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18878318 No.18878318 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

I am just curious.. what makes humans.. unique I guess? I guess what I am saying is.. what makes other races envious of humans? I am a huge human lover and half human things(I really like half orcs primarily because I am a black guy in real life, and being black and playing DnD pretty much makes you a pariah of sorts.)

Anyway, what makes other races envious of humans? Humans appear to be frail... short lived especially and weak? So /tg/ give me the skinny on humans. What makes them good? what makes them bad?(not from a gameplay point of view.. I am looking for more of a fluff POV.)

>> No.18878373

They breed faster and are more culturally dynamic than elves or dorfs but are better able to organize and therefore defeat the even faster breeding orcs.

Therefore, they dominate the continents. Also, they are best at capitalism.

Shorter life can be a virtue vis a vis racial dominance. Even if bad folks get in charge eventually they die and there's a fresh start. Imagine a shitty-rule-of-iron-fist in a race where someone can live 1000 years.

>> No.18878461
File: 206 KB, 275x606, People_Vivaldi_full.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Also, they are best at capitalism
Witcher dwarves disagree

>> No.18878661
File: 31 KB, 379x400, BlondeEladrin.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

There isn't any reason actually. Menfolk are weaker in every conceivable field. Their own jealousy and spite is what drives their endless ambition. And even that fails in time; just look at the host of fallen empires they produce. They would even go so far as to willingly mingle their blood with that of devils. The gods have quite simply frowned upon humans. Only the goblinoids and orcens compete with them for the crown of "most misguided race", and their failings can be attributed to their unfortunate association with gods of chaos. Otherwise they are quite hardy specimens, if not a bit dimwitted.

>> No.18878687

They can fuck ANYTHING.

>> No.18878714
File: 43 KB, 450x613, Malekith.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Oh, and the pansy elves know nothing of this?

Pic related, it's a guy who became buttmad beyond belief.

>> No.18878749


He's pretty close tobeing the most butthurt being ever only CWC and maybe God can compare

>> No.18878757

In D&D? Humans learn quicker than any other race. Compared to humans, everybody is developmentally challenged.

This is both from a game-play AND from a fluff point of view, by the way. In the fluff human mages really do become more powerful than centuries-old elf and gnome mages in a scant few decades, and often achieve amazing (relative to the other races) levels of skill before they even reach adulthood.

>Humans appear to be frail... short lived especially and weak?
Actually no, they're tougher than many other PC races, and in the fluff humans are generally depicted as physically fit and hardy, less so than dwarves but more so than elves and small folk.

>> No.18878769

We're lucky.
We have fate on our side.
We're the right species at right and wrong times in the world.
We defy the gods and natural orders.
Where other races stagnate, we progress.


>> No.18878789
File: 770 KB, 550x1184, elf hunter.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

fuck yeah ELVENKIND!

>> No.18878824

It's difficult to explain my point of view, but I always thought (because we as humans created every other fantasy species ever made, like aliens, elves, dwarves, etc) that we haven't made fictional races all they could be. To me, many other races seem to be too settled in the past, bound by their old ties to culture and a long lost golden age. Humanity prevails and conquers everything. We can solve problems by being abstract, while many races stick to tradition and what they know. This makes humans more adaptable and versatile.

I don't come to /tg/ often, and I won't even pretend to know much about many fantasy/sci fi universes fluff. I'm just going by what little I know.

>> No.18878828

Elves are the worst race in any fantasy setting ever.

This is commonly known to every fa/tg/uy on this board.

You elf-lovers suck cocks.

>> No.18878869

Usually, the benefit of being human is adaptability, versatility, and incredible strength in desperate situations.

Humans are the only race species that instead of conforming themselves to suit the environment, they conform the environment to suit themselves.

>> No.18878875

Extra feat, plus they learn faster. Their fertility rivals that of dragons.
Back in early D&D, they could hit higher levels than anyone else.
According to the Book of Vile Darkness, the first human was an evil monster that the gods killed for being so nasty. Then Grazz't brought him back to life and gave him a mate, breeding the inherently evil race of vasharans.
So, it turns out their roots are in evil.

>> No.18878876

>In D&D? Humans learn quicker than any other race.

Not really, Humans are just the Goblins of the civilized races. They're just far more willing to do crazy shit that borders on suicidal.

>> No.18878885

Yeah, also humans are far less stereotyped than elves or dwarves because elves and similar are far less likely to scream racism.

>> No.18878890
File: 122 KB, 540x720, MaleElfArcher.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>competing with anyone in the category of physical fitness

Strength? Obviously the domain of the Orcens.
Constitution? Easily the Dwarves.
Dexterity? The skills of Elvenkind are legendary.

Humans will always only be second best. Hells, they won't even be that much in most categories. Your half breeds may just qualify for you, though.

>> No.18878895
File: 195 KB, 1200x1699, whitelion-look-02.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Reason # 231 Why I love WFRP
The way they handle elves.

Holy shit you start off way better than humans with better stats, better looks, better talents and skills.

The downside? You're a fucking elf and everyone in the world hates elves. Don't expect a fun or long life.

>> No.18878908

It's because Humans are at just the right amount of everything. They're the jack of all trades and while they excel at nothing they can do something better than anyone else can. Humans don't live as long or as intelligent and agile as elves, but they're stronger and more robust allowing them to survive and thrive in places elves couldn't. They're smarter and wiser than Orcs which gives them an edge in being civilized and not making stupid decisions that get your species on a hit-list for eternity. They're more agile and less brash than dwarves allowing them to make friends and survive in places dwarves can't or won't. The smallfolk have size as a burden, while they may be faster or more intelligent their physical size prevents them from being capable of surviving in many areas and allows them to get picked on by bigger races than themselves. They've got a decent lifespan, long enough to accomplish things that take a great deal of time, but short enough to foster an extreme sense of ambition which drives their civilizations, and dooms others.

Really it comes down to survival. Humans can thrive in any environment where others might falter.

>> No.18878930

hey elf-lover dude, plural of orc is orcs, don't make up words

>> No.18878938

What Humans have is Willpower nigga

>> No.18878946

My first WHFRP elf got lynched. The party helped.

>> No.18878977

>They're just far more willing to do crazy shit that borders on suicidal.

Except that no, that's wrong. Humans can be studious or methodical, and often are. They simply achieve everything that any race can do, and do so in less time. An elven wizard who studies for fifty years is can be a moderately skilled journeyman. A human wizard who studies for fifty years is the High Archmage of Hoeth. An dwarf warrior goes through training and learns under a sergeant as they patrol the mountain border, as they slowly master the art of war. A human can have a training sequence and beat up the champion with a pittance of learning and practice.

The difference between humans and other races, in D&D, is two things: humans age quickly, and everybody else is retarded. In the medical, psychological sense.

>> No.18878988

It seems like all fantasy races are just humans with X traits. It's actually kind of reversed. Humans are a mix of all the other races. We are the final, fine-tuned humanoid in the experiment of the gods.

>> No.18878990

My thoughts exactly. Elves may have long lifespans and great agility, and orcs have massive strength, and dwaves have stout and reliable weapons, mankind files itself in all of these, but only on average.

But what makes the other races envious of humans? From what I've seen, humans are almost always the new kid on the block who's rising fast. The older, supposedly wiser races don't like how quickly mankind can evolve and advance to their surroundings. Some other races might secretly envy the drive and determination that humans possess, but most won't admit it aloud.

Humanity has what others lack. As you said, we're like a well rounded sword. We aren't the most nimble or well balanced, we aren't the longest or the sharpest, but damn if we can't still kill anything with determination and a bit of tenacity.

>> No.18878997
File: 660 KB, 850x1150, DwarfWarrior2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>calling a dwarf brash
Do not confuse tempered anger with brashness, laddie.
It's not Dwarven remains they find littered in adventurer locales.

>> No.18879017

This. Humans settle in the places no one else wants/ can use and we adapt to it and it to us.
Arctic? partially underground houses, warm gear and changes in diets plus increased preservation of food
Desert? Light clothing adobe style houses or light cotton tents for nomads
the list goes on because humans, once they think something is theirs, are damn stubborn and will fight to hang on to it

>> No.18879034

We don't live as long as the other races around us, so we breed more. More generations in a lifetime of other creatures, each generation full of people who have to learn to adapt and improve themselves in order to keep the race strong and well populated.

So, effectively, humans are the powerful race that they are because they are so adaptive. They change and evolve so much more quickly compared to older, longer-living races such as elves and dwarves to a point where their society can, in some aspects, completely outclass them. Humans are determined, young, and diverse amongst themselves. Where a dwarf may be too stubborn to take on a situation or an elf may not want to become involved, humans do not have time to simply forget and move on, because their years are numbered.

>> No.18879036

humans tend to be more inquisitive and industrious, they're need to know everything about everything and then know how to use that knowledge to their advantage means that it's only a matter of time before they out-pace the older and more prideful races of elves and dwarfs.

>> No.18879042

orcen is still the race

>> No.18879056
File: 73 KB, 400x454, Zarus' Holy Symbol by Wayne England.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Genesis 1:1 In the beginning, there was the World and from the World came all things. The last and most perfect creation of the World was Man. His name was Zarus and he was the first of the races of Mankind. Zarus came into the World without the hand of any being, mortal or immortal, being raised. He was created from and by the World alone.

>Genesis 1:2 When the older races saw Zarus, they trembled. His grace surpassed that of the elves of Corellon Larethian. His endurance surpassed that of the dwarves of Moradin. His skills and craft surpassed that of Garl Glittergold’s gnomes and Yondalla’s halflings. His strength surpassed that of the orcs of Gruumsh. Zarus was perfect in every way. All trembled lest Zarus breed a race of his like, superior to all others, but Zarus was alone.

>Genesis 1:3 In his loneliness, Zarus called out to the World from which he had sprung for a companion. The World answered. Astra was created by the World, just as Zarus had been created. She was perfect and Zarus’ mate. Now, the other races grew fearful and prayed that Mankind be destroyed. Corellon heard the prayers of the elves that Mankind be destroyed. Moradin heard the prayers of the dwarves that Mankind be destroyed. Garl Glittergold and Yondalla heard the prayers of gnome and halfling that Mankind be destroyed. Gruumsh heard the prayers of orcs that Mankind be destroyed.

>> No.18879057

I never quite got how intelligence works in fantasy. It seems like everyone is handicapped compared to manknid, and yet other races are hailed as more intelligent/wiser. How can a human ever hope to out learn an intelligent being that easily lives double your lifespan?

>> No.18879073

Humanity is willing to break tradition, defy the natural order of the world, and not be considered the villain. They are just as good at war as they are at home, and they are willing to forgive even if it takes many lifetimes (A blink in the eyes of a stubborn Dwarf or unforgetting Elf).

Humanity is willing to build a keep on the borderlands because they want it. They'll get hurt bad, but they'll try and hold the land because something beyond that next hill is calling them. Elves and Dwarves are content to their woods and holds, and while they may seek to reclaim old lands; Humans want new ones.

Humans are short-lived, they aren't as hardy as a Dwarf or as graceful as an Elf; but a Human can hit like an Orc, smooth-talk like a Halfling, they can fuck anything, and if you give them enough time, they'll find a way to become as hardy or as graceful as a Dwarf or Elf.

Humanity can adapt. That's why Humans are unique.

>> No.18879074

Yup. I'm a Dark Elf WHFB fan, I won't lie. I don't frequent /tg/, so I didn't really know the supposed elf hatred, and I don't much care. Regardless, It's always been my belief that humans will fight anyone for anything, and damnit, we will win. Other races can't adapt, can't conform and can't prevail when they're blown slightly out of their perfect little niche.

>> No.18879080
File: 112 KB, 514x800, GnomeAlchemist.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.18879087

>Genesis 1:4 In secret, the older races plotted to poison Zarus. In a gift of wine at his wedding to Astra, the older races offered a toast to Zarus’ health with poisoned wine. Zarus knew of the jealousy of the older races but honor prevented him from refusing the treacherously offered cup. Zarus drank, and died, but the World would not allow such injustice and raised Zarus as a god as great as the chief most gods of the older races and greater still as would be revealed in time.

>Genesis 1:5 Now a god, Zarus wiped Astra’s tears and together they sired the races of Mankind.

>Apotheosis 2:1 Astra bore Zarus many children. In their perfection, they spread over the face of Oerth, adapting to the different lands in which they settled. Some of Zarus’ children had dark skin. Others had tan or olive skin. Still others were pale. All were the children of Zarus and formed the races of Mankind. In their seemingly infinite diversity, all honored Zarus and proved the most perfect of the creatures of Oerth, superior to all the other non-human races.

>> No.18879099

>Apotheosis 2:2 In the First Epoch (Ordus Dominus Dominum or OD&D), no race could fully equal the achievements of Mankind. While an elf might grow great in the fighting arts and as well in wizardry, a human could surpass an elf in either or both. And so it was in every way; other races would prove themselves able but Man was always superior.

>Apotheosis 2:3 In the First Age of the Second Epoch (Annus Dominus Dominum or AD&D), Man grew mightier still. No matter how a creature of another race might show a diversity of talents, Man would prove greater in any one or more. The best any of the lesser races could do is perhaps equal man in a single area, but Man would always prove the superior overall.

>Apotheosis 2:4 In the Second Age of the Second Epoch (Annus Dominus Dominum Secundus or AD&D2E), much the same was true. While there was much ferment among the older races and attempts to better their state compared to the exalted state of Mankind, these efforts ultimately failed. Humanity remained dominant and no non-human race could equal the achievements of Man. At the end of the Second Age, a great cry went up from the non-human races and their gods again heard their pleas.

>> No.18879109

>Apotheosis 2:5 In the Third Epoch ( Tertium Dominus Dominum or 3D&D), the older races were raised up to challenge Man. Now dwarves were gifted with the potential for sorcerous might. Elves might be great warriors. Even lowly gnomes, halflings and half-orcs could think to challenge Mankind’s claim to domination. Yet, the blood of Zarus flowed strongly in Man. His feats were greater. His skills were unsurpassed. Humanity was favored in all ways, while the favors newly bestowed upon the older races were more limited. The world still belonged most fully to the human race as it always had belonged to that most perfect of races - the Children of Zarus.
There ya go.

>> No.18879112

because humans tend to write everything down or pass their knowledge on to others in some other way so even though humans don't live long their knowledge is the collection of generations of knowledge and personal experiences. we learn from the mistakes of our forefathers more so than other races.

>> No.18879116
File: 122 KB, 800x1289, MadTiefling.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Adaptation even if it means no longer being human.
What kind of victory is that?

>> No.18879125

Wanna know why they're scared of humans? Because we don't need them.

You've got your world without humans, Dwarves do Dwarven things, Elves do Elvish things, Orcs do Orcish things. Then humans come along, and humans can do all Dwarven, Elvish and Orcish things. They become redundant when we can do their job and more, the balance of the world is thrown off and they are redundant. Their place in the world is lost, so they blame us.

Unfortunately humans do excel at one thing in particular, survival, and the complacent old races cannot win against an enemy who cannot die.

>> No.18879146

Humans take risks with much less forethought far more often than they should. Less intelligent species aren't capable of such forethought, so even their best tend to suffer and succeed from short-sighted goals. More intelligent species tend to lapse into overthought and allow the chessboard to play itself out before stepping in. Those equal to humans tend to emulate their forerunners and observe and debate their issues or act on established principle.

Humans are one of very few species that display a high frequency of vacillation between measured actions and gut instinct [that is not the terror and inaction of something out of its depth].

But that's just another way of saying, 'we respresent the middle-ground of biologically evolved adaptability' (magical or alchemically-altered monstrosities are another story altogether).

>> No.18879148

Our potential. Throughout D&D's history Humans one big bonus is that we have a greater capability than the other races to rise above and beyond what we should be able to do. It's our ability to defy fate, and accomplish what others deem impossible.

>> No.18879150
File: 162 KB, 640x463, genasi.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

A half-human is still partially human.
You just mad because you can't fuck errything up to and including gods and titans.

>> No.18879152

I always pictured humans as being good at war, aside from other things mentioned in this thread. Not in the sense that they're good fighters, but in the sense that they're very good tacticians, tactical geniuses, if you will. Orcs may have raiding parties, and elves have great skirmishers and archers, but humans have phalanxes and legions and cavalry and know how to use them.

That's always been my take on "why humans aren't extinct," because they're willing to become a cog in the great human war machine, and because the war machine has skilled drivers.

I never really liked the "humanity can adapt and breed fast" angle. I figured humanity needs something to stand out, just like elves are stereotypically good archers and dwarves live in caves and are good smiths.

>> No.18879153

See, this always bothers me about fantasy settings. Humans come into power, despite all their shortcomings and self destructive tendencies, do to the fact they breed like rabbits.

Humans should terrify the other races, do to their viral nature. So much so that they would put aside their own differences, for however short a time, to kill them off.

If I ever run a campaign, humans will not be the predominate species, in any region, simply do to the other races doing everything they can to keep them in check, if they decide killing them off completely just isn't worth the effort.
They'll have great potential individually, but the masses will never realize them either because of the great amount of oppression they are put under, or do to the typical dicking themselves over.

>> No.18879155

You're obviously not a human.

Humanity isn't a static idea, we are not set in stone. We are what we are now, not what we once were, we accept that where the old races cannot. We are always human and cannot lose that, that is why we survive, that is why we are versatile.

>> No.18879171

not cannot so much as will not. in nearly every human is the idea of spite. that if im going to die, to fall in battle or lose my home then ill make sure it hurts my foe. with their last gasp a man may slash at the foe who felled him, the commoner who flees the advancing army sets fire to his home and crops robbing the enemy of food and shelter

>> No.18879179
File: 51 KB, 397x561, Kyuss.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>magical or alchemically-altered monstrosities are another story altogether
Who has two thumbs, was once a man, and invented Worms That Walk? IT'S THIS GUY!

>> No.18879182
File: 49 KB, 350x600, TieflingFemale.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Ah, so the segregatino and hatred of Tieflings was for some other reason then. The peasants who cry "Devilspawn!" mean it as a compliment.

>> No.18879187

has this become a HFY thread yet? i cant tell

>> No.18879194

From Order of the Stick: On the Origin of PCs
>Vaarsuvius: I do not comprehend why human spellcasters are so skilled, Miss Starshine.
>Haley: What do you mean?
>Vaarsuvius: I have been studying magic for six decades--longer than most spellcasters of your ilk. And yet, I find that the arcane mastery of human wizards much younger than I dwarfs my own.
>Haley: Well, V, you're an elf. Elves learn much more slowly than humans.
>Vaarsuvius: Did you imply that all elves have some sort of learning disability?

>> No.18879199

Pfft, peasants.
They call the half-illithids monsters, too. Doesn't mean they're not awesome.

>> No.18879207

>Haley: No, no! I'm saying that if it takes X amount of magical knowledge to become a 1st-level wizard, then every race requires the entire time from childhood to adulthood to learn X. The longer it takes to grow up, the longer it takes to master it.
>Vaarsuvius: ...That makes little sense.
>Haley: No, actually, it works out. See, if it wasn't this way, every elf who started as an apprentice would be a 20th-level mage before hitting puberty.
>Vaarsuvius: And what would the problem with that be?
>Haley: Well, then logically, there would be a bajillion elven epic-level wizards running around, since they live for centuries.

>> No.18879229

>Vaarsuvius: And what would the problem with that be?
>Haley: Elves would pretty much run the world, therefore, and other races wouldn't have a chance.
>Vaarsuvius: And what would--
>Haley: So help me, if you say, "What would the problem with that be?" one more time, I'm gonna sneak attack you!
>Vaarsuvius: This is lucirous. My people are penalized because we have the good sense not to die off like fruit flies??
>Haley: I don't know what you're complaining about. I'd love to live for that long. Imagine the treasure you could collect.
>Vaarsuvius: It has its moments, but it is as often a curse as a blessing.
>Haley: I dunno, it still sounds pretty good...
>Vaarsuvius: 20 years in diapers.
>Haley: Ah.

>> No.18879249

Think of it this way, Tieflings are not human, and also human. They share everything about humanity, except name. They must fight for survival just like the rest of us. Their environment to survive and adapt to is one of other humans hating them, after all what kind of survival would it be if they were accepted without a fight?

I like to imagine that if they did survive well and become a threat to humans, we would adapt again and join them. Of course this is one of many paths of survival, so who am I to say? If we must change, then we will, but until that day.

>> No.18879252

I have to say, and from what I've read, most of /tg/ agrees with, is that Humans are special because they're adaptable. They are the jack-of-all-trades that can adapt to almost any environment and, with time and the right tools and skillset, adapt to them. On top of this you have humanities natural curiosity and affinity for machines (although in some settings the Dwarves outclass them in this) that means that Humans will get looked down on and get mistreated by, say, the Elves for a while, but will roll over them in a tide of fire and steel once they discover all the handy things you can do with Black Powder and fancy metal tubes of varying sizes.

>> No.18879258

I play hummies as diplomats and traders. Everyone has a contact or a friend of a friend that is a human. They go everywhere because they mesh with everyone. They literally fit into any society they want and when they form their own cities they turn into city states the focus heavily on trade and incorporating the strengths of the other races into their society.

>> No.18879271


>Adapt their environments to them


>> No.18879272

I'm not really a fan of those, but I appreciate the effort put into them. What irks me most is their commandments. Clashes with my prideful Lawful Good Paladin of Zarus.

>Elf (Actually an Eladrin, but Ragnar can't tell the difference.): Why do you embrace the halfbreeds as your own?
>Ragnar: Johnathan and Torg? The blood of Zarus thunders through their veins as strong as it does in mine, undiminished by the unfortunate circumstances of their conception.
Elf (She had actually found that very site when she googled Zarus): But Zarus says that halfbreeds should be purged.
Ragnar: Nothing of the sort. In fact, Johnathan tells me that the elves are the ones that ostracized him for his heritage, and the human communities embraced him as a brother. No, elf. The sons of Zarus know their own.

>> No.18879289

The reason that humans are unique and powerful in D&D is really quite simple. We're the only major race who split with our Patron God. Rather than conforming to some ideogog's vision of what humanity was to be, we grabbed hold of the the reigns of our own destiny by choosing to primarily worship gods of the world.

Elves, Dwarves, Kobolds, Orcs, Gnomes, and Lizardmen are all basically the same the world over, because in their societies their Patron God is king and the gods of agriculture, healing, commerce, and construction are derided as lesser pursuits. Mankind, on the other hand, is a veritable rainbow of societies all trying to discover what works the best. You won't find an excellent Human, but you'll find that humans make excellent farmers, apothecaries, traders, and masons.

It's possible that the non-racial gods play favorites a little bit with humanity, the only race that doesn't cast them as second fiddles, and the divine oomph of having such a broad spectrum of the pantheon on our side results in us being the most proficient species despite our comparatively short lifespans.

>> No.18879298

Zarus is a Lawful Evil god, and you're complaining that he's difficult for a Lawful Good character to worship?

>> No.18879304


Elves, dwarfs and orcs go to war in the hundreds. Humanity goes to war by the thousands.

>> No.18879316

Nothing canonical about him is actually evil except that they slapped the label on him. Hell, the "good" racial gods of the others have much more extreme (read: "genocidal") views on other races. Zarus is all about pride and little else.

>> No.18879329

In a world where the other races are immensely older than we are, our best advantage is the ability to quickly adapt more quickly and populate in greater numbers.

>> No.18879332

Extra feat is hot sex. That is the actual reason the other races are jealous on the purely mechanicaly level. if we're not talking game play thought, in theory its because humans learn faster and learn better. In practice that is entirely bullshit. take elves for example. They learn slower and age slower but see they don't learn significantly slower, for this to work as a disadvantage to them they'd have to be mentally handicapped but actually, they're far from it, they aren't dumb by any means, we're just a bit better. So take a guy thats just a Little worse than you at learning and then give him a 300 year head start. Yeah.
There are other fucks out there you straight up just are humans but better. D&D is a fucked up world.
I mean you've got fucks like war-forged who are immortal and immune to a bazillion shits but still entirely capable of doing all the human things that we do. Just a tiny bit less creative. Luckily, they have all of forever to catch up.
Ignoring lifespans you have midget assholes like gnomes who trade that tiny bit of creativity for MAGIC. Man fuck you guys, I wouldn't mind learning a bit slower to have FUCKING MAGIC.
If you take this from a mechanical perspective though humans are hot fucking sex. There is a reason optimizers and minmaxers love humans.

>> No.18879353

Humans are exactly like rats; they multiply quickly and can adapt to nearly every environment.

You don't need intelligence when you have just sheer numbers and versatility.

>> No.18879364

So, why aren't we bros with Skaven?

>> No.18879377

We don't like radiation poisoning.

>> No.18879379

That would be interesting for a homebrew setting. Or as a curse inflicted upon certain humans

>> No.18879394

His canonical stance is "humans are better than everyone and all the other (read, inferior) races can lick our fucking feet". Pretty sure Moradin doesn't quite say that.

>> No.18879483

Like many other fa/tg/uys before me have said, humans have a few select advantages that let them prosper. I, personally call this the big five.

1: Charm
Humans are everyones second best friend, plain and simple. Even if your race hates one kingdom of humies, another kingdom of us will agree with you and have your back. The multitude of different views humans have make it so they can have an ally anywhere.

2: Prosperity
Also known as thier ability to survive, humans can, and will, bunker down and found a city where ever they can. No matter where they go, some human will think "I like it here", and once they get entrenched, good luck getting them out.

3: stubbornness
Dwarves are the kings of this trait, that much is true, but almost everyone forgets how close humans come to matching the dwarves. Once a human has his sights truly set on something neither high nor hellwater can keep him from it.


>> No.18879491

No, but he does want the complete slaughter of all goblinoids, orcs, giants, derro, and duergar. I may be forgetting a race he calls for genocide against.

>> No.18879518

Doesn't count on a cosmic level if they're "usually evil", I think. Them's the breaks.
Never said I agreed with the policy, but that's it.

>> No.18879596

Point is, labels. Correllon and Moradin preach genocide, Zarus is about pride.
I'm having no problems playing Lawful Good while following all the canonical teachings of Zarus. It's the fansite stuff that would rustle my jimmies if it was forced on me. No hatred, but condescension, pity and dismissal are par for the course.

>> No.18879671

But having variable allegiances sounds like a recipe for infighting and disaster, which may be the reason behind humanity's long list of failed civilizations. Prosperity never seems to stick around.

>> No.18879691


4: Adaptability
This one is the strange one of the five, because it is only half true. Humans apparent ability to adapt is actually a mix between their short lives, lack of tradition, varying views, and inborn stubborn streak. While an elf will look at a problem and immeidately defer to tradition and whatever has worked in the past, a human will consider whatever works for him. The illusion comes from each human trying a different solution to the same problem, and if does not work, they try something different.

5: Spite
This is the one most people overlook. When most races are pushed into a corner they resolve to go out in a blaze of glory. Not humans. Humans will fight tooth and nail to not only survive, but to punish whoever put them in a position. They will sacrifice everything just to spit in their tormentors eye. And, if it becomes truly hopeless, they make damn well sure that whatever they leave behind cannot be used by their opponent. Any of the longer lived races can tell you a horror story of the aftermath of a human war, how they left the land scarred in their wake.

I'm sure there is more that I missed, but I'm sure it will be covered by other anons.

>> No.18879736
File: 282 KB, 1200x675, Scoia'taelIorvethAndCrew.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I've always considered spite as a trait associated with any peoples in dire straits. The elder races are just rarely even in such predicaments

>> No.18879861


Yes, spite is in every race, but humans crank it up to eleven.

Neither elves nor dwarves will put their homes to the torch if an enemy occupies it, humans will.
Halflings and gnomes will run and start a new community, humans will come back and retake what is theirs.
Orcs and the other savage races will die in the name of glory, humans will live to torment whomever decided to try fucking with them.

Yes, on a personal level a menber of the other races may become overwhelmed be wrath, revenge, and spite, but humans as a -race- have the monopoly.

>> No.18880026

The example given is that of the Scioa'tael. They are a widespread group of rebel elves and dwarves (supposedly halflings too) dedicated to fucking over humanity every chance they get. They fight a vain war hoping to retake their lands and advocate the eradication of mankind. It's not a case of single individuals; the populations cry out for vengeance against mankind.

I believe these would be traits inherent in any intelligent race faced with utter defeat. Human history has shown examples of both responses. Sometimes in defeat, we submit to our oppressors, other times we flail wildly in our death throes. Generally people like to live, even if it's a shitty life, so submission has been more common. There is little reason to believe we are particularly special in the area of spite.

>> No.18880070

simple humans are the most adaptable.

>> No.18880107

The difference being that humans in that situation have an end-game. Humans have a way of regaining power by numbers, in the Witcher it's colonised land they already have done so. Elves have no choice but to continue a pointless guerilla struggle against a people who don't care. Unless the times change, they have no hope.

>> No.18880162

I believe it is because Humies tend to be the X factor of most any setting. They are the "Jack of all Trades, Master of None" race. We are just so goddamn versatile and stubborn that we can't help but make other races piss themselves a bit.
We are crazy, but that insanity grants us insights the others cannot, and will not, ever have. So they are scared of us despite our overall inferiority (for we, above all else, know how to work what little we got). Just my thought on the matter.

>> No.18880174

The point is the Scoia'tael are vindictive, vicious and widespread. They're losing, but most in their situation would, humans included (we've stomped out natives in our own world in much the same way).

Spite is not unique to humans. It's unique to intelligent life.

>> No.18880218

So tradition is our strength? Aren't dwarves and elves supposed to have the long traditions? It's not like they don't meticulously record everything too.

>> No.18880259

They breed like rabbits, spread fucking everywhere, and spend all their free time fighting each other when they aren't fighting anyone/everyone else.

War breeds ingenuity.

Also, in AD&D they're the only race that can reach any level in any class or dual-class. In 3.X and 4E, they're really adaptable and get extra skills and feats.

>> No.18880275

The human patron god is usually Pelor or some other god of civilization. it's not that we split off from our god, we simply picked the best ones.

>> No.18880299
File: 101 KB, 1235x474, ElvesKillingEachOther.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

.spend all their free time fighting each other when they aren't fighting anyone/everyone else
Sounds like elves, or at least my favorite idea of them

>> No.18880403

The things I find most interesting about humans in DnD are actually the mixes they produce.

Half-Orcs gain a speed and dexterity no Orc can lay claim to being the equal of.

Half-Elves become quite possibly the most charming creatures in all of existence.

Muls acquire a level of endurance that is just downright astonishing.

It's like humans act as a multiplier. The offspring's potential goes well beyond what the parent races could've ever hoped to achieve.

Humans just simply have the best genes.

>> No.18880495

well there you go OP.
Humans are good at fucking. and when it's all said and done, isn't that the only thing that matters?

>> No.18880509

They have a soul.

>> No.18881648
File: 159 KB, 291x373, vashar.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

There's something I've always wondered.
Vashar are identical to humans except evil, right? So can THEY mate with everybody as well?

>> No.18882081

Humanity is perhaps the only race older than its gods. Think on this for a moment.

The other races were created by their gods, and though in most settings humans are a young race, the human pantheons are made up of a great many ascended humans, and even those that aren't, typically see those gods appearing AFTER the arrival of humans to that world.

It's as if they all came from somewhere else.

>> No.18882088

>>Humanity is perhaps the only race older than its gods. Think on this for a moment.
Nah, we're not older than the gods. We just killed our old gods when we got too sick of their shit. That's why only the crazy gods try to claim they're gods of humanity, they know they're going to be nailed to a tree if they manage to piss us off.

>> No.18882104

Zarus, by his own admission, is an ascended human.

>> No.18882112

Doesn't change the fact that he's bugshit crazy, nor invalidate that claiming to be a god of humans is a dumb move long-term.

>> No.18882132

Why, honestly?
His decrees are "Humans fucking rule. You? Yes, you. You fucking rule. Go out there and show all the other races how much we rule."
I have difficulty taking offense to that.

>> No.18882138

Some humans might object to the whole 'slaughter the unbelievers and subhumans' aspect, on the principle of 'I like my elf waifu/dwarf husbando, fuck you.'

>> No.18882142
File: 109 KB, 700x439, 1310428612203.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Mfw this was probably supposed to be a trollthread and instead /tg/ turned out to be friendly and tolerant people.

>> No.18882162

It's said right in the book that his decrees can be taken multiple ways. You can kill all subhumans, yeah. Or you can pity them, and help them rise above their tainted blood. Non-humans simply have to admit human superiority, and then even the biggest prick among his followers can't even enslave them, instead giving them rights as second class citizens. As for apostates... fuck apostates.
He doesn't even call for genocide, no matter how nasty the race All he wants is humans on top, now and forever.

>> No.18882298

>Now dwarves were gifted with the potential for sorcerous might
>Elves might be great warriors
>His feats were greater
>His skills were unsurpassed
>Humanity was favored
>Third Epoch
> 3D&D
I see what you did there. Very good.

>> No.18882312

>All he wants is humans on top, now and forever.

Yea, that's all. I mean it's not like wanting all other races to bow before his pet species and act greatful for being allowed to exist as second-class citizens is a big deal, right? How could anyone have a problem with that?

>> No.18882332

Zarus doesn't want their deaths. He just wants their submission.

>> No.18882350

I think you missed the sarcasm.

>> No.18882357


>The clerics of Zarus encourage conquest and slavery.


>> No.18882379

In my setting, the humans weren't innately more adaptable than the fantasy races. Their only real biological advantage was their fecundity. However, because humans were newcomers to the continent upon which the elves, dwaves, halflings and orcs resided, they were newcomers who had no vested interest in maintaining the sociopolitical status quo. They freely utilized metalworking and later machinery techniques from the dwarves, attempted to study the arcane magic of the elves, adopted the crop rotation of the halflings, the fighting techniques of the orcs, etc. Humans didn't excel at any of these things, but they didn't have age old grudges or a history of isolationism to prevent them from taking things from other cultures on the continent. This and the fact that the humans brought an undead plague with them led to a massive war in which humans ultimately drove many of the other races to virtual extinction. It was really the fact that they were outsiders with a willingness to experiment that allowed them to barely squeeze a victory out of a one-sided war.

The problem is that in defeating the other races, the humans became complacent, as there was nothing left to measure up against. Yet.

>> No.18882381

one aspect that I find rather bizarre is the universal technological stasis everywhere. One would think that humans would be able to start the industrial revolution sooner or later.
Throw into that the whole ideology deal (liberalism/atheism/communism/fascism) andI guarantee you that the setting would be an industrial WW1 wasteland.

But maybe thats the problem. giving steam engine to humans is simply OP.

>> No.18882384
File: 328 KB, 636x1200, 40k_inq.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>What kind of victory is that?
The winning kind of victory.

>> No.18882395

Of course they do.
Few races are willing to agree that humans are best and agree to be their servants.
Hence slavery.
I didn't, actually. It just annoys people when I do that.

>> No.18882475
File: 96 KB, 751x658, DnDKillingInvadingHumans.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>thread about human supremacy

>> No.18882530

I say we go all out with Tieflings, Aasimas, Mul, Half-orcs, Half-elves, Quarterlings, Genasi, Half Dragons and whatnot.

Keep pulling in more and more variety into the genepool, even now we see random concurrences of old blood "taints" popping up between otherwise "pureblood" humans.
Their culture crafts and lands have already been subverted into ours, soon it will be common for every Human to manifest some ability other races thought their alone.

>> No.18882546

Why aren't Crows fiends with Gulls?
Same goals, largely same methodology, only so many resources around.

>> No.18882565

I say we bone EVERYTHING.
Including, I dunno, gnolls. And aboleths. And liches. And everything else that threatens mankind.
One day, they will all be fucked into oblivion.

>> No.18882566

It depends. Mixing occurs mostly where you have lot of cultural mixing, so big trade cities, ports, capital cities and so on. it also depends on the state ideology. If you have laisezz faire approach that is common in merchant republics then mixing is probably not worried about.

If you are in theocratic monarchies who do the Zarus thing and so on, expect lot of hatred and ghettos everywhere.

Countryside is generally excluded from most of , mainly because each rural popuation usually stays out of the way of politics or foreign culture.

>> No.18882578

Many do so with delight in order to spread misery and inside agents.

>> No.18882586

Apart from sharing the same race as the players of course.

>> No.18882602

Fuck them too, then they can then hate their bastard children that then will turn against them and beget more crosses.

>> No.18882627

That's really quite interesting. Methodically seeding other races with little sociopaths, either forcibly or not, all simply because fuck those guys.
Thanks. I actually have always liked vasharans, because they were great fuel for paranoia. Any human you see, anywhere, could secretly be an inherently evil monster who's descended from a hidden society of like-minded evil monsters, for various reasons that are invariably unpleasant. There's no way to tell the difference without straight up Detecting Evil on everyone.

>> No.18882644

Naturally you'll give your children some heirloom with conceal alignment.
Best would of course be to cross with Doppelgangers for immoral shape-shifting serial killers.

>> No.18882686
File: 17 KB, 260x367, tedbundy.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Any human you see, anywhere, could secretly be an inherently evil monster
So just like reality then.

>> No.18882739

Psychopathy is just emotionlessness. They're manipulative, but altogether harmless.
Bundy was just fucked up even further.
Well, I have a new goddamn bad guy conspiracy next time I GM.
Fuck, half-shifters can turn into any other humanoid race. ANY OTHER.
That means ANYONE YOU SEE, PERIOD, could secretly be a vasharan.

>> No.18882788
File: 225 KB, 760x596, kingshaped.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

All up to causing all-out wear between all other races, and they themselves being indoctrinated as worthless half-things so in the end they'll destroy each-other too.
(Might get a bit silly if there too many in a given area)

>> No.18882838

I can't help but think a couple of vashar half-shifters would just burst out laughing at that.
Good idea, though. They party finally tracks down the original vashar who had the bright idea, probably some insignificant character from earlier on, and upon being asked why he made all the races go to all-out war, he says "Well, why not?"

>> No.18882879

"Because they are not me, and that must be punished with death."

>> No.18882929

Ooh, good one.
I just got this mental picture of the guy. Kindly middle-aged fellow, perhaps runs an inn.
When they confront him, his omnipresent jolly smile disappears and is instantly replaced with a sardonic sneer.
Yeah, I'm definitely doing this.

>> No.18883008

Distraction enemy:
Another one with poor ability control and unstable mental state.
Shuffles around on roads and though cities, will steal food when hungry, sleep where he falls, and anyone that looks him in the eye is mimicked, killed and robbed.
Lunging forward wearing their face with a mad scream of "No you're no me, you're all wrong!"

easy way to introduce players to the shapeshifters.

>> No.18883079

Crazed failure, or something? Sure, that works.
Another good one, I think, would involve a character they'd come to trust.
Of course, he's one of them. He says "Maybe I was him all along. Maybe I killed him and took his place. Maybe one of us is closer than you think. Either way, you'll never know. Pleasant dreams."

>> No.18883091
File: 83 KB, 252x598, 252px-The_Emperor.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

So God-Emperor of Mankind is Aspect of Zarus?

>> No.18883107

I'd say they're the same person, in different universes.

>> No.18883142

In a similar vein, let a player character find his corpse hidden in the basement of his house. It's obvious that it has been murdered a long time ago. Mindfuck ahoy!

>> No.18883207

He appears to have been killed horribly with something similar to [insert player's main weapon here].
A good thing to remember with vasharans is that they are completely unbothered by things like filth and gore and vermin. So they start noticing things like an elven ambassador nonchalantly stabbing a sewer rat and eating it like a kebab. If asked, he simply says he was hungry.
People seem to look at them for just slightly too long, and they have this horrible glint in their eyes... of course, at least half of that latter bit is just their imaginations.

>> No.18883436


HOLY FUCK! the vashar sound fucking HOT!! At least the vashar women.. the first vashar apparently had sex with a succubus and then the succubus had his kids!? man.. I WANT THAT.. also apparently all sex in their society is done through rape!? my god.. its like I am in heaven! The only thing I don't like about them is their tolerance for shit piss and gore and such.

>> No.18883458

For some reason, people keep forgetting that Zarus is an evil asshole as bad as, say, Gruumsh.

>> No.18883498


>human hating faggot detected

go jump off a bridge xenoscum

>> No.18883499

>For some reason, people keep forgetting that Zarus is an evil asshole as bad as, say, Corellon Larethian

>> No.18883520

Corellon Larethian: CG
Zarus: LE

There's a reason most humans don't actually worship Zarus and stick to, say, Pelor. Zarus isn't really a racial deity in the same way the others are; he didn't create humanity or imbue it with his own nature, otherwise they'd be mostly lawful evil instead of neutral. He's just a dickhead human supremacist god butthurt about not being the sole focus of worship among his adopted race.

>> No.18883522

That's one version of the legend. The other is that Grazz't gave the first vashar guy a suitable mate of his own kind, who he probably raped the shit out of until they had enough kids to populate their species.
Come to think of it, either way would necessarily involve incest. No wonder the vasharans are so fucked up.
The only real difference there lies in whether they were nurtured by devils or demons.

>> No.18883529

...yet of those two gods it isn't Zarus who demands genocide of other race.

Go figure.

>> No.18883536


well I wouldn't call it rape.. I mean if its just a naked man and a naked woman out in the middle of nowhere.. what the fuck else are they going to do?

>> No.18883537
File: 25 KB, 360x359, deal with it shepard.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

>Transcendence 3:1 Zarus guided each of the races of Man as best he could, but even Zarus, greatest of the gods, grew tired. The other non-human races and their gods never stopped trying to destroy Zarus and his children. In comely guises, they sought to seduce human men and women. Abominable admixtures of humans and the more fecund of the non-human races began to be commonly seen. Humanity had turned from Zarus and he turned his back upon them. Mankind knew not of Zarus.
They don't generally worship him because Zarus said "fuck all y'all".

>> No.18883539

Of which two gods? CL or Pelor?

If it's CL, the only race I can think of is the drow, and I'm pretty sure that's not what CL wants so much as what one of his dickhead subordinates wants. In any case, Zarus wants all other races exterminated or subjugated.

>> No.18883564

All vashar sex is rape. That's just how it works.
The only way I could conceive of it happening otherwise is the boredom simply overwhelming both of them. As if he'd wait that long.
Way it probably happened, she popped out of thin air all confused-like, then he tackled her and gave her a good hard dicking. After having to repeatedly break her limbs to stop her running away or harming him, he probably invented rope.
What a lovely race.

>> No.18883566

Corellon: ethnic cleansing - CG
Zarus: human superiority - LE
>makes perfect sense

>> No.18883580

For one thing, Zarus also does ethnic cleansing. For another, Lloth and the drow started everything and CL doesn't actually want to wipe out the drow entirely, just defeat them as a military opponent to the other elves.

>> No.18883582

No, Zarus just wants them subjugated. Slavery, not death.

>> No.18883585

Corellon: destroying or thwarting an actively hostile race of sadistic, murderous, domineering assholes - CG
Zarus: enslaving or exterminating everyone that won't bow before you, because you think you're better than them - LE

So yes, it does make sense.

>> No.18883594

Wrong. Zarus would let orcs live as they please, as long as they hold humans superior to them. Corellon simply wants to wipe them out from the face of the earth.

>> No.18883602

And will kill them if they don't submit. Zarus also wants to murder every last part-human.

>> No.18883605

Okay, those guys want to burn our women and rape our homes, better slap their shit hard - ethnic cleansing.
Lets all act like we are cheap nazi knockoff in B-movie - human superiority.
>makes perfect sense

>> No.18883608

Orcs "living as they please" would never accept humans as superior at all, and CL wouldn't want to wipe out all orcs, just defeat them as a military power. Again.

>> No.18883611

The Book of Zarus is fan-made.
You know that, right?

>> No.18883623

Zarus was created in the official book Races of Destiny, and outlined his goals pretty clearly (with far less HFY wanking).

>> No.18883641


I just don't see how it could ALL be rape... I mean.. is all sex in human society rape? I mean at some point both parties want to have sex right?

also.. I would totally have sex with a vashar female.. AND/OR an orc female.. what do orc females even fucking look like? The only orc females I have seen are the cartoony ones in wow.

>> No.18883643

Just making sure.
Because it never said he wanted them dead. He pretty much said they needed human masters, for their own good.

>> No.18883648

According to some feminists, yes.

>> No.18883654

...are you baiting for orc pron?

>> No.18883660

isn't it obvious?

>> No.18883666

Sigh... I'll start digging.

>> No.18883673

And would kill them all if they didn't accept mastery.

>> No.18883680

unlike Corellon?

>> No.18883682

Killed or banished to badlands.

>> No.18883688
File: 51 KB, 500x657, 35ce0606-4020-406d-98d8-1f089d0cff49.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>> No.18883692

Never mutually.
You don't seem to get it. Vashar are fundamentally different from us. Consensual sex to them would be essentially admitting weakness, because you have equal control. If a vasharan finds a woman attractive, he'll corner her and rape her, even if she's his fucking sister. Why? Because that way he's making her the bitch, and asserting his dominance.
Vashar hate each other, and their society works out of mutual self-interest. Due to the fact that they'd rather die than submit to a leader like the gods that cast them out, it's highly democratic.

>> No.18883693


well I am not baiting orc pron.. I was just asking to see what some DnD orc females look like.. but if you wanted to post orc porn.. I wouldn't be particularly adverse..... get my drift?

>> No.18883698

Don't be silly it's not Murder if it's an evil people hellbent on annihilating your own race and culture, like the Jews, Nazis were only defending thir blood purity and traditions..

>> No.18883703

Corellon won't kill orcs who aren't currently raiding elves (or other races).

>> No.18883707
File: 112 KB, 400x548, MM35_PG203.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Happy to help!

>> No.18883716

>Once per year, on the fourth of Richfest, the holiday of Agelong is celebrated. Elves hunt for orcs to slay in memory of Corellon's battle against the god of the orcs, Gruumsh.

>> No.18883718

Good one.

New thing you'll tell me that Kender and Malkavians are perfect for anyone to play.

>> No.18883733

Well, it's not like it's hard to find orcs who are currently engaged in raiding. In fact, you'd be harder pressed to find ones who aren't.

>> No.18883740
File: 422 KB, 697x1000, 772729 - orc.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Should work

>> No.18883746

>"Anybody who runs is a raider. Anybody who stands still is a well-disciplined raider."

>> No.18883759

Don't worry. Any clerics who kill the wrong targets will have committed an evil act and thus either be stripped of power or rebuked, so they'll know what to do and what not to do.

>> No.18883768
File: 106 KB, 969x840, Orc_Female_Anatomy.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Would you?

>> No.18883781


Dem claws.

Oh god yes.

>> No.18883783



>> No.18883801
File: 87 KB, 498x474, Baffo2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

I'm not interested in orcs.

>> No.18883813

I've thought about accounting for actual biology in this. Humans are basically the best long-distance movers in the animal kingdom. Probably selected for due to spearing elephants on the savannah and then following them while they bleed to death.

So we are selected for endurance and ruthlessness. COOL.

>> No.18883832

So wouldn't that mean that those who had consensual sex would be the deviants? You can't say they don't have sexual deviants.

>> No.18883836
File: 78 KB, 483x522, 2167502-rorschach2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Short, violent lives ending violently, burning like a split atom the entire way through.

I guess for the same mercurial reasons old mythological gods claimed to 'envy your ability to die'. Most of the time (in DnD), a human's life is short. Brutal. Horrible. But it can almost NEVER said to be boring. Not so for the elves.

>> No.18883842

The vashar punishment for consensual sex in the missionary position is probably scaphism.

>> No.18883902
File: 18 KB, 320x240, 191TheJoyOfSect.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]

Stronger than elves, smarter than orcs, taller than dorfs.

They're better than every race at more than one thing, while most other races only have one thing that they do better than anyone (admittedly, even humans). This ultimately not-a-big-deal quirk is unique in them and ultimately makes them look better than everyone at everything because without exception they really are better than everyone, just at SOMEthing instead, not everything.

We're talking about DnD humans. When the aliens come I'll ask them.

I'm definitely expecting this thread to turn into a HURR NO HUMANITY SUCKS HFN thread any second though. Retards like that are the majority after the Hitlermod purgings.

>> No.18883968


Cool. Find anyone that does all three better than them.

In b4 HURR DRAGONS. Dragons are stronger than orcs, smarter than humans, more constitutional (they resent all these amendments) than dorfs and more dextrous than elves. They are IN ACTUALITY the mary sues elves fools themselves into thinking their own race is, right up until the point a member of the 'lesser' races cuts their pretty face.

>> No.18883983


I think that they do it the WORST way. It canonizes them IN THE FUCKING FLUFF as 'misunderstood' mary sues.

And no, I'm not going to stop using that words no matter how butthurt it makes you. It's the perfect fucking word to describe this sort of person.

>> No.18883991

>and more dextrous than elves
Actually, all true dragons only have a DEX of 10. Forever. At every stage of their life.

>> No.18883999


I always just assumed that was because your bones were small enough for a dragon to digest without having to spit out like the rest of us.

>> No.18884003
File: 39 KB, 900x414, 2002_kung_pow_enter_the_fist_002.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]


>all true dragons

As opposed to all those FAKE dragons?


>> No.18884005


That smacks a bit of 'no true dragon', doesn't it?

>> No.18884012

They are not Eragon elves.

That is reason enough to not call them Mary Sues.

>> No.18884024

You know there is an established difference between the 'true dragons' and normal dragons, right? Take a look through the monster manual, you'll see it.

>> No.18884027

We're better than someone at something, as opposed to the rest of the races that are better than EVERYONE at one thing and the absolutely fucking WORST at everything that doesn't encompass that one thing.

Specialization is good at filling niches, but good luck conquering the world with it.

>> No.18884032


Would you prefer a plate of hot shit or a plate of cold shit?

Because I'll have neither. Thanks.

>> No.18884052


>there is a difference

Let's hear it. What makes them fluff-different as opposed to just mechanically superior? It always seemed to me like having their cake and eating it too, so that adventurers can successfully hunt dragons but OHHH NO THOSE AREN'T REAL DRAGONS, THE REAL ONES ARE SO MUCH TOUGHER. Even though there's no difference apart from bullshit plot-armor that prevents cloudkill and the like.

>> No.18884077
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One poorly crossed species, one wayward epidemic, one failed battle, AND KA-BLOOEY!

We're hairless, weak, material plane bound monkeys... They got more half-kobold dwarves than they got the likes of us...

SO! While you fine non-humans are so proud, so cocksure, prancin' about with all your spell like abilities and stat bonuses, "come and get us!" We say! We'll be waiting with the fire and brimstone.


>> No.18884080



>> No.18884100

There is a Chinese myth concerning how mankind was created.

One god decided to create mankind from mud. Some humans were carefully sculpted and baked in an oven. However, the god then decided this wasn't time effective. He then started flinging mud around, and a human emerged from every splatter of mud he threw. However, these mud-flung humans were inferior to the baked ones. The baked ones became the ruling class, while the mud-flung ones became the peasants.

It works kind of like that. The true dragons are closer in form to the gods that created the dragons.

>> No.18884126

>Chinese myth concerning how mankind was created
This is one of those "old story used to justify racism" myths, isn't it?

>> No.18884141

Man, it would suck if other races were as adaptable as humans, and shared their drive for improvement.

>> No.18884143

Yep. just like Bible justifies why blacks are inferior to everyone else.

>> No.18884156

True Dragons (like Chromatics, Metallics, and so on) become inherently more powerful as an aspect of their age. True Dragons are the ones that have the large age charts that run from Wyrmling to Great Wyrm. Even if a True Dragon didn't gain experience, over the many years they live, they would still grow more powerful. It's an innate aspect of their race.

Dragons that don't fall under the True Dragon category grow in power the same way most other races do - through experience. Any greater power one individual has beyond their race's innate capabilities involved struggling to gain that power.

>> No.18884158

Used to justify their caste system, anyways.

Anyhow, true dragons are closer in form to the dragon gods than other dragons. You can actually go see the dragon gods yourself and confirm this...though you have to be pretty high level to do it.

>> No.18884168
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>It's like humans act as a multiplier. The offspring's potential goes well beyond what the parent races could've ever hoped to achieve.

I like this idea a lot. I might homebrew a world where the other races keep a genetic battery of humans around for the purpose of emergency culture-boosting under the guise of 'friendship'.

>> No.18884177


I remember that myth and it was the first thing I thought of, but was curious if the DnD people just copied the 'sleeve in mud' passage word for word if they'd tried to justify it with something other than Gods getting bored with something halfway through and halfassing it.

>> No.18884194

Surprised there wasn't more mention of elvish birth-rate in this thread.

Seriously, the fucking elves, dwarves, etc replenish their populations hilariously slow.

>> No.18884201


God, cool it with your junior-high Full Metal Jacket take on HFY for a second. The adults are talking.

Thinking critically about it, what came first: man or religion?

>> No.18884212

I don't think there's an exact mythology written anywhere, but Bahamut created the metallic dragons, Tiamat created the Chromatic dragons, all of the true dragons you find on the outer planes are probably due to the work of some god, and the non-true dragons don't have their creator stated anywhere, I assume they were just kasplerged into existence like everything else.

>> No.18884219
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Sooo... humans have the highest Spiral power potential?

>> No.18884226

This isn't reality, It's DnD. The gods and primordials came before humanity. The elder races came before humanity. We're new kids on the block

>> No.18884250

Apparently only through mixing. We exist as a way for other races to make themselves better, and through them protect ourselves from extermination.

A race designed to be raped, if you will.

>> No.18884252

>Psychopathy is just emotionlessness. They're manipulative, but altogether harmless.

...That's Sociopathy, retards, and even they are almost never 'harmless'.

The difference is basically that a psychopath would prefer to throw the grenade and see you explode whereas the sociopath would rather plant a bomb and be in another country when it happens.

>> No.18884292
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>> No.18884312
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You literally have it backwards.
Sociopathy is antisocial personality disorder. They enjoy being "bad". It's common to career criminals.
Psychopathy is utterly lacking emotions and empathy. A psychopath rarely will commit a major crime without a very good reason, because he's overwhelmingly narcissistic and thus does not want to be punished. The worst a psychopath generally does is use people in various ways.
Psychopathic serial killers are almost unheard of. Ted Bundy was a special case. Most serial killers are sociopathic.
Please don't be abrasive if you're not sure what you're talking about.

>> No.18884329

>implying there is a modern, agreed upon and meaningful distinction between 'psychopathy' and 'sociopathy'.

Try again.

>> No.18884338

The problem there is that all the greatest members of those societies will have human blood. Now, do you not think this would cause problems among the non-human races?

>> No.18884376


Fucking hell, I'll put it another way:

In DnD, what came first: humanity or their god?

I don't trust you not to fuck this up so I'll answer for you: they did. That makes them different than everyone else.

>> No.18884382

Yes, there is.
Psychopathy is characterized by an utter lack of empathy and remorse, and a psychopath has barely any emotions. This is the meaning of psychopathy.
There's no consensus of what the symptoms of it are, and it has thus never been officially diagnosed.
Sociopathy, when not being erronously used to refer to psychopathy, refers to antisocial personality disorder, which has a distinct diagnosis. I quote: a pervasive pattern of disregard for, and violation of, the rights of others that begins in childhood or early adolescence and continues into adulthood.

>> No.18884387


They are both subsets of ASPD.
The terms flipflop in definition constantly, but they are always vaguely similar.

Both lack empathy and enjoy being "bad", that's part of what they are. Neither completely emotions, just DEPTH of emotion. They feel anger, happiness, etc, they are just fleeting and shallow, and often don't appear with the expected stimuli. Temperament and ability to assimilate into society are the separating characteristics in most cases. Again, the terms change meaning frequently.

>Please don't be abrasive if you're not sure what you're talking about.

>> No.18884396


Sociopaths don't 'enjoy being bad' because, and this is straight out of the fucking textbook, they can't even identify what 'bad' is.

Psychopaths can but don't care.

That's the common wisdom, anyway. I seriously doubt they flipped that shit at any time in the last fifty years but given that they're trying to reclassify Aspergers as autism now, who knows.

>> No.18884402

Put another way, sociopathy is ASPD. Psychopathy is a subset of ASPD.
All psychopaths are sociopaths, not all sociopaths are psychopaths.

>> No.18884414

Misrepresentation. Asperger's Syndrome is being subsumed into "Autism Spectrum." We've known that autism is a spectrum disorder for a while. Doesn't make much sense to have a unique term for the far end.

Similar, sociopathy and psychopathy should be consolidated into more descriptive terms.

>> No.18884415


...Those definitions are both exactly correct but they've been misattributed to the opposite classification.

If this is a new sort of troll it's very Andy Kaufman.

>> No.18884417

It has, actually. Psychopathy and sociopathy are under the same umbrella, now. Both are characterized by a callous disregard for others. Psychopaths may understand what being "bad" is, but they don't understand why they should care.

>> No.18884429
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>humans exist to be raped

I hope every HFY thread from now on takes this turn.

>> No.18884465

Works both ways. Better constitution than orcs and elves, more dextrous than orcs and dwarves, stronger than elves.

>> No.18884466


So I was right the entire time


>> No.18884482

This is right: >>18884387

Whatever you said is not as right as that, if it was even right.

(I don't know which anonymous you are, but that dude is right on the money.)

>> No.18884493

Yes and no.
Psychopathy, as a subset, is rarely violent. It generally manifests itself in the psychopath manipulating others to benefit himself. Sociopathy otherwise often is.

>> No.18884494

orcs have a better constitution and are more dexterous in most cases. They're just physically better. They just have the downside of being mentally hanicapped by everyone else's standards.

>> No.18884518
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>> No.18884543
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>Psychopathy, as a subset, is rarely violent.(...)Sociopathy otherwise often is.

...That's not right...

>> No.18884556

2e= they can be any class and can dual class
3e=extra feat and skill points
4=extra feat, can put their ability bonus in any attribute, extra skill trained, heroic effort racial power or extra at-will

So every edition of D&D has been implying with their rules that humans are just more "heroic" and "versatile" then other races.

>> No.18884566

Ted Bundy was a psychopathic serial killer, notable for being a psychopathic serial killer.
Most serial killers cannot be called psychopaths, but they can be called sociopaths, as sociopath is a word that encompasses psychopathy.

>> No.18884612

>A disproportionate number exhibit one, two, or all three of the MacDonald triad (see below) of predictors of psychopathy

Honestly, are you high? Ted Bundy was notable for being CHARMING, which is usually more attributed to whatever definition of sociopath is circulating, and for getting away with it for years.

Psychopaths are REPEATEDLY serial killers. they're repeatedly criminals of any sort. Our jails are full of them. Them and niggers. An odd phenomenon come to think of it...

>> No.18884823

WHERES ALL THE ORC BOOTY!? OP here.. I went to a class and came back.. and there is no more orc booty :(

>> No.18884879

Psychopaths are scary, because they themselves feel little if any fear.

They will go full crazy in order to hurt somebody, and they will not care about consequences.

>> No.18884887

The problem with this statement is that muskets are fucking awful weapons. Economically viable sure but any organized force of elven archers would shit all over an company of line infantry.

>> No.18886352
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That has to do with impulse control.

It's not that they don't fear, it's that they act without control.

>> No.18886661

Sociopaths and psychopaths are the same thing you retards.

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