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16254610 No.16254610 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Matt Ward

If he is hated so much and it's considered that everything he involves himself with is bad...why dont players ignore him?

Use old rules and dont regard anything he writes as canon.

Why not do that?

Sure it's not a permanent solution but it is better than nothing.

>> No.16254633

>dont regard anything he does as canon

But it IS, you just cant escape that fact

>use old rules

This is fine for casual games, but in most LGS's or tourneys you cannot do that

>> No.16254653

>>16254633
>But it IS, you just cant escape that fact

I'll interperate the story as I like, I can at least do *that*. Everybody can agree (except for Ward) that his take on parts of the story are just fucking stupid.

>This is fine for casual games, but in most LGS's or tourneys you cannot do that

Ok, point taken.

>> No.16254668

What if we hired a Vindicare Assassin to deal with him?

>> No.16254680

>>16254610
Because Robert Cruddace can be just as bad.

>> No.16254681
File: 198 KB, 481x1423, FUCK.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254681

lol, blood angels

>> No.16254691

>>16254668
impossible

being a daemon he cant die, he's just banished and he'll come back and make the game even shittier than ever

>> No.16254699

He's not hated so much anymore except by bandwagoning kids that were too young to live through his real fuckups but still want to be cool.

Obviously his fluff is garbage. No one considers it canon. But like... there has always been some garbage fluff. It's easy to ignore.

Obviously his rules used to suck (daemons) but he's doing fine these days. He learned from his mistakes. He's described as the "least worst" game designer GW has. Most people would rather him write their book than Cruddace or Gav or even Phil Kelly. Why? Because he's consistant. In recent years he's become capable enough to actually write a stable codex where nothing is glaringly over or underpowered. Sadly this is better than anyone else at GW can say.

Not using his rules is fucking pants on head retarded though. He writes decent rules these days (in before someone greentexts me and herps about daemons in Fantasy as if I didn't just specifically address that)

Honestly Ward hate is really annoying. Even more annoying than his shitty fluff. I can ignore his fluff by not reading it but it's harder to ignore people when they bring it up in conversation.

>> No.16254726
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16254726

>He's not hated so much anymore except by bandwagoning kids

>bandwagoning kids

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Matthew_Ward

"bandwagoning" is mentioned specifically on your page here Matt.

The inquisitors/neckbeards of /tg/ found you out long ago!

>> No.16254733

>>16254610
>If he is hated so much and it's considered that everything he involves himself with is bad...why dont players ignore him?
Because there are a select group of people who don't and if they keep encouraging him with no one to resist, then the franchise is doomed. DOOMED!!!!!

>> No.16254776
File: 97 KB, 989x820, 1315165506781.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254776

Here come the babies again...
Our daily "Waaaaahhhhh Mat Ward hurt my pee pee hole" thread

>> No.16254786

>>16254726
Point out that the hate is unreasonable despite how shitty he is because in fact everyone else at GW is as bad or worse

>get called Mat Ward

Yeah fuck you too kid. How old are you? Seriously? I think you proved my point.

>> No.16254796

>>16254733
Basically
Imagine /tg/ is like the democrats and Matt Ward Fanboys are the republicans. If we did nothing and ignored him like the democrats have been doing for the past 3 years. Then we would have a fuck up similar to the one we have now only with GW.

>> No.16254800

It really feels bad to miss the Ward hatewaggon.
I'll let you in on a secret, OP. It was glorious, it will never return, and you missed it.

>> No.16254813

>>16254699
>implying Phil Kelly isn't the greatest dev at Gw
>implying his codices are ever imbalanced
>implying his fluff is retarded

>> No.16254816
File: 30 KB, 200x200, 1315465973317.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254816

>>16254776
>>16254786
>>16254699
I hear you are writing the new Necrons codex Matt.

Are you going to retcon the Ultramarysues getting fucked up by them?
Or if you cant do that will you just make them entirely shit in general?

Dont say you are not Matt by the way, if you *really* didnt give a shit and were not Matt you'd just hide the thread and leave.

>> No.16254821

>>16254800

until he writes his next codex

hell imagine the hellstorm that would come out of a Wardian 6e rulebook

>> No.16254845

>>16254796
Mat Ward does not have any fucking fanboys. He has people who blindly hate him and blame him for cancer and the holocaust and he has vaguely reasonable people who dislike him but recognize he has grown and that while his fluff still sucks he's not the worst GW has to offer.

Only the blind haters would call those "fanboys"

>>16254816
You're really annoying man. You're also quoting multiple people. But you're trolling so you know that I guess.

>> No.16254855
File: 147 KB, 400x378, Ward Deal With It.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254855

>this thread

>> No.16254858
File: 116 KB, 484x1405, Matt_Ward.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254858

>>16254845
>Are you going to retcon the Ultramarysues getting fucked up by them?

He already has.

>> No.16254862

>>16254821
8th Edition Fantasy was primarily Wardian. It's not the end of the world.

Now all this Ward apologism aside, his only balanced (stupid but balanced) books have been marines. That's really not hard to do.

His real test of whether he has evolved as a games designer is how he does on the Necron codex. Something that isn't Space Marines. If he fucks that up then yeah, his marine work was just a fluke, but I don't think he will. I'd trust him to write any army book over Cruddace.

>> No.16254882

>>16254668
>>16254691

That's no reason we shouldn't try. Turn that bastard's head into a bloody, pulpy mass of goo.

>> No.16254884

>>16254862

Or Gav. The Dark Gods are not pleased with his work.

>> No.16254886

>>16254691

If nothing else, he'll be out of our hair for at least another thousand years or so.

>> No.16254912
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16254912

What do you guys think of phil kelly?

>> No.16254915
File: 338 KB, 1050x1000, Wardass.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254915

>spiritual leeeeeeeeege

What I didnt get about Ward was the sisters massacre, I think that was him projecting his hatred of women onto the 40k universe.

>> No.16254916
File: 215 KB, 648x900, Mat Ward the Grey Knight.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16254916

>>16254882
And then Cruddace writes your next army book and your staple support unit is overpriced and all your anti-tank is in one slot. Three units that never used to exist are vastly overpowered compared to the rest of the army which isn't even worth taking and everyone winds up playing the same cookie cutter list just to stay in the game.

And then you actually miss Mat Ward and he has the last laugh.

Which is of course also Mat Ward's fault. DAMN YOU WAAAAAAARD!!!!

>> No.16254928

>>16254816
Matt was a 'cron fan originaly, in one of the old white dwarfs there is a game fan by the name of Matt Ward playing Necron in a Battle Report vs Ultramorons, he lost horribly.

Now is the time of vengance, for the fan is writing the Codex.

>> No.16254932

>>16254915
Or he just doesn't like them. He doesn't have to be a misogynist to think that they are a stupid faction.

>> No.16254945

>>16254912
Pretty okay most of the time. Good fluff, decent rules that reflect the fluff but at least one solid mistake per codex. Not the end of the world to be sure though. He's pretty good but he's a jack of all trades master of none writer.

I think he's the one who brought in Jaws of the World Wolf though.

>> No.16254969

>>16254915
He's gonna end the Sisters, I swear it. They'll go the way of the Squats cause Ward's got his dick in a knot.

>> No.16254988

>>16254962
>Posting in a "/tg/ talks to Ward himself" thread.

No you aren't. Don't kid yourself. It's possible to acknowledge that Cruddace and Gav are in fact far worse in the current scheme without being Mat Ward.

If it weren't there would be hundreds of Mat Ward clones walking around right now and sorcery like that would've made the news.

>> No.16255000

>>16254915
>>16254932
If you read old/more fluff this is not exactly a new thing. Remember the part about how the universe is all GRIMDARK and nobody survives?

>> No.16255001

>>16254969
dude... Cruddace wrote the rules for the sisters. Cruddace. You can tell because Faith is random and doesn't scale properly.

Say what you will but if Ward had been in charge of more than fluff on that abomination at least they'd have a real Faith system.

>> No.16255012

>>16254988
>Cruddace and Gav are in fact far worse in the current scheme

Nice dubs but I doubt Gav is worse, at least he writes halfway decent fiction.
Wards fiction wouldn't pass my grade 3 fiction class, and we had some really crap stories there.

>> No.16255020

>>16254912
Phil Kelly is probably the best writer for rules and fluff. His fluff is interesting and for the most part lacks retardation. His books are very balanced and IMO reflect what all books should be. The Dark Eldar codex is a masterpiece.

He still has made mistakes and isn't perfect certainly, but when you look at the competition: Andy Chambers (good fluff, boring codex rules), Matt Ward (horrible fluff, decent if slightly overpowered rules in a few areas), or Cruddence (pants on head retarded), he is the best choice for writer.

>> No.16255022

becuase this retard sac of skin makes it so that he only makes the ultrasmurfs awesome and the grey knights broken as fuck and out you want to see something fucking stupid read this.
http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Kaldor_Draigo

>> No.16255044

>>16255012
No one is defending Ward's fluff. We all dislike it. Bringing it up as if it's relevant to the argument is... well... irrelevant to the argument.

We're talking about game design. And Mat is objectively less terrible at that than Gav. All I really need to do to prove my point is mention Gav's response to the chaos codex haters. He said it was literally our fault he didn't do his job.

Oh and Gav doesn't always write good fluff. He just doesn't suck constantly at it. Doesn't mean he doesn't derp himself.

>> No.16255055

>>16255022
no thanks your post was enough.

>> No.16255063

http://thegoodthebadtheinsulting.blogspot.com/2011/08/sisters-of-battle-sarcificed-for-ward.html

Matt Ward is a bad person on principle. Like if Stalin were able to make a reasonably balanced card game, he's still Stalin.

>> No.16255082

ITT White Knights shitting themselves because a few Sisters were killed.

>> No.16255086

>>16255082
I can tell you're a dirt-eating white trash monkey. From just that one post! Isn't that weird?

>> No.16255087

>>16255063
And Stalin would still be a better games designer than Cruddace or Gav.

Why can't we have Mat Ward on crunch, Stalin on fluff and Phil Kelly keeping them both on track? Best codex release ever.

>> No.16255107
File: 62 KB, 553x759, 1314031560697.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16255107

Kaldor Draigo

This shit I just did not get, surviving in the heart of the Warp without being a Primarch is tough enough though fucking up everything INSIDE the warp is just dumb.

It's the fucking warp, you could kick down Tzeentchs front door, TRASH his entire PALACE, burn it down and shit on the ashes and he'd just go "whatever" wave his hand and reform the entire fucking lot of it.

>> No.16255114

>>16255107
>reform
NOOOOO, THAT'S NOW HOW YOU TZEENTCH

>> No.16255115

As for Matt Ward's 'solid crunch' one needs to remember that the majority of what he's done lately have been marines.

Vanilla marines
Blood marines
Grey marines

sure, the latter kinda broke the mold a LITTLe bit, but mostly just ended up being 'marines with less melta and more gimmicks, a big dumb MC that is the laughing stock of /tg/, a SINGLE highly customizable and fluffy unit option that requires an SC to field at all effectively, and a few Inquisitor HQs and assassins'.

So apart from daemons, Wards codexes that are considered at the very least acceptable crunchwise are all marine dexes.

He co-wrote the recent sisters update, and look how well That worked out.

I am not convinced that Ward will capably handle the new Crons, as they just dont seem to fall under his competence zone. Only time will tell for sure

>> No.16255119

>>16255107

And that's exactly what happens.

>> No.16255122

>>16255107
It's almost as if Mat Ward writes spectacularly shitty fluff.

I just wish people would stop confusing being a shit writer with being a shit rules writer. They're not the same.

>> No.16255126

>>16255107
>It's the fucking warp, you could kick down Tzeentchs front door, TRASH his entire PALACE, burn it down and shit on the ashes and he'd just go "whatever" wave his hand and reform the entire fucking lot of it.

But that's exactly what happens.

>> No.16255129

>>16255082
Right there with you buddie, my Nids eat SoB's for breakfast.
Where's the harm in putting the SoB's to use, I mean seriously, at least annointing the GK's they did something.

>> No.16255134
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16255134

>>16255107
>It's the fucking warp, you could kick down Tzeentchs front door, TRASH his entire PALACE, burn it down and shit on the ashes and he'd just go "just as planned"

ftfy

>> No.16255136

>>16255107
But don't you see, that what makes it so grimdark! Draigo spends eternity wrecking shit in the Warp, only for his efforts to go unrewarded. Everything he destroys is instantly rebuilt, and yet he continues futilely destroying it again and again.

It's sooooo deep, man. Like, really philosophical shit up in this thread.

>> No.16255141
File: 18 KB, 505x358, Cunt destroyer.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16255141

>>16255129
>>16255082
Jesus you're awful at this.

>> No.16255145

>>16255115
Yep. Necrons will be his test.

If he fucks them up than I wont defend him again. It's perfectly possible that the balanced marine books were a fluke. After all we have the most data on that army and all the marine books are basically the same army. My grandmother could write a marine codex.

I kinda like the rumors for Necrons though so I have some hope it'll be good.

>> No.16255148

>>16255129
Knowing the Sisters, they probably got down on their knees and stuck their heads out for the knights.
If it meant the destruction of the Emperor's enemies, especially daemons, the Sisters couldn't have asked for any better.

>> No.16255151

>>16255141
no sir, that would be you, being as you cannot even pickout samefags properly

>> No.16255152
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16255152

You know what needs to happen to Draigo?

He needs to get out of the corrupting, evil warp, to think he has won great victories, only for somebody to say "no draigo, you are the daemons"

and then draigo was a daemon

>> No.16255159
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16255159

>>16255141
>People are disagreeing with me
>They must be samefagging!

>> No.16255164

I just hope ward writes the tau codex, so he can break railguns even more.

Maybe he'll make them d6 large blast template weapons, at s10 ap1 ignores cover/invulnerables.

Would be almost as bad as grey knights, really.

>> No.16255166

>>16255152
That would be excellent.

Like, after centuries of nonstop fighting, it turns out that it's all been a plot by Tzeentch to have him fall to Khorne.

>> No.16255181

>>16255152
I always thought the thing about Draigo was that in the end, he doesn't matter. And he knows it. All the wars he fights, all the daemons he banishes, all the worlds he purifies... in the end, it won't matter.

>> No.16255185

>>16255152

and then Draigo proceeded to defeat and absorb every Chaos god one by one, until he finally became Chaos United

>> No.16255188

>>16255148
That is exactly how FAITH works.
MARTYRS FOR THE CAUSE!

>> No.16255189

>>16255151
>>16255159
Look he's still doing it.

>> No.16255193

>>16255126

Just replace 'Tzeentch' with a Greater Daemon.

Honestly? I'm not too anger-obsessed about Draigo. The Mortarion-carving, sure. Not because it's overpowered but because it's stupid. If you can carve a name into something's freaking HEART, then you can kill it. Why didn't he just kill it? But the whole traveling through the Warp thing? I can picture that sort of thing happening to mortals every now and then. Most get torn to shreds immediately. Utterly immediately. But Grey Knights are supposed to be so pure that Chaos can't corrupt them, and this was a particularly pure specimen. So I can see one surviving a trip into the warp. And well, what else is a Grey Knight going to do but slaughter and burn everything around it? So far the biggest baddie he's come across is a Greater Daemon, which he's supposed to be on par with anyways, so what's the big deal?

>> No.16255199

>>16255164
Oh good. Someone else who thinks Grey Knights are broken. Thank you for your contribution to the discussion.

If you wanna complain that Inquisition armies need a special character or that dreadknights are ridiculous I'm right there with you but to say that the codex is broken is rather foolish. Even if you're a Tau player dealing with the FAQ'd plasma syphon (a bad FAQ decision to be sure) you can still just kill its bearer before it gets into its incredibly short range.

>> No.16255200

>>16255181

Well the hope is that if Draigo exists, then there will be more Draigos. Hell, Draigo could spawn and train an army of Draigos to replace him when it is finally his time. The Draigo Marines.

>> No.16255210

>>16255200
What if Draigo went back in time through the warp and killed his past self so he could have two of his favourite sword?

>> No.16255215

>>16255189
I like samefaging myself and someone else just to be a dick sometimes, I'm sorry guys, I'll stop cluttering up your thread with needless statements of retardedness. I promise.

>> No.16255219

>>16255193
>Why didn't he just kill it?
Because you can't kill any warp entity. You can fuck up its physical form, but at least in the Warp itself, a daemon is truly and completely immortal.

All Draigo can really do is troll Chaos, and carving your name into Mortarion's heart is pretty substantial trolling.

>> No.16255253
File: 489 KB, 352x240, Aku portal.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16255253

Long ago in a distant land, I, M'kar, the shape-shifting Master of Chaos, unleashed an unspeakable evil! But a foolish Grey Knight warrior wielding a magic sword stepped forth to oppose me. Before the final blow was struck, I tore open a portal in space and flung him into the warp, where my evil is law! Now the fool seeks to return to the real, and undo the evil that is Chaos!

>> No.16255261

>>16255164
Protip: Grey Knights are actually fairly midding or at least tournament-wise (or at least NoVa-wise) have not performed *as* well relative to their representation. Most the 6-Dread/Inquisitor setups didn't do as well as the numbers would've lead one to believe.

The numbers still point to SW and DE ultimately being better-suited for tournament-play even if the difference is comparatively small. Comedy is watching a SW player mass-Stunlock a GK Rifledread line with Fangs, while Njal negates Fortitude. The final had Draigo being Jaws'd dead also, which was rather amusing for us to watch as well.

>> No.16255320

>>16254668
>>16254691
Make a GK kill him.

>> No.16255338

>>16255115
He's still managed to take 3 armies that were quite similar in ways and make them play in different fashions that can't be replicated by the other armies.
In GKs case, you can actually make the small, absolutely elite wrecking crews they are supposed to be in the fluff on tabletop with a chance to actually win, something that has never been possible before.

>> No.16255355

>>16255219

But that's only true for beings born of the Warp. Mortal-turned-Daemons can still be killed, fully and completely. Mortarion is one of the latter. Super fucking hard and nigh impossible, sure, but clearly Draigo had a freaking blade on his heart so he was already at the finish line.

>> No.16255371

>>16254796
>injecting a superseding personal political view into a Matt Ward canon thread
yeah, no one wants to hear who you're going to vote for in 2012

>> No.16255421

>>16255253
Guys...guys...

What if..

What if Matt Ward decided to make to that reference? Like, the whole thing IS a Samurai Jack reference to tie-in to the silliness of the past.

>> No.16255427

>>16255355
>But that's only true for beings born of the Warp. Mortal-turned-Daemons can still be killed, fully and completely.

You're gonna have to provide a damned good source for that because I'm quite positive you're wrong given that immortality is one of the central motivations for wanting to become a daemon prince and always has been.

>> No.16255438

>>16255159

My /tg/ folder thanks you for your generous donation.

>> No.16255516
File: 46 KB, 468x551, stalin.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16255516

>Stalin the GW employee
The Valhallans rushed upon the heretics that opposed the Great Mustached Emperor, shouting with deafening magnitude UUUUURAAAAAH...

>> No.16255595

>>16255427

Immortality =/= Invulnerability

It's the same mistake over and over again. Why does everyone always think that dying of old age is the only way to die? Because that's the only way that those can mean the same thing.

>> No.16255612

>>16255595
No, that's just eternal youth =/= immortality.

They are two different things. Immortality means you can't die.

>> No.16255617

>>16255595
UMMMMM Karn, Lucius, Eternal Warrior. . . . .

>> No.16255669

>>16255612

>Immortality means you can't die
From aging.

>> No.16255679

>>16255669
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/immortality

>> No.16255683

>>16255669
1im·mor·tal
adj \(ˌ)i-ˈmȯr-təl\
1
: exempt from death <the immortal gods>
2
: exempt from oblivion : imperishable <immortal fame>

I see nothing here about age. Stop making up your own private definitions.

>> No.16255756

I'm looking at a fucking Webster's right now. If you looked for it online, maybe you should have checked to be sure it's a good source.

Immortality means you are not subject to the passing of time and the effects of aging. Just because most examples of immortal beings are more then just immortal doesn't mean that those add-ons are part of the term itself.

>> No.16255798

If we can't kill Matt Ward, we could just make him disappear. But it would take a tactical geni-

>> No.16255816
File: 92 KB, 580x750, 1302678404257.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16255816

As a new player, the past few years, I've enjoyed Ward's work. What's the big fucking deal ay?

>> No.16255877
File: 818 KB, 718x1024, To_the_Warp_and_Back_Again_by_MajesticChicken.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16255877

>>16255107
>This shit I just did not get, surviving in the heart of the Warp without being a Primarch is tough enough though fucking up everything INSIDE the warp is just dumb.

Read codex : daemons of chaos, it explains normal mortals can travel around in the warp, hell it even says some steal daemons and ride them to get around, you sir just don't understand 40k lore.

>> No.16255889

>>it explains normal mortals can travel around in the warp, hell it even says some steal daemons and ride them to get around

Grand Theft Auto V takes place in the Warp.

>> No.16255935
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16255935

>>16255669
>>16255612
The term "Biological immortality" exists since their is a jelly fish which never dies so no the word immortal by itself means never dies altogether.

>> No.16256011

>>16255935

No, because that jellyfish can still be killed. It just doesn't suffer the ill effects of aging. Hence saying it's immortal.
But it can still. Be. Killed.

>> No.16256027

Matt Ward is the best Codex writer GW keeps on the books right now.

>> No.16256068

Mat Ward is a known evil. We understand him. We can anticipate him. We can adapt and conform around him.

Any replacement would be an unknown. I think we'd dislike being left in the dark far more then not liking what we know is coming.

>> No.16256084

>>16255935
Read the post it is not "immortal" since it can die but it is it is "Biologically immortal" which means it can never die from old age, it does have the ill affects of aging since it has to essentially regrow itself by going back to it's child like form.

>> No.16256143

>>16256084

The ill side effect I was referring to was just death. Not deterioration. That is still possible with immortality. And you are still wrong. It is called 'Biological' not because it has a different definition but because it isn't something abstract but an actual possible case of it.

>> No.16256185

>>16256143

It is immortal from the perspective of biologically natural causes.
It is not immortal period.
It's like saying "this is hydrochloric acid proof" and taking that to mean that it's proof against any acid.

>> No.16256271

>>16256185

No, it's like saying that it is proof against hydrochloric acid.

If you wanted something to be acid proof against more types of acids, then you would need something additional to hydrochloric acid proof. Likewise, if you wanted to immune to more than just dying of old age, then you would need something more then just immortality. Which is why all, or almost all, immortal beings are described as being more then just immortal. The immortal part just says that aging doesn't affect them the same way it does us and they've been around a lot longer and likely will yet.

>> No.16256679

Ward said that chaos Daemons can't be killed because of this the most the Grey Knights can do is imprison the daemon inside items so it can not be re-created in the warp.

>> No.16257795

Just do what I do and embrace the truth that 40k is absolutely fucktarded- fun, but indeed fucktarded. It becomes a lot more enjoyable once you just go along with it.

It's a little different with crunch, admittedly. I just hope Ward makes the Necrons at least playable instead of something that gets tabled on turn 2 if it doesn't spam 60 warriors.

>> No.16258702

Wasn't this the same guy who said it was perfectly fine for High Elves and Lizardmen to summon daemonic hordes in Storm of Magic?

>> No.16258721

>>16255877

Didn't Ward write that one?

>> No.16258864

I think that as long as there's good in what's current, people are still going to use the current system for it.

I mean if I had the choice between all sorts of new units and abilities but with ever so slightly sillier fluff, and a basic codex with only the most essential units but fluff that is airtight and actually moving instead of embarassing? I'd take the new version. Because in the end, fluff can exist outside of the game, so the game can survive with these little blemishes that Ward's made, and I think outside sources of fluff provide a band-aid to those that insist on having one.

>> No.16259103

>Read codex : daemons of chaos, it explains normal mortals can travel around in the warp, hell it even says some steal daemons and ride them to get around, you sir just don't understand 40k lore.

Or I take the liberty to consider that 40K lore dumb.

>> No.16259404
File: 34 KB, 500x389, hahaha oh wow.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259404

>>16259103
>cites Matt Ward literature and uses it as a case that all of 40k is dumb and not just Matt Ward fluff.

>> No.16259425

>>16259103
didn't I just see you in the nurgle thread?

>> No.16259444
File: 37 KB, 510x546, blud ravuns.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259444

Why is Matt Ward writing the rules if nobody likes him?

>> No.16259455

>>16259444

I suspect nepotism or corruption at the heights of power in games workshop.

>> No.16259475

>>16259444

Because the company is run by people who really enjoy shooting themselves in the foot. Over and over again if the yearly price hikes and a certain "free loader" comment is to believed.

>> No.16259516
File: 11 KB, 250x315, phil kelly cut.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259516

>>16255020

Kelly made space wolves. They're /tg/'s favorite thing to rant on, for one reason or another.
Kelly also made space orks, and they're very bad, with no thought for the future involved. Just like ogres.
When GW decided they were gonna remake dark eldar, they had JES GODWIN HIMSELF sit down with Kelly to write the rules and the fluff. It's basically Kelly on the laptop, writing down everything Jes said. That's why their current book is the direct opposite of everything else Kelly has ever done.

Ward is 40k overfiend, and in charge of 'the big rules,' to a point. So he made fantasy less clunky, and added all these useful magic items? Jervis says 'not casual enough,' adds random terrain bullshit, tons more items you don't need (+1 S sword, +2 S sword, when there's a +3 S sword already), and decides magic needs to be 'shock and awe.' So Ward adds it, and Jervis is pleased.
He also made zero books so far that people take issues with, balancewise.

Cruddace is the local hackwriter. You don't know bad fluff until you read tomb kings, imperial guard, or tyranids. Guy writes like a 12-year-old, overusing names, starting 10 sentences in a row with the same word - so on. Also, has serious issues understanding how the games work.

>> No.16259542

Guard rules are pretty solid, with exception to a couple wtfs like Rough Riders pistol or ccw choice.

I can deal with direct rip-offs and crappy writing if the rules are fine.

>> No.16259576

So what you are saying is Jes Goodwin should write more fluff and books? Cause if he did actually come up with the Dark Eldar codex I'm ok with that. The fluff was pretty cool.

>> No.16259621
File: 4 KB, 122x146, robin_cruddace2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259621

>>16259542

Guard rules are not 'solid,' or casualfags wouldn't quake in their boots when someone says leafblower. Also, 55 point chimera are stupidly dumb, same with the manticore and vendetta. Veterans as troops, with no strings attached? Okay, Robin. As long as you push this new, huge helicopter-thing. What? You'll make it the only viable fast attack!? Emprah bless you, Robin. Here, have a pet project in tomb kings for later.

Because Cruddace sucks very, very hard at his job.

>>16259576

Yes. That's why Kelly has so little to say in the 'interview' they did about the codex.

>> No.16259686
File: 72 KB, 250x250, ButtHurt.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259686

>>16254610
Sometimes /tg/ is hard to follow without a program, so I'll break it down for you. Here's how it always goes:
101 Troll (OP): Matt Ward! Also, why aren't you all smart and good-looking like me? >
102 Anon: He's shit cos GW hires the lowest bidders. Also, OP is a faggot. >
Matt Ward: Hurr! Ur dum, jus get on th hate bandwagon there u dummy durr. >
Anon: Fuck off, Ward. >
Ward: Hurr nuh uh cant make me, an I not Ward. Also ur a trol, durr! >
There invariably follows anons mistaking the random quality of GW's utterly indifferent writing team as trending toward "improvement" until the thread starts to slow, then >
Troll (OP): Hi I not OP but I actually *like* Ward!!! > GOTO 102.

Thanks for playing Troll Enabler 40,000!

>> No.16259759

>>16259686
>GOTO

FFFFFFFFFUCK YOU YOU BLACK LEPRECHAUN

>> No.16259833
File: 69 KB, 273x240, 317.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259833

>>16259759
People call him a 'Black Leprechaun' but I've never even seen a picture of him.

>> No.16259838
File: 22 KB, 287x277, AngryMarine.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16259838

>>16259516
Oh god, as far as Cruddace is concerned, this is absolutely true.

All the fluff is kind of retarded, but in the blandest way. It's not funny bad. It's just bad.

Take, for example, the narvhal. Tyranids used to travel through the Warp. I mean, the Warp was everywhere! Why not? It's turbulent in the Milky Way, but it's an established part of the setting.

Not for Cruddace! Tyranids and the Warp? Makes no sense! Hence, the Narvhal! It uses gravity wells to create gravity from distant stars, and that allows faster than light travel! However, the narvhal can only use distant gravity because they're super sensitive and nearby gravity is hard. Wanna go ride bikes?

Fuck Robin Cruddace.

And holy hell, not to mention the tactical genius of the Swarmlord. He made his troops play dead. Why? So he could attack in two places at once and spread the Ultramarines thin. Hey! Here's a suggestion! If you're basically making a frontal attack anyway, why not just attack in two places at once without killing half your army in a plot first!

Jesus, the guy needs to read a book on tactical warfare.

>> No.16259923

Just get the Imperial Armour guys to do the fluff for the Codices, while Ward or whoever does the rules. it'd be good fun.

>> No.16259990

>>16259923

Forgeworld writes terrible stuff, except for the one imperial armor with lamenters. EVERYTHING else is bland, or all about the BIG wars, with the BIG guns, the BIG ships, and marines in their thousands dying/killing shit always, all the time.

>> No.16260007

>>16259990

>>EVERYTHING else is bland, or all about the BIG wars, with the BIG guns, the BIG ships, and marines in their thousands dying/killing shit always, all the time

Didn't you just describe 40K in its entirety?

>> No.16260028

>>16260007
Nope.
Rogue Trader was all Dr. Who references, punk music jokes, and space pudding.

>> No.16260042

I dunno, i really enjoyed the tyranid based imperial armor book.

>> No.16260053

>>16260028

*eyeroll* Since we have to be nitpicky.

"Didn't you just describe modern 40K in its entirety?"

>> No.16260094
File: 43 KB, 500x371, kirkface.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260094

>>16260053
>*eyeroll*

>> No.16260099

>>16259990
I tend to disagree. Forgeworld writes decent fluff. Much more detailed and "realistic" than codices.

>> No.16260113
File: 187 KB, 389x351, 1315607077002.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260113

>>16260053

>*eyeroll*

>> No.16260128

>>16260053
Yeah. Pretty much.

Who wants to hear another story about Spess Mehrenes killing everything in head-on assaults guys! No, I promise this story will be different. This time a Spess Mehreen almost dies!

What do you mean you think war stories should have more potential than that? Lawrence of Arabia? Who's that! The important guys were the British soldiers locked in a stalemate with the Turkish!

FUCK YEAR!

>> No.16260146

Forgeworld's hard-on for the Red Scorpions and Elysian Drop Troopers is kinda weird. Especially since they keep getting slaughtered in Imperial Armor.

>> No.16260151
File: 29 KB, 258x314, harvey.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260151

>>16260053

>eyeroll

>> No.16260165
File: 49 KB, 336x475, 1248520049_toofar.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260165

>the first image that popped into my head when I read Imperial Armour 8

>> No.16260176
File: 12 KB, 564x500, 1307640769139.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260176

>>16260053
>*eyeroll*

>> No.16260183

>>16260094
>>16260113
>samefag

>> No.16260203
File: 19 KB, 488x417, 1308932649544.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260203

>>16260183
>greentext

>> No.16260223

>>16260146

The Elysians get slaughtered.

The Red Scorpions grow ever more powerful.

>> No.16260234

>>16260223
So true.

>> No.16260247

>>16260223

Really? I guess I'm mistaken, but I recall the Scorpions tkaing hevay casualties in 4 and 9/10.

>> No.16260279

>>16260247
In 4, no as I recall.

>> No.16260284
File: 27 KB, 184x184, 1227900439966.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260284

>>16260146

>produce a line of miniatures for those factions
>their focus on them is "weird"

>> No.16260375

>>16260099
Yeah I like the forgeworld fluff. It seems a lot more believable and thought out.

I really don't like a lot of Matt ward's fluff, I ignore most of the BS about ultramarines but I have to admit the new rules aren't too bad. Grey Knights was a bit gimmiky but it always was anyway.
I can't blame him for the retarded models either (imo thunderfire cannon, derpknight) because the designers make them and tell him to write rules and fluff for it.

>> No.16260438

/tg/'s been looking at 40k the wrong way.

It's not ALL grimdark. If you're a warp entity, your life is pretty fucking cool.

>> No.16260465

>>16254610
>Use old rules
That only works if both players have a problem with the new rules. Despite all the neckbeard rage, most people don't have a problem with those codexes.

>> No.16260558

>>Or I take the liberty to consider that 40K lore dumb.

>cites Matt Ward literature and uses it as a case that all of 40k is dumb and not just Matt Ward fluff.

>that 40K lore
>that

Hahaohwow - no.

>> No.16260586
File: 273 KB, 904x868, 12330268302277.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260586

>>16260438

Once upon a time, we had Cultist-chan threads every day.

>> No.16260601

I don't raelly care about his fluff, I don't mind my warhammer having monkeys and shit, it already has farting marines.

>> No.16260631
File: 111 KB, 550x781, 1244542153489.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260631

>>16260586

There will always be a Cultish-chan thread in MY HEART.

>> No.16260674

Funny how tg hates so much on Ward, given their fluff is just as terrible.

>> No.16260708
File: 35 KB, 407x482, 2scream.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260708

Matt Ward writes all-right rules for whatever the current balance is. But he writes fluff like a 13 year old.

>>16260053
>*eyeroll*

>> No.16260779

>>16260601
>I don't mind my warhammer having monkeys and shit
40K had techno-monkeys before Ward (see 1st ed rule book)

>> No.16260886

>>16258721
>>16259404

Ward didn't write that.

>> No.16260945
File: 82 KB, 424x568, wolf freehand.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16260945

>>16260708

The game is marketed towards the 12-16 year old crowd, in case you didn't know.
If we didn't have Ward, all the books would be 'AND THE BIG, STRONG, SUPERWOLFMAN RIDES IN ON HIS WOLFY WOLF WITH HIS TWIN WOLF CLAWS AT THE READY, WOLF TALISMANS AND WOLF PELTS AND WOLFBLING BLINDING THE ORKS AS HE CUTS THEM ALL DOWN! THE END!'

Yes, Ward's fluff will read like that on the surface, too, but go between the lines, and you'll see things change. Like how he can't even begin to explain where the dreadknight came from, or even who made it.

Ignoring all stupid fluff (which is all fluff, ever), Wardian grey knights really have 4 separate builds right then and there, while the Kellynese space wolves have 1(!) build, no matter what.

>> No.16261011

>>16260945
Which I honestly find to be a bit of a pity. I'd like the game to be a little more skewed towards my Man Child, plays with toy soldiers market like the older editions and stuff like Lost and the Damned, which isn't the most mature thing ever, but it's also "not for kids". Of course, GW makes more money playing for the kids like most comix do, and just kind of appeasing new generations of market. They would have more integrity if they were to accept making a better and more consistent product for an older market, but they would be a smaller, less profitable one, and the share holders won't have that.

>> No.16261130
File: 46 KB, 600x450, solid gold.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16261130

>>16261011

They actually make more money in the long-term selling to the 16+ audience, but the company is in churn-and-burn, which means the focus on the 12-16 is at its peak, for maximum short-term cash.

I fully expect GW to not be around by 2014.

Until then, well, I'll keep being a Wardfan. If it wasn't for Ward, I'd have dropped out at the end of 4th edition.

>> No.16261165

>>16260674
War fluff is retarded, they only things in it that are not retarded are possibly unintentional subtext. His rules are not bad.

>Kelly has a history of shit but for some reason Dark Eldar fluff and crunch kicks ass, which I assume is because he didn't write it alone. When he writes it alone we got the wolfing wolf of the wolfity wolf. Though for some reason the background about Fenris and it's viking tribes was fucking awesome and completely different in style from that regarding the Space Wolves themselves. If a knife is pressed into Kelly's back his rules are great, when he does it by himself we get Jaws of the World Wolf.

>Curdance writes fluff with the proper tone, but the actual writing is terrible with way to much name dropping of the units. His crunch is gimped, like he is so afraid of someone mixing good units together to make a game breaking build that he allows only a few units like tanks or tervigons to actually be useful. Rather than tweaking the force allocation system to prevent overpowered mixing of units.

The problem here is the same problem you see in a lot of very popular settings, too much creative control.

Creative control can be good for a new setting, most new settings are shit and as such only the best are remembered and catch on. Those first stories in the setting tend to be the best because creativity remains but it is tempered by the fear of rejection by the audience on part of the writer.

For a long established setting with lots of existing fluff creative control is actually bad(see Star Wars) it causes the new writes who are fans to take their vision of the setting and hype it up to make it the standard. Instead they should force the writers to work more closely so there is always someone to look over their shoulder and say, "No that's retarded." This keeps the worst of the excesses in check.

>> No.16261230
File: 109 KB, 492x600, 1303785887615.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16261230

holy fuck, are you nig-nogs still going on about this? LOL

>> No.16261247

>>16261165
Can't say Cruddace fucked the IG crunch up, only several units in this dex suck. However, IG fluff is meh. Alot of new Nids whine is that Cruddace trashed Nidzilla and they now need to apply some thought and tactics. But Nids fluff is really good.

>> No.16261313

>>16261247
>Can't say Cruddace fucked the IG crunch up
Oh for certain under the current vehicle rules the IG are totally unfucked in any fashion. Though my lascannon/mortor crew spamming blob army does not fair so well that is to be expected since I use those choices for fun rather than to win.

The nids did get gimped though. The fexes really need extended carapace and they are too expensive for their stats. They don't need to be stronger or hit harder because that will bring back nidzilla tactics. They just need to be tougher, so they don't go down like bitches.

The Nid codex does well if you use tervigon spam. But a lot of the shooty options are underpowered. The just really need that extra toughness to make some of other models sell.

>> No.16261318
File: 3 KB, 129x81, BRS.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16261318

Guys. Guys!

What If Matt Ward writes a new space marine codex

The Blood Raven Codex!

>> No.16261361
File: 113 KB, 800x729, DSC01912.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16261361

>>16261165

>Kelly has a history of shit but for some reason Dark Eldar fluff and crunch kicks ass, which I assume is because he didn't write it alone. When he writes it alone we got the wolfing wolf of the wolfity wolf.

Jes Goodwin didn't want the fuck nugget Kelly to fuck up his little baby project. Like you said DE stuff is fairly good a few hiccups like all the Vect masturbation (but thats typical of all the races best and brightest see Calgar) and there being more DE than humans and orks, but that sounds more like a Kelly shit fuck.

>> No.16261374 [DELETED] 

>>16255107
>mfw this was just as planned
>mfw Tzeentch get's a massive fucking insurance payout because someone broke his palace
>mfw Tzeentch is now rolling in hookers and cocaine because of you

>> No.16261378

>>16261318

Tarkus would have a short story about how he clubbed a Farseer to death with an Avatar

>> No.16261412

>>16261318
We'd learn that the Blood Magpies artificers are just really good and make perfect copies of famous wargear instead of stealing it.

WWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRDDDDDDDDDDDDD!

>> No.16261447

>>16261313
Yup, Nids can deal damage, but can't absorb it.

>> No.16261553

>>16261361
Believe it or not Vect was actually toned down a little. In 3rd ed he was born before the Fall of the Eldar and somehow survived it. Now he was some slave borne after the fall the slowly rose to the top. The the amount of Just as Planned is ridiculous.

>> No.16261773

>>16261553

He survived it by being a devious motherfucker, also it used to be that the DE would drink tormented souls to offset the constant drain of Slaanesh and the most powerful DE who got the most and the best souls were immortal as long as they had a steady supply.

>> No.16261781
File: 17 KB, 241x403, pretty stupid.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16261781

>>16261374
>Slaanesh' face when

>> No.16261863

>>16261318

...
Dear god he's seen the future.

Gentlemen, we require the address to Ward's house and some chainsaws. Lots of chainsaws.

>> No.16262008

Isn't Ward busy with the Black Templars codex?

Can't wait to see the new Emperor's Champion.

>> No.16262932

My problems with Ward came with the 8th ed fantasy book (other than his god awful fluff).

-Magic Resistance: You get a ward save against magic. Every third spell: NO SAVE OF ANY KIND MAY BE TAKEN
-Steadfast: My crazily insane monster/lord/heavy cav unit just raped my opponent's unit and normally it would need double 1's to pass its break test. We has a rank, roll normal leadership.
-In the grim darkness of medieval Europe you can tell that rock is 92'3" away. In the grim darkness of the far future they are still guessing

>> No.16263025

>>16262008

It's worse. He's supposedly working on the Necron codex. "Improving" it by turning them all into fully sentient, benevolent anti-Warp space police who overthrew the C'Tan according to most information so far.

>> No.16263176

Y'know. It really bugs the shit out of me when someone says

>"Ward's rules are alright. Please stop harping on about how he's the antichrist. He's actually much better than the other rules writers if you look at it objectively. His terrible fluff isn't really anything new either and shitty fluff has always existed."

... and gets dismissed with "LOL U R WARD Get off /tg/ Mat"

Mat Ward haters genuinely annoy me more than Mat Ward, (and I play White Scars. I have more reason to hate his fluff than most) because the debate is so intellectually dishonest. It's champion level trolling. Gets me mad yo.

>>16262932
In the grim darkness of the far future they are an edition behind, so to speak, and all rumours about 6th Edition point to the same removal of guessing ranges and random movement.

>> No.16263207

>>16263025

I'm sorry but that sounds a lot more awesome than generic 'Hurr destroy all life just cuz'. And it's believeable a race that married to science would overthrow their gods. Crunchwise it works better as well because The Nightbringer at full power couldn't be properly represented on the tabletop. The Emperor had trouble making an already weakened C'Tan jut lie dormant. Bring on the space police!

>> No.16263211
File: 148 KB, 367x438, 1310140724303.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
16263211

>>16263025
Anything would be an improvement.

>turning them all into fully sentient
No, just emphasizing the fluff that already exists: that lords and immortals are sentient and that warriors used to be but died too often and their personality eroded. This is a good thing.

>benevolent
No. Just not mindlessly evil for no reason. They are now aliens with alien goals rather than aliens with EXTERMINATE ALL LIFE HERP goals

>anti-Warp
They already were

>space police
What?

>who overthrew the C'Tan
Yes and that's awesome. Fuck the C'Tan. Also the idea of killing one's gods is surprisingly lacking in the 40k setting so it's slightly more original than non-euclidean space Cthulhu.

>> No.16264924

>>16262932
>In the grim darkness of the far future they are an edition behind, so to speak, and all rumours about 6th Edition point to the same removal of guessing ranges and random movement.

So there will be random charge distances as well. Anything thing that annoys me about 8th ed fantasy

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