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[ERROR] No.18912652 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

a greenskin thread.
post your ideas, experience and immages.
im particulary intrested in Squigs and spiders.

>> No.18912680

does large mmonster size squigs exist?

>> No.18912694

Right now I have a small mob of 12 Stormboyz. Should I beef them up? (I don't have the codex on me, what's their max number?)

>> No.18912902

I'd just like to come in and say that today, I stomped a Grey Knight army. Nobz are a life-saver.

>> No.18912924

>>18912902
And it only took about four games against the fuck to find his weakness.
They are just the ESSENCE of overpowered. Luckily he sucks ass at tactics.

>> No.18912934

>>18912902

Bikes? Klaws? Painboy?

>> No.18912954

>>18912934
Nobz, Warbosses, Attack Squiggs, Klawz on everything, Painboyz and Trukkz.
It took so many points, but I was able to move around, disembark, and then stomp everything, sometimes it took a bit TOO much to kill them with this bullshit 2+ saves they seem to get even against double toughness.

>> No.18913016

>>18912954
I get raped against my buddies GK when I use Nobz.

He's like: "Oh cute, multi-wound-models." *Power-weaponed*

And I cry, because my 800 point death-ball went out like a bitch with 5 GK attacks.

And I can't load up on boyz because he LOL PURIFIERs them.

Its a bad time for me. Lootaz are about all that works. Maybe I should run burna boyz and just spray him.

>> No.18913043

>>18912954

Ah yes. Green Cheese. Delightful.

>> No.18913048

>>18913016

Burna power weapons could be pretty cool. How well do vehicles work against GK?

>> No.18913085

>>18913048
My friend runs a list specifically to pop metal boxes. He has few, high powered weapons. But against AV14 with a Big Mek around, he doesn't fare well against battlewagons. He just waits till I have to get out and murders me. Or opens them with his own power weapons.

I just think that GK more or less hard counters Orks. All he has to do is take some purifiers and he wins. hands down. The only way I've been able to hurt him even remotely is realize that I lose the melee game and focus on shoota boyz. If I can outplay him I can dakka his shit up. But if he lives, he just charges me with a purifier and literally kills half my army. Its bullshit.

>> No.18913124

>>18913085

Do your Nobs have a Waaaagh Banner?

>> No.18913152

>>18912694
Stormboyz are fun, but nothing more.

They die like boyz, but are more expensive. And their jet-packs are pretty lackluster.

Totally a cool unit though. My non-GK friend plays Eldar, and it was fun to swarm his tanks with them. Painted a pretty epic scene. They're struggling to lift off, maneuvering horribly as orks fly up and crash onto the wings, cracking the glass. The pilot turns the barrell quickly and sends a stormboy falling to his doom.The greenskin tries to activate his pack, but it malfunctions. Like a firework, he explodes in the sky.

The eldar tries to initiate his star-engines but they fail. A swarm of stormboyz is clawing at his engines and one manages to shoot a fuel tank. A massive explosion rips the sky, massacring the 3 boyz on board.

tl;dr : I assaulted his tank with them, killed it, but lost 4 in the explosion. Shit was cash.

>> No.18913157

>>18913124
banner, painboy, like 3 claws, boss pole. They are kitted out hard.

>> No.18913168

>>18913016
>>18913085
Yeah, GKs are the worst fucking thing in 40K. I am so lucky my friend doesn't know how to use them to their full power.
I mean, even how he plays, it gives me a hard fucking time.
+2/+3 when I need 3's and 4's to hit. It is just a pure fucking cockfest.

>> No.18913209

>>18913168
GK just has an answer. For. Everything.
Vanilla SM's have to gear towards a particular goal, or split their purpose into a 'diet' army. Thats the disadvantage to playing an elite army vs a horde army. But GK's.
Tanks? No probs. Shooty Dread.
Horde? Purifier.
CC? Psycho-grenades. You attack yourself.

Their only weakness is their mediocre shooting which is why my shootaboyz did better than sluggaboyz. But in order to be in range, you are also in assault range. Not to mention its hard as shit to ork-shoot into termie armor.

Bull-shit.

>> No.18913257

>>18913152

>Stormboyz are fun

Welp, time to buy some more Stormboyz.

>> No.18913267

>>18913209
Exactly. And every time I win, or come close, or do anything that evens out the game, he says that I shouldn't be able to. He knows good and fucking well that his army is overpowered, and when I find ways around it, or pay out the fucking nose to beat it, he calls bullshit or says my Orkz are overpowered.
>"You shouldn't be able to go toe-to-toe with my Paladins."
WELL I SPENT THE POINTS TO DO THIS. IT COSTED MORE THAN ANYTHING YOU FUCKING HAVE
>"Well this costed this much"
I DONT CARE YOU PAID HALF WHAT I DID AND HAVE MASTERCRAFT AND REROLLS ON 1S
>"WELL THAT COSTED A LOT"
I DONT GIVE A FUCK ITS OVERPOWERED BECAUSE IT ONLY COSTED YOU AN EIGHTH OF WHAT IT WOULD COST ME TO GET THAT ON HALF THE GUYS.

I mean come the FUCK on. They cost way too little.

>> No.18913348

>>18913267
Cause generally boyz > terminators.
Theres 20 of you. 5 of them. Powerfist makes them go last. you hit them >9000 times. You'e gonna force some 1's and kill like the whole unit. Especially if you dakka into them first. My shootaboyz *love* starting down termies.

But freakin purifiers man. "Oh, you assault me? Half your unit dies. And I have halberds so I attack first. And I have Grenades so you *roll* *consult chart* shove your miniatures up your ass..."

Like... what is the answer? I tried head-strong deffrollin them, killed like one. Next turn he surrounded it and blew it up.
I tried loota-ing them to death. 2 squads of 13 took out about 5. which was good. My shootaboyz mopped up the rest. But like. Oh wow, my entire turn was spent killing 8 guys! Look at that!

>> No.18913422

>>18913348
no fucking shit. I wish I still had my full ork army because I play chaos now and I fucking DESPISE grey knights for the reasons stated earlier. Orks at least I could just throw down buckets of dice and force saves on them where a 10 man squad of 3+ men get wiped out due to ini 5-6 power weapons from a BASIC squad of grey knights. jesus fuck I hate those grenades too.

>> No.18913427

But seriously. A Warboss, mega armor, and attack squigg, with 10 Nobz each. The Nobz take a dedicated transport Trukk. All of the Nobz take Power Klawz and cybork.
Trukk takes a wrekkin ball and a red paint job.
Rush forward, if you can, move less than full so you can disembark and assault.
Either way, most GKs can take those bullshit instakill power swords that still seem to go their first mother fucking init. Force Weapons just need to be gotten rid of entirely. Or at least give the Orkz some. Hell, Tank hammers should be counted as such, THEY ARE FUCKING ROCKET PROPELLED HAMMERS.

Or at least give me Storm Nobz. Something like that.

I've never even seen a Terminator take power fists, they always have some sword that is JUST as powerful, that goes at their normal init.

>> No.18913452

Already made two vehicles for a friend because I found some old toys and wanted to ork them up instead of throw them out. Also found a windup toy which I'm making into a deffdred, hopefully I can find out how many winds is 6 inches, so one could just wind it and then set it on the table to move its movement
I can take pictures, but the vehicles are both primed black so i don't thin you'll be able to see much and the dread is still very wip (and I fucked up the front tusk design thing)

>> No.18913474

>>18913427
I meant vanilla termies.
And whats that squad of 10 nobz gonna do when 3 or 4 die to purifier and the other 6 get mopped up by halberds before they even move?

>> No.18913488

>>18913422
Don't forget the CONSTANT orbital strikes, which can literally rid the field of 60 boyz in a turn.
>>18913348
It takes so much to take down grey knights. I have a lot of lootas I don't normally use. I may take some of them instead of some boyz, which are literally, and I am serious when I say this, USELESS against Paladins. Why? Because no matter what, I need a 5 to hit, 6 to wound, and then they fucking get a +2/+3. Statistically, I have about 3% change for a boy to even wound a Paladin. Even when I have 20 of them, that still doesn't help at fucking all when they all have 3 fucking wounds.

>> No.18913497

>>18913427
I think tank hammers are counted at str 10 so they insta gib most marine commanders if they fail their save anyway.

>> No.18913515

>>18913488
paladins have 2 wounds. your boyz should be packing a nob with a klaw murdering at least 2 paladins a turn while you remove boyz as ablative wounds.

>> No.18913530

>>18913497
Yeah, but still not as retard powerful as GK force weapons. I liked playing the game and being able to do actual tactics. When Grey Knights come out, you throw out tactics and just shit on the table for an hour.
>>18913515
A group of Nobz have a hard time taking them out.

>> No.18913531

This is arguably the most inherently awesome Warhammer 40k I've seen to date.

>> No.18913539

>> No.18913550

Incidentally, this also characterizes various policy attempts of the Republican Party.

>> No.18913559

>> No.18913569

dibz on the pyro-choppa.

>> No.18913578

You know what I really love about Warhammer 40k ?

The overarching theme of, "if you want to make something really cool, make it really BIG!"

>> No.18913580

First miniature I painted.

>> No.18913584

>>18913580
Looks great.

>> No.18913589

>>18913580
just because you believe you painted a miniature, doesn't mean that you actually did.
that only works for the Orkz.

>> No.18913594

>> No.18913602

WAAAAGGGGHHHH!!

>> No.18913606

>>18913580
forgot pic lol...

>> No.18913715

Yeah GK are completely overpowered. It's pretty ridiculous. But hey, new ork codex this year according to the rumor mill!

>> No.18913735

>>18913715
Something tells me that it will make my army either unplayable, or nerfed as hell. And I will just walk away from 40K forever.

>> No.18913761

just picked up this fella. i don't have a camera; but i spent all yesterday putting him together. 100% as cool IRL as online. so worth it.

>> No.18913766

I once painted up an army of Ultraorks who had recognized Marneus Calgar as their spiritual warboss.

>> No.18913813

>>18913735
why not just use an old codex if that happens?

>> No.18913839

>>18913813
Because that'd be "against the rules"

>> No.18913846

>>18913735
I hope they bring back proper looted vehicles, that "looted wagon" shit from our current codex was a punch to the dick and a huge "fuck you" to blodaxe and deathskulls players.

>> No.18913882

>>18913846
They will probably make shit that no one use and new kits good. So i guess flash gits, tank bustas and looted tanks will be great this time around?

>> No.18913911

Where'd these new ork codex rumors come from? I'm just starting out, do I have to revamp my army list again?

Isn't Chaos slated for getting a new book within the year?

>> No.18913939

>>18913882
I have a looted leman russ and a basilisk that have been gathering dust since 3rd ed. They will be happy to come out to play again, I know they could be run as battlewagons/bigtrakks but it just doesn't feel right to me. Have a looted landraider too, but it is a horrible model and I won't be using it ever again.

>> No.18913964

I feel your pain.

I was a daemonhunter, once.

I had three squads of inquisitorial stormtroopers, chimeras, an inquisitor lord, and a small force of grey knight terminators. I rarely won, but my victories were tactical and each game was hard fought and fun.

>>Grey Knights Codex

>>Most of army is now unfieldable and my army will forever wear a scarlet letter.

Kill me. Just kill me.

>> No.18913986

>>18913964
>I'm bitching that Mat Ward objectively improved my codex

>> No.18914002

>>18913986

Hey, the man had a perfectly good Inquisition based army turned into Marine wank, cut him some slack.

>> No.18914045

>>18914002
I played Daemonhunters in 3e.
I have no complaints about the new codex whatsoever. He's just bitching for the sake of bitching.

>> No.18914056

>>18913986
Yes. Thank you, O' omniscient masters for making me junk my Daemonhunters and forcing me to play mary sue flavored space marines. Fuck you and fuck Ward.

>> No.18914065

Latest 'boss. Really need to finish my Waaagh, just got my Templar Crusade done painting.

>> No.18914135

One of the more amusing games I had was one where through MSU-multiassaulting shenanigans, I was able to dismantle a Draigostar in 2 turns.

We're still surprised it worked.

>> No.18914174

Assaulted a 1200 point unit of Grey Knights with my lone battlewagon. They fail their morale check and are escorted off the board by the wagon. 20 minute match for 2k/person. We rematched and I got by via objectives.

>> No.18914203

>>18914135
klaws are pretty good. news at 11.

>> No.18914223

>>18913986
>overpowered == improvement in every situation ever; especially for people who play an army for flavor and fun; but not necessarily to win tournaments.

>> No.18914231

GENTLEMEN.

I have a vision. It is to kitbash a pimp themed Bad Moonz warboss model.

Now, I've got most everything thought up but I need help with one final detail.

His hat. What would be a good hat to put on a orky pimp warboss? Would I be able to find one already existing, or would I have to sculpt one from scratch?

>> No.18914262

>>18914056
>I HAVE TO play Grey Knights despite having the option of playing an inquisitor and his henchmen
>a bloo bloo bloo waaaard
You, sir, are a manchild.

>> No.18914268

>>18914231
An Eldar helmet, brightly coloured and ded flash. Nailing a feather to it is optional.

>> No.18914271

>>18914231
Greenstuff a carmen sandiego hat, paint it purple with silver trim and dark angels bits for the feather in the brim.

>> No.18914285

>>18914174
1500pt dreadmob vs draigowing
>roll scenario
>killpoints
Ohboyherewego
>GKs deployed between 2 cliffs, only 2 ways in and dreads won't fit through the 2nd as the gap was too small
>PSYCANNON
>PSYCANNON
>PSYCANNON
>PSYCANNON
In the end I had managed to kill 2 paladins with a charge and his librarian failed 2 perils of the warp and died of a headache. My army was munched to bits, charge of da zoggin' light brigade.

What a horrible night to have a melee army.

>> No.18914287

>>18914203
They are...but not when you go last and every hit on you is instant-death, and you have to take dangerous terrain first...

We actually had the game because we were wondering "how exactly *did* Blackmoor do so well with his list?" So we tested out the list he used last year at NoVa...and I used an Ork list with 2 Battlewagons (min-strength meganobs), some trukkboyz, Ghaz, 2 units of Lootas...simple enough stuff.

There were a few things that helped:
1) He had tried to spread out his men in a line to threaten more. So I assaulted on two flanks. 5 or so Paladins could not Defenders-react without breaking squad coherency.
2) Ghaz aimed his assault towards the librarian specifically.
3) Only one model was eligible to hit my Meganobz.
4) I sent a Loota unit into the fight...a 5-strong loota unit, which tied up some paladins, and Draigo. It took about 12 wounds worth of casualties, which only count as 5 for CR. Meanwhile, each dead Paladin is another 2 CR...

It was fairly hare-brained yet systematic in how it worked. The interceptors/other GKs were blocked from supporting by means of sacrificial Warbuggy-roadblock.

>> No.18914290

Questions for the bosses.

One, if purifiers are such an issue in CC, why can't a horde of shoota boys hopping out of a trukk take down their 5ish man squads without the danger of taking 25% casualties from psyker crap in assault? Also do any of you use battlewagons? I know theres that double autocannon dreadnought shit, but heavy armor or say, kan squads with a mek force field could work, right?

Also, my friend who plays orks' first model he ever bought was Snikrot and shortly after some kommandos, but I haven't seen him use them lately. He plays a lot of games with a tyranid player. Are kommandos bad or something?

Just curious.

>> No.18914295

>>18914271
Alternatively paint it codex grey and leviathan purple wash for the details of it, if you put some in. Press the GS between two layers of a shirt with defined threads in it to get the look.

>> No.18914309

>> No.18914333

>>18914287
Edit: detached from a unit in move-phase, Waaaagh-moved so the Librarian was the closest model to assault.

>>18914290
Shootas are suitably annoying. With luck, you might even snipe the Psycannons out.

>> No.18914339

>>18914285
I admittedly got lucky with that failed roll--one that many would say is the only real way to kill the GK. Sucks, but maybe I'm a little bitter.

>>18914290
They're not bad, but there's waaay better uses for points in the codex. Sure, you get infiltrators (or Ambush if you paid for Snikrot, and if you use him tie along a killy HQ for backside shenanigans) but all they'll be is a fire magnet and not really pay their points back in the end. While it's true that using two burnas in a 5 man squad has its uses, you could be buying more boyz with those points. Or lootas. Or anything else.

>> No.18914352

>>18914271
>>18914295

Sounds baller, taking note. That fabric trick is quite clevva.

>>18914268

You know I could use an eldar helmet for the "tower" portion of the hat, that might be amusing.

>> No.18914387

>>18914352
Best of luck with that. Don't worry about losing some of the circular shape of the brim after you press it--while it might be an issue with some armies, you're making an ork boss. A little dodgyness is accepted, even expected.

And don't forget to take photos, mang.

>> No.18914400

>>18914290
>Are kommandos bad or something?

Not really, just not cost-effective. Those points are better spent elsewhere if you're talking less than 2000 point games, and I don't have enough experience in larger games to comment.

>>18914339

Pretty much what he said. More boyz, more gubbinz, more speed, more dakka, 'arder boyz. There's not a whole lot of reasons to step out of that template.

>> No.18914466

>>18914400
I go by the idea of "Boyz before toys". Not the best ork player out there, but I do admirably.

>> No.18914478

>>18914262
Oh, eat it. I can take one squad of henchmen and an inquisitor. That's not an army. The new codex is creamsicle flavored kittens if you used to play grey knights and wished they were good (and don't care about the rape of fluff). If you were all inquisition and wanted to keep being inquisition, it was the end of days. Maybe I'll move to witch hunters before they get sent to oblivion. Cheers.

>> No.18914518

>>18914290
>are kommandos bad
In the right game they are absolute magic (only with snikrot ofcourse).
The ability to stick a str6+4 multi-charges up the ass of a table-edge hugging IG player and straight into his carpark of tanks is pretty special, adding a dash of grotsnik for a str9 charge and FNP shenanigans. The moments when they truly shine are few and far between, but when they do, the glare will blind everyone within 20' of the table.

>> No.18914559

>This thread

Holy shit, is 40k really this imbalanced?

I got into the hobby with Warmahordes, so I wouldn't really know. Hordes seems... pretty legit, compared to the kind of bullshit /tg/ talks about with Grey Knights and Blood Angels (Ravens? I wouldn't really know).

A friend (who used to ork it up at the LFGS) says this sort of thing is why he stopped playing, but I didn't wanna judge the whole game based on one opinion.

>> No.18914607

>>18914559

FLGS, to clarify

>> No.18914623

>>18914559
If your playing friendly fluffy games it's alright, but if someone takes one of the stronger codexes and crafts a mature cheddar list it's game over unless you are a massively better player.

>> No.18914665

>>18914559
>>18914623
This.
There are tonnes of people who select armies and play them based off of what units they think will be most effective or which look the coolest.
Then there are people who will take armies that can be bent into completely overpowered ways that fluff-wise, probably wouldn't make sense, but stat-wise are complete rapists. There was a thread this morning about making extremely overpowered armies, Necrons were brought up several times with infuriating army lists.

>> No.18914739

Glad I found this thread, since I was just contemplating starting up an Ork army. How good are Burna Boyz? I was thinking of going for a shoota-heavy core with as many burna boyz as I can fit into elite slots (what can I say, I love flamethrowers), and battlewagons to get them to the fight quicker. Probably going with a Big Mek as my main HQ. For the rest I'm pretty much undecided so far. How viable does that sound?

>> No.18914775

Burna Boys delete most infantry from the game. There are a few problems, however:

1) No transport choice. Meaning you'd need to allot them a Battlewagon.
2) Infantry-killing is all they do. Anything can kill infantry. What Ork armies tend to struggle with is killing massed armor.
3) They're in the same slot as Lootas, and Meganobz.

>> No.18914785

>>18914665
>>18914623

So some codexes are overtly stronger than others in every way? Or in the ways that matter?

Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of having multiple armies?

On a related note, are the Eldar any good? I have this starter pack lying around that I got as a gift.

>> No.18914802

>>18914775
Could I deal with the massed armour problem by adding as many rokkit launchas as possible to my squads of shoota boyz? Also, yeah, I was planning the battlewagons to be transport for my burna squads.

Are lootas and meganobz that essential?

>> No.18914839

>>18914802
Adding Rokkit Launchas is usually bad because if you use them on tanks you can't use your shootas on infantry. Yoiu're better off with a dedicated anti-tank unit.

>> No.18914889

>>18914802
It helps. but you will need Lootas, and/or Rokkits on Buggies/Trakks and/or Kanz.

The problem is that even spamming Rokkits on all shoota boyz, taking 3 units of Lootas, and 3 units of Rokkit-Buggies/Koptas as well as 3 units of Rokkit Kans... will only "get you by". It won't be enough for most of the stupidly ridiculous spam, and it won't do jack shit to a Monolith, Russ, or Land Raider.

PKs are your first and formost bet, followed by Lootas and then followed by rokkits. Rokkits in your Fast Attack is practically mandatory. Deathrollas are a blatant and easily countered way of dealing with AV-14, but usually worth having at least 2 of if you have the points for the Wagons.

You will find, as an Ork player, that there are some players you should just not bother playing against if you want to enjoy 40k. Ass-hats spamming Purifiers, any IG player who runs nothing but Chimeras and Manticores, and the Blood Angel 'all jump-pack Feel No Pain' armies all tend to be "No Fun Zone!" lists. The Purifier one especially, as even winning feels like a boringly-dull waste of your fucking time (it involves NO COMBAT, EVAH). Other close lists that ruin the enjoyment level include the Razorspam BA or SW, especially if the SW list has 2+ Jaws spammers who spend all day picking out your Warboss/Nobs in every unit.

>> No.18914928

>>18914839
That's incorrect. You use the Rokkits with the Shootas on Infantry. You use the Rokkits against vehicles, only if there is not any infantry in range or of threat (and/or you're close enough to follow the shooting up with a charge).

The Rokkits are not for "Always shoot tanks" like a lot of players assume, they're there to give the unit even more versatility and allow it to have other backup targets to fire at.

>> No.18914939

>>18914802
Lootas are not essential but highly recommended.
Meganobs are alright but too slow and too fat, with no option for FNP or cybork bodies without grotsnik, who will lead them aimlessly around the board at a snails pace.

>> No.18914971

>>18914889
I see, looks like I'm going to have to resign myself to being utterly gimped against armour if I want to take my burna boyz. Still, I hadn't really decided on fast attack yet, so I can certainly take lots of rokkits for that to at least make up a little of the deficiency.

>> No.18915001

>>18914971
Your main anti armour comes from your klaw swinging nobs and their 29-man bulletshields, filling your elite slots with burnas won't gimp your shit against tanks that much.

>> No.18915024

>>18914971
Burnas are still viable, but not in combat. You'll find the most useful way of using Burnas is to keep them in their Battlewagon (which they need), and torching the shit out of anything from it's open-top. When you're laying down 15 burna templates on a squad and catching 4 or more in each template, you're GOING TO KILL some shit. Even Thunder-LameShields fall to that kind of onslaught. The problem is that it's a one-trick pony unit and becomes a target very fast after people realize what it can do. Don't bother charging them into combat unless their ride explodes, either. Templates are way better than 3 power weapon attacks that swing (at best) at Initiative 3 (almost always last). Rolla is optional on the Burna-Battlewagon (never take a Looted Wagon, it's shit). But keep in mind that a Deathrolla on a Burna-Wagon means it's going to attract attention even faster.

At least 1 unit of Lootas is still a good idea, though you do not need to spam them (and you definitely do not need more than 10 unless you just want the extra firepower).

>> No.18915029

>>18914971
Rokkit coptas are good units, but they severely lack staying power. Use them to pop the tanks turn 1/2, cause they won't see turn 3. Also, PK nobs. They pop tanks just fine when they get there.

Also, if you enjoy shooty lists, pick up a SAG mek. He fucks up erryting.

>> No.18915041

>>18914802
>>18914785
Part of it is different codexes are made for different editions, where some mechanics are a lot different. For example, Orks were (despite design problems) quite fine for 4th ed, as most vehicles were paperbox deathtraps. You could glance tanks to death, for example. You could consolidate into new close combats, terrain automatically blocked Line of Sight...

And in other cases, GW overvalues things. They overvalue AP 3 (despite the fact you can pratfall into 4+ cover), invulnerable saves (despite ease of torrent), etc.

As for Rokkits in Boy mobs...they are cost-inefficient and would prevent the shootaboyz from, well, shooting Marines or other infantry. It's still worth taking two anyway just so you have models that can Death or Glory...because being tank-shocked into flamerback formation isn't fun when you sit there and take it...

Oh, and Warbuggies are generally a must. They're not great (they're pretty crummy in fact), but there are two reasons to use them:

1) Fast vehicles. They're more likely to get side-shots...plus you can use them to delay enemies for a turn, or inhibit opponent maneuverability...say you have a Deffrolla.Battlewagon...very few opponents would be kind enough to drive their Land Raiders straight towards the thing that can most reliably kill them! Having sacrificial shit to prevent your opponent from taking another route is worth the investment.
2) Fast Attack Slots: There's less competition here overall.

>> No.18915048

>>18914939
It should be noted that an army with roughly 150 points to burn can spend it on a 3-man Mega-Nob unit in a trukk. Hurl the unit at the biggest blob of infantry, and let them draw fire as a 'throw-away' distraction. If it buys a turn or two, it's earned it's points.

>> No.18915127

>>18915041
>As for Rokkits in Boy mobs......prevent the shootaboyz from, well, shooting Marines or other infantry.

Why do people automatically assume that Rokkits = No Shooting Infantry Ever!?

Shoot the fucking Infantry, with the fucking Rokkits! The increased dice value of the Big Shoota only really wins out in averages against 4+ save infantry (or worse), and 2+ save infantry. Rokkits win out against Marines, and anything Toughness 6 or higher (which generally only has a 3+ save at best).

You shoot the fucking vehicles, when you have no other target to fire at. That 'other target' also means shit like T7 or lower Monsters, because shootas still fuck those up.

Rokkits at 10pts a model may be a bit cost-inefficient... but it's only 5 more points than a Big Shoota, and 15 more points for a unit of 30 to have 3 of them as opposed to Big Shootas.

>> No.18915278

>>18915127
I meant in regards to "If you are firing Rokkits, the other 20-something are collectively sticking their thumbs up their posteriors..." (The "no splitting fire" bit of things). It's not that they "never shoot infantry ever."

On another note...I pretty much don't bother with Big Shootas except on Battlewagons, Trukk Nobs, or (rarely), Kans.

>> No.18915342

>>18915127
Rokkits can also blast careless marines to smitheroons if they step out of cover and get hit by one, which can be handy sometimes. They also force them to take the slightly worse +4 when they are in cover

>> No.18915393

This thread has inspired me to create a new shooty army, seeing as my dreadmob has gotten a bit stale, but the kans can fit into a shooting army just fine. I have the mandatory lootas, a SAG and not enough painted shootaboys just yet, but il sort that soon enough, anything else that would be nice to add?

>> No.18915415

>>18913488
fielding 60 boyz in one place. Ever.
>Confirmed for yoof rookie.

>>18914802
>>18914839
Against AV10 and AV11 OT Big shootas are better then RLs. Shootas in trukks to get around the side, bs on trukk and in the mob. Shoot up the AV10 RA/SA and be pleasanty suprised. All you're after is an imobalise, after that assault it, and cover those hatches. Autohitting means your boyz might glance it to death, killing the insiders when they can't disembark. If not the PK-nob should wreck it.

@Everyone playing with fat nob mobs:
Don't. Get dok, cybork, waaagh banna, 2 pks, bosspole (on the banna/PK nob), 'evy or UCs only to abuse WAAC. UCs on a nob are the same or worse against most enemies, so they're first target. Put Kombi-weapons on the PK and UC nobs, since they loose the extra attack anyhow. Don't put a warboss in with it, too much of a sink in one spot. IF this can't deal with a mob, don't bother CCing it. We have ranged options for a reason, and orks aren't a CC centric army, despite BS2.

>> No.18915418

>>18915342
Exactly.

Just because you take Rokkits, doesn't mean 'fire rokkits and the shootas can't do shit'. They can. Because a Shoota unit's primary priority should ALWAYS be Infantry, or Monsters with T7 or less. If during your shooting phase you are not within 18" range of an infantry squad, and have no better target (i.e. a Trygon), then you turn those Rokkits towards that Razor/Predator because there's nothing else for your Shootas to be shooting at.

Rokkits are a 'versatility' upgrade. They let Shootas continue to do something, when there's nothing but vehicles in range for them to be used again.

>> No.18915470

>>18915342
Big shootas are still better vs. marines, albeit slightly, and better at dealing with AV10 and OT11. Most the vehicles orks need to worry about have an AV10 somewhere, the trick is getting to it.

>> No.18915507

>>18915393
1 or 2 units of 20 to 30 Gretchin (preferably no more than 29), as a bullet-sponge and charge-screen. Fill the remainder of your Troops with Shoota mobs.

Kanz work alright for a shooty army, as does Lobba Big Guns. NEVER go for Zzap Guns, they blow total ass in this codex, and rarely do shit for you. KillKannon Wagons actually aren't too bad, if you field them like a Looted-Russ and be aggressive with them. Throwing a unit of Grots or Shootas on-board isn't a bad idea, either. If AI8 is allowed, the Soopa-Kannon upgrade to the Battlewagon makes for a damn-good vehicle and counter-measure to infantry and armor. Rokkit Trakks/Buggies are also a solid addition.

And don't forget your KFFs! If you go with numerous Battlewagons, make sure a KFF is with them. If not, stick the KFF in a Shoota mob, and make sure he's catching the Grots, his shootas, and preferably 1 more unit of shootas. You will end up with 4+ saves for your shootas against direct fire, 5+ to them against indirect, and your Grots can Go To Ground for a 4+ save in the open (which they should feel free to do at a moment's notice).

Warbikes aren't bad either, as they can pump out some serious firepower while giving you plenty of mobility and acting as a versatile 'shoot or medium-value combat unit'.

>> No.18915598

>>18915470
3 Big shootas will average 1 dead marine 2/3rds of the time (3 hits, 2 wounds, 1.33 passed saving throws). 3 Rokkits will average 1 dead marine 5/6ths of the time (1 hit, wound on a 2+). If there's cover involved, then the Rokkit drops to a 42%, give or take.

Against AV-10, 3 Big Shootas can expect 1 damage roll attempt with an equal chance of it being Glance or Pen. 3 Rokkits will average 1 damage roll chance 5/6ths of the time, with 2/3rds of the shots being a penetrating hit. Higher chance for a better damage-table, at a 1-in-6 chance for failure.

Against AV 11, 3 Big Shootas will only score a damage roll 50% of the time, with a 100% guarantee for a glance. 3 Rokkits however will score a damage roll 2/3rds of the time (better), with a penetrating roll scored on a 4 or higher. You will have a better chance at destroying AV 11 open-topped (rare, mostly in Dark Eldar) with 3 Rokkits, then you will with 3 Big Shootas. And the greater number of shots with a Big Shoota only nets you a 16.6% increase to your chance to hit, at the cost of a 50% chance for a glance/pen.

Rokkits beat Big Shootas where vehicles are concerned. Even AV 11 vehicles. This is coming from someone who knows all too well that massed Big Shootas does not do jack shit against Rhino/Razorback spam. I ran an army of Warbikes.

>> No.18915628

Since we're already talking strategy:
What does /tg/ think of using small Kommando mobs (with two special weapons and nob) for distraction and/or a "get in one good hit before they get krumped" unit?

It seems like it would make a good rokkit / powerklaw nob delivery system for tank hunting.

>> No.18915683

>>18915507
I've always figured grots and KFF to be an either/or kind of thing. They both serve the same purpose, more or less. Grots do better for slogging lists, KFFs are your best choice for vehicle heavy lists.

>> No.18915737

Anyone here use the Snikrot-Smuggling trick much?

>> No.18915759

>>18915683
Nope.

Grots work for giving footsloggers saves... provided nobody is using indirect fire weaponry (i.e. Griffons). Then the KFF shines. Grots ultimately benefit from being within the range of a KFF, because then they become that much harder for your opponent to deal with. No longer can he just 'hose them down', as it will take upwards of 2x as many shots. Instead, combat becomes his major alternative, which he WILL win combat, and WILL cause the grots to break and get run-down. At which point he's in the open, and you can dump buckets of dice at him from the shootas.

KFFs are huge on Vehicles (likely to downgrade to a 5+ come 6th edition), but they've *ALWAYS* been a major deal for footslogging lists, even back in the days of 3rd and 4th. In current day, it keeps your cannon-fodder soak-screen from exploding without any saves. And you WILL make the grots Go To Ground to turn that 5+ cover in the open into a 4+ FUCK YOU, MEQ!

Seriously... Marine players top laughing at Grots when their attempts to shoot them off the board result in only about 6 casualties out of 20+.

>> No.18915779

>>18915737
It's pretty 'meh'. He doesn't need much help killing vulnerable tanks in the back-lines, or fucking up a devestator Squad. And that 2nd HQ can be spent better supporting the rest of your army.

But having him infilitrate a Ghaz or a Warboss in their back end can make for a nice 'distraction', even if it is stupidly expensive.

>> No.18915814

>>18915759
I see where you're coming from, but the grots exist mostly to die. A KFF is 85 points, which means I could have taken 25 extra grots instead. And the KFF competes for an HQ slot that could hold a warboss, a biker boss, or a SAG mek.

Regarding the Griffon Heavy Mortar and its ilk, they're going to hose the average slogging list no matter what you do. The good news is that the meta is metal boxes, and so there aren't many of those floating around.

>> No.18915839

>>18915737
The warboss slingshot is quicker and easier. It also will teach the other guy to deploy farther away and hide in metal boxes, so it does bite you in the ass.

>> No.18915929

>>18915814
>Regarding the Griffon Heavy Mortar and its ilk, they're going to hose the average slogging list no matter what you do.

Not if you've got KFFs. a 5+ or 4+ GtG with a boy mob, does a great job of ignoring that shit.

The KFF really is the more valuable HQ out all of those. And if you're running a footslogging horde (especially a dakka-footslogging list), you should have 1 supporting your battle line. Taking that 2nd HQ on a biker boss... meh, they're good at what they do, provided you have the Bikes to support them. Otherwise it's an easily-dealt-with HQ out on his own. And for god's sake, don't take Wazzdakka. The only time you should field that waste of points, is if you're running a Warbike list.

The Shock Attack Gun is decent, and makes for a good 2nd HQ in addition to the KFF. But that KFF really is what makes your Grot-Screen a serious thorn in your opponent's side. When their attempt to bladestorm through them results in a mere 10 casualties as opposed to possibly 20+ and wiping them off the board, it throws a serious wrench in your opponent's plans. Again, it means they will literally have to find alternative ways of dealing with your Gone To Ground 4+ Grot shield, all the while your Shootas are taking their toll in relative safety. And while that 85 points of Big Mek KFF (110+/- for me, because I give him a PK and use him to support) could be spent on another Grot mob, you only have 6 troop choices to work with. And at least 4 of them SHOULD be shootas. So if you've got 2 mobs of grot-shields + 4 mobs of shootas, that 2nd HQ KFF is a nice way to turn that solid footslogging core into a hell of a problem to deal with.

>> No.18915992

Orks should never be made to hit anything that isn't less than a foot away. Burnaboyz in a battle wagon and Skorcha Nob Bikerz. Get cookin.

>> No.18916119

Wishlist Thought:

Get rid of Looted Vehicles as a unit. *Instead*, make it so there are light/medium/heavy Mek chassis (Trukks/Gunwagons-Bigtrakks/Battlewagons), and you have the choice between "Orky" or "Xperimental" tech (that is, looted tech). Thus, the "Don't Press Dat" rule would be replaced with appropriate mishaps for using the (powerful-for-cost) dangerous-toys. Are you feeling brave enough to try to affix Stormraven Engines to your Battlewagon, knowing very well that they'll most likely fall off mid-battle?

>> No.18916291

>>18916119
A better thought, is to just make the Looted Wagon a 'build-your-own' vehicle with different chassis options, and weaponry upgrades. The Battlewagon just needs the Soopa-Kannon from IA-8, along with the other IA-8 'Mega-Guns', Zzap Guns to be worth fielding once again (2d6 Armor Pen), and the option(s) to twin-link certain weaponry.

Really though, the Orks need a lot. A hell of a fucking lot.

>> No.18916435

>>18916291
Not really.
Weirdboyz -> elites
Lootas -> HS
Weirdboyz could be a little better or cheaper.
Tankbustas need tank hunters instead of Glory hogs
Maybe FoC shenanigans, because as is it gets real constricting real fast
Flash gitz cheaper or shootier
Bigger gunz for wagons.
trukks for burnas
Unrestirct 'ard boyz
More options for MANZ
Burnas in boyz mobs.
Nobs/10 instead of /mob (I wish)
Bring back the choppas rule.
...okay, that's getting to be a pretty long list.

>> No.18916722

>>18916435
>Bring back the choppas rule.
No. I'm a long time Ork player, and even I recognize that that rule was fucking borken.

Choppa rule doesn't need to return, Choppa-boyz just need +1 initiative. That, or Choppas in general just need to apply a +1 imitative. Becoming an always-strikes-last army has really been our greatest setback as far as CC is concerned.

>> No.18916890

>>18916435
Get rid of the copphas rule, increase the max for EACH mob, and get rid of the /10 instead

>> No.18918221

>> No.18918894

>spiders
I may be able to help you there.

>> No.18918900

>> No.18918905

>> No.18918919

>> No.18918925

>> No.18918966

>> No.18918968

>> No.18918974

>> No.18918982

>> No.18918987

>>18913986
>I'm bitching that he made it better compeditively, right before the core rules change in a way that the old codex had better options.
>FTFY

>>18915598
Open Topped 11. Different ball game.

>>18916722
Skarboyz, as troops. Orks with I3, priced appropriately. Instead of gun options they have 1PK/UC/Burna per 10 orks.

>>18916435
Give us some melta, probably in the form of Kustom Mega-Blastaz (since they're shitty now) OR make it so armies don't need melta to function.

Make UCs better then 2CCW. I'm paying for that shit, I want an upgrade.

>> No.18918999

>> No.18919133

my mek i painted for my kill team

>> No.18919323

>>18918968
>>18918982
>>18918999
im thinking on making a goblin only army... Does this guy perform well in 2000 battles?

>> No.18919346

>>18919323
8 spider attacks, 8 goblin attacks, 1 thunderstomp, and can move over terrain and walls without penalty...yeah it's pretty good. I run two in rare at 3000 pts, and 1 in hero.

>> No.18919446

I had this thingy yesterday morning

>> No.18919450

>>18919446
In the evening it looked like this

>> No.18919471

>>18919446
>>18919450
nice! *thumbs up* I wish I could into plasticard. I'm really bad at it for some reason.

>> No.18919487

>>18919471

I find that the hardest part is the small detail work, I just lose interest after I build the basic shape.

>> No.18919501

The supa kannon is, of course, from Chinese Forgeworld

http://www.miniature-sales.com/forge-world-orks-c-46_71.html

As is this here kil Bursta

>> No.18919513

>>18919501
how much of a pain was that tervigon to put together? I think I want at least one when I get back stateside but I'm not sure if it's gonna be a real pain in the dick.

>> No.18919519

>that feel when skaven have and always will roll orks n gobbos.

>> No.18919528

>>18919519
I don't care about getting rolled honestly I wanted to make a spider tribe goblin army.

>> No.18919535

>>18919513
Not too bad. The middle legs are bit stupid, if you don't watch out the body hang a bit too low and the emerging gaunt ends up with his face scraping on the floor. Mold lines and such are pretty good.

>> No.18919555

>>18919535
well I was already considering cutting the talons to sit up higher, and if I don't do that I always do a scenic base for my monstrous creatures and Independent characters. so they sit up higher anyway. I had heard some basic complaints about how it was a pain to put together so I thought I would at least ask. Thanks for your input.

Have you gotten to play around with the plastic flyrant kit yet?

>> No.18919567

Squig art in Ork & Goblin armybok sucks sigh:(

>> No.18919575

>>18919555
Yeah, it's cool. No issues at all.

Protip: if you can snag a second torso and pelvis off a bitz site, you can build the walking version / Swarmlord as well.

>> No.18919585

>>18919575
I actually plan on positioning the legs to look like they are landing and magnitizing the wings and scything talons. Meaning that I could make the scything talon one look like it was leaping and about to land on somthing. But I will take your advice and attempt to pick up a second torso and pelvice anyway, "wast not, want not" right?

>> No.18920822

>> No.18921366

moar squiq power

>> No.18923321

>>18921366
squig squig squig...

Warhammer should make rules for cave fighting

>> No.18926705

>>18912652
see
>>18924615
>>18924685
posted in the WIP thread cause i didnt se this one, but basically im scratch-building giant and great cave squigs for my night goblin army. Will post pics of finished ones in about 8 hours.

>>
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