronistic my ass, look at dis shit.

>> No.26123861

>>26123480
Jimmy, have you caught up on the previous thread? In it it was shown how murderstrike is worse than half-swording in like 99% of all situations.

>> No.26123872

>>26123480
Sounds pretty interesting. Both methods would seem to have their merits and drawbacks; the former method for example sounds like it'd be easier to slot into the Schools system, but the latter method makes it so that core proficiencies are still the, well...CORE of your knowledge.

>> No.26123895

>>26123861
I did see the subject, yes. The implementaiton of MS values will make it a lot better of a maneuver, and there will be some other additions as well.

Attacks to the head, even if unsuccessful in causing damage, will also probably inflict Shock in the next update, so that it won't be necessary to mention that a Murderstrike inflicts extra. Hence us not mentioning it in the most recent update.

>> No.26123906

>>26123850
That one specifically is supposedly ca 1480, though the same basic design can be seen in this illustration, the maker of which went and died in 1455.

>> No.26123945

I am having trouble with the pdf

I have seen a few fechts but never really participated or read RoS

Can someone explain the following?

1. Where your combat pool comes from.

2 The process to make an attack

3 How all the numbers are derived, target numbers, defence numbers etc

>> No.26123965

>>26110583
Holy shitting fucks. That picture gives me all sorts of new respect to the anon who fought off an elephant seal in the Adventure Story contest.

>> No.26124010

>>26110692
Indeed they are. I would fight a 50 foot alligator instead of a 20 foot snapping turtle any day

>> No.26124297

The OP image has restored my sense of childlike wonder

>> No.26124508

>>26123945

In Riddle of Steel?

>1. Where your combat pool comes from.

Weapon proficiency + Reflex

>2. The process to make an attack

Declare maneuver, declare investment of dice, roll that shit

>3 How all the numbers are derived, target numbers, defence numbers etc

Attack and defence target numbers are part of the weapon itself - for example it's harder to defend yourself with a knife than it is with a longsword.

>> No.26124784

>>26124508
Thanks.


Just one more thing you could clear up for me.

> Attack and defence target numbers are part of the weapon itself - for example it's harder to defend yourself with a knife than it is with a longsword.

So where does armor factor in. And ranged weapons?

>> No.26124875

>>26124784
>So where does armor factor in. And ranged weapons?

Armor is DR. When the other guy bypasses your defense by rolling more successes than you, Armor is what makes the difference between a scratch and a bleeding stump where your leg used to be.

Taking damage at all is dangerous in the system since it could mean bleeding, and bleeding could mean eventual death unless you put the other guy down before your blood loss starts to affect your combat capabilities. Armor is pretty important, but its weight can also reduce the number of dice you have in your combat pool - while you might be protected in a suit of heavy plate ("jousting plate"), your fighting will be impaired.

>And ranged weapons?

The more powerful ranged weapons, like bows and crossbows, take several rounds to prepare. Their CP is derived from a slightly different source in the base RoS system, and you can spend more time aiming to increase the CP you have available for use on the attack.

They're just straight up not viable in a melee, of course, but scoring a wounding ranged attack on some dude from ambush will make it that much easier to stab him in the dick, or might outright incapacitate him. Unless he's wearing armour.

>> No.26126048

Thinking about ranged weapons this morning, and I think the low ATN for simplicity is wrong.
Early guns are distinctly inaccurate, in the hands of equal masters a bow will hit on target far more than the handgonne.
Rather, I propose that ATN represent only accuracy of the weapon, and the ease of use come from Proficiency costs, maybe 1 PP for really simple weapons like a gun and up to 5 for something really awkward. But then I suppose Proficiency costs take into account reloading and such, pushing the complexity of guns up a bit.
You could lower the Tier 1 level for simple weapons, but getting to Tier 2 is a bigger gap because of it.

Really I'm just throwing ideas at the Devs, they likely considered everything anyway but I like to play too.

>> No.26126845

>>26124875
>Their CP is derived from a slightly different source in the base RoS system, and you can spend more time aiming to increase the CP you have available for use on the attack.
As I remember, you can add number of dice equal to your Wit every turn of Aiming, but overall PP can't exceed Aim + Proficiency.

>> No.26127096

Bump.

>> No.26127452

Damn, imagine finding with something like this in SoS while swimming near the sea or a river.

>> No.26127541

>>26127452
This lady has a huge nose, so it's not a problem.

>> No.26127617

How the fuck would it be possible to ride a stegosaurs?

>> No.26127627

>>26127617

Sit between the plates, put some sort of saddle there. You'd just have to keep your legs together rather than straddling it.

>> No.26127629

>>26127452
Murderseal? I can take it!

>> No.26127641

>>26110634
>was

>> No.26127652

>>26127641
Not everyone lives in Australia mate. The meanest thing I can encounter in our forest are boars (fucking boars) and the ocasional and shy wolf.

>> No.26127657

>>26110722
They would most likely be really fucking stupid

>> No.26127684

>>26127617
Something in between the spines on the peak, much like a cross between an elephant and a camel.
You'd use a lance or bow, maybe more than one guy up there.

>> No.26127711

>>26110839

>> No.26127723

>>26127629
Well, knowing how fucking hateful and mean are seals, and how they play with their food, I augur lots of Sir pinguin bones at the end of the seal play.
>>26127684
I think this one its better as mobil fortress. Not very fast but eh, armour and mace without the spines.

>> No.26127761

>>26127723
Yeah, but you're more perched than with a Steggy which comes with its own enclosing armour for you.
And if we're going full-fortress, give me an Ankylosaurus any day. That goes double if I can rivet steel on.

>> No.26127780

Oh how I wish mount n blade had the combat of chivalry.

>> No.26127800

>>26127780
How would you fight on horseback?

>> No.26127812

>>26127800
I dont know. I wish chivalry had mounted cobat.

>> No.26127826

>>26127780
It does not

>> No.26127903

>>26127812
>mounted combat
>stunlock everything with trampling
I wish it never will.

>> No.26127931

>>26127627
>>26127684
Both could work, yeah you could easily fit two.

>>26127723
A Trice seems like a decent balance between both speed and armour, but your rear is very vulnerable. The first impact of the charge would be devastating.

>>26127761
It would be a lot easier to just kill the rider than even try to touch the Anky. I guess that's the case with most dinosaur/beast mounts.

>> No.26127983

>>26127931
Anky is like a war elephant, you point it at the enemy and get out of the way.

>> No.26128719

Bump.

>> No.26128801

>Dem Ancient whales.

>> No.26128878

>>26128801
He looks like he just can't wait to bite me in half.

>> No.26128963

>>26128878
The ambulocetus seems so happy.

>> No.26129083

>>26128963
He has just found, that his descendants will be a giant killer whales.

>> No.26129793

>>26123895
Hey Jimmy! Did you see;

>>26111076
>>26111198

>> No.26130442

>>26129793
Forgive me for not answering immediately, but I actually did. I'm rather in love with the idea, though I understand other peoples' hesitance about such an in-depth system for something so often taken for granted.

We may look at something similar when we address languages ourselves.

>> No.26130623

Kind of out of context. Atleast until japan supplement. But I'm interested. There's plenty of gentlemen here who have read Berserk and ookami no kuchi. I'm interested if any of likeminded fechtsmen here has read Shigurui and their thoughts on it?

>> No.26130651

>>26130623
Oh man, that manga. Some of the tecnniques were very bizarre, and perhaps a bit to much guro or scat, but a cool manga non the less.

>> No.26130673

>>26130651
Ignoring all the gore I think the story's really nice.

>> No.26130677

>>26130623
I did. Grotesque story, in every sense of the word, but very good. Very different take on the culture of swordsmanship in Japan. It would take a concerted effort to find a more grim, nihilistic and sobering manga than Shigurui that doesn't take place in the mountains of Switzerland.

>> No.26130701

Reading through the beta for the first time. They actually did goblins. I thought they were joking. I'll start writing up a campaign I guess.

>> No.26130707

>>26130623
How homoerotic can a manga about eviscerating other human beings be?
The answer is Shigurui.

>> No.26130752

Does deluge manga exist?

>> No.26130753

>>26130677

Are you saying it's grimmer than something like Berserk? Jesus.

>> No.26130768

>>26130623
I thought it was really good. There was that distinct animu-element with the physically improbable secret moves (seriously, holding the grip of the sword between two fingers... So posting with a katana is an unstoppable secret technique? What a buncha amateurs,) but at the same time it felt grounded. It was distinctly character driven, and everything made sense in the context of a character driven story. The revelation for why the blind guy was so vengeful (it had almost nothing to do with him being blinded or his girlfriend being mutilated, which is hilarious) was amazing.

>> No.26130777

>>26130753
Well, the only way to find its to read it.

>> No.26130814

>>26130752
While you'd think that Japan would be all about Polish Hussars, who bear many uncanny similarities to the Samurai, not to my knowledge. Poland is probably off the East-Asian radar.

>>26130753
Berserk had elements of heroism alongside its grimness. Guts does the right thing when he can, and there's some real Rage of Achilles shit going on there, where he's going to go kill the gods because one of them fucked his girlfriend. (Among other things. Christ Griff.)
And you actually believe he's going to do it. The story is speeding up into heroic fantasy after reaching its bottom point.

Shigurui goes to the darkest corner that Berserk did, and it just stays there. And there's no God Hand motivating these people, they're just sociopaths raised in a culture of sociopaths.

>> No.26130829

>>26130753
Shigurui is the Hotline Miami to Berserk's Scarface.

>> No.26130846

>>26130814

Well, looks like I have something else to read, much to the detriment of my players.

Poor bastards don't know they're entering a New World setting based on Berserk, King of Dragon Pass, and Spice and Wolf in equal measure.

>> No.26130853

>>26130846
You are my friend, you fight for freedom.

>> No.26130868

>>26130853
Sorry, stepped out of thread.

>> No.26130903

>>26130868
The avatar covers it.

>> No.26130908

>>26130846
King of dragon pass? Also is spice and wolf actually good or is is just "naked foxlady is naked and that'
s fun"?

>> No.26130922

>>26130853

Sacrificing cattle to the haughty wolfgoddess so you can control the market and so she doesn't send trolls and demons to ruin the day for everyone. Now that's a setting I think everyone can get behind.

>> No.26130949

>>26130908

When people say they watch it for the economics, they aren't being coy. The first plot arc revolves around the manipulation of the amount of silver in currency. The wolfgirl is adorable, but the romance area is more of a side plot than the focus of the show.

Given the choice to focus on two guys discussing the market or the cute wolfgirl, the show will almost always choose the two guys or the wolfgirl discussing the market.

>> No.26130952

>>26130908
Basic economics plus Naked foxlady. Meh.

>> No.26130953

>>26130908
I don't know if there even is a moment of nakedness in that. Been some time since I read it. But it's fun.

>> No.26130954

>>26130908
King of Dragon pass is as follows: You are a pseudo celtic tribe. You must conquer Dragon Pass. The only way to win is through Roleplaying, since trying to game the system results in you being destroyed by Duck people
Seriously, do NOT fuck with the Ducks, they are one of the strongest opponents in the entire game.

Spice and Wolf is an anime that at first looks to be some medieval slice of life or some bullshit with a foxgirl. Instead it becomes economics, as presented by well written characters in an interesting world.

>> No.26130962

Well, I guess I gotta give the naked fox economics a try.

>> No.26131015

>>26130954

Those fucking ducks.

I didn't realize. I didn't know what would happen, man.

>> No.26131017

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dhjyxcrGD8

Daily dose of Serbia, Wolves and Fire.

>> No.26131024

>>26130623
The art is horrible even when people aren't getting their faces ripped off.

>> No.26131042

>>26130953
She spends most of her time naked when not in public because she's a wolf and wolves hate clothes.

>> No.26131066

>>26130651
>scat
Wow, I stopped reading it just in time.

>Some of the tecnniques were very bizarre
Even Woman's Guard can look bizzare.

>> No.26131075

>>26131042

And cheeks, apparently. They fucking love peaches and apples, though.

GRRM would be proud of some of the descriptions in this series.

>> No.26131086

Does martial arts exist in europe in a way like karate or other unarmed shit. Like kicking and punching and throwing stuff. Not just grappling.

>> No.26131123

>>26131086
What is Boxing.Pugilism?

>> No.26131149

>>26131086
It's less pronounced, because the striking martial arts thing sort of started in India, but there are a few.
Boxing is probably the most pronounced and oldest example. The problem is, it was always a sport-fighting thing first, because nobody in the west saw the applications of an unarmed striking system except for entertainment.

That's not to say it wasn't brutal. There was a form of Roman boxing where four guys with wooden poles, holding them limbo-style, would stand in a square around the boxers, and gradually hedge them in so that they couldn't dodge or maneuver, and just had to beat the shit out of each other from three feet away with no lateral movement, and they did this with big fucking metal and leather cestus things on. People died mang.

>> No.26131170

>>26131066
Not... Really like that. There are just a couple of scenes with shit in them for no reason. It never gets like... that.

>> No.26131171

Carthage: in the Rome book or in the Tribal book? It already has Gauls and Dacians and such, should it just expand to all Rome's enemies?
Maybe I just make one HUGE book for Antiquity? Like the Core but 1000+ years earlier.

>> No.26131191

>>26130954
Not actually ducks, but their older mean brothers like centaurs or minotaurs or midgets riding huge insects

>> No.26131212

>>26131086
Savate.

>> No.26131222

>>26131086
>Not just grappling.
Well, do you know, that grappling is one of the best ways to deal with single opponent, especially, if you have mass and strength advantage?

>> No.26131324

>>26131171
Well, Carthage was far from your tipical Tribal. The dacian too were more advanced than the Gauls in a lot of aspects, so yeah, better to make this ancient Supplement.

>> No.26131326

>>26130707
How homoerotic can a manga about eviscerating huge demonic beings be?
The answer is Berserk.

for some reason, I liked that possessed old man

>> No.26131342

I think we should get a new thread up.

>> No.26131379

>>26131171
Carthage was like Rome, but with bloodthirsty gods, mercenaries and elephants.

>> No.26131425

>>26131324
>>26131379
Not gonna lie, it's the elephants that are selling it to me.

>> No.26131618

>>26131425
Elephants are for pussies.

>> No.26131655

Do you say the "th" in Carthage, or is it Cartage?

>> No.26131706

>>26131618
Well I'd ride an adult, not a baby.
Honestly, can't trust a Spaniard with anything. They just want to stick metal into animals with gay abandon.

Devs, how are you planning to handle those weapons which span the dagger/sword spectrum?
How do you determine when a weapon is big enough to be used with a Sword proficiency, or small enough to be used with a Dagger?
Do range increments correlate to any fixed lengths?

>> No.26131740

Will there be a pugilism mastery?

>> No.26131802

>>26131706
Isn't a baby elephant be the way, its a forest one. They were used so much in war than they were totally exterminated.

>> No.26131827

>>26131086
Pankration

>> No.26131882

>>26131655

I say Carthage. I've never heard Cartage.

>> No.26132318

>>26131740

This, so much this.

Also, new thread needed.

>> No.26132323

>>26131706
That should be reach, not range.

>> No.26132481

>>26132323
>that feel when you find long-discarded OC of yours via standard image search
>that feel when only the thumbnail is saved because neither foolz nor suptg saved the whole image
>that feel when it's related to KoDP ducks

>> No.26132522

>>26131212
Savate is a lot newer than the time period he's probably thinking of.

>> No.26132766

>>26130868
Should the grappling profiency have some small bonus to hitting the opponent wiht fists and stuff aswell?

>> No.26132797

I'll make the new thread since it appears no one else is.

>> No.26132854

>searching for Dominions 4
>it was actually announced
>it's pretty much Dom 3 with some sprites replaced
>same combat mechanic, magic and bad interface
>same crappy Bandar infantry and Oceania

>>26132766
You mean grabbing him and hitting, while he can't dodge?

>> No.26132870

>>26132854
What, they released Dominions 4? ERMOR VICTRIX.

>> No.26132885

>>26132854
>>26132870
>same Hell-like DRM
Don't even consider giving money to those pieces of shit.

New thread. >>26132879

>> No.26132973

>>26130814
Poland is off most of Polish radar too, so there's not much to be surprised of.

>> No.26133018

>>26131191
Which were themselves the eternal beastmen of the Valley of Flowers, who were creations of the corrupt and ambitious empire that once dwelled in the same lands before getting eaten by dragons.

The true story about this empire was that they were mortals trying to literally powergame the universe. They were the god-knowers who attempted to quantify worship of the deities and the rewards resulting from it, as well as every other form of magic to manipulate the univese.

They were bucked in the futt by dragons the size of Matterhorn. This was written just to make a very deeply emphasized notion about what the game's creator thinks of gamism.

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