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[ERROR] No.25211881 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Another leaked pic of the July WD

>> No.25212147

Flying monoliths? Fuck. This is an Apocalypse only type model, right? I can just picture the local Necron players proxying monoliths on nightscythe stands stands otherwise. Not sure how I feel about 40k shifting to larger and larger models

>> No.25212165

neo /tg/ can't use the catalog

>> No.25212181

Looks like dickbutt

>> No.25212451

I like it. Big models are cool and its something the devs have wanted to do for a while. Its just feasible now.

>> No.25212510

Goddamn that's cool. Now I wonder what Orks will get. Massive Squiggly beasts I hope.

>> No.25212680

Sure they'll get anything new? They have the stompa already. I could see the guard being in a similar spot too.

>> No.25212951

Hell its likely there will be just these two. Last time it was only the baneblade and stompa

>> No.25212988

yeah but last time GW was very different with its releases.

>> No.25213753

Yeah by Imperial Guard have the Behnblaaaade.

Chaos already had the Defiler and such. And a few other sources of Ork rumors have already stated Orkz are getting a Squiggoth, that's larger than the normal one from FW, but still smaller than the Gargantuan one.

"New Monsterous Creature - A large multi wound squiggoth type creature, not ForgeWorld, it is always hungry and uses a hunger points system. If it doesn't fulfill the hunger points with enemies it will rampage nearest unit friend or foe in order to eat."

Straight from the 1d4chan article
Which is sourced Naftka ala Faeit212, which has been taken down, but hes recovering from Google's douche bagery.

>> No.25216362


Chaos are getting that dumb tank that looks like a vindicator with a giant khorne torso on the front.

I really wish they'd release some sort of skirmish system for 40k. No vehicles, just infantry, characters, walkers and skimmers.

>> No.25216379

What will marines get?

>> No.25216384

Go home Ward, your drunk.

>> No.25216407

The niggas at WG should just release fuckin GREATER DAEMONS IN PLASTIC

>> No.25216409

*GW , my rage took over too much

>> No.25216428


>> No.25216500

They do that, it's called an 800 point army.

>> No.25216508

Considering that for all we know there could be a Werenought with fur and muscles, a chapelnought without a mangled hero - just runs on devotion to the emperor, a bloodnought psyker that... wait no that's covered... anyway, an Ultranought (despite the cheese associated with the Ultra) doesn't sound half bad for a dreadnoughts

>> No.25216515

I can fit Land Raiders, Monoliths, Hammerheads and Leman Russ' into 800 points

>> No.25216565

>800 point Land Raider army

That's 1 HQ, 20 Troops and 1 Land Raider. Still a skirmish.

>> No.25216592

With a Land Raider

>> No.25216647

Looks like they are bringing back the Æonic orb

Why are they butchering the remains of Epic to throw units that dont fit the 40k scale into it?
If they wanted to play a good large army&titan game, just play epic.

>> No.25216662

>800 pts.
>AV 14
I hope you enjoy getting glanced by 15+ Missile Launchers.

>> No.25216684

More money when you need to vuy normal kits to play Epic sized games. Also the reason why Epic miniatures are not made anymore

>> No.25216691

Vehicles are vehicles. You wanna make the point of how you can do something hypothetically, using the biggest vehicles gets the point across

>> No.25216705

Alright then.

>> No.25216723


Apocalypse basically being Epic 28mm, it's normal they bring back the good ole units who made Epic glorious.

There are days I still regret the massive engagements between an Imperator ant two Mega-Gargants, while the puny footsoldiers tried their best to remain out of them machines way!

>> No.25216727


The best kind!

>> No.25216906

Another? There were other pics too? Can anyone care to post those too?

>> No.25216965

no, no its not. Apocalypse is 40k but with more points, there are no similarities with the epic ruleset and lets be honest, apoc is horrid

>> No.25216984


I like Epic more than Apocalypse but I like 28mm more than 15mm. Feels bad.

>> No.25217013

What in the name of penis is that thing?

>> No.25217057

I know a guy that still put in 3 fliers and no ground troops (elysians) in a 650pt game.

>> No.25217069

oh I do agree, 28mm models are much nicer/detailed/easier to paint well.

I know your feel man, but at the same time we can sit back and laugh at all those "X is unbalanced, Y is broken" threads and know that since gw hasnt touched the old gems for years, then wont ruin them.
All hail Epic. All hail BFG!

>> No.25217076

the big ball-inside-monolith?
Æonic orb. Basically a 'cron titankiller powered by a miniature sun, mad science, big explosions. you get the gist.

>> No.25217875


I am discovering 1/72/20mm as pretty much the perfect 'compromise' scale personally.

Shame nobody but historicalfags use it.

>> No.25218106

So, we know what Necrons are getting(as if they needed more OP flyers) and we know what Daemons/CSM will likely be getting.

Do we know what Eldar, Space Marines, Nids, Tau, and Orks will be getting?

Because just giving necrons an AV14 titankilling flyer is pretty dumb when most armies that aren't Space marines have issues killing AV14 aircraft.

>> No.25218112

The monoliths look kinda cool but shit, this thing. The whole LOLOL TORSO ON TRACK just ruins it for me. Hopefully it will be good for kitbashing at least.

>> No.25218113

20mm is nice (I got a ton of WW2 Brits and just got some Germans for eastern front battles), but with little to no customization and rather limited details, you rarely get to do any nifty center pieces, etc. Or if you do, making them will require more skill than with 28mm heroic scale. Some manufacturers offer multi-part kits and customization options, but more often you're stuck with what ever single-piece infantry models came in the kit.

I'm planning to make Erwin König (Ed Harris' character in Enemy at the Gates) as a sniper for my Germans. Just take a sniper, give him an officer's cap, iron cross and an arm band.

>> No.25218121


Those two are the only things for the apocalypse "Re-issue", calling it now

>> No.25218131


Skulldozer looks like something out of Metalocolypse

>> No.25218156

Is that really its own kit, because it looks like a studio conversion/kitbash. The arms look like they're from the Dreadknight (along with the minigun, which seems to have a collar of khorne on it), the head is from the plastic DP kit, the exhausts on the sides look like they're from the Forge Fiend kit, there's juggernaut heads circling the container on its back, etc.

>> No.25218158

What the fuck is this shit, that's retarded

How about this in plastic instead?

>> No.25218184


>> No.25218206

Because Thats boring as fuck.

It looks more dark eldar than Khorne.

>> No.25218241

Hopefully we will see a modern re release of this as well. Complete with 4+ jink

>> No.25218262

Torso on tracks is metal as fuck, you uptight tripple faggot.

>> No.25218264

I honestly found the lack of cavalry in 40K disturbing. Cool Chaos mounts aside, there's plenty of stuff space cavalry could do

>> No.25218273

Should have had a regular Berzerker-size head. That would have been something to see.

>> No.25218302

Shit... it's propped up on Defiler leg sections as well.

The gun is a forgefiend or whatever head, isn't it?

>> No.25218312

we guntank now

>> No.25218326

Eh, works great for Orks with their lulzy style, but I'm just not seeing it with Chaos or anyone else. Maybe if they made it more fleshy and daemonic, like the grinder.

>> No.25218336

My thoughts exactly. And even Gundam found that design to be too silly in the end.

>> No.25218347


>> No.25218358

I don't mind the torso on tracks, but I'm not really a fan of the bloodcrusher kennel at the back

>> No.25218390

Nah, Chaos job is to look like they arrived straight out of a metal album cover. They shouldn't have to make sense with their warmachines. Otherwise all they are is the Imperium with spikes and horns.

>> No.25218396

>everyone getting cool shit
>Chaos gets this

Please no, its too dumb.

>> No.25218411

I know. The lack of cavalry is disturbing.

CSM bikers could have daemonic mounts.
IG already have rough riders.
SM could have beast mount things (I'm sure more chapters than SW ride on big animals).
Eldar could have Exodite lizard riders.
Tau could have Kroot riding on something Krooty.
Orks definitely need boars (with upgrades to cyboars, possibly just cyborg body upgrade).

>> No.25218452

Dreadknight riding another Dreadknight on all fours. Monstrous Cavalry.

>> No.25218495

With a cyber-mastiff wired to the controls of the four-legged dreadknight.

>> No.25218514

The CSM bike looks cool, though. But yeah, they could ride cyborg spawns or something.

Dark Eldar could have Haemonculi cavalry of some manner.

>> No.25218531

We already have bikes in most armies. Daemons don't have bikes but they have actual Cavalry.
IG already have Cavalry.
Eldar have bikes - they even have an aspect devoted to charging with giant lances in the style of knights.
Space Marine bikes could already count as cavalry ans Space Wolves have Calvary.
Orks have bikers.
Tau don't do cavalry charges so the point is moot.
Dark Eldar hide in vehicles and as such all of them ride horses you just can't see them because they leave them in the vehicles to die.
Nids are already all beasts, calvary isn't their style.
Did I miss anyone?

>> No.25218533

kroot already have kroot riders.
at least three different units

>> No.25218576

Generic as fuck.

Here's a real brass scorpion.

>> No.25218578

guess you all have never heard of the Khorn lord of battle... thats what that is on white dwarf..... just look it up it sure as fuck isnt a "new" thing.

>> No.25218579

Every single faction excluding Tyrranids has some sort of cavalry style unit. How much is enough for you? Space wolves, bloodletters, daemonettes kroot, and guardsmen even ride actual animals! How much is enough for you?!??

>> No.25218592

Even better, they should just allowed Chosen to take daemonic mounts. That was one of the biggest annoyances i had with the new codex. A lord and a unit of chosen on seekers or juggers would be so awesome.

>> No.25218607

>We already have bikes in most armies.

Bikes aren't cavalry. Sure, you can count as just about anything, but is there any really any good reason why we couldn't have more cavalry units?

>Tau don't do cavalry charges so the point is moot.

They also don't do CC, but Kroot do. And there's more uses for cavalry than a full frontal charge with lances. Like scouting, hit & run attacks, and flanking into enemy weak points.

You mean that 3 editions old merc list? The one you can't use with Tau? Sure, Tau get Krootox riders, but they're just infantry bulky W2 Kroot with a big gun, nothing more.

>> No.25218609

Yo dawg, we didn't want the Tyranids feeling left out on the cavalry front, so we put a Tyranid on your Tyranid, so now they can rip and tear while you tear and rip

>> No.25218616

Why are you so obsessed with cavalry

Bikes are basically the same thing

Get over it

>> No.25218627

So... Only some factions should be allowed the access to a certain unit type?

>> No.25218638

>And there's more uses for cavalry than a full frontal charge with lances. Like scouting, hit & run attacks, and flanking into enemy weak points.


Seriously. What part of flying over or around shit and shooting it in the sides or rear, or charging from the flank or going fast as fuck do cavalry have that bikes don't?

>> No.25218648

Why are you so obsessed with bikes?

Cavalry are an opportunity for variety in models and hilarity in a game that's not based on 100% seriousness.

Get over it

Do... do you not like variety in army lists?

>> No.25218649

You're right, lets just give everyone monstrous creatures, flyers and super-heavies.

>> No.25218651


>Not the Lord of Battles

Step up anon.

>> No.25218653

I'm not obsessed with bikes. You're obsessed with cavalry.

Which is the same thing as bikes, except you have a hard on for cavalry

>> No.25218655 [DELETED] 

It's... Not cute. but it's neat!

>> No.25218656

No I don't. I just don't discriminate

>> No.25218657

Beasts are Cavalry+ in the rules right now.
A giant monster riding a giant monster actually just makes no damn sense when you could just shit out the same monster as a single entity rather than making it detachable.

I just said that every faction already has access to that unit type or something that fulfills that role in the exact same manner.

>> No.25218662

But dude, what about how Hassan beat Abbaddon?

>> No.25218667

Try Infinity. Way better system, and models that don't have massively oversized hands/heads.

>> No.25218675

And Armani design all the uniforms

>> No.25218680

Bikes are literally cavalry of the future.

Get that through your thick skull.

There are reasons that people use machines to fly through space and guns to kill people and drive cars to work.

Eventually technology just outstrips normal creatures and you realize that a bike that can go 150kph is probably better than taking a fucking camel to work.

Just like we don't need the typical giant centrepiece model GW is shoving down everyone's throats we also don't need two stupid units in the same army that literally do the exact same thing. You are the reason GW hikes their prices.

>> No.25218681

Line of Sight: The Arguing

>> No.25218694

Avoid windows and holes when building terrain - makes life much easier.

>> No.25218699

>Better system
Debatable, exceptionally poor at mass combat, built for it's size
>model appearance
again, debatable. I prefer GW models but can see the attractiveness of cyberpunk Infinity stuff.
It's different and built for an entirely different purpose than 40k.

Those 6 fucking models could be your entire bloody army for christ's sake.

Some people don't want to play at such a small scale and want bigger armies.
Infinity is seriously worth trying out though.

>> No.25218706

Except cavalry can do much better over rough terrain than a bike can. In some instances, legs trump wheels.

>> No.25218708

Tau don't have bikes.

Also, daemonic cavalry would give special rules and stat changes to CSM. Juggernauts would be big and strong, seekers fast and nimble, discs jet bikes and what ever Nurgle gets tough as nails. SM monster mounts could act like SW thunderwolves, offering a more CC based unit over the shooty bikers (bonus Str., access to CC upgrades, etc.) Same with Ork boars.

>> No.25218717

>kill team (the white dwarf version)
>kill team (the rulebook/battle mission version)
>40k in a flash
>zone mortalis (forgeworld)
>shipboard combat (badab war)
>building combat (anphelion project)
>jungle combat (codex: catachans)
Shit, like, there's loads of skirmish options.

>> No.25218721


How can anyone prefer GW's miniatures to Infinity's? GW minis have terrible proportions and are basically just covered in detail to distract you from the fact that they all look like 80's cartoons. Infinity has simply beautiful sculpting.

>> No.25218724


>entire bloody army

Britfag detected, defending 40k is their national sport

>> No.25218730

I think, you're taking this a bit too seriously. You should lighten up.

Took a deep breath and so E?


Okay, pitch. Space Elves riding Space Raptors! Huh? Huh? Okay, okay. Chaos units riding Daemons! In an actual unit! Necrons riding... Mini Cyber Scorpions?

Anyway, think of the fun, I repeat FUN that could be had by people

>> No.25218737

I was showing how inferior the FW scorpion was.

But here;

>> No.25218738


Why are you so obsessed with one thing riding another?

>> No.25218762

>Better system
>Debatable, exceptionally poor at mass combat, built for it's size
I should have expanded my answer. Better system for a skirmish game than anything GW has done for the 40k universe over the years (40k in 40 minutes, Killteams)
>model appearance
>again, debatable. I prefer GW models but can see the attractiveness of cyberpunk Infinity stuff.
Agreed, art is subjective.
>It's different and built for an entirely different purpose than 40k.

Those 6 fucking models could be your entire bloody army for christ's sake.

Some people don't want to play at such a small scale and want bigger armies.
Infinity is seriously worth trying out though.
The guy was wishlisting for 40k skirmish rules. I suggested what I think is the best sci-fi skirmish game on the market right now. The Infinity system could never handle mass combat, but in the context of skirmish game, it's fantastic.

>> No.25218774

Not in the rules son, not in the rules.

Tau pathfinders should totally have bikes actually.
Juggernauts aren't slow anymore, they're just as fast as Seekers now.

Seriously, how you people don't realize that bikes and cavalry are almost entirely mechanically identical in 40k is a mystery to me.

Daemonic calvary is a dumb idea because it just showcases how few unique things daemons have that csm also have and better of. Look at whfb and realize that there is no reason to even run daemons as everything they can do Warriors do better for less while using all the cool centrepiece models of both factions.

I don't jerk off to anime-inspired cyberpunk maybe?

>> No.25218777

Yeah but bikes are dull. I can jazz 'em up, but they're dull

>> No.25218785


Guns have also replaced swords and warhammers. And we wear camouflage over bright dress uniforms and unit colours. Not to forget that smart weapons and mobile warfare have done away with trenches and massed infantry charges. Yet all of these things exist and are pretty much at the core of 40k.

If one unit of a type per army is enough, why do daemons need so many different chariots and cavalry units? Why do SW have both thunderwolves and bikers? Why both sanguinary guard and vanguard for BA? What's the deal with deff koptas (jet bikes), warbikes and nob bikers? Isn't one unit enough, they all basically do the same thing, don't they?

>> No.25218788


...but you do jerk off to catholic space nazis?

>> No.25218790


Scot here, fuck GW.

But then I see myself as Scottish not British so maybe that means I was banned from the sport.

>> No.25218791

Rough terrain exist in rules

>> No.25218797

>I don't jerk off to anime-inspired cyberpunk maybe?
See that's our problem, you should get out more

>> No.25218817

Don't be an asshole pal. I love Infinity but GW miniatures (the new ones) are also beautiful in most cases. Dark Eldar, Eldar, Necron, Tyranids I love most of them.
And to be honest some Infinity miniatures are weak but those are accidental. Plus the whole whore miniatures, but I just don't use them.

>> No.25218824

>Seriously, how you people don't realize that bikes and cavalry are almost entirely mechanically identical in 40k is a mystery to me.
Seriously, how you don't realize that bikes and cavalry are almost entirely mechanically identical in 40k is a mystery to me. Are you really gonna flip your shit if a guy uses proxies of marines riding... something that can take it's weight or Rough Riders riding horses?

>> No.25218830


>GW miniatures

It's ok, you're probably a shitty european

>> No.25218832

Space elves should have their raptors, we even had models for them in the past. I'll give you that.

Chaos units riding daemons pisses me the fuck off in WHFB. Seriously, skullcrushers are almost strictly better than bloodcrushers. It's like getting pissed on as daemons because on top of getting a shitty book WoC get all your cool toys on top of their own.
Daemons already have two cavalry units that are awesome.
I literally want to strangle the person who invented skullcrushers and the humanseeker riders. It's like: why don't we give everyone space marines in their army, only we make them cost 12 points and come with ccw/pistols/bolters. Doesn't that sound great?

>> No.25218834

I can't orgasm from a machine

>> No.25218838

You sound foreign

>> No.25218846

I'm an European and I feel disgusted at the thought of someone claiming GW minis are "beautiful".

>> No.25218851

Ahem. Sorry to but in to your argument gentlemen, but there's a very good reason why we shouldn't use cavalry:

They'd get gunned down before they even reached the enemy. We discovered this during the First World War, and I doubt even the most idiotic general of any faction would consider using horses on the battlefield.

>> No.25218863


Thank you for being an acceptable YUROP

>> No.25218867

Hell no! That shit is fucking awesome. Thunderwolf cavalry is cool as shit. I'm just trying to say we don't need a new unit entry for that shit when you can just have space marines on wolves instead of bikes or rough riders on horses or motorcycles instead of camels.

I dream of the day I see an eldar player using raptor riders as jetbikes.

>> No.25218871


40k 2nd edition

>> No.25218875

Hey! It so happens that I have your picture

>> No.25218884


Didn't Russia use mounted cavalry troops in WW2?

Hell, wasn't like 50% of everything the Germans fielded in the eastern fron horse drawn?

>> No.25218892


>don't like 40k, you're a hipster

Classic 40kidz troll

>> No.25218893

That massive split open monolith thing is fucking cool.
I'll probably never actually buy one because fuck it, but I'll look at it lustfully at GW.

>> No.25218907

Necrons are becoming more and more an army of killer alien-toasters, with flying kitchen appliance stores for their vehicles.

>> No.25218908

So.. huh, that Iyanden supplement lets you take a wraithknight as your warlord. And a spiritseer-council.

Mite b cool.

I probably should have put that in place of Necromunda, considering they're the same system.

>> No.25218922

Hold on, nest he'll try to be edgy by saying how much he loves 6th, how 'balanced' it is, and how great and important it is to have half the armies in the game be space marines.

>> No.25218924

The Poles had regiments of cavalry, although they usually fought as infantry but used their horses to transport them to and from battles.
The Russians did use horses to pull artillery, but not on a major scale.

>> No.25218933

Where the hell do you buy your toasters from to have them look like a monolith?

>> No.25218941


And if you've got a problem with 6th edition, it's because you don't play with the right people

>> No.25218946

Gunned down you say?

The Imperial Guard doesn't think that's a problem. Neither do the Orks. Marines are wary of it, but the tactics are much the same. The Tau love having their fodder gunned down and Necrons just get back up afterwards half the time. Sisters are too faithful to care and Dark Eldar would just take refuge in audacity.

Elves have Jetbikes anyway, so Elven Cavalry

>> No.25218948

yeah, no. I don't play this shitty game (I play Infinity mostly). But I admit that I like the fluff and most of the new miniatures are great. Also I love Blanche. Suck it.

>> No.25218955

Mounted Infantry and Calvary charges are COMPLETELY different things.

Mounted infantry used horses to get around and increased maneuverability, but an actual Calvary charge has been done like, what once in the past 100 years that didn't end up in a complete slaughter for the charging side, and that was because of a massive fluke.

>> No.25218960



>I don't play 40k, I just show up in 40k threads to defend 40k

>> No.25219012

Dude... You are letting go with your imagination. I don't defend 40k. It's shitty game that takes forever and has no tactical thinking or real options involved during the game. But I like some miniatures and fluff as I said. Don't be a retard and don't add your paranoia to what others say.

>> No.25219071

>Seriously, how you people don't realize that bikes and cavalry are almost entirely mechanically identical in 40k is a mystery to me.

I agree. Why do we have to put up with SM scouts when tactical marines do the same thing? What's the point of having two identical infantry options? Just have one and proxy the models as the other, if you're so obsessed with them.

>there is no reason to even run daemons

Yes, because when I start an army, I just look at all the models I can have. Daemons and Warriors play rather differently, so there's that.

>> No.25219094

There's also a reason why we shouldn't use trenches, swords and combat chainsaws, dress up in clothing/armour that doesn't stand out and why we shouldn't build slow, lumbering war machines that can be seen from orbit.

But unfortunately 40k runs on all those things, so...

>> No.25219097

Scouts and Marines have entirely different roles

>> No.25219109

>But I admit that I like the fluff
So then let me ask you this... Why? Is it because it's dark and unique for sci-fi (it's not unique at all, btw...)? Or perhaps because it's a "LOL FANTASY IN SPACE"?

>> No.25219110


You, I like you, I will kill you last

>> No.25219113


Hey GW, Sunrise Studios called with a Cease and Desist!

>> No.25219119

>Dude... You are letting go with your imagination. I don't defend 40k.
>I'm gunna call this guy a hipster for not liking 40k! Lols!

>> No.25219134

But they're both infantry! Their rules are exactly the same! There's absolutely no reason to have two of them! You're the reason GW is run by Jews and why everything costs so much!

>> No.25219136


Not him but for me, it is amusing and retardedly good

Also I like the aesthetic with a bit of modification

>> No.25219137


He likes the fluff because he liked it when he was 12, approximately 3 years ago

>> No.25219138

They're a bit late for that, considering how old the Lord of Battle is

>> No.25219148


what is "retardedly good" and why is it amusing?

>> No.25219161


It is purely subjective opinion of mine, I don't know how to express it so pardon me

But I find the loltorsobot is amusing, and retarded. Therefore I like it

>> No.25219166


So you think it's pretty stupid, so stupid it's over the top, and so stupid you'd be willing to spend $150 or whatever on it

>> No.25219176



>> No.25219178

Yeah, you see, that kind of thought is complete and total bullshit even in real life.

There are several major reasons that we don't engage in shit like trench warfare and such in real lift.

1) The value of each individual solider in the military is extremely high compared to the overall military expenditure of modern countries.

2) There is a MASSIVE mismatch between the military technological prowess of the enemies that modern military fights. When was the last time we saw a "real" hot war between modern superpowers/first world countries. Modern war depends so much on completely demolishing smaller, weaker, militaries using weapons like jets that singularly cost more than their entire army combined and are almost immune from anything that the enemy can possibly throw at them. As SOON as enemies appear that have similar capabilities, you can be DAMN sure that things such as trenches and such will appear on battlefields because armies cannot always be 100% reliant on having 100% reliable armor/air support when they are tied up fighting other comparable air/armor.

3) Public backlash. Currently with the massive amounts of coverage over wars and battles, there is massive public backlash over massive deaths, which really started with the Civil War. Before that, militaries could do WHATEVER the fuck they wanted because no one gave a shit what causality values were like

>> No.25219182


...i admire your commitment to stupidity, i guess

>> No.25219211


WWII proved that trench is not as good when you have trench destroyer, namely Tank

Thus it has shifted to maneuver warfare of tanks vs tanks, and closed terrain warfare in urban or dense forestation

The instance of trench warfare during WWII is limited, usually used on Urban Siege or Defensive Warfare. Case in example is Siege of Stalingrad or Bastogne/Battle of the Bulge

However, when they are tied up fighting comparable forces as you said, what happened is a bloody stalemate, case in example: Battle of Kursk

>> No.25219216


Thank You I guess, remember, taste is subjective, art is subjective

>> No.25219224

Can you see the issue here? In 40k, none of these things apply.

The cost of each individual soldier, or even a million soldiers is a pittance versus the output of even a planet. When the value of the target far outweighs billions of soldiers economic value, there is no reason to give a shit about each individual soldier.

Mismatch between technological prowess doesn't really exist in 40k. All armies are at least, "comperable" in technology. They all have air, armor, and foot soldiers that all do obscene amounts of damage.

Also, interesting fact about sword/bayonet charges. CC happens when there is some sort of "mismatch" lets say between the offensive and defensive powers of the respective armies. In real life, CC doesn't happen much because the offensive power of rifles and the like VASTLY outperform defensive technologies. Namely, you will die before you get into CC. Marines don't give a shit because, unlike in real life, defensive technologies have kept up to pace with offensive technologies.And CC happens to be an extremely efficient way of killing targets

3) Public Backlash in 40k? HAH!

>> No.25219226


taste isn't subjective at all. If you want to go around being a willfully ignorant asshole all over 4chan and loving torsobot I'm not going to stop you. I'm just going to continue mocking you and all your kind.

>> No.25219228


Trench warfare doesn't work half the time in 40k.

It works if it's IG fighting a cultist horde or orks or other such mindless foes, or Ultramarines holding a fortified position against Eldar body waves.

But in 13th Black Crusade cadians dug trenches and Typhus teleported into one and soloed an entire regiment of guardsmen. Daemons and Space Marines pop up from nowhere and don't have to deal with trenches unless they want to in fluff. Necrons sometimes just ignore trenches and guard positions too, depending on the dynasty's condition.

>> No.25219231



>> No.25219240


Yes it is subjective, that is why Lady Gaga is popular

>> No.25219251

Which happens to also conveniently be the magic material used for everything derptarded in 40k.

>> No.25219252


Lady Gaga is popular because she makes well produced and technically excellent vocal pop music and has a great creative image director. If you think you're a better vocalist than Gaga or a better producer than her production team I'd love to hear that shit (and make us both rich).

>> No.25219268

What on earth are you on about? You don't want cavalry in 40k because it's not realistic, while 7 foot dudes in brightly coloured armour are running in machine gun fire over an open field at the enemy while swinging a giant hammer and city block sized war machines are punching each other in the face while firing missiles that tear holes into reality?

>> No.25219272


See that is why taste is subjective, I dont think I like Lady Gaga's music

I find that Flute and Harp music is the pinnacle of taste, but not everybody agree with me

It has no empirical validation, therefore it is subjective

>> No.25219284


i prefer justin bieber

>> No.25219287


empirical validation has to do with the level of skill involved and the technical achievements advanced by the musician. you should probably learn a thing or two about music before you try to make this comparison.

>> No.25219307

Tanks are really the ONLY reason trenches aren't heavily used in modern combat.

Problem now is that, modern AT weapons can now deefeat modern MBT armor.

>> No.25219332

I don't give a shit about calvary in game. Calvary already exists in game.

>> No.25219338


Yeah I should, but I still don't like Lady Gaga because I don' like how it sounds, therefore the taste component is not empirically valid even though she is technically good and solid. It does not make her good in my opinion, my taste, see where I am going? opinions, taste, "art styles" are not objective.

Same with other things of interest, like hobby, do you like knitting? not everybody likes knitting, but some do, does people who dislike knitting have low taste?

>> No.25219346

>It works if it's IG fighting a cultist horde or orks or other such mindless foes

Which is like 90% of the fighting in 40k.

There's also whole regiments dedicated to siege warfare and fortifications. Even Marine chapters/legions, like Iron Warriors and Imperial Fists. In Storm of Iron there's a long and bloody siege war over an Imperial fortress, where the attackers inch their way at the fortification by digging trenches and deploying siege weapons. They also use trenches to repel the Imperial counter offensive. They even try to dig their way into the fortress underneath it.

>> No.25219347


Not really, do you know how much RPGs are used just to disable a Merkava Mk. IV? 46, and the crews are safe

>> No.25219387


The fact that you are playing and arguing about a game with action figures for 13 year olds should give you some indication of how your taste is totally fucked up and objectively bad to other adults

>> No.25219408

RPG-29 have shown to be able to defeat the front armor of a Challenger and has also defeated M1 Abrams armor, and in multiple cases seriously damaged the tank and caused KIA's.

Military guys are terrified of what might happen if this stuff gets into the hands of insurgents in a mass basis.

>> No.25219420


Is it though? how do you come up into conclusion that game for 13 years old are bad for adults? I have several colleagues who has coloring books as their hobby

>> No.25219448

>adults who has coloring books as their hobby

Either you know some SERIOUS hipsters or you are the resident of an insane asylum and the people you believe are your colleagues are actually other inmates

>> No.25219450

Why even uses RPGs as a serious anti-tank weapon anymore?

>> No.25219477

Just weld a metal grate some distance away from the armor.

>> No.25219485

>Military guys are terrified of what might happen if this stuff gets into the hands of insurgents in a mass basis.

That doesn't quite describe the existential fear the Pentagon has of this thing. The Iraqi army is banned from buying the damn thing because they're that terrified.

>> No.25219489


Yes RPG 29, one case, I know that maybe military dudes are covering up some cases of penetration

But Cojones Eh has proven that MBT are super durable that they need artillery strikes plus A-10 strafing run with AGM Mavericks just to make sure that the Abrams are not looted

And the armors still survived those ordeals, you can also find some vids in Liveleak on how Merkava survives several salvo of Metis and Kornet

Please also bear in minds that proper Armor formation won't even give RPG a chance of hitting the MBT, most case of casualties from IDF and ISAF are from MBT who strayed from formations or their crew is exposing body parts outside

This is coming from the "Military guys" you are refering to, My dear friend in USMC also said that facing MBT with infantries is the pinnacle of stupidity, ATGM and RPGs are created as supplement to MBT, not hard counters

Hard counters to MBT is Air superiority

>> No.25219501


I rest my case

>> No.25219514


In my opinion, they are terrified it might get used to destroy HUMVEE and Stryker, it would totally demolish IFV, APC and light vehicles

MBT? different class altogether

>> No.25219530

A RPG 16 can already take out a HUMVEE. This punches through the side and turret armor of a M1

>> No.25219535


It is still super effective against lighter armor, and most patrols are light to medium armor

high-end MBT is expensive to buy and maintain, that is why it is nigh-perfect

>> No.25219542


You seem incapable of separating between terrible decisions and actual taste

>> No.25219559


You mean the old M1? M1A1, 2 and 3 is very, very different

Unless it can shot the joint of the turret, I am sorry to say that I cannot fathom the fact that it can penetrate M1A1

>> No.25219568


Your opinion

>> No.25219636

Yes, lightly armoured and soft-skinned vehicles, sure. They're more than capable of taking care of them. But what serious nation has RPGs as their main anti-tank weapon to take on MBTs?

Then again, our instructor in the army was convinced that our renamed M72 LAWs were perfectly capable of taking on, say, the Russian T90. So what do I know? I'm sure anyone who decides to try it won't have anything left for me to patch up at the aid station.

>> No.25219657

That was in Iraq so I assume either 2 or 3. AFAIK the M1A1 was a terrifyingly underpowered piece of shit until the updates for the Gulf War.

>> No.25219665

When the stetting your in allows you to ride a suped-up, augmented alien monster from Gods know where that can shrug off bolter shots, then cavalry is totally viable.

It at least works for Space Wolves.

>> No.25219722


I agree with you, only Vampir (RPG-29) has proven to seriously penetrate modern day MBTs armor and it is generally considered a n extraordinary feat

Why? because closing in a MBT require a great deal of mental strength and a bit of insanity, especially if they have escorts


Indeed, I only know that several M1A1 are damaged by RPG-29, not 16, Correct me if I am Wrong

>> No.25219770

I wasn't implying older RPGs could handle a MBT, I was just saying that the light stuff would probably hurt whether it was a RPG7 or a Hashim

>> No.25219789


Ah yes, my English is bad so pardon me

>> No.25219835

I see Scriptarius finally got a job at GW

>> No.25219971

My biggest issue with the stupid Lord of Battle model is that it only has a place in Khorne armies. Couldn't they have used something a little more generic for Chaos like a small titan with god-specific bitz so it can be customized to fit the player's army?

>> No.25220095

This is all my pain. MWF I have an apocalypse force for Tzeentch and this model will be useless to me.

And he Lord of War is more themed for a Chaos Marine Army, not Daemons.

>> No.25220099

The model is painted AND unoriginal. At least Scriptarius didn't make models that already existed.

>> No.25220306

This is bullshit, Necrons don't need anything new, they're already OP

>> No.25220312


Siege focused marine chapters are stupid and contrary to the idea of a space marine as a mobile elite force, but that can be chalked to them being the posterboys and needing everything. The 40k writers not really caring (or knowing, none of them have degrees in real sciences or military studies under their belt) about function or consistency of their universe, so they tend to be bafflingly unskilled at what they do as well.

>MFW an Iron Warrior fortressworld once fell because a trygon burrowed into their stronghold under the walls

>> No.25220318


Shitty ridiculous "conversion" is shitty no matter who made it - Scriptarius was a fucking faggot and you know it

>> No.25220423

So your trygon sneaks under the wall to find that there is only a gorillion autoguns and landmines behind it because the iron warriors actually just make fortresses that are worthless deathtraps for giggles?

>> No.25220442


No, that was a canon event.

Worth a laff at least.


>> No.25220464


Does absolutely every single Space Marine chapter HAVE to be a mobile elite force? Or can some be specialized to tackle other types of problems, your Highness?

>> No.25220494


That's what the original concept of "1000 guys with their own interstellar transportation" was about.

1000 guys who deploy tanks lighter than the real army of the imperial faction and start sieges is just idiocy but understandable from sales standpoint - the most popular faction is the power armored faction so you'll get power armoured guys that do everything no matter how stupid it is in fluff and it sells anyway.

>> No.25220497

Iron Warriors, why you so dumb?

>> No.25220523

>During the invasion of Forgefane by Hive Fleet Leviathan, Warsmith Kolvax arrogantly declared that he would single handedly defeat a Trygon they had named Tremorbeast. He was eaten whole by Tremorbeast shortly before it breached the defences of Ironblood Citadel and the fall of Forgefane.

>> No.25220543

Probably they wouldnt know there was a fucking living bug-diglett the size of a building cappable of sneaking around eating the fucking ground or something. You know, in the fluff each army hasnt read all the codexes. Half of the time, they are like DUDE SERIOUSLY WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT.

>> No.25220569

More like a dozillion trygons.

>> No.25220572

Iron warriors know that hades breaching drills exist. Why wouldn't they think to defend against those?

>> No.25220667


Yeah, GW would have us believe iron warriors are masters of siege warfare and fortress building who once took over the galaxy - and their strongholds can be overcome by tunneling in from under the wall!

>> No.25220712

The Tremorbeast conversion that appeared in that article was sweet - pic related, only image I can find of it online. Yet despite it looking like it was built and painted by the studio, I've never seen it again. And they had datasheets for the Tunnel Swarms and Bioshock Broods mentioned in the story but didn't give the Tremorbeast any rules.

>> No.25220739

In their books they prepare landmines, tunnels, and other sit, ready to fuck with anyone trying to go under there. It seems reasonable for them and their large quantities of resources to think that anyone hasnt enough drillers to explode, nor living pilots willing to die, and not so fast or silent to get them surprised. Then the hivemind said -No, fuck you.- and sent wave after wave of terrifying mindless monster that can move under earth like water or something.

>> No.25220851


Even the first one of trygons got through in forgefane, it seems that what Iron Warriors consider reasonable is in fact most unreasonable!

>> No.25220965

Ok, there isn't another explanation, the writer is retarded. Is like the avatar being the bitch of everyone and everything.

>> No.25221021


That's what you get with devs who have no knowledge of real science or military strategy.

Liberal arts majors are good at painting a broad strokes picture of the setting "Space Marines are so mighty that 1000 are enough to conquer an entire subsector in weeks" but the moment things get detailed the derping starts.

>> No.25221176

I hear a WW2 Lee tank has thicker armour than a Land Raider

>> No.25221221


try it

>> No.25221286

>Chaos job is to look like they arrived straight out of a metal album cover.

Oh shut the fuck up, this is not the criteria for a good chaos model.

>> No.25221354

Yeah, but that really doesn't mean shit when one is made of steel, and the other is made of some super sci-fi material.

>> No.25221570

You mean Girlyman wrote that Marines should be mobile elite forces and nothing more, right? Because fuck him and his "this is how Marines should be".

The strength of Marines is NOT that they drop from orbit waving big hammers and screaming bloody murder. Their specialty is that they can respond to threats quickly and without going through proper Imperial channels. They can arrive and begin fortifying Imperial positions while the call for help is still making its way through the Munitorum bureaucracy. By the time the Guard arrives with aid, the chapter has fortifications up and can assist the Guard with tactical knowledge, hit & run strikes on the enemy and moving their forces where they are needed across the battlefield, independent of the IG command structure.

Mentor Legion especially is known for distributing their forces across the Imperium to aid other organizations instead of fighting as one force. They offer their knowledge and in turn learn new ways of war, which they record and teach new recruits, who in turn teach it to others somewhere else in the Imperium.

>> No.25221580

Which they named steel

>> No.25221615

Really? I thought it was plasteel and ceramite. It'd make more sense really, considering that's what you make all your muhreens wear.

>> No.25221646

It would but; 135mm Steel

>> No.25221648

I think you mean the handwavium armour is equivalent of 300mm of conventional steel. On and Abrams the same figure is around 1300-1600mm.

>> No.25221682


Not any in-universe crap, that's how marines were written by the devs since RT era.

And using a rapid responce assault force whose equipment is lighter than guard's to fortify stuff is beyond ridiculous, luckily it's very rare for GW to put even Imperial fists to the job you describe.

Mentors' thing is something that could be done with normal databanks and instructors, not something you need ridiculously expensive power armored supersoldiers for. It's like dragging cutting edge researchers from postdoctoral work into teaching in elementary schools. It sounds cool, but ain't practical, and is also in all likelihood something that stemmed from the popularity of Space Marines and resulting demand for marines in every role.

>> No.25221746

BTW, did you know that the Predator (AV13/11/10) is only 6 tonnes lighter than the Land Raider, and has on-road max speed of 65 kph (LR 55)?

>> No.25221762

That's the one, I haven't seen the the comparison pic in awhile, turns out I'm way off. But yeah that's the one

>> No.25221833

So it didn't have any rules?

>> No.25221942

Nope. This was all the info on it.

>However, of all the beasts that crawled beneath the surface of Forgefane, there was one that proved to be more deadly than any other. This monster could peel open plasteel bunkers as if they were made of parchment and eight bastions fell in as many days following its first sighting. In their need to find a focus for their hatred, the Iron Warriors named this creature the Tremorbeast, and with each massacre its reputation grew. The Warsmith, in his arrogance, resolved to slay the Tremorbeast personally – he was swallowed whole for his efforts, dragged into the creature’s gullet by a writhing mass of tentacles. The Tremorbeast breached the Ironblood Citadel mere hours later, and as the Tyranid swarms poured through in its wake, the Iron Warriors knew that Forgefane was lost.

>> No.25222255

You mean RT stuff like the RT era piece on the Badab War (WD Compendium pg. 33), where the Star Phantoms chapter lays siege on Badab while chapters like Nova Marines and Howling Griffons were patrolling space-lanes for pirate activity?

Or RT book, on pg. 153, saying Marines are independent armies on their own with their own ships and are often the first ones on the scene?

I must suck, because I fail to find where in RT it says Marines are used ONLY for mobile elite force. Yes, they do raids and tactical strikes, but it also says they use tactics most suited to the situation.

>> No.25222524

And when actual engineers and other hard science majors try to write fiction, it often just devolves into reading a technical manual that bores people looking for a story.

>> No.25222728


Having a science major doesn't gimp your storywriting skills, a bad liberal arts major writer would just add his own brand of wank. Knowledge of the concepts or detail isn't hurting you.

>> No.25222851


Sieging a world with a fleet of ships is consistent with Marines' role as an independent strike force, nowhere in the compendium was it stated that the Phantoms made planetfall and set up a chapters' meager number of vindicators and devastator squads to "siege" Huron's palaces.

Patrolling works too regarding marines' role, but the most glaring issue with the compendium's Badab fluff is that Space Marines are given the task and no one else gets involved because...absolutely no explanation! Just because the devs (Priestley) feel like showcasing a certain army, not because of any thought out in-universe reason.

Later it became an "astartes affair" but that's later devs adding their own troubles to the mess.

>> No.25223599 [SPOILER] 

>A giant monster riding a giant monster actually just makes no damn sense

What about a robot riding another robot?

Dude, seriously, give up, the crazy train has returned and it has no brakes.

>> No.25223841

Dude, their writters fucked up, stop trying to justify shit.

>> No.25226228

Anon please, what are you smoking. Chaos should look as baller as possible, and 80's heavy metal covers are one way of doing it.

>> No.25226265


>> No.25226365

Because 80's metal covers =/= good models.

>> No.25226371

So what's a good model to you, then?

>> No.25226412

Depends on the model. Generally, a unifying aesthetic and (extremely remote) plausibility are pretty nice. The khornemower has neither, it looks more like a toy than a war machine, and the idea of a centaur tank is stupid, no matter how you spin it.

A scaled up decimator engine would've looked ten times better.

>> No.25226647


It has a unifying aesthetic with everything khornate - red, brass and skulls fucking everywhere. It looks like its only reason to exist is to fuck shit up.

>scaled up decimator
So a spiky Warlord titan? Flying off the shelves already.

I get it. You're one of the faggots who think that 40k must be grim and serious all the time, despite being an inherently silly and over the top setting.

>> No.25226774

>I get it. You're one of the faggots who think that 40k must be grim and serious all the time, despite being an inherently silly and over the top setting.

And you're one of those people who can't enjoy anything un-ironically. Are you saying shit the horus heresy books are actually comedies or what?

40k hasn't been openly silly for the better part of 2 decades now, and certainly suits grimdark a hell of a lot more than goofy shit like the khornemower. Heck, if I'd most likely be all over it if 40k actually was a lighthearted setting, but it really isn't.

>> No.25226799

Oh, like that's obvious? what does = good models? Twee mulatto raver surfers shitting their pants?

>> No.25226837

I'll just proxy a leviathan crusader instead.

>> No.25226940

Have you fucking read those books? If you can take that shit seriously there is something wrong.
And that brilliantly stupid robotank couldn't be MORE grimdark. It's like a Bolt Thrower album on repeat at top volume inside a knocked-over portapotty filled with teargas. If Tau or whatever are grimmer to you we must be communicating through a dimensional wormhole

>> No.25226987

The khorne thing is more grimderp than grimdark.

>> No.25226989

135mm imperial space steel. Not RHAe

>> No.25227944

It hasn't been openly silly, but it hasn't dropped its silliness either. It's a typical british dystopia filled to brim with dark humour, giant dudes punching other giant dudes with giant weapons and everything being crazy. I'm sorry if you can't detect any of it.

Don't get me wrong, I like me some Abnett and the tragedy of Prospero, but that doesn't mean I don't like the shenanigans of Redeemer, Killboy, Ciaphas Cain or Dark Eldar dicking eachother over and having a good laugh about it. 40k is a setting, not one long story. It is a backdrop for stories, both grim and serious and light hearted, goofy and downright brutal. So there is both place for crazy shit like the Khornethrone 3000 and Doomrider as well as slightly more grounded stuff like Decimator.

But god damn, bitching how a model is dumb because it is not enough grimdark (how the FUCK a giant rapemachine clad in skulls is not grimdark) is, well, dumb.

>> No.25227981

Put a wall behind him and he's suddenly all dynamic and ducking.

What's him you and poop anyway buddy?

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