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[ERROR] No.12412238 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Know what pisses me off about the Krogan?
>Extremely volatile, warlike.
>Extremely high reproduction rates to make up for high mortality.
>Live for centuries.

It just makes no sense. It seems that fantasy/sci-fi writers just slap on the trait of being super long-lived to every single race because they think it makes them interesting.
How does a race that survives (or rather, survived) based solely on quick reproduction evolve the traits necessary to live for centuries?

>> No.12412259

if you're wondering how krogans eat and sleep
or other science facts

remind yourself it's just a game
you should really just relax

>> No.12412262

>>12412238
Because Krogan evolved to be like old pickup trucks.
Once the weeded out the shitty organs, they surviving ones just managed to be the ones to keep on ticking for centuries.

>> No.12412269

They were long- lived before they were warlike or quick to reproduce.

>> No.12412274

>based solely

Did you notice that they're armor-plated? Their survival is not based entirely on their reproduction rate, and even if it was, this doesn't mean long life makes no sense. In fact, it makes total sense, because the longer a being remains fertile, the more children it can have.

Eh?

>> No.12412284

Did you know that worker bees would live for up to 18 years if they didn't work themselves to death in a single year?

>> No.12412288

think sea turtles.

they lay 200 eggs and live for almmost 250 years

>> No.12412302

>>12412259
Lalala!

It's completely possible that if the Krogan managed to get to space-faring tech on their own, they eventually were able to fix themselves up to the point where they could be longer-lived. We're nearly at that point ourselves, so I'd say it would actually make less sense for any sufficiently advanced race in sci-fi to NOT be elf-old-capable.

>> No.12412303

>It seems that fantasy/sci-fi writers just slap on the trait of being super long-lived to every single race because they think it makes them interesting.

Salarians only live to be like 40, don't they?

>> No.12412304

>>12412259
Krogan roll call!

>> No.12412308

There's been some argument by biologists that aging serves some evolutionary benefit - we get old, we die off, the turnover of generations happens faster and we evolve faster, making us more adaptable.

The Krogan might not have never needed to - they can get really old, but most get killed long before that, so they adapt fast anyway, and the few that survive to a very old age probably are excellent genetic specimens. They might never have "needed" to die off from old age.

Don't assume that just because something happened one way in our evolutionary past, that it HAS to happen that way for everything.

>> No.12412315

Always seemed like Tuchanka was supposed to have been a place with a ridiculously high gravity and oppressive atmosphere, so they were giant man-crushing warmongers because the rest of the galaxy seemed squishy and kind in comparison...You know, until the sequel, where you go there and it's got Earthnorm gravity and the only atmospheric oddity is the slightly-orange sky, presumably a visual effect from the UBERNUKEWAR.

Basically, I thought all that stuff was supposed to reflect their physiology in space, since their own world was so hellish that a species designed to last 10 years there would live to be 800 offworld...but then the sequel crapped on that. Like it did with a lot of the lore.

Am I sounding bitter about the second one? I might be a little bitter.

>> No.12412318

>>12412238
That's kind of the point of what made Krogan so deadly. They reproduced fast, and the ones that were strong enough to survive would live long and spread their seed for hundreds of years. Leading to the clan structure of their society. Maybe it was always just a few that were allowed to reproduce after they had proven themselves worthy of it.

>> No.12412331

I think there's a high radiation count on their homeworld, so more durable cells that don't break down as fast.
They mention numerous secondary and tertiary biological systems which, outside of the harsh environment which likely caused numerous permanent damages through wounds, end up not being so worked, so the cells stay healthier, and don't need to divide as quickly to heal.
They couldn't just survive on a high birth rate, since they still had to survive to adulthood, create children, and provide for them, while not getting killed in the process.
That'd be my layman's guess, anyway.
Also, when another species is basically "blue chics with tentacles instead of hair and having sex with them is like getting high" krogan seem more likely.
And compare the tortoise. Long lived, hardy, lays lots of eggs.

>> No.12412335

>>12412304

Urdnot!

>> No.12412350

Krogans have multiple copies of some of their vital organs, right? How could they not live longer?

>> No.12412367

>>12412315
Then you were a fucking idiot. It was made very clear why they're such monsters, and it wasn't gravity.

>> No.12412379

Very few of the Krogan ever do reach their old age, but they appear to stay potent right up until they do. If anything they get better, since they're more experienced and more powerful (and more likely to attract a mate). If the Krogan are born in large numbers it just means that the majority die as cannon fodder and smaller and smaller fractions die over the ages until one out of the litter actually dies due to old age.

Heck, that was the problem the Salarians were trying to fix. They weren't dying as fast as they used to, meaning a generation of Krogan would stick around and the whole next generation was looking for somewhere to live and couldn't just live where the last one used to. Hence their dangerous expansion.

>> No.12412398

MAYBE KROGANS DON'T HAVE LONG LIFESPANS

maybe humans just have short lifespans

>> No.12412406

>>12412367
What Mass Effect said about this:
>The krogan are a species of large reptilian bipeds native to the planet Tuchanka, a world known for its harsh environments, scarce resources, and overabundance of vicious predators. The krogan managed to not only survive on their unforgiving homeworld, but actually thrived in the extreme conditions.

Sounds pretty "HARSH ENVIRONMENTS MADE THEM WARLIKE" to me...

I mean, not to make you sound like a raging faggot who doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about or anything...

>> No.12412424

>>12412406
DURF IT SUUUURE SAYS CRUSHING GRAVITY, HURF HOW COULD I BE SO WRONG.
HURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR DURRRRRRRRRRRRRR

>> No.12412430

>>12412398
DUN DUN DUUUUN

>> No.12412436

>>12412406
>DURHUR TUCHANKA HAS NO PREDATORS AMIRITE GUISE?!
Seriously, you're being the faggot here. You disgusting fucking namefag.

>> No.12412440

>>12412424

>> No.12412442

>>12412406
>>12412398
>>12412424
>>12412430
>>12412436
MAYBE YOU PEOPLE NEED TO TURN CAPS LOCK OFF

>> No.12412444

Wrex is sexy, it is easy to forgive him.

>> No.12412451

>>12412406
But it didn't mention gravity.

>> No.12412468

Krogans evolved on a death world, where the atmosphere is toxic, everything is trying to eat you, and surviving is the name the game. To compensate they evolved multiple organs, their skin thickened to reduce radiation/poison damage, and they have a large hump which stores food and water.

They only started to live for centuries when they got off of their deathworld and found the galaxy wasn't a hellhole in fact it was paradise. So they overpopulated, invaded new worlds and started the Krogan Rebellion. The solution? Reduce their reproduction rates by 99.9%

>> No.12412470

>>12412442
HOW ABOUT NO

>> No.12412476

>>12412406
...you posted the evidence for his case while calling him an idiot.

>> No.12412512

>>12412430
>>12412398
Whole point of Mass Effect 2 and the collectors was to hammer the idea that humans were the ONLY species in the galaxy that hadn't had widely available consumer genetic tailoring for centuries. Bring Mordin along on the collector ship. Talk to him about the collectors. He points out humans are still mostly "natural" and haven't had all the outliner genetic code weeded out by century after century of genetic tailoring.

Thousand years in the future, humans might all be blue eyed blonds with thousand year lifespans but at that point in the game they're still the same as humans today.

>> No.12412517

On the topic of lifespans and mass effect has it been stated how long are turians supposed to live?
Or anything that isn't asari or krogan for that matter

>> No.12412532

>>12412406
Not really. Harsh environment doesn't necessarily mean the whole planet's a ball of neutronium lava; it could be something as simple as harsh seasons and massive windstorms, which would exacerbate the massive predation issue. The fact that everything wants to kill and eat you on Tuchanka is pretty heavily underlined throughout a lot of the Krogan descriptions, to the point that it seemed really obvious to me that that was meant to be The Big Thing in determining their behaviour and physiology.

>> No.12412541

>>12412517
salarians average 40 but mordin was around fifty in mass effect.

>> No.12412546

>>12412517
Salarians usually live to about 40. They burn energy faster, so their cells wear out quicker, but they only need a couple hours of sleep, so it makes up for it. Mordin is an old man for a salarian.
I think Turians and Quarians have similar life-spans to humans, but I don't have a source or anything.

>> No.12412548

>>12412517
Turians live just about as long as humans.

>> No.12412556

>>12412517
Someone already mentioned the Salarians.
I'd say Turians live roughly as long as we do. It'd be interesting, considering they're supposed to be relatively similar to us.

>> No.12412560

>>12412512
>all be blue eyed blondes
Troll.

But seriously, I see your point, but with genetic tailoring we can look however we want. Even the aliens had multiple races, the krogans being among the more colorful, the Turians coming in grays, whites, and browns, only the lightest gray ones having non-white facepaint, and the Asari are many different shades of blue, some of them almost looking brown.

>> No.12412568

>>12412468

You know, the thing that made the Genophage really controversial (beyond, uh, genocidal superweapon) was that it forces the Krogan to do the sort of thing a society is supposed to come around to doing on their own. It stabilized their birth rate to a level society could withstand, albeit devestating their society in the process since they didn't have a culture to accomodate it.

It isn't entirely the Krogan's fault that it was necessary, though, because they'd been uplifted from their world by the Salarians before they were really ready for it. If they'd not been made the Citadel's muscle they'd have had a chance to grow and evolve at their own cultural pace, and if/when they were ever ready they could join the galactic community.

So using the Genophage on the Krogan is just another incident of the Citadel races controlling and using the Krogan, condescending to them. It was necessary, true, but only due to circumstances the Citadel races themselves had created, and for their own purposes.

You can point to how using the Krogan in the first place was also a necessary act to fight off the Rachni, but that doesn't change the nature of the violation that took place. When the only defence of an act is that it was necessary, a certain amount of deference, humbleness, and contrition is expected, and a debt exists.

If the Krogan had gotten to galactic society on their own terms and still conquered people because of their high birth rates the Genophage wouldn't have been nearly as controversial.

>> No.12412578

its a fucking reptile, some turtles can live for centuries retard.

>> No.12412595

>>12412541 HURRRRR.
Salarians do live to be about 40, but nowhere in the game does it indicate Mordin's age. The closest you get is him stating that he'd like to spend his last decade helping people.

>> No.12412596

>>12412568
I think the genophage was controversial because rather then lowering the fertility rate by, say, increasing the period between...ovulation?, it has them popping out still-born fetuses by the dozens. That tends to piss people off.

>> No.12412597

>mfw they look like turtles.
>mfw tortoises live for 100+ years

>> No.12412599 [DELETED] 

>>12412560
You're such an idiot.

>> No.12412605

>>12412596
Yeah, the several million BACs on Earth must have been shitting bricks.

>> No.12412615

>>12412595
http://masseffect.bioware.com/universe/squad/mordin/

>> No.12412622

>>12412568
The whole babies being born dead thing also would rub most races the wrong way. It's not like it just "lowers the birth rate" so much as makes them die in the womb (or whatever krogan do) incredibly often

>> No.12412637

>>12412615
It's on the website, not in the game. It's about as canon as the Star Wars EU.

>> No.12412677

>>12412637
So even if there was video footage of the creators confirming his age in an interview it still wouldn't be valid enough for you because it isn't in the actual game?

>> No.12412679

>>12412622
>>12412596

Okay, yeah, the actual "born dead!" is probably a huge goddamn deal, but narratively it serves the purpose of driving home the damage being done. It's a little hollow if they just have fewer kids, although damn that'd have been easier for the Council to sell with a straight face.

Then again, it's kind of important that the solution be grisley, so that it's hard to defend and can only be considered in terms of direst need.

I did like when Okeer ranted that the lowered birth rate had made each krogan born be seen as "special", and how he found that repugnent. In a bloody, dirty way the genophage *is* driving home some of the basic principles of civilized society on to the Krogan, but as an external force forcing these messages on to them.

Hopefully Wrex will be the example that shows everyone else the Krogan can do it on their own. His big arc has a lot to do with pride, and his people seriously lack it - plenty of pride to get shot in the head over an argument, not much in their ability to amount to much as a people anymore. They've got to both come out better for the experience and take their own affairs in hand.

>> No.12412713

I only need to know one thing about xenos, where they are.

>> No.12412738

Lots talk instead about how Tali is masterbating to fantasies of Shepard or humans in general.

>> No.12412748

>>12412713
gb2/death/, Vasquez.

>> No.12412756

Krogan are incredibly tough, they're very hard to kill, which is why I guess they live for so long.

The reason their high birth rate was kept under check was because on their home planet before they properly went out into space, they was constant inter tribe conflict.

Krogans are tough, but a Krogan will kill another Krogan quite easily.

Krogans that were tough and managed to survive lived a long time to ensure that their good genes would carry on.

>> No.12412757

>>12412599
I got the joke, I wasn't being serious when i called you a troll, and figured you at least meant we would all look the same. Next time you make a subtle joke like that I hope someone posts a picture of Phillip J. Fry peering at you so that you comprehend they saw the joke.

>> No.12412766

>>12412738
There's a 'u' in masturbate, you know.

How appropriate.

>> No.12412773

>>12412679
Canon Shepard is Renegade Male Shepard. Wrex is dead. Shepard shot him on the shores of Virmire.

Create a new Shepard for ME2 and you get the official version of what happened in ME1.

>> No.12412782

>>12412773
...there is no canon Shepard. We've been over this.

>> No.12412795

>>12412622
>>12412596
>Krogan face when dead babby

That's gotta be annoying.

>> No.12412821

We're forgetting something: Krogans are all Post-apocalyptic raiders. They went through at least one complete self-inflicted nukage of their civilization. The only surviving Krogan were thus cuthroat wastelanders with poor anger-control skills. That fucked their culture and genetics and skewed them towards being short-sighted sociopaths.

>> No.12412849

Fuck you guys, the genophage was correct -- the other option was to genocide them. The Batarians, you just need to change their shitty culture, stop the slaving, go to the council and submit themselves to charity; theyll be way better off. But the Krogan are gnetically incapable of this, as a people, they want to wage war and conquor things. Until they are genetically edited to behave in intergalactic society, at least they have to have their population controlled.

>> No.12412861

>>12412849
Oh hi Mordin. Still dealing with that guilt, I see?

>> No.12412906

>>12412861
I don't think Mordin would have said anything like that.

>> No.12412938

>>12412821
MAAAAAAYBEEEEEE, You'll, sit, and sigh.... wishing, that I, were something, something...

War, war never changes. In the year of ogzark the Kchuta tribes fought for fun and money. The Bergd armadas fought for wealth, and entertainment. Terga Haerte took a battered Ruent tribe and transformed them into a horde of champions. But war never changes...

>> No.12412960

>>12412906
No, probably not. I think he believes the krogan can change, for a start.

>> No.12412983

It sucks balls that you have a race of intelligent beings genetically bent on conquest, becasue it means lots of people are going to get fucked over -- but it's only a matter of who gets fucked, the agressive party or victims minding their own business. Sorry to say, if given a choice, I have to pick the agressors -- the Krogan -- for being fucked. They are genetically given to conquest, so just beating them back to their planet isn't enough; out of the shitty options, the genophage was the least shitty.

I'm not taking away from the shittiness of it, but in a situation with shitty choices, it was least offensive one.

>> No.12412991

>>12412679
Intrestingly, Okeer's solution to the Genophage is actualy very simliar to what Mordin and co. hope will happen with the Krogan society.

Instead of focusing on creating many Krogans or trying to recreate the fertility rate, he created one perfect speciesment, which when you read between the lines means, that he wanted to create a son he could be proud of.

This echos later when you are on Tuchanka and can overhear two Krogan, with one talking about his one son and how proud he is of him.

Krogan society might really slowly change towards finding pride and love in fewer children. If the society at large changes to that, the Salarians would see less reason to restore the Genphage again, or downright remove it secretly.

It would restore the natural order on how Krogan society would have developed if they found a way themself to reach the stars. Though if this could still have happend naturaly is left unknown.

On a totaly different note. Does anyone else find the suddent introduction of that new species from the Shadow Broker DLC silly? I mean seriously, a species which is stronger than a Krogan and super intelligent?

>> No.12413004

>>12412991
Yea, I thought it was sort of shoehorned in. It just made me "wat"

>> No.12413066

>>12413004
>>12412991

Ehh, it makes sense that such a species would be quarantined by the council. If they'd just popped up randomly everywhere I'd have a problem with it, but just one is fine.

Also, I don't think they were THAT strong if a human can whip the shit out of one in melee (one drawing power for his personal shield from his ship, no less).

>> No.12413076

>>12412821
Sadly when you think about it. Aliens comming and giving humanity a new start is the only way anything in the Fallout universe could ever make a change to the better. Since even if civilisation is restored, earth has not enough resources anymore to get anyone into space. Which means it decays one way or another.

>> No.12413119

>>12412512
>blue eyed blonds
If you have widely available genetic engineering... why would you make people ugly?

>> No.12413138

>>12413066
Well remember that Shepard is heavily argumentated with nano implants to restore his/her body (explains how the Krogan Warlord could be knocked back slighty by his/her headbutt). Even more so if you are playing soldier.
So a punch from Shepard regardless of class might allready have some nasty properties.

Also wasn't shepard hitting on his head, which is covered in eyes? I think that's actualy a pretty good weakpoint.

>> No.12413186

>>12412238
Krogans evolved in a terrible planet that basically made their average lifespan like 30 years or etc, and that was only because they had such superior biology.

Mordin specifically mentions that the genophage only set their reproduction rates back to what they were on their home planet.

you take a tank, designed for surviving getting hit by mortars and shit, and use it to go to the famer's market in the Pennsylvania countryside, and so long as you keep the oil changed and don't screw anything up, you can use that fucker forever.

>> No.12413198

I'm gonna fuck your granddaughter, Shepard. Just because.

>> No.12413239

>>12412288

>Open Thread
>Ctrl+F: Turtles
>This post pops up
>mfw

>> No.12413257

>>12412795
krogans are reptiles, they lay eggs, because of the genophage some eggs don't hatch. it's not like there give birth to dead babys. it's the same thing we do to chickens.

>> No.12413302

OP, you missed the part about them being INCREDIBLY tough. Like, ridiculously so. Multiple redundant organs, very fast regeneration rate, incredibly strong immune system.

Krogan would probably have a slower aging process after reaching maturity simply because they don't suffer as much internal shit as other species do. Oh no, my liver's failed! Wait, I've got a spare.

>> No.12413342

>>12413257
They haven't actually stated that they lay eggs have they? It's not far-fetched or anything, but I think something like that would have been stated

>> No.12413384

>>12413342
i'm pretty sure the word clutch is used at some point, and that is the word for a group of eggs

>> No.12413412

>>12413257

"You have not seen the bodies of children that never lived!"

Not only the most evocative line in the game, but also whatnow.jpg

>> No.12413445

>>12413257
>>12413342
>>12413384
I feel like I heard someone mention the mothers having to see their dead children. I could be wrong though.
Although, having a dead fetus in an egg is still a bit worse then just having an unfertilized egg. And I know they've used the term "still-born" to describe its effects.

>> No.12413464

>>12413445
maybe thats the point. The genophage increases infant deaths in fertilized egg.

>> No.12413596

>>12413445
>>12413412
fair point

>> No.12413791

>>12412991
Yahg? Well they are as strong as Krogan (I think), but not as tough. However they are extremely violent, just the Shadow Broker was apparently an abnormality.

>> No.12413838

>evolve

lol, he believes in evolution

>> No.12414225

>>12413838
>mfw humanity will develop independent of all external interference, just so we can curb-stomp alien gods' faces.

>> No.12414357

>>12413791

Dont forget that the Shadow Broker hailed from a non-space faring species

>>12414225

You mean develop by ourselves as in continue to use mass effect technology/Collector base tech?

Cant wait for the Turian Councilor in the next game to say 'Ah yes "Collectors" we have dismissed this claim'

The previous SB took him onboard as a curiosity, so I doubt we'll be seeing much more of them unless they spontaneously develop space travel by the next game

>> No.12414392

>>12413838

Speaking of Harbinger

>Rachni Queen: "a tone from space which hushed one voice after another and forced us to resonate with its own sour yellow note
>its own sour yellow note
>yellow note
>yellow
>Harbinger
>yellow

I cant wait to see her children return in ME3 (romantic option???)

>> No.12414398

>I cant wait to see her children return in ME3 (romantic option???)

Paragon Shep/Rachni Queen is my OTP

>> No.12414450

>>12414398

Not surprising, considering the stuff that /tg/ likes...

>> No.12414482

>>12413257
this is not what we do to chickens
as >>12413445 points out, chicken eggs are unfertilized.
So it's what happens with chickens is closer to a human having a period

>> No.12414496

>>12414482

Admit it /tg/... you'd enjoy frying up some Krogan eggs (with some Salarian Salami on the side)

How to serve Xenos

>> No.12414635

>>12414482

Modern, supermarket chicken eggs are unfertilized.

Oldschool farmyard eggs may or may not have been fertilized, assuming there was a rooster around.

>> No.12414680

>>12414635

How is Turian babby formed?

How Garrus make girl Pragnent?

>> No.12414858

so how many generations before the krogan who are least affected by the genophage pump out boatloads of kids who are less affected by the genophage and so on until the problem is the same again ....(what you mean you did a thing that makes it really hard for a species to thrive and multiply to the Krogan? Haven't they already overcome half a dozen of these things?_?)

Give long lifespans and huge clutch numbers imma gonna guess 2

>> No.12414909

why would "less effective"=boatloads of kids, and not just changing 99.9% infertility, to 99% infertility.
and ME2 implies that this will take a while for them to overcome the new version (I'd guess a view dozen generation before its at 80% or better, but I'm pulling those numbers out of my ass), by that point the reapers will have come.

>> No.12415620

Guys serious question: have we ever seen a female Turian?

>> No.12415659

>>12415620
Probably. Of course, for the purposes of this post, I'm assuming Turians have a similar gender system to that of the Moties, and so you've just seen turians in the male phase.
>>12414496
Any Asari Calamari to go along with that?

>> No.12415709

>>12415620
No. Technical limitations in first game. Trend continued in second game.

There ARE female turians, they just don't make any appearances.

>> No.12415710

>>12415659
...so Garrus is sitting there fantasizing about Shepard entering a female phase?

>> No.12415734

Crazy curious to see female Krogans. Slightly less curious to see female Turians. DON'T want to see Quarians in the flesh, leaves something good up to the immagination to go with dem hips.

>> No.12415759

>>12415734
AND DEM TOOOOES.

>> No.12415791

>>12415710
No, he's checking off the days on his calender till he gets his vag back.
Everyone knows Shepard only pitches, and everyone is more then willing to catch. No exceptions.

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