/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.12615712]

How do we debunk the "it's just a flu" meme?

[Anonymous No.12615717]

>>12615712
By letting the troglodytes kill themselves off.

[Anonymous No.12615725]

>>12615717
With the vaccine.

[Anonymous No.12615762]

>>12615712
Oh, sure... The yearly flu always kills over 2 million people and grinds the entire world to an unprecedented halt.

All the smart 4chan users know (((that))).

[Anonymous No.12615791]

>>12615712
bio engineered weapon. we knew it since 2020 january

[Anonymous No.12615806]

>>12615712
deboonk the 99% survival rate, then open up the earth because you can't

[Anonymous No.12615826]

>>12615762
>and grinds the entire world to an unprecedented halt.
Done by the politicians, not by the virus.

[Anonymous No.12615834]

I hope covid explodes. I hope covid escalates in lethality and virulence. I hope covid becomes vaccine resistant. I hope covid kills off the old and weak. I hope covid reinfects and weakens the populace. I hope covid destroys humanity.

[Anonymous No.12615839]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVIGhz3uwuQ

[Anonymous No.12615880]

>>12615712
Show this image. Made by a pozzed plebbitor. In this age range notice
>28k deaths
Track CDC data for 2020 deaths in that age group
>7k deaths due to COVID-19
And that's WITH COVID-19 and not FROM COVID-19. So, ask them where the other 21k comes from.

[Anonymous No.12615884]

>>12615712
We need a control group.
Send flu sufferers to nursing homes and treat them with ventilators.
Also test everyone for the flu. Symptomatic or not.
Then you'll have your answer.

[Anonymous No.12615946]

>>12615880
I'll play Devil's advocate here. What if these deaths are the result of people with other illnesses not getting proper care because of lockdowns/emphasis on covid?

[Anonymous No.12615979]

>>12615946
That's what I think it is. Those are lockdown effects, not pandemic effects in my eyes. It gives a really easy why to help normies to divorce lockdown effects from pandemic effects. They're currently programmed to assert everything is COVID

[Anonymous No.12617087]

>>12615712
The holocaust seemed more real than "COVID-19" deaths.

[Anonymous No.12617118]

>>12615839
>Vox
how to get laughed off /sci/ 101
provide some fucking scientific sources next time faggot.
fucking fairy faggot with shitty normie retard sources. are you a woman?
you must be a woman, because you're so fucking retarded. You should feel bad.
feel bad, retard.
>>12615712
Well first of all they are in totally different families.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthomyxoviridae
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndrome_coronavirus_2
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza
>Orthornavirae is a kingdom of viruses that have genomes made of ribonucleic acid (RNA) and which encode an RNA-dependent RNA polymerase (RdRp). The RdRp is used to transcribe the viral RNA genome into messenger RNA (mRNA) and to replicate the genome. Viruses in this kingdom also share a number of characteristics involving evolution, including high rates of genetic mutations, recombinations, and reassortments.
this is all they really have in common.
Which is true about fucking ebola. So covid is JUST an EBOLA
A FUCKING NOTHIGN BURGER EBOLA

[Anonymous No.12617151]

>>12615717
Based. I've got a family member who's on ECMO and will almost certainly die from it, and while I feel sorry part of me still goes "Well, shouldn't have had your whole family over for Christmas retard"
>>12615880
Cool, now show the graph of excess deaths.
>>12615884
Basically. Almost nobody who gets the flu actually feels that sick, and anyone who actually did get hit with the full "flu" thing will tell you it fucking sucks anyway. But universal testing will just yield a shitload of false positives, even with the current 99.5% specific NAAT platforms, so it's not a great way to do it. That's why looking at excess deaths are better, where we see how many people die annually in general and from ILIs, and then see how many times more people died this past year, while rates of every other disease either remained relatively constant or decreased.

[Anonymous No.12617188]

>>12617118
>bitches about sources
>links to wikipedia
Retard.

[Anonymous No.12617194]

>>12617188
Check the resources page, vox faggot

[Anonymous No.12617196]

>>12617194
Get some fresh air.

[Anonymous No.12617210]

>>12617196
>avoiding the fact s(he) just got BTFO'd
No thanks, I preferred my harvested and filtered air.
I'm safe watching clown world in the background.

[Anonymous No.12617218]

>>12615725
There is no vaccine. There's a symptom intensity reducer. The "vaccine" doesn't stop you from being infected. The "vaccine" doesn't stop you from infecting others. The "vaccine" is not a vaccine. Stop calling it that.

[Anonymous No.12617223]

>>12617210
>dude i just PWND you epic style
Literally nothing wrong with that Vox video. Stop being such an emotional retard.

[Anonymous No.12617230]

>>12617218
Not sure if this is satire or not. What a brainlet if not.

[Anonymous No.12617259]

>>12617223
>Literally nothing wrong with that Vox video.
>>>/lgbt/

[Anonymous No.12617482]

>>12617118
>muh Vox!!
Just looking at the fucking visualisation retard, that's all you need to know. You don't need to watch the whole video, pic related is enough of an argument to shut down the "muh nothingburger flu!" retards

[Anonymous No.12617489]

>>12615834
why not at this point.
im down

[Anonymous No.12617493]

>>12617230
>you WILL take the vaccine!
>but you also WILL wear a mask because vaccine does not help!
>how dare you call it a non-vaccine!

[Anonymous No.12617568]

>>12617493
>vaccine does not help!
The vaccine is effective at reducing or eliminating COVID-19 symptoms, and it is highly effective at mitigating COVID-19 symptoms down to the level of the common cold, something which can be dealt with at home without requiring hospitalisation. No one in the vaccine trials who got the vaccine and caught COVID-19 had to be hospitalised. That's a game-changer
However, we do not know whether the vaccine stops you from getting infected with SARS-CoV-2. You wear a mask to protect others from you, not yourself from others.
To sit there and say that the vaccine "doesn't work" is stupid. We know it eliminates the need for hospitalisation if you catch COVID-19. How is that a vaccine that doesn't work?

[Anonymous No.12617574]

>>12617568
>The vaccine is effective at reducing or eliminating COVID-19 symptoms, and it is highly effective at mitigating COVID-19 symptoms down to the level of the common cold,
which would happen to 99.8% of the infected anyway, except those frail, old or HIV-positive who cannot be vaccinated anyway. so the "vaccine" does jack shit.

[Anonymous No.12617583]

>>12615712
You don't because it's not a meme, it's reality.

[Anonymous No.12617592]

>>12615839
R0 is a meme statistic. It's almost entirely variable on environmental conditions and not a property of the virus itself. Remember in January/February when they were saying that the R0 value was 10-14 based on one cruise ship?

[Anonymous No.12617598]

>>12617482
no it isn't, R0 is a meme. see >>12617592

[Anonymous No.12617623]

>>12617568

[Anonymous No.12617625]

>>12617623
Got the vaccine and no bells palsy :)

[Anonymous No.12617632]

>>12615834
I hope you have sex someday.

[Anonymous No.12617653]

>>12617623
Show me the evidence that the vaccine is the cause of Bell's Palsy.
>>12617574
The old and frail are at the front of the line for the vaccine.
>who cannot be vaccinated anyway
What are you going on about? 90 year olds are taking it.

[Anonymous No.12617661]

>>12617568
>You wear a mask to protect others from you
What if the ones who want to be protected will stay home instead?

[Anonymous No.12617665]

>>12617568
Great, if vaccine does not stop the spread, then there is no reason to take it, since you can't "protect others" with it.

[Anonymous No.12617667]

>>12617625

[Anonymous No.12617670]

>>12617665
It does
https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-data-shows-50-reduction-in-infections-14-days-after-first-vaccine-shot/amp/

[Anonymous No.12617671]

>>12617653
>The old and frail are at the front of the line for the vaccine.
All the Norwegian old-timers totally liked it.

[Anonymous No.12617673]

>>12617667
Nice pepe
Mind if I save it ;)

[Anonymous No.12617674]

>>12617632
Covidists are forbidden to have sex: if they do so, they mix households.

[Anonymous No.12617696]

>>12617670
>“Seventeen percent of the new serious cases today, or 180 cases, are after the first dose,”
Thanks for proof that the vaccine gives you a worse case of the disease.

[Anonymous No.12617822]

>>12617671
>muh 23 Norwegians that died
Prove that they died due to the vaccine causing fatal side effects.
For all we know, they received the first dose and a couple of hours later went straight into a crowded market, thinking they were immune. They didn't wait a few weeks to get partial immunity, nor did they wait to get the 2nd dose to get full immunity.

[Anonymous No.12617826]

>>12617583
If it's not a meme, how do you explain this: >>12617151?

[Anonymous No.12617830]

>>12617665
>Great, if vaccine does not stop the spread, then there is no reason to take it, since you can't "protect others" with it.
And that's exactly why the young and health are at the end of the queue, and not at the front.
Would you prevent your grandma from getting the vaccine?

[Anonymous No.12617836]

>>12617822
Prove that people dying from disease with higher-than-life-expectancy average death age are actually dying from that disease and not from unrelated reasons.

[Anonymous No.12617838]

>>12617583
Also, how do you explain this: >>12615880?

[Anonymous No.12617843]

>>12617830
>Would you prevent your grandma from getting the vaccine?
Absolutely. I don't want her to become a lab rat, become sick and potentially die. So I will advise her to avoid the vaccine as long as she can.

[Anonymous No.12617844]

>>12617836
>Prove that people dying from disease with higher-than-life-expectancy average death age are actually dying from that disease and not from unrelated reasons.
I cannot prove it.

Now, can you prove that the Norwegians died from the vaccine and not from anything else?

[Anonymous No.12617845]

>>12617151
The graph already accounts for excess deaths. Think about it. The volume of deaths is listed for the past 5 years and is fairly stable. The excess deaths this year from what we expect is approximately 28k for that age range. The amount of COVID-19 deaths for that age range is about 7k. This implies 75% of the excess deaths in 2020 for those aged 25-44 are not COVID-19 related. Why do think that is?

[Anonymous No.12617854]

>>12617843
A lab rat? The phase 3 clinical trials for the Pfizer vaccine recruited about 20k people to receive the vaccine. How can you say that she is a lab rat after 20k people took it first?

[Anonymous No.12617859]

>>12617854
Typical vaccine backfire rates are about 0.01% for long term SAEs. With a trial of 20k people, you'd expect a meager 2 instances of SAEs. These are easily explained away with any level of p-hacking or other bullshit. Only when you scale this sample size up to hundreds of millions will you begin to see the true effects of SAEs which can no longer be swept under the rug.

[Anonymous No.12617863]

>>12617859
>Typical vaccine backfire rates are about 0.01% for long term SAEs.
Where exactly did you get this 0.01% number from? Do you have any links for further reading?

[Anonymous No.12617882]

>>12617844
>>12617863
*crickets*
Like clockwork.

[Anonymous No.12617924]

>>12617863
If you're asking for any kind of metastudy that analyzes all the vaccine studies and quantifies an average SAE, you won't find one. Not because they're nefarious, but the vaccines are different, so it's not a meaningful study. Source? Read papers. On any vaccine, you pick. You'll find that the SAE rate hovers around 0.01% for every vaccine, including Pfizer. For example, see here.
>https://www.fda.gov/media/144414/download
Let's see what they state for SAEs.
>A total of six (2 vaccine, 4 placebo) of 43,448 enrolled participants (0.01%)
This is an effect of injecting a solution into the bloodstream, and is observable in the placebo as well. What about non-fatal SAEs?
>The most common SAEs in the vaccine group which were numerically higher than in the placebo group were appendicitis (0.04%), acute myocardial infarction (0.02%), and cerebrovascular accident (0.02%), and in the placebo arm numerically higher than in the vaccine arm were pneumonia (0.03%), atrial fibrillation (0.02%), and syncope (0.02%).
Notice the placebo effects are different from the vaccine effects, but also much less severe and more generic in scope (e.g. syncope, bless Tiffany's heart).
>>12617882
>Demands high quality comments
>Gets anxious when low-quality (you) isn't delivered instantly
Actual NPC.

[Anonymous No.12617937]

>>12617844
>I cannot prove it.
For every restrictive measure the burden of proof is on you then.
>Now, can you prove that the Norwegians died from the vaccine and not from anything else?
If you want me to inject something, then the burden of proof is, again, on you. But
>took the vaccine
>died almost immediately after
is already an evidence strong enough to avoid getting it.

[Anonymous No.12617949]

>>12617937
>took the vaccine
>died almost immediately after
>is already an evidence strong enough to avoid getting it.
By your logic, peanuts are dangerous too
>ate peanuts
>died almost immediately after
>is already an evidence strong enough to avoid getting it.
But we know that this line of thinking is bullshit. We don't ban peanuts for everyone just because a few had severe allergic reactions. Why should we do the same with the vaccine?

[Anonymous No.12617991]

>>12617882
>>12617924
*crickets*
Like clockwork.
Am I doing it right?

[Anonymous No.12617992]

>>12617949
That sounds just like covid!
>tested positive for covid
>died a bit after
>is already an evidence strong enough to do lockdowns/closing businesses/masks

[Anonymous No.12618000]

>>12617949
If the government will try to heavily push peanuts on me and I will also see that people die directly after it, then I'll try to avoid them as long as I can. Actually even if I'll once get poisoned by something I like, I'll avoid it for some time.

[Anonymous No.12618030]

>>12617924
>https://www.fda.gov/media/144414/download
You posted the wrong document.
This is the correct document that contains all of your information: https://www.fda.gov/media/144245/download
>This is an effect of injecting a solution into the bloodstream, and is observable in the placebo as well.
Notice the placebo effects are different from the vaccine effects, but [...] more generic in scope (e.g. syncope, bless Tiffany's heart).
Doesn't the fact that the placebo group got more deaths and more adverse effects than the vaccine group prove that the vaccine doesn't directly cause any of these issues? You claim that they handwave all of this away using p-hacking and whatnot, but why shouldn't they?
>Notice the placebo effects are [...] also much less severe [compared to the vaccine group]
Yeah, but if you read the document you'll also find this:
>The cases [...] occurred no more frequently than expected in the given age groups
We have no evidence to suggest that the vaccine caused these SAEs. Why should we believe the vaccine caused it then?

It's kinda like how some claim people don't die from COVID-19, but they had a bad heart (or something else) and COVID-19 finished them off.
I can apply the same exact line of thinking to the vaccine. I can claim that these people were already predisposed to developing these illnesses (appendicitis, acute myocardial infarction, cerebrovascular accident) due to many factors (bad genetics, lack of exercise, smoking/alcohol/drugs, etc.), and that the vaccine brought them to a head. Ergo, it's not the vaccine's fault.

>>12617991
Fair enough. I did not expect a fruitful discussion to occur. I withdraw my snarky response.

[Anonymous No.12618032]

>>12618000
So your only logic when deciding whether something is good or bad is whatever the government says?
You don't read any research papers? No critical thinking? No looking at the data?
That's kinda a poor method of gauging life choices don't you think?

[Anonymous No.12618035]

>>12615712
It's the truth, what's there to debunk?

[Anonymous No.12618044]

>>12617992
>is already an evidence strong enough to do lockdowns/closing businesses/masks
Why do people keep believing in this meme that the masks/lockdowns are there to save lives?
Lockdowns were never about saving lives. Whoever pushed this argument is pushing a strawman onto people.
The reason we went into lockdown was to prevent the health system from collapsing. No more, no less. It was never about saving lives.
Doctors already know perfectly well that the average age of death in COVID-19 patients aligns pretty much perfectly with the country's life expectancy. They already know that these people were ready to die anyway (old, frail, obese, etc.)
But lockdowns were about preventing the health system from being overrun with grandpas and fatties taking beds away from cancer patients and car crash accidents. Lockdowns were never about savings the lives of those grandpas and fatties.

[Anonymous No.12618047]

>>12615712

[Anonymous No.12618052]

>>12615712
Don't, if they can't get their head around the common flu, bird flu, swine flu and covid all having different fatality rates and long term effects then nothing is going to stop them being retarded.

[Anonymous No.12618060]

>>12618044
>The reason we went into lockdown was to prevent the health system from collapsing. No more, no less. It was never about saving lives.
If collapsing health system does not affect lives being saved or not, then such a health system should collapse.

[Anonymous No.12618065]

>>12618060
You've accidentally redefined the term "saving lives". When used in the current context of the pandemic, this term can either mean saving the lives of COVID-19 patients, or saving the lives of other people who require access to the health system.
>If collapsing health system does not affect lives being saved or not
Which of the two definitions above are you using when you say "lives being saved"?

[Anonymous No.12618066]

>>12618032
Umm... yes? If someone I don't like or don't believe is trying to push something on me, then avoiding it is a very good strategy. You need to be competent and well-intentioned for the opposite.

[Anonymous No.12618078]

>>12618044
So... where did the fabled health system collapse happen? Did it happen in Sweden? Maybe in Slovenia or Belgium?

[Anonymous No.12618080]

>>12618065
If covid patients die without health system significantly more often, then it's the same. And if they don't, then just don't overload the hospitals with them.

[Anonymous No.12618081]

>>12618078
It didn't happen because governments intervened quickly and imposed lockdowns and law mandates for wearing masks. They ignored the libertarians sperging about "muh freedoms!" and worked quickly to implement mitigative measures.
That is why you didn't see any complete meltdown, because they didn't listen to (You).

[Anonymous No.12618094]

>>12618081
Meanwhile I just prevented Sun destroying the Earth by chanting the magic spell.

[Anonymous No.12618096]

>>12618094

[Anonymous No.12618111]

>>12618081
Since USA is doing worse than Sweden both by cases and by deaths, that sounds like a failed experiment. Most lockdownist states like New York are also doing even worse. Now neither them, nor Sweden actually have any "hospital collapses" so looks like it was a complete bullshit.

[Anonymous No.12618116]

>>12618096
Correct, "Post hoc ergo propter hoc" isn't a valid line of reasoning.

[Anonymous No.12618120]

>>12618111
>Sweden
Sweden went into a de-facto lockdown. The social cohesion and the willingness to obey instructions and guidance pretty much resulted in a lockdown without requiring to pass any legislation.
Swedes stayed at home and worked from home, wore masks, socially distanced, washed their hands, all without requiring the government to pass a single law. They did all this because they aren't retarded people constantly complaining about their freedoms.
So for you to sit there and tell me that there was no lockdown in Sweden is dishonest, and has the same misinformational capacity as outright lying.

[Anonymous No.12618123]

>>12618030
>Doesn't the fact that the placebo group got more deaths and more adverse effects than the vaccine group prove that the vaccine doesn't directly cause any of these issues?
Missing the point. Statistically, 2 and 4 deaths with a 20k sample is indistinguishable and essentially equivalent. Suggesting the effect is due to injections and not the contents of the injection.
>the placebo group got more deaths and more adverse effects than the vaccine group prove that the vaccine doesn't directly cause any of these issues?
I don't follow. The vaccine and placebo caused different effects. Vaccine had heart attacks and strokes whereas placebo has elevated heart rate and passing out. These are quantified in the quoted passage where the first three were vaccine effects and the last three were placebo effects. Dunno how you got placebo induces more effects from that. Nonetheless even if true, you're comparing more instances of passing out to fewer instances of strokes—the latter is clearly more severe.
>You claim that they handwave all of this away using p-hacking and whatnot, but why shouldn't they?
Scientific integrity? Not brainwashing NPCs into thinking this shit is perfectly safe on a large scale? Just to save old people so compromised they can't even get a vaccine themselves?
>if you read the document you'll also find this:
>We have no evidence to suggest that the vaccine caused these SAEs.
>Why should we believe the vaccine caused it then?
Again I don't follow. I quoted directly from their document where they cite the effects (e.g. stroke) occurred more frequently in vaccinated samples.
>I can claim that these people were already predisposed to developing these illnesses
You can claim that, sure. Then it's unethical for CDC or FDA or any other alphabet organization to mandate I get a vaccine.

[Anonymous No.12618133]

>>12618123
>Then it's unethical for CDC or FDA or any other alphabet organization to mandate I get a vaccine.
not him, but the CDC or FDA never mandated a vaccine onto anybody, that is borderline lying

[Anonymous No.12618135]

>>12618120
>wore masks
No, they didn't. Same is true for the rest of the bullshit. And even if they did, "de-facto lockdown" is not a lockdown, and if it works better, then it's proven that lockdowns kill.

[Anonymous No.12618138]

>>12618116
By your logic, the fact that eye damage rates in laboratories decline after wearing safety goggles is just a post hoc fallacy. Am I right in assuming you wouldn't wear safety goggles then?

[Anonymous No.12618144]

>>12618135
>No, they didn't. Same is true for the rest of the bullshit.
False.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v341VNPgL50
>And even if they did, "de-facto lockdown" is not a lockdown
So your only concern with lockdown is not the lockdown itself, but the law mandating it?

[Anonymous No.12618153]

>>12618123
Why did you conveniently not respond to this?
>The cases [...] occurred no more frequently than expected in the given age groups

[Anonymous No.12618154]

>>12618133
It's slimy rhetoric.
>We're not forcing you to get the vaccine... We're just imposing strict and unliveable consequences if you don't get the vaccine, capisce?

[Anonymous No.12618156]

>>12618154
>We're just imposing strict and unliveable consequences if you don't get the vaccine
Such as?

[Anonymous No.12618157]

>>12618138
Correct, if someone from the lab will demand from me to wear glasses everywhere in the labs, or even everywhere outside, he will not get any understanding. And yes,
>some countries forced masks, they did not go extinct, therefore masks saves you from extinction
>north korea is a dictatorship, its population isn't completely dead, therefore dictatorship saves you from death
>you chant a magic spell, the sun does not destroy earth, therefore that spell saves earth
are all post hoc fallacies.

[Anonymous No.12618162]

>>12618153
>Responds to 90% of relevant comment
>Ask him why he didn't respond to irrelevant point
>Ignore rest of response due to being BTFO'd
Bad faith NPC.

[Anonymous No.12618164]

>>12618157
But you are drawing a false analogy.
There is no evidence to suggest that magic spells prevent galaxy collapse. Nor is there any evidence that dictatorships save you from death.
There is however plenty of evidence to suggest that safety goggle wearing prevents eye damage in labs. Similarly, there is ample evidence to suggest that mask wearing mitigates the spread of the virus from carriers to uninfected people.

[Anonymous No.12618165]

>>12618156
>Incapable of searching "vaccine mandate" on his favorite search engine

[Anonymous No.12618169]

>>12618165
>Just google it bro

[Anonymous No.12618172]

>>12618144
>False.
Yes, you are lying. Sweden wore almost no masks and also went out when they feel like it. Meanwhile lockdowns did nothing to prevent covid in lockdownist countries.
>So your only concern with lockdown is not the lockdown itself, but the law mandating it?
Absolutely so? If I stay in my home, that's my decision. If I go outside, that's my wish. If the government demands any of these things, it is a dictatorship. You should ignore what it says or fight with it.

[Anonymous No.12618183]

>>12618169
Top result, lazy faggot.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/12/05/covid-vaccine-required-government-employers/3797885001/
Next result
https://www.today.com/health/will-covid-19-vaccine-be-mandatory-t190838
Next result
https://www.history.com/news/smallpox-vaccine-supreme-court
Do you want me to literally just copy pasta links you find from a simple search query? Are you that intellectually dishonest and lazy? If yes, why should I even respond to anything else you have to say?

[Anonymous No.12618188]

>>12618164
That's a correct analogy.
>There is no evidence to suggest that magic spells prevent galaxy collapse
Correct.
>Nor is there any evidence that dictatorships save you from death
Correct.
>There is however plenty of evidence to suggest that safety goggle wearing prevents eye damage in labs
Maybe correct in very specific circumstances.
>Similarly, there is ample evidence to suggest that mask wearing mitigates the spread of the virus from carriers to uninfected people.
Completely false. For example Czecha demands masks even on the streets and it is currently in top 5 by deaths. Same is true for all other mask countries - masks do nothing to stop covid.

[Anonymous No.12618194]

>>12618162
>You ignored everything I said and only pointed out a single thing in my argument. Ergo, you are an NPC
Except the point I have raised is absolutely crucial to understanding the main question on hand.
You talk a lot about the vaccine causing fewer serious side effects compared to the placebo causing more not as serious side effects
>you're comparing more instances of passing out [in the placebo group] to fewer instances of strokes [in the vaccine group].
But it doesn't matter in the slightest in the end.
I raised a very very simple point. The cases occurred no more frequently than expected in the given age groups. Just from this simple fact, any conclusions we try to draw from the data are immediately rendered meaningless.
And you agreed with it!
>You can claim that, sure.

[Anonymous No.12618197]

>>12618194
>The cases occurred no more frequently than expected in the given age groups
That's not stated anywhere in the document.
>And you agreed with it!
>Omitting the immediately following implication that vaccine mandates are unethical

[Anonymous No.12618199]

>>12618183
>America
I don't live in Burgerland.
I'm sorry you live in such a fucked country that gives employees no workers rights and allows employers to completely rape every person they hire.
By the way, you haven't shown me evidence requiring the CDC and FDA are forcing the vaccine onto every single US citizen.

[Anonymous No.12618209]

>>12618197
>That's not stated anywhere in the document.
It is. If you read my previous post you would see I included a [...] marking, indicating I cut the quote.
>The cases [...] occurred no more frequently than expected in the given age groups
Here it is in pic related.
>Omitting the immediately following implication that vaccine mandates are unethical
You are switching the topic of the conversation away from SAEs caused by vaccines and into the ethics of vaccine mandates. Let's finish up with the SAEs first before switching the conversation into vaccine mandates, yeah?

[Anonymous No.12618210]

>>12618156
There have been plenty but the most recent comes from a Republican member of Congress who wants covid relief funds denied to those who have not been vaccinated. Then you have nutbags such as AOC who want to imprison people who don't get the vaccine, which is something Germany is also considering. Of course so far this is mostly talk, but New Mexico wanted to disallow anyone who hasn't been vaccinated from purchasing food, which is the type of thing that causes armed revolution. LA and New York have both toyed with the idea of cutting off water to those who violate covid mandates. There have been an endless stream of these insane policies trotted out so it's a bad faith argument to try to gaslight people by claiming they never happened.

[Anonymous No.12618211]

>>12618199
So: are you claiming that those who don't take vaccines will lose no rights in your country, whatever it is? By the way
>give me the proofs!
>here are the proofs
>these are not proofs since I live in a different shithole
is a wonderful way of arguing. At least you feel some shame here.
>By the way, you haven't shown me evidence requiring the CDC and FDA are forcing the vaccine onto every single US citizen.
Hitler also didn't kill every Jew in existence.

[Anonymous No.12618213]

>>12618210
Call me back when legislation get passed. The twitter feeds and ramblings of politicians don't count.

[Anonymous No.12618215]

>>12618199
>>Vaccine mandates aren't a thing
>Original attempt at refute abolished
>Modify refute:
>>Vaccine mandates aren't given to ALL citizens
Why should I bother even addressing that if you're just going to move the goalposts again? The mandate doesn't have to be applicable to all citizens for the mandate to be unethical.

Perhaps an analogy will help. Let's say I lecture a class of 10 people. Chad walks in wearing a hat. I refuse to lecture unless Chad removes his hat. He doesn't comply. I just stand there for 50 minutes. Am I engaging in anything unethical? You say sure, I am. I respond
>Ah, but my good sir, I am not mandating that all 1,000 students in the University remove their hats at all times!

[Anonymous No.12618217]

>>12618188
>For example Czecha demands masks even on the streets and it is currently in top 5 by deaths.
>This country has imposed a retarded mandate with masks in open spaces.
>Ergo, we can conclude that masks in other contexts don't work (e.g. closed spaces).
Really?

[Anonymous No.12618218]

>>12618209
>Appendicitis results applicable to stroke and heart attacks results
Try again.
>You are switching the topic of the conversation away from SAEs caused by vaccines and into the ethics of vaccine mandates.
What? You're the one who shifted the topic. I merely provided an argument on your shifted grounds.
>Let's finish up with the SAEs first before switching the conversation into vaccine mandates
Take your own advice.

[Anonymous No.12618220]

>>12618217
Are you trying to imply that Czechia has mandates in open spaces yet doesn't have mandates in closed spaces?

[Anonymous No.12618228]

>>12618220
>Are you trying to imply that Czechia has mandates in open spaces yet doesn't have mandates in closed spaces?
No. What I'm saying is that just because a country has an open space mandate for masks and they are in the top 5 for deaths, doesn't mean masks don't work. Correlation is not equal to causation, etc.
Masks don't work everywhere, nobody competent said or implied this anywhere.
But masks do work in enclosed spaces with poor air circulation and lack of ability to enforce social distancing.

[Anonymous No.12618233]

>>12618218
>What? You're the one who shifted the topic. I merely provided an argument on your shifted grounds.
>Take your own advice.
Are you joking? You were the one who brought up vaccine mandates. I never brought it up. See pic related.

[Anonymous No.12618236]

>>12618228
>Correlation is not equal to causation, etc.
Get off /sci/. You just lost that argument with that single retarded, meaningless statement that only midwits use.

[Anonymous No.12618239]

>>12618236
>If you use this specific phrase that normies use, then that means you lose the argument instantly!
How about refuting the argument instead of sperging about my terminology?
Do you really wish to imply that because Czechia is a top 5 country for deaths, and that they mandate open space mask wearing, that we can conclude masks don't work?

[Anonymous No.12618241]

>>12618228
>Correlation is not equal to causation, etc.
Correlation correlates with causation well though. So if you want to see if masks work, you do the following
>take countries with forced masks
>take countries with no forced masks
>compare who has more "health system collapses"
If there are no countries with forced masks or countries with no forced masks, your argument fails. If the latter have no health system collapses, your argument fails again.
>But masks do work in enclosed spaces with poor air circulation and lack of ability to enforce social distancing.
No, otherwise mask-mandaters would have done much better.

[Anonymous No.12618243]

>>12618215
>>12618211
What is your exact definition of a "vaccine mandate"?
As long as this term is undefined, then the goalposts are undefined, and we are arguing blind without knowing where the discussion is going.

[Anonymous No.12618245]

>>12618239
>Do you really wish to imply that because Czechia is a top 5 country for deaths, and that they mandate open space mask wearing, that we can conclude masks don't work?
Of course that's not the complete evidence you need, yet it is a pretty solid datapoint.

[Anonymous No.12618246]

>>12618233
The topic was SAEs caused by vaccines. You shifted it away to people just being sick an unable to take vaccines. A natural question on that topic is whether it's ethical to force such groups to take vaccines. If you wanted to have the discussion remain on SAEs from vaccines, maybe don't switch the topic?

Let's try an analogy. The topic is gravitational forces. You bring up the notion that, ah, but it's not even in the standard model of particle physics! So I start explaining concepts of particle physics and why gravity doesn't belong. You say
>Bro, why change topic? We're talking about gravity. Let's finish that first before discussing particle physics, k?

[Anonymous No.12618252]

>>12618243
>What is your exact definition of a "vaccine mandate"?
It's very simple: if those who don't take vaccine have less rights than those who did, that's a vaccine mandate.

[Anonymous No.12618257]

>>12618243
Good question. I'd define a vaccine mandate as a vaccine that's mandated.
>https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mandate
In a nutshell:
>Get the vaccine. Or else.

[Anonymous No.12618260]

>>12618252
>>12618257
>if those who don't take vaccine have less rights than those who did, that's a vaccine mandate.
And if it's a private employer enforcing this, do we blame the Government/CDC/FDA/etc, or do we blame that specific private employer?

[Anonymous No.12618268]

>>12618246
>You shifted it away to people just being sick an unable to take vaccines.
Where and how did I do that?

[Anonymous No.12618271]

>>12618260
I blame the government that created laws allowing the private corporation to revoke my rights. Private corporations only have the power bestowed upon them by government.

[Anonymous No.12618273]

>>12618260
If some private employer tells employee or a client to fuck off because he is wrong skin color/wrong religion/unvaccinated, then it's private employer's evildoing. If the government demands from employers to fire people with wrong skin/religion/vaccination status, then the blame is purely on government.

[Anonymous No.12618277]

>>12618153
>https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motte-and-bailey_fallacy
Midwit detected.

[Anonymous No.12618290]

>>12618271
>I blame the government that created laws allowing the private corporation to revoke my rights.
Please show me the exact law that specifically gives private employers the right to fire unvaccinated people.
>If the government demands from employers to fire people with wrong [...] vaccination status, then the blame is purely on government.
And when exactly did the government demand private employers to fire people who haven't received the COVID-19 vaccine?

[Anonymous No.12618294]

>>12618277
If I used a motte-and-bailey fallacy, what's my motte and what's my bailey then?

[Anonymous No.12618299]

>>12618273
See >>12618290

[Anonymous No.12618328]

>>12618290
Since government recently did a lot of things of comparable evilness and it is actively promoting vaccine, it is natural to expect that soon it will demand vaccinations from the most of population (and didn't do that yet only because vaccine is pretty recent). So here the burden of proof lies on you. But why, I'll give you a benefit of doubt. If you'll clearly say that you are against vaccine mandates and you also think that they will not happen, I'll believe you - for now.

[Anonymous No.12618346]

>>12618328
So you admit that the government has never forced COVID-19 vaccinations on anybody.
Pic related is (You).
>you'll clearly say that you are against vaccine mandates
Correct. Vaccine mandates are the most undemocratic thing imaginable and will destroy trust in government for generations to come.

[Anonymous No.12618369]

>>12618346
>>12618328
Forgot to attach the picture

[Anonymous No.12618371]

>>12618213
>preparations don't count, call me when they complete them

[Anonymous No.12618373]

>>12618346
Okay, what do you think about such a prognosis for Czechia?
https://www.praguemorning.cz/covid-19-vaccine-could-become-mandatory-to-entry-restaurants-and-mass-events/
Do you think that it will not happen?
Do you think that it it will happen only in Czechia?
Do you think that it will "destroy the trust" in Czech government?

[Anonymous No.12618379]

>>12618373
>Do you think that it will not happen?
I do not know.
>Do you think that it it will happen only in Czechia?
I do not know.
>Do you think that it will "destroy the trust" in Czech government?
Yes.

[Anonymous No.12618385]

>>12618369
No, the real picture would be a man surrounded by (government-assigned) demons and predicting that a worse one will come soon. But (you) are close to this pic.

[El Arcón No.12618413]

>>12615712
When the 2020 final USA aggregate deaths chart gets published, I expect that it will show that it's not even the flu.

[Anonymous No.12618425]

>>12618379
Good, and I think that if government did draconian measures for almost a year and then promises new one, then it will most likely do it and it doesn't care about trust much. I don't know what country you are from, so can't predict it for you.

[Anonymous No.12618428]

>>12618413
I highly doubt it. If the UK statistics are anything to go by, excess mortality should show a big spike for 2020.
>>12618425
I live in the UK

[Anonymous No.12618463]

czech here. nobody here gives a shit about covid, we're just mad that the pubs are closed.
>inb4 our death rate is a consequence of this attitude
I'm not even denying this lol

[Anonymous No.12618469]

>>12615791
Yeah, pretty close. I think it was a little earlier, like around the vape pen scare summer of 2019 and the breach at the BSL4 lab at Ft Detrick in fall of 2019.

[Anonymous No.12618637]

>>12615712
>How do we debunk the "it's just a flu" meme?
People have already made up their minds, you're not going to change them with words.

[Anonymous No.12618716]

>>12618637
/thread

[Anonymous No.12618958]

>>12618047
Good Lord...

[Anonymous No.12619004]

>>12618047
I wonder why we always see these statistics and not, say, proportion of flu deaths and covid deaths in all deaths, per year.

[Anonymous No.12619007]

>>12618047
These days dying of cancer counts as dying of COVID.

[Anonymous No.12619020]

>>12619007
You're litterally making this up or repeating something some rando on the internet made up, but I'm going to play devils advocate here and argue for what you're saying

>covid runs unchecked by masks
>hospitals get overrun
>break bone in accident
>maybe you stubbed and broke your big toe
>ER is full so they send you away
>hospital is full so they send you away
>all doctors and nurses busy dealing with covid
>die because you stubbed your fucking toe
>die because of covid, without ever getting covid

[Anonymous No.12619025]

>>12619004
Because then people would just claim >>12619004.

[Anonymous No.12619048]

>>12619025
infinite recursion?

[Anonymous No.12619054]

>>12619020
>die because of covid, without ever getting covid
die because of the government's hysteric overreaction to covid.

[Anonymous No.12619056]

Covid is only dangerous to the elderly and obese. In other words: A Good Thing.

[Anonymous No.12619078]

>>12619025
What did he mean by this?

[Anonymous No.12619106]

>>12619025
Oops, I meant people would claim >>12619007. Focusing on total COVID-19 deaths is fruitless because the deniers believe all the death certificates are being falsely labeled. I've also seen people repeatedly claim pneumonia deaths disappeared for 2020, which makes me wonder where they're even getting their information from.

[Anonymous No.12619109]

>>12619056

[Anonymous No.12619121]

Has anyone had or know someone who's had the flu this year? Where did the regular old flu go?

[Anonymous No.12619210]

>>12619121
>Has anyone had or know someone who's had the flu this year?
Nope. In January and February, so many people I knew were coming down with terrible flu-like illnesses, including several hospitalizations, and they were all testing negative for the flu.

>Where did the regular old flu go?
Masks and social distancing measures, plus less international travel.

[Anonymous No.12619248]

>>12619210
>Nope. In January and February, so many people I knew were coming down with terrible flu-like illnesses, including several hospitalizations, and they were all testing negative for the flu.
Sure this happened...

[Anonymous No.12619264]

>>12619210
>Masks and social distancing measures, plus less international travel.

If those things have virtually eliminated the flu, how is covid still spreading like wildfire?

[Anonymous No.12619339]

>>12615880
Notice how none of these pozzed COVID-19 truthers have any rebut to this. They know it's accurate too and can't debunk it.

[Anonymous No.12619359]

>>12619210
This is such a halfwit take. Think about it.
>Cultural changes reduce R0
>Flu and COVID-19 R0 should reduce by same rate
>Flu R0 drops below 1
>COVID-19 R0 drops to X
Solve for that new value. Now, using X, the modified R0 for COVID-19 after sanitary practice. Project the death count for COVID-19. Does it match up with the 400k that's reported? (No).

Your own argument is self-defeating. The proper answer is that flu deaths are being categorized incorrectly as COVID-19 deaths.

[Anonymous No.12619371]

>>12619210
You are one of those tards that think that masks which can keep things in can't keep things out. The door swings both ways.

[Anonymous No.12619406]

>>12618120
>The social cohesion and the willingness to obey instructions and guidance pretty much resulted in a lockdown without requiring to pass any legislation.

Yes, and the reason Sweden has a high level of social cohesion is because they don't have a government that employed authoritarian policies to enforces legal and social norms. If our leaders had acknowledged COVID in the beginning and not lied about transmissibility and the efficacy of masks then this wouldn't be a problem. If our government had lied us into the Iraq War, this would not be a problem. If social media companies and big tech were not engaging in censorship and deplatforming, this would not be a problem. This is an objective fact and it is supported by both empirical evidence and game theoretic models. If you want social cohesion, you have to start with liberal values, free speech, open debate, and education.

The idea of censorship and social engineering has been completely debunked by fields like behavioral economics, game theory, evolutionary anthropology, and criminology. There is literally decades of research confirming that the best way to combat issues like drug crime, terrorism, cults, extremist religious groups, conspiracy theories, social conflict, etc. is through non-coercive measures, public engagement, and education. In other words, instead of using threats of legal punishment, deplatforming, censorship, or military occupation, governments and commercial entities should encourage community debate, discussion, reconciliation and mediation between competing viewpoints, and education programs. Again, this is all objectively true, and one of my CS professors actually studies the social dynamics of religious and political extremism and teaches a course on this stuff. If you want to combat shit like Islamic Terrorism, COVID conspiracies, gangs, Qanon, etc. it is actually objectively ineffective to resort to coercive methods like censorship or militarization of policing methods.

[Anonymous No.12619483]

>>12619406
That kind of openness can lead to people not believing the preferred truth.

[Anonymous No.12619547]

>>12619483
And the Streisand effect will amplify the amount of people who buy into radicalized views. Pick your poison. We don't censor 9/11 truthers. We don't censor people who believe in angels or homeopathy.

[Anonymous No.12619556]

>>12619359
Firstly, [math]R_0[/math] is the basic reproduction number, but you're using it to refer to the effective reproduction number [math]R[/math].

More importantly, you're wrong.
>Flu and COVID-19 R0 should reduce by same rate
That isn't true. Preventative measures have different effects on different pathogens. It's entirely plausible that our preventative measures have been more effective against influenza than against COVID-19. It would make sense if that's the case because a lot of our experience combating respiratory viruses is from influenza, which this year has been repurposed to protect against COVID-19.

[Anonymous No.12619565]

>>12615712
Inject all people who don't think it's just the flu with it and see if they change their tune. Again, I'll say that I don't think it's as bad as many people are saying it is, but it's still pretty fucking bad and can and will fuck your shit up for a bit if not kill you.

[Anonymous No.12621655]

>>12619106
I don't understand. So they would claim >>12619007 , so what? there's the next round of argument. the issue was always whether we accept something without argument or not, and your ilk thinks we must do as you tell us and not ask questions. better 5% of the population die out than to create a precedent for "experts have spoken, the case is closed".

[Anonymous No.12621663]

>>12615762
This flu can fug your lungs, it can develop a nu-pneumonia...i think we have more than enough with 3 of those
We still have to see how bad is the reinfection

[Anonymous No.12623650]

>>12615717
>troglodytes
Why do reddit bugmen love this insult so much?

[Anonymous No.12623657]

>>12623650
>bugmen
Why do /pol/ schizophreniacs love this insult so much?

[Anonymous No.12623664]

>>12615712
you have to go back

[Anonymous No.12623665]

>>12621655
>there's the next round of argument.
There's no argument at that point. I actually had someone tell me that unless we examine every single death certificate and case, they're not going to believe anyone's really dying from COVID-19. That's obviously never going to happen, so there's no point in continuing the argument.

[Anonymous No.12623670]

>>12617482
Vox is pretty gay brah

[Anonymous No.12623722]

>>12619483
>people not believing the preferred truth.
C19s biggest impact is turning /sci/ into a subreddit

[Anonymous No.12623744]

>>12617568
Actually, so called 'leaky' vaccines which mitigate symptoms, but not transmission, like the covid vaccine, may actually worsen diseases and make more deadly and virulent in the long term. The vaccine is a failure, just like everything else

[Anonymous No.12623780]

>>12615712
We are talking about people who are quite literally too stupid to live, I dont think there is any way to convince them, at least until somebody they know dies.

[Anonymous No.12623796]

>>12623780
So much irony in this smug post.

[Anonymous No.12623820]

>>12615712
when more than %0.1276442 will die and not just old people

[Anonymous No.12623847]

>>12615712
Reality will catch up with the "it's just a flu" crowd when they'll catch it or their parents or grandparents. Even more if these family members got it from them.

Of course it can feel like a long lasting flu or even just a bad cold for many but what people should be aware of are the potential sequelae. Especially cardiovascular and neurological.

[Anonymous No.12623945]

>>12615806
The only valid response. If it wasn't just the flu, more people would be dying.
>but muh 2 million
Ah yes the 130k elderly people who died of covid and the other 1.8 million people who were diagnosed with covid and died of car accidents, suicide, murder, etc.
>>12615834
>>12615717
>>12615762
These replies are fascinating examples of this weird psychological condition that I read about once. These Reddit schizos have such boring lives that their form of escapism is pretending that they live in I Am Legend or some equally shitty PG-13 action movie. In the minds of these people, they are misunderstood geniuses that have an almost psychic sense of impending danger. I would hate to live a life as starved for attention and recognition as these fucking neanderthals. These people are the one hoodie kid at the speed running competition that are told "I would really prefer if you'd be quiet."
Pic related, its you.

[Anonymous No.12623964]

>>12619556
>Preventative measures have different effects on different pathogens.
Only if the pathogens spread differently. Covid and flu spread via the same mechanics (airborne droplets, probably fomites). If you were comparing covid and HIV, then you'd have a point because airborne transmission and sexual transmission are different.

Put another way, cultural changes influence the transmission environment, which is pathogen independent. If the airborne transmission environment changes, it simultaneously reduces covid and flu transmission.

[Anonymous No.12624023]

>>12623964
>Covid and flu spread via the same mechanics (airborne droplets, probably fomites)
Spreading via the same mechanics doesn't mean equally transmissible. Ability to remain viable on surfaces, the number of particles needed for a minimal infectious dose, the amount of shedding the infection causes, the ability to aerosolize, the infectious time period prior to symptoms, the duration of the illness, all affect the degree of transmission.

[Anonymous No.12624152]

>>12615712
Covid denialism isn't a problem of MISinformation, it's a problem of intentional systematic DISinformation. To solve the problem requires attacking and disempowering the mechanisms of disinformation that promote Covid denialism.
The problem is that almost the entire Republican party and its propaganda machine of right-wing media is the mechanism of this denialism.
America's problem of right-wing disinformation has finally come around to bite ourselves on our own ass and create real, massive damage to our country. We're literally being crippled as a nation from right-wing stupidity - a goal that is also sought by our enemies.

[Anonymous No.12624160]

>>12624023
>Spreading via the same mechanics doesn't mean equally transmissible
Obviously. That's why they have different R values! But the rate at which these R values change is from changing the transmission mechanics.

[Anonymous No.12624204]

>>12624152
Thankfully the Republicans are largely out of national power. The question now is whether Democrat leadership is strong enough to successfully fight right-wing disinformation by exposing and prosecuting it. The Republican party should be completely disgraced in the eyes of the American public, it cannot be allowed to exist politically after the violence it has done to America for the past 4 years.

[Anonymous No.12624214]

>>12624204
The Republican party shouldn't have been allowed to exist after Bush II. But we got Obama, who in turn gave us Trump due to his failure to fight against right-wing lawlessness.

[Anonymous No.12624224]

>>12624214
Obama and the dem leadership also failed to fight against corrupting influences in the dem party, most especially the influence of corporate and rich donors.
If the Democratic party continues to capitulate to the corporate wing, it will just continue to serve as another wing of the Republican party.

[Anonymous No.12624303]

>>12624152
People like you are what's wrong with this country

[Anonymous No.12624306]

>>12624303
One term.
No wall.
Infinite cope.

[Anonymous No.12624411]

>>12618172
>If the government demands any of these things, it is a dictatorship. You should ignore what it says or fight with it.
Cool. If the law demands that illegal niggers should be deported, those niggers can just claim its a dictatorship and ignore being deported? Pretty based
> inb4 B-B-BUT THEY AREN'T CITIZENS OF [your country] SO THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW THE LAW. NOOOOOOOOO
>seething_soijak.jpg

[Anonymous No.12624468]

>>12624306
ok
You're still poisoning discourse, undermining the ability of citizens to find common ground, and harming public trust in institutions

[Anonymous No.12624491]

>>12617087
holy fucking kek

[Anonymous No.12624505]

>>12624152
>>12624204
>>12624214
>>12624224
>>12624306
The right wing media DOES feed its viewers/readers misinformation. But so does the left wing media. And the majority of the media is left wing, ie, controlled by Democrats. If you're unable to see that, you're probably also unable to see that the Democratic party does not fight for the working class, and has not for a generation. In other words, they don't give a fuck about you. They just want power. Exactly like the Republicans.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_cross-ownership_in_the_United_States

[Anonymous No.12624539]

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm#Comorbidities
>For 6% of deaths, COVID-19 was the only cause mentioned. For deaths with conditions or causes in addition to COVID-19, on average, there were 2.9 additional conditions or causes per death.
It's not ebola, christ in heaven.
>>12624204 This cum drinking retard wants to prosecute "right-wing disinformation" when the left wing media has spend 12 months making the coronavirus out to be a deadly pandemic. 94% of patients have a comorbidity listed as a co-fatality? This is what we shut the global economy down for? I know it's hard to question authoritative sources of information like the mainstream news, but fuck, we're on /sci/, let's take a scientific and rational approach to this virus.

[Anonymous No.12624594]

>>12624539
I'm pretty glad that trump is out. /sci/ used to be pretty based, atleast as far back as early 2016. We'd get retarded pol posters here on occasion, and they'd get btfo and ridiculed.
Then this board got overrun with retarded crossboarders.
Now trumpnigger is out of power, and all the based /sci/ homeboarders can tell stormniggers to fuck off back to their one-term circlejerk board

[Anonymous No.12624612]

>>12618236
>retarded argument
lmao. Look at this reCOPElican stormnignog.
Correlation DOES NOT equal causation.
>czecha has a mask mandate
my country has a mask mandate, yet many people dont observe it. Do you think that there is no murder or theft simply because there are laws against it?
Having a law for masks + high death rate from covid =/= masks kill you
It means that most likely the retards don't wear masks, there are lots of deaths, and the mandate was put in place because of that.

[Anonymous No.12624736]

>>12624612
>Correlation does not equal causation
You are right. Having a law for masks + high death rate from covid =/= masks not being worn
Any proof for many people not wearing masks in your country? Any studies or data? Genuinely wondering because I live in Chicagoland and the city and state harp on about people not wearing masks but it seems like everyone has been wearing them for months now, even rednecks.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-coronavirus-holiday-covid-surge-illinois-20210118-antj7ho7mjg2tgkowzm53kxytm-htmlstory.html
https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-coronavirus-thanksgiving-covid-surge-illinois-20201216-yg3bkowlwbb57am5igoxt4nlhe-htmlstory.html
A lot of people still traveled for the holidays which is much more dangerous than not wearing masks but that somehow didn't cause a covid surge like the news was worried about.

[Anonymous No.12624785]

>>12615712
do you lose taste and smell from the flu? and get blood clots?

[Anonymous No.12624898]

>>12624612
I'm a centrist. I just hate mindless drones who tout that retarded, meaningless phrase. By that stupid phrase, we have zero understanding of causation, full stop. Nothing we've ever studied has been proven to be a cause. It's anti-intellectual bullshit.

[Anonymous No.12624948]

>>12624612
If you strictly demand something from others, you should *at least* show that there is a causation between that and something good. If you can't show it, you should at the very least show that there is a strong correlation. If the correlation is almost nonexistent (or actually inverse), then your case fails completely.

[Anonymous No.12625223]

>>12615880
>WITH vs FROM
>NOOOOOOOOOOOO i got shot but i died from bleeding out, don't register me as a gun fatality you can't do that

[Anonymous No.12625302]

>>12615717
By letting *(like 0.1 - 3% depending on agegroup of)* the troglodytes kill themselves off.
And that's gonna help exactly how in reducing their numbers?

[Anonymous No.12625409]

>>12624505
This. I cannot grasp how US bros still haven't understood that politics is a career machine. They never cared about you at least since Clinton.
One thing that made Trump interesting for many was that he didn't let himself control by the usual suspects. He was a symptom, not a cause.

[Anonymous No.12625434]

California's governor just announced he's severely relaxing the state's covid mandates. This goes along with New York, Michigan, and several other states all doing the same thing. Apparently the danger has passed. Those of you who were on the shutdown/isolate/mask up bus are about to get thrown under it. Now you have to decide if you want to continue pushing the old narrative or gaslight everyone while pretending you were never in favor of the restrictions.
The powers that be aren't going to wait around for you to change your mind or even try to ease into this. Everything in the US is about to reopen and most, if not all, of the restrictions lifted. Anyone who goes against these new orders by Gavin, Cuomo, and Whitmer will be called economic terrorists and treated the same way those who wouldn't wear a mask were. You've been warned. It's time for you to flip-flop on masks again.

[Anonymous No.12625515]

>>12624594
>reeee,... everything is trumps fault

[Anonymous No.12625530]

>>12615712
this picrel is the govt.
why would you ever question anything they say?

[Anonymous No.12625998]

Still not gonna get the (((vaccine)))
Still not gonna wear the (((mask)))
Seethe harder

[Anonymous No.12626315]

Absolute state of /sci/...

>falling for fake news article
>prefer to endanger your US brothers to wearing a simple mask sometimes and distancing
>bringing politics in everything

[Anonymous No.12626319]

>>12624594
>Trumpnigger
You are part of the problem.

[Anonymous No.12626330]

>>12625434
>California's governor just announced he's severely relaxing the state's covid mandates.
Hmm, aren't the covid deaths currently at its peak in California? But guess that they never mattered.

[Anonymous No.12626336]

>>12625223
>NOOOOOOO I stubbed my toe and then got in a car crash, but I am totally a toe-stubbing pandemic victim

[Anonymous No.12626531]

>>12626336
what exactly does this refute? do you even know where you are?

[Anonymous No.12626669]

>>12626531
>do you even know where you are?
On a mongolian basket-weaving forum?

[Anonymous No.12626698]

>>12626315
>Won't somebody think of the 80 year old boomers :(

[Anonymous No.12627116]

>>12626698
?