Why is physical reality so depressing?

[Anonymous No.9568744]

No free will.
The Selfish Gene.
Life or human existence has no real meaning or purpose because human existence occurred out of a random chance in nature, and anything that exists by chance has no intended purpose.

[Anonymous No.9568778]

>>9568744
I find nothing depressing there. Why would it?

[Anonymous No.9568784]

>>9568744
>No free will
False
>The Selfish Gene
Dawkins is overrated
>Life or human existence has no real meaning or purpose because human existence occurred out of a random chance in nature, and anything that exists by chance has no intended purpose.
Babies first nihilism.

[Anonymous No.9568807]

>>9568784
>False
t. brainlet

Unless a God grants you a magical Soul that ignores the physical laws governing the universe, willing your own will is a literal impossibility.

[Anonymous No.9568813]

>>9568807
>your own will
Only laws of nature can establish authorship. You can't reason about magic, so can't tell anything certain about it, and can't be sure about authorship.

[Anonymous No.9568816]

>>9568744
>physical reality is what humanists talk about in their revival of the greek academia and give me a degree against money

JAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJJAJAJAJAJAJAJA

[Anonymous No.9568820]

>>9568744
>le 15 year old fedora freethinker
get back to /r/philosophy

[Anonymous No.9568821]

>physical reality
kek

[Anonymous No.9568827]

>>9568744
>existence has no meaning
>calls it depressing
>complains about the meaning he gave to existence
Nihilists are fucking braindead I swear.

[Anonymous No.9568828]

>>9568813
>a bunch of sophistry
Here´s the deal: determinism or not, your thoughts are sprung from either a causal chain of events or random chance - both of them beyond your control.

[Anonymous No.9568830]

ITT: edgy 17 year olds who think they are smart

[Anonymous No.9568831]

>>9568744

>t. psuedo-scientist/psuedo-philosopher

[Anonymous No.9568833]

>>9568828
Depends how you classify "you", you massive faggot

[Anonymous No.9568834]

>>9568831
How can one be a real Philosopher instead of psuedo one?

[Anonymous No.9568835]

>>9568807
lmao God is the requisite for determinism, physics are already proven to be non-deterministic. Git gud

[Anonymous No.9568838]

>there are people that unironically believe in determinism
What's the fucking point? It doesn't even make a difference and you'd actually have a better life if you believed in free will.

[Anonymous No.9568842]

>>9568778
fpbp

[Anonymous No.9568845]

>>9568835
>>9568838
t. underage babbies who just found out about determinism

[Anonymous No.9568846]

Because life is just matter like any other matter, with no special meaning or purpose. It just so happens that our matter has this weird property of suffering/experience, but that doesn't exempt us from the same indifferent destruction that affects everything. The difference is that we care that it affects us, whereas an eroding cliff face or a dried up river doesn't and can't.

[Anonymous No.9568849]

>>9568834

By not deriving your philosophical viewpoint from pseudo-science.

[Anonymous No.9568850]

>>9568835
>>9568838
determinism has no impact on the existence of free will, if you don't realize this then kindly leave this board

[Anonymous No.9568851]

>>9568838
It's stupid to think of it as a choice. If you lose an arm in an accident, can you choose to believe you still have the arm? Maybe if you're severely delusional, but for most people that's just a fact to accept, not a belief to choose.

[Anonymous No.9568856]

Life is constantly at war with time

[Anonymous No.9568858]

Never post again

[Anonymous No.9568865]

No such thing as physical reality. Physicalism is a metaphysical commitment and merely a relative truth, not an absolute truth.

[Anonymous No.9568868]

>>9568744
because my stupid girlfriend is a twit thats why

[Anonymous No.9568870]

>>9568828
You can't control the external events, but you can control how you react to them.

[Anonymous No.9568874]

>>9568870
"you" is merely a delusional observer, it's the processes in your brain that dictate your actions and reactions

[Anonymous No.9568875]

>>9568835
Physics is deterministic, fix your education.
>>9568850
Quite the contrary, free will is impossible without determinism.

[Anonymous No.9568876]

>>9568874
>"you" is merely a delusional observer, it's the processes in your brain that dictate your actions and reactions
what the fuck am I reading

[Anonymous No.9568877]

>>9568744
>No free will.
I never got the free will meme. If your actions weren't entirely defined by the ruleset that is "you", your actions would partly be random, or at least outside of your control. How is that better than having full control?

[Anonymous No.9568881]

>>9568876
>>>/brainlets/

[Anonymous No.9568886]

>>9568875
>Physics is deterministic, fix your education.
No it isn't, it's probabilistic

[Anonymous No.9568903]

>>9568875
The Universe might be Non-Deterministic...

[Anonymous No.9568916]

>>9568874
The processes in my brain are me, so yes, I dictate my actions and reactions.

[Anonymous No.9568919]

>>9568886
You won't look smart if you insist on your ignorance.
>>9568903
To the best of our knowledge it isn't.

[Anonymous No.9568931]

ITT: People who never read Kant

[Anonymous No.9568934]

>>9568874
>it's the processes in your brain that dictate your actions and reactions
then you're the brain you fucking retard, or are you gonna claim that "your brain" wrote that and you merely observed? that's the dumbest fucking thing i've ever read

[Anonymous No.9568944]

>>9568875
>free will is impossible without determinism.
no, free will is impossible regardless of determinism

[Anonymous No.9568952]

>>9568919
QM is inherently probabilistic, you can't draw a difference between the micro and the macro.

[Anonymous No.9568955]

>>9568916
No they aren't. Also they have no volition, they are just physical/chemical processes hence no will.

[Anonymous No.9568971]

>>9568934
No, you're not the brain. And yes all experimental evidence agrees that the choices your brain makes happen before "you" become conscious of them, "you" is merely an observer imbued with the delusion that it's making the choices and driving the machine. Why are you so upset? It's easy to tell given your infantile writing that you don't belong here.

[Anonymous No.9568976]

>No free will
There is probably no free will but why would you let that affect your life? You still got your senses. Pro-tip: social contact is underrated. You can actually use the knowledge on the effect of environment on general mood (which then affects everything) to your benefit.

>The selfish gene
As a scientist (probably bio or popsci or so it seems) you should know that the material world progresses as it does and the rest is up to interpretation and speculation. There's multiple reasons to altruistic and one is egoism but who cares. Does it edgily stop you from being altruistic?

>Life has no meaning hurdur
Stop reading edgy popsci, mang. The world at the smallest scale is cool, on meterscale it's too (esp. because of life) and also on the 10^9m scale is okaye. You have to get over these things after your teenage years, but that probably will, no worries.

[None !niqjediPCA No.9569610]

>>9568744
>Why is physical reality so depressing?

jews.

luckily it's limited to earth.

and always will be, until the earth is destroyed.

or something happens to the population on the earth.

[Anonymous No.9569877]

>>9569610
>luckily it's limited to earth
No m8, jews will control the next planet we will live in.

[Anonymous No.9569964]

>>9568838
It was determined they will

[Anonymous No.9570124]

>>9568952
They work the same indeed, and both are deterministic, see evolution operator. QM is governed by math, and math is as deterministic as you can get.
>>9568955
Mind is process in brain and will is behavioral pattern in mind, so it's obviously a process in brain too.
>>9568971
It's just a limit of reflection, subconsciousness is "you" too. It doesn't really matter how it reflects in consciousness if the result and process are consistent with person's beliefs.

[Anonymous No.9570134]

>>9568952
On the other hand QM is irrelevant, decisions clearly depend on the person, which means causal connection.

[Anonymous No.9570142]

>>9570124
Do operating systems have free will too?

[Anonymous No.9570298]

>>9568952
>probabilistic
You have no control over the outcomes of the probability. Free will gets rekt in all interpretations of QM.

[Anonymous No.9570303]

>>9570298
jesus brainlets like you piss me off so much
free will is impossible regardless of determinism or indeterminism, what difference does it make if everything you do is predetermined or determined by chance? you don't have free will in either case

[Anonymous No.9570306]

>>9570303
That's what I'm saying, retard. Learn to fucking read.

[Anonymous No.9570353]

>>9569610
>forgot about the interdimensional-jew
stay sharp

[Anonymous No.9570397]

>The Selfish Gene
>because human existence occurred out of a random chance in nature
These things are mutually exclusive, but that was your goal, wasn't it? Certainly a lot of people took the bait.

[Anonymous No.9570412]

The absence of "intention" is not equal to the absence of "purpose" ;) Apart from how loosely those two words are defined, this is clearly a non sequitur. And why would "Give your life your own purpose" be depressing? Its the most empowering thought i could possibly come up with.
And apart from that... "Has a random component" does NOT equate to "is absolutely random". E.g. i do not consider it random that something thinking originates in a universe with all the required properties for it and lots of time, even though it might be "random" that it's homo sapiens and not homo neandertalensis in our case or that it just happened to happen on earth and not somewhere else.

[Anonymous No.9570438]

>>9570142
Free will is defined relative to personality and interests, it's difficult to identify interests of operating systems. If they have then they could.
>>9570298
QM can do both, in practice it looks like in case of free will QM provides causal connection between a person and his actions. Apparently uncontrollable processes have little to no effect on it.
>>9570303
You can have free will if your actions are deterministic. Rather free will requires determinism to exist.

[Anonymous No.9570440]

>>9570124
>>9570438
The fact that you have to resort to a watered down definition of free will to have any argument at all is evidence enough that it's bogus.

[Anonymous No.9570460]

>>9570438
>causal connection between a person and his actions
Literally what determinism is.
>uncontrollable processes have little to no effect on it
"little to no" doesn't mean none.
>You can have free will if your actions are deterministic
How can you have free will if every interactions in the universe is predetermined to happen in an exactly precise way since its creation?

>>9570124
>QM is governed by math
It's only represented with maths within a model.

[Anonymous No.9570461]

>>9568744
but all that shit has been obvious to everyone their whole lives senpai it aint depressing its just reality .

[Anonymous No.9570486]

>>9570440
An ability to act according to your interests. It's as meaty as you can get, straightforward and right to the point. Also the only one that makes sense.
>>9570460
>"little to no" doesn't mean none.
At least negligible. You know you can tunnel through a wall? That kind of effect.
>How can you have free will if every interactions in the universe is predetermined
You assume laws of nature are a constraining factor. That assumption is factually wrong. Without them you wouldn't exist in the first place, and nonexistence is not freedom.

[Anonymous No.9570491]

>>9570438
>You can have free will if your actions are deterministic
jesus christ, if I can predict every single one of your future actions you still claim you have free will?
kys

[Anonymous No.9570498]

>>9570486
>negligible
Holy fuck. No matter how you spin it, it doesn't change anything.
>You assume laws of nature are a constraining factor.
They are. I can't really fathom the point you're trying to make.
Explain to me what degree of freedom do you recieve from the fact that everything you do or think has been predetermined to happen in this exact way it does since the beginning of the universewithout you having any control over it.

[Anonymous No.9570512]

>>9568744
>Life or human existence has no real meaning or purpose because human existence occurred out of a random chance in nature

Anthropic principle.

We occupy a necessarily privileged existence within a Many-Worlds (MWI) event field. If it were not "privileged", no one would be sentient enough to sit around questioning the mystery of our existence...there are too many variables in our cosmological and biological models for us to arise by "chance", unless every chance were possible and we're within the boundaries of the tiny subset of possibilities that allows us.

[Anonymous No.9570538]

What's the point in calling universe deterministic if nothing within it cannot determine its future state. It is like saying that you have algorithm that solves halting problem, but it takes infinite time to get the solution.

[Anonymous No.9570542]

>>9570512
>Many-Worlds
Take your pills
>sentient
"Sentience" has no bearing on physics since you're still made of simple atoms. Many worlds memethesis is also deterministic which means you cannot be sentient by definition.
>there are too many variables in our cosmological and biological models for us to arise by "chance"
Not an argument. Survivor's bias.

[Anonymous No.9570549]

>>9570491
I'm not really against you believing in wrong memes, you just look pathetic when you try to convince others in them.
>>9570498
>No matter how you spin it, it doesn't change anything.
What doesn't change anything is neglecting negligible factors.
>Explain to me what degree of freedom
Obviously more than in nonexistence. The point is that you have wrong assumptions and derive wrong conclusions from them and try to use them as argument, but it's a weak argument, that's the point.

[Anonymous No.9570554]

>>9570538
It's about principle. It's obvious we'll probably never be able to account for all the forces acting on a macroscopic object. The point is that if determinism is true, you are fundamentally physically "scripted", like a simple turing machine. This depresses the average brainlet because he's been fed individualism since day one.

[Anonymous No.9570557]

>>9570542
>Take your pills
You flatearthers are laughable.

[Anonymous No.9570565]

>>9570549
I'll make it simple
>quantum interactions are probabilistic
>quantum interactions form the macroscopic world
>thus, the macroscopic world is probabilistic
Or
>If A=B and A=C, then B=C

>Obviously more than in nonexistence
OK
>free will in nonexistence = 0
>free will in deterministic existence = 0
Or
>If A=x and B=x, then A=B

>wrong assumptions and derive wrong conclusions
Such as?

[Anonymous No.9570572]

>>9570557
>flatearthers
Wait, what? I'm saying that the Everett interpretation is a meme.
Can you even read? Are you retarded?

[Anonymous No.9570595]

>>9570572
That's what flatearthers do - coming with retarded screeching, get debunked and later return with the same screeching.

[Anonymous No.9570602]

>>9570595
What are you talking about?
Nobody is talking about the flat earth garbage.

[Anonymous No.9570616]

>>9570565
>macroscopic world is probabilistic
It doesn't change anything because it's negligible, you can't make it simpler than this.
>free will in deterministic existence = 0
Based on wrong assumption. Are you trying to to convince me that nonexistence is better than existence?
>Such as?
Such as zero free will in deterministic existence.

[Anonymous No.9570618]

>>9570602
Flat earth is ok, what's not ok is repeating screeching.

[Anonymous No.9570625]

>>9570542
>Survivor's bias.

"Survivor's Bias" is exactly the point.

This isn't just a plane crash where one person miraculously survived out of a hundred...the unlikelihood of our existence can only be expressed with exponents.

Our universe could be nothing but dull, non-reactive particles, or only hydrogen atoms, or only hydrogen and helium nebula never coalescing into stars, etc. etc. on up the ladder until you get to the biological level, where the dinosaurs did perfectly well at the top of the food chain without any sign of intellectual development for hundreds of millions of years.

That level of infinitesimal chance lends credence to the Anthropic Principle, which necessarily implies the MWI. Copenhagen (the most widely accepted interpretation of quantum weirdness) is just the cautious approach to MWI.

[Anonymous No.9570630]

>>9568744

Reality isn't depressing, you are depressed and probably bored.

[Anonymous No.9570641]

>>9570616
>negligible
NO SUCH THING
>Are you trying to to convince me that nonexistence is better than existence?
I'm only trying to convince you the amount of free will you have in both is 0. The physical world also cannot be "better" or "worse".
>Such as zero free will in deterministic existence.
Ok, explain to me how you get this magicall "free will" in a deterministic world. I'm very interested in how you managed to reconcile the two.

[Anonymous No.9570649]

>>9570625
Widely accepted interpretation among applied scientists is "shut up and calculate", which is not even a model, the second is MWI (mostly among theoretical scientists). Only uneducated brainlets believe in copenhagen, because it's self-contradictory.

[Anonymous No.9570652]

>>9570625
>MWI
You do realize that Everett interpretation is base on nothing other than speculations, right?
>infinitesimal chance
Chance is irrelevant if Everett is right since many worlds is deterministic. You can talk about chance only in a probabilistic system.
>Anthropic Principle
It implies sentience. And scentience cannot exist by definition in a probabilistic system, since everything is "scripted".

[Anonymous No.9570654]

>>9570625

How do you even know what COULD be? How could you possibly know which possible configurations of laws and fundamenta constants our universe could have? this is literally impossible to know^^

[Anonymous No.9570658]

>>9570649
>MWI
>lmao guyze decoherence crieytes other unverses en shiet mang totally sure bout it bruv
>proof: my ass

[Anonymous No.9570659]

>>9568744
Tasteless != Bitter

You are the problem OP

[Anonymous No.9570668]

>>9570641
>NO SUCH THING
Well, there are macroscopic uncontrollable effects like in the schrodinger cat experiment, but superposition of macroscopic states is not what you mean? Every macroscopic state in superposition is still properly deterministic.
>The physical world also cannot be "better" or "worse".
I think existence is better than nonexistence. Why would you argue for nonexistence if you don't believe it's better?
>Ok, explain to me how you get this magicall "free will" in a deterministic world.
If you didn't have wrong assumptions you would easily understand this. That's the very reason to not have wrong assumptions, you just fucked yourself with it. Even a nigger should be able to understand this much, it's really trivial.
Freedom from yourself, from common sense, from existence is meaningless, be free from everything else, there's nothing to reconcile there.

[Anonymous No.9570671]

>>9570652
>in a probabilistic
*in a deterministic

[Anonymous No.9570678]

>>9570658
MWI is only expression of QM math to ease intuitive understanding. Decoherence does propagate superposition, fix your education, flatearther.

[Anonymous No.9570686]

>>9570668
QM is probabilistic.
>Why would you argue for nonexistence
I'm just saying that it's equivalent in the amount of free will it has to a deterministic system or namely none nada zero 0. I'm typing the exact same shit for the third time you retarde faggot. What is so hard to understand?

>Freedom from yourself, from common sense, from existence is meaningless, be free from everything else, there's nothing to reconcile there.
That whole construction makes no sense. Type it again, this time, potentially, including some physical arguments. You are not on /pol/.

[Anonymous No.9570689]

>>9570678
As I said
>proof: my ass

[Anonymous No.9570721]

>>9570686
>QM is probabilistic.
If the observer sees his lovely cat dead he will be sad deterministically. What's uncontrollable there is superposition of the dead and alive cat and the corresponding state of observer, but the observer is deterministically entangled with the cat in each state of superposition. Since pure states are not governed by superposition, they are not uncontrollable, they behave as if there was no superposition.
>I'm just saying that
But you literally meme for nonexistence, you can't deny it.
>Type it again
It make no sense to be free from some things, but it makes sense to be free from other things.

[Anonymous No.9570726]

>>9570689
Proof is QM math, and you can't just get away from it, dumb flatearther.

[Anonymous No.9570735]

>>9570726
>math(s)
Such as?

[Anonymous No.9570737]

>>9570602
You mean you're not talking about it now, but will talk about it later?

[Anonymous No.9570754]

>>9570735
Can you even understand math?
Example:
Suppose we have a double slit experiment, a flying photon and a detector near the right slit:
(|left>+|right>)|detector>
After detection:
|left>|detector>+|right>|detected>
As you can see superposition propagated to the detector as its state decohered during interaction with the photon.

[Anonymous No.9570759]

>>9568744
Because you are made of trillions of cells and 1.5 million of them die on average per second. Poor little things.

:(

[Anonymous No.9570764]

>>9570721
>But you literally meme for nonexistence
You are the one who bought in "nonexistence" in the first place. The discussion is about the physical interpretation of "free will", not metaphysical drivel you brought from /pol/.
>shrodinger's cat
Popscimongler, please spare me.
And yes, QM is probabilistic. Particles have a wave probability function.

>It make no sense to be free from some things, but it makes sense to be free from other things.
This makes even less sense. The point is that if you have a direct cause-and-effect chain, starting from the big bang, you cannot actually be "free", since your brain is part of this chain as well and your actions are already determined at the start within the whole system of chains. Thus determinism is the utterly exact opposite of free will- basically total order and predictability.

[Anonymous No.9570767]

>>9570754
How does a photon decoherence imply a new universe is created?

[Anonymous No.9570817]

>>9568744
>No free will.
This is not conclusively proven. Maybe we have free will, maybe we dont. Why do you care either way? If the illusion of free will is persistent enough, is it really any different that true free will?
>The Selfish Gene.
Why the fuck do you care what other people think or do in relation to you? Who gives a fuck? Do drugs, fuck sluts, and blow shit up. Enjoy yourself.
>Life or human existence has no real meaning or purpose because human existence occurred out of a random chance in nature, and anything that exists by chance has no intended purpose.
Speaking as a true nihilist, your life needs no purpose. If there is no reason or purpose for our existence, then the only thing that matters in the entire universe is how you experience it. Do whatever you fucking want. It dont matter, none of this matters.

[Anonymous No.9570830]

>>9570764
>This makes even less sense.
You want to be free from everything including existence? Then why do you insist that it's me who brought in nonexistence? You're a liar or your thought process is probabilistic just like you believe. What is the meaning to be free from existence?
>Thus determinism is the utterly exact opposite of free will- basically total order and predictability.
That's only a consequence of your wrong assumption that laws of physics are a constraining factor.

[Anonymous No.9570835]

>>9570767
Decoherence of the detector's state creates two independent states of the detector that are independent of each other as they were in different worlds.

[Anonymous No.9570841]

>>9570835
as if*

[Anonymous No.9570843]

>your mum loves you because she is programmed to
These are some hard truth bombs

[Anonymous No.9570855]

>>9570843
And I'm programmed to have it feel good and i do

[Anonymous No.9570857]

>>9570855
I am programmed to make your mum feel good and I do

[Anonymous No.9570874]

>>9570857
and i yours

[Anonymous No.9570875]

>>9570830
>What is the meaning to be free from existence?
I honestly have no idea what you're talking about. You are the only one talking about whatever you're trying to convey.
>wrong assumption
And what are the right assumptions? Magic?

[Anonymous No.9570876]

>>9570835
>as if they were in different worlds
Damn, good thing they aren't then.

[Anonymous No.9570883]

>>9570875
>You are the only one talking about whatever you're trying to convey.
But it's you, who thinks that freedom should be freedom from everything.
>And what are the right assumptions? Magic?
The right assumption is that the laws of nature are not a constraining factor and freedom from them is destructive, and it's better to look for constructive and meaningful freedom.

[Anonymous No.9570885]

>>9570876
They look like worlds, walk like worlds, talk like worlds, that's what MWI says, and it's right in the math.

[Anonymous No.9570926]

>>9570883
>freedom from them is destructive, and it's better to look for constructive and meaningful freedom
Oh, it's all clear now. You are just a philisophy memer >>>/his/ (&Humanities was a mistake t-b-h)

[Anonymous No.9570929]

>>9570926
>philisophy
*philosophy

[Anonymous No.9570935]

>>9570885
>They look like worlds
How exactly do devergent universe world look like and how do you deduct their existence?
>and it's right in the math
Correlation =/= causation

[Anonymous No.9570941]

>>9568744
Get some meaning fag, and learn some self control and ambition

[Anonymous No.9570943]

>>9570941
>meaning
>>>/his/

[Anonymous No.9570980]

Nah, there are worse things. For example the fact that this planet is most interesting thing around. Rest of the universe is repetitive and empty. That's why no aliens around. It is just better to isekai into Dysonsphere and live with anime girls.

[Anonymous No.9570993]

>>9570843
>muh love can't be programmed
>fall in love with the first stacey you meet
>i-it's a coincidence I swear

[Anonymous No.9571014]

>>9570935
>How exactly do devergent universe world look like and how do you deduct their existence?
They look like they don't interact with each other.
>Correlation =/= causation
In a sense MWI is trivial and doesn't say anything that's not in the math, it only helps with intuitive understanding, and once you're there you will understand intuitively how quantum states work as they are and won't need extra interpretation.

[Anonymous No.9571017]

>>9570993
If people are programmed to love why noone loves me? Haha check mate determinists. You are really losers.

[Anonymous No.9571283]

>>9571017
Because they've been programmed to love healthy, strong men, Anon.

[Anonymous No.9571313]

>>9568744
You basically just named all things I love about the world.

Also
>No intended purpose
Sounds like a great excuse to do whatever the fuck you want as long as it doesn't kill you or gets you to prison

[Anonymous No.9571345]

>>9568827
Word play. You know exactly what OP means. He has a point.

My answer is that I just cant imagine any other system. Universe just has to be indifferent algorithm, you cant possibly imagine it with any kind of structure thqt would give it "color"

[Anonymous No.9571688]

>>9570941
I don't read outside textbooks and lectures, is beyond good and evil really that hard? I saw it in a pewdiepie video, yeah sue me I try and stick yt to only that if friends aren't over, and he said its very difficult.

[Anonymous No.9571706]

>>9568744
>Why is physical reality so depressing?
Because you're an unimaginative, willfully ignorant, droll, and lazy person who is desperately seeking some kind of external validation for why you are such an abhorrent piece of shit on the inside.
>>>/r9k/

[Anonymous No.9571954]

Life is cool as an observer,
but suffering as life.

[Anonymous No.9571967]

>>9568778
You have no choice, if there is no free will. Neither does OP.

It seems to me better to assume that there is free will. If there is, you're not operating under a false premise anymore, and if there isn't, at least it's more fun and gives you something to do.

[Anonymous No.9571970]

>>9568831
>Not only is he smart, he's Japanese!

[Anonymous No.9571973]

ITT: People who desperately need to get laid.

[Anonymous No.9572318]

>>9571967
Choice is right in the perception, you don't need theory to prove it. Even programs make choices.

[Anonymous No.9572452]

>>9571706
>>9571973
>>>/f/acebook/

[Anonymous No.9572457]

>>9568744
>>9568744
>no free will
That goes against basic logic. Determinism implies a cause beyond the first state of the observable universe. That is, the casual chain regressively continues beyond it towards the realm of non-(physical states), including the set of Potentials, since there is not a physical thing yet, which is isomorphic to teleology. Therefore, any agent within physical space using its power of telesis inherits free will with the same degree of its ability to think ahead.

A simpler way to see it is the Intuitive association between free will and intelligence: a bee has less free will(therefore less guilt) than an angry dog, which has less free will than a mentally impaired person, who has less free will than a median-intelligence citizen, who has less free will than a genius. If general intelligence starts between one of these creatures (eg if it starts at ravens and if ravens are between dogs and humans) then you can believe free will isn't present in bees at all.

>selfish gene
Genes are selected for reproduction/permanence of something, not selfishness. Your set of genes might well be selected for working against its own selfishness and instead be working for the prevalence of human society.

>human life has no meaning
Like I said, you have to decide if you believe in Determinism(Causation) or Non-Determinism(Non-Causation/Randomness). If you think life is meaningless and random then at least agree that you don't think the world is a clockwork orange.

[Anonymous No.9572461]

>>9568744
>Why is physical reality so depressing?

It really isn't but prevailing capitalist corporate culture forces you to belong to a society with a lot of practices designed to keep you unhappy which makes you a better consumer, learn to see the difference between being a happy person(what benefits you) and being an useful member of society(what benefits them) all of your life you have been led to believe the two are the same, learn to see the difference and youll be much closer to being happy.

>>9568807
>>9568784

Sure, you dont have control over anything but some things are very dependant on what you do.

For example, being skinny and having a six pack (which opens a lot of paths to happines in life) is literally a choice. Like anyone can do it by using only their will.

[Anonymous No.9572499]

>>9572461
>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.9572501]

>No free will
Baseless conjecture.

>Selfish gene
Who cares?

>No meaning
How do you know? How could you know?

Take drugs.

[Anonymous No.9572505]

>>9572499
literally nothing pol about my comment

[Anonymous No.9572522]

>>9572505
Except being politics

[Anonymous No.9572524]

>>9572522
even the part about abs? because thats literally the most important info about my post.

il literally say it again:

literally every western human male has the choice to get fit, it costs nothing but decision. NO one is forced to eat a lot and 99% of the population can excersise even if they cant affoard a gym

having a muscled body with six pack increases self esteem and sex with hot hcicks dramatically

these two bring happines

[Anonymous No.9572632]

>>9568744
>babby's first nihilism
Lmao
Absurdism ftw

[Anonymous No.9572672]

>>9572501
>Take drugs.
only good part of your post
next time leave the rest out

[Anonymous No.9572685]

>>9572672
>>>/r9k/

[Anonymous No.9572807]

>>9568916
>there exists processes in my brain
>therefore, I dictate them
Retard. You cannot be in control of something that appears as a result of a causal chain of events or an indetermined process.

You are no more free than a children´s toy that speaks - if the electrical circuitry is in working order - at the push of a button.

[Anonymous No.9572818]

>>9572457
>Therefore, any agent within physical space using its power of telesis inherits free will with the same degree of its ability to think ahead
What you are saying boils down to this: a creator ("potential") creates physical space, which then bestows upon its inhabitants a similar capacity for taking original action free of any influence.

It makes no sense at all, except to a religious person, who feels entitled to discard any criticism and doubt with more or less eloquent versions of the "God works in mysterious ways"-meme.
>Like I said, you have to decide if you believe in Determinism(Causation) or Non-Determinism(Non-Causation/Randomness).
What you believe in does not make a lick of a difference. Only a fantastical, God-like creator can originate something without regard for causation (which, if assumed to exist in the traditional sense of the word, leads to an infinite regression events infinitesimally close to each other) or random chance.

[Anonymous No.9572831]

>>9568744
can someone give me the original of this pic

[Anonymous No.9572981]

>>9568744
Free will can meaningfully exist in a deterministic universe, and no it's not semantics.
The selfish gene is "contested" to put it lightly.

Come on anon you can do better than this.

[Anonymous No.9573140]

>>9572818
>"potential"
You have to agree that potentials have physical consequences when humans identify them. e.g.: An ugly man waving a firearm around you will trigger people to act simply because of the potential of harm. Potentials are a physical cause like it or not. Given causation can't come from infinite regression, eventually the non-past dictates what happens. This is really really simple. However, if you Don't believe in causation/determinism then just say so, not because your belief is disproportionally important but because of logical consistency within this argument. Your intuition might say determinism is real, but your confused psyche says otherwise, so just make up your mind.

[Anonymous No.9575218]

Unless your neurons magically turn on you don't have free will

[Anonymous No.9575491]

Alright, tell me: what is free will?
And if you can't, how can you have a meaningful discussion over it?

[Anonymous No.9575547]

>>9575218
>what is quantum fluctuation

[Anonymous No.9575560]

>>9575491
The power to self-configure, independently of a another system. Something like a puppet that moves without consent of its strings. Quite easy.

[Anonymous No.9575651]

>>9572524
Fucking normies on my board.
Kys.