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17683955 No.17683955 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

How far can the Guard go before they start stepping on the toes of Tech Priests. Can a guardsman strip, clean, and reassemble his gun? Does a tech priests need to manufacture every bullet, shell, and lasgun energy pack? What about if you need to repair a tank or put on new treads?

>> No.17683984

>Can a guardsman strip, clean, and reassemble his gun?
YES!

And yes, IG can also repair tank-tracks, etc.

The Ad-Mech handles the worky-bits, and know-how. A Guardsmen may not know precisely what every piece of his Lasgun does or how it all works together. But they can field-strip and clean it, and then reassemble it without a hitch.

>> No.17684017

>>17683955
The Imperial Guardsman's Uplifting Primier has instructions for field-stripping a lasgun.

As for tanks and stuff, I dunno. I've read a lot of army fluff that has guardsmen maintaining their Russes and Chimera, when push comes to shove, but army fluff is basically fanfiction.

/tg/'s own "Love can Bloom" mentions something about the guardsmen preforming field repairs on their chimera, and shoving whatever they can find into the fuel tank, and how these practices piss of the Tech Priests.

That's as much as I can help.

>> No.17684067

I think for almost all intents they are allowed to do whatever with their weapons and guns. They may not know the science behind everything but if they can get it working/firing then its okay. My reasoning is that the Imperial Guard is a very pragmatic orginization and if battles are lost because there is a sand storm and the guardsmen can't clean their weapons. Or its muddy and a tank threw its treads would not be okay.

>> No.17684075

>Can a guardsman strip, clean, and reassemble his gun?
Yes. Coming from a mil-fag, every half decent soldier needs to be able to clean their weapon. Dirty weapons jam, and a jammed/inoperable weapons get you killed dead. Sadly, the guardsmen think of it was "I wipe off those lenses there, while saying the Litany of Sure Aim, and then my gun works, " while we would say "Clean off the focusing lense, so that the laser beam can be focused onto the target.

>Does a tech priests need to manufacture every bullet, shell, and lasgun energy pack?
No, but they are often involved in the process. On forge worlds, millions of minor tech-priests and thousands of fully-invested magos watch over the production lines and the billions of menial laborers. On most hive worlds, businesses of various kinds are the main producers of weaponry and goods. However, they oftentimes must be licensed by the Mechanicus, or lease their patterns and expertise. So Tech-Priests are probably involved in their production, but as overseers of the production lines and quality control inspectors.

>What about if you need to repair a tank or put on new treads?
See my first answer. Serious damage to complex systems, like target identification, night vision cameras, or the complex feed systems of plasma weapons would probably require and Enginseer. However, minor hull damage, broken engines or thrown/damaged treads would definitely be within the purview of the crew, since a mobility kill makes you a big fucking target.

>> No.17684112

>>17684067
This. The lasgun is incredibly easy to use, and is basically built to make the AK series look like fragile, finicky toys. A quick wipe down of various parts (focusing lenses, power feeds, the "mag port," ect) and then the reassembled weapon should work just fine.

>> No.17684186

In the Ultramarine game there is a group of Guardsmen repairing a basilisk and one of them says "We're on a Forgeworld and there isn't a damn tech priest in sight! Get the field manual." So yes, guardsmen can and do perform repairs on their equipment.
And if I remember right in Imperial Armor 1 it says that the Thunderer siege tank was originally built by guardsmen as a stop-gag measure

>> No.17684206

>>17684186
>Imperial Armour 1
Ah, yes! I remember that, too.

There's your answer, OP. Guardsmen can go as far as slapping an entirely different weapon onto an existing chassis, if the situation calls for it.

>> No.17684222

>>17684206
This.

Of course, don't ask them how the weapon works if its a melta or plasma weapon, but i bet they can wire it up and get it shooting.

>> No.17684276
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17684276

>>17684206
This will also most likely piss off a few tech-priest.
But pissing off tech-priests is what Guardsmen do on daily basis. Want to listen to the local music vox?
Tamper with your vox-caster a bit.
Want a bit more "Fooosh" in your Hellhound?
Modify the inferno cannon a bit.
So yeah, stuff gets field modified by unsanctioned Guardsmen all the time.

>> No.17684384

In my Dark Heresy group we have a general guide line of if you modify something (for example one guy turned a multilaser into a SWTOR assault cannon) and it works it means that the machine spirit is pleased with what you did (PRAISE THE OMNISSIAH!) if it doesn't work or your dice rolls using it go to shit the machine spirit isn't pleased and that's heresy

>> No.17684420

>>17683955
Why would you ever need to field strip and clean a laser gun?

I'm just curious, 'cause I'm fairly certain they do not have too many moving parts and are fairly complex electrical devices on the inside.

>> No.17684503

>>17684186
>>17684206
In Forgeworld books there's a shitload of mentions of the IG modifying their vehicles more or less legally, which probably pisses off the AM from Mars quite a bit, but I'm pretty sure they always do this through their local/rogue techpriests.
The main point is that they can't MANUFACTURE the more advanced weapons or chassis so they have to import them from Forge Worlds. If their supply is cut, they have to make do with what's gathering dust in the armoury, or what the local factories can plop out. It's mentioned that the Thunderer's conversion was done at "a Departmento Munitorum field workshop".

Speaking of IA1, it mentions that the crew of the Atlas recovery tank (guardsmen) can repair lightly damaged vehicles on the spot ("such as those that have thrown a track"), but they need to be accompanied by Techpriests to "see that the proper blessings are administered to the machine spirit".
Destroyed vehicles also need their machine spirits "commended to the Emperor" before they are "left to rust in peace."

>> No.17684514

>>17684420
Well, we know from fluff that much of the internals are in sealed parts. This makes sense, since there are no moving parts, just delicate internal circuitry.

However, the focusing rings (as all these guys are pointing out) can get covered with shit, like mud or sand. Besides that, grit and other shit that gets into the "magazine well" of the weapon could disrupt the power feed.

So those are my main reasons for thinking that those guys might need to strip the weapon.

>> No.17684555

>>17684514
Makes sense, thanks.

>> No.17684593

>>17684555
The nice thing is that the only moving part of the weapon is the trigger. So basically, RUGGED. AS. FUCK.

Not a bad quality in a weapon that needs to arm everything from trained soldiers to barely-capable feral worlders.

>> No.17684686

>>17684276

I wonder how the Imperium would function if the Mechanicum was it's pre-heresy self. Hell, McNeil makes me wonder.

>> No.17684759
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17684759

>>17684686
Fairly good question. I fancy myself to be very knowledgeable about the AdMech, but it's actual history is something I haven't really read up on.
Guess I know less then what I thought I did.

>> No.17684822

>>17684759
That is a thought, huh?

>> No.17684896

Does the AdMech have it's own military force?

>> No.17684910

>>17684896
The Skitarii

>> No.17684923
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17684923

>>17684686

If the Mechanicus was it's pre-heresy self you would be seeing titans deployed in almost every battle, the Imperial fleet would be even more massive and making use of the Emperor class battleship in major engagements, instead of the literal handful that exist currently.

>> No.17684944

>>17684896
The IG regiments they have to give out due tithe (Happens sometimes) Usually tends to have a lot of binoic implants among their ranks.
Skitarii is exclusive AdMech fighting force.

>> No.17684981

>>17683955
> Does a tech priests need to manufacture every bullet, shell, and lasgun energy pack?
Not if you're in the company I've been attached to.
>frustratedcommisar.jpg

Captcha: "except conseire"
Okay Captcha, I'll admit Private Conseire is above average. He also knows which end to point at the enemy, which is a plus.

>> No.17685024

>>17684686

I still maintain that if Koriel Zeth hadn't fucking died, the Imperium would have a much better foundation of science and technology.

Sadly, she did, and I was fucking mad.

>> No.17685030

>>17684981
Meant to quote:
>Can a guardsman strip, clean, and reassemble his gun?
Apparently my scribe is just as useless.

>> No.17685033
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17685033

Have some more navy

>> No.17685168
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17685168

I get the stripping and cleaning, but why would he need to reassemble it?

Giggity.

>> No.17685226

>>17684686
It seemed like the exact same Mechanicum, only it was learning more due to all the tech comming in from the Great Crusade.

>> No.17685402
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17685402

>>17684503
I thought that modifying weapons at all was heresy?

>> No.17685581

>>17685226
And then the Fabricator-General sided with Horus, leading to mass civil war across Mars, the construction of multiple Ordinatii, destruction of legions of Titans, and when he realized he was going to lose the Fabricator-General reformatted the computer archives and blew up the hard copies.

Because fuck them.

>> No.17685913

>>17685402
It is, but if the Mechanicus finds it useful or there is a powerful or respected backer of the technology, like the Ultramarines and the LRC, then they can just sweep that under the rug.

>> No.17685940

>>17685913
A special note on this goes to the Inquisition and the Grey Knights, who adapt and use outright Xenotech

>> No.17686037

"Yes, sir, I know the enginseer is annoyed, but we had to open the machine casting... yes, but we would have lost the Chimera if we didn't jury rig it... what? ... demands penance? Front line you say? Throne... Well, if the Emperor commands" - From the Enginseer rank, Dark Heresy.

>> No.17686303

>>17685581

Not even reformatted. The rebel Mechanicus unleashed a scrapcode contagion that tore through Mars' information networks, turned infected techpriests to Chaos, infested datavaults with daemons and generally fucked things in every possible way.

>> No.17686485
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17686485

>>17686303
And then they pissed in the sacred unguents.

Friggin S/N cults!

>> No.17686581

Since Imperial technology is based on the Standard Template Construct system, it's highly likely that there's a lot of standardisation of parts and measurements, even between machinery manufactured sectors apart, otherwise the Imperial war machine would grind to a halt.

This being the case there's probably a lot of cross-compatibility and modular construction in Imperial technology. The easier it is to salvage spare parts to make a working tank, the more working tanks you'll have on the field. So while it might make the AdMech frown, it's likely within the ability of an experienced tank maintenance crew to to switch out a vehicle's guns or suchlike. If it works then obviously they were respectful enough not to offend the tank's machine-spirit. If it doesn't work then the machine-spirit is displeased, and the guardsmen must soothe it somehow.

The AdMech mainly hoard the knowledge of WHY stuff works - the science behind the technology, as it were. The knowledge required to maintain and perform basic repairs are taught to outsiders, but with a heavy dose of ritual and mysticism. The Litany of Purification for lasguns probably reads like a step-by-step troubleshooting procedure - check power-pack charge; check power-pack couplings; check focusing lens; check contacts between interior components; cycle the pulse capacitor to make sure it's charging properly. Except that every other step involves uttering a prayer, and you have to go through the entire litany from start to finish since you have no idea how to identify the specific problem and the Litany doesn't tell you WHY you perform each action beyond "it makes the machine-spirit happy".

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