/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.10188209]

Why has nuclear power fallen so massively out of use with only so few new reactors being built in the west?

[Anonymous No.10188236]

Massively dangerous and polluting. Some studies also take into account the (indirectly produced) co2 pollution and it is damning.

[Anonymous No.10188248]

>>10188209
Three mile island, Chernobyl, Fukushima...

[Anonymous No.10188257]

>>10188209
They are really expensive to build and maintain (just like all power plant types.) And, like all forms of energy generation they need massive amounts of subsidies to even break even let alone make a, "profit". Since subsidies are something that is transient and competitive to get, you have other power generation technologies competing for the same pool of subsidies. Meaning, there's only so much money to go around.


http://www.world-nuclear.org/information-library/current-and-future-generation/plans-for-new-reactors-worldwide.aspx

[Anonymous No.10188261]

>>10188209
Lower demand. Literally. That's it. People want solar and wind. They don't know or care about the applications for space travel, electric cars, machines etc. They just want to live their lives "peacefully" unaware or ignoring that life is pure war. Every breath is a war. War against bacteria. War against viruses, against funghi, war against radiation and parasites. War against the animals, the plants, the seas and the air, war against chemicals, against corrosion and entropy itself. There is no escape, except absolute and total victory.

[Anonymous No.10188265]

>>10188248
Three mile island wasn’t even a bad thing
Not a single person was injured

Fukushima was caused by retarded nips putting a fucking reactor on one of the most earthquake heavy countries in the world AND putting it on the fucking coast.

Chernobyl was enitrely the fault of the atypical reactor design of the RMBK, if they had used a different material it wouldn’t have been unstable at lower temperatures, but because it was so atypical no one knew the material had that property

Being afraid of nuclear means you don’t actually know about nuclear. Deaths per energy generated nuclear is the safest energy period.

[Anonymous No.10188272]

>>10188261
>Lots of excuses to accept misery
Grow up.

The universe can be boiled down to one thing and one thing only, you feed or you are fed upon. You eat and meet metabolic demands, or you're eaten by bacteria living in your blood, that have colonized your brain and organs (yes), that live in your bowel, and that live on your skin. Even a sun feeds or it is fed upon, though it's arguable if an entity can "eat" another or if they just merge at that scale, both losing their identity.

Anyway. Life is many kinds of conflict. You can make it easy on yourself, or long, brutal, and miserable. Not all ease should be pursued and not all stressors should be accepted. Don't take offense, but once you've actually lived this becomes clear.

[Anonymous No.10188287]

>>10188209
NIMBYs

[Anonymous No.10188289]

>>10188209

This >>10188236 is why, but not for the reasons stated.

Too many retards think that nuclear is dangerous and too many retards think nuclear pollutes worse than any other form of energy generation.

They always point to obsolete designs that have been bandaged throughout the years that have failed just like >>10188248 when we have reactors that are so safe you can walk away from them and they will be self contained for hundreds if not thousands of years.

Wind is relatively non-toxic to produce but kills large amounts of wildlife, changes micro climates in surrounding areas.
Solar is probably the worst 'renewable' you can make due to toxic manufacturing processes and the chemicals involved.
Hydro kills alot of wildlife, ruins fish populations within the rivers they inhabit, concrete slowly leeches poison into waterways

[Anonymous No.10188300]

>>10188248
>>10188236
>>10188257
>>10188261

>3 nuclear “major” disasters in 76 years of nuclear energy
>meanwhile, have major oil spills every single year which pollute the oceans and seas

[Anonymous No.10188305]

>>10188272
All miseries should be accepted. Only through acceptance can they be overcome.

[Anonymous No.10188319]

>>10188272
>You can choose to make it easy.
Sometimes, war just comes a knockin'. No prep time. Just action. No choice in the matter when a meteorite hits or lightning strikes.

[Anonymous No.10188337]

They bury radiactive nuclear materials into the soil.

Let that sink in.

[Anonymous No.10188353]

>>10188289
>Wind is relatively non-toxic to produce but kills large amounts of wildlife, changes micro climates in surrounding areas.
Wind requires petrochemicals or GMO onions / cotton oil to lubricate bearings. It also creates subsonics and high levels of dirty electricity when run through typical inverters because no one gives half a shit about anything. They're also somewhat ugly.

>Solar is probably the worst 'renewable' you can make due to toxic manufacturing processes and the chemicals involved.
Solar is barely a crude mimicry of what is achieved by plants. Same problem with inverters. Panels that use telerium and indium require ravaging third world ecologies to mine.

>Hydro kills alot of wildlife, ruins fish populations within the rivers they inhabit, concrete slowly leeches poison into waterways
Yep. Separate streams for fish to jump up don't entirely work. Concrete leaks a constant supply of garbage into waterways but:
>Fukushima still pouring shit out everywhere. Maybe it sinks, maybe it gets uptaken by migratory species and trafficked everywhere.
One goof.

LFTR seems like the only feasible technology.
>Neutron poisoning.
Shit my reactor is shutting down periodically. Better scrap it, war effort or none. Xenon? What's that?

[Anonymous No.10188358]

>>10188300
An airplane crash killing 200 people gets orders of magnitude more attention than the sum of a hundred automobile accidents killing two people each on average.

[Anonymous No.10188420]

>>10188209
Planning a nuclear plant takes more then a decade, building takes another decade. Today no company can plan ahead this far. Natural gas, wind and solar plants can be build much faster and much cheaper.
Also nuclear energy is not competitive. Cost per MWh in a nuclear plant is about $100 while wind and solar is $60 or less.

Also green energy is way more popular. It's good for your image.

[Anonymous No.10188782]

>>10188209

because states stopped subsidizing it

same will happen to solar power in 10-20ish years as plants/panels reach their end-of-life and utilities choose abandonment over renewal

[Anonymous No.10188828]

>>10188353
>Solar is barely a crude mimicry of what is achieved by plants
>Plants convert about 10% of solar energy to chemically stored energy which must be converted again before use
>Newest solar panels convert 43% of solar energy directly to energy
You don't have any idea what you're talking about

[Anonymous No.10188844]

>>10188828
>Plants grow in multiple layers. Have canopy, many branches in between, understory
>The best you're going to get with solar panels is some sort of photocollector directing a beam at some fixed angle over multiple panels
>Transparent panels would suffer loss of efficiency
>The chemical energy made by plants can be made more useful in a larger processing chain.

You assumed one tree, not the whole ecology. You'd use it all.

[Anonymous No.10188850]

>>10188265
Chernobyl could have been averted if not for the lazy and complacent communist workforce that operated it.

[Anonymous No.10188856]

>>10188828
No solar plant at 43% is affordable/scalable, at tleast I don't think so otherwise we'd have more solar

[Anonymous No.10188859]

>>10188850
>Commies are worked like dogs and if they resist, straight to gulag
>Commies are lazy and slovenly, cannot even do basic task right. Too lazy even to ship to gulag.
Which is it.

[Anonymous No.10188871]

>>10188337
>They bury radiactive nuclear materials into the soil.

You need to do a little research there, bud.

[Anonymous No.10188873]

>>10188420
You realize why, right? It isn't that nuclear is that hard. It's that Governments have made it that hard.

[Anonymous No.10188884]

>>10188353
>Complaining about GMOs
>Thinking dirty electricity is some insurmountable problem
>LFTR seems like the only feasible technology.
Wew lad

[Anonymous No.10188887]

>>10188856
At least use Google before you post

https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2018/11/23/all-i-want-for-christmas-is-a-90-efficient-solar-panel/
>The first manufacturing lines could cost $4.1 million, and would initially produce ~45% efficient modules, at a clip of 20MW/year with a proposed price of 10¢/W.
>At full efficiency, costs are cut in half and volumes per year doubled.

Stop LARPing

[Anonymous No.10188893]

>>10188884
All problems are insurmountable when no one knows and admits they exist.

Have fun with that cancer kiddo, if you don't start thinking. I've watched many people die of cancer, and I don't say that lightly.

[Anonymous No.10188896]

>>10188859
Both
The soviet union was large, and the commisars very corrupt

[Anonymous No.10188902]

>>10188893
>kiddo
How's highschool?

[Anonymous No.10188903]

>>10188859
Neither. Commies cull thinking, competitive types from the population as a first order of business. What's left are broken minds who do what they're told and little else.

[Anonymous No.10188904]

>>10188859
Both, depending on which part of the hyper corrupt government the poor commie slave works under.

[Anonymous No.10188908]

>>10188844
>Place transparent infrared solar panel over regular solar panel
>20% efficiency off each layer
>Leaves are opaque and only collect about 10% of the energy they receive
>it doesn't matter how many layers you have

Your canopy assumption is garbage

[Anonymous No.10188912]

>>10188902
Long gone. Kiddo-posting is vaguely stress relieving and can be effective rhetoric, or produce substantive conversation.

Strange, but true.
:^)

[Anonymous No.10188928]

>>10188893
Double wew lad I thought you were talking about actual dirty electricity not some new age woo bullshit.
If you're not trolling, you're a literal retard and if you are, good work.

[Anonymous No.10188929]

>>10188908
>>Place transparent infrared solar panel over regular solar panel
>>20% efficiency off each layer
Examples.

>>Leaves are opaque and only collect about 10% of the energy they receive
Leaves aren't opaque, they're a multilayered lattice. Each subsequent layer absorbs slightly more. Plants will tend to grow near other plants which reflect frequencies they can tune their leaves to efficiently absorb. This is why leaves aren't black. They need to not suffer thermal damage, but they don't just say oh well and leave it at that.

>>it doesn't matter how many layers you have
Leaves aren't as inefficient as you're stating, whether you take into account reflection or not.

>

[Anonymous No.10188934]

>>10188928
>Double wew lad I thought you were talking about actual dirty electricity not some new age woo bullshit.
Uh, where is the difference in your mind?

[Anonymous No.10188935]

>>10188934
Dirty electricity as in noisy

[Anonymous No.10188944]

>>10188935
Right. High frequency transients and harmonics.

[Anonymous No.10188947]

>>10188209
Fear mongering from the left. Every "environmentalist" who opposes nuclear power is not concerned about the environment, but is in fact a fetishist of torture via deprivation.

[Anonymous No.10188964]

>>10188929
>He doesn't know how to use Google

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/see-through-solar-panels-will-put-untapped-energy-work-ncna813836

Besides that you can now get 43% directly refer to this post
>>10188887

You can't get around the fact that plants do not store more then 15% of the solar energy they receive as biomass. It is literally more efficient to collect the solar energy with photovoltaics and feed some of it to crops via LEDs

[Anonymous No.10188969]

>>10188944
Which doesn't cause cancer

[Anonymous No.10188981]

>>10188964
>It is literally more efficient to collect the solar energy with photovoltaics and feed some of it to crops via LEDs
Though again, you're underestimating plants for whatever reason, I can get behind this to an extent. As long as it's widely recognized that the spectral character of LEDs, and the blue component especially, are strongly biologically active, bad for most higher life, and often tune micro-organisms towards virulence and a general form of antibiotic resistance. They can also be used to more finely control gene expression of various plants, for better or worse. This would require study to ensure endogenous beneficial compounds made to combat fungi and bacteria are not compromised, and that endotoxins are not upregulated.

A lot of potential, too little talent and consciousness to use it.

[Anonymous No.10188987]

>>10188969
Yes it does. Melanoma in particular is correlated.
>inb4 not causation

[Anonymous No.10189023]

>>10188981
>underestimating plants
They simply do not have a place in the context of generating energy. You will never get any system of plants anywhere near the 43% solar conversion efficiency that has already been demonstrated with the latest panels. Even if you somehow could, you would lose 40-80% of it when you convert it from stored biomass to electricity and heat. It is better as compost then as kindling

[Anonymous No.10189033]

>>10189023
Yeah but like, you can put them almost anywhere. In fact, they've been doing the same thing themselves for quite some time, and they're very clever.

There are some problems to solve, but for many regions I wouldn't count plants (or programmable self replicating machinery) out quite yet.

[Anonymous No.10189035]

>>10188209
Because western "environmentalists" are actually luddite naturalists who want everyone else living in caves (not themselves, of course).

>>10188850
>>10188859
Chernobyl was caused by an experiment with the reactor, to see what its failure modes were. The workforce was trying to understand what the actual margin of safety was for the reactor, and it behaved unexpectedly during the test.

[Anonymous No.10189064]

>>10188420
Cost per MWh is generally compensated for by the sheer amount of MWhs that nuclear generates over other forms.

>>10188873
Governments made it that hard due to poor public opinion and a demand to make it "safer".

>>10188265
> Fukushima
You have to make the electricity somewhere. The earthquake didn't even take out the plant, it was a higher than expected tsunami. They already had guards against a tsunami. At some point, we have to say that we don't want to live in caves and have to accept the risk that is entailed by not doing so. If you put the reactor in the middle of the Sahara, it could be hit be a meteor. Then what? Oh, heavens, the plant was put on the Earth which gets hit by meteors all the time? While there were some poor decisions regarding Fukushima, building it wasn't one of them.

[Anonymous No.10189081]

>>10188987
>>>/x/

[Anonymous No.10189093]

>>10189081
Refer to Samuel Milham, and the book "Electromagnetic Fields and circadian rhythmicity" 1992. And others.

Also, just so I don't give the false impression that I have infinite patience, I'm right and you're a moron. But it's not a big deal, because this state is not static, you can respond to this contrast by looking into what I've suggested and forming your own conclusions.

[Anonymous No.10189110]

>>10189093
Are you the same dumb nigger who shits up any thread that has a remote connection to radio technology?

[Anonymous No.10189115]

>>10189110
Oh holy shit you are
>>/sci/thread/S10055125#p10058452

[Anonymous No.10189119]

>>10189064
>You have to make the electricity somewhere. The earthquake didn't even take out the plant, it was a higher than expected tsunami. They already had guards against a tsunami. At some point, we have to say that we don't want to live in caves and have to accept the risk that is entailed by not doing so. If you put the reactor in the middle of the Sahara, it could be hit be a meteor. Then what? Oh, heavens, the plant was put on the Earth which gets hit by meteors all the time? While there were some poor decisions regarding Fukushima, building it wasn't one of them.

I'm pro-nuclear, but this is very retarded. TEPCO didn't build the tsunami wall high enough, and they were retarded enough to put the diesel generators IN THE FUCKING BASEMENT

[Anonymous No.10189122]

>>10189110
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/dj875cd10yb72/EMF
Here, I've uploaded it for you.

[Anonymous No.10189123]

>>10189122
Wewest of lads, you're obsessed
>>/sci/?task=search&ghost=yes&search_text=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.mediafire.com%2Ffolder%2Fdj875cd10yb72%2FEMF

[Anonymous No.10189129]

>>10189123
It is very important.

[Anonymous No.10189131]

>>10189129
You're very autistic sweaty UwU

[Anonymous No.10189177]

>>10189131
I developed microwave sickness which presented as MS-like symptoms 10+ years ago. The first major sign was lack of a sweat response and a burning sensation throughout most of my body, particularly when blood would pool in the extremities in accordance with gravity. My skin would take on a leathery texture and turn dark red. Microwave induced damage is first reversible but quickly becomes irreversible with continued exposure. Though it's gotten better, periodically my thermoregulatory system isn't fully competent to this day, though having low body fat I don't have much insulation anyway. Don't know exactly why it's like a flickering lightbulb. Humidity is not the factor. Another possibility is some vaccine related goof, which seems less likely all things considered.

So the sweaty part is out. I wouldn't say I'm autistic either. I have probably have more intact theory of mind than you do.

Good memes, man. One of us is a real human being, the other one I'm not so sure about. Think about that.

[Anonymous No.10189293]

>>10189177
AYY LMAO YOU AGAIN

This is who you're talking to when you respond to a post talking about how microwave pulses/emf/rf/vlf/whatever is bad for you and will wreck your life through vgccs. The following posts outline one man's mental illness and egotistical delusions. It's pointless to argue with him.

IF YOU ONLY READ ONE LINK READ THIS ONE:
>>/sci/thread/S7412900#p7419557
He's a dumb tweaker who went nuts as a teenager and melted his brain with drugs afterwards.

>>/sci/thread/S6030054
Post from 2013 where he admits he knows doctors won't believe him.

>>/sci/thread/S7381438#p7384671
Here he is admitting he takes stimulants before posting.

>>/sci/thread/S7347630#p7350199
Admits to hallucinations

>>/sci/thread/S9039115#p9043898
He admits he's dumb as a box of rocks.

>>/sci/thread/S8205938#p8206096
Autistic textwall about how he's a clever superhuman with undiagnosed MS and self diagnosed bipolar and an insane skeleton


>>/sci/thread/S9072343#p9072588
Goes on about smart meters, the evils of processed food, and how he's so unique among sheep.

>>/sci/thread/S7644877#p7651596

>>/sci/thread/S7644877#p7650927

>>/sci/thread/S6862166#p6862235
Gets told he's nuts by a doctor

>>/sci/thread/S8800448#p8806774
This speaks for itself
>>/sci/thread/S8369061#p8369080
I'm a special warrior pls stroke my ego

>>/sci/thread/S8339168#p8339266
This entire thread is him wigging out about how he's totally not insane and the evils of shrinks.

[Anonymous No.10189298]

>>/sci/thread/S7644877#p7651596

>>/sci/thread/S7644877#p7650927

>>/sci/thread/S6862166#p6862235
Gets told he's nuts by a doctor

>>/sci/thread/S8800448#p8806774
This speaks for itself
>>/sci/thread/S8369061#p8369080
I'm a special warrior pls stroke my ego

>>/sci/thread/S8339168#p8339266
This entire thread is him wigging out about how he's totally not insane and the evils of shrinks.

>>/sci/thread/S8322068#p8322156
Him going on about his genius again.

>>/sci/thread/S8261316#p8261569
>>/sci/thread/S8261316#p8261598
Protip: Don't constantly call people myopic if you want to remain anon.
Muh jaw problems muh nerve probems

>>/sci/thread/S8230504#p8245636
Spends half a thread freaking out about MUH JAW MUH SUPER HEALING MUH LOGIC and CT scans, plus some of his wacky medical adventures.

>>/sci/thread/S8219875#p8220852
He's some sort of genius philosopher.

>>/sci/thread/S7397504#p7397645
Arguing with doctors again since they don't agree with his self diagnosis.

>>/sci/thread/S8208158#p8208194
Muh logical framework cures acne

>>/sci/thread/S7355671#p7356297
All caps rage about how stoic he is, and how you don't see him doing exactly what his post says.

>>/sci/thread/S7530472#p7532449
Neurosurgeon pro

>>/sci/thread/S9325159#p9329305
More mental issues

>>/sci/thread/S9327702#p9331355
Whining about neuralgia again, admits that he feels mentally impaired.

>>/sci/thread/S9981946#p9994713
Sperging out in /med/ general about how the WHO is lying

[Anonymous No.10189394]

>>10189119
So, poor design decisions? You called me retarded, but all of your complaints are poor design and site management, not a poor decision to build the plant to begin with.

[Anonymous No.10189397]

>>10188209
fear mongering

[Anonymous No.10189433]

>>10189293
Like I said the last thread:
"I've gone through some of this poster's walls of links in the past and often 1/2+ aren't me, which is an unacceptably high error rate. More likely all that really counts is framing and establishing a core narrative."

Briefly:
>Post from 2013 where he admits he knows doctors won't believe him.
This is not me.

>Here he is admitting he takes stimulants before posting.
Yeah. And I was on the hard stuff earlier today. Pic related.

Moved on to yerba mate, cold pressed briefly fermented cacao powder, and a bit of guarana seed now.

>Admits to hallucinations
This is a citation where the source doesn't fully support your statement.

[...]

>>>/sci/thread/S6862166#p6862235
This isn't me.

>>>/sci/thread/S8800448#p8806774
Past me is intense, but correct.

>I'm a special warrior pls stroke my ego
Where are you getting this?

>>>/sci/thread/S8339168#p8339266
This shit is hilarious.

>>>/sci/thread/S8322068#p8322156
It's good to look back on this stuff, because I pretty nearly did it. Changes in my spine, herbs, dietary stuff. Rapid changes in air pressure still occasionally cause problems for whatever reason, but the fear of getting my head wet is slowly fading away.

At this time I was pretty much starving myself and eating large amounts of cacao and other stimulant herbs every day. Real interesting with slight unease. Thanks anon.

>Spends half a thread freaking out about MUH JAW MUH SUPER HEALING MUH LOGIC [...]
I don't really understand the commentary for this one.

>>>/sci/thread/S8219875#p8220852
Neat. I'll have to study what I was thinking at this time.
I've been getting to you for a while, haven't I?

>>>/sci/thread/S8208158#p8208194
True. Should've mentioned RF and blue light, and suggested NAC.

>Whining about neuralgia again, admits that he feels mentally impaired.
I'm not sure what the point is here.

>WHO is lying
True.

[Anonymous No.10189448]

>>10189433
i like autists again, thanks nigger

[Anonymous No.10189522]

>>10188420
I would expect it to be cheaper from all the subsidies

[Anonymous No.10189622]

>>10188209
sierra club/green party being massive faggots and spreading as much misinformation as they can for decades. at least some of them are coming around and acknowledging/owning their hypocrisy.

[Anonymous No.10189631]

>>10189622
they're all gonna laugh at you
they're all gonna laugh at you

[Anonymous No.10189718]

>>10189433
All this post tells me is that you're an insane spammer.
Go help geometric unity find the limits of cosine or something

[Anonymous No.10190828]

>>10188305
>stabs you with misery

[Anonymous No.10190836]

>>10188209
Two words: Chernobyl

[Anonymous No.10190837]

>>10188859
>Commies are lazy and slovenly, cannot even do basic task right
This one.

We're not talking about pre=WW2 commies.
Chernobyl was a result of complacency and human error. Read up on it.

[Anonymous No.10190840]

no mention of fusion.

no mention of w7x.

[Anonymous No.10190869]

>>10189064
>If you put the reactor in the middle of the Sahara

You obviously lack basic knowledge. All nuclear plants are build near the sea, a river or a lake. Because you need lot's of water for cooling. If cooling fails you get a meltdown and your plant is history.

[Anonymous No.10190889]

BBC doco on Chernobyl
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v40hu54fAvw

[Anonymous No.10190890]

>>10190869
bro just make it only cool at night everyone knows it freezes in desert at night lmao

[Anonymous No.10190973]

>>10188265
Power plants have to be near large bodies of water because of the better ground conductivity

[Anonymous No.10190985]

>>10190890
Using turbines and low friction systems you probably could cool a plant with cold air.

[Anonymous No.10191012]

>>10190869
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palo_Verde_Nuclear_Generating_Station

[Anonymous No.10191524]

>>10191012
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palo_Verde_Nuclear_Generating_Station
"The Palo Verde Generating Station is located in the Arizona desert, and is the only large nuclear power plant in the world that is not located near a large body of water. The power plant evaporates the water from the treated sewage from several nearby cities and towns to provide the cooling of the steam that it produces"
q.e.d.

[Anonymous No.10191882]

bump

[Anonymous No.10192481]

>>10188209
unironically because of the simpsons

[Anonymous No.10192804]

>>10188337
They do the opposite, they did radioactive fuels out of the ground and then when they're spent they keep them in dry casks above ground in geologically stable areas.

[Anonymous No.10193750]

>>10188209
Probably because of experimental meme reactors like your pic.
>It‘s gonna be better than ever!
>except it actually sucks dick after all
HTR is a shit technology and I can‘t believe some people are still championing it as the future of nuclear.

[Anonymous No.10193815]

>>10190985
no

[Anonymous No.10193817]

>>10191524
Neat. What would be cooler is they exposed the garbage to radiation to break it down and a breakneck pace, and sort of like, rotated the exposed spot around the reactor so each section only had heat generation for certain periods of time.

[Anonymous No.10193972]

atomic age is over