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18682819 No.18682819 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

>A Modest Proposal For Increased Diversity in D&D

http://www.tor.com/blogs/2012/04/a-modest-proposal-for-increased-diversity-in-dungeons-and-dragons

I think I just got a rage tumour

>> No.18682889

Didn;t 3.5 have a black monk, druid and I think paladin?
Not to mention the constant (and sometimes confusing) interchangeable use of his/her.

>> No.18682902
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18682902

I have never met anyone who wasn't white playing an RPG. Fair play I'm from Scotland (living in England) so there's not much in the way of ethnic diversity, more so now since I live in England.
At our club (mix of RPG and Wargames) there's one Indian guy and he only plays 40K. The population of the town in probably 10-15% are a mixture of Indian and Chinese. 60 people in the club, so youd expect at least half a dozen.
Maybe it's different in the US but I suspect that its mostly a white mans game, as it were.

>> No.18682922

ITT the author of the article doesnt know that D&D is

>> No.18682925

And constantly calling racism on everything doesn't help get rid of it, it only brings more attention to it, as Morgan Freeman said, "The only way to stop racism is to stop talking about it."

>> No.18682928

>>18682902

I apologise for my truly awful English. Proof reading is for soft southerners. Hoots etc

>> No.18682932

It's funny, because Eberron is insanely diverse.

>> No.18682944

>kickstarter video: The last airbender film poster

>> No.18682947

I honestly don't see why anyone gives a shit. Artists make their own characters, they shouldn't pander to a politically correct quota, because that's just as racist.

If everyone would shut up about race distinctions and actually start treating people equally, ignoring their skin colour entirely, it wouldn't matter. It's like me saying "I've got a lazy eye, why aren't there enough lazy-eyed characters in rpgs?"

The point is, if you want to make that character, you can, no-one is stopping you. stop pretending what colour your skin is actually matters to anyone but backwater rednecks, chavs, and equivalent.

>> No.18682965

Nutshell:

"Racism was not a problem on the Discworld, because - what with trolls and dwarfs and so on - speciesism was more interesting. Black and white lived in perfect harmony and ganged up on green."
— Terry Pratchett, Witches Abroad

>> No.18682968

We have a multicultural, multirace group: black, white, brown, asian, and that fucking ginger kid. We have a girl. We have a jew, two catholics, one atheist and a guy that says "I believe" and that's it. And our gaming is like our party, we have black charactrs, rare race characters and a that fucking warforged.

>> No.18682971

>>18682819
I've always been a fan of the diskworld theory of racism in fantasy worlds.

Can't remember the exact quote, but something like "racism doesn't exist because speciesism was far more interesting"

>> No.18682977

>>18682965
>>18682971
Pratchett Mind...

>> No.18682996

>>18682902
Well on the other side of the color spectrum I live in NYC and it is pretty diverse.

My group is one black guy, one turkish guy, two white guys and two asian fellows.

I'm not raging at the article but then again I'm not reading it either. I glanced at it but honestly, how could they force diversity? Does he really think races like the Redguard and Erudite promote diversity? All they do is make segregation and racial differences explicit.

There is nothing more "fair" than just saying "I'm gonna be this race. Also, I'm gonna be black/white/purple." A template is a more powerful tool for diversity than a shoehorn. It's up to the players and the DM to add "color" diversity.

>> No.18683001

>>18682968
you have naruto in your group?

>> No.18683015

I think there should be a law that restricts all artists to have to rotate between which race the characters they draw are, EXCEPT white males. They should be removed from the public consciousness, because they are MONSTERS.

>> No.18683017

Tor ran THIS on their website?

>> No.18683023
File: 84 KB, 248x396, what.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683023

>>18683001

>> No.18683036

>>18682947
Lazy eyed characters are offensive. Just ask /mlp/.

>> No.18683038

>>18683015
Is it sad that I actually genuinely agree with this? And I'm white and male myself.

>> No.18683042

>>18683015
I agree, and I am a white male. Our forefathers prospered and shit on everyone elses forefathers, now we're trying to change that, but you know, it's only fair if we let them oppress us for a change, that's what 'Equality' means, right?

>> No.18683044
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18683044

My friend is white and all his characters can be described as: "I look like Will Smith".

>> No.18683050

This is so very very retarded.
Complain to your DM, not wizards.

>> No.18683055

I'm all for adding racial diversity. But since most fantasy is based on medieval period, I demand the other races be portrayed faithfully. Asians get the same stuff as pasty humans, as do characters of middle-eastern look, but the night-camo humans can only get proficiencies in stone tools and elephant-shit-hutbuilding. Armor and metal in general will cause panic tests.

>> No.18683059

>Wanting black people in European based fantasy mythos

Granted, but they must wear traditional/fantastic clothing and be show on their own myths or an entire new culture based on that (How Forgotten Realms handles this with Thay and their Egypt analogues)

You don't see them much in the basic book because they have not much of a place there, is that simple.

I fucking love mythology from all over the world, I love fantasy cultures.

Putting a random black woman as a Paladin isn't "diversity" it's making a character white, black. There is a big difference.


It's just as retarded as 3.5 complete fighter handbook when there was a dwarf Samurai. It looked dumb and out of place. (The entire concept of the class was a bit dumb and out of place as well since it was based around yelling and dual wielding - Who the fuck thinks of a Samurai that dual wields and yells real loud?)

>> No.18683060
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18683060

3.5 core book, because that's what I have to hand

>barbarian
white, male, halforc
>bard
white, male, halfling
>cleric
white, male, human
>druid
WHITE, female, elf
>fighter
white, male, dwarf
white, male, human
>monk
black, female, human
>paladin
white/mixed, female, human
>ranger
white, male, elf
>rogue
yellowy-white, female, halfling
>sorceror
tanned, male, human
>wizard
tanned, female, elf
white, male, gnome

a bit biased, but not as bad as some

>what the article is actually asking for, but asian

>> No.18683066

>>18683038
>>18683042

I for one feel terrible that in a game last week my US Cavalry shot the bejesus out of some Apache. We intend to play a game this week where we let them build casinos to assuage our guilt.

>> No.18683107

www.politicalcorrectnessforeveryone.fag/PROPOSAL-TO-MAKE-EVERYTHING-IN-MAINSTREAM-AMERICA-TO-LOOK-LI
KE-A-COLLEGE-PAMPHLET

YOU GUYS, GUYS. I GOT A GREAT IDEA
YOU HAVE A BLACK PERSON WIZARD, OKAY. AND THEN YOU HAVE A WHITE GIRL FIGHTER OKAY. AND THEN GUYS GET THIS, YOU HAVE A GUY IN A WHEELCHAIR WHO IS A PALADIN!

AND THEN MAKE THE WHITE GUY A ROGUE TO SHOW THAT WHITE MEN CAN ALSO BE HORRIBLE PEOPLE! THEN WE'RE ALL HAPPY. EXCEPT YOU, THE TARGET AUDIENCE.

>> No.18683114

>2012

Only playing in medieval Europe analogues.

>> No.18683120
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18683120

>>18683059
>Here
Wait.
They used this in their article?

No. Fuck it. This article went from "kinda dumb" to "One of the most stupid pieces about RPGs ever written".

>> No.18683136

I don't think how skin color would influence a fantasy game, specially because a black human or a white human have a lot in common: none of them possess horns or wings or a tail.
Shadowrun had that Humanis Policlub with was basically that: "you stop worrying about the color of each other skin when trolls and orcs prowl around" or something like that.
Same goes for the other races: They don't like drows because they have a dark skin. They don't like drows because all their society is based on murder, slavery and the worship of a she-bitch goddess that praise both of those things.

>> No.18683140

rolled 7 = 7

>>18683120
because there are bigger dicks then white people!

>everybody take a DC 18 willpower test against shock

>> No.18683147

We usually have a Mexican or Black guy in our group and we use to have an Asian, and Half-Indian chick. We also have a short chick that's a regular.

We joke about each other, but to force diversity is just silly. Who cares if the art only shows white people? Most the artist are white themselves. That's like getting mad about Japanese Anime being set in Japan, and no Black Japanese characters.

>> No.18683150

I think that there should be 3 or 4 depictions of each class, instead of just one.


Barbarian could show some dual-wielding Apache, a sword & board Viking berserker, and a clay-more swinging Scottish lass.

Bard could be an Egyptian belly-dancer, Romani minstrel and an Asian courtier

Cleric, well a bunch of people could be brought in

Druid? Non-whites, non-whites everywhere (except Celtic lass maybe)

Fighter? EVERY CULTURE HAS SOME KIND OF WARRIOR

Not hard to have non-whites

Paladin? Whitey's domain, idgaf

Ranger? Like druid

Sorcerer? Like above

Wizard? Old World, Middle-Eastern book-delver, Chinese philosopher, white robed old man

>> No.18683152

The author lost credibility for me after I read "A modest proposal" and then saw the article was not remotely satirical.

>> No.18683153

>>18682819
How dare a game based on European mythology and literature have white people.
This is so racist.
Gimli should have been asian, Gandalf should have been black, hobits should have been Indian.
Only the orcs should have been white because they are violent and oppresive dictators like white people.

This message was brought to you by the new black panter party. Now go out and kill some crackers.

>> No.18683158

>>18683055

See this is why we get stupid shit like this article being written.

Educate yourself.

http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/mali/
http://eriksedge.com/

>> No.18683168

Why aren't there more white, black, hispanic, Native American, Aboriginal, Indian, Arab, Turk, Persians in Lot5R???

WTF They are all asian???

>> No.18683169

>>18683153
All settings are faux-Medieval Europe?

The rules are universal, so should the classes.

Consider that.

The way the guy argues is horrible, but consider that tidbit.

>> No.18683175
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18683175

>>18683107
>AND THEN GUYS GET THIS, YOU HAVE A GUY IN A WHEELCHAIR WHO IS A PALADIN!

...I can get behind that.

>> No.18683177

>and no Black Japanese characters.
Actually...there are only two types of blacks in anime. The trigger-happy muscular sarge, and the ugly, pure-maiden-raping-and-breaking negro. Seriously, the blacks in any hentain are so damn ugly as to look like neanderthals or demons, not humans.

>> No.18683188

>>18683150
>I think that there should be 3 or 4 depictions of each class, instead of just one.
THIS. All over this. Not just to shut up anyone who won't stop vomiting up verbal diarrhea about political correctness, but to show that each class can be different mechanical concepts as well.

>> No.18683193

>The rules are universal, so should the classes.

If the classes are truly universal, you either don't care what skincolour is the character portrait in the book because it's just one of many, or go the derp road, and insist they show all, or as many examples of each class as possible. Just so gamers know how black man in plate armor looks (which is the same as white man in armor, and asian in armor, and even fucking half-orc in armor, because the armor and helmet cover the skin)

>> No.18683194

>>18683177

Having spent alot of time in Okinawa, around Military bases, they seem to assume all Americans are Rap listening gang members.... at least based on what they sell.

>> No.18683210
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18683210

>>18683158
>the joke
-
-
-
>your head

>> No.18683212

>>18683193
It wouldn't hurt to throw in one person of each ethnicity distributed among the classes

>> No.18683220
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18683220

I don't know about you, but there's plenty of diversity in my D&D.

>nardard Sept
this has nothing to do with Tau, captcha.

>> No.18683225

>>18683194
Oh god I'm going to cry. Now with the internet and shit all the retarded people get to talk and I hate it.

>> No.18683229

If you're going to demand different ethnicities in humans, then why aren't you going to demand ethnicities of fantasy races as well?


Blue-skinned tieflings are extremely underrepresented.
Kobolds have a vast variety of ethnic scale colors and cultures.

>> No.18683234

>A Modest Proposal
THIS MAN IS A GENIUS!

>> No.18683236

>>18683059
Have to agree with this guy. D&D's pretty euro-myth-centric and it just looks forced to see a black viking analog, for example.

>> No.18683243

There's already plenty of racial diversity in D&D. Other species in-game represent other races. Elves, for example, epitomise the unique beauty and brilliance of the Asian race.

>> No.18683246

>>18683229
And let's not forget the orcs! I've never seen one that wasn't green skinned!

>> No.18683253

What would be nice is if we could have some Dwarves that WEREN'T Scottish or Welsh. We're not ALL belligerant drunks. I for one am quite level headed.

Fair enough I'm still drunk and yes I have a beard....also Im below average height but thats besides the point.

>> No.18683256

>>18683246
When the last time you saw a grey-skinned Orc, huh?

GREY POWER

>> No.18683262

Niggers

>> No.18683263

>And for that matter, are you seriously telling me that you think having a person with darker skin is somehow more of a strain on your suspension of disbelief than…a lizard lady or a devil dude?

This just reminds me how retarded some of the things in D&D is

And playing/portraying a black dude because "lolPC" is kinda boring. It makes race into a not-problem, and if there's something fantasy worlds need it's problems. That's why you should play a foreigner with strange customs in not-feudal europe: because it's interesting.

And if you want some kind of cosmopolitan super-nexus of races, sure go ahead, but it MUST have some kind of conflict or problem, because every single culture ever has had problems both internal and external, and that's what interesting fiction is made of.

>> No.18683267
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18683267

>>18683229

Don't get me started on all the stereotypes about dark-skinned elves.

>> No.18683273
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18683273

I love all the elven women of the world, no matter their color.

>> No.18683279

>>18683194
Well in Germany the locals are all convinced America is nothing but a bunch of drunks.

I'm in a country that prides itself on wine, beer festivals, and getting completely hammered in public, and they expect us not to join in?

>> No.18683280

>>18683169
Why?

The d20 system is universal. The classes, monsters, magic and fluff are designed to evoke a certain style of fantasy roleplay.

>> No.18683282

I don't wanna play no black man because most have fucked up facial features.

I like the dark skin though, I love it when my chinese cartoons have dark skinned bitches with regular faces.

>> No.18683293

The point isn't "your gaming group is too white!" it's "how about marketing to non-whites?" If you make more of your flagship characters black, or asian, or whatever, you send the message of "hey, this game is for everyone". And really, that's important to the hobby.

>> No.18683294
File: 112 KB, 400x548, orc.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683294

>>18683263
See
>>18682971
>>18682965
Humans forget about black vs white vs red vs yellow when there are greenskins about.

>> No.18683295

>>18683282
Those are what they call ganguro. Tanned to the point of baked. Think Jersey Shore.

>> No.18683296

>>18683263
Because at least 15+ races that have extremely different cultural practices and physical abilities can't create conflict.

Nope.

We gotta make sure that we have yet another example of how the white man is the ultimate unredeemable evil.

>> No.18683298

The classes should be universal and they should be a concept. The Paladin is a holy warrior. Anyone can be a holy warrior, all you need is the spirit, the faith and the determination. His skin color is based where he came from or where his paladin church/monastery/war academy is.
In Diablo 2 the Paladin was black because his whole religion was from Kurast, who was to the east, and there, the denizens had dark skin. Incredibly, the Necromancer who was also native from Kurast was white, because of years of deprivation of the sun, hidden in the mausoleums under the swamp. The tan sorceress was from a close location, that's why she's tan. She was borned there. The barbarian was from the cold north, hence white muscular guy. The amazon was from a tropical jungle, and the forest was so thick that the sun hardly could be seen, hence why they're also white. That shit was diversity right there. And we didn't noticed it, because oh shit halberd cows.

>> No.18683300

>>18683280
Oh yeah, sphinxes and mummies and vampires & kobolds & minotaurs & orcs were all present in the medieval era

>> No.18683305

Man I can't fucking wait to see everything I'm amused about be a tool for political correctness!

I can't wait to open up a Players Handbook ready to immerse myself as some sort of mystical, hardboiled warrior only to see some Urkel looking motherfucker wearing a halfplate backwards with his crossbow turned sideways.

>> No.18683314

I don't think the article is particularly well-written, nor does he make the point in the best way possible, but there's something to be said for what he's trying to get at. As a white male, I'd like to see more diversity in the art simply because it would make it more interesting. Hell, it might even inspire myself or others to create characters that we might otherwise not.

And that's all I have to say about that.

>> No.18683318

>>18683293
You find me a rulebook cover that doesn't feature at least one non-white character.

Because people of any ethnic ancestry are just immediately put off if they don't see someone who isn't white, red, blue, grey, green, purple.
No, gotta see all them characters that look like them in order to be interested.

>> No.18683322

>>18683253
The "scottish drunken dwarves" is just a stereotype that /tg/ spouts off.

Sure, it's common in satire and such, but in novels and actual play, dwarves tend to be pretty diverse. Gruffness and strong work ethic tend to be dwarven traits, but it's not much of a culture if it doesn't have some typical social norms.

>> No.18683323

>with his crossbow turned sideways.
The first fucker to try this will have amusing look when his char fails dex roll to catch the bolt as it falls from the stock.

>> No.18683330

>>18683060
male human fighter looks spanish or some shit

>> No.18683335

When was the last time you saw an adventurer in a wheelchair?

>> No.18683342

>>18683314
Nobody here is saying that we shouldn't have more diversity in rulebook art.

We're just saying that the demand is fairly frivolous. The art doesn't represent anybody. This isn't the bechdel test, this is just a demand to have pictures that might suggest an idea for a character while looking over the rules.

>> No.18683344
File: 136 KB, 1024x768, FantasyBlackMan.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683344

>>18682902
I have never played a DnD game with a white guy. It's always been majority black/asian, and some hispanics/mixes sprinkled in. Granted I'm from New York, so there's a lot in the way of minorities.

It's all where you live. Nerds have no ethnicity.

>> No.18683345

>>18683300
To your average medieval peasant vampires, kobolts and the like were far more real than some African on another continent.

>> No.18683346

>>18682902
White people play white people. Shocking.

If you're looking for novelty, you make an orc, not a Mexican. People are all mostly the same, despite what the half-crazed faggots in /pol/ might claim

>> No.18683347

>As a white male, I'd like to see more diversity in the art simply because it would make it more interesting

As a white, european male, I don't give a flying fuck about non-white characters. My group plays both historical-setting and fantasy...and the last time GM put a black NPC into our fantasy, our sole girl player yelled "I KILL THE HEATHEN MOOR". We're not allowed to have blacks in the game anymore.

>> No.18683349

>>18683335
You don't play GURPS much, do you mate?

>> No.18683351

>>18683335
in my current campaign...

>> No.18683354

>>18682902

There was a black dude running Pathfinder Society at PAX East. Also my brother brought his black friend in once when I was running L5R.

They're out there man, you just gotta believe.

>> No.18683364

No matter what percentage of the drawings are made 'ethnic,' as the article writer puts it, people will find something to bitch about.

>> No.18683378

>>18683344
Definitely depends on the region.

It can be argued that a lot of non-white (although I hate to say non-white, that false dichotomy is just bullshit) cultures tend to discourage nerdy activity.

It's okay for a white male to be nerdy, because "He's just a white boy." But an ethnic person is expected to do great things, be an example of responsibility, masculinity, or femininity.

So... nerds sort of have an ethnicity, but only in the sense that some ethnicities are heavily discouraged from engaging in such from their fellows.

>> No.18683384

>Like the fact that in the Fourth Edition Player’s Handbook there are only four black characters. There are more diabolically red skinned people — tieflings — then there are dark skinned people.

THAT'S BECAUSE TIEFLINGS ONLY COME IN 1 COLOR, WHILE HUMANS COME IN LIKE 50.

>> No.18683389

>>18683150

4e kinda gets to do this by showing off paragon paths for each class.

>> No.18683390

The people that care about their ethnicity to the extent that they demand it's to be put into the games are unlikely to be the demographic for the game in the first place.

>> No.18683405

>>18683342

>The art doesn't represent anybody.

I don't know about that... I think an argument could easily be made that the art is supposed to represent everybody who might play that game--or at least, their characters. The only thing I'm getting at is that nobody benefits from having their experience entirely homogenized in the way that the article suggests it currently is. Now, I don't believe that it's as extreme as the author does, nor do I think it's intentional, but it might be cool for the next core book's art to feature a wider range of ethnicity.

Anyway, this is an argument that can only get uglier as it goes on, so I'm gonna' bow out now.

>> No.18683407

>>18683378
>White nerd
>Encouraged

Full of shit. I'm calling you out.

>> No.18683416
File: 24 KB, 175x231, Pokemon Nigger Version.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683416

>>18683378

>This entire post

>> No.18683427

>>18683296
I'm trying to reply to this in a coherent fashion but I don't know how, so I'll just type it all out in caps:

I ALSO THINK A NEXUS OF A BUNCH OF RACES WOULD CREATE RACIAL CONFLICT. MY PROBLEM IS WITH HAVING SUCH A NEXUS AND NOT HAVING ANY PROBLEMS OF THE SORT.

>> No.18683429

>>18683407
Did I say that white people were encouraged?

If that's implied, that's not what I meant at all. Non-white ethnicity are discouraged, but it's much more acceptable, relatively, for a white person to be a nerd.

It's considered acceptable because we have a stereotypical image of it. Claim as you will that it's "suffering to be a nerd", but that's just circle jerking to how you got teased in high school.

>> No.18683433
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18683433

>>18683344
>>18683378

I do however know one white guy who's heavy into warhammer lore. He's never played the RPG though, as it's a depth of nerddom that intimidates him.

Nerds are never popular, only as parodies. People actually interested are put off by the label of nerd. I blame shit like pic related.

>> No.18683436
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18683436

I do my best to avoid threads like these, but GODDAMN that made me mad.

Unless you're going to play the characters drawn in the books, why would you use them as representation as to what you want to play in a game that's all IMAGINAAAATION? Make your character look how you want them to in your head; I've played plenty of black and Asian characters.

I suppose reading the rest of this thread might help before I post blindly here, but oh fucking well. Race threads on /tg/ rarely end well.

>> No.18683437

I remember back a couple of years when one of the main artists on 3e went on and on about how WoTC FORCED him to whitewash some of the iconics.

As in literally came down, saw him drawing an intentionally vaguely ethnic guy with a sword, and forced him to stop and make the guy white.

I think it's the reason that one iconic fighter always gets shafted in the art. He's always the one they show getting stabbed and tortured and shit, because WoTC literally forced them to include him.

>> No.18683439

>>18683416

More like this entire thread.

>> No.18683451

>>18683427
I'm not sure what your point is.

I say fantasy races create the racial conflict.
You say you're fine with that.
But your original posts racial conflict.

>> No.18683454
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18683454

>>18683433
>that show

>> No.18683461

Perhaps if black males weren't so damn ugly to non-black eyes, they'd be included more often in art...even the "black" art is usually ethnically ambigious rather than presentign typical african morphology.

>> No.18683467

>>18683378
I would argue east asian culture supports nerd like pursuits and hobbies far more than white cultures (if you can call what american whites have "culture")

>> No.18683469

>>18683152
...It was not satirical?

>> No.18683470
File: 10 KB, 251x200, shrug.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683470

>>18683437
We all hate WotC, anyway.

>> No.18683491

>>18683467
Mmm, that's true. Arguably asian, particularly asian-americans, are even encouraged or expected to be nerdy, regardless of what they do.

Although I will never understand this concept of, "White people don't have culture."
I don't even understand the basis for such a statement.

>> No.18683500

>>18683491
White people have a culture. White americans don't-they basically still suckle at the teat of Mother Europa, just regurigating the themes in american scenery.

>> No.18683503

>>18683384
I don't get what the fuck hes getting at.
The 4e book had what, two tieflings in the whole thing?

I'm just sick of anti-race/anti-sexism shoehorned into absolutely everything ever. I just want to sit back and immerse myself into something and the second I see one of these cliche's pop out suddenly the entire show is a god damn sunday morning educational video for 5 year olds with a DnD theme or something.

>Maybe your claim is that Dungeons & Dragons is based on a fantasy feudal Europe? Maybe your game is, but the whole point is that you can make whatever game you want; a diverse cast in your illustration just encourages that. And for that matter, are you seriously telling me that you think having a person with darker skin is somehow more of a strain on your suspension of disbelief than…a lizard lady or a devil dude?

All I read is:
>HOW DARE YOU. HOW DARE YOU NOT CATER TO MY SYMPATHY FOR PEOPLE THAT ARE DIFFERENT THAN I AM.

What the hell man, did you accidentally say something racist and then you had to write a shitty article to appease your anti-white masters?

>> No.18683504

>>18683467
Common misconception. The Japanese DESPISE nerds. Nerds and otaku are seen as prone to criminality and as worthless degenerates.

>> No.18683518

>>18683427
But then it's just Diskworld all over again, and the differences between men, dwarves, elves, halflings, gnomes and orcs will overshadow the differences between men of different color.

You want human on human racial conflict? You'd better create a setting where humans are the only humanoid race.

>> No.18683521

>>18683500
Americans have culture.

Just because it's recent doesn't mean it doesn't count as culture.

(I'm not even American)

>> No.18683531
File: 15 KB, 227x305, i-want-you-to-stop-trolling-thumb.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683531

>>18683500

Ohhh Boy

>> No.18683532
File: 11 KB, 302x227, 8550_lenny_mclean.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683532

>Huge Disclaimer: This is hardly a scientific process, and I bring my own biases to the table; I’m a white male, so how I perceive race is going to be a tricky wicket, anyhow.

White people of the world: quit this shit.

>> No.18683537

>>18683504
Ah, but non-asians expect asians to be nerdy.

But, yes, you're right.

>> No.18683545

>>18683521
I politely disagree. It's still their european heritage played out in picturesque Bumfuck, Arizona.

>> No.18683556

>>18683500
Guys

Guys

You know what's the difference between America and yogurt?

>> No.18683563
File: 33 KB, 480x320, BaDumChing.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683563

>>18683556

>> No.18683564

>>18683545
>I politely disagree.
willful ignorance is hardly polite.

>> No.18683565

>>18683556
>something about live cultures

ba dum tiss

>> No.18683566

>>18683556
Yes, yoghurt didn't have apartheid for the blackberries in it.

>> No.18683567
File: 48 KB, 202x200, 1326143711868.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683567

>>18683532
But anon

white people are all racist
and they don't have culture
theyre just privileged assholes
living in patriarchy
putting down the good folks of ethnicity and the powerful woman

If your a white male
your the worst thing on da planet

>> No.18683573

>>18683451
I'm not sure what your point is either
>But your original posts racial conflict.
Doesn't make sense

>> No.18683579

>>18683545
That alone makes it American.

If it's something from elsewhere but somehow gets integrated in that society, then the way that society perceives this new cultural artifact is now their culture for their symbolic perception of it comes from their American context/point of view.

Being a ex-colony has this effect on you, doesn't make their culture less rich or interesting.

>> No.18683586

>>18683573
Apologies, I must have typed too fast.

Your original post demanded that every setting have racial conflict.
And that's fair, that's a good setting that has racial conflict.

The reply was that you get racial conflict from fantasy races, bothering with ethnicities within the species/races is unnecessary.

And then.. you just repeated your first point in caps?

>> No.18683587

>>18683500
You serious, nigga? You watch American movies, eat American fast food, use American English derived laon words, and play American vidya.

American culture is hugely pervasive. Some countries - France and China particularly - get super-butthurt about how Americanization is eroding their own culture.

>> No.18683588

>>18683158
>Dating from the 16th to the 18th centuries, the ancient manuscripts presented in this exhibition cover every aspect of human endeavor and are indicative of the high level of civilization attained by West Africans during the Middle Ages.
Why are the African middle ages hundreds of years after everyone else's middle ages?

>> No.18683593

>doesn't make their culture less rich
Mhm. Having Holywood does. That's what putting jews in charge of entertainment gives you...they never understood what "fun" is, the bunch of god-bothering buggers.

>> No.18683596
File: 58 KB, 640x480, 1267599142781.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683596

>>18683567
Shut it, Emi, or I'm not using lube next time.

>> No.18683598

>>18683545
>I don't a fucking thing about the history of music, literature, art, or dance
FTFY, genius

Oh,and if you want to play the 'jazz is merely a derivative of European blah, blah, blah' BS, then the only original culture is Mesopotamia, so fuck off in advance

>> No.18683603
File: 925 KB, 676x559, GTFO olde.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683603

>>18683593
Back to your concentration camp, /new/fag scum.

>> No.18683605

>white is the default
>human race isn't even mentioned in D&D like, fucking ever
>this all has to do with the fucking art in the 4e rulebook
Seriously? Article author needs to kill himself. What does he want WotC to do, send art back to the artist all "this is perfect but add more black people"? Or does he expect them to =insist specifically= on the ratio of FUCKING FANTASY CHARACTERS resembling real life races in all their art? Is this really a fucking pressing issue?

As a person of partial Hispanic descent, this guy can stick his white guilt up his ass.

Also, if you're not going to be doing satire, don't fucking title your article 'a modest proposal'. It just proves you fucking fail at... well, everything.

>> No.18683608

>>18683567
Holy shit, that face is faggotry given a female form. Everything about it screams "HEY EVERYBODY I'M A HUGE FAGGOT! I'M EITHER TROLLING OR REALLY FUCKING STUPID, BUT EITHER WAY I'M GOING TO TAKE A MASSIVE SHIT ON THIS THREAD KTHANXBY ;p"

8/10

>> No.18683609
File: 46 KB, 500x334, 1326944994242.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683609

>>18683579
But all cultures borrow practices from one another.

That's what society is, no?

>> No.18683611

>>18683545

I impolitely disagree and suggest you were dropped on your head as a child and are merely another dickless European with an over-focused short man complex against Americans.

I furthermore suggest you cope with the situation.

>> No.18683612

I don't know if this is suppose to fit in here, but hey wtf: I was playing Mass Effect and while on the elevator during a random trip, Williams (Human) says to Wrex (big ugly alien): "You look different Wrex. I tought your species was a bunch of bullies and fools" (I'm paraphrasing but the message is still the same). And Wrex answers "Yes, because you humans have a multitude of features, individuals and governments and not a single one of you looks or behaves different". And she is like "oh shit sorry".

>> No.18683613

>In a nutshell — maybe the makers of D&D should take some of the effort being put into bending over backwards to explain why they don’t need to reflect the diversity in the real world…and put it into a flowering of diversity in their imaginary one.

How dare they make characters white!

>In the third edition, you’ve got Ember, the human monk — but other than her initial appearance under the class description, she’s absent from the rest of the book. Some artists have depicted Regdar as black, and he along with some of the other character have a generous color palate, by which I mean that their ethnicity is fluid on the page. They are hardly pale but neither are they a deep brown in skin tone, lending them a lot of flexibility for reader identification.

>Why isn't the black character all over the book!?

>> No.18683614

>>18683587
And here I thought the proper term was "commercialization".

Oh well, I guess it's the same thing.

>> No.18683616

Why are all anime characters white too? Shouldn't they be asian instead?

>> No.18683620

>>18683593
>check the board
>No, I'm not in /pol/
>WTAF

>> No.18683631
File: 20 KB, 452x339, Thats_the_joke.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683631

>>18683608
There's this thing called satire.

You've probably never heard of it.

>> No.18683633

>>18683614
As Khruschev said, 'we will bury you.'

>> No.18683638
File: 258 KB, 480x640, 1298737336792.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683638

>America has no culture.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_of_the_United_States

If anything it's omnipresent and beats people across the world over it's collective head with it to the point of mass annoyance.

>> No.18683640

>>18683609
Glad to see we agree kind anon.

>> No.18683644

>You watch American movies, eat American fast food, use American English derived laon words, and play American vidya.

Not really, definetely not, sometimes I guess, and nope, the only game I played the last year was M&B, which is turkish. I like turks. In fact, I wish there was more turks in the world and less americans. Kebab is superior to bigmac, even turk-pop is way better than Lady Gaga.

And none of it changes the fact that americans still can't shake the point-of-origin odium off themselves. You have anglo-americans, the few french-derived ones in the south, italian-americans, irish-americans...No other nation has such self-recognition issues as the poor immigrants in the colonies.

>> No.18683654

>>18683616

That's actually a really interesting topic that I don't have the energy to go into, especially when you consider that all animu (yes, ALL animu) is written, drawn, animated and scored by asians.

But basically it goes back to us steamrolling them in dubs dubs tubs when the Russians hit their stride and basically won the war in europe by themselves, freeing us to send more dudes over there to beat them up, then the atom bomb, then falling in love with Betty Boop and the rest is racist racist history.

>> No.18683656
File: 843 KB, 700x944, growf_20100321.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683656

"This simplistic assumption that an entire race is good or evil is ridiculous. The only thing that would be WORSE would be if the Drow had some obvious, unique physical characteristic that drew unfortunate parallels with the real world.

Lucky break, huh?"

>> No.18683658

>>18683500
There is no such thing as 'white' culture and even attempting to claim there is, is disseminating the culture of individual countries
>>18683587
>You watch American movies, eat American fast food, use American English derived laon words, and play American vidya.
I don't do any of those things, but yes, American culture is very pervasive, as you said.

>> No.18683659

>>18683616
Actually, they are asian. Most anime styles make it difficult or even impossible to distinguish between asians and whites based on facial structure, and since their skin color ranges overlap, they could be interpreted as asian or white.

>> No.18683660
File: 45 KB, 560x350, Sevendust+user169643_pic2461_1224612152.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683660

>>18683593
Take your fucking racism and spin on it, faggot. No one will put up with your shit here. Now slink on back to /pol/.

>> No.18683663

>>18683644
>Kebab is superior to bigmac
EVERYTHING is superior to big mac.

>> No.18683670

>>18683491
White *Americans* are always looking for some sort of cultural heritage they can call their own. White Europeans have that heritage handed to them, to the point where "white" has no real meaning for Europeans. You are Norwegian, or Welsh, or Romanian; here is your flag, your language, your ten thousand years of history, and a list of ways to celebrate holidays. A lot of that was lost by the cousins of these same Europeans in the sea-crossing, the pot-melting, and of late, militant ignorance typical of Americans.

I come from just such a white American household. Middle aged women would typically say ridiculous things like "I wish I was 100% Irish and 100% Jewish." It makes sense in the context of a cultural vacuum. Now I have married into a family that is 100% Irish and 100% Jewish. (My in-laws immigrated; my spouse is the first member of the family to have natural-born American citizenship). There is no cultural vacuum here. Christmas is full of traditions imported from the British isles. Kurdish, Hebrew, English, and British are spoken. The food is amazing. History is known, and communicated.

Compare this to a constant search for belonging. It's typical of not just the family I came from, but all their friends. Advertisements flood the airwaves aimed at an American culture which is defined as the absence of and search of culture.

>> No.18683673

>>18683644
>And none of it changes the fact that americans still can't shake the point-of-origin odium off themselves.

So what? Just because their culture wasn't developted after thousands upon thousands of years and was based off another (They WERE a colony, bro) does that mean it doesn't exist?

One thing is to dislike a culture.
The other is to pretend it doesn't exists.
Which by the way:
You just regonized in your post, making your initial argument null and void.

Enjoy your "crappy" (in your opinion) but that actually exists American culture, Anon.

>> No.18683674

>>18683644
>the poor immigrants in the colonies.
>as fucked as America is economically, Europeans literally can't afford the gas they use to start fires when protesting necessary-to-avoid-total-economic-collapse austerity measures

God I'm glad I'm not European.

>> No.18683679

>>18683660

>actually thinks all races are equal

try getting out of your basement more

>> No.18683683

>>18683670
Maybe it's just my generation speaking, but as a white male american I have no "longing" for a cultural history.

My culture is the internet culture. Who I genetically descend from has no impact on me.

>> No.18683685

>>18683679

He does, jackass. Seriously, shut the fuck up, this was a fairly good ragethread before the Euro v. America and racist shit started.

>> No.18683686
File: 17 KB, 404x588, First_Thanksgiving_Pilgrim_Indian_Turkey_Corn-1Lg.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683686

>>18683644

You are partly right... all peoples of america do love the turkey.

>> No.18683693

>dem responses

>Wednesday April 11, 2012 01:05pm EDT
I loved this post. I'm a girl gamer. There have been games I've had a hard time enjoying because it was so painfully obvious that women weren't considered part of the target audience at all

>For better or worse, D&D is the king of RPGs; if someone of a given skin color goes to a gaming con and wants to sit in on a game, they're probably not going to find one tailored to their particular hue — unless that hue is white.

>As a Dungeon Master, to avoid similar problems, I usually establish what range of skin colors and "races" based on Earth ethnicities live in a certain region

>When is breaking into someone's house to kill them & steal their stuff heroic? Answer: when you call it a "dungeon delve!" The act of a bunch of white dudes killing a bunch of non-white orcs is a perfect example of how & why real world ethnicities need to be addressed.

>> No.18683694

>>18683674
>necessary-to-avoid-total-economic-collapse austerity measures

Except austerity measures hasten economic collapse.

>> No.18683696
File: 74 KB, 512x512, Mario.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683696

>>18683685

>he

Even trying to hide by pretending you're somebody else? On an anonymous imageboard?

>> No.18683697
File: 392 KB, 940x718, trollcert.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683697

>>18683644
I *might* have bought it until
>turk-pop is way better than Lady Gaga
ANYTHING IN THE WORLD is better than turk-pop
3/10

>> No.18683701

I seem to recall hearing that, when WOTC was doing character designs for the 3.0 iconics, they intended that none of the iconics be discernably White. But there was some confusion about that, and Regdar the white human fighter slipped in, and that was kind of awkward for everybody involved.

This is why so many subsequent books have art of Regdar getting filled with arrows or falling in pit traps or being stabbed or (in one case) being dead.

>> No.18683702
File: 93 KB, 550x825, BlackHalfElf.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683702

This reminds me of an odd question I have:

Are there black half-elves? I mean logically, it should be possible, but art of such seems to be exceedingly rare. This is the only pic I've ever seen of such. There's more black halfling art than there is half-elf. You'd think artists would use the opportunity to make some interesting racial feature combinations. Are elves just too disgusted by them darkies to wanna make half-breed babies?

>> No.18683706

>>18683673
but it's still the same culture they "left" in the Old Country. They haven't added anything to it. They haven't modified it even. They tell the same stories. the only thing that changed was the geography of it. It's not new culture, it's continunation of the old.

>> No.18683707

>>18683702
Or you'd think the other way around;

That humans would be banging brown-elves left and right.

>> No.18683715

>>18683696

I'm not hiding behind anything, mostly because I hate Sevendust unlike the other poster. Hiding behind the excuse of "lol it's just a samefag"? What is this, 2007? I thought Internet trolling and racism used to be an art.

>> No.18683717

>>18683693
so if a bunch of black break into a dungeon and kill lots of non-black orcs it's ok?

I swear, some people are just looking for something to be offended at

>> No.18683720

>>18683659

They're fucking white, dude. Down to the goddamn blonde hair and light eyes.

Anime culture basically sprang into existence thanks to Betty Boop postcards sent to GI's combined with the bang-bang shoot 'em up cowboy culture of the United States at the time. After the war they basically had to remake their culture from the ground up since America kicked down their thousand year institution and god emperor without a second thought.

Basically they were in the nineteen fifties until the nineteen eighties, and have been in the eighties ever since.

>> No.18683721

>>18683693
>When is breaking into someone's house to kill them & steal their stuff heroic? Answer: when you call it a "dungeon delve!" The act of a bunch of white dudes killing a bunch of non-white orcs is a perfect example of how & why real world ethnicities need to be addressed.

>non-white Orcs
>NON-WHITE ORCS

D&D orcs are actually so fucking white, they are almost grey.

Oh wait you mean the humance race white? They are Orcs. Not human.

>> No.18683723

>>18683693
>The act of a bunch of white dudes killing a bunch of non-white orcs is a perfect example of how & why real world ethnicities need to be addressed.
hahaha oh wow

>> No.18683725

>>18683706
>They haven't modified it even.
America is just like Europe? Who knew?

>> No.18683730

>>18683702
we call them drow

>> No.18683734
File: 50 KB, 350x253, bitch please.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683734

>>18683696
Pronouns are masculine by default in the English language.

Also:
>two posts on the same anonymous image board disagree with me!
>therefore, they must have been made by the same person!

>> No.18683739

>>18683683
You do have a longing for culture. You are human. And you admit having chosen to identify as "internet." This is not so different from the silly white women who, one day, identify as Scottish, and then the next, Irish, taking what little they know of their genealogy and identifying with part of it. Then they go out and learn about these alien societies, just as one has to go to the internet and learn about the alien society that lives within it. Memes after all are units of cultural information. Flipping logs and wearing kilts is not fundamentally different from doing barrel rolls and masturbating to men wearing skirts.

>> No.18683740

>>18683715

Then how do you know for sure that he leaves his basement? For all you know, the guy could be a fat neckbeard who has no idea what the real world is like.

>> No.18683742

>>18683674
Ah yes, the "united" europe which, to some americans, mean it's a single country and behaves like one. There are countries in europe that are on the brink, and yes, they're being pumped full of cash...but if it all crashes and burns there, France and Germany and britain will be of course irritated and lose some money (seriously, germany sells like half the stuff rest of europe buys) but it won't be anywhere as dramatic as fall of the federal government in USA would be. It sucks to be a greek, yes. And it's risky to be a spaniard. but it's not bad at all to be a german or even irish (they're getting back on their feet very nicely).

>> No.18683746

>>18683720
I'm not sure if they count as caucasian if they engage in asian languages, beliefs, and practices.

Most anime stories are struggles very deeply rooted in japanese culture.

>> No.18683748

Does anybody else find the idea of attacking a set of tools that allow people to do anything they desire, limited solely by their imaginations, for not being "diverse" enough to be very silly?

If I don't want to have black characters in my game, that's my prerogative, not the game's.

>> No.18683752

>>18683740

Like you? I'm making an assumption based off of his statement; unlike your Stormfront horsedickery.

>> No.18683757

>>18683720
>down to the blond hair and blue eyes
And the pink hair and the blue hair and the green hair, right?

>> No.18683760

>>18683746
Do you know where the Caucasus Mountains are located?

>> No.18683764

>>18683706
>I STILL don't know a single thing about the history of music, art, literature r dance
Stop listening to jazz, blues, rock, or pop music, and read a book, will ya'?

>> No.18683766

>>18683633
But he never said that.

>> No.18683774

>>18683748

Not so sir, I've heard that 5E DnD has mandatory Afirmative Action rules.

>> No.18683776

>>18683660
How is it racist? Hollywood makes pure tripe and barely-watchable shit. A large degree, if not most of the financial backers of said movies, and directors themselves, are of jewish origin. It either means all the talentless jews gathered in one spot, or that there's something fundamentally wrong with jewish idea of good entertainment. I have not called them evil, just talentless.

>> No.18683778
File: 976 KB, 300x300, sisko_facepalm.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683778

>>18682819
>A modest proposal to Wizards of the Coast: how about including a more diverse representation of ethnic background in your core product? You’re working on Dungeons & Dragons Next — some call it D&D Fifth Edition — and I think now would be a great time to welcome new players. A product where white wasn’t the default would be a welcome addition to the hobby.

"Hey guyz ! I'm a nice little WASP who would totally LOVE to see those poor niggers playing D&D - the finest product of our proud civilisation ! So, you should totally make a point on drawing watermelons and KFC chicken wings in your books to make them more atractive for those uneducated monkeys !"

>> No.18683784

Ah yes, austerity measures. A weasel-word term for "we destroyed the economy, now we will take away your social services and tax you more while we take advantage of the market to buy up distressed properties at a fraction of their worth, lower wages, push through anti-worker legislation, and break down regulations designed to protect citizen health and safety."

Every time a politician tells us "we all must sacrifice," I want to be sick. I don't see any do-nothing senators voting for their pay raise every fucking year on capitol hill making sacrifices. I see them cutting meat off our flanks to serve their paymasters.

>> No.18683785

>>18683757
The green haired ones are Irish right? The Pinko's are obviously Russian
>>18683748
Yes, very silly. D&D is the only system I play a white character and it doesn't bother me.

>> No.18683788

>>18683720
Hair and eye color diversity is just there to hide samefaces. Most anime characters are obviously meant to be Japanese.

>> No.18683791

>>18683752

You think i don't? You think I visit stormfront? It's funny, that the least racist people often live in the most racially homogenous areas. In other words, the closer you are to other races, the more friction will occur.

>> No.18683792
File: 96 KB, 504x400, yatter03.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683792

Japanese culture has been a rip off of American culture since 1945.

>> No.18683798

>>18683739
My point was that it's not just americans that like having a cultural background.

Everybody does.
Everybody struggles with that concept.
And most definitely not just americans.

>> No.18683801

>>18683766
He did. Its part of the historical record. Plenty of sources on that one.

>> No.18683802

>>18683764
>jazz blues rock
I think these were developed by black slaveas and their freed descendants?
>pop music
...

>> No.18683808

>>18683760
Do you know what caucasian refers to?

>> No.18683809
File: 78 KB, 363x364, caucasus.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683809

>>18683760
Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan and just a bit of Russia.

Not that I see what that has to do with anything, as 'caucasian' has become synonymous with all varieties of whites.

>> No.18683812

I'm really curious as to why this modern age of faceless communication has led to more snooty white faggots getting up in arms about diversity, equality, and racism.

God damned faggot-ass tumblr generation.

>> No.18683813

>>18683798
Your point was already very well made by me. Americans however have a cultural deficit for numerous reasons.

>> No.18683826

>>18683812
The internet doesn't really change the way people think, it just lets them broadcast their shit further and easier.

>> No.18683829

>>18683784
Here's some austerity I can get behind: stop starting wars with filthy illiterate ragheads that hate us even more now because we murdered their neigbors and children and kidnapped their friend down the street to be tortured in a CIA black site on the word of Abdul Goatfucker who pocketed a bounty for turning in a "terrorist." How about we stop cutting taxes for corporations that plainly aren't making jobs - and when they do, they're low-paying part time work. How about we stop pumping trillions into stupid shit military equipment to fight a war that will never happen with a country that no longer exists.

>> No.18683833

>>18683808
Asia is a big place, pal. There are plenty of what the most ardent Klansman would call "white" people there. But of course "white" like all races does not exist. It is not a scientific concept; it cannot be defined or tested for.

>> No.18683839
File: 4 KB, 452x523, 1328562439584.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683839

>>18683812

Who could possibly have caused all this?

>> No.18683840

>>18683826
A true enough point.
Let's stupid people be louder and more easily accessible than ever before.

>> No.18683847

>>18682947
>Artists make their own characters
Not when they work for WotC they don't. This is all commissioned art with fairly specific restrictions. As is the case for most artwork that are not themselves the product.

>> No.18683849

>>18683833
You use words

But you don't see to understand what they mean

>> No.18683853

>>18683504
>Common misconception. The Japanese DESPISE nerds.
Common misconception. With the rise in popularity of the internet in the early 2000's, the country underwent an "otaku boom," one of the primary undercurrents of which was the realigning of people's beliefs that EVERYONE is an "otaku" of something.

>> No.18683854

>>18683701

Not so much "slipped" as "jammed".

The art guys wanted it to be as diverse as possible and loved doing such.

The marketing department forced them to add more white people in order to "look better on cardboard cutouts"

>> No.18683856

>>18683839
>>>/pol/
Seriously, you're getting fucking annoying.

>> No.18683857

>>18683748
RPG's are an incredibly flexible medium that allow you to not only have exciting adventures but to explore real-world dilemmas of morals and ethics in a safe environment. And with the use of exotic fantasy races it is almost TOO simplistic to explore the concept of the other, the outsider, the down-trodden, calls divides, generational divides, culture, and race without depending upon PC cliches from the real world


And then there's this fuckwit
>"I counted the pictures and there aren't enough brown people"
FFS

>> No.18683861

>>18683829

You forgot spending aid to Africa, even though it clearly doesn't work, and social aid to people who obviously don't need it/ned to face their own responsibilities

>> No.18683864
File: 21 KB, 461x307, 1235611677677.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683864

>>18683742

Mostly it just bugs me that even going through OUR shit, you still have the gall to take our relief money (it blows my mind we're still giving you relief money; pull your shit together grandpa) and then mock us for our economic situation. That's about as European as it comes to me.

You live off our consumption. A single state in Americaland has more economic output than an entire European nation. You don't get to have an opinion; you live and die off our fucking charity and then question the manner in which we provide it. Fuck off. Just keep making your stupid artesanal cheeses and dancing your stupid cultural dances and try not to interrupt our staring contest with China; much hangs in the fucking balance.

>> No.18683865

>>18683801
But it was deliberately misinterpreted by western warhawks.

Khruschev had a tendancy to put his foot in his mouth, this is true. But "we will bury you" was more along the lines of "we will outlast you," that is, the socialist ideology would live to see the capitalist one whither, die, and be put in its grave.

>> No.18683868

>>18683849
And now he hides behind passive-aggression, like the little bitch he is in real life.

>> No.18683871
File: 76 KB, 501x585, 1330845360324.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683871

>>18683856

>implying /pol/ isn't a kike-controlled opposition

/new/ is where it's at, goy

>> No.18683876

Seems to be a lot of recent talk about diversity in sci-fi/fantasy/RPGs.
This was an article a couple of days ago in The Guardian.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/apr/09/eastercon-sf-fantasy-convention

What does /t/g think of this?

>> No.18683877

>>18683865

>the socialist ideology would live to see the capitalist one whither, die, and be put in its grave.

dhohoho, funny how that turned out

>> No.18683880

>>18683847
not that I dont believe you but can you back that up with some source?

>> No.18683883

>>18683868
Not that guy you've been bickering with, but here's a wiki page since you seem to enjoy supposed definitions:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_race

Also this anonymous that you ignored in order to seem clever:
>>18683809

>> No.18683889

>>18683876
>Seems to be a lot of recent talk about diversity in sci-fi/fantasy/RPGs.
>what does /tg/ think
READ THE THREAD, DUMBASS! YOU'LL KNOW EXACTLY WHAT WE THINK ABOUT THIS KIND OF BULLSHIT!

>> No.18683893

>>18683877
Do you watch the news? How long do you think this system can last? Do you really think Eastern Europe and Russia are better off? What about infant mortality in the capitalist US, comparable to that of subsaharan Africa?

>> No.18683905

>>18683877
History is an ongoing story. The Soviet Union did more to throttle socialism than the capitalists ever did, replacing it with their own poisonous, typically Russian vision of it.

>> No.18683912

>>18683802
>I DEFINITELY don't know a single fucking thing about the history of music
Want to keep embarrassing yourself, moron? Maybe you want to continue to imply that Blacks aren't part of America? All you have to do now is insult women and you'll hit the ignorant racist trifecta

>> No.18683913

>>18683893

Does it matter? Socialism is dead. This isn't whether capitalism is sustainable (even though it is, since the current situation in Eastern Europe is due to massive corruption as a result from the communist period, and the situation in the US is because certain races tend to breed more than is good for them), it's all about whether socialism outlives capitalism. And if anything, socialism, as in state controlled economies, have been proven to be vastly inferior to their capitalist counterparts.

>> No.18683917
File: 13 KB, 264x320, pope.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683917

Why do you think they released NPC classes? If you want to roll a minority acurately just stat up a commoner.

>> No.18683918

>>18683378
HOLY MOTHER OF GOD IM GOING TO EAT THIS TROLLBAIT LIKE NO ONES FUCKING BUSINESS

What is your definition of nerd? Mine is: responsible, caring, values, successful, open-minded. Honestly this trollbait is so well crafted. Holy shit I want to give you a hug and help you through the internet but I know I can't.

>> No.18683919

>>18683812
It is th eonly thing in their life that might, just might, be morally positive

>> No.18683920
File: 168 KB, 896x792, why must you be like this....jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18683920

>>18683889
I meant your opinion on the article I linked.

>> No.18683929

>You live off our consumption.
Yes. We greatly enjoy the fact you keep buying our shit and siphon cash our of your country while we keep spending largely inside of EU and in china. You can now shut up and buy more of our overpriced cheese and feel yourself cultured. the alternative is Real American Cheese, with 0% real cheese in it.

>> No.18683931

I have an idea, let's eat the white people.

>> No.18683934

>I agree with Mordicai, but feel that both Wizards and Paizo will need to take things a few steps further in the long run—adjusting their editorial approach around topics like slavery, colonization, and the internal coherence of 'other' cultures within their worlds.

>Would you be forced to engage with racism and tension and prejudice within the story medium itself? You know, it’s easy to talk about “racism” between, say, elves and humans, because it’s not real to people in the same way. All of a sudden, when you are roleplaying a human from THIS culture, and they meet a human from THAT culture with different facial features and skin color, roleplaying racism could… well, it could add a lot to your game!

>I mean, you are right to point out that this isn't some "white man's burden" version of Dangerous Minds or something. That being said...it doesn't strike you as weird that there are more dragonborn than there are black skin tones in the PHB? Because it strikes me as weird. You mention Gene Roddenberry though, which is a little weird, since Uhuru (for instance) was sort of a pivotal figure in television portrayals of people of color.

This last one was posted by the author of the article in response to reply 59 made by a half-black who says that the idea that blacks need to be represented in everything is kind of insulting

>> No.18683935

>>18683893
A new system will be put into place, and it may be tempered with socialist aspects, but at the end of the day it will be capitalist. Every economic system since clans of cavemen traded their excess of A for other clans excess of B has been capitalist to some degree, it is only a question of how capitalist it is.

>> No.18683938

>>18683880
I don't have a specific example at hand for D&D, but there's a column about how they do the art that has some information:
http://wizards.com/DnD/Archive.aspx?category=all&subcategory=dragonseyeview

and WotC regularly writes about the whole process of MtG art-commissioning, including full descriptions, in articles like:
http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/arcana/836

>> No.18683939

>>18683905

The Chinese faced the same problems. Any economist can tell you that a state controlled economy is a very bad idea.

>> No.18683940

Holy mother of god what is this thread. Either it's trollfest 2012, most of you are under the age of 15, or you're so obsessed with what other think of you you can't think about yourself, and humanity has degenerated into a downward spiral of holy fuck I don't know.

>> No.18683942

Diving in my own peril, communism is impossible because it is incompatible with human nature at a basic level. It tries to pretend that people will work for the good of others, which is laughably idealistic at best. As soon as human greed and ambition get put into the communist equation, it all goes to shit.

Capitalism works well because it sucks. It openly embraces basic human nature for the pile of shit it is.

>> No.18683944

>>18683865
>"He never said that"
>"yes, he did"
>"Well, he did, I guess, but it was more nuanced than it sounds"
you gonna' keep moving those goalposts, sparky?

>> No.18683951

>>18683929
I'm just jumping in to state that America produces so much cheese, the government has to store surplus in CAVES in order to prevent a price crash. Just because we buy fancy foreign cheese doesn't mean we make none. That's like saying I bought a japanese video game because there's none being made in america.

>> No.18683952

>Capitalism works well
Not really. Considering none of the scandi countries had so much as hiccup during the recent crisis, I dare say social-democratic capitalism with some state interventionism works better than either communism or pure capitalism, which has a nasty tendency to devolve into oligopoly.

>> No.18683956

>>18683942

>human nature is shit, therefore socialism doesn't work

This has nothing to do with human nature. Any animal, hell even plants, fungi and bacteria would do the same. To do the least amount (or spend the least) for the maximum return. That is the very principle upon which evolution is built. It's only natural that mankind acts in the same way.

>> No.18683959

>>18683893
/pol/ SHIT BELONGS IN /pol/
TAKE YOUR FAGGOTRY OVER THERE NOW
FUCKING REPORTED FOR VIOLATING GLOBAL RULE 3

>> No.18683961

>>18683876
Back in the day there was a convention of SF/Fantasy writers and there was a huge debate about "letting" writers write about other races and genders; the feminists claimed men shouldn't write from a woman's viewpoint; the minorities argues no other race could write from theirs. They all had a lot of support from the general (White) audience and were about to pass a resolution that outsiders could not 'speak for' others when a female author stood up and asked
"Who will speak for the aliens?"

The resolution was dropped

>> No.18683969

Working in hospitals you will see plently of nerdy blacks and browns. People are the same the world over. Pay your children into respected and well paid positions.

Only wealthy people can afford nerds because the poor have no opportunities to be educated.
A nerd is a waste of a child when there are no learnings to be had.

>> No.18683971

>>18683938
Incidentally,Jon Schindehette (senior creative director for D&D and the guy who writes those D&D articles) does seem to care quite a bit about inclusiveness and sexism, and articles like OP's, which is a good sign for D&D Next.

>> No.18683973

>>18683952

>capitalism doesn't work well
>gives a capitalist economy with some social-democratic influences as an example

Besides, those scandi countries are going to face an immense demographic crisis in the coming decades.

>> No.18683974

>>18683876
>"The first time I went to a convention, all I could see was a sea of white, male faces, says Rita Medany. "I found it very disheartening, and I knew I could either go away and never go to another con or try to do something about it."

I don't get this at all.
It's like going to a fashion exhibition and being disappointed that most attendees are female.
Why would you even bother trying to change it? It's just the audience.

What the fuck.

>> No.18683980

>>18683942
Holy shit this isn't the fucking feudal ages. What's stronger, one fucker being a fucker, or a team of fuckers working together for everyone? You're stronger in a team.

>> No.18683985

>>18683961
That sounds like a yarn if I've ever seen one.

>> No.18683990

>>18683974

You know when people say they are anti-racist? They are not. They are anti-white. And before you think i'm a /pol/ stormfaggot, just remember that all these diversity preachers never criticize homogenous black, asian or arab communities or activities. Only the white ones.

>> No.18683994

>>18683973
we were socialist the last time I checked...

>> No.18684001

>>18683951
European Commision also pays farmers not to till the land from precisely the same reasons (which goes to show that "hunger in the world" is mostly political issue). But the point was, it's the US that WANTS to buy our overpriced cheese, despite abundance of your own. It clearly is worth more to the american consumer than the american cheese equivalent. Saying that Europe is "dependant" on US and should shut up is as true as saying that US craves Europe and should shut up. Both sides could do without the other, but it's simply beneficial for both to cooperate.

On another level, expensive european cheese is status symbol of wealth and class. You buy it because you want to be seen as man of the world, and wealthy enough to buy it. No one wants to be associated with Big Mac, on the other side.

>> No.18684003

>>18683980
>What's stronger, one fucker being a fucker, or a team of fuckers working together for everyone? You're stronger in a team.
But you get a smaller cut of meat if you have to share it with the rest of the team, and if you can win with your wits instead of your strength, who needs all those other losers?

>> No.18684004

>>18683746
>I'm not sure if they count as caucasian if they engage in asian languages, beliefs, and practices.

Sorry, dude. No matter how hard you shinto the nippon fairy will never wave her magic ricewand and make you no longer baka gaijin roundeye. Race is race and you need to deal with that.

>> No.18684014

>>18683893
I remember visiting the USSR and Communist Poland in '83 on an exchange program.

Lines for bread, and they ran out of bread before people; lines for shoes that didn't fit and didn't last; getting a car was about being in the Party; most of the kids I met had a cousin or an uncle who was taken by the police and was taken - no charges, no trial, no word, just gone. I helped a girl send her father a package in the Gulag - he had said that he thought it would be better if Russians could watch any TV show they liked, like in West Germany and someone heard him.

Yeah - they're better off. Anyone who says they aren't is a fool or a liar.

>> No.18684018

>>18683994

>free enterprise everywhere

Don't think so. How's the debt going by the way?

>> No.18684019

What's so bad about this?

>> No.18684028

>>18684003
Alright, have fun when the rest of the team comes a fucks you up for your little cut of meat and everyone gets a little more.

>> No.18684029

>>18683956
On the other hand, humans, and indeed many animals too, display altrusit behaviour on regular basis. Mostly because it's beneficial to the group, and survival in a group is always easier than for solitary beings. Evolution is a bit more complex that "toughest one wins".

>> No.18684031

>>18684019
Communism.

That's what I get from this thread anyway.

>> No.18684038

>>18683939
Chinese communism was Stalinism, only done even worse. This is (part of) why the Soviets and Chinese had a falling-out: the Soviets wanted to change things after ol' Joe was finally dead, and it got the Chinese asspained.

Nowadays the Chinese are state capitalist.

>> No.18684041
File: 1.68 MB, 296x248, 132403554954.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684041

>perfectly good /tg/ thread turning into /pol/
nope son, you can fucking have this. Enjoy the firebomb.

>> No.18684043

>>18684029

I know, but working in groups would not have been a success if it didn't have any value for the species, it wouldn't have worked.

>> No.18684048

>>18684031
Yeah I'm reading "More Brown people in D&D core book" = "Communism"

>> No.18684050

>>18683944
I'm an entirely different person, shit-for-brains. I'm actually the one that quoted Khruschev to begin with.

>> No.18684057

>>18684041
>perfectly good /tg/ thread turning into /pol/

Does it count if the turning point was the OP?

>> No.18684061

>>18684019
I'm fucking tired of leftists, that's what.


They are like deranged religious fundies. Replace original sin with white privilege.

>> No.18684063

>>18684028
You don't understand, there is no 'rest of the team'. You're not part of a team. You don't need to be a part of a team, because you can make it on your own. You left the team, you left their land, you found your own land, you kill your own meat.

>> No.18684065

>>18683985
Google "Judith Merril" - she was the woman who said it.

>> No.18684066

>>18684038

Yes, but maoism was undoubtedly Chinese.

Why blame the Russians for a system that is inherently flawed? Like I said, most economics these days are convinced that a state controlled economy isn't as effective as a free market, since people can better decide what they want than the government can.

>> No.18684068

>>18683598
no, they took their culture from themes developed by the first famers in Anatolia, who in turn derived their 'culture', limited as it was, from experiences passed down over hundreds of thousands of years of paleolithic hunting and gathering, who inherited that culture from their ancestors in the Great Rift Valley in Africa.

It goes on and on down the line to monkeys, which we still are. We just tend to forget that for some reason. Somehow makes us feel more important.

tl;dr : EVERYTHING IS MONKEYS.

>> No.18684074

>>18684061
I see conservatives whine about liberals whining about white privilege more than I actually see liberals whining about white privilege.

>> No.18684079

>>18684074

You don't frequent leftist media outlets that often? Well, steer clear of them then.

>> No.18684082

>>18684074
There must not be many liberals where you live.

>> No.18684085

>>18684074
USA must be a magical land. Here, left or right, everyone whines about the government which let the brownskins into the country in the first place.

>> No.18684089

Threads like these makes me glad I don't have to put up with American political ideas in my country.

>> No.18684092

>I don’t want to minimize the impact of Asian, Hispanic, Middle Eastern and other backgrounds or marginalize them in any way
>Don't mention Slavs, Finnic people, Germanic people, Nordic people, the French, or any other ethnicities that are simply lumped together as "white" and occasionally referenced and sometimes being represented by an equivalent caricature-like race in various fictions

This seems hypocritical. Why is it that the only concerns are about people who can't be ignorantly shoved into the leviathan 'demographic' if it can be called such, that is "WHIIIITE" who get no mention at all here? I suppose there's 'other backgrounds' but the least this man could do is make a more inclusive list than the usual white guilt bulletpoints.

>> No.18684094

>>18683877

We'll see.

>>18683893

This.

>> No.18684095

>>18684074
I'm glad you don't visit Tumblr. You're a good person.

>> No.18684097

>>18684018
pretty damn well. we're swimming in cash. feels good to have so much oil and not being bombed by poor, jelly murricans

>> No.18684100

>mordecai


It's ALWAYS a fucking Jew or a white WOMAN. ALWAYS.

>> No.18684102

>>18684085
And ocasionally poles that steal all the work, but this comes only from perpetually unemployed who wouldn't work as plumbers anyway.

>> No.18684110
File: 332 KB, 800x601, patface.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684110

You know, I wonder why some people can't stand politics.

>> No.18684111

>>18684019
...Nothing? The article raises important issues and makes good arguments. But /tg/ turns into /pol/-light on issues of racism, sexism and the like.

>> No.18684112

If the Capitalist system fails, it will be feudalism and fascism, not socialism, that replaces it.


I'll help to make sure of that.

>> No.18684114

>>18684066
The bolsheviks share the lion's share of the blame because they literally murdered people practicing non-bolshevist forms of socialism, many of which sprouted up following the intense worker dissatisfaction during the depression.

The Soviet Union cared less about socialism and more about obedient satellite states that did exactly what they were told. Much like the U.S. then and now, really.

>> No.18684122

>>18684111
>The article raises important issues and makes good arguments.

No it doesn't. Shut the fuck up.

>> No.18684123

I'm hispanic, I play D&D.

Did I ever, for one fucking second, assume I was being forced to play a whiteboy?

Well, uh, nope. Not really. Not at all, in fact. What's up that journalist's butt?

>> No.18684124

>>18684097

>oil

any retard can get rich with oil.

>>18684094

I already responded to that post in >>18683913

>> No.18684128

>>18684092
Because he takes an (north) American persepective. In America, groups like the Slavs, Germans, and Nords don't recieve the same treatment (or the percieved treatment) as those of color in that country.

It could be as well that French, German, and Nordic tales are the underpinning of most modern fantasy, but why would we consider that.

>> No.18684133

>>18684114

yeah, but the US actually had a half-way decent system. Also, that's how politics works. If your system can't even deal with politics on a basic level, it's pretty fucking bad.

>> No.18684135

>>18684122
Thanks for proving my second point at least.

>> No.18684137
File: 16 KB, 200x200, trollpride.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684137

Diversity would mean having a game with only white people in it. Every RPG book I've seen has at least a few non-white people in it, even though the vast majority of players are white. That's not very inclusive.

>> No.18684140

>>18684135
You don't have any points.

>> No.18684145

>>18684135

You can read the entire thread if you want to know why it raises no valid points. We're not going to bother summarize it for you.

>> No.18684147

>>18684003

The percentage might be smaller, but the gains could be much, much larger.

I mean one dog might kill one cat and spend a bunch of his time guarding his meal from the other dogs.

Or you could get six or seven dogs and take down a nice, juicy cow and then every single one of them gets twice what they would have gotten from the cat.

People like to venerate the individual, but basically every great individual was a part of a group that was just as skilled as he was or at least somewhere nearby.

>> No.18684149

WOW...

I knew 4chan was bad, but this is despicable.

As a geek girl, feminist, and proud supporter of diversity, I'm going to tell all my friends on tumblr what a horrible place this is. We're going to make you guys be more inclusive, fucking assholes!

>> No.18684150

>>18684066
It's not like there's a massive, gaping chasm, with a Randian free market on the one side and a Stalinist command economy on the other. Pretty much every country except North Korea dabbles in both state and market control of the economy.

>> No.18684155
File: 102 KB, 147x96, troglodyte.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684155

>>18684124
hhhyyyyepp.
you jelly of our oil

>> No.18684164

>>18684147

>Or you could get six or seven dogs and take down a nice, juicy cow and then every single one of them gets twice what they would have gotten from the cat.

You know capitalism does exactly this, right? that's why corporations exist.

>> No.18684167

>>18684155
>feels good not to have jelly Americans bombing us for our oil

That can change real fast.

>> No.18684168

>fucking assholes!
See, first time on /tg/ and you get the idea! Just let me be the pretty girl from time to time, okay?

>> No.18684179

>>18684155

nah, i got gas. Dutchbro here.

>> No.18684185

This further inspires me to make a game about white people 15 years from now fighting in a race war to exterminate all the kikes, muds and dyke feminists.

What system do you think I should use guys? Inb4 FATAL.

>> No.18684192

>>18684133
The U.S. had a lot of luck propping up its "decent system." An abusurdly resource-rich land filled only with easily-killed primitives, far from European interest or ability to enforce their will even if they were interested.

Russia's history is one long horror story of invasions across its insecure flatland borders, sometimes ceasing to exist at all. Russia prior to the revolution was a calcified, oligarchic state with basically no developed industry, badly losing an incredibly brutal war due to their industrial weakness and the ineptitude of the ruling class.

Then there were two revolutions, in which the west participated with home troops, funding for the White Army (who were by and large bandits), and mercenaries. Even the fucking Japs got in on the act. Then the intelligensia calling themselves 'bolsheviks' had to figure out how to run a country, because they had no idea in practice, only in broad Marxist theory. Then World War 2 happened.

The simple fact of the matter is that socialism found a Russia that was a backwater laughingstock with no industry and left it as the second most powerful country on the face of the planet, humming on power generated from nuclear piles and sending craft (the first craft) into space. In less than a century.

>> No.18684193

>>18684167
bring it on. not only are we both in nato but you'll get sweden and denmark against you, the russians will back us because fuck america and you just attacked NORWAY. who does that? no one is gonna want to play with you anymore.
and you thought the desert was bad? last time we had murricans here on a military winter practice we had to bail em out so they didnt freeze to death

>> No.18684195

You know what sucks

Iconic characters in RPGs
I don't mind the stereotypical fighter with a sword and shield, but I want to see a viking and a janissary and a samurai too. Of whatever gender.
Having every picture of a fighter be Regdar gives the impression that all fighters need to be like Regdar.

>> No.18684197

>>18684185
RaHoWa.

http://web.archive.org/web/20011223145057/www.wcotc.com/revm/rahowa.html

>> No.18684200

>>18684185
It's called Dark Heresy.

>> No.18684201

Zarus cares not for skin tone but the blood all humans share. We humans have to much bullshit to overcome then to worry about petty skin tone. So I ask you does it really matter that the man to your left has darker skin and slantier eyes? No, for he is human and our shared humanity shall help us enslave and take down the fithly elves, orcs, and dwarves.

>> No.18684204

>>18684147
Of course wild dogs will team up to take down large hoofed animals and get more meat from it. But when the hoofed animals migrate away, it's down to hunting rabbits, and for the most part everyone is on their own. If one dog falls down on his luck, maybe the other dogs will help him out to make sure he's still around when the hoofed animals migrate back.

That's capitalism with some socialist tempering, and that is the only thing that works well at the end of the day.

>> No.18684211

>>18684128
The former point is obvious, I know it all too well, living in America. But this ignorant perspective that white ethnicities aren't worth talking about beyond their skin color and how they're not worth discussion therefore, is just silly and it baffles me how it continues to breed and spread. And the latter is very true, but that still leaves the ill-known Finnic peoples (as if anyone bothers to remember them) and Slavs ("WUT? DEM RUSSIANS Y'MEAN?") left out, which is shameful and silly.

Then again that MIGHT be because Slavic mythologies are known for being strange, brutal and horrific, their monsters being the stuff of nightmares. As well as the Old Slavic mythologies not being incredibly well known even to the various Slavs, let alone outside of Eastern and Southeastern Europe, since unlike the Nordic peoples I don't believe the Old Slavs wrote any sagas.

>> No.18684218

>>18684149
I'm not sure if there's any point in replying to you since you're either a Troll (another one) or just plain stupid. We're not advocating less diversity in the industry, but rather that it isn't needed in art for a specific game that already allows full diversity at your whim.
Further it is a game whose setting is medieval Europe centuries before affirmative action.

>> No.18684224

>>18684193

>not only are we both IN nato

Don't kid yourself. We ARE nato.

>> No.18684234
File: 39 KB, 900x414, 2002_kung_pow_enter_the_fist_002.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684234

>>18684193

>you'll get sweden against you

Oh my goodness gracious not SWEDEN! Whatever will we do!?

>> No.18684235

>>18684195
This might be diversity done right, for each character class show their analogues for several cultures. Lets see a pointy hat Merlin type wizard standing next to a Tao wizard, etc, etc...

>> No.18684236

>>18684192

>The U.S. had a lot of luck propping up its "decent system." An abusurdly resource-rich land filled only with easily-killed primitives, far from European interest or ability to enforce their will even if they were interested.

Communist Russia possessed just as many, if not more, resources and still famine and poverty were common.

>Then there were two revolutions, in which the west participated with home troops, funding for the White Army (who were by and large bandits), and mercenaries. Even the fucking Japs got in on the act. Then the intelligensia calling themselves 'bolsheviks' had to figure out how to run a country, because they had no idea in practice, only in broad Marxist theory. Then World War 2 happened.

First of all, the Red Army was by far worse than the White army. And the difference between marxist theory and practice is exactly where it went wrong. But they were too proud to admit that the ideology was flawed from the core. Hell, even the so-called communist victory before WW2 was because of capitalist import. Also, WW2 didn't just happen after the revolution. There is twenty years between that. That's more than what Western Europe took to get back on track after it was completely destroyed after WW2.

>The simple fact of the matter is that socialism found a Russia that was a backwater laughingstock with no industry and left it as the second most powerful country on the face of the planet, humming on power generated from nuclear piles and sending craft (the first craft) into space. In less than a century.

Like i said, the industrialization in Soviet Russia was largely on capitalist import. They traded capitalist machines for food, while their own countrymen starved. And those achievements are nothing compared to what Nazi Germany, using fascist economics rather than full state control, did in less than a century.

>> No.18684248

>>18684234
You won't laugh when the bar you from their skiing resorts, and with hold their chocolate.

>> No.18684255

>>18684248

That's the Swiss

>> No.18684265

>>18684149

I realize this is a troll post (the good kind that makes you feel good), but I still wonder how and why women think like this.

And yes, it's women. Don't start. A dude will get pissed and call you a prickmonster or whatever but a woman will be like I HATE YOU! I'M GOING TO HANG OUT WITH YOU UNTIL YOU SEE THE ERROR OF YOUR WAYS!

That goes double for relationships. Why do you think we're going to stop hitting you? We're not. It has nothing to do with how much you love us or hate us.

>> No.18684273

>>18684255
Hmm, in that case
>giggling_girls.jpg

>> No.18684283
File: 90 KB, 589x375, trololo.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684283

>>18684218
It's hard to see racism when you're white. You obviously don't care about minorities, fucking bigot!

>> No.18684286
File: 79 KB, 350x218, 1229498305273.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684286

>>18684224

>Don't make me call the brute squad!
>Hey, I'm in the brute squad.
>You ARE the brute squad!

Americunts and snownigs are so cute together. You should have a sitcom.

>> No.18684288

>>18684283

>It's hard to see racism when you're white.

wait, are you from /new/ by any chance?

>> No.18684304

>>18684255
>>18684248

Yeah, the swedes are the ones that make those gummi fish and baked desserts.

>> No.18684306

>>18684283
herp derp, I'm not white and it doesn't matter if I was, the points are still valid.

>> No.18684310

>>18684288
It's called /pol/ these days, and they're pretty much the exact opposite of people who say "It's hard to see racism when you're white."

>> No.18684315

>>18684288
I advise never going to that horrible racist antisemitic website! Those insane nazi bigots are obsessed with exterminating 6 billion more Jews in another holocaust!

>> No.18684318

>>18684306

When he said "it's hard to see racism when you're white", he was referring to this:
http://unfaircampaign.org/

Some leftist campaign that claims only whites can be racist.

>> No.18684326

>>18684310

No, i meant the site to which /new/ moved soon after /pol/ axed it. Not on 4chan though. It's similar to /pol/ these days, although slower and more racist.

>> No.18684338

>>18684326

>No, i meant the site to which /new/ moved soon after /pol/ axed it.

moot axed it, i mean of course.

>> No.18684343
File: 6 KB, 500x500, icausethatfeel.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684343

Hehehehe....good goyim. We need more minorities so you can be more diverse. You'll never be allowed to forget that you're racist white privileged bigots that oppress minorities just by existing!

>> No.18684347
File: 475 KB, 320x240, 1329421026288.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684347

>>18684318
It's bullshit like this that I can't call myself a leftist.

>> No.18684354
File: 35 KB, 501x585, 1334263729773.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684354

>>18684343

Oy vey, Moshe! What are you doing? The goyim will notice!

>> No.18684357
File: 28 KB, 377x458, goodthread.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684357

>>18684343
>>18684354

>> No.18684394
File: 43 KB, 500x340, 1293621797185.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684394

>>18684318

What in the name of the Emperor am i reading?

How the fuck could anyone be stupid enough to believe this, let alone make a government-funded campaign of it?

>> No.18684398

>>18683175
I... wait... Polnareff? I don't recognize this at ALL.

>> No.18684414

>>18684394
It serves as a nice wooden dummy for people to attack and further focus on partisan politics rather than looking at government conduct as a whole.

>> No.18684471

This has inspired me to put heavy duty racism into my next campaign.

>> No.18684564
File: 10 KB, 212x238, around elves.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684564

>> No.18684683
File: 88 KB, 1226x453, the afirmative action dictionary.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684683

>>18684394
leftist "anti-racists" have decided that it is only possible for white people to be racist. All white people are racist subliminally because they benefit from "privelige" while black people cannot be racist even if they are prejudiced because "they have no power".
They define the meaning of the word "racist". They also define the meaning of the word "white". George Zimmermann is white to them despite being pretty brown while that smug chucklefuck Tim Wise gets to claim opressed minority status despite being white as fuck. They just change the rules to further their political aims.

>> No.18684698

>>18684014
The travesty that the USSR called "communism" wasn't communism or socialism. Sadly, revolutionary attempts to convert to communism never seen to go well.

>> No.18684721
File: 85 KB, 599x455, 1296552323893.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18684721

D&D...?

Days Raciss!

>> No.18684816

Of course minorities can be racist; we have gang wars between blacks and Mexicans (other central Americans too, like Puerto Ricans in the North East and Salvadoreans elsewhere where Mexicans aren't in large numbers) based solely on racism.

Now, unlike whitey's racism, this racism has not been institutionalized, and probably won't be; that is what is meant by powerless racism.

Racist nigger - dead spic, raped whitey.

Racist whitey - White Man's Burden, imperialism and Western "civilization".

A racist minority has no power to affect the system as a whole and can only damage other individuals whereas a racist white person can game the system and has done so in the past to make it better for white people.

This is different in South Africa, which is a uniquely fucked country.

>> No.18684856

>>18684816
Or Zimbabe, or Rhodesia. From being the Granary of the world to another shit-hole. Why?

>> No.18684860

>>18684816

>South Africa doesn't disprove my point because it's different for reasons that will come to me.

Yeah, no. Fuck off.

>> No.18684887

>>18684860
South Africa is different because it's the almost opposite, blacks (which compose the majority) have not institutionalized the racism de jure but have made it de facto anti-white. Not all blacks come from South Africa, and you can't call South African blacks minorities without beign a fucking idiot, so it doesn't disprove my earlier points, which focus on MINORITIES

>> No.18685316

>>18684816
>this racism has not been institutionalized, and probably won't be
don't count on it when we have a president who says if he had a son it would be Trayvon Martin

we already have qualified white men being rejected from jobs because of affirmative action quotas like in the case of the Chicago firefighters, I guess saving people from burning buildings is a lower priority than forming a beautiful cultural rainbow

>> No.18685427

>>18683658
White culture is sort of a catch all term for the various cultures of England, Ireland, Germany, France, etc, etc.

>> No.18685444

This thread is autosaging, but there's a second thread here >>18683516

>> No.18685466

>>18685444
Why wouldn't you just let it die?

>> No.18685494

>>18685466
It's going to die anyway, that's why I'm suggesting we move to the other thread!

Seriously, because I think if people want to talk, that's a good thing. If you aren't interested, you're welcome to leave. Why do you think a conversation other people want to have should die?

>> No.18685822

>>18685494
>no reply
I didn't think the "stop talking about what I don't like!" crowd had any real arguments.

>> No.18686935

Oh boy, yet another article telling me that I should feel bad because I was born with white skin, and my ancestors (not my literal ancestors, but hey why should that stop me being counted) did some bad shit to other people that didn't have some white skin! Because I totally had a choice in being born with white skin!

You know, this reminds me of certain behaviour from a century or two ago...

>> No.18687000

>>18686935
>I should feel bad
>I was born with white skin
>my ancestors
>I totally had a choice in being born with white skin!
>me me me me me
This post isn't about you, you tremendous faggot. It's asking WotC - you know, the people whose decisions matter - to do something. Go feel as white and proud as you want, it's not like anyone gives a shit.

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